Podcast Summary: New Books Network – Xiang Biao and Wu Qi, "Self as Method: Thinking Through China and the World"

Date: September 22, 2025
Host: Subi Rauzio
Guest: Prof. Xiang Biao (Max Planck Institute for Social Anthropology)
Book: Self as Method: Thinking Through China and the World (Palgrave Macmillan, 2022)
Episode Theme: Exploring personal and social transformation in contemporary China through the lens of "Self as Method."

Episode Overview

This episode dives into Self as Method, a widely influential and bestselling manifesto for young people in China. Professor Xiang Biao, in conversation with the host Subi Rauzio, reflects on his collaboration with journalist Wu Qi and the book’s central message: encouraging youth to engage in self-examination, relate personal experience to societal contexts, and rethink agency and change in modern China. The conversation moves between Xiang’s personal journey, intellectual context, and broader social themes in China, emphasizing the need for concrete, lived understanding in social life and scholarship.

Key Discussion Points and Insights

1. Origin and Intentions Behind "Self as Method"

• How the Project Began [03:28]
  • Xiang recounts how editor Luo Danny prompted him in 2017 to write a book for Chinese youth, inspired by his ability to provide broad sociological perspectives that resonate with individual experience.
  • Collaboration with Wu Qi, whose journalistic expertise allowed for a conversational, accessible format, began in 2018.

Quote:
“I was able to provide a big picture description of Chinese society. And in the picture individual young people can see themselves, they can relate their life experiences to the big picture.”
— Xiang Biao [05:07]

• Academic ‘Hibernation’ and Real-World Impact [07:33]
  • Xiang admits he was not aware of his growing popular influence until approached by journalists and his editor.
  • Describes intellectual loneliness in academia and how public engagement re-energized his work.

“Sometimes it freezes you away from the real world. I thought I was in hibernation after I did my PhD… I received some email messages from young audiences… but it was not that overwhelming.”
— Xiang Biao [07:33]

2. Thinking Through Contradictions and Conflict

• The Importance of Engaging with Everyday Contradictions [17:08]
  • Xiang argues that current polarization and breakdown of public dialogue owes to an avoidance of concrete, detailed social realities.
  • Encourages youth not to think in black-and-white terms, but to examine the actual local context of conflict and disagreement.

“People very quickly use abstract categories… to make a quick package. Okay, this is A… and this is B. It’s all about dividing society… rather than look at more concrete issues.”
— Xiang Biao [21:00]

• Agency via Self-Examination and Local Understanding [25:46]
  • Xiang emphasizes looking inward as a tool for objectifying one’s experience and then understanding the outward world.
  • He distinguishes this method from generic “self-care” discourses, instead advocating for harmony between historical limitation and current ambition.

3. Types of Change—Self-Improvement vs. Systemic Transformation [29:04]

• Two Paths to Change:
  1. Self-Improvement, often pushed by contemporary Chinese society (ambition, mobility, relentless self-betterment).
  2. Systemic Change, which requires understanding one’s concrete relations and environment—a “radical” action can sometimes be to step back (e.g., the “lying flat”/tang ping phenomenon).
• The Power of Examining Personal Details
  • True social transformation happens through collective, concrete self-understanding, not just striving within pre-existing structures.

“Probably the most radical action you can take now is to not work so hard... It sounds quite passive, but as a sentiment, actually it is very radical because they want to say no to the general condition.”
— Xiang Biao [36:30]

4. The Gentry Perspective: A Model for Social Knowledge [41:08]

• Definition and Role of Gentry in Chinese History

  • Gentry were educated, often local notables—connected both to rural communities and state bureaucracy.
  • Their value lies in knowing their environment deeply and blending empirical understanding with a normative, ethical outlook.

• The Charm and Relevance of the Gentry Approach

  • Combines detailed empirical knowledge with an ethical, community-oriented worldview.
  • A critique of both scientism (reduction of social life to data) and moral rigidity.

“Jantry is charming for me because of their way of knowing. They know their surrounding very well... everything is a very empirical miracle… but they will give meanings to these details.”
— Xiang Biao [47:38]

5. Bridging the Gap Between Theory and Lived Reality/Research Practice [54:13]

• Academic Knowledge vs. Life Knowledge

  • The gap between abstract academic debate and real social issues must be bridged.
  • Xiang suggests using experiential, locally grounded details as a foundation for larger questions, blending them with theoretical concepts.

• Relevance to Early Career Scholars

  • Encourages young academics to attune to their institutional (and national) environments, not just chase rankings or abstract reputation.
  • Recognizes writing "to the public" as a new form of intellectual responsibility and transformation.

“The art of living, art of learning is to very imaginatively and attentively to take some suggestive big categories, abstract ideas from text and mingle with vivid, lively… details that you observed and especially experienced in your own life.”
— Xiang Biao [58:50]

6. Public Engagement and Reflexive Scholarship [65:22]

• Transformation Through Public Interaction

  • Public dialogue and feedback from young people fundamentally reshaped Xiang’s anthropological practice—prompting deeper engagement with feelings, ethics, and lived contradictions.

• The Value of Challenging Public Audiences

  • Refutes the notion that engaging with lay audiences means simplifying theory; young readers want tools and stimulation, not “sugar-coated” answers.

“Public audience welcome at least don’t mind difficult theories... What they need is stimulus, is some tools, some questions that help them to think deeper.”
— Xiang Biao [71:20]

7. Evolving Research and the Future: Institutional Settings, Memory, and Common Concerns [78:20, 89:56]

• Institutional Context Matters

  • Moving to the Max Planck Institute (a research-focused institute) brought new research freedoms and challenges.
  • Xiang discusses the need for mindfulness and situational awareness for academics in different environments.

• Ideas for a ‘Fourth Conversation’

  • Plans for further discussions with Wu Qi, perhaps shifting to themes like collective memory and “disremembering” in Chinese society.
  • The need to articulate, not suppress, collective trauma.

• Current Projects

  • Developing a ‘common concern approach’—starting research from urgent, lived anxieties (e.g., uncertainty, competition, powerlessness), not pre-set theoretical questions.
  • Ongoing work on how societies channel ambition and the resulting feelings of powerlessness in China.

“We start with what the people are worried about in their life, what kind of concern they are grappling with now… identifying contradictions, but also clarifying the relations between different types of contradictions.”
— Xiang Biao [92:41]

Notable Quotes and Memorable Moments

• On breaking out of academic hibernation:
  “Do break out. There’s a great fun and lots of enjoy.”
  — Xiang Biao [13:09]

• On the dangers of abstraction:
  “If you don’t know how you are related to your surrounding… you will become a person kind of rootless, intellectually rootless and socially without anchor.”
  — Xiang Biao [23:23]

• On the power of youth public engagement:
  “I feel tremendously grateful to the Chinese young people... do not forget, under the dark cloud there are millions and millions grass asking questions and they are looking for sunlight and they want to grow in a healthy way.”
  — Xiang Biao [87:44]

• Host’s personal reflection:
  “My, my interpretations of your writing is that you don’t—of course you have the theoretical foundation there, but it’s not for the purpose to make that theoretical claim. Rather, it’s a very hands-on type of research, at least of what I’ve read of your work.”
  — Subi Rauzio [75:01]

Timestamps of Key Segments

| Segment / Theme | Timestamp | |----------------------------------------------------|-------------| | How "Self as Method" began | 03:28–06:59 | | Intellectual hibernation and public writing | 07:33–12:12 | | Encouraging contradiction engagement | 17:08–25:46 | | Types of change (self-improvement vs. systemic) | 29:04–38:49 | | Gentry perspective and its relevance | 41:08–52:57 | | Bridging theory and lived experience | 54:13–65:22 | | Effects of public engagement on scholarship | 65:22–74:47 | | Institutional change and memory | 78:20–89:04 | | Common concern research approach | 89:56–97:54 |

Concluding Thoughts

The episode is a nuanced, accessible exploration of what it means to relate the self to the world—and how examining our own experiences can be a method for understanding and changing society. Xiang Biao articulates a vision for reflexive, concrete social thought, blending personal narrative, historical insight, and a commitment to public engagement. He also cautions young scholars to ground inquiry in lived details and urges Chinese youth—and the global audience—to cultivate intellectual agency in turbulent times.

Further Resources

• Download the Book (Open Access):
  Self as Method: Thinking Through China and the World is available at Palgrave Springer.

For more conversations like this, follow New Books in Chinese Studies on the New Books Network.