Cassie (6:26)

Aaron, you got everything going on. You got the Victorian thing. You got the wilderness and outdoor thing. Well rounded and you can see.

Danielle (6:33)

You see the ghosts. You hear the ghosts, man. And you just. The way you told the story, it feels like you're very accustomed to seeing these things. You're like, yeah, I saw someone, but I didn't mention it.

Cassie (6:44)

Yeah. And also not just someone. Once you saw, you're like, every room there was a different apparition or feeling or whatever. Like, I'm lucky if I even get one.

Danielle (6:53)

Yeah, I've never seen anything.

Cassie (6:56)

Me neither.

Danielle (6:57)

I've had, like, experiences, but I've never seen. That is false. You have seen.

Cassie (7:01)

Yeah, I have, but not in this, like, context. I haven't gone to a notably haunted location and seen something.

Danielle (7:09)

Apparitions. Yeah.

Cassie (7:11)

Yeah. It reminded me a lot. And I think obviously it's because she's writing from Australia, but the Sydney harbor episode I did about the quarantine station, it reminded me a lot of that episode. Yeah. Cool.

Danielle (7:24)

Thank You. Well, thank you. Yeah. Thank you Aaron, for writing in and stoked to hear that we inspired a lot of your new. Your new adventures.

Cassie (7:33)

And the the costume is fabulous and I can't wait to post a photo of it because I had a real missed opportunity not being in theater and being able to to do that.

Danielle (7:42)

Tell your classmates if they're still bullying you to cut it out or else.

Cassie (7:47)

Yeah. What are people are still bullying in 2025?

Danielle (7:50)

Yeah, we'll bully. I'll bully a bully.

Cassie (7:53)

Yeah.

Danielle (7:53)

Happily. Give me their names actually.

Cassie (7:57)

Yeah, just a first name. And somehow Cassie will be able to find them.

Danielle (8:00)

It's true.

Cassie (8:01)

And their IP addresses somehow.

Danielle (8:03)

Yep. Try me.

Cassie (8:11)

As I've gotten older, I found myself wanting to drink less and less. I do enjoy a nice cocktail here and there, but when I go out with friends, I just don't have the interest in drinking all night long. Especially because I am the queen of horrific hangovers. And because of that, I found myself reaching more and more for soles out of Office gummies instead because they give me a light social buzz without the hangover. Sole is a wellness brand that believes feeling good should be fun and easy. They specialize in delicious hemp derived THC and CBD products designed to boost your mood and help you unwind. Their best selling out of Office gummies were designed to provide a mild relaxing buzz, boost your mind and enhance creativity and relaxation. And their out of Office gummies come in four different strengths so you can find the perfect dose that's right for your vibe. You can choose from a gentle microdose which is my personal favorite. A perfect buzz, a noticeable high or fully lit. All of Sol's products are made from organically farmed USA grown hemp and are vegan, gluten free and low in sugar. And if you like their out of Office gummies, you have got to try their new out of Office beverage. It's a refreshing, alcohol free alternative, perfect for summer sipping. And I've had both their raspberry lemonade and cucumber melon lime flavors. And I have no lie. Had to hide them because everyone who comes over drinks through them so fast because they're so good and I just want them all to myself. Bring on the good vibes and treat yourself to Seoul today. Right now, Sol is offering our audience 30% off of your entire order. Go to get soul.com and use the code NPAD. That's get soul.com promo code NPAD for 30% off. So my first story is titled I Got Smacked at Radium Hot Springs Smacked. That's right.

Danielle (9:59)

Oh no.

Cassie (10:00)

Cassie and Danielle. I'm Katie. I'm 24 and I live in Ohio. In the times where I really wish I wasn't in Ohio, I listened to your podcast to Escape, which is a lot. Thank you for taking me away from here.

Danielle (10:12)

Oh, no.

Cassie (10:13)

A few years ago, I scored a summer internship in Denver, Colorado and I tell you, I had a blast. I visited national park parks almost every weekend and unlocked my love for adventure. At the end of the summer, I had my hometown friends visit me for a weekend. I was very excited to let them in on the experience. So I plan to take them to Radium Hot Springs. After a two hour drive, one of my lactose intolerant friends, whom had ice cream the day before, started off, started us off strong with a bathroom emergency.

Danielle (10:43)

I love lactose intolerant people because they're all like, it's fine.

Cassie (10:46)

It's like, it's worth it.

Danielle (10:48)

Worth it.

Cassie (10:50)

Every single person's like, but it's either cheese or ice cream that they're willing to just put their lives on the line for.

Danielle (10:56)

Yeah. And we all know someone who's lactose intolerant. You are. You either are the person or you know the person. And every time there's an opportunity, there's always a moment where they're like, what am I doing later? I'm free.

Cassie (11:10)

Close proximity to a restroom.

Danielle (11:12)

It's like, am I busy leader? Can I eat this?

Cassie (11:14)

And they never have the pills because. Don't. Aren't there pills you can take, like preemptively is?

Danielle (11:18)

I think so. I'm not lactose intolerance. I'm not super familiar, but yeah, we.

Cassie (11:22)

Know the lactose intolerant people. We are not them. But I'm pretty sure there are pills and tablets you can take. Like if you plan to go out for ice cream or have a pizza later or something that helps lessen the severity. I don't know much about it, but this person did not have those. This is not a super populated spot. So there were no toilets available at the trailhead. One friend was searching for anything that resembled toilet paper in the car. Two of us were standing guard to hide her from children in the parking lot and the other was holding her up while she shat into a plastic bag in a birthing style position.

Danielle (11:56)

God. Well, those are true friends. I've never had a friend do that for me.

Cassie (12:01)

That's another layer of friendship that truly is. Oh, okay. They go on to say, this is not the main point of the Story. This just felt like an omen for how our afternoon would go.

Danielle (12:14)

So you're setting the scene.

Cassie (12:15)

We're leaving that behind. We're moving on. The hot spring was positioned right on the Colorado river, so it was possible to have one foot in the hot spring and the other in the cold river looming above it. There was a huge cliff that a few kids were jumping off of. We watched them smack into the water over and over, and every time I had the thought, hell, no, I am not going to do that, and these Colorado kids are crazy. That is until one of my friends spoke up and said, guys, I think I'm gonna do it. Which we knew meant that if one of us was gonna do it, we all had to do it. If your friend jumped off of a cliff, would you? The answer is immediately yes. Friend number one climbs up to the top of the cliff and sends it. She crawled out of the water in decent condition, but she later confessed that the water shot up her crotch, leading to the quick decision to pull her tampa tampon out underwater and after stored it in her empty sandwich bag. Friend number two asks a 12 year old boy if she can borrow his life jacket. So she straps on a ridiculously small life jacket and also sends it. She crawls out of the water screaming, my vagina. After suffering the same fate.

Danielle (13:24)

Oh, man.

Cassie (13:25)

Friend number three sends it. She bruised her tailbone from the smack and had to sit on a cushion for weeks. Friend number four couldn't get in the water due to fresh ink, so she was saved by the tattoo gods. Finally, it's my turn. I had a bad gut feeling and was hesitant at the top, so the kids at the bottom started to chant.

Danielle (13:43)

Do it, do it, do it. The worst. Oh my God, the pressure.

Cassie (13:50)

After all we had just put them through, I didn't want let them down, so I sent it. And this wasn't just a smack. It was a smack. As an Ohio girl, I did not know that you were supposed to hit the water pencil style to break the impact. I just flung my limp body into the air and landed in a seated position and it felt like smacking into concrete. The air was knocked out of my lungs and I crawled out gasping with my bathing suit twisted and my boobs out. I feel so bad for those kids. Well, depending on how old they are, you probably gave them a show. My lower back had gone into full spasm from the impact. My friend held me in the hot spring in the second birthing. Sorry, the second birthing position of the day. While the others ran around Asking if anyone was a doctor. They actually found someone and she kept telling me to move my toes so that we would know if there was any paralysis. Any small movement sent my back into spasm, so we knew I would be unable to make the hike back. The game plan was to have three of my friends hike back to the car while one stayed with me so that we could wave down a rafter to potentially help us out. It worked and we got into the raft with two dads, their children, and their dogs. These kind strangers handed me a beer while my friend cradled me in the third birthing position of the day. They also happened to be from Cincinnati, which is where I was going to school at the time. There was no cell service where we were at, so the others were told to just drive downstream and look out for a dirt lot where they could wait for us. We waited, worrying that they went too far or that we were going to be stranded there. But they eventually found us and we all got into the car exhausted. Later, we googled the cliff and learned that it is referred to as the big kahuna due to it being approximately 50ft above water level, the equivalent to a five story building. What are you?

Danielle (15:38)

I could not be peer pressured into that. That you have some. You are brave. You were brave to be like a.

Cassie (15:46)

Lot about vaginas, but you got balls.

Danielle (15:49)

You got balls. Yeah.

Cassie (15:51)

Oh my God. No. I remember. So in Keene, when. Where I went to school, Keene state in New Hampshire, there was a nearby quarry that had cliff jumping and I was really close to a couple of guys that lived on our floor. They were actually my neighbors and they were like always there in the summer or in the. When the weather was appropriate or they were sending it off of snow and stuff or skiing and things in the winter. So I went one time and one time only. And there was three like levels and I don't know how big the. The highest one was, but it certainly looked way too high that I would ever. And I have a thing with her heights anyways, so I was like, absolutely not. I did the lowest one and from up top looking down, it looked like I was. I was in space. But then when I was in the water, I felt like I could just reach up and touch the top of.

Danielle (16:42)

It, you know, like, oh, that wasn't a fire jump.

Cassie (16:46)

Never, never. Have you cliff jumped?

Danielle (16:47)

Yeah. No.

Cassie (16:50)

Okay.

Danielle (16:51)

I did. So there's a little river. I haven't even thought of this memory in a long time, but there's a river in the town that I Grew up. And it's kind of like a local secret. Ish. Except all the locals know about it, but if you're coming from out of town, you would have no idea where it was. And we went. We would go after school because it was within walking distance of our school. So especially during the summertime at schools, like letting out before, right before, we would walk there after school, and I went there with a group of friends, and everyone was jumping off the cliff that was there. It was not 50ft. I mean, I would guess that this was maybe 15, 20ft. Like, it was definitely a jump. And it was into a river that was. Had a current, like, pretty close after. So you had to jump in this specific spot or you would get dragged down the river. And I was pretty nervous because I just. I am a person that I am excited to try things and do things, but I like to watch someone else do it first. Like, I'm not the person who's like, yeah, let's go. And I jump. I need to watch other people do it first and see. See what the outcomes are. And so I was watching all my friends do it, and then one of my friends was like, let's do it together. And we, like, held hands and jumped in. She landed in the pool part. I landed in the current part, and I got dragged down the river. I was fine. I didn't. It. I didn't go very far. But then I was across the river on the other side, and one of my friends had to help me swim back across.

Cassie (18:15)

It's. It's frightening. And I know that, you know, Katie's okay, and it sounds like her friends are too, but I. I mean, when I was in high school, there was an incident that scarred me forever. And I wasn't there, but one of my classmates died cliff jumping.

Danielle (18:31)

Oh, wow.

Cassie (18:32)

In my town, there's a place called Wildcat Falls, which was very popular for cliff jumping and swimming and things like that. But it has a pretty gnarly current at certain times of the year, depending on the precipitation and things like that. And he was with a group of friends, and just like, you know, hundreds of other people have done before him and continued to do. And he just. He jumped in and another person jumped immediately, immediately after him, and it disoriented him in the water, and he drowned. And I just. From there on out, I mean, I just said I had gone at the quarry in college later, but that was never far from my mind. And I just. To me, it's just not worth it. I don't Even really enjoy it. But I can totally understand the peer pressure of this scenario and, like, everyone's doing it, and it kind of feels like almost like a rite of passage type of thing. So I get it.

Danielle (19:23)

It's like a little adrenaline.

Cassie (19:25)

Yeah.

Danielle (19:26)

Rush that you get with your friends. I. People do it all the time for fun, but then.

Cassie (19:31)

But then you get smacked and things happen.

Danielle (19:32)

You get smacked.

Cassie (19:34)

Okay, so back to the story. The following week, I had a black and purple bruise covering my entire thigh, a heating pad jangly strapped to my back, and pain patches on everything. Back in Ohio, I did four months of PT twice a week, and the pain slowly faded.

Danielle (19:49)

Oh, no. You need PT with it, too.

Cassie (19:52)

Okay, so this is no small thing. Yeah. This is a pretty significant injury.

Danielle (19:56)

Yes.

Cassie (19:56)

Months later, one of my friends was in a university class and told someone next to her about our day at Radium Springs. When she mentioned the location, the girl gasped and told her that she had a friend who jumped off the same cliff and unfortunately became paralyzed from the waist down.

Danielle (20:11)

Wow. Okay, that's awful.

Cassie (20:13)

Let's rethink jumping from here. We are so lucky that no one had that level of injury. I'd like to take this moment to emphasize the importance of proper form. Land feet first, keep your body streamlined and tight. With your core engaged, cross your arms or cover your mouth and nose with your hands. And avoid holding your nose as the water pressure can cause injury. I pulled this from Google. Feel free to fact check this. I didn't, so take that for what you will. As soon as I was healed, I returned to Colorado at the same internship. It was ski season, and I learned to ski from scratch, eventually and carefully progressed to black diamond, and then eventually broke my leg on a flat green. If you're an Ohio girl with big dreams, you may also return home more than once on crutches, pain meds. So be careful out there. Enjoy the view, but watch your smack, Katie. If I have to think about form and proper things in, like, such a quick. I don't want to do it. I don't want to do it. I'm not interested if I'm like, if I don't do this right, I could become paralyzed. I don't want to do it.

Danielle (21:11)

Yeah, I can't relate because I feel like I do a lot of things that I could potentially become paralyzed. I mean, I ride a motorcycle.

Cassie (21:18)

You do?

Danielle (21:19)

I snowboard. I mountain bike. I. Yeah, I don't cliff jump, though, anymore.

Cassie (21:25)

Well, it's your turn. We're just staring at each other. I'm not about to say anything else. Hey, just a quick little reminder. You know that doctor's appointment you were supposed to make a while ago? That one you meant to book but completely got sidetracked and spaced it.

Danielle (21:46)

It.

Cassie (21:46)

It's time to get that done. Oh my God. Who said that? Okay, it was me. About Me I have a whiteboard above my desk and I have making my dentist appointment on my list that just keeps staying on the list and I'm venturing to guess you have something similar. So let's do it together. Let's get those appointments booked with Zocdoc. They make it easy to find the right doctor right now and it's all online. Zocdoc is a free app and website where you can search and compare high quality in network doctors and click to instantly book an appointment. And we all know that insurance and figuring out in network providers can be the most confusing thing on planet earth. But with ZocDoc you can book in network appointments with more than a hundred thousand doctors across every specialty from mental health to dental health, primary care to urgent care and more. You can filter through. Doctors who take your insurance are located near you, are a good fit for any medical need you may have, and are highly rated by verified patients. Once you find the right doctor, you can see their actual appointment openings. Choose a time slot that works for you and your schedule and click to instantly book a visit. Once I decide to do things, I like them done fast. So I love that appointments made through Zocdoc happen quickly, typically within just 24 to 72 hours of booking and even offer same day appointments. I'll be using Zocdoc for this dentist appointment just as I have used them for other appointments in the past. They're my go to. So stop putting off those doctor's appointments and go to Zocdoc.com NPAD to find and instantly book a top rated doctor today. That's Zocdoc.com NPAD Zocdoc.com NPAD.

Danielle (23:25)

All right, well my next story is titled Sneaky Quick Salt and Surreptitious Stares from strangers. Hi gorgeous gals. Megan here, she her big fan of the pod and you both. But I'll keep the gushing to a minimum to keep this story shortish a giant challenge for me. So my story takes place in Death Valley National Park. I visited a few times in the late spring and summer, but last spring, March 2024 I had the amazing opportunity to visit while Lake Manley was making a very rare appearance. Lake Manly is a remnant of a prehistoric lake that existed in Death Valley thousands of years ago. Nowadays, the location where the lake used to be is Badwater Basin, a giant salt flat and the lowest point in Northern America. I've been there recently. Actually. I've visited to see the flat before, and it's an absolutely gorgeous sight. Bright white salt as far as the eye can see. But like I said, last March, Death Valley experienced so much rain in the spring that Lake Manley made an appearance for the first time in 20 years. I knew I had to go see this amazing phenomenon, so I left my teenage daughter with some friends. She's not much of a desert gal. And set off for a solo trip to Death Valley. The morning I went to Badwater, I arrived well before sunrise because I wanted to watch the sunrise over the basin. There were a handful of people there enjoying the view. And what a view it was. I've attached pictures of the lake as well as the photos I grabbed from the Internet. With no water as comparison, one of the many interesting things about Lake Manley is that it's very shallow, just a few inches to a foot. Deep. Deep. I've attached a photo of another visitor who looks like they're standing in the middle of the lake, almost walking on water, but it's just shallow enough that you can walk out super far. So as I'm walking around waiting for the sun to rise and finding the best place for photos, of course, I'm noticing the ground beneath me is a little strange. It's not really sand, mostly salt. But when submerged underwater, it acted like sand for the most part. That was until I walked out onto what I thought was a stable patch of salt to get a better view. All of the sudden, I sank down to my knees. Felt this coming. As you were describing that one moment I was up, and the next I was stuck. I tried not to panic, figuring I could just step out of the hole I had created. But the more I tried to get out, the deeper I sunk. Submerging myself to my thighs, my breaths came faster as I realized that there wasn't really anyone in my vicinity to help. Although the thought of the embarrassment of asking someone to haul my ass out of a salt pit was almost worse than the thought of drowning in quicksand. Quick salt. As this was before your episode where you discussed how to get out of quicksand, I didn't know for sure, but I instinctively felt that I needed to better distribute my weight to get out of this mess. So I fell forward onto my hands and was Able to crawl my way out now that I was safe, my embarrassment overcame my fear and I glanced around, noting with relief that no one seemed to have witnessed my literal fall from grace. I was a little wet, sure, but this is Death Valley. Even in March, it's plenty warm enough that my clothes dried quickly. After another hour or so of just vibing and snapping pics, I decided it was time to walk back to the car. The lake was kind of a trek out into the flats from the parking lot maybe a half a mile from where I had parked. As I made my way back to the car, I noticed a few visitors on their way out to the lake, casting me weird glances. I am an extremely socially awkward penguin who always feels weird around strangers, so I tried to convince myself I was just imagining it. But it happened more than once. Finally, when I started to think that maybe I was in the middle of a nightmare where I showed up to school naked, a little girl who was walking by with her parents said, oh no, mommy, did that lady fall in the lake? Since my pants were completely dry, I couldn't figure out how she could have known that. But I glanced down to be sure that my pants weren't wet. My black pants, which had been soaked not in regular water, but literally swallowed by quick salt. Unbeknownst to me, although it would have been obvious if I had had thought about it, my pants had dried, but the parts that were wet were now bright white and covered in a savory salty crust. No wonder folks had been looking at me strangely. The mystery solved. I laughed and told the family what had happened and advised them to keep an eye out on their little one in the area where I had sunk. Unfortunately for me, this was the first stop in a long planned day in the park. I was about an hour and a half away from the little RV I had rented. I had no change of clothes and the salt wasn't going anywhere no matter how hard I try. So I had to spend the rest of the day in the park with weird two tone pants. Although on the plus side, my lower legs were super exfoliated and soft. When I finally made it back to my camper, there is skincare half.

Cassie (28:03)

What is it? Glass half full.

Danielle (28:04)

Yeah.

Cassie (28:05)

Yep.

Danielle (28:05)

So that's my story of almost drowning in an inch deep lake. That's only a lake every few decades or so. In addition to the pics of Lake Banley and Badwater Basin, I have also attached photos of my salty lower leg. Legs. Feel free to share the pics of the valley, but maybe my Crusty legs can stay just between us girls. Thanks for listening and thanks for all you do, particularly your advocacy for wild spaces given the threats they're facing under this current administration. Have a wonderful day and enjoy the view, but watch your back and your feet last you find yourself in a salty situation. All the best, Megan.

Cassie (28:39)

I mean, imagine trying to. It's like if you really did get caught in that and died, like she died in Death Valley's lake, people will be like, what?

Danielle (28:50)

What lake? What do you mean what lake? Yeah, I did when I was in Death Valley. They had flash flood warnings though.

Cassie (28:59)

Yeah.

Danielle (29:00)

Posted signs everywhere, which is really interesting and not a place that you would suspect that.

Cassie (29:05)

But was it two or three years ago that there was just flash flooding everywhere?

Danielle (29:09)

I felt like maybe it was this time when she's talking about oh yeah, maybe. Yeah, probably the Historically okay, my next.

Cassie (29:17)

Story is titled A Rescue from beyond the Grave. Hey ladies. I stumbled upon the pod when I was searching for something to listen to while rocking my then 9 month old daughter to sleep. I just finished episode 277 and pad turns 4. Danielle when I reached the episode about Ian, I bawled my eyes out. My condolences for your loss. The way you and Cassie have honored him on the pod is beautiful. Your talk of signs and all things from beyond the grave made me remember. I do have a story to share about my dad who ingrained the great outdoors into my life. Trigger warning, substance abuse and suicide attempt. My dad was an immigrant refugee from Southeast Asia with my mom and then five year old brother to America. They quite literally came here with nothing and had to start their life with the help from a sponsor family from the Mormon Church in Washington State. Before my parents left, my mom told me a story that my dad had gone to a fortune teller in their refugee camp. Camp Mind you, my mom didn't tell me the story until I was in my mid-20s. The fortune teller told my dad that my parents will have the baby girl they have always wanted, but he will pay for that with his life. The fortune teller predicted that my dad would pass away around the time I turned 16. My family is the we camp and fish outdoors rather than the hiking backpacking outdoors. My summer for the first 14 years of my life were filled with dispersed camping and fishing along the Snake river in eastern Washington and Idaho. When we weren't camping, we could be found fishing on Lake Washington almost every other day and weekend during the summer. We had our favorite spot in a city called Bellevue. I love Bellevue. So pretty over there. The Spot is beautiful, surrounded by huge lake homes and a gorgeous view of Mercer Island. This was our favorite spot because we would always because we always came out with a huge haul and not a lot of people would be there. In the early 2000s, my dad was laid off and then his health started to decline. Our summer weekend camping trip slowly turned into one to three times during the summer and our fishing spot in Bellevue was barely accessible for my dad since he had to use a cane to walk. In 2005, my dad and I managed to do one last fishing trip together. Unfortunately, in April of 2007 he was rushed to the ED, the emergency department and after a month of being in a coma in the icu, we were told that we had to take him off of life support. My older brother had begged my dad's doctor to wait until after Memorial Day weekend, but no such luck. My dad passed away May 20th surrounded by my brother, myself and our close family friends. We celebrated my 16th birthday eight days later, but it was one of the worst birthdays of my life. The weeks after were blurred. We had a very traditional Laotian funeral for my dad. I vividly recall after we walked his casket to where he would be cremated, a white butterfly flew over me. Fast forward to the late 2008s early 2010s. I had struggled with substance abuse and alcohol after I had started dating a terrible guy. I hadn't properly processed my dad's passing and had zero emotional support from my family, so I had turned to substances. I also wanted to mention that depression and self harm was something I struggled with for a very long time. I struggled with my identity as a second generation Asian American and having a very strict conservative immigrant parents feelings and showing emotion was not a welcome thing in our home. I accidentally overdosed one night in 2012. I had drifted off and I don't know how long I was out. I vividly recall having a dream that I was drowning but in a familiar lake. In my dream I made the connection that I was drowning in Lake Washington and realized that it was the park that my dad and I had last gone fishing at together. As I was drowning, I saw my brother's boat floating towards me. At this point in my dream I'm underwater but can still see above me. The boat is now near me and I see a man yelling over the side of the boat. I made the connection that this man was my dad. He threw over a lifebuoy towards me and I remember grabbing it as my head went above the water. I woke up from my dream and vomited. It's been 13 years since that moment. My dad truly saved my life from beyond the grave. I truly believe that he was trying to let me know that it was not my time yet and that I had a lot more to live for. And he was right. While I did drop out of college, I still found a fulfilling career in oncology healthcare. I eloped with my best friend and we have have an almost one year old daughter. I have an amazing village of friends and my true love of hiking started in 2017. Your podcast has inspired me to get outside again and I am wanting to share this with my daughter. I'm planning on taking her and my nephew to Mount Rainier national park this summer. My dad will send me signs that he's around. Every time I see a white butterfly or a grasshopper, I acknowledge that he's checking in on me. The other morning, before taking my daughter to daycare, I asked him for a sign and told him it had to be something with nature. As I was driving out of my neighborhood, I noticed a deer on the side of the road. And my gut instinct told me to slow down and to not drive past it. And the deer slowly walked out in front of me. When I got home, I noticed a squirrel chilling in a tree, glaring at me when I pulled into my carport. And I know that's him. Thank you for all that you do, the hard work you guys put into the pod. I appreciate you guys keeping me company while I put my daughter to bed every night. All the best. Jen. Jen, your dad literally threw you a lifeline.

Danielle (34:25)

Literally. Yeah.

Cassie (34:27)

And the fortune teller, like predicting everything.

Danielle (34:30)

To a T. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I mean, that moment where you're. You described your dad throwing you, throwing you, literally rope and to pull you out and then coming out and as soon as your head left the water, you woke up and vomited. I mean, that, yeah, to me is definitely a sign that he was saving your life beyond the grave.

Cassie (34:54)

And then he's still with you and, you know, just wanting the best for you. So in a bad situation, it's like your dad isn't physically here anymore. But this just goes to show to me that like, our loved ones really do never leave us. And sometimes they, most times they show up in small ways like a white butterfly and like this subtlety that you really need to be open to and really pay attention to. But other times it couldn't be more clear and more in your face. And you illustrated both in this story. So thank you so much for sharing that.

C (35:25)

Yes, you're great at protecting your own personal information. You probably even use things like two factor authentication, strong passwords and a vpn. But as much as you try to be in control of how your information is protected, there are lots of places that also have it and they might not be as careful as you are. That's why LifeLock monitors millions of data points every second for identity threats. If your identity is stolen, a LifeLock US based restoration specialist will help solve identity theft issues on your behalf, guaranteed or your money back. Plus, all LifeLock plans are backed by the million dollar protection package, meaning LifeLock will reimburse you up to the limits of your plan. If you lose money due to identity theft. You might not be able to control how others handle your personal information, but you can help protect it with LifeLock. Save up to 40% your first year. Call 1-800-LIFELOCK and use promo code IHEART or go to lifelock.com iheart for 40% off. Terms apply.

Danielle (36:24)

All right, my next story is titled the Time I Went to Joshua Tree, Found God, Got Lost and Almost Died. In that order. Hi there. I've only recently started listening to your show, but I immediately became obsessed after I listened to one of your episodes. I usually info dump the entire plot line to my partner because you always pitch pick such engaging stories. My trail tale takes place in October 2019. I was feeling burnt out and dissatisfied for my accounting job and was also still processing a difficult breakup from earlier in the year. Initially, I took time off on a random slow week of October for a staycation, but a co worker of mine, hearing that I didn't have any plans for my long weekend, offered to let me use a property of hers just outside of Joshua Tree. I had never heard of Joshua Tree before and wasn't particularly interested, but several friends of mine made it clear that I would be be stupid not to go. I figured going on a trip might help clear my head because it was last minute. I drove to Joshua Tree by myself. This was the first time I'd ever gone on vacation completely alone. At first it was liberating. I had plenty of time to reflect and go at my own pace. On my drive down, I impulsively decided to stop at Yosemite since I'd never been there before either. The detour added about three hours to my drive and I didn't get to the house until 2am but it was worth it. It not only was Yosemite gorgeous, but I also passed through a tiny town in the middle of the woods that had an accounting firm. It felt like a sign that I could do my job anywhere and I didn't have to feel stuck with my current one. I saw all the major sites all over Joshua Tree. Later in the day I was hiking around the oasis of Mara and sat down on a boulder to enjoy the peaceful silence. I looked around the flowing landscape imagining the millions of years of history shaping these rocks rocks and felt connected to the universe. I felt like God was in everything from pleasant and unpleasant things, including my grief and frustration. The meaning of life for me at least must be to try to understand God by understanding myself, other people and the world around me. I figured if God is everywhere and there's no way to know for sure what happens in the afterlife, then heaven is a privilege of being alive. Just to clarify, I was not high nor am I a super religious person, but after that trip I started to believe there is a particular beauty to the national parks that can bring on spiritual musings even while completely sober. Eventually I realized it was 4pm and I should start to head back before the sunset, but the trails were not clearly marked and I got confused. I found a sign that I thought was pointing to the parking lot, but I must have misread it because it led me to a drop off that was about 10ft high. After deliberating, I decided to jump down. I landed in a pile of sand so I wasn't hurt, but when I realized how long my fall was, I knew that I had made a mistake. There was no way back up that rock. I tried to deny being lost. Despite the red flags, no one crossed my path. Nothing looked familiar. The gravel on the trail was completely undisturbed and flocks of quail would fly out of the bushes as I passed as if they had never seen a person all day. It wasn't until I had been walking for about an hour when I hit a dead end. Even though my phone had no service, the blue dot on my maps app still showed my location. According to my phone, I was right next to the parking lot, but I had to climb a steep 100 foot tall pile of rocks in order to get there. I have no experience with rock climbing or bouldering. I had to decide quickly. Once the sun set, predators would come out and I wouldn't be able to see my path. There was no way I could retrace my steps and get to my car before it got dark, so the shortest route was up. I tried to grab and step on the most stable rocks, but I climbed in fear that one wrong move might lead to A rock slide that would surely injure me. I couldn't call for help and no one knew where I was. All the while I wasn't sure if my phone's directions were accurate and I would get to the top of the hill only to find more wilderness. Luckily I made it to the top and I could see the parking lot and my car in the distance. I screamed and celebrated taking photos of the long route up. Now I had to go downhill and this side was covered in cacti. Somehow pattern recognition kicked in overdrive and I was able to find a cacti free path path. It would be windy, indirect and slow, but at least it was safe. When I finally reached the bottom on flat ground right by the parking lot, I saw signs saying that the area I was just walking in was closed because the soil was contaminated with heavy metals like arsenic, lead and cobalt. Don't worry, I didn't get poisoned. But damn. At that point as the sun was setting, I just wanted to rush home and take a shower on top of my reflections about the nature of the universe. This trip was when I decided to quit my job so I could travel. The overwhelming beauty and proximity to danger made me realize there much more to life than being stuck behind a desk with an incompetent, demanding and micromanaging boss. We feel that. Well, hell yeah, I'm glad I quit when I did too, because I was able to visit four different major cities I'd always wanted to see right before the shutdown at the start of the pandemic. As healing as it was to go on this trip alone, ultimately I prefer traveling with loved ones. It's both more enjoyable and safer. Now I don't hike alone without a walkie talkie so I can contact someone in an emergency. And I always let someone know where I'm going beforehand. I lucked out this time. Time. But there are so many ways my one mistake could have gone wrong and I could have ended up as a story on your podcast. I'm happy I got the chance to keep living after rediscovering my love for life. Thanks for letting me share. I attached a few photos from the top of the hill I climbed in case you're interested. Enjoy the view, but follow the trails. Cass.

Cassie (41:47)

I mean, it's hard at Joshua Tree especially is so hard. Especially because we were just there. Those trails are difficult to follow.

Danielle (41:53)

Yeah, they are. And it's just a lot of it is just rock. It's just rock and open space and.

Cassie (41:59)

And sand. That's just like winding around and you can kind of see like where people's footprints and stuff are. But again, like do you really want to trust just going on that? Like I can understand how getting turned around so easily, especially in Somewhere in Joshua Tree, is to do. But I also appreciated the like finding like not even finding spirituality, but just like considering it and pondering it. Because again, especially in somewhere like Joshua Tree where I think that's such a theme, so many people go there for that exact reason or find and discover an experience like that while they're there. There's something about Joshua Tree that makes that just something that so many people stumble upon or intentionally seek out.

Danielle (42:43)

Yeah, there's a different energy in Joshua Tree that brings that out that can be found in other places as well, but just feels feels stronger there for some reason.

C (42:52)

Yeah, I know you're great at protecting your own personal information. You probably even use things like two factor authentication, strong passwords and a vpn. But as much as you try to be in control of how your information is protected, there are lots of places that also have it and they might not be as careful as you are. That's why LifeLock monitors millions of data points every second for identity threats. If your identity is stolen, a LifeLock US based restoration specialist will help solve identity theft issues on your behalf, guaranteed or your money back. Plus, all LifeLock plans are backed by the million dollar protection package, meaning LifeLock will reimburse you up to the limits of your plan if you lose money due to identity theft. You might not be able to control how others handle your personal information, but you can help protect it with LifeLock. Save up to 40% your first year. Call 1-800-LIFELOCK and use promo code IHEART or go to lifelock.com iheart for 40% off. Terms apply.

Cassie (43:51)

Okay, well my last story is titled the Stinky Ghost so I feel like we're Stinky Ghost going somewhere else. Hi ladies. Long time listener, first time writing in. Before diving into my story, I wanted to share my thanks to you both for creating my hands down favorite podcast. I frequently make the two hour commute between LA and San Diego and so I listen to a lot of podcasts guests. I stumbled upon your show very early on. I think it was the second episode and have been hooked ever since.

Danielle (44:19)

Wow.

Cassie (44:20)

Second episode is you're a real one. I love tuning in every single week and I'm always rooting for you both through life's hardships and good times. I think I can speak for all of your longtime listeners when I say thank you for all the incredible stories and hours of entertainment. Never stop. I had to write in today after listening to your episode on America's oldest ghost Tour. But my story is not about Harper's Ferry, rather your recent ghost tour in Old Town San Diego, because I have taken that exact same tour. No, no. Having grown up on Scooby Doo and Nancy Drew, my siblings and I love ghost tours. Every new city we visit together, we try and hop on one. They're not expensive, sometimes they're even free. And to be perfectly honest, I learned more about the local history from ghost tours than many professional tours. The guides are always so passionate and knowledgeable and keep you engaged with tales, tales from regions beyond. From killers on the cobblestone streets of Rome to the haunted Red Lake district of Skagway, Alaska. We've gone worldwide in our quest for spooky stories. Anyway, I'm from San Diego and have been on several Old Town ghost tours. As soon as you describe your recent guide wearing regular clothes, deadpan delivery, lots of personal ghost sightings with no historical context telling you to reach out to pet a ghost boy, I realize I've been on that same same exact ghost tour. It was a few years back in the depths of COVID and my sister, brother and I were looking for something fun and local to do that was mostly outdoors. We stumbled upon this ghost tour and like that, the guide had more of a realistic take, not the scripted, dare I say cheesy costume tour guides that are typical of ghost tours. Though those guides are also a fun time. Not gonna lie, maybe it was the margaritas we had before the tour began, but we were getting a kick out of his deadpan delivery and were on the verge of a hysterical laughter throughout the ENT tour. We didn't have margaritas and I feel like we had a similar experience. The absolute kicker came when we went inside the historic hotel. Gathered around the bar silently listening as he recounted stories of phantom orbs and ghostly lights. Out of nowhere, my brother leaned over to us and whispered, I'm about to fart. In a room that quiet and crowded with air, so deathly still, there was not much we could do in the few seconds we had besides desperately scooting as far away from him as possible to avoid anyone thinking we were the gas surpassers. As you can imagine, in a stale wood paneled room, the sound reverberated like a shot and the tour guide was suddenly more excited that I'd seen him all night. Did anyone hear that? I think the spirits are responding to us you could tell this was going to be a tale for a future tour. To which the sarcastic dad in the group next to us said, must be a stinky ghost.

Danielle (47:07)

Ghost.

Cassie (47:07)

I don't think we ever fully recovered from the hilarity of that moment. And my sister swear she really did pet a ghost cat that night. Anyways, thank you for bringing so much joy and knowledge to your listeners. I look forward every Monday to your stories. Cheers. Shelby. Shelby.

Danielle (47:22)

So funny.

Cassie (47:23)

We have sat at that bar in that hotel.

Danielle (47:27)

Exactly what you were describing.

Cassie (47:30)

That room, his delivery, how quiet it is. And. Yeah. Oh, God, I can. Could just see ourselves in it. He didn't tell us that story, though, so.

Danielle (47:39)

He didn't. It didn't make it to our tour, but maybe. Maybe others he tells it in. It has been years.

Cassie (47:44)

It has been years. Yeah, but. Oh, my God, I just. I'm so happy that somebody knows the. I don't even know the word for it. Strife, the anguish, the hilarity, the weirdness of that experience.

Danielle (47:57)

Yeah.

Cassie (47:57)

And I feel like I'm shaming. I'm not shaming him. It's just. Was so unique.

Danielle (48:02)

It was unique. That is for sure. It was memorable. We'll never forget that tour, Right?

Cassie (48:08)

I'll never forget it. I wish I knew more. Like, I wish I retained more knowledge about Old Town San Diego and not just that person, but, like, I couldn't even. I could barely even tell you, other than the Cosmopolitan Hotel. That was a stop on that tour. The only reason I know the name of that building is because we stayed in it separately. Yeah, like, I wouldn't have known any. I don't know any of the other buildings that we stopped at, what they.

Danielle (48:30)

Were, what they used to be used for, what they're used for now.

Cassie (48:34)

Yeah.

Danielle (48:34)

Why they're haunted.

Cassie (48:35)

He's like, oh, the Whaley House, I guess.

Danielle (48:37)

Yeah.

Cassie (48:38)

Well, that was it for my regular. Are you done?

Danielle (48:40)

Yeah, I'm done, too. Oh, but I do have one. I do have a bonus one. If you're on Patreon or Apple subscriptions, we both have some bonus stories for you. So the episode doesn't have to end now if you want to head over there and hang out with us. Mine is titled Emergency Landing in Antarctica.

Cassie (48:57)

And mine is titled Kentucky Cobra.

Danielle (48:59)

Us. Oh, all right, well, we'll see you all over there. But if not, that's okay. And in the meantime, enjoy.

Cassie (49:06)

That was so sad. It's all right.

Danielle (49:08)

I guess it's okay if you don't want to be there, but it's fine, really.

Cassie (49:12)

It's we're not hurt at all.

Danielle (49:14)

Not even a little bit.

Cassie (49:17)

Doesn't upset us. I won't even think about it again. Enjoy the view, but watch your back.

Danielle (49:24)

This is a weird, dramatic ending.

Cassie (49:28)

Thank you for joining us again this week. If you have a trail tale of your own you'd like to share, you can write to us@npadstoriesmail.com or visit our website at npadpodcast.com bonus trail tales and content are available to Patreon members and Apple subscribers. Follow the show on Instagram, TikTok, Facebook, and X at National Park After Dark. And if you prefer to watch our episode, you can find us on YouTube at National Park After Dark. And as always, if you enjoy the show, please take a moment to rate, review and subscribe. Wherever you listen to podcasts.

C (50:15)

You'Re great at protecting your own personal information. You probably even use things like two factor authentication, strong passwords and a vpn. But as much as you try to be in control of how your information is protected, there are lots of places that also have it and they might not be as careful as you are. That's why LifeLock monitors millions of data points every second for identity threats. If your identity is stolen, a LifeLock US based restoration specialist will help solve identity theft issues on your behalf, guaranteed or your money back. Plus, all LifeLock plans are backed by the million dollar protection package, meaning LifeLock will reimburse you up to the limits of your plan if you lose money due to identity theft. You might not be able to control how others handle your personal information, but you can help protect it with LifeLock. Save up to 40% your first year. Call 1-800-LIFELOCK and use promo code IHEART or go to lifelock.com iheart for 40% off. Terms apply.

Danielle (51:14)

Not all meals are created equal.

C (51:17)

For instance, breakfast has the spicy egg.

Danielle (51:20)

McMuffin for a limited time, and lunch does it McDonald's breakfast.