Podcast Summary:

New Books Network: Interview with Thomas Kuehn, "Patrimony and Law in Renaissance Italy"
Host: Yana Byers
Guest: Thomas Kuehn (Professor Emeritus, Clemson University)
Episode Date: February 7, 2026

Overview

This episode features a rich, detailed conversation with historian Thomas Kuehn about his book Patrimony and Law in Renaissance Italy (Cambridge University Press, 2022). The discussion centers on the complexities of family, property, and legal practices in Renaissance Italy, drawing on decades of Kuehn’s archival research. It highlights how family structure, inheritance law, and the operation of legal institutions shaped both daily life and broader societal structures during this pivotal historical period.

Key Discussion Points & Insights

Kuehn’s Intellectual Trajectory and Research Approach

• Kuehn has focused his career on the intersection of family, people, and law, especially in Florence but also Milan and the Vatican. His approach is deeply archival, exploring how legal documentation both reveals and obscures historical reality.

  "Most of the documents you could find in the archives to explain these issues of family interaction are themselves legal. And that throws...a very thick and opaque veneer over what people are thinking and doing. But you've got to wade through that to get to things." (B, 01:41)

• Data collection methods have evolved, moving from manual transcription to digital databases and photography, but issues of interpretation remain.

  "I know I've gone back into some of that stuff...and I keep going through that database going, what the hell does this mean?" (B, 04:52)

The Core of Patrimony and Law

• Kuehn describes his research as fundamentally about patrimony — the transmission of family wealth and status — and the legal mechanisms governing it. His works follow threads of emancipation, illegitimacy, and the negotiation of inheritance and property rights.

• Central contradictions emerge: While law and custom suggest the father’s control is absolute, in practice, legal prerogatives and the roles of sons, mothers, and siblings complicate the picture.

  "On one hand you find all sorts of statements that make it look like a father of a family controls all the property, all the income. And yet...sons have prerogatives on these things. Mothers clearly have a prerogative in the dowry..." (B, 05:25)

Family Composition and Legal Definitions ([08:26])

• "Family" (familia) is not simply a group of blood relations; the term’s meaning has shifted:

  • Originally linked to groups of slaves.
  • Later, it legally excluded figures today considered family, such as the mother, who is technically from another family.
  • Residency and citizenship also complicated claims to inheritance and status.

  "Your mother's not part of the family. I mean, that's maybe one of the most astounding things. And yet she's not in legal terms..." (B, 08:26) "You get the whole problem of people who claim to be Florentine but live in Padua..." (B, 10:04)

Law, the State, and the Preservation of Wealth ([12:25])

• Most conflict resolution and property management occurred within families, led by patriarchs and shaped by tradition.

• The government’s role included preserving the wealth of elite families; state intervention sometimes aimed to keep property within citizen hands, but fortunes remained volatile.

  "The government sees part of its role as to preserve the wealth of its citizens...But government also will seemingly step in in some situations and say, well, that's our role. We're supposed to keep people in their wealth." (B, 12:25)

• Notable case: the Pazzi and Borromei families argued over inheritance, reflecting both legal ambiguity and political realities ([11:27]).

Conflict, Cooperation, and the Legal Profession ([14:05])

• Family and inheritance disputes were common, intensifying with claims by illegitimate children or when legal interpretations differed.

• Legal outcomes could be uncertain due to the lack of a precedent-based system; every situation had to be argued with available statutes and legal reasoning.

  "There's a lot of fighting that can go on. There's a reason Florence was full of notaries..." (B, 14:11)

Jurists and Legal Theory: Bartolus of Sassoferrato ([16:21])

• Bartolus (1313–1357/8) played a pivotal role in shaping the legal conception of family and patrimony.
  • He described family as “substance,” a flexible term encompassing not just property but status, honor, and relationships.
  • In Roman law’s ideal, transmission from father to son was seen as automatic and immediate; others had more conditional claims ([21:13]).

  "Bartolus...famously said basically that family is substance. Substance is a very nicely imprecise word...that moves from one generation to the next." (B, 19:26)

Realities of Wealth Transmission ([21:20]–[25:40])

• Numerous factors complicated straightforward inheritance:

  • Sons might earn and hold their own property (if emancipated).
  • Dowries, brothers, multiple households, and changing family membership added complexity.
  • Official records (e.g., the Florentine catasto) could mask actual dynamics; apparent patriarchal control often disguised more complex intergenerational arrangements.

  "You find some of these situations where there's a kind of older patriarch with...a dozen or more people in the household...Who’s really running this show?" (B, 24:04, 24:46)

Legal Devices Protecting Family Wealth ([25:49])

• Key mechanisms included inheritance statutes, the trust (fideicommissum), and legal registration (to prevent, or facilitate, fraud).

• The fideicommissum was meant to keep property in the family, sometimes at the expense of creditors or non-family claimants.

  "Fideicommissum is a Roman device that allowed someone to direct property through one person to another...and sometimes, very specific name pieces, is not to go outside the family." (B, 26:28)

• These strategies could be used to manipulate obligations and shield assets ([29:09]).

Managing Family Members: Incompetence, Insanity, and Guardianship ([29:55])

• Legal frameworks existed for dealing with “wastrel” or incompetent family members, often equating insanity with inability to manage property responsibly.

• Court cases offered rare occasions where women or slaves could give testimony to establish incompetence.

  "Sane people are supposed to be able to take care of their stuff. Those who don't...must be insane." (B, 29:55)

• Guardianship was legally and practically complex, involving oversight, inventories, and the risk of exploitation, especially for minors ([38:37]).

Legal Documents and Everyday Life: Inventories and Oversight ([35:22], [38:37])

• Inventories compiled at moments of inheritance offer a granular view of households (often itemized by room), but many items (like cash or clothing) often went unlisted or were too mundane to record.

  "The inventory, they're fascinating devices in some situations because clearly they went through the house room by room...But on the other hand, there are also pieces of...property that kind of don't make the list." (B, 35:22)

• Florentine magistrates provided oversight for guardianships and minors’ property—a system producing expansive archival material ([38:37]).

Gender, Guardianship, and Maternal Roles ([40:30])

• While Roman law excluded mothers as legal guardians, practice and later revisions allowed and sometimes preferred maternal guardianship, especially as mothers did not stand to inherit.
• Remarriage could disqualify mothers from guardianship, as legal loyalty shifted to the new family ([42:32]).

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• "You find out, for instance, that...your mother's not part of the family...she’s technically not." (B, 08:26)
• "The passage of property to the son is automatic and instantaneous. And it doesn't require a formal act of acceptance of the property, although it would help if you did, because you get the dates down." (B, 21:13)
• "That's how you build an archive in Florence, with a lot of paper." (B, 31:54)
• "All property is seemingly bespoken, multiple levels, by family members, by those who aren't family members...nothing transacts alone." (B, 32:10)
• "They work. And sometimes they don't." (B, 42:48)

Timestamps for Key Segments

• Kuehn’s research career and themes: 01:41 – 05:25
• Archival practice and evolution: 03:37 – 04:52
• Family conception and legal definitions: 08:26 – 10:04
• Inheritance and city/state intervention: 12:25 – 13:58
• Conflict and cooperation: 14:05 – 15:56
• Bartolus, law, and family substance: 16:21 – 21:13
• Complexities of inheritance: 21:20 – 24:46
• Fideicommissum and legal devices: 25:49 – 29:09
• Dealing with incompetence and insanity: 29:55 – 31:47
• Inventories and state oversight: 35:22 – 38:37
• Guardianship, maternal roles, and minors: 40:30 – 42:32

Tone and Style

The conversation is collegial, accessible, and occasionally humorous. Kuehn’s explanations are rich with illustrative examples, while Byers brings a personal and enthusiastic perspective as a fellow historian.

Conclusion

Through vivid anecdotes and expert analysis, Kuehn and Byers unpack how Renaissance Italian law both reflected and shaped family life — exposing a world where legal frameworks, personal relationships, and communal authority constantly intersected. Kuehn's work highlights both continuity and complexity, providing essential context for understanding the transformation of family and property in early modern Europe.