Podcast Summary

Podcast: New Books Network
Episode: Stevie Suan, "Anime's Identity: Performativity and Form Beyond Japan" (U Minnesota Press, 2021)
Host: Jenny Lee
Guest: Dr. Stevie Suan, Associate Professor of Media, Performance, and Asian Studies at Hosei University
Date: October 20, 2025

Episode Overview

This episode features a deep dive into Dr. Stevie Suan’s book Anime’s Identity: Performativity and Form Beyond Japan. The conversation explores how anime’s form, production processes, and global reception complicate its presumed "Japaneseness." Dr. Suan discusses his theoretical approaches, especially the concept of the “anime-esque,” transnational labor in anime production, and the shifting relationship between national identity and globalization in anime culture. The episode interrogates longstanding assumptions about anime as exclusively Japanese cultural property, offering a layered perspective that foregrounds form, hybridity, and the politics of cultural production.

Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Dr. Suan’s Background and Motivation

• Interest in Form: Dr. Suan’s scholarship centers on formal analysis—examining how media forms operate within the world and mediate broader social and global tensions.
  • "The majority of my interest is really in formal analysis or looking at form and exploring how that can be active and operative in the world in different ways." (02:29)
• Anime Enthusiast: He is a long-time anime fan; favorites include Evangelion, Cowboy Bebop, and the Trust and Betrayal OVA from Rurouni Kenshin (03:41–04:46).
• Project Genesis: Frustration with the lack of analytical frameworks for anime’s transnational production led him to ask new questions about creativity, repetition, and identity in anime.
  • "There weren’t really frameworks or vocabulary to talk about the different ways something could be transnational." (05:40)
  • Noted Caroline Levine’s point: “There is no politics without form.” (05:21)

2. Anime as Japanese Cultural Representation

• Semantic Differences: "Anime" in Japanese means all commercial animation, including Disney, versus its global association as a distinctively Japanese style (10:22–12:50).
• Cool Japan and National Branding: External popularity of late-night TV anime influenced domestic recognition and contributed to nation branding, e.g., the Cool Japan campaign (12:50–14:50).
• Internal/External Definitions: Domestic/mainstream anime like Sazae-san dominate Japanese viewership, but fans abroad fixate on niche, subcultural works.
  • "Nobody’s going to Akihabara to buy Sazae-san goods. Nobody’s cosplaying as Sazae-san outside of Japan." (13:44)

3. Shifting Perceptions and Institutionalization of Anime

• Changing Reputations: Anime has moved from subcultural/nerdy stigma to institutional legitimacy in Japan and globally.
  • "My interest in anime went from being like, what? Why...? To, oh yeah, of course—it’s Japanese culture." (16:11)
• Direct Cultural Reading Cautions: Anime does not offer a simple reflection of “Japanese culture”; stylization, conventions, and anime’s own media logic distance it from direct indexical reality.
  • "Nobody in Japan sounds like anime characters talk... it’s a very stylized way of speaking." (17:39)
  • "This media form makes a direct reading of anime as a reflection of Japanese culture directly kind of difficult." (17:23)

4. Theoretical Framework: The Anime-Esque

• Definition: “Anime-esque” denotes recurring formal and stylistic conventions—visuals, narrative patterns, character expressions—that signal “anime” across genres and studios.
  • Examples: arched eyes, exaggerated mouthful-of-toast moments, glimmering eyes, shock expressions (20:47–22:40).
• Function: The anime-esque provides a way to identify anime through density of conventions rather than origin—enabling a more global, form-focused definition.
  • "What defines anime is a type of density of these different anime-esque elements." (23:20)
  • Opens up anime by form: "This allows us to open anime up to a more global view... and still concentrate on the formal elements." (23:36)

5. Anime, Nation, and Globalization

• Nationalization via Globalization: The more anime is promoted globally, the more it is branded as quintessentially Japanese, often through focus on hyper-localized settings—a dialectical relationship (24:27–27:34).
• Anime Pilgrimages: Fans worldwide visit real locations featured in anime (Tamako Market, for example)—a sign of the interplay between local sites and global fandom (27:34–28:57).

6. Anime’s Transnational Production Networks

• Transnationality Forms:
  • Local-Global Tension: Anime is presumed locally Japanese even as it is produced/consumed globally.
  • Centralized Transnational Networks: Production is mainly centralized in Tokyo, with extensive outsourcing to studios (often in Asia). Example: A single episode’s frames may involve work from Japan, Philippines, Vietnam, and China (30:35–40:10).
  • Decentralized Networks: The anime-esque itself is a set of formal conventions iterated and referenced by animators around the world, regardless of location—creating a decentralized, referential web of production/reproduction (40:10–44:30).
  • "In a weird way, this anime-esque performance both enables but also hides the transnationality of anime's production." (44:56)
• Labor and Agency: Emphasis on skilled, often underappreciated, non-Japanese labor in anime; calls for making their contributions visible and recognized.

7. The Hybrid Nature—and Future—of Anime

• Constant Hybridity: Anime’s form is and always has been hybrid—pulling from global influences (e.g., UK’s Thunderbirds, Hong Kong kung fu films).
  • "Anime and the anime-esque itself is always quite hybrid from the get-go." (48:11)
  • "It keeps feeling, I think, so fresh... because it’s always bringing in different things." (49:22)
• Innovation vs. Authenticity Trap: Non-Japanese productions are scrutinized—if they deviate, not "anime enough;" if they conform, "mere copies"—a double bind (46:00–47:07).

8. Anime’s Social Function and National Identity

• Mainstreaming in Japan: Increasingly, teaching anime is counted as teaching Japanese culture.
• Provocation for Cultural Theory: Anime exemplifies complex hybridity and border-crossing, challenging nation-based models for cultural production and identity.
  • "For me it’s hybridity all the way up, all the way down... If we look at the idea of the anime-esque, as long as the anime-esque patterns are adhered to, anyone, anywhere, theoretically could participate..." (51:56–55:25)
  • "There’s a bunch of different possibilities for conceptualizing culture in general—who makes it, where it comes from, how we relate to it... All of that gets wrapped into the way that we expect it to perhaps, or what we expect it to represent and what we can glean from it." (52:40)
• Imperialism and Power Shadows: Anime’s transnational production often involves societies with colonial histories vis-à-vis Japan, raising questions about agency, erasure, and repetition of historical violence (55:38–56:23).
• Call for New Methodologies: Advocates moving beyond origin-based analysis to focus on form and collaborative labor, reconceptualizing cultural production as inherently hybrid and multi-sited.

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On Form as Political:
  • "There is no politics without form." – (Citing Caroline Levine, 05:21)
• On Anime’s Varied Definitions:
  • "In Japanese, anime...implies commercial or popular animation of all different kinds. Outside of Japan, though, the word has a much more narrow meaning..." (10:22)
• On Globalization and the Local:
  • "As anime gets more global, the emphasis on the local and really, really tiny local places, it increases." (26:55)
• On Production Networks:
  • "In the book, I talk about one particular episode which had parts of it done in Japan, parts done in the Philippines, Vietnam, and China." (39:30)
• On Anime-Esque and Cultural Borders:
  • "If we look at the idea of the anime-esque, as long as the anime-esque patterns are adhered to, anyone anywhere, theoretically could participate in cultural production." (54:30)
• On the Double-Edged Sword of Hybridity:
  • "The anime-esque, when seen as representative of Japanese culture, can be seen as a copying over and a replaying of the historical violence of erasure..." (56:08)

Timestamps for Important Segments

• Introduction & Guest Background: 01:29–04:55
• Motivations for the Book: 04:55–09:31
• Anime as Japanese Representation: 10:22–15:07
• Changing Perceptions of Anime Fandom & Studies: 15:07–20:06
• Defining “Anime-Esque”: 20:47–23:56
• Anime, Nation, and Globalization: 24:27–28:57
• Transnational Production Explained: 30:35–47:07
• Anime’s Hybridity and Innovation: 48:11–50:33
• Anime’s Role in Japanese National Identity & Cultural Theory: 50:59–57:24
• Closing Remarks and Book Recommendation: 57:24–57:38

Conclusion

Dr. Stevie Suan’s interview challenges simplistic nation-focused understandings of anime, urging listeners to recognize the medium’s complex, hybrid, and transnational realities—both in its stylistic forms and in the actual labor that produces it. By foregrounding the anime-esque and emphasizing animation as a collaborative, global effort, he opens up new ways to conceptualize identity, culture, and media beyond rigid national borders.