Brad, Chad, and Thad: Self-worth in the Dating World with Anna Kai

Summary

Networth and Chill with Your Rich BFF: Episode Summary
Episode: Brad, Chad, and Thad: Self-worth in the Dating World with Anna Kai
Release Date: November 13, 2024
Host: Vivian Tu
Guest: Anna Kai

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Introduction: Vivian Tu's Journey in Dating and Self-Worth

In this engaging episode of Networth and Chill, Vivian Tu opens up about her personal journey in the dating world, highlighting the challenges she faced while striving to understand her self-worth and financial independence. Reflecting on her early days on Wall Street, Vivian emphasizes the importance of recognizing one’s value and the necessity of both dating high-value individuals and embodying high-value traits oneself.

Notable Quote:
Vivian Tu [02:48]: "Today we're going to talk about my absolute favorite topic. Dating."

Anna Kai's Worst Date Experience: Navigating Sobriety and Dietary Restrictions

Anna Kai shares a humorous yet insightful account of her worst date experience. While adhering to a sober and vegan lifestyle for personal reasons, she recounts how one particular date tested her boundaries and highlighted the challenges of maintaining her values in the dating scene.

Notable Quotes:
Anna Kai [03:48]: "The worst date I've ever been on was actually kind of hilarious."
Anna Kai [05:35]: "He was trying to convince me to drink, but I was serious. I don't drink right now."

Realizing Self-Worth Through a Pivotal Relationship

Anna delves into a transformative relationship that spanned six weeks, which ultimately led her to prioritize her career and personal growth over unhealthy relationships. This period was crucial in her decision to pursue real estate, leading to financial stability and personal empowerment.

Notable Quote:
Anna Kai [08:31]: "I could either be depressed and wallow in my apartment forever, or I could just go out and become the best fucking real estate agent I could possibly become."

Career Path: From Liberal Arts to Real Estate and Social Media

Anna discusses her unconventional career trajectory, starting from a liberal arts major at NYU's Gallatin School, venturing into acting, transitioning to real estate, and eventually finding success as a social media content creator. She highlights the flexibility and financial benefits that real estate offered her, especially during challenging times like the pandemic.

Notable Quotes:
Anna Kai [12:20]: "I was a liberal arts major. I wanted to be a performer, creative, ever since I was 10 years old."
Anna Kai [15:48]: "As an actress, my best year I made $30,000... In my best year in real estate, I was making $120,000 a year."

Transition to Social Media: Finding the Right Niche

Facing the downturn in acting and real estate opportunities during the pandemic, Anna pivoted to social media. After struggling with initial content creation, a pivotal call with a TikTok coach redirected her focus to authentic storytelling about dating and relationships, leading to viral success and a flourishing online presence.

Notable Quotes:
Anna Kai [20:13]: "My TikTok coach shouted, 'Why are you doing these reels? You could just tell a story.'"
Anna Kai [21:18]: "It hit like half a million views in the first day or something like that."

Who Pays on the First Date: Traditional Roles vs. Modern Perspectives

A significant portion of the discussion revolves around the dynamics of who should pay on the first date. Anna advocates for traditional roles where the man pays, emphasizing her upbringing and values instilled by her father. She contrasts this with the modern trend of splitting expenses, explaining her preference for a "provider mentality" in relationships.

Notable Quotes:
Anna Kai [22:12]: "The man. Money is a lot of things, but it is not everything."
Anna Kai [24:36]: "We don't really split expenses. It's all one big fungible pot."

Financial Harmony in Relationships: A Partnership Approach

Vivian and Anna explore how financial discussions and arrangements impact marital relationships. Anna shares her seamless approach with her husband Dave, where finances are treated as a unified pool, fostering mutual support and shared financial goals. She underscores the importance of aligning financial values and communication to maintain harmony.

Notable Quotes:
Anna Kai [37:41]: "We don't really split expenses. It's all one big fungible pot."
Anna Kai [40:20]: "We're legally married... We have this tacit understanding that this is all one fungible pot of funds for us."

Friendship Dynamics: Letting Go and Embracing Authenticity

Addressing the topic of friendships, Anna discusses the tendency, especially among women, to hold onto relationships out of a desire for approval. She recounts a personal experience of terminating a toxic friendship, highlighting the liberation that comes from prioritizing genuine connections over superficial bonds.

Notable Quotes:
Anna Kai [41:40]: "Women do it because we've been taught that our value lies in who wants us and who likes us."
Anna Kai [43:59]: "Being disliked has been the best thing for me. It's been so freeing."

Cultivating Confidence Through Courage and Self-Acceptance

Anna differentiates between confidence and courage, emphasizing that true confidence stems from facing fears rather than an inherent trait. She advocates for embracing vulnerability and making choices that align with one’s authentic self, even in the face of uncertainty.

Notable Quotes:
Anna Kai [44:10]: "Courage is so much more important than confidence because courage stems from feeling fear and doing it anyways."
Anna Kai [45:08]: "Make sure you're willing to accept the reality if it hits you."

Advice for Younger Selves and Financial Pitfalls

When asked about advice to her younger self, Anna opts for no advice, believing that making mistakes is crucial for personal growth. She also shares her biggest financial mistake—spending money out of guilt in a past relationship—underscoring the importance of financial independence and self-worth.

Notable Quotes:
Anna Kai [45:16]: "She just has to make the mistakes. I would not be here if I didn't do all that stupid shit in my 20s."
Anna Kai [47:52]: "Don't spend money out of guilt. Maybe that's the takeaway from that period of my life."

Conclusion: Embracing Authenticity and Financial Empowerment

The episode wraps up with reflections on the importance of authenticity in both personal relationships and financial decisions. Anna and Vivian reinforce the idea that understanding one’s worth and maintaining financial independence are pivotal for healthy, fulfilling relationships.

Notable Quotes:
Anna Kai [49:24]: "No one should make you feel guilty about pretty much anything unless you feel guilty for actually something that you've done a hundred percent."
Anna Kai [29:53]: "You can find me on Instagram and TikTok, Abe both is my handle."

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Final Thoughts:
This episode offers a candid exploration of self-worth, financial independence, and authentic relationships. Through Anna Kai's personal anecdotes and insights, listeners gain valuable perspectives on navigating the complexities of modern dating, managing finances within relationships, and fostering genuine connections both romantically and platonically.

Transcript

[Vivian Tu]

Who do you think pays on the first date?

[Anna Kai]

The man. Money is a lot of things, but it is not everything. I personally do not believe in prenups.

[Vivian Tu]

This episode of Net Worth and Chill is brought to you by Marshalls. I love sharing new tips on how to make the most of your money. And one of the biggest misconceptions about looking good is that you have to spend. Spend a lot and I'll be real with you. I want those high quality items that'll last. But I'm also on the hunt for the best deal. How can I dress in brand name on trend pieces without maxing out my credit cards? My go to place to do that is Marshalls where I know I can get the brands I love at 20 to 60% off retail prices. Visit a store or head to marshalls.com to see what good stuff you can find today. What's up rich friends? Welcome to another episode of Net Worth and Chill. I'm your host Vivian Tu, AKA your rich BFF and your favorite Wall street girly. And today we're going to talk about my absolute favorite topic. Dating. Now, I may be happily married, but let me tell you, the road to finding Prince Charming was rough, to say the least. I had to kiss a lot of frogs and I definitely didn't always have the confidence or the high standards that I have now. Like many people, in particular women, I was conditioned to accept the bare minimum. Thankfully, while I was working on Wall Street, I had an incredible mentor who really explained to me why it's so essential to know my worth and not only date a high value person, but to be a high value person. Like, trust me, the guy who texts you at 3am and won't be seen with you in the daylight probably isn't going to treat you correctly. You deserve way more than that and sometimes dating can make you feel like you don't deserve that. With Tinder, Grindr, Hinge, Bumble, There are literally a thousand ways to date nowadays, but people are feeling more discouraged than ever when it comes to finding a partner. 79% of Gen Z says they feel burnt out from dating apps, despite it being one of the most common ways people meet potential partners. And people feel stuck when it comes to dating. And while my mentor was like a big sister guiding me both in my career and personal life, not everyone has that person so readily available. But they can certainly find one on the Internet. Today's guest kind of serves as the Internet's big sister and dating coach. She's a content creator and the queen of Giving pep talks. Everyone, please welcome Anna Kai.

[Anna Kai]

Hi. It's so exciting to be here and talk about all things dating and money.

[Vivian Tu]

Yeah. And honestly, it is so nice to meet you irl, because I feel like we're soul sisters every time.

[Anna Kai]

I. I cannot believe it's taken me this long to actually meet you in real life, but this is so amazing. Also, guys, she's like 8ft tall. I did not realize this Vivian is so tall. So when she stood up, I was like, oh, my gosh, she's got such a pressure on her.

[Vivian Tu]

I know everyone thinks I'm like small Asian woman, but I'm like five, seven.

[Anna Kai]

Who's tall in your family?

[Vivian Tu]

My dad. My mom's small, but my dad is very tall.

[Anna Kai]

How tall is he?

[Vivian Tu]

Like, I don't know. I don't know. But, like, tall. Like, he's taller than me.

[Anna Kai]

Like, he's certainly tall. So there's. I was like, there's a tall gene there, which is rare for Asian women because most of the time I'm like, average high.

[Vivian Tu]

Yeah, yeah.

[Anna Kai]

You know, for sure.

[Vivian Tu]

For sure, yes. But like you mentioned, we've been Internet friends for so long, but I'm really excited to talk to you in person. But since we're really only just starting to get to know each other, kind of like a first date, I want to know what's the worst date you've ever been on?

[Anna Kai]

So the worst date I've ever been on was actually kind of hilarious. I was sober and vegan for about 10 months in my 20s.

[Vivian Tu]

You didn't want to have any fun?

[Anna Kai]

Yeah, literally, no, No. I did it because of a guy, obviously. I wish I could say yes. So I dated a guy for six weeks who was sober and vegan, and he ruined my life. I don't even know if we have enough time to go into that. But I came out of that six week long situationship and I decided I was gonna go sober and vegan. Cause he was. And I was trying to find myself and depressed. So I figured not drinking and not eating meat was going to help, which it actually really did. And it taught me a lot about what I can kind of withhold from. And I was like, okay, I can be disciplined. But during that time, I was also heavily dating. So that is a very awkward thing to tell people on a first date. And so what I. Cause I don't think it's fair when you have that many dietary restrictions to spring that on somebody on a first date in New York City especially. And especially we're talking about eight years ago. So I think every bar now has a mocktail section. Yes. But eight years ago, that was not a thing. So I would tell the guy, you know, we would get to the point on a dating app where he'd be like, okay, what are you doing on Friday? Let's meet up in real life. And I would say, sure, would love to. Just so you know, I am sober and vegan. I don't care if you drink or if you eat meat. I just wanted to let you know so you're not caught off guard. You know, if that's an issue, totally understand. And it never was. Except for one man who told me that it wasn't an issue. But then I remember exactly the date I was. It was right before Thanksgiving. We went to Cosme, which is.

[Vivian Tu]

Yeah, yeah, fancy Mexican.

[Anna Kai]

Fancy Mexican, fine. Interesting choice for somebody who's vegan. But there were plenty of options there for me to pick from. And I got there, and it's kind of a party scene for those of you who haven't been. It's kind of loud in there and it's very dark, and it's just a scene. And he then proceeds to spend the entire night trying to convince me to drink. He was like, no, you don't really, like. You don't really not drink, do you? I'm like, no, I was serious. That wasn't a joke. I don't drink right now. I don't know if I will drink in the future, but right now that is not a thing in my life. And he was like, okay, cool. So. And then I think if it had been me now, I would have just left. But I had the mentality back then that even if I wasn't having a good time, I had to make the date good for the other person.

[Vivian Tu]

Even if you don't like them, you want them to like you.

[Anna Kai]

Exactly. Because it's this strong desire to be approved by somebody who really does not matter in my life. And so. And this was crazy too. I was in a real dark place or something at this point. Cause I can't. I never used to go back to guys apartments after the first date because.

[Vivian Tu]

That'S where we're different.

[Anna Kai]

I mean, and we're all alive. I actually had like a pretty not great experience doing that in my early 20s. And I was like, let me.

[Vivian Tu]

Oh, like serial killery vibes.

[Anna Kai]

Yeah, it was really not great. It was really not good. So I made it a point not to do that. But this guy was honestly such a fucking doofus that I was like, let me just see what. And I could. He described himself as a third culture kid, which if you guys don't know what that means, I had no idea. It's basically like his parents were diplomats. So he was born in like Saudi Arabia, but went to an American school, but then went to college in like at like Harvard or something, I don't know. So he had oodles of money and I could tell by the way he was talking. I was just kind of curious to see his apartment. It was gorgeous. I was like, this is so worth just seeing this apartment that I will never step foot in again in New York City as like, you know, a struggling 26 year old. So he spent the entire time at his apartment not even trying to hook up with me, trying to convince me to smoke weed, which I never really did. I've never. So it was honestly. And then I left. And I will say he did call me an Uber. So he paid for my Uber, which was very nice. But then he didn't walk me downstairs. So the whole date was just kind of hilarious. Awful and just awful. And I don't know why I let it go so long. I just kept letting it continue. And yeah, he never asked me out again, but I just felt like the whole date was a challenge for to try and get the sober and vegan girl to not be sober and vegan.

[Vivian Tu]

So like deeply misinformed of him. But like I am wondering, did was that like the moment that you knew you deserved better? That you were like, going forward, I'm gonna be proud and strong and like stand up for myself?

[Anna Kai]

That was not the moment actually. The moment was the man who turned me sober and vegan. Oh, dark. Okay, okay, that. And I always think now when people DM me, they're like, I was only with this guy for X amount of time or this AM and I feel like it's ruined me more than even my long term relationships when they ended. And I think back to this one relationship that was very pivotal in my life. It was six weeks, I shit you not. It started January 1st and it ended on Valentine's Day because he ghosted me on Valentine's Day. So I think about that and I think about the reason why that relationship was so pivotal. It was because I was at a very weird place in my life. I met this man who promised me the world. Okay. I was a struggling actress. I was trying to study for my real estate license. Cause I needed a better way to make money other than all these random odd jobs. I was Doing. And I had really very little. And so this guy comes into my life. He's like eight or nine years older than me. He works in media, he's got a big fancy job.

[Vivian Tu]

He's sober and vegan.

[Anna Kai]

He's sober and vegan. He just has it together. And he's so. Just kind to me in the beginning. And he really listens. And what I didn't realize was that was love bombing because from the first date we met, he would text me all day, every day, morning until night, every 10 minutes. I don't even know how this man had a job. He actually ended up getting let go, fired, whatever, from his job in a pretty public way, which again, I've said this before in my videos, I don't think that's karma because I don't think the world revolves around me. But, like, that sucks for you, right? Yeah, I love, love that attitude. So this guy just. I could not believe what had happened to me when it all was said and done, because he basically spent six weeks convincing me that we were meant to be together forever. And I just thought age meant that he was more mature. Doesn't mean that at all. And then on Valentine's Day, he just stopped. Imagine somebody texting you, like 100 text messages a day every day for six weeks. And then on Valentine's Day, silence, Silence. And at like 11:55 on Valentine's Day, he was like, oh, sorry, it's been such a busy day. And I immediately picked up the phone. I was like, what the fuck? You know, I was like, you do this and you lead me on for what are you trying to say here? And he was like, well, I'm actually not ready to be in a committed relationship. I'm happy to continue dating you, but I'm not going to commit to you. And I was like, what have we been doing for the last six weeks and why even bring me here, right? But it was never about me. It was about what I could do for him because he had just gotten out of a very long term relationship. He had never been on the dating apps. And I think he wanted to prove to himself that he was desirable and valuable, right? And I did that for him. And then once his ego was set, he was like, great, now I'm gonna go find better and whatever. So I left that feeling very wrecked, but also just realizing that I could either be depressed and wallow in my apartment forever, or I could just go out and become the best fucking real estate agent I could possibly become. And it was the best thing that happened to me because I ended up getting my real estate license. I did really well that first year in my career, and it was the first year that I had disposable income in New York City. And I loved my job and I loved the people I worked with. And it was all because of him, because I just was like, this is not it. For me, that was the. That was the moment where I really realized that as a woman, you need to have a career in order to have true freedom.

[Vivian Tu]

Wait, I have a question about this. You talked about real estate, acting. Like, what is your background? Because I feel like neither of those are approved Asian jobs.

[Anna Kai]

Literally. What is my background? I was basically a liberal arts major in college. I wanted to be a performer, creative, ever since I was 10 years old.

[Vivian Tu]

I'm sure your parents love that.

[Anna Kai]

My parents were mortified, but they accepted it. And I will say, as far as first or immigrant Chinese parents go, they were very, very liberal in that policy. They never forced me to. First of all, I sucked at math and science, so going into banking, anything related to numbers was not a good thing. You know, I was like, that was just not going to happen. And so they supported me in the sense that my dad always said, you know, he came here and he's a chemist, and he was like, I did what I didn't want to do, not so I could force you to do what you didn't want to do, you know? So my background is. I went to nyu. I went to Gallatin, which was the School of Individualized Study, which is you.

[Vivian Tu]

Make your own major.

[Anna Kai]

You make your own major. And I just tell people it's a liberal arts major because that's the closest thing that you could sort of get. So I don't know what I studied. Honestly, I think I studied ethics, which is not employable. My thesis was on, like, kindness and how ethics are very. It was so bizarre. I don't know. Nothing employable. Right. Okay. So. And then I came out and immediately tried to become an actress. And I worked a ton of weird jobs. I was trying to sell wedding videos for a while. I.

[Vivian Tu]

Wedding videos?

[Anna Kai]

Yes. I was like a wedding. I worked at a company that produced wedding videos, so I was doing sales for them for a while. I was a personal assistant to a woman on the Upper west side. I worked at a building violation services company. It's. Yeah, my background is just as confusing as it sounds, so. But the whole goal, ever since I was a kid, was to work in something creative. And obviously, I did not think I was Going to be on social media. But, you know, acting didn't really work out then and it kind of led to this. So, yeah, it's. It's been a wild ride.

[Vivian Tu]

How did you go from acting to real estate to then social media?

[Anna Kai]

So I just. I needed a job that was flexible and I needed one that was flexible but also paid well and real estate fit the bill there so I could make my own hours. And I always loved real estate. Kind of just looking and I thought New York City real estate was really interesting and there is nothing like this real estate market here. And so that offered me the flexibility to go and audition and then go to set when I needed to when I booked a role. And then basically what happened in the Pandemic was acting and real estate are two very non pandemic friendly jobs. So I ended up leaving my real estate job. I was already with my husband at the time, who was not my husband, but we had been together long enough to know that this was it. He works in Connecticut, and so he was doing the reverse commute. We lived near Grand Central. He was taking the train. So he was like, let's move out to Connecticut. And we did that. And so all of a sudden, I am no longer a real estate agent. I am not acting because auditions have sort of ground to a halt. And especially for somebody like me who never really took off like it was. There was no opportunity there for me anymore.

[Vivian Tu]

Quick aside.

[Anna Kai]

Yeah.

[Vivian Tu]

Can I ask if you're comfortable sharing, how much money were you making as an actress and how much money were you making as a real estate agent?

[Anna Kai]

So as an actress, my best year, which was one year, by the way, I made $30,000.

[Vivian Tu]

Okay.

[Anna Kai]

Which is nothing. Yeah. Right. But it was enough to pay for my health insurance because I got union health insurance, which was actually amazing because paying for your own health insurance is so expensive. And you have the most terrible health insurance when you don't have a lot of money and. Yeah. Don't have a company. In my best year in real estate, I was making $120,000 a year.

[Vivian Tu]

Oh, nice.

[Anna Kai]

Yeah.

[Vivian Tu]

Okay. So that was really what was keeping you afloat while you were chasing this dream.

[Anna Kai]

Exactly. And I got to that 120 pretty quickly.

[Vivian Tu]

Yeah.

[Anna Kai]

So that was just a very. I think within the first two months, three months during the peak season, I made a voice.

[Vivian Tu]

So you're good at it.

[Anna Kai]

I was, you know, and it's something that I was. I also found myself in a very. I think fit is really important in terms of company culture. I found myself at a really great company. Just understood that I had this acting dream, but was very good about giving me opportunities. And I did my best for them and they were amazing. They were a great part of my 20s, but I always knew that it was a job, it was not a career for me. Like, there are people who are so passionate about real estate, right? And they just, you know, they build out these huge teams at these brokerages, and that was just never me. I was like, this is too transactional for me. I always wanted something that I could create too.

[Vivian Tu]

Okay, so mid Pandemy, no acting jobs. You're not selling real estate.

[Anna Kai]

I was 30. I turned 30 in the middle of the pandemic in 2020. And I was out in Connecticut. And we were lucky in the sense that my husband makes enough where we could live modestly out in Connecticut and I didn't have to worry about a job. But I was like, is this the rest of my life? I was just kind of like staring at the barrel of my 30s thinking, I mean, I guess I could just pop out a kid and be a stay at home mom and that would make sense to people, you know, that would, like, be logical.

[Vivian Tu]

No one would ask any questions.

[Anna Kai]

No one would ask any questions. And I was just so depressed. I just, I just thought, there's no. I'm an only child. My parents fought tooth and nail to get here, to survive here.

[Vivian Tu]

The immigrant dream.

[Anna Kai]

Yeah, the immigrant dream. I was like, is this what they came here for? So their only daughter could marry a guy and not work and never do anything? And, you know, my dad is always like, if that had been the case and you were happy, we would have been happy. We didn't need you to have this illustrious career. But I wanted it. You know, I think I've never been super maternal. We want kids, but in the kind of very abstract. And so I just said, well, what can I do out here? I'm gonna start a blog. So I started a blog, a WordPress, when everybody else was getting on TikTok, I was like, I'm going to start a WordPress and then start Instagram. And I did that pretty unsuccessfully for two years.

[Vivian Tu]

Two years.

[Anna Kai]

I was on Instagram for two years before anything happened, like blogging to my 2,500 followers.

[Vivian Tu]

So you do social media for two years and it doesn't work. What makes you feel like, oh, I just have to keep going, Something's gonna happen.

[Anna Kai]

Honestly, it's sometimes better to not have any other choice. I mean, my other choice was I Could go get my real estate license in Connecticut and try doing that. And I just said, I don't want to do that. I want to make something happen here. And so it's almost easier when you have nothing to lose, because I really didn't have anything to lose. So I changed my niche a couple times. I started off trying to do home decor, and I was like, I can't freaking redecorate this corner of my house every week. Yeah. Then I did fashion for a while and I ended up. What had happened was again, I think my best moments and the best things that have happened to me have come from my most depressing moments. I actually got an audition and a callback for a recurring role in a pretty big network TV show two weeks before our wedding in September of 2022. And I got a call back and I was so excited. And it would have been a pretty. I don't know if it would have been a game changer, but it would have been a substantial role. I would have been back in the game. Right. And I didn't get it. And I was horrifically depressed, like 10 days before our wedding and all that.

[Vivian Tu]

So you're down in the dumps and you're supposed to be getting married.

[Anna Kai]

I know. And so I was like, you know what? What am I gonna do? So I. On TikTok, I book a call with a TikTok coach. Sure.

[Vivian Tu]

A TikTok coach.

[Anna Kai]

Yes.

[Vivian Tu]

That exists.

[Anna Kai]

Yes.

[Vivian Tu]

How much does that cost?

[Anna Kai]

It was literally $200 for, I think, a half hour call. And I said, let me just try and see if, you know. And this coach comes in, looks at your content and what you've been doing right and wrong. And what I'd been doing were those fashion transition reels, you know, where you jump and all of a sudden you're in a different outfit. And like, I was in the 200 view hell hole for a long time. And this TikTok coach shout, Tyla, who really changed my life because she was like, I feel like you have the personality to talk to camera. Like, why are you doing these reels? Like, you could just tell a story. And I was like, I don't have any stories. She's like, why don't you just try talking to camera? And so I was like, okay. I had seen somebody else do their makeup while they were telling a story. And so I just decided to do my makeup and tell a story about dating and kind of realizing how women should be the grand prize. And it took off.

[Vivian Tu]

And how many views did that Video get.

[Anna Kai]

Oh, my God. I think it hit like half a million views in the first day or something like that. It was crazy because again, I forgot about it. I was just trying to make myself feel better because I just feel when I'm not feeling well, movement helps. Like, for me, sitting and reflecting and being still does not help. I just wallow even more. I just go, need to go do something. So I was like, oh, yeah, let me try this. It's probably not going to work, but at least it gets me out of my head and sad that I didn't get this role. And then when I got back to my phone, I was like, this is it. This is my niche. And I just never looked back. I was like, fuck fashion. Sorry. I was like, this is dating and relationships and empowerment is my niche. And it has been the most incredible two years of my life.

[Vivian Tu]

I love to hear that. Since dating is your niche, I have a hard question. Who do you think pays on the first date?

[Anna Kai]

The man.

[Vivian Tu]

I need the explainer now.

[Anna Kai]

Okay, so. And this is again, I say everything because with a caveat that this is. These are my personal values. I always wanted to be a provider for my family. My dream is to buy a house for my parents one day, right? And I tell Dave, my husband, all the time, if I make enough money one day to retire you, I would love that. And you wouldn't have to work. I mean, you'd be really horrible around the house. So we'd have to find a purpose, but you could learn. But I also wanted a guy who had that provider mentality. It's not so much about. Because I grew up with that. My dad was like, I'm the man of the house. I will provide for my family. And he took honor in that and great pride in that. And I think these days, you know, feminism has done a lot of great things. But I think men who don't take pride in being a provider have used feminism as an excuse to slack on doing that. And look, not every woman wants that, which is fine. Like, those men who don't want to be providers end up getting married, and they sometimes are happy. I'm sure the women are happy. But that was important to me because I had that in my father when he had nothing, right? He. I remember we had very little growing up. And he took. He took me skiing once, because that's what all the rich kids did, right? And he was like, I want you to have this experience. So he saved up to take me skiing, and he took some of my friends with Me and their mom came and it was like a family affair. And it was like all these Asian kids on the mountain skiing together for the first time. And these kids, their father was kind of out of the picture and skiing is really expensive.

[Vivian Tu]

Yeah.

[Anna Kai]

So he paid for those kids to ski too, even though he had no business doing it. Like we, we were really like, we lived in an apartment until I was 12 years old. We rented and so he just took great pride in that.

[Vivian Tu]

Where did you grow up?

[Anna Kai]

I grew up outside of Philly in Pennsylvania.

[Vivian Tu]

Yeah.

[Anna Kai]

So he took a lot of pride in being able to provide. I take a lot of pride in being able to provide for myself and now my family. And I just can't handle a man that doesn't feel like that and paying on the first date. To me, it's like if he cares, then he's not the guy. So I got to a point in my 20s and Chris has probably heard me say this a million times now.

[Vivian Tu]

But Chris is our producer for everyone listening.

[Anna Kai]

I just didn't even flinch. I don't do the fake reach. I don't do any of that. I just stare when the fake reach because it's inauthentic. And I think my whole life has been moving towards what is authentic and true to me. And if you don't like that, then we shouldn't be on this date. And nobody ever cared. Literally no guy ever cared. Because also, by the way, by the time we got to the first date, there was a vetting process online and you just kind of, you know, knew that this guy wasn't going to care. Nobody ever cared. And if they did, they didn't say anything to me.

[Vivian Tu]

Hey, rich friends. You know, I love to talk about the habits of rich people. And one thing they all have in common is that they find ways to keep their money. That's something my partners at Marshalls can help you with. Because rich people look the part. They're wearing high quality brand name clothes, but what you might not realize is that they didn't pay full price. That's how they're staying rich. And while you're on your way to getting rich, you can get the same good stuff without breaking the bank by shopping at Marshalls. Head to your local Marshalls or visit marshalls.com to shop their ever changing selection of high quality on trend merchandise.

[Anna Kai]

So that's how I feel. That is not how a lot of my girlfriends feel. A lot of my girlfriends feel like they don't want to owe the guy anything. 50, 50 everything. Like that all points are valid. That's just where I'm coming from.

[Vivian Tu]

Yeah. Can I ask. And I don't even know if he has a pov, but, like, how have things in your relationship changed? Because at one point, Dave, your husband, was your, like, really providing a lot for you. You weren't making any money Right. Mid Pandemi. And now my assumption is you're making killer money. And I say this from, like, a similar position. I make more money now than the average W2 job. Significantly more. And my assumption is you make more than your husband now. Maybe I'm wrong, but I don't, actually.

[Anna Kai]

You don't? I don't. We're pretty. I'm getting there. Yeah. I'm getting close to. He's also seven years older than me. Yeah. And he's been working a long time, and he basically does nothing but work.

[Vivian Tu]

So does he feel any type of way that, like, your money has just kind of do, do, do, do.

[Anna Kai]

Thrilled. I mean, like, there is no sense of, you know, I hear girls saying, oh, my gosh, like, my boyfriend's threatened by the fact that I make more money than him, or I'm getting close to making more money than him. And he's none of that. He's like, great. Go for gold. You know, it's important.

[Vivian Tu]

We'll get our vacation house faster.

[Anna Kai]

Exactly. And it's afforded us the opportunity to do a lot of cool things, to not have to think we're in such a different position than we were two years ago. So he's all in support of it, and we are really a partnership. And I think the reason our marriage works because I am really weird. I have. I don't know, I just. And the more I married and the more I've been with him, I just realized, like, I'm so weird. And there was a reason it didn't work out.

[Vivian Tu]

Wait, what do you mean by that?

[Anna Kai]

I just think it's like, you know, everybody's really weird in specific ways. Right. But, like, I don't live according to convention. I feel very ambivalent about children at this stage. I'm 34, you know, I really. All I want to do is just work and kind of build my career. And I'm super close with my parents, and I'm a homebody, and I don't like to travel and all these things that sort of people are supposed to maybe. Like, people love to travel and they love to spend. Like, my husband's weird in the same way I am. And so I found that we are Truly a partnership.

[Vivian Tu]

He literally match my freak.

[Anna Kai]

He literally matches my freak. So much. We both share a huge disdain for air travel. We'll do it. I do it so much. I used to be deathly afraid of flying two years ago. And I've now been subjected to plane rides, international plane rides. So much that I no longer am scared of it. I just find it a little unsettling.

[Vivian Tu]

Yeah. You know, so, you know, normal stuff people like spending their money on. You guys don't. What do you guys like spending your money on?

[Anna Kai]

We go out to dinner and we like spending our money on food. And we actually really like real estate as like to enjoy, but also as an investment. So we do actually have a vacation home now, thanks to my job.

[Vivian Tu]

And I'm coming.

[Anna Kai]

I know. Come to Cape Co. Oh, that's. I'm in.

[Vivian Tu]

Oh, my gosh. You don't have to ask me twice.

[Anna Kai]

I know, it's amazing. And we have a rental property we bought. And so that's what my job has afforded us the opportunity to do. Not just to have a primary home, but, you know, it's an investment, but it's also, instead of going on vacation, we go to our Cape house.

[Vivian Tu]

Yeah.

[Anna Kai]

So. And I think a lot of people would find that boring in the sense that I know so many girlfriends of mine who are like, I never want to go to one place or the same. The same place over and over again, but I find great comfort in just knowing that all my shits at that house. And I basically just have to pack up and go. Pack up the dog and go.

[Vivian Tu]

Okay, Spicy question.

[Anna Kai]

Yeah.

[Vivian Tu]

Do you and Dave have a prenup?

[Anna Kai]

We don't. And I've been waiting for this question because I know your views on it.

[Vivian Tu]

Yes.

[Anna Kai]

And it is such a controversial topic because I've broached the subject a few times on social media, on stories, and people have varying opinions. But here's my opinion, and you're probably going to think this is horrible financial advice, and maybe it is, but I think money, to me, money is a lot of things, but is not everything. And I personally do not believe in prenups unless the.

[Vivian Tu]

Sorry, I just choked.

[Anna Kai]

Guys, this is. I don't believe in prenups unless there is an extreme division of wealth, like if there's like, family assets to protect, generational wealth and everything. Because. And I know, I've heard the argument. Oh, prenups protect people from a lot of different things and everything. And if you don't get a prenup, you know, the state gives You a prenup. I get all of that. But for me, I just wanted. It's a feeling, and I think I just wanted to feel like this was it. Like getting married was getting a tattoo in my forehead. And there was no way I was going to get divorced from this person. And I know the statistics, but I just wouldn't have married a person who I felt I should get a prenup with and who felt they needed to ask me for a prenup. We're also talking about, like, Dave and I. Even though he was more successful in his career than I was when we first met and, you know, was working for a lot longer and had more money, we weren't operating off of, like, two different. Of playing fields, you know, so it wasn't like. I totally believe in prenups for people with generational wealth. And there's family stuff there. Like, you should get a prenup, because that's really complicated. We were not really blessed with that.

[Vivian Tu]

Our families are poor.

[Anna Kai]

Well, they're not poor, but, you know, there's not, like, a massive trust fund coming to either one of us that maybe there's, like, siblings gonna fight over or whatever, you know? So that's kind of my feeling. And I also think that for those of you listening who are like, oh, my God, she's a moron, or, hey, that's how I feel. It's like, you also have to make a decision and be willing to live with the consequences of your decision. So my decision was not to get, you know, our. Was not to get a prenup. But if in 20 years, in 10 years, we get divorced and I royally get fucked over, I'm accepting that. I'm willing to accept that. And I think that's the thing is, like, there needs to be a space, because I know. I think it's very fiscally and financially sound to get a prenup. There is a space for people who just kind of are maybe romantics like me in a way, and I'm very practical in a lot of ways, but that was just something I felt very strongly about. I did not want a prenup. And Dave really didn't think about it either. And most of our friends, pretty much all of them, don't have prenups. Cause it's just sort of like, you know what? We'll just figure it out. And a couple of them are getting divorced, and it's fine. You know, it sucks, but you just deal with life as it comes. I think you can only prepare for so Much. And I wasn't willing to at all even think about the possibility of preparing for divorce. That's why we don't have the prenup.

[Vivian Tu]

We can agree to disagree, but I really do appreciate you sharing that. Cause I think that's, like, a really vulnerable question to answer.

[Anna Kai]

Yeah. And, like, you know what? My opinion is not the popular take right now, too. I think it's much more.

[Vivian Tu]

No, I've popularized this take.

[Anna Kai]

I know, I know. Which is good, by the way. Cause I think, look, nobody knows whether they marry the asshole who's gonna take them for everything they're worth, But. But sometimes you just have to trust your gut. It's a thing that you can't put down on paper. And you know what? We'll figure it out.

[Vivian Tu]

Yeah. In 60 years, when you're, like, old and gray and you've never, ever needed one, like, it'll be perfect. You'll look back on this moment and you'll be like, told you so.

[Anna Kai]

Yeah. You know, and I'm. But if not, I can live with the consequences. And I think that's the important thing is when I do.

[Vivian Tu]

I think that is important.

[Anna Kai]

Whatever you do, make sure you're willing to accept the reality if it hits you. Yeah.

[Vivian Tu]

Yes. I think that's really, really good. In terms of advice, I want another piece. What is the best piece of dating advice you've ever gotten? And then I also want to know, what's the best piece of money advice you've ever gotten?

[Anna Kai]

The best piece of dating advice I ever got was from my parents. And they said, find the man who does the right thing. Which sounds, like, very simple and ambiguous. But what they meant was, don't marry the man who's the fun guy, who. Who's the cool guy, necessarily.

[Vivian Tu]

No, I don't want that.

[Anna Kai]

Not that I'm saying Dave is not fun or cool, but find the man who does the right thing when the right thing is not the easy thing to do. So. And I look at Dave and the way he works and his work ethic and how he gets up every morning and, you know, he runs and all this stuff. And I'm just like, that's so difficult because that's not the easy thing to do. And honestly, being with me is not always a walk in the park. I am very.

[Vivian Tu]

I say that, too.

[Anna Kai]

Yeah, I am quite a trip sometimes. And he always does the right thing. And that's why we have this marriage. Because, you know, there is sort of this shared ideal of, like, life isn't always going to be easy. But, like, our marriage doesn't have to be difficult. Life is hard. I don't think our marriage is hard because we both just want the best for each other. We're a partnership, so. But that's because I found the guy who did the right thing. If you find a guy who, when shit hits the fan, wants to go party with his boys and, you know, cheat on you, that's the easy thing to do in a lot of situations. And I think that's why a lot of relationships fail, is because people marry who's fun. They don't marry who is going to do the right thing. So the best piece of financial advice I ever got was from my mom, Invest in the S and P. Early on, any tiny bit of money I had in my 20s, when I started making money, I set aside a certain percentage and I put it into the S and P. And that's done quite well. And it's, by the way, like, it's investing for dummies. I am not a good investor. I don't want to pick stocks. I don't really want to spend the time to think about it. So the s and P500. There we go.

[Vivian Tu]

You know, you say I'm not an. Like, I'm an investing dummy. The fact that you're doing that, you're not an investing dummy. You are, in fact, an investing genius because your returns are likely beating some of the top hedge funds.

[Anna Kai]

Yeah.

[Vivian Tu]

Because they're trying to cherry pick. They're trying to do, like, the perfect investment.

[Anna Kai]

Right.

[Vivian Tu]

I'm telling you, as someone who worked on the street, we got calls week after week that funds were blowing up because they made the wrong call.

[Anna Kai]

Yeah.

[Vivian Tu]

People with billions of dollars of tech don't get it. Right.

[Anna Kai]

So, no. And my parents do not really believe in financial advisors, which is a very Chinese thing. It's just to not believe anybody. Right.

[Vivian Tu]

They're all scammers, by the way.

[Anna Kai]

Everybody is like, you know, everybody is out. They don't believe doctors, they don't believe financial advisors. They don't believe, like, everybody's out to get them. So my parents, obviously, my mom taught herself how to invest because when they finally started having enough money to invest, she was like, we gotta figure this out, because other people are retiring at the rate we're going, we're never gonna retire. But. But I have looked at my investments versus Dave is in the S and P, but he also has a pretty diverse portfolio because he does pick his own stocks and he has a few other individual funds like Small cap and all that stuff. And my S and P has done better than him. Now, look, there's still a long leeway to go. So that's not to say that his investments couldn't do better than mine in the future, but it's been like. I don't know, I'm like, honey, it's been 10 years of you being in this fund. Like, maybe you should just cash out and go into the S and P like me. Yeah, I know, exactly. Make it easy.

[Vivian Tu]

Yeah. Make it easy. Speaking of easy, this is not an easy conversation, but when did you guys first talk about money? And how do you guys split expenses?

[Anna Kai]

We don't really split expenses. It's all one big fungible pot. I think the first thing that came up for us was. I think I just asked him. I was like, how much do you make? This is like a year into our relationship.

[Vivian Tu]

You and I both have no net in between the brain and the lips.

[Anna Kai]

Yeah. I was like, whatever. I mean, we've been along long enough and, like, we should figure. And he didn't know how much I made, so I was like, we should have this conversation. It was like a random Friday night. It was actually on Cape Cod. I think I remember we did not have our own house. We were there visiting his parents, and we went out to dinner, the two of us. And I just remember saying, how much do you make? And it was actually a lot more than I thought because he literally lived like a pauper. For nine. He was in the same rent stabilized apartment in New York City for nine years. Genius. Genius. But also, the place needed a little. Okay, so let me just explain this apartment to you. When he shut the door, some drywall plaster would fall onto his couch every time. So before Washedos dust. Yes. So he would need to vacuum up that on his couch before sitting down. The toilet, for some reason would only flush if you held the handle down for 10 seconds. It was rough, but he saved a lot of money.

[Vivian Tu]

Yeah.

[Anna Kai]

And I just always assumed that, you know, because like New York women, you kind of figure out, okay, if he's paying for this apartment, this is probably how much he's making. I was like, you know what? This guy probably doesn't make that much, but it's okay. He's trying. I could see the effort. And I knew he did well enough. Right. And then he told me, and I was like, are you. What the fuck are you doing in there? You know, in your asbestos apartment? In your asbestos apartment. He's like, I'm happy. I'm Good. He's just so low maintenance. Right. He's so low key. And so that was the first conversation. Then he asked me how much I made, and he was like, oh, yeah, you make around what I thought you made.

[Vivian Tu]

So your radar was off. But his radar was spot on.

[Anna Kai]

His radar was spot on. Yes. You know, I spent money the way that probably what somebody who's making $120,000 at 27 would spend. And he honestly, like, he could probably go back to that apartment right now and be happy and just save and invest and whatever. So that was the first conversation. And it's honestly never really been a huge conversation because for some reason, we're just kind of on the same wavelength. We don't have a combined account per se, but we just have access to everyone's funds, like, for some reason, because I'm an independent contractor and he's a W2 employee. But we're married. We're legally married.

[Vivian Tu]

Sweet, sweet. Health insurance.

[Anna Kai]

I know, right?

[Vivian Tu]

That is how you think I have health insurance. I am on my husband's.

[Anna Kai]

Yes. It's like, oh, my gosh. It's so much better than anything we could pay for ourselves. Not at all. Yeah. It's insane. So we just. He pays for a portion of my taxes, technically, because we pay estimated taxes. Where's the W2? It goes, you know, you pay taxes as you go along. So he's paying, like, now pretty sizable estimated taxes for me. And there's never any kind of weirdness around, oh, I paid for this. I paid for that. It was always just sort of this tacit understanding that this is all one fungible pot of funds for us. So I don't recommend that. It's not exactly sound financial advice, but, like, I think the goal would be to say to people is, like, find somebody who you just are on the same page with, rather than find somebody. Somebody who you like and you love, but you're just so different financially that you're just never going to see eye to eye.

[Vivian Tu]

Yeah. What I like to say is find somebody who values a dollar the same way you do.

[Anna Kai]

Exactly. Yeah. And we very much do.

[Vivian Tu]

Okay, so I want to pivot really quick and chat a little bit about the other types of content that you make oftentimes. Talking about friendships.

[Anna Kai]

Yeah.

[Vivian Tu]

Why do you feel like so many of us settle both in relationships, but also in friendships? Like, I am definitely someone who holds on to, like, bad friendships for a lot longer than I should.

[Anna Kai]

I think it's this really big desire by women especially. I actually don't think men do it nearly as much as women. I don't think they settle. I think they just move on.

[Vivian Tu]

They just, like, don't hang out anymore.

[Anna Kai]

They just don't hang out anymore. And nobody feels bad or just, you know, they just move on. I think women do it because, again, we've been taught that our value lies in who wants us and who likes us. So even if we don't necessarily like somebody, we want them to like. And I kind of figured this out early on. I remember I've had one pivotal friend breakup in my life where I was just so proud of myself for doing it, because it was a girl that was, like, part of our friend group in high school, and then we were all in New York together, and I never really liked her, and I knew she never really liked me, but it was a.

[Vivian Tu]

Can we get why you didn't like her?

[Anna Kai]

You know, I always so. And women do this, but we have a shared friend, and she was always trying to be the best friend, and I think felt that I was maybe a threat to her best friends. Best friendship with this person where it's like, we can all be best friends. You know, you don't have to have one best friend. It was a very juvenile thing, but it was this possessiveness over this shared friend of ours. And I don't think she ever. I think it was. I don't know what it was. You know, she just. Everything I said to her usually ended in some sort of comparison or competition. And, like, it's not like I was doing that well, by the way. But, like, for example, I moved in with an ex of mine, and I told her that over at dinner one night, and she spent the rest of the night talking about why she wasn't moving in with her boyfriend of three years. Like, she was trying to justify it to me. And I was like, I'm not asking you why you and, you know, Chad are not moving in together. I'm just relaying this information. But you cannot be friends with somebody who takes every bit of good news that you have as a threat to their existence. And that's really why I never really liked you, because I was like, I. I don't think you actually want good things for me. But it was a friendship of convenience, and I didn't want to be disliked, and I really didn't want to lose that mutual friend we had because my relationship with her was great. And I finally got to a point where it's like, I hate this girl so fucking much that if not being friends with her means that the rest of them don't want to be friends with me. I have to accept that, and I'm willing to accept that. And guess what? I'm still friends with the mutual friends. I think she's still friends with them too. It worked out. I sent her a text, I blocked her, and I moved on with my life.

[Vivian Tu]

Mm.

[Anna Kai]

Yeah. So don't be afraid of being disliked. It's. Honestly, being disliked has been the best thing for me. It's been so freeing. Okay.

[Vivian Tu]

But Anna, where do I get this energy? Where do I become as confident as you?

[Anna Kai]

You just realize you're gonna die one day. Honestly, like, you realize you're gonna die one day and that there's no time to be spending time with chads or bitches who are only friends with you because they're comparing themselves to you. It's like, I didn't wake up confident. I'm scared of absolutely everything in my life. I, you know, really abhor this idea that, you know, always be confident. I think that courage is so much more important than confidence because courage stems from feeling fear and doing it anyways. Whereas, like, you know, this idea that. This sort of idea that, you know, you have to be confident all the time is just not true. I'm not confident all the time, but I also know I'm going to die one day. I don't know when that day is. And I just want to make sure with whatever time I have left, I'm spending it with the people I love, doing the things I wanna do, and just not dealing with bullshit as much as possible. Yeah, that's so morbid. I'm so.

[Vivian Tu]

No, but it's good. It's no false bravado. You just do it scared.

[Anna Kai]

Yeah, just do it scared.

[Vivian Tu]

If you could go back in time and give 21 year old Anna a piece of advice, what would it be?

[Anna Kai]

So I get asked this a lot and I say no advice. She just has to live life on her own.

[Vivian Tu]

Just has to make the mistakes.

[Anna Kai]

She just has to make the mistakes. I would not be here if I didn't do all that stupid shit in my 20s. And I have some friends who honestly, I don't think have mistakes in life. And they live amazing, happy lives. And I just look at them, I'm like, how the fuck did you go through your 20s and, like, not cringe at some of the stuff you did? I did really absurd things and sometimes dangerous things. And, like, I live to tell the tale. And now I'm actually sober again, not.

[Vivian Tu]

A vegan though, right?

[Anna Kai]

Not a vegan. Okay.

[Vivian Tu]

Thank God. We can still go to dinner.

[Anna Kai]

We can still go to dinner. I can still go to dinner. But now I. You know, I gave up drinking earlier this year, and.

[Vivian Tu]

Sidenote. Are you an Asian who glows? Like.

[Anna Kai]

No. I actually.

[Vivian Tu]

I'm so mad at you.

[Anna Kai]

I know. I actually, when I do, I was the tank. I could drink a lot, and that was the problem.

[Vivian Tu]

No, I'm like, two beers and I'm blackout. Like, it's sad. It's good.

[Anna Kai]

You know, you're a cheap date.

[Vivian Tu]

Yeah, I really am. I always say that. And my boo, he always like, are you joking? You ordered the caviar. You are absolutely not a cheap date. You wanted the lobster. You. But you're making up for it by not drinking. Not drinking. You never drink at dinners. Yeah.

[Anna Kai]

Although I will say the mocktails these days have gotten so crazy.

[Vivian Tu]

$23.

[Anna Kai]

Yeah. So it's not actually saving money if.

[Vivian Tu]

You go to mocktail. I actually only drink now, probably four times a year, and it's always to celebr. And there's only one thing that I drink.

[Anna Kai]

What is it?

[Vivian Tu]

Tequila. Straight.

[Anna Kai]

What?

[Vivian Tu]

Yeah. You are terrifying. I know.

[Anna Kai]

That is. Yeah.

[Vivian Tu]

I, like, save up all of my liquor tolerance. Like, all of those, like, two beers that I could have had. I save it all.

[Anna Kai]

Do you sip it or do you take a shot? Oh, you just. And how many?

[Vivian Tu]

Like, in a night?

[Anna Kai]

Yeah.

[Vivian Tu]

I don't know. Maybe like, seven to ten.

[Anna Kai]

Holy shit. Oh, my God.

[Vivian Tu]

Yeah.

[Anna Kai]

Okay.

[Vivian Tu]

But, like, I save it for every so often.

[Anna Kai]

So when you made Forbes girl, you were taking 40 shots, right? 30 shots.

[Vivian Tu]

I did, in fact, get quite drunk at the. At the party.

[Anna Kai]

Yeah. As you know what, if you're gonna get drunk at any party, you should get out. Is that one? Yeah, but that's. I like that, you know, and I'm trying to figure out what the balance is in my life, but so far, I've really loved being sober. And, you know, it's. For those of you who don't think you can do it and be single and date, you very much can. You know, I met a guy, and I dated him for a while while I was sober, and he was fine with it, you know?

[Vivian Tu]

Okay, but you mentioned earlier that you have a lot of friends who you feel like haven't made mistakes in their 20s. So I want to wrap us up with what is the biggest money mistake you have ever made?

[Anna Kai]

Ooh.

[Vivian Tu]

I know. No one else has asked you this question.

[Anna Kai]

No, I. No one has asked me this. Question. What is the thing? This is sort of a money question, but sort of also a relationship question. When I lived with my ex, he made significantly more money than me. I was paying him rent because he already lived in the apartment prior to me moving in. And because he. I was very young, because he paid for a lot of the dates and a lot of the experiences we had, I felt the need to pay him back in weird way. So I would just buy him shit that I really should not have been buying. Like, I would buy him, like, a really fancy espresso machine and just, like, just I would spend money to try and pay him back because ultimately, I don't feel like I ever felt like I deserved all the things that he was freely spending money on me for. You know, it's like he wanted to go to the Caribbean every other month for vacation, which I had no desire to do because, as you know, I don't love to fly or travel. And at the time, I was also trying to be an actress, so I was like, okay, but what if I get an audition? Like, when we're in fucking Turks and Caicos, like. And he's like, well, you just have to live life. And I'm like, but I'm trying to live my life, and it doesn't involve flying down there. So he would fly us down there and pay for the trip, and I would feel guilty that he paid for the trip, even though I didn't want to go. So I would try and pay him back in weird ways, and I spent a lot of money doing that when I should have honestly just broken up with him. So don't spend money out of guilt is maybe that's kind of the takeaway from that period of my life.

[Vivian Tu]

And I think that is a great note to end on, because no one should make you feel guilty about pretty much anything unless you feel guilty for actually something that you've done a hundred percent.

[Anna Kai]

Yeah. Oh, and I've done a lot of things that I feel guilty about, but not on this podcast, that is for another podcast.

[Vivian Tu]

Anyway, Anna, thank you so much for being here. You are such a gem. We're getting dinner after this. We're hanging out. We're becoming immediate best friends. But please let everybody know where we can find you.

[Anna Kai]

You can find me on Instagram and TikTok, Abe both is my handle.

[Vivian Tu]

Amazing. Thank you so much.

[Anna Kai]

Thank you.

[Vivian Tu]

I'd like to thank my partners at Marshalls for sponsoring this episode of Net Worth. And chill. Being responsible with your finances means taking care of future you and thankfully, while you're looking out for the you of tomorrow, Marshalls is looking out for the you of today day. They've got the latest on trend and high quality fashion, beauty and home decor at a fraction of retail prices. So whether you're starting a new job, taking some overdue PTO or just sitting at home planning your next move, Marshalls will make sure you look good doing it. Shop in store or online to get.

[Anna Kai]

The good stuff today.

[Vivian Tu]

Thanks for tuning into this week's episode of Net Worth and Chill, part of the Vox Media Podcast network. If you like the episode, make sure to leave a rating and review and subscribe so you never miss an episode. Got a burning financial question that you want covered in a future episode? Write to us via podcast at yourrichbff.

[Anna Kai]

Com.

[Vivian Tu]

Follow Networth and Chillpod on Instagram to stay up to date on all podcast related news and you can follow me at yourrichbff for even more financial know how. See you next week. Bye.