Podcast Summary

Podcast: New Books Network
Episode: Martin Herskovitz, "Son of the Shoah: Poems from a Second-Generation Holocaust Survivor"
Host: Rora Arousi
Guest: Martin Herskovitz
Date: December 26, 2025

Episode Overview

This episode features a profound conversation between host Rora Arousi and poet Martin Herskovitz about his book Son of the Shoah: Poems from a Second-Generation Holocaust Survivor (McFarland, 2025). The discussion delves into Herskovitz's personal and collective journey as a child of Holocaust survivors, exploring inherited trauma, memory, the burdens of silence, and the role of poetry in processing intergenerational grief. The episode also examines the evolving meaning of Holocaust remembrance for second-generation survivors, with Herskovitz reading select poems illustrating these themes.

Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Introduction & Context

• Martin Herskovitz's Background:

  • Born in the USA, made aliyah to Israel at 30.
  • Began confronting the impact of being a second-generation Holocaust survivor in his mid-40s ([02:43]).
  • Turned to poetry after realizing the impact of unspoken trauma and the silence prevalent in survivor families.

• Poetry as Connection:

  • Poetry became a vital tool for Herskovitz to reach into his family’s past, especially when spoken words were absent:

    “So I used poetry as a means of connecting to my past and connecting to the Holocaust memory.” ([03:58])

2. The Book's Title and Its Evolution

• Original Hebrew Edition:
  • First written and published in Hebrew as Shnot Dor, a wordplay on "second generation," with deep biblical resonance ([04:31]).
  • English title changed to Son of the Shoah for explicit Holocaust reference—a choice emphasizing the shaping force of the Shoah on his identity:

    “Who I am now is... because of the Shoah, and I’m very much a product of the Shoah.” ([06:19])

3. The Concept of “Second Generation”

• Herskovitz reflects on being born “to repair and to fill the vacuum the Shoah left” ([06:57]).

• Judith Baumel Schwartz’s foreword highlights the implied continuity in “second generation”—a concept of inherited trauma, connection and dependence ([06:19]–[06:57]).

• On Burden and Identity:

  "When you’re born in order to repair a world that was destroyed, it’s almost an impossible task." (Herskovitz, [07:55])

• On Naming and Responsibility:

  “A child of Holocaust survivors seldom has a life of their own. We’re almost always named for someone or, more usually, more than one person… brought into the world to replace those other souls.” (Arousi citing the book, [07:55]–[08:29])

4. Themes of Silence and Mourning

• Parental Silence:
  Herskovitz recounts his mother’s refusal to discuss her Holocaust experiences, protecting her unique “silence” ([11:23]).

  Notable Quote:

  “My mother has never spoken of what happened during the war. Her silence unsullied. Just look on the Internet, she says. It is full of stories no different than mine. Only silence is truly hers.” (Poem “Silence”, read at [11:23]–[11:48])

• Inadequacy of Conventional Mourning:

  “I truly feel that my parents never mourned for the family that died... They made themselves busy with reinventing the world and repairing the world... the silence is unfair to those who were murdered.” ([08:41]–[09:57])

  • Herskovitz’s poetry serves as a private and communal act of mourning, striving to fill the void left by his parents’ silence.

5. Intergenerational Trauma & Rebellion

• Rebellion Deferred:

  “My poetry is some sort of my adolescent rebellion, 40 years later.” (Herskovitz, [11:13])

• Feeling of Failure and Responsibility:

  “I was born in order to cure my parents, to make them feel better. And I failed… I’ve grown up with the feeling that I never was able to make my parents full.” ([10:00])

6. Tension Between Sadness and Renewal

• Poem: “Renewal” ([13:18])
  • Vivid imagery of almond trees blooming in frost reflects both renewal and cruelty in being born into trauma.
  • Herskovitz expresses ambivalence about hope:

    “No, I don’t see it as hopeful at all... I don’t think I’m here in this world to be happy. If I can help people with my pain and with my poetry, then that’s why I’m here.” ([14:18]–[15:50])

7. Complexities of Bearing Witness

• Limits of Second-Generation Testimony:

  • Herskovitz is candid about the difference between inherited and lived trauma:

    “What does a second generation testify? ... They have the inherited story, but then they have their own story also.” ([19:56])

  • Poem: “Testimony” ([19:56]):

    “When my turn came to tell my family’s Holocaust story, I could only remember the lonely boy in the yard. I could only remember the disappointment in her eyes as I told my memories from Auschwitz.” ([20:45])

  • The emotional burden is compounded by a sense of inadequacy and alienation from direct experience, yet an internalization of grief.

8. God, Theodicy, and Faith After Catastrophe

• The Role of God:

  • Herskovitz’s poems “Theology” and “God’s Wrath” grapple with the absence or incomprehensibility of God post-Shoah:

    “Either God was able to prevent their deaths and chose not to… then I see no reason to thank him… Alternatively, if God was helpless and incapable… then I don’t have any reason to be on his good side…” (“Theology”, [22:09])

    “God stays in his room and I’m in mine… he does not huddle next to me in the safe room... at night he snores and keeps me awake.” (“God’s Wrath”, [26:10]–[27:03])

  • This struggle reflects both rational and emotional attempts to process suffering and injustice within faith traditions ([23:30]–[24:41]).

9. The Image of the Memorial Candle

• On Remembrance:

  • Herskovitz considers himself a "memorial candle," responsible for mourning and keeping memory alive, especially for relatives never commemorated ([27:34]).

  • His poems “Names” and “Mints” poignantly enact this remembrance:

    “My mother’s father was named Mordechai Kleinbart... Mordechai Kleinbart is the single name I have, and it alone is carved into stone... All other names exist only in memories long interred or in pages yet unwritten.” (“Names”, [28:00]–[30:07])

    “No one really mourns my grandfather. No one really mourns my uncles who died as children, except me a little bit.” ([29:00])

• Purpose of Poetry:

  • Through these poems, Herskovitz attempts to "process the trauma" by restoring memory and initiating mourning, both personally and for his community ([27:34]–[30:07]).

10. Rethinking Holocaust Memory and Commemoration

• Toward More Personal Remembrance:
  > “One of my goals … is to change the way we commemorate the Holocaust… it’s very little about remembering and mourning the people who died… If I can change it to be more like the Soldier’s Remembrance Day, I’ve done something.” ([30:19]–[31:06])

• Herskovitz advocates for more individualized mourning, moving away from ideological approaches toward emotionally resonant memorialization.

11. New Projects

• Herskovitz previews an upcoming book in collaboration with the Finkler Institute and Prof. Judy Baumel, focusing on the evolution of Holocaust memory—from ideology to emotional resonance ([31:12]–[32:15]).

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On Jewish Intergenerational Identity:

  “When you’re born in order to repair a world that was destroyed, it’s almost an impossible task.” ([07:55])

• On the Role of Silence:

  “Only silence is truly hers.” (Poem, [11:48])

• On Mourning and Memory:

  “When I read those poems, I remember them and I mourn them and I deal with the trauma. So that’s why I wrote this book.” ([29:00])

• Struggle with God:

  “God stays in his room and I’m in mine… And on Shabbat in the synagogue, I look for him, but I cannot find him. But I know that he exists because at night he snores and keeps me awake.” (Poem “God’s Wrath”, [26:10])

• Herskovitz’s Vision for Commemoration:

  “If I can change it to be more like the Soldier’s Remembrance Day, I’ve done something.” ([31:06])

Timestamps for Key Segments

• Guest Introduction & Motivations: [02:43]
• Book Title & Hebrew/English Differences: [04:31]–[06:19]
• Definition of Second Generation: [06:19]–[07:55]; [08:29]
• Discussions on Mourning & Parental Silence: [08:41]–[11:23]
• Reading: “Silence”: [11:23]–[11:48]
• Personal Reflection on Rebellion & Trauma: [11:13]; [10:00]
• Reading & Reflection: “Renewal”: [13:18]–[15:50]
• Testimony and Transmission of Trauma: [19:56]–[20:45]
• DNA Memory / Epigenetics: [20:56]
• God, Theodicy, Theology: [22:09]–[27:03]
• Reading & Reflection: “Names” and “Mints”: [28:00]–[30:07]
• Call for Change in Remembrance Culture: [30:19]–[31:06]
• Upcoming Projects: [31:12]–[32:15]
• Closing Reflections on Duty and Mourning: [32:21]–[32:42]

Conclusion

This episode offers a moving exploration of second-generation Holocaust survivor experience as seen through Martin Herskovitz’s poetry. The conversation skillfully traverses personal memory, inherited trauma, questions of faith, and the evolving landscape of Holocaust remembrance. Herskovitz’s openness and the evocative reading of his poems invite listeners—regardless of background—into a space of reflection, communal mourning, and renewed understanding of survival and legacy.