Podcast Summary: The Dodleston Messages with Paul Rogers

Podcast: New Thinking Allowed Audio Podcast
Host: Jeffrey Mishlove
Guest: Dr. Paul Rogers
Date: February 13, 2026
Episode Theme: A deep dive into the anomalous and controversial Dodleston Messages—a case involving apparent communication across centuries through computer messages in 1980s England.

Episode Overview

This episode explores the fascinating and perplexing case known as "The Dodleston Messages," in which a series of extraordinary communications allegedly took place between residents of a small English cottage in the 1980s and a man living in the 16th century, as well as a mysterious entity from the future. The discussion centers on the authenticity of the case, the nature of the messages, and the ongoing research spearheaded by Dr. Paul Rogers and a dedicated international group.

Main Discussion Points & Insights

1. Introduction to the Dodleston Case

• Central Figures: Ken Webster (schoolteacher) and his partner, Debbie, experienced 1980s phenomena documented in Webster’s book, The Vertical Plane ([03:27], [03:55]).
• Renewed Interest: A new edition of the book, with updated chapters and added content, made the case accessible and more affordable ([03:55]).

2. Initial Phenomena: Poltergeist Activity

• Early Occurrences: Footprints with six toes appeared inexplicably on the walls, returning after being painted over ([00:00], [06:17]).
  • "The footprints was the first strange event they noticed ... it was a different footprint. So that's when it all started to go a bit weird." – Dr. Rogers ([00:00])
• Other Activity: Movement of objects, balancing items, and unexplained disturbances ([06:17], [32:02]).

3. The Computer Messages Emerge

• First Message: A poem appeared on a borrowed BBC Microcomputer; assumed to be a prank but led to more anomalous messages ([06:17]).
• Nature of Communication: Messages in Early Modern English, referencing events, people, and institutions from the 1500s, with details confirmed through historical research ([06:17]–[12:40]).
• Pseudonym Mystery: ‘Lucas Wayman’ later revealed as a pseudonym for Thomas Harden, a historical figure corroborated via college rosters ([12:40]).

4. Mechanics of Communication

• How Did the Messaging Work?: Thomas (16th century) described using a ‘Leams Boys’/‘box of lights’—words appeared in the air, while Ken used a basic computer with no internet connection ([19:10]–[21:36]).
  • "He had a Leams Boys, which is a box of lights... He would see words appear in three dimensions in the air like a hologram." – Dr. Rogers ([19:10])
• Introduction of "2109": Mysterious future entity involved, possibly orchestrating the communication ([22:53]).

5. Messages from "2109" and Predictions

• Role of 2109: Claimed a supervisory or experimental function, communicating advanced mathematical predictions (e.g., Fermat’s Last Theorem) that later came true ([22:53]).
  • "They did make a prediction in about 1985 about Fermat's last theorem being solved... Eight years after the prediction was made, it was solved..." – Dr. Rogers ([22:53])

6. Evidence Supporting Authenticity

• Printed Records: Hard copies of messages were kept; many translated by Peter Trinder, an Early English expert ([26:36], [27:22]).
• Archaeological Verification: Hand-drawn maps from the 1500s sent in messages matched underground features verified via modern LIDAR ([27:55], [40:08]).
• Group Research: Ongoing investigations by a group of ~35 researchers, including psychologists, historians, and technologists ([27:55], [40:08]).

7. Skepticism and Hoax Debates

• No Technological Means in 1980s: A retired member of the research group, who helped invent Wi-Fi, attested the events could not have been fabricated with the period's technology ([36:57]).
  • "There's absolutely no way, no way this could have been hoaxed... the infrastructure... was not available to anybody in the 80s." – Dr. Rogers ([36:57])
• Consistency of Testimonies: Main witnesses’ stories have not changed for decades; non-involved participants (e.g., Gary Rowe) also received messages ([05:01], [29:33]).

8. The Poltergeist and Environmental Links

• Phenomena Extended: Poltergeist activity occurred before and after the main events, possibly linked to local geology or geomagnetic anomalies ([41:42]).
• Neither the Residents nor the Entities Could Control or Explain All Phenomena ([32:02]).

9. Connections to Other Cases

• Instrumental Transcommunication (ITC): Parallels drawn with similar cases in Europe, e.g., those involving Konstantin Raudive and the “Skoll Experiment,” which also referenced 2109 ([42:54]–[45:15]).
  • "There could be a link between some of these very obscure and anomalous phenomena." – Jeffrey Mishlove ([45:28])

10. Open Questions and Future Research

• Unfound Manuscript: Thomas Harden’s book, allegedly hidden for posterity, has yet to surface. Its discovery would be pivotal ([33:23], [48:30]).
• Invitation to Researchers: The research group remains active and open to participation ([40:08]).

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On the Nature of Reality:
  "Our version of reality is really a cultural artifact of sorts... In another 80, 90 years, for all we know, humanity will have developed a whole new version of reality." – Jeffrey Mishlove ([38:35])
• Abandoning Conventional Explanation:
  "If this is the hoax, which I don't think it is, it's the greatest ever hoax going. But...if it's genuine...it's also one of the most amazing paranormal phenomena ever as well." – Dr. Rogers ([12:40])
• On the Limits of Technology:
  "Even if the Pentagon wants to have a go, they wouldn't have been able to do it because there was no physical, you know, hardware or structure to do it." – Dr. Rogers ([36:57])
• On Skepticism:
  "People will tell you, I won't believe it even if it's true." – Jeffrey Mishlove ([49:02])

Key Timestamps

• 00:00 – Initial poltergeist activity (footprints, object movement)
• 06:17 – First computer messages, historical context
• 12:40 – Identification and validation of Thomas Harden
• 19:10 – Mechanics of "box of lights" communication
• 22:53 – Introduction and role of "2109"; predictions
• 27:55 – Physical evidence and research group activities
• 32:02 – More on poltergeist phenomena and photographic evidence
• 36:57 – Testimony by Wi-Fi inventor on technological impossibility of hoax
• 40:08 – Modern research, archaeological corroborations
• 41:42 – Environmental factors (fault lines, geomagnetic activity)
• 45:15 – Broader context: links to ITC and other trans-dimensional cases
• 48:30 – The elusive manuscript and ongoing research efforts

Conclusion and Outlook

The Dodleston case remains a conundrum—unexplainable by mainstream science, yet stubbornly resilient to debunking attempts. Dr. Paul Rogers and the Vertical Plane Research Group continue to amass and analyze evidence, searching for the lost 16th-century manuscript that could be a “smoking gun.” Whether ultimately proven real or a sophisticated, unlikely hoax, the Dodleston Messages invite us to reconsider time, consciousness, and communication in extraordinary ways.

For further research or to join ongoing efforts, listeners are encouraged to connect via the Vertical Plane Research Group.