Podcast Summary: "Why Plato Matters Now" with Professor Angie Hobbs
New Books Network – January 14, 2026
Guest: Professor Angie Hobbs
Host: New Books
Main Theme & Purpose
In this episode, Professor Angie Hobbs discusses her Bloomsbury Press book, Why Plato Matters Now, exploring the enduring relevance of Plato’s philosophy for today’s world. The conversation covers how Plato’s ideas offer important resources for addressing contemporary political, ethical, and educational challenges—from the decline of democracy and the rise of demagoguery to education, flourishing, and community. With an accessible, dialogue-rich style, the episode demonstrates how engaging with Plato can help individuals and societies navigate current crises.
Key Discussion Points & Insights
1. Angie Hobbs’ Background and Motivation for the Book
- Academic Journey: Hobbs studied classics, specialized in Ancient Greek philosophy, earned a PhD on Plato and Homer, and taught at Warwick and Sheffield, alongside extensive media and policy work ([03:38]).
- Public Philosophy: She became the UK’s first Professor of the Public Understanding of Philosophy, championing philosophy’s role in wider society.
- Why Plato Now: Plato’s ideas increasingly surfaced as central in addressing modern questions across government, policy, and education. Even without accepting Plato’s metaphysics, his approach to ethical, political, and social issues is invaluable ([03:38], [06:17]).
2. Structure and Audience of the Book
- Thematic Approach: Unlike standard introductions, Hobbs’ book explores Plato by theme (democracy, tyranny, love, art, flourishing) rather than going dialogue by dialogue ([07:36]).
- Accessibility: Written for intelligent, curious readers—academics and amateurs alike—with minimal jargon, helpful footnotes, and extensive further reading ([10:01]).
3. Why Plato’s Ideas Remain Relevant
- Perennial Questions: Plato probes persistent questions—“How should I live?” “What is justice?” “What is the flourishing life?”—making his work timeless ([11:27]–[11:48]).
- Dialogue Form: Plato’s refusal to write in his own voice and his dramatic dialogues draw readers into active participation, compelling them to think for themselves ([11:48]–[19:52]).
- “The form is as important as the content… The dialogue form is part of the content.” – Hobbs ([11:48])
- Philosophy as Moral Training: Plato’s approach models the art of dialogue—collaborative, truth-seeking, and civically virtuous—contrasting with today’s polarized, adversarial discourse ([21:12]–[23:40]).
4. The Art of Dialogue and Civic Virtue
- Lost Virtue: Hobbs and the host lament the loss of constructive dialogue and civic virtue in the digital and political age ([21:12]–[24:47]).
- “The goal is to find the truth together. And I think… the world has really, really lost [this], particularly in the last 20 to 30 years…” – Hobbs ([21:12])
- Critical Thinking from a Young Age: Hobbs advocates for teaching philosophical dialogue and critical thinking in primary schools to empower children against manipulation and sophistry ([24:48]–[25:48]).
- “We need to not be suckers. … Plato’s trying to give us the inner resources so we don’t fall for it.” ([24:28])
5. Flourishing and the Good Life (Eudaimonia)
- Socratic Unexamined Life: Self-reflection, not endless testing, holds the key to a meaningful life ([27:18]).
- Plato’s Tripartite Soul: Flourishing requires the harmonious development of reason, spiritedness, and appetite—with reason in control ([27:18]–[32:02]).
- “Your flourishing is the harmonization of these three faculties. It’s about your inner psychic harmony.” ([27:18])
- Plato introduced a more objective, agency-driven idea of flourishing (eudaimonia), influencing Freud’s psychology and modern conceptions of mental health.
- Ethical Implications: Justice is internalized, becoming a property of the soul rather than merely external action. Returning wrong for wrong damages one’s own soul ([32:03]).
- “The good person, the just person, should never return wrong for wrong.” ([32:03])
6. Plato’s Relevance for Modern Challenges
- Agency and Optimism: Flourishing means proactivity—using one’s faculties for the good, even in a troubled world ([37:34]).
- Applications: Hobbs connects Plato’s ethics to issues like AI, climate change, health care, and education ([39:52]).
- “How do we know what kind of values we want to instill in AI systems until we've done this basic preliminary thinking?” ([37:34])
7. Education, Art, and Moral Formation
- Beauty and Character: Plato believed in forming character through moral and aesthetic education from an early age, emphasizing the environment, art, and inner/outer beauty ([40:44]–[48:16]).
- “It’s the whole environment in which a baby and a toddler and a child is raised that's crucial…” ([40:44])
- Levels of Artistic Engagement: True moral influence of art is internal, not superficial; awareness of historical misuse of art (e.g., Goebbels) illustrates the danger of missing its ethical import.
8. Plato on Democracy, Tyranny, and Language
- Sophistry and Cynicism: Plato’s characters Callicles (Gorgias) and Thrasymachus (Republic) exemplify political cynicism and the “might is right” ethos, showing how democracy can devolve into tyranny ([51:03]).
- Demagogue’s Playbook: Analysis of the tyrant’s rise—demagogue gains power through promises of “freedom,” builds a cult, subverts institutions, sows division and fear ([51:03]–[61:14]).
- “Everybody in the world should read this section of the Republic right now…” – Hobbs ([61:01])
- Corruption of Language: Tyranny begins with the manipulation and inversion of language—freedom becomes license, shamelessness called courage ([62:09]).
- “Plato, way before Orwell, … has predicted Newspeak, Orwellian Newspeak, where war is peace and black is white.” ([62:09])
- Active Resistance: Understanding the playbook and empowering citizens (especially the young) to spot and counteract manipulation is crucial.
9. Community, Friendship (Philia), and Love (Eros)
- Philia—Civic Bonds: True friendship is mutual goodwill for the other’s own sake, forming the foundation of a just city. Plato’s vision, though at times extreme, raises vital questions about the relationship of power, wealth, and social trust ([65:17]–[73:54]).
- Eros—Beyond Possession: Symposium explores the transformative power of love—not as possession, but as inspiration and aspiration ([65:17]).
- “You should be loving somebody as a whole in their own right.” ([65:17])
- Building Community: Platonic notions of friendship and love can help counter today’s loneliness and polarization by rebuilding bonds of trust and dialogue.
10. How to Revive Plato for Today
- Method as Much as Content: Platonic dialogue and philosophy can be introduced in schools and professional settings alike; we can benefit even without the entire metaphysics ([74:15]).
- “Keep the dialogues alive, keep the methods alive… Even if his answers are too extreme sometimes, he nearly always asks the right questions.” ([74:15])
- Updating Plato: Some ideas need adapting—the single model of flourishing, for example—yet the questions and spirit of inquiry remain essential.
- Practical Steps: Engage young people, educators, and policymakers in active philosophical dialogue, teaching critical thinking and the art of conversation.
Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments
-
On Plato’s Style:
“The form is as important as the content. In fact… the form is part of the content.”
— Angie Hobbs ([11:48]) -
On Moral Dialogue:
“The goal is to find the truth together… Your interlocutor is not your opponent.”
— Angie Hobbs ([21:12]) -
On “Flourishing” versus “Happiness”:
“It’s about the best realization of your individual faculties in the circumstances in which you find yourself.”
— Angie Hobbs ([32:03]) -
On Demagogues:
“First of all, the demagogue gains power by democratic means… They make all these false promises. They particularly offer the electorate intoxicating quantities of freedom. Freedom is always their banner word.”
— Angie Hobbs ([51:03]) -
On Language and Tyranny:
“It always starts with the corruption of language and particularly the subversion of key terms like democracy or freedom… Liberty gets confused with license, and shamelessness is called courage.”
— Angie Hobbs ([62:09]) -
On Reviving Plato:
“Keep the dialogues alive, keep the methods alive, keep thinking about these things. Even if his answers are too extreme sometimes, he nearly always asks the right questions.”
— Angie Hobbs ([74:15])
Important Timestamps
- [03:38] Angie Hobbs describes her background and approach to philosophy
- [07:36] Explaining the thematic structure and accessibility of the book
- [11:48] Why Plato’s dialogue form is central to philosophical education
- [21:12] Civic virtue and dialogue in Plato; contrast with modern polarization
- [24:48] Critical thinking and philosophy for children
- [27:18] Unpacking eudaimonia—what is flourishing for Plato?
- [32:03] Plato’s internalization of justice and the imperative against “returning wrong for wrong”
- [40:44] Art, beauty, and moral formation
- [51:03] Plato’s analysis of how democracies succumb to tyranny
- [62:09] The manipulation of language as a harbinger of tyranny
- [65:17] Platonic friendship and love as tools for rebuilding trust and community
- [74:15] Strategies for reviving Plato in the 21st century
Conclusion
Prof. Angie Hobbs persuasively argues for Plato’s continued urgency in an era marred by division, distrust, and autocracy. Through dialogue, critical self-examination, and aiming for flourishing rather than shallow happiness, individuals and communities can reclaim agency, resist manipulation, and build new bonds of trust. Whether through the education of children or the reinvigoration of public discourse, Plato offers pressing resources for our age.
Why Plato Matters Now is highly recommended by the host as “beautifully accessible, yet deep,” inviting all readers—and listeners—to join the conversation that Plato began over two millennia ago.
Audiobook Note: Angie Hobbs narrates the Why Plato Matters Now audiobook, available on all major platforms ([76:27]).
End of summary