Schedule Everything (Even Sex) with Emily Oster

Summary

**Podcast Summary: "Schedule Everything (Even Sex) with Emily Oster"
Title: My So-Called Midlife with Reshma Saujani
Host: Reshma Saujani
Guest: Emily Oster
Release Date: October 16, 2024

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Introduction

In this episode of My So-Called Midlife, host Reshma Saujani delves into the intricacies of managing family life and maintaining personal relationships during midlife. Her guest, Emily Oster, an economist and acclaimed author known for her data-driven approach to parenting and women's health, shares her unique strategies for scheduling every aspect of her life—even intimacy—to reduce conflict and enhance satisfaction.

Emily Oster: The Vagina Economist

Reshma introduces Emily Oster as a trailblazer who has transformed parenting through her data-centric insights. Emily’s approach is likened to that of a "rock star" among parents, with her popular newsletter and website, Parent Data, offering evidence-based advice. She is celebrated for her ability to synthesize complex information, making it accessible and actionable for parents navigating the challenges of raising children.

Managing Family Schedules: The Power of Planning

One of the central themes of the conversation is the meticulous scheduling Emily employs to manage her household. Emily explains how she and her husband use weekly emails to outline daily plans, ensuring that everyone is aware of their responsibilities and schedules.

Emily Oster [06:17]: "The cornerstone of this sort of keeping this thing together is these emails."

Reshma admits her own struggles with household management, contrasting her approach with Emily's highly structured system. Emily emphasizes that this level of planning is essential for her family to avoid unexpected changes that can lead to frustration.

Emily Oster [07:43]: "It's so people can make plans. And my husband works in Boston, and so he's, like, on a train three days a week. And so there's sort of some logistics."

Emotional Labor and Fairness

Reshma probes into whether managing the household schedule places additional emotional labor on Emily. Emily acknowledges that while she is the primary coordinator, her husband handles the weekend plans, creating a balanced distribution of responsibilities.

Emily Oster [08:26]: "I am the sort of primary parent and holder of the emotional labor in the household."

This system not only distributes tasks but also mitigates blame, fostering a collaborative environment where any scheduling mishaps are shared responsibilities rather than individual faults.

Balancing Routine and Excitement

A significant portion of the discussion revolves around the balance between maintaining a routine and introducing excitement into midlife. Reshma expresses a fear of monotony leading to dissatisfaction, while Emily shares her approach to keeping life dynamic despite a structured schedule.

Reshma Saujani [09:36]: "Every day is freaking Groundhog's Day... there's no excitement."

Emily counters this by finding personal goals outside of her daily routine, such as running, which provide a sense of achievement and anticipation.

Emily Oster [11:05]: "It's something where it's like, I'm trying to achieve it... that's what gets me up in the morning."

Intimacy: Scheduling Sex

The episode's title suggests a focus on intimacy, which is thoroughly explored when discussing how couples can navigate the challenges of maintaining a healthy sex life amidst the demands of parenting and work.

Emily reveals that scheduling sex has become a practical solution for her and her partner, acknowledging societal reluctance but emphasizing its effectiveness.

Reshma Saujani [32:46]: "Do you think people lie about that?"

Emily Oster [32:50]: "Everybody schedule sex."

This candid discussion normalizes the concept, highlighting that even though it may seem unromantic, scheduling intimacy can enhance a couple’s connection by ensuring regular and intentional time together.

Women's Health and Perimenopause

Towards the end of the episode, the conversation shifts to women's health, particularly perimenopause. Emily and Reshma discuss the unpredictable hormonal changes and their impact on daily life and fertility.

Emily Oster [28:56]: "Almost always the answer to something about like, why is this going wrong? Is like, well, your estrogen's down."

Emily emphasizes the importance of understanding hormonal fluctuations and encourages women to educate themselves about the typical symptoms versus those that may require medical attention.

Emily Oster [30:36]: "It would be great if we could give people a better sense of the range of symptoms that are typical."

Reclaiming Midlife: Key Takeaways

In wrapping up, Reshma and Emily summarize their insights on living a fulfilling midlife through structured planning and self-awareness.

Reshma’s Takeaways:

1. Get Comfortable with Being Boring: Embrace routine and discipline as a means to maintain stability.
2. We Don't Have to Have It All: Reject the unrealistic expectation of balancing every aspect of life perfectly.
3. Schedule Sex: Normalize and utilize scheduling as a tool to maintain intimacy.

Conclusion

This episode provides a refreshing perspective on managing midlife challenges through structured scheduling and realistic expectations. Emily Oster’s practical strategies offer valuable lessons for anyone looking to enhance their family life and personal relationships without succumbing to the pressures of perfection.

Notable Quotes:

• Emily Oster [06:17]: "The cornerstone of this sort of keeping this thing together is these emails."
• Emily Oster [08:26]: "I am the sort of primary parent and holder of the emotional labor in the household."
• Reshma Saujani [09:36]: "Every day is freaking Groundhog's Day... there's no excitement."
• Emily Oster [11:05]: "It's something where it's like, I'm trying to achieve it... that's what gets me up in the morning."
• Emily Oster [32:50]: "Everybody schedule sex."
• Emily Oster [28:56]: "Almost always the answer to something about like, why is this going wrong? Is like, well, your estrogen's down."
• Emily Oster [30:36]: "It would be great if we could give people a better sense of the range of symptoms that are typical."

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This summary encapsulates the essence of the episode, highlighting Emily Oster's methodical approach to family management and personal well-being during midlife. For listeners seeking practical advice on balancing family responsibilities and maintaining a fulfilling personal life, this episode offers insightful and actionable strategies.

Transcript

[Reshma Sajani]

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[Emily Oster]

Hey guys. Hey. I'm trying to tape my podcast. I need you to go or be quiet. I know. I need you to speak quieter. Me?

[Reshma Sajani]

Welcome to my so Called Midlife, a podcast where we figure out how to stop just getting through it and start actually living it. I'm Reshma Sajani. So our guest today has saved parents countless hours of Internet sleuthing. She synthesizes data about parenting, pregnancy and our bodies like no one. And she's basically a rock star. Like, I have been in a room with her with parents and she's like mobbed, like Taylor Swift at a Swifty convention. And now in her latest newsletter, she's digging into hormones in midlife. Emily Oster is an economist and award winning author. And specifically now this is my favorite. She refers to herself as the Vagina Economist. I love that. Her breakout book, Expecting Better sold over a million copies. And since then she's written three data driven books to help parents make these hard decisions. And she's created community through her website, Parent Data. But like, more than that, she's on top of her shit in a way that is so foreign to me. I want to Study it under a microscope. For example, she sends out a weekly email to her husband, kids, and nanny every single week. It outlines the entire run of show for every day. Everyone is expected to read it and send questions. And on top of that, her husband's in charge of the weekend plans. He sends out an email that outlines what their family's going to do and when the downtime is going to happen. I mean, even the fun is scheduled. But here's the thing. That's how they avoid conflict, she says. So I can't wait to talk to her about that, because, as you can tell, I don't do that with my family. I mean, not even close. Emily Oster, welcome to the show.

[Emily Oster]

Hello. I'm so happy to be here.

[Reshma Sajani]

So what happened to you this week? That felt very midlife.

[Emily Oster]

I feel like most of my day feels very 40s. But I would say the. The thing that feels 40s every morning is when I get up and I feel like I, like, limp to the bathroom. I don't know, there's just something about the. The soreness of, like, just like the morning, you know, when you just feel old. I feel old in the morning and I. That's. That's new.

[Reshma Sajani]

Yes. I walk around with my little. What's my little theragun? You know what I mean? That's like my little best friend. Okay, so, but have you discovered anything to solve the aches and pains? Like, do you do a heating pad? I started doing that. It helps.

[Emily Oster]

I have a foam roller. Oh, you have a foam roller?

[Reshma Sajani]

A very ugly blue one in the corner of my house.

[Emily Oster]

Yeah, mine's like, Mine's like the Amazon basics one. It's like the only thing that pattern available was, like, speckled. So I have like a, like a speckled dotted foam roller that lives just, like, around my house.

[Reshma Sajani]

Foam rollers are a game changer. But it's also like, when I was, I was. I was like, is everybody that tight? Like, is everybody in that much pain? And, like, am I going to have to get a hip replacement soon? Like, what's the deal?

[Emily Oster]

I don't know. This is not my. This is not my specialty. I do think that my sense from other people who run is that you definitely do get more that stretching is a priority as one ages.

[Reshma Sajani]

I want to talk about your tools for managing the household. And I'm going to admit I don't do any of the things you say to do. Like, I should do. All right, so, like, I'm the parent that when my son brings home his backpack Like I don't open it up, I don't take out the homework or fill out the forms. And I normally need to be reminded by the teacher like five times. So I'm not proud of it, I'm just being honest. Like that's my deal. Because it's hard to be a parent when you're managing your job. You're managing, but then you gotta manage the kids, the fridge, the shoes, the healthcare, the whole thing, right? And what I love about what you do, and I hope to take that advice one day, is like, here's some real concrete ways that like you can ease the burden. And you know, I wanna talk about how you and your husband do it because you have a very specific way of keeping stuff on track. And you use emails with your husband and your nanny. Tell me your flow, like walk us through your, your Sunday email.

[Emily Oster]

Okay, so let me just step back. The key issue for us is that nobody in my family in particular, my husband and I, but also our kids like to be surprised and we're all busy and my husband and I in particular, when it's like I plan to do X and instead I need to do this with the kids, it makes us really mad. It's like upsetting. I. We're both like routine driven people.

[Reshma Sajani]

So like when you're supposed to go to basketball and you're like, fuck it, let's go to ice cream, like that just like that throws everybody off.

[Emily Oster]

No, no, we would, we would never do that.

[Reshma Sajani]

No, that's my house.

[Emily Oster]

It's more like if, if like I wasn't warned I needed to pick up like right now I'm kind of cranky because the school initially told us that pickup from like the school trip drop off today was at 3:30 and then, and we planned for it to be 3:30 and then like two days ago they were like, oh, it's 2:30. That's annoying. That's the kind of thing that like drives our family nuts. Okay? So the cornerstone of this sort of keeping this thing together is these emails. And so like on the weekend I will send an email that just says it's super simple actually. It's just like, here's what's happening Monday, here's what's happening Tuesday. And mostly it's like on Monday the kids are going to school. Here's what's happening at the end of the day. Like on Tuesday the kids will go to school. Here's what's happened at the end of the day. But it's a way to kind of Call out, like, here's where somebody has to be. You know, here's the driving that needs to happen.

[Reshma Sajani]

Yeah. It gives people, like, they can make plans because they know what's happening.

[Emily Oster]

It's so people can make plans. And my husband works in Boston, and so he's, like, on a train three days a week. And so there's sort of some logistics. But so much of our family structure just relies on this idea of, like, planning in advance so we don't fight later.

[Reshma Sajani]

And your husband's an economist, too, right? So, like, both of your brains are that way. And clearly your kids are going to be economists, because everybody.

[Emily Oster]

No. Oh, my gosh, I hope not.

[Reshma Sajani]

I don't think so.

[Emily Oster]

No. One of them is planning to have a YouTube channel. Reshma. So we're going in for a growth area of the economy.

[Reshma Sajani]

Yeah. Okay. I have two thoughts from what you just told me. One, are you the manager of this?

[Emily Oster]

Yes, I do. I do. I do the weekly email. My husband does the weekend email.

[Reshma Sajani]

Okay. Does that create more or less emotional labor for you?

[Emily Oster]

I think it's pretty clear. I think he would agree with this, that I am the sort of primary parent and holder of the emotional labor in the household. It definitely improves that. Writing this email lessens that emotional labor, in part because it means that everyone else has an opportunity to, like, weigh in on mistakes that I have made and fix things. So it's not like I was the person responsible for this and then I messed it up. It's like, if something gets messed up, we kind of all messed it up. So I think that's this helpful aspect of it.

[Reshma Sajani]

Have you ever, like, said, I'm done. I'm not doing this weak email. You gotta do it. It's like, this is like me in my house about the trash.

[Emily Oster]

Oh, no. I don't think he would be good at the week. The weak email.

[Reshma Sajani]

So that's why you do it?

[Emily Oster]

I don't know. I guess it just feels. To me, it feels like. It feels fairly evenly split. Like, the weekend email is also kind of annoying. So.

[Reshma Sajani]

So you feel like it's fair?

[Emily Oster]

Yeah, I feel like that aspect is fair.

[Reshma Sajani]

My beef with midlife is like, every day is freaking Groundhog's Day.

[Emily Oster]

Yeah.

[Reshma Sajani]

Like, every day is the same and there's no excitement. Like, there's no. And I think that's why people blow up their life, whether they have an affair or whether. You know what I mean? Do something or quit their job or, like, move to a nursery. It's like they're just Bored. You gotta feel that way a little bit. Do you sometimes. Don't you feel like sometimes just like, writing the wrong thing on your weekly email and saying that, like, pickup is at 5 instead of 6 and just throwing the whole family off and just, ooh, like, wouldn't that be exciting?

[Emily Oster]

Wouldn't that be exciting if we were like, we're ha. We're not having veggies on Wednesday. On Wednesday, there's no veggies at 5 o'clock and you can all forget it. F. Off. So look, I actually, I think that's a very. Yes, I think people feel that way very much. And this is. I had a conversation last year with Pooja Lakshmi about her book about self care, and she makes this point about, like, sort of self care being like something where you prioritize yourself. And like, I need something that I'm, like, trying to do outside of my job. And it has to. It can't just be like, I go to yoga for recreation. Like, I have to be trying to achieve something or else it, like, doesn't, like, work for me in terms of, like, helping take my mind off things. And so the thing that I have been doing much more seriously basically since I turned 40, so I think it's quite, quite consistent with your whole thing is running.

[Reshma Sajani]

Yeah.

[Emily Oster]

And so this weekend, like, I'm going to a race and I'm nervous about. I'm like, nervous that I won't be able to achieve my stupid goal. And I understand your great goal.

[Reshma Sajani]

It's not stupid.

[Emily Oster]

It's about, like. And it's like, I have these goals and they're not important in the sort of grand scheme of my life, but they're important to me. And it's something where it's like, it has a cadence that's like, almost not the same. It's like, okay, I'm like, leading up to this thing that I'm gonna try to. That I'm gonna try to do and test myself in various ways. But, yeah, I mean, I think most people, you probably. You want to look for something, I don't know, something different.

[Reshma Sajani]

One of my biggest fears in many ways is that I'm just boring and dull and like, I've become lame. Right. And I, like, you often pick goals that just make me more lame. Right. Like, it's not gonna make you, like, more fun, more loose, more risky. Right. It's actually making you more disciplined.

[Emily Oster]

Yeah. Isn't that ridiculous?

[Reshma Sajani]

Isn't that bad?

[Emily Oster]

Yes.

[Reshma Sajani]

Aren't we, like, doing. Shouldn't we be picking things that actually, I don't know, mix it up more for us, make us more spontaneous, make us less disciplined.

[Emily Oster]

I don't know. Or I don't. I don't know.

[Reshma Sajani]

Because you don't like those things. I don't like those things.

[Emily Oster]

I don't like those things. I like discipline and achievement. I don't know. The biggest thing for me at running actually is, like, people. There's a bunch of like, people who I would now consider friends, who I get to connect with through this. And that's. That's new. Like, the people I've been friends with, who I love very much, I like, been friends with since college. You know, I met my husband in college. I met my best friend day one of college. And so this is like. There's like. I don't know, there's a thing about this, but I totally agree. Like, maybe we should be more. Our hobbies should be more interesting.

[Reshma Sajani]

No, but that's good because I think what you're saying is like, for me too, like, I have to be more social. Like, I think it's like when you look, I think when you're on all the time, it's actually. I've become more of an introvert as my career has progressed. When I was always an extrovert. Right. And so. And then you, you write, you read all these things, which is like the most important thing as you're getting older is like friends. And I'm like, oh my God, I don't have any friends. And so it is great that you found something that like, helps you get more friends.

[Emily Oster]

Yeah. But I agree that the thing I found is boring and kind of just like. I mean, I like it, but it's just like all the other things about me.

[Reshma Sajani]

Yeah, no, I get it, I get it, I get it. Maybe this will inspire you to find something that. Or both of us to find something that's like in a different lane.

[Emily Oster]

Painting? Should we be painting?

[Reshma Sajani]

No. Paintings. No, I was thinking more like, I don't know, late night DJing or something like that. Right. Something that like messes with your sleep.

[Emily Oster]

Okay. Okay. Yeah. I like to go to sleep, so. I didn't even in college.

[Reshma Sajani]

That's funny because I was Club Reshma. I could dance all night long.

[Emily Oster]

That sounds amazing. I wish I had known.

[Reshma Sajani]

I know. Everybody misses Club Reshma. I'm going to bring her out though. For my 50th birthday, I will invite you to my party. Spark something uncommon this holiday season with incredible handpicked gifts from Uncommon Goods. That's right. It's not too early to think about the holiday season and making it absolutely memorable for your loved ones. Uncommon Goods makes your holiday shopping stress free. By scouring the globe for original, handmade and absolutely remarkable things for everyone on your list, they've officially found a way to tap into that. It's exactly what I wanted feeling Whether you're shopping for your Secret Santa or your entire family, Uncommon Goods knows exactly what they want. Here are a few of my favorite gifts that I found on their site. A book lover's Advent calendar. Such a good gift idea. They also have these adorable Christmas sweaters that you can personalize with a photo of someone's dog. To get 15% off your next gift, go to UncommonGoods.com MidLife that's UncommonGoods.com MidLife for 15% off. Don't miss out on this limited time offer. Uncommon Goods we're all out of the ordinary. As the days get shorter and the to do lists grow longer, finding time for wholesome meals can feel nearly impossible. That's where Green Chef saves the day. Green Chef is the number one meal kit for clean eating, delivering fresh organic produce and responsibly sourced proteins right to your door so you can create nutritious, satisfying meals without the hassle of shopping or planning. One of my favorite things about Green Chef is how it brings the flavors of the season right to my kitchen. Fall ingredients like delicate squash, cranberries and even organic free range turkey make it easy to keep things fresh and delicious. And with easy to follow recipes and pre measured ingredients, I've been able to skip meal planning and focus more on just enjoying my food. I just made the lemon herb pork chops with squash, corn couscous and feta. It was so indulgent but still so balanced. I loved every bite. Green Chef's menu has something for everyone from Mediterranean and gluten free options to delicious plant based meals. Whether I'm cooking a cozy dinner solo or something special for friends, Green Chef's quality ingredients and variety have been a game changer in my routine. Go to greenchef.com midlifecrisis50 and use code midlifecrisis50 for 50% off your first box plus 20% off your next two months. That's code midlife [e-mail] midlifecris50 to get 50% off your first box plus twenty percent off your next two months. What I love about your work so I'm obsessed with cons, right? Like the con about us feeling like women we have to, like, fix ourselves and that we just need a little more confidence, really, when we've had no structural support. And what I love about you too is like, you really also talk about the con. The con about like, not exercise when you're pregnant. The con about how much weight you can gain. You know, the con about, like, when your eggs all disappear and you're not afraid to be confrontational about it. And your work is so much about the debunking of parenting, pregnancy, women's bodies. What do you feel in all of your research is the biggest con? Women have been sold.

[Emily Oster]

So let me give you two answers. So I think in parenting, the biggest con is that little things matter. I think if I could just get people to stop thinking and like, stop asking me, not because I don't want to answer, but stop like, getting in their head about, like, tiny stuff because someone has told them, like, every choice you make is the most important choice and every minute is an opportunity to like, optimize your kid. And like, and I realize in some weird sense, like, maybe like some of my work is like trying to. But actually I, I would just like people to be like, there's like three important things. Love your kid. Kids need a stable place to be. Try not to yell too much and read to them. That's great. You're done. You're good. And so that's one, I think for women. I think we sold people a little bit of a bill of goods on having it all. Not that I don't think that it is possible to have a career that you love and a family that you love and be super involved with your kid. Like, I'm trying. Like we're both trying to do that. I think we have to recognize that There are only 24 hours in the day and sleeping is important for functioning.

[Reshma Sajani]

Yep.

[Emily Oster]

And it isn't possible to both be a full time stay at home mom and also a full time employee.

[Reshma Sajani]

Yep.

[Emily Oster]

Because those are both full time jobs, as the title suggests. And I, I kind of think we sometimes give people the impression that, like, if you just like worked harder or you thought about it differently or whatever, like you could do both of those things. And I think we can make it easier to balance those things for sure. With tools or whatever. Different approaches being more deliberate. I think we can make it easier. But I do not think that we should expect ourselves to do all of those things at the same time.

[Reshma Sajani]

That's right. You had some great advice in your newsletter Parent Data recently about how we as parents compare ourselves to all the other parents, how we judge ourselves based on what everyone else is doing. You wrote basically that comparison is the thief of joy.

[Emily Oster]

Yeah.

[Reshma Sajani]

And I think. Right, talk to me about that.

[Emily Oster]

Yeah. So I think when we look out at other parents very frequently, it's like, here are the ways in which, like, I'm not doing good enough. The example I was giving there was like, what's in your kid's lunchbox? Right? That, like somebody else's kid's lunchbox. Like it's got, it's a bento, it's got the shaped animal rices, whatever it is. But there are so many aspects of that where we are comparing ourselves to someone else and finding ourselves coming up short. And if we could take a deep breath in those moments and be like, I don't really know what is going on with those other people, but I've thought about like, what, how the way I want my life to operate and I am implementing that and that is working for me. For me. I find this when I talk to parents whose kids are engaged in like, like a lot of high tech, like intensive extracurriculars which like, isn't a thing we've really gone in for like Russian math. Yeah, Russian math. Like geography B, you know, like three different instruments. You know, Karate nationals, like just things which like, seem great. But you can feel as a parent when someone's describing like, well, you know, my kid was at the debate nationals and now they're going to the karate world championships. You like feel that like the like rising panic, you know, like, oh my.

[Reshma Sajani]

God, yeah, like I've ruined my child. Right.

[Emily Oster]

It's just the exercise of being like, you know what? Like that sounds great for them. Not, not the exercise of being like, that's stupid. Karate's dumb. Because it's not. Like that might work great for them, but just the exercise of being like that sounds lovely for them and it's not what works for my family.

[Reshma Sajani]

Because of this comparison piece. Do you think that that's why so many women in their midlife are unsatisfied and want to blow up their lives?

[Emily Oster]

I actually think what you hit on earlier is the biggest thing, which is the feeling of monotony, kind of the experience of sort of getting out of the ever changing little kid world, right? Where like there's just like a lot of chaos. It's hard to be bored with a two year old. It's hard to be rested, but it's hard to be bored. And you know, once your kids. Yeah, like a couple kids and they're like, in elementary, middle school. They're like, trucking along. It's like, pretty consistent. And people are in their jobs and usually they're not still trying to climb the ladder in quite the same way that they were before. Like, you're a little more settled. And, you know, it's like, well, what? Like, okay, like, is it just this? Is this just it till I die? Sex with the same person, same kind of school? Like, I mean, Groundhog Day is the right. Is the right way to put it. Like, am I going to the same office, doing the same thing, seeing the same people, eating the same nine meals, you know, every day until just death?

[Reshma Sajani]

Do you feel like that?

[Emily Oster]

No. But what I'm doing right now, like, trying to build parent data, trying to build something where, you know, it's. It's different from what I've done before. Like, yeah, I get. I get the high. Cause it's hard. It's like the thing that gets that. That gets me up is like, I don't know what to do. Like, I don't know what the next step is. Like, I'm. I'm nervous. I'm, like, anxious that it's not going to work, but super excited about the possibility that it will. Like, you know, that's what gets me up in the morning.

[Reshma Sajani]

So what's the secret to reclaiming your midlife?

[Emily Oster]

Entrepreneurship is like, I think it's finding. I mean, I think it depends. It depends. But I think for a lot of people, it's finding something, Something that you want to try for. I mean, I think for me, that's like the. That's the thing that people are often missing. It's like I'm. I was trying to achieve it. I was trying to get, like, people are trying to get to something. They're trying to land somewhere, and then they land there with the, you know, the kids and the partner and the job, and then there isn't something that you're trying for. And I think that's where people you want to figure out, like, what are you going to try for? And, you know, maybe that's like something that is totally outside of everything else you do, like being in a dj, late night dj.

[Reshma Sajani]

It's like, what's your. Like, for example, what's your goal this weekend for your run?

[Emily Oster]

1930. It's a 5K. It's. My goal is 1930. It's not a realistic goal. My friend Arielle said she would come and we could try to achieve it together.

[Reshma Sajani]

That's amazing. But that's Kind of like that's, that's it, right? A goal, something you want to try for. It could be like your next half marathon.

[Emily Oster]

Yeah, it could be like just like whatever gets. Whatever floats your boat.

[Reshma Sajani]

You know? I love cooler months because I feel like it offers me so much more flexibility with my fashion and layering. And let me tell you, Quince has been a total game changer for my wardrobe. I've been living in their cashmere sweaters. Yes, cashmere starting at $50. They're so soft and cozy. Plus I've got a few of their washable silk tops which are perfect for those days when you want to feel a little more polished without a lot of fuss. And the best part, Quince offers these beautiful, high quality pieces at prices that are 50 to 80% less than similar brands. They partner directly with top factories so there's no middleman, which means more savings for us. And I love that they're committed to ethical manufacturing practices too. I've worn my Quince pieces like my 100% Mongolian cashmere sweaters just about everywhere from casual lunches to evening events. And they always hold up. Honestly, they feel just as luxurious as any high end brand I've tried, but without the crazy price tag. Get cozy in Quince's high quality wardrobe essentials. Go to quince.commidlife for free shipping on your order and a 360 day returns. That's Q U I N C E.com midlife to get free shipping and 365 day returns. Quince.com midlife if you're anything like me, managing money hasn't always been easy. I remember the first time I thought about investing, I had no idea where to start. Maybe you've had that same experience, feeling like investing is only for people with a lot of cash or expertise. But here's the thing. It's not. Today's episode is sponsored by Acorns. Acorns makes it easy to start automatically saving and investing for your future. You don't need a lot of money or expertise to invest with Acorns. In fact, you can get started with just your spare change. Acorns recommends an expert built portfolio that fits you and your money goals, then automatically invests your money for you. I've been trying Acorns myself and it's been a game changer. It takes the guesswork out of investing, which is perfect for someone like me who's always on the go. I love how I can invest just by rounding up my everyday purchases. Like when I grab a coffee or order takeout, giving those small investments a chance to grow. Head to acorns.com midlife or download the Acorns app to start saving and investing for your future. Today. Paid non client endorsement compensation provides incentive to positively promote Acorns Investing involves risks. Acorns Advisors, LLC, an SEC registered investment advisor. View important [e-mail] midlife perimenopause. You've lately been talking a lot about bodies, how they change. You've started a newsletter with Dr. Jillian Goddard.

[Emily Oster]

Who's the best?

[Reshma Sajani]

Who's the best? Called Hot Flash. Are you in the pause, like, and what motivated you? Oh yeah, you're in the pause.

[Emily Oster]

I think so. It's not that well defined, Reshma. So we, you know, we started this newsletter partly because it felt like a good topic that a lot of people are interested in. And I will say in our first conversation, I was like, it was just like a quote, interview in which I just like asked her all of the questions about my own personal situation. And, you know, I'm 44. I would say I have some early perimenopause symptoms. And it's weird, right? I mean, people talk about menopause and that starts on average at like, at 50 and, you know, takes a couple years. But there's an awfully long time of sort of like, lead up.

[Reshma Sajani]

Yes.

[Emily Oster]

In which things will fluctuate around in ways that are sort of unexpected.

[Reshma Sajani]

I mean, I'm in it now. Like, I'm sweating right now, like, profusely, you know, for no reason. Even though, like, the air conditioning has turned down to 68.

[Emily Oster]

My problem is like, sleep. I just, like, just sleep.

[Reshma Sajani]

But it is interesting because I think about, you don't know whether you're blaming everything for it. And the other thing I found really interesting was that so many of my fertility issues pop back up at this stage while I'm going through perimenopause. And I think we just don't, we don't like, know enough off. It's so, it's, it's. And is that a data problem, too?

[Emily Oster]

So Jillian's an endocrinologist and I think so much of her writing and so much of what's in Hot Flash has helped me understand that the core misunderstanding is about just our understanding of hormones. The answer to like, why are your fertility issues seeming like paramit? Like, that's because it's the same set of hormones sort of combined in different ways. And almost always the answer to something about like, why is this going wrong? Is like, well, Your estrogen's down. Like, the estrogen turns out to be, like, super important to making you feel good. And so many of these answers surround the balance of hormones. And this is not something that we learn a lot about. I don't think it's something that medicine understands that much about. I mean, there aren't that many endocrinologists. Most people will probably never see an endocrinologist or be informed at all about, you know, what is the range of hormone kind of cycles over, over your life cycle. And it comes up in these times in which the balance of those things are changing a lot.

[Reshma Sajani]

So based on your own inform, like your own experience, what do you wish women knew?

[Emily Oster]

I think it would be great if we could give people a better sense of the range of symptoms that are typical, because you're absolutely right. There is a little bit of a. Of a vacuum where then everything gets attributed to perimenopause or to menopause. It's, you know, like, I'm dizzy, my ears hurt, you know, my foot. Like, my. My foot is swelling. A whole range of things people ask, like, is this perimenopause? And some of the times, like, no, that's. That's not. And so that, like, even. Even breasts, right? To sort of say, like, cyclical breast pain, which arises anew at, you know, in your early 40s. That is a very common perimenopause symptom. Consistent pain in one breast. That's not a perimenopause symptom. That's something you should have checked out because that could be something else that you would want to worry about. So even things like that, we're just helping people understand, like, what is going to happen or is likely to happen or could happen and what are things that are outside of this. And sure, they could be related to your hormones, but they are something you should try to understand better.

[Reshma Sajani]

So you conducted this intimacy survey about women's sex life in their midnight. Also, side note, I didn't realize that the emoji for sex was a hot pepper. Is that what it is?

[Emily Oster]

Yes, that's true. Yeah.

[Reshma Sajani]

Okay, so I just learned that recently, thanks to you, what are some of the most surprising stuff that you heard from the community about this topic?

[Emily Oster]

So the data we got back from people, I think when we did this survey, it was like 26,000 people wrote in. And we asked people, how old are your kids and how much sex do you have? And, you know, I think a lot of it is pretty much what you would expect. People have Sex less than they did before kids. Very early on, people have less sex, although, like, when their kids are very small. And then you kind of return back to something closer to the frequency that you had before. I think the typical was in the range of sort of twice a month, you know, ranging between like, every other week and every week. But there's a really wide range. And there are couples who say they never have sex. There are couples who say they have sex every day. That was not common, but occasionally were a few.

[Reshma Sajani]

Do you think people lie about that?

[Emily Oster]

About how much sex they have?

[Reshma Sajani]

Yeah.

[Emily Oster]

To. On a survey? Maybe a bit, I think. I'm sure they lie more like to their friends. To their friends, right? Yeah, but maybe a little. I mean, what was interesting about the survey, maybe more than the data, was kind of what people said. There's a lot of, like, I like my partner, and I'm sad that this isn't a way that we're connecting anymore. Like, there was more emotion in those answers than maybe I had expected when.

[Reshma Sajani]

I saw it too. It was funny about the older women who had taken their survey. It said, basically, don't worry, it gets better when the kids leave the house. I thought that that was super funny. But part of that then, I think, sheds some light a little bit on why people are unhappy. Because the spontaneity is gone. Right. You almost have to schedule it when the kids are out of the house.

[Emily Oster]

Yeah, you have to schedule when the kids are out of the house and people are not. People don't like to schedule sex, even though many people. Actually, all of these surveys, you will see, and you see this in many places in data and in anecdotes, is people say, like, I don't. You know, we schedule. I don't really like the idea of scheduling it, but once we get into it, I like doing it right and sort of like, you know, it's fun. I mean, this is not like.

[Reshma Sajani]

I mean. I mean, we have to schedule sex. I mean, do you guys have to schedule sex?

[Emily Oster]

Everybody schedule sex.

[Reshma Sajani]

Yeah. You're like, I'm married to an economist. Of course I schedule sex. Well, that's the other thing I wanna get to. So you called yourself boring in this interview, and I think you love that. I think you love the discipline. You love routine. And is loving a boring life the key to being content in midlife?

[Emily Oster]

I think it is helpful if you are a person who likes routine. And you're absolutely right. Like, I like routine. I like to do the same thing every day. So since midlife is often quite routine. If you are a person who thrives on that, I think that that can be helpful. But I'm not sure it's the key to being content in the sense that, you know, you could mix it up. You don't have to have the same coffee at exactly the same time with exactly the same electrolyte drink every morning to be happy. Although if you're a person who likes that and like every morning there's like a little spark of joy when you're like, oh, I get to have my electrolyte drink and my graham crackers and go for a run. Like, that's lucky.

[Reshma Sajani]

That's amazing. Well, thank you, Emily. This was such a fun conversation.

[Emily Oster]

I love talking to you. Could do it forever.

[Reshma Sajani]

Okay, here are my takeaways from Emily on how to really live my midlife. Number one, get comfortable with being boring. Big one. Number two, we don't have to have it all. In fact, having it all, it's a con. And three, this is a good one. Schedule sex. Everyone does it. You don't have to feel guilty about it. Emily Oster is the author of four best selling books including Expecting Better. She's the founder of Parent Data, a data driven guide through pregnancy, Parenthood and beyond. Thanks Emily for coming on the show. That's it for our show. See you next week. There's more of my so Called Midlife with Lemonada. Premium subscribers get exclusive access to bonus content like Midlife Advice that didn't make it into the show. Subscribe now. In Apple Podcast I'm your host Reshma Sajani. Our producer is Claire Jones. This series is sound designed by Ivan Karaev. Our theme was composed by Ivan Karaev and performed by Ryan Jewell, Ivan Koraev and Karen Waltok. Additional music by APM Music. Our senior supervising producer is Kristin Lepore. Our VP of New content is Rachel Neal. Executive producers include me, Reshma Sajani, Stephanie Whittles Wax and Jessica Cordova Kramer. Series consulting and production support from Katie Cordova. Help others find our show by leaving us a rating and writing a review. And let us know how you're doing in Midlife. You can submit your story to be included in this [e-mail] midlife follow my so Called Midlife wherever you get your podcast or listen ad free on Amazon Music with your prime membership. Thanks for listening. See you next week. Bye.

[C]

Why hello there. This is your pal Sarah Silverman. You know, the standup comic that's not afraid of a diarrhea joke. Oh my God. I'm so brave. I hope you're enjoying this podcast that you're listening to. I am just dropping in here to let you know about another podcast I think you'd like, and it's called the Sarah Silverman Podcast. Each week, listeners from all over the world call in and they ask me for advice or they talk about something going on in their life, anything, their silliest, grossest, deepest, darkest situations. And then I respond, whether I'm qualified to or not. Go ahead, search for the Sarah Silverman Podcast wherever you get your podcasts. Bye.

[Reshma Sajani]

I'm Lupita Nyong'o. My new podcast, mind you'd Own is a storytelling show that navigates what it means to belong all from the African perspective. We're going beyond the headlines to dive into nuanced, intimate stories from Africans around the world. I'm so excited to bring this show to you. Listen to Mind your Own on Amazon Music.