Podcast Summary: "Andrew W. Bernstein, 'Fuji: A Mountain in the Making'"

Podcast: New Books Network – New Books in Japanese Studies
Host: Hans Wagenberg
Guest: Andrew W. Bernstein
Air Date: December 26, 2025

Overview

This episode features a conversation with historian Andrew W. Bernstein about his book Fuji: A Mountain in the Making (Princeton University Press, 2025). Bernstein offers a comprehensive "biography" of Mount Fuji, tracing its geological formation, religious significance, political disputes, cultural meanings, and evolving symbolism in Japan and beyond. The discussion delves into how Fuji both shapes, and is shaped by, human society—spanning deep history to the contemporary Anthropocene.

Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Origins of the Book and Framing Fuji as an Actor

[02:23 - 07:09]

• Bernstein’s motivation: Initially researched legal disputes over Fuji’s summit after WWII (Shinto vs. state ownership). A comment from a conference attendee asking “Where’s the mountain?” shifted his focus to the mountain’s physical and volcanic aspects and their influence on culture and politics.
  • “What about Fuji as a volcano? And then how does the fact that it's a volcano affect, over time, the ways people have interacted with it, both physically and in the imagination?” — Andrew Bernstein [03:06]
• Fuji as an “actor” in history: Not a passive backdrop, but an active agent shaped by both geologic processes and human interpretations.
• Book aims to reach both scholars and general readers, drawing on the mountain’s fame and historical richness.

2. Geological and Cultural Entanglements

[07:09 - 14:46]

• Geological history: Old Fuji began ~100,000 years ago; modern cone (“New Fuji”) is only ~17,000 years old, making Fuji a young, active volcano in geologic terms.
  • “Fuji grew up among humans, together with humans.” — Andrew Bernstein [07:31]
• Fuji is vital due to volcanic soil and water sources—affecting agriculture, industry, ritual, and pilgrimage.
• Diverse cultural representations: Early texts depict Fuji as both forbidding and powerful (source of epidemics, gods, and immortals).
• The Manyoshu and classic literature use Fuji as a metaphor for longing and passion, drawing from volcanic imagery.

3. Edo Period: The Hōei Eruption and Political Tensions

[16:14 - 24:17]

• Hōei Eruption of 1707: Last erupted in 1707, devastating villages and agricultural infrastructure, exposing the vulnerabilities of the Tokugawa “compound state.”
  • Massive ashfall affected life up to 100 km away, requiring unprecedented centralized intervention.
  • The shogunate’s relief measures (including national taxes and expropriation of Odawara domain lands) tested the balance between local and central authority.
• Role of peasant petitions and Confucian ideals: The populace appealed to the government’s supposed benevolence, revealing the moral and political tensions of the era.

4. Religion and Fuji: Fujikō, Gender, and Syncretism

[24:17 - 31:00]

• Fujikō: Grassroots worship groups from the 17th-19th centuries. Organized rituals, pilgrimage, and spread Fuji’s cultic importance.
  • Imagined Fuji as a “parent” or nurturing cosmic body, with caves (tainai) representing wombs, water as breastmilk, and the mountain enabling metaphorical rebirth.
• Gender restrictions: Women were long banned from the summit; Fujizuka (miniature Fuji mounds) in Edo/Tokyo democratized access, especially for women and the infirm.
• Religious ambiguity: Fuji belief blended elements of Buddhism, Shugendō (mountain asceticism), and Shinto, making it “impossible to neatly categorize”:
  • “So it's kind of a mix, right, of all these different rituals and beliefs that come together in Fuji worship.” — Andrew Bernstein [30:01]

5. Material, Visual, and National Culture

[31:00 - 34:48]

• Fuji became a proto-national symbol through widespread commodification—appearing on poetry, prints, maps, kimono, and everyday items.
• Ubiquity fostered a sense of shared Japaneseness, making Fuji a tangible collective identity, not only esteemed domestically but by foreigners.

6. Globalization: Art, Commodities, and the “Great Wave”

[34:48 - 38:22]

• Hokusai’s Great Wave off Kanagawa epitomizes Fuji’s global iconography. The vivid blue used—“Berlin Blue”—was an imported synthetic dye from Europe.
  • “It seems quintessentially Japanese, but is incorporating this synthetic dye that was invented in Europe.” — Andrew Bernstein [36:16]
• Global trade and foreign engagement entwined with Fuji’s symbolic power, rendering it both nationally and transnationally circulated.

7. Meiji Period: Nativism, Shintoization, and Scientific Modernity

[38:22 - 49:56]

• 19th-century nativist scholars reframed Fuji’s deity in Shinto (as Konohanasakuya Hime), suppressing Buddhist associations—a process intensified by the Meiji Restoration’s Shinbutsu Bunri (kami-Buddha separation).
• Fuji, over time, becomes an “all-Japanese” national symbol in popular discourse and education, with less focus on religious specifics.
• Foreign mountaineers and diplomats (notably Rutherford Alcock in 1860) used Fuji as a site of imperial demonstration and scientific data collection, sometimes clashing with local customs.

8. Modern Science and Gender on Fuji: The Nonaka Expedition

[49:56 - 51:29]

• The Nonakas—a husband-wife team—attempted overwinter meteorological observations atop Fuji (1895-96). Mrs. Nonaka notably did much of the scientific work when her husband fell ill.
• Their suffering blurred boundaries between objective observation and corporeal (and social) entanglement—highlighting that science is not outside the human experience.

9. Fuji in the Anthropocene: Entanglements of Nature, War, and Conservation

[51:29 - 57:32]

• Bernstein argues Fuji exemplifies the convergence of geological and human time, central to the Anthropocene.
  • E.g., military use of grasslands at Fuji’s base preserved habitats for endangered butterflies—military needs paradoxically sustaining biodiversity.
  • “Who would have thought? … very complex and often unexpected entanglements between humans and non-humans in the Anthropocene.” — Andrew Bernstein [56:47]

10. Pollution, Pop Culture, and the World Heritage Campaign

[57:32 - 61:31]

• Pollution: Postwar industrialization led to infamous pollution in Suruga Bay; represented in pop culture as Godzilla vs. Hedorah, where a sludge monster rises from Fuji’s industrial waste.
• UNESCO World Heritage:
  • Multiple failed attempts; Fuji eventually became a Cultural (not Natural) World Heritage Site in 2013, which involved “erasing” inconvenient histories—such as militarization, eruptions, and contestation.
    • “Turning Fuji into a Cultural World Heritage Site is a process of not just celebration, but erasure.” — Andrew Bernstein [61:22]

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• “Fuji grew up among humans, together with humans.”
  — Andrew Bernstein [07:31]

• “Most obviously it acts by erupting. So it’s a volcano … But also, it’s an actor by supplying water for these different purposes.”
  — Andrew Bernstein [07:09]

• “The thinking was, if we show you our suffering, you have to do something about it.”
  — Andrew Bernstein, on Tokugawa petitions [21:30]

• “Fuji was really imagined by these Fujikō in these very human terms, as a kind of human body nourishing and healing.”
  — Andrew Bernstein [27:17]

• “It’s impossible to neatly categorize Fujikō … a mix of all these different rituals and beliefs.”
  — Andrew Bernstein [30:01]

• “It creates a kind of cultural cohesion within Japan and at the same time is increasingly seen as an emblem of Japan …”
  — Andrew Bernstein [32:36]

• “It seems quintessentially Japanese, but is incorporating this synthetic dye that was invented in Europe.”
  — Andrew Bernstein [36:16]

• “Science following the flag.” (on Rutherford Alcock measuring and singing atop Fuji)
  — Andrew Bernstein [46:13]

• “Turning Fuji into a Cultural World Heritage Site is a process of not just celebration, but erasure.”
  — Andrew Bernstein [61:22]

Important Segment Timestamps

• [02:23] — Why Bernstein wrote the book; Fuji as a research subject and historical actor
• [07:09] — Geological “biography” and Fuji’s role as an “actor”
• [10:50] — Early representations: sacred, violent, and love poetry
• [16:14] — Fuji’s distance from early Japanese centers; integration into national culture
• [17:57] — Edo era and the 1707 Hōei Eruption’s social/political impact
• [25:50] — Fujikō religious groups, gender, and alternative “pilgrimages”
• [32:05] — Everyday culture and Fuji’s role in proto-national identity
• [34:48] — Globalization, Hokusai, and Berlin Blue
• [38:34] — Shintoization, Meiji policies, and nativist appropriations of Fuji
• [43:44] — Rutherford Alcock, foreign mountaineering, and contestations
• [48:08] — Nonaka meteorological expedition: science and suffering
• [51:29] — Anthropocene: military, grasslands, and unexpected conservation
• [57:32] — Pollution, Godzilla, cultural anxieties
• [59:03] — World Heritage debate and the politics of heritage

Conclusion

Hans Wagenberg and Andrew Bernstein’s conversation traverses deep time and contemporary politics to illustrate Mount Fuji’s ongoing role as a crucible of Japanese identity, a site of contestation and adaptation, and a symbol continually “in the making.” The episode, rich in both detail and sweeping perspective, reveals Fuji not only as a timeless emblem but as a dynamic participant in Japan’s—and the world’s—history.

Recommended for listeners interested in:

• Japanese history and culture
• Environmental and geological history
• Religion and syncretism
• Heritage, nationalism, and globalization
• The interplay of nature and society