Podcast Summary:
New Books Network – Rayanne Haines, "What Kind of Daughter" (Frontenac House Press, 2024)
Host: Holly Gattery
Guest: Rayanne Haines
Air Date: December 3, 2025
Episode Overview
In this profoundly moving episode, host Holly Gattery interviews acclaimed poet and hybrid author Rayanne Haines about her latest book, What Kind of Daughter. Blending poetry, lyrical essays, and fragments of memoir, the collection explores themes of daughterhood, anticipatory and experienced grief, familial complexity, and the enduring strength and contradictions of women. The conversation offers listeners deep insights into the book’s motivations, structure, themes, and the powerful, visceral language that defines Haines’s style.
Main Discussion Points & Insights
1. Motivation and Origins of the Book
(03:36-06:39)
- Rayanne Haines wrote the book in response to her mother’s terminal cancer diagnosis and her struggle with private, anticipatory grief.
- She notes that society rarely allows for open grief before a death, necessitating her private reckoning and turn to writing as a means to process these emotions.
“We exist in a society that does not allow us to really grieve publicly when someone is still living... So I turned to writing because that's how I tend to process the things that I'm moving through.” - Rayanne Haines (04:36)
- The book evolved into an exploration of intergenerational trauma and the burdens placed on women as caregivers and grievers.
- Formally, Haines’s choice for a hybrid structure reflects the unpredictable, complex nature of grief: “I really didn't feel I could force the book into one particular form, that I really needed to allow it to take its own shape...” (06:24)
2. Embracing Contradictions in Familial Love
(06:39-11:48)
- Gattery commends the book's refusal to tie up messy, contradictory feelings into simple resolutions, especially regarding the mother-daughter relationship.
- Haines elaborates on honoring the “firestorm” complexity of her mother: “If I was going to be as vulnerable as I knew I had to be, I also had to be as truthful and as authentic as I could be.” (08:28)
- She discusses the importance of writing the whole, messy reality, balancing admiration and annoyance, love and frustration.
3. Poetry as a Vehicle for Grief and Memory
(11:48-16:02)
- The poetic and fragmentary forms are seen as inherently suited to exploring grief’s unresolved, cyclical nature.
- Haines speaks to how language and imagery are often rooted in the body and instinct: “I write to take things out of my body because holding it in my body is far too difficult. And so I imagine that element of the body... when I'm thinking about the imagery or the visceral reactions...” (14:04)
- She emphasizes reading widely, especially poetry, as key to crafting evocative writing.
4. A Reading from “What Kind of Daughter”
(19:45-21:53)
- Haines chooses to read the poem “in lieu of flowers,” transporting listeners into a palliative hospital room with sensory-rich, fragmented details of her mother’s final days, underlining the collision of the mundane and the profound in the face of loss.
- The reading is praised for its vivid, immersive, and authentic details.
5. Hybrid Form and Editorial Process
(21:53-23:57)
- Haines praises her editor, Micheline Mailer (Frontenac House), for fully supporting the book’s hybrid structure: “She understood that the book asked to not be one thing, that the intention, because as we move through grief, it's so many different things.” (22:59)
- The publisher’s commitment to experimental, formally innovative writing was crucial to the collection’s final form.
6. Sequencing and Structure – The Seven Stages of Grief
(26:31-29:05)
- The collection is intentionally sequenced according to a personal concept of the “seven stages of grief,” marked by one-line poems that punctuate and organize the book thematically rather than chronologically.
- Haines reflects that neither grief nor memory are linear—so neither is her book.
7. Writing about Family: Ethics and Repercussions
(29:05-32:08)
- Haines candidly addresses the recurring dilemma of writing about family, foregrounding her responsibility mainly to younger family members, less so to adults.
- She writes “with care” but does not ask for permission to tell her truth, even when it involves traumatic experiences: “If they are... come, they do the thing, then I can write the thing.” (30:23)
- She never writes with the intention to harm, but maintains the prerogative to tell her story.
8. Another Poem: “It’s the Dead He Can’t Sit With”
(33:44-36:20)
- Haines reads this poignant poem about her father’s complicated grief after her mother’s death, touching on themes of hoarding, memory, family dynamics, and the unease of letting go.
- This provides listeners with another window into the book’s deft handling of familial loss and emotional inheritance.
Notable Quotes & Moments
-
On the need for truthful writing:
“We are human beings, are nuanced, we are complicated, we are complex... we have to write about those complexities and those challenges.” - Raeanne Haines (08:28)
-
On poetic language and the body:
“I write to take things out of my body because holding it in my body is far too difficult.” - Raeanne Haines (14:04)
-
On the authenticity of grief:
“It wouldn't have made sense for the book to be a chronological thing, because grief is not much like I couldn't write the book in one particular form. I couldn't write grief in a particular linear timeline either.” - Raeanne Haines (28:55)
-
On writing about family members:
“My belief has always been that if a family member is a child...it's my responsibility to take more care... An adult, I don't have the same sense of responsibility...I don't feel the responsibility to ask permission.” - Raeanne Haines (30:23)
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Memorable exchange about tearing up while reading:
“My oldest son came in and said to me, mom, why do you read books that upset you? And I said, her mama died. And he just said no and gave me a hug.” - Holly Gattery (36:57)
Key Timestamps
- 1:31 — Podcast proper begins
- 3:36 — Haines discusses her motivation for the book
- 6:39 — Conversation on contradictions in relationships
- 11:48 — Exploration of imagery and poetic process
- 14:04 — Haines on writing through the body
- 19:45 — Haines reads “in lieu of flowers”
- 22:59 — Editorial support for hybrid form
- 26:31 — Sequencing the book via grief’s stages
- 30:23 — Ethics of writing about family
- 33:44 — Haines reads final poem about her father
- 36:57 — Emotional resonance and final reflections
Episode Tone & Language
- Intimate, raw, and conversational
- Both host and guest lean into vulnerability and candor
- Emphasis on honesty, complexity, and acceptance of emotional messiness
- Deep respect for the craft of poetry and the authenticity of lived experience
Final Thoughts
This episode is a layered, heartfelt exploration of What Kind of Daughter and the challenges of writing—honestly and artfully—about grief, family, and self. Haines and Gattery both invite listeners into uncomfortable, universal truths of love and loss, making the episode as memorable and emotionally resonant as the work it discusses.
“What Kind of Daughter” is available through Frontenac House Press and wherever books are sold or borrowed.