Podcast Summary: New Books Network – Interview with Leo R. Chavez, "The Latino Threat: How Alarmist Rhetoric Misrepresents Immigrants, Citizens, and the Nation" (3rd Edition, Stanford UP, 2025)

Episode Overview

In this insightful episode of New Books in Latino Studies on the New Books Network, host David James Gonzalez speaks with anthropologist Leo R. Chavez about the third edition of his landmark book, The Latino Threat: How Alarmist Rhetoric Misrepresents Immigrants, Citizens, and the Nation. The discussion explores how anti-immigrant rhetoric—particularly against Latinos—has moved from the political fringes into the mainstream of American discourse, the evolution of 'the Latino threat narrative,' and the profound individual and societal impacts of such rhetoric. Chavez also highlights updates in the new edition, especially his research on the psychological effects of negative rhetoric on Latino individuals.

Key Discussion Points and Insights

1. Leo Chavez’s Background and Motivation

• Personal & Academic Roots
  • Chavez traces his roots to New Mexico, with a family presence dating to the early 1600s. He notes the irony in "go back home" rhetoric, having deeper generational ties to the region than many nativists. (03:11)
  • His professional evolution since the 1980s has centered on understanding why immigrant communities, especially Latinos, are persistently misrepresented in U.S. society. (05:18)
  • Quote:

    "When I hear a lot of this rhetoric about, you know, Latinos should go home... Well, I kind of ask, well, where did you come from? Because we were here a lot longer than most of the people who are talking." (03:24)

• Motivation for New Edition
  • Dramatic shifts in the public and political rhetoric about Latinos, especially after Trump’s rise, prompted a comprehensive revision.
  • Quote:

    “Where I thought [the Latino threat] was dying out under the Obama years... you have Donald Trump, and I felt like, who gave him a copy of my book? Because it's almost everything I wrote about the myths of the Latino threat narrative. He basically was shouting them and extolling them and claiming them as truth.” (09:45)

2. From Fringe to Mainstream: The Latino Threat Narrative

• Historical Context
  • In earlier decades, nativist and alarmist rhetoric was fringe, associated with figures like Samuel Huntington and Pat Buchanan.
  • In the 21st century, notably post-2015, these ideas have become central in mainstream political discourse, often endorsed by prominent politicians.
  • Quote:

    "It was the super fringe... but it has now been pushed... and it's become mainstream... I think Trump's biggest effective message is this, right? Is the Latino threat, is the immigrant threat. I think that's how he pulls his coalition and holds them together in many ways." (18:33)

• Right-Wing Media & Policy
  • Right-wing media and politicians deploy concepts such as "white replacement," "remigration," and explicit eugenics-era terms, normalizing ideas once considered taboo.
  • Quote:

    "The willingness in this administration to use terms that are so clearly coming out of a white racist rhetoric is unbelievable." (21:17)

3. The Function of Rhetoric vs. Empirical Evidence

• Rhetoric as Political Tool
  • Chavez’s research illustrates that the Latino threat isn’t grounded in empirical reality (e.g., immigrants causing more crime), but is a constructed rhetorical tool serving political and social goals.
  • Quote:

    “It's not empirical evidence that's pushing the Latino threat narrative. It's rhetoric... So I felt I had to put the evidence just so people realized how powerful the rhetoric was.” (26:49)

• Narrative as Social Motivator
  • The "Latino threat narrative" helps channel public frustrations and economic anxieties toward scapegoating, obscuring the real sources of inequality and stagnation.
  • Quote:

    "A narrative like the Latino narrative... is a scapegoat narrative. It's a way of saying, you know what?...It’s not our policies that are causing the problem. It's those people." (28:32)

4. Political and Policy Consequences

• Motivation for Radical Policies
  • The narrative catalyzes drastic policy responses: militarization of the border, family separations, mass deportations, attempts to end birthright citizenship, and endorsement of racial profiling.
  • Quote:

    "It motivates policies that seem radical, like putting barbed wire on the Rio Grande, so when people... they get caught up and drowned. I mean, it's just a macabre set of policies that seem to work.” (35:26)

• Erosion of Constitutional Protections
  • Even basic constitutional protections, like those against racial profiling or for birthright citizenship, have become targets.
  • Quote:

    “Racial profiling was illegal until the Supreme Court told us to do as much racial profiling as you wanted to, because how do you really tell who's a citizen or not?" (46:56)

• Diminished Citizenship
  • Chavez describes a new social hierarchy, where those “perceived as immigrant or non-white” experience “diminished citizenship,” subject to discretionary harassment and fewer protections.
  • Quote:

    "You have citizenship, then you have diminished citizenship. Those who don't have quite the same safeguards anymore..." (47:47)

5. Media Spectacle and Information Fragmentation

• Role of Media in Spreading the Narrative
  • The transition from mainstream magazines and cable news to fragmented, algorithm-driven social media has intensified the echo chamber effect and expanded reach of alarmist rhetoric.
  • Quote:

    "This fragmentation of the sources of information is really, in a sense, worked to enhance the idea that there really is no truth. That the truth is what we're going to tell you right now." (54:35)

• Challenges to Critical Thinking
  • The barriers to locating credible information make it difficult for individuals (even students) to verify or challenge dominant narratives.
  • Quote:

    “How hard, if you really wanted to counter that information, that was your sole source of information, where would you begin to look? ...Even my students, you want them to think critically, but you have to kind of lead them by the hand to go find information." (57:22)

6. Psychological and Social Impact on Latinos

• Laboratory Findings: Rhetoric's Psychological Toll
  • Chavez’s new edition features research co-conducted with a psychologist at UC Irvine. They exposed Mexican-origin students to negative, neutral, and positive rhetoric, measuring physiological and emotional responses.
  • Negative rhetoric raised stress and lowered subjective health and belonging; positive rhetoric improved well-being and reduced stress.
  • Quote:

    “If you talk bad about people, they feel bad about themselves. If you talk good about people, they feel part of society, they feel like they belong.” (66:17)

• A Broader Lesson for American Society
  • Chavez cautions that anti-Latino rhetoric is a bellwether: once normalized, it easily expands to target other minorities and dissenters, undermining social cohesion for everyone.
  • Quote:

    “I talk about for Latinos isn't just for Latinos... Well, then he starts talking about the, you know, the Chinese pandemic and rhetoric... or the Somalis right now not being, being disgusting, being animals, it's the same.” (65:03)

7. Final Reflections

• Both host and guest express hope for a political pendulum swing but acknowledge the cultural and legal damage wrought in the meantime.
• Closing question from Chavez:

  “What kind of country do we want? Do you want to have where we're calling immigrants, we're calling Mexicans rapists and murderers... or do you want to have a society where people feel like they belong?” (71:17)

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On rhetorical scapegoating:

  “It's a motivator for action by people who want to pursue that kind of a line of thought to blame Latinos and immigrants for whatever bad thing in their life they feel is happening.” (27:32, D: Leo Chavez)

• On the normalization of extremist rhetoric:

  “The willingness to just borrow those phrases and use them as if somehow they don't matter. Someone asked me, well, isn't re migration just return migration? I said, no… one’s in ideology, one’s trying to understand a phenomenon.” (21:44, D)

• On the decline of meaningful truth in media:

  “There really is no truth. The truth is what we're going to tell you right now.” (54:36, D)

• On the stakes for all Americans:

  “It's sort of like that old saying, you know, you didn't say anything when they came for me, but now they're coming for you.” (65:14, D)

Important Timestamps

• 03:11–06:00: Chavez’s family history and his entry into immigration studies
• 09:08–15:17: Why and how the third edition of The Latino Threat came to be; focus on the Trump era
• 18:33–20:30: Host/guest discuss mainstreaming of anti-Latino rhetoric and MAGA movement
• 25:59–32:09: Chavez’s anthropological approach—what narrative accomplishes vs. evidence
• 35:08–42:20: What policies are justified or motivated by the Latino threat narrative?
• 46:56–51:13: Constitutional erosions, racial profiling, and the hollowing of protections
• 54:35–59:39: Media spectacle shifts with the internet—truth, echo chambers, and algorithmic reinforcement
• 62:37–68:00: Psychological studies—measuring the real, negative impact of political rhetoric on Latino well-being
• 71:17–73:13: Final reflections—What kind of country do we want? Invitation to societal self-reflection

Conclusion

This timely and thoughtful conversation between David James Gonzalez and Leo R. Chavez thoroughly examines the history, mechanisms, and consequences of anti-Latino rhetoric in American life. Chavez’s updated research illuminates not only the sociopolitical movement of these ideas from margin to mainstream but also their deeply personal psychological effects on individuals and their corrosive impact on the fabric of American democracy. The episode closes by reminding listeners that the question of who belongs, and on what terms, is urgent—not only for Latinos, but for the nation as a whole.