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- [00:00]
Narrator (Good Bad Billionaire Podcast)
This BBC podcast is supported by ads outside the uk.
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He's widely recognised as one of the greatest footballers in history.
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He's won the prestigious Ballon d' or award five times.
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He's the all time leading goal scorer in professional football and according to the
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Bloomberg Billionaires Index, he's the first active footballer in history to achieve billionaire status.
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Guess who we're talking about yet?
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That's right. Good Bad Billionaire is exploring the life and fortune of football icon and Cristiano Ronaldo.
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That's Good Bad Billionaire from the BBC World Service.
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Listen now, wherever you get your BBC podcasts.
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Keir Starmer
The question my party is asking now is whether I am best placed to lead us into the next general election. I have heard the answer of my parliamentary party to that question and I accept that answer with good grace. Every decision I've taken has been about putting the country I love first. That is why I will resign as leader of the Labour Party.
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James (BBC Newscast Host)
Keir Starmer there just outside number 10 Downing street, having announced his resignation this morning after chris months of speculation and he's resigned, what, less than two years after winning a pretty thumping majority. It's amazing, isn't it?
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Chris Mason (BBC Political Correspondent)
It is, really, yeah. And you know what, James? Having covered every twist and turn of the frankly downfall of Keir Starmer, still to stand there in the street anticipating that moment where the guy in the T shirt comes out with the lectern and the mixing desk and the speakers and then the staff pile out of number 11 and form a semicircle in the corner of the street and cheer the departing Prime Minister out into the street. I've seen that happen three times in the last four years. And that doesn't include Rishi Sunak, who just lost a general election as opposed to losing his job in between elections, is still one heck of a moment to. It's one heck of a moment. One heck of a moment politically. It says something that perhaps is worth discussing about our country, the speed with which at the moment, we get through prime ministers and you feel it personally, you could hear it in the Prime Minister's voice, you could see it in the Prime Minister's wife's expression.
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James (BBC Newscast Host)
A lot to talk about, Chris, on this episode of Newscast, Newscast, Newscast from the BBC.
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Keir Starmer
I will resign as leader of the Labour Party.
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Chris Mason (BBC Political Correspondent)
And what will you do? Stare at a wall? Humanity's next great voyage begins.
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Keir Starmer
You know, I like my buses. I'll come on to them.
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James (BBC Newscast Host)
It's supposed to be me as a doctor.
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Chris Mason (BBC Political Correspondent)
Ooh la la.
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James (BBC Newscast Host)
Thinking about it like a panther helped. Do we Play music now.
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Keir Starmer
Or what do we do?
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James (BBC Newscast Host)
Hello, it's James in Edinburgh and it
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Chris Mason (BBC Political Correspondent)
is a croaky Chris in Westminster and
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Joe Pike (BBC Political Correspondent)
Joe pike also in Westminster. Hi, James.
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James (BBC Newscast Host)
Listen, Chris, the Voice. We have to talk about your voice very quickly. What's going on?
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Chris Mason (BBC Political Correspondent)
I'll tell you what's going on. It's the G7 in Evian, followed by an all nighter in Wigan, followed by a weekend that was at the busier end of the spectrum, followed by a Monday morning that was at the bonkers end of the spectrum. I feel absolutely fine, but I think my voice is wearing the workload of the last week or so.
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James (BBC Newscast Host)
Yeah, fair enough. I'm not sure the Prime Minister feels fine. Or maybe he does. Maybe he feels better having done this. I suppose the big question to start with is for both of you, what happened to push him over the edge? And everyone's talked for so long about the possibility of this happening. Some people have said it's been inevitable for a long time. What was the straw that broke the camel's back?
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Joe Pike (BBC Political Correspondent)
I think, to be honest, James, it was the appearance of a successor who many in his party thinks would be okay at the job and certainly best at him. That being Andy Burnham's election last Friday morning in the early hours. But I suppose if we take a step back, this premiership has been on the slide for many months. There's been a bit of a sense of decay around Sakir Starmer's administration for a while and I think his premiership will be remembered as one of early errors, of wasted opportunities and of plummeting popularity. And the popularity is so central, the stats on his personal popularity are pretty astonishing. Now, maybe partly that's because of the sort of political world we now live in, but we saw the results of that in Scottish, Welsh and English local elections a few weeks ago. And I think with somebody who is so unpopular, Labour MPs decided, Look, we need someone new and somebody who can maybe help us keep our jobs.
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James (BBC Newscast Host)
What point did that happen, Chris, do you think? Do we know at what point he made this decision?
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Chris Mason (BBC Political Correspondent)
In the end, over the weekend, I think. I think in the aftermath of the by election, particularly given the scale of Andy Burnham's victory in that by election, he'd already been, if you like, nursing the reality of some senior figures in his cabinet, having told him privately he ought to set a timetable. The only reason that was sustainable for a handful of weeks was because the by election was ongoing and nobody could be quite certain until the result, quite what the political landscape would look like afterwards. What was guaranteed to be at least part of the political landscape afterwards, irrespective of the outcome of the by election, is that the pressure would crank up again on the Prime Minister and he would have to address the reality that he had Cabinet ministers who were basically saying the boss ought to go. And the only way you resolve that is either by listening to them and doing what he did this morning, or sacking them and replacing them with somebody else, in so doing, creating chaos. And given the volume of discontent within the Government, probably prompting other resignations. In other words, you'd be into a scenario where your government would be disintegrating in public. And I think the Prime Minister, confronted by the prospect of that, went for the option that was less spectacular, less volcanic, more maintaining of his dignity, and chose the window to do it just before Andy Burnham was going to get on that train in Manchester and travel to London and where the momentum would inevitably switch towards him. So the Prime Minister chose a moment this morning, just after 9 o', clock, where he could grip the agenda and use what agency, if you like, he had left, not a lot, but a bit, and make that statement knowing how the day was going to pan out. Firstly, as I say, with Andy Burnham coming to Westminster and being sworn in and all the rest of it. And then secondly, by the way, the Prime Minister had the prospect of a Cabinet meeting tomorrow morning. I don't think that would have been politically sustainable to hold without having said what he said this morning, because, well, you can imagine the kind of questions that Joe. I mean, it wouldn't be me shouting because I've got a terrible voice, but someone like Joe or others might have been shouting in the direction of those Cabinet ministers as they went in if Keir Starmer had not said what he said this morning.
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James (BBC Newscast Host)
Joe, I want to get your thoughts on that as well, but let's. Just because you mention it, Chris, let's have a little bit of a listen to a bit more of that speech, because you talked about the pressure on Keir Starmer and you can hear it in the end in his voice.
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Keir Starmer
I will also give my successor my full and unequivocal support, knowing that they will inherit a Britain that is far stronger and fairer than the one I inherited two years ago, better prepared for the challenges ahead and better able to ensure the Labour Party secures a second term in office. I want to thank all of those friends and colleagues who have been at my side for these past six years or so for their incredible commitment, service and support. I want to thank the brilliant number 10 staff and our country's extraordinary civil service who dedicate their lives to public service. And when I leave the biggest job the country, I shall spend more time on the most important job being the best husband I can. To my fantastic wife Vic, who has been a rock by my side through good times and bad and being the best dad I can. To my beautiful children who are my pride and my joy. Thank you very much.
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Narrator (Good Bad Billionaire Podcast)
What do Beatles member Sir Paul McCartney,
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YouTube megastar MrBeast and former Facebook executive
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Cheryl Sandberg all have in common?
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They're all being discussed in the new season of Good Bad Billionaire, the podcast which explores the lives and fortunes of the world's super rich.
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That's Good Bad Billionaire from the BBC World Service.
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Listen now. Search for Good Bad Billionaire wherever you get your BBC podcasts.
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James (BBC Newscast Host)
So Joe, I mean we're actually getting quite used to these speeches now. Some of them emotional, I mean remember various others. Theresa May was emotional, Gordon Brown from memory was emotional. But I mean people, people have. One of the criticisms of Keir Starmer has been, oh, he sounds quite robotic and he's got this delivery that's not really connecting with people. And is he really emotional and authentic? And people, do they crave authenticity in their politicians? Well, it's. If they crave it, they're getting it now. On his way out the door it seems.
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Joe Pike (BBC Political Correspondent)
They certainly are. And I suppose that's maybe one of the tragedies of Keir Starmer's time in this job that yeah, he's getting sort of sympathy today, maybe in that final section talking about his wife and kids. I'm not sure sympathy is something really political leaders really want, but it was a level of emotion we've never seen from him before. And I think it is quite revealing as to the personal toll that all of this must have had on him. Not just the fact that him and his wife and family are in the spotl but his, you know, his kids are teenagers. We're not talking about David Cameron who had kids, what under 10 and Gordon Brown I think sort of similar age, but kids who probably having lots happening in their lives, including I bet school exams and also of course, what a couple of weeks ago we had the conclusion of that trial of the men who'd launched an arson attack on the house the Prime Minister had lived in, where his sister in law was still living in. So a lot of stuff must have been been happening behind the scenes. And he now says, James, that he will be focusing on being a dad and being a partner too.
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James (BBC Newscast Host)
But it must be really something to stand up not just in front of your office or in front of your colleagues in the canteen or in front of your boss, but in front of the many, many bosses that one has as Prime Minister all over the country, including newscasters, many of them, and admit that you've failed totally.
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Chris Mason (BBC Political Correspondent)
And I think that's, for me, it's one of the fascinations of covering politics, that politics, public life is the expression out loud of variations of what we could all imagine in our own professional or personal lives, but played out on the public stage. So, as you say, James, imagine that overlap in any of our lives between the professional and the personal, where a spouse or a partner is stood there in the street when we're standing down from a job, where everybody watching and listening has a view as to whether you've been any good at that job, where your emotions will be exposed in that moment because of how raw the situation is. And then the rollercoaster. From Keir Starmer's perspective, you know, it's under two years ago that he was being clapped into the street, that the union flags were. Were being flown and waved by Labour supporters lining the street. That here was a guy who had dragged his party off the canvas of their biggest election defeat since 1935. One of only two Labour leaders alive to have won a majority in the House of Commons. Tony Blair, the other one. And look at where he is now. And the speed with which, as Joe was saying a few minutes ago, his popularity nosedive. The speed with which Labour MPs, particularly after the elections of six weeks ago, came back with a sense that he disproportionately was the reason for Labour's unpopularity. And then throwing to the mix on top of that, Andy Burnham winning the maker field by election against a insurgency like reform in a part of the northwest of England where reform had done spectacularly well just a handful of weeks before. And whilst it's imperfect, because clearly Andy Burnham's very popular in Greater Manchester, and to what extent does that stretch beyond that city region? Labour MPs see in Andy Burnham, at least for now, a winner, when frankly, for a while they've been seeing a loser in Keir Starmer.
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Joe Pike (BBC Political Correspondent)
And Keir Starmer has clearly failed and failed fast in government. I mean, he achieved quite a lot in opposition, right, turning around the fortunes of his party very, very quickly. But it was also interesting, him setting out what he sees as his achievement today. We certainly, because we've seen what's coming, have been thinking and preparing for this possibly happening for, I'd say, what, probably four months now. The Anas Sarwa Scottish Labour leader call for Keir Starmers ago was probably the key start of that. So we've been putting together pieces thinking about Keir Starmer's legacy and it wasn't actually that obvious and clear. Four months ago he probably would have said his big legacy was a very positive relationship with Donald Trump. Well, that has slightly fractured, but Starmer's team would argue fractured for a good reason, because they say he made the right call on the Iran war and UK opposition parties didn't. But also today, James, he was trying to sell out his domestic legacy, which isn't that clear. You know, one key part of it is very recent and hasn't been implemented, which is that social media ban for under 16s. Other things we probably talk about might be the scrapping of the 2 child benefit cap, the new laws to strengthen workers rights. And there are some positive signs in different parts of the public sector, but arguably his successor may be the person
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Chris Mason (BBC Political Correspondent)
who really gets to benefit, at least partially because. Not entirely, but at least partially because across a five year term, a lot of the achievements that any party will point to tend to start bearing fruit towards the tail end. And we're not even at the halfway point yet.
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James (BBC Newscast Host)
So I have, I suppose, a question. We've talked a lot about Keir Starmer, but I have a question about the wider picture here. So are we being unfair in saying this guy, particularly this guy wasn't very good and despite having a majority of 174, he's out the door because of his own failures as a leader, as a Prime Minister, or given that we are now heading towards Prime Minister number seven in the decade since the UK voted to leave the European Union, is there a bigger issue here for the United Kingdom? I mean, when you talk to people here in Scotland who support Scottish independence, and we've heard similar criticism from other political parties in other parts of the country. And you know, as you know, we have Nationalist first ministers in Cardiff, Belfast and Edinburgh now. And what you hear from some of those people is saying, look, the problem here is not any one individual or even any one political party. The problem is that Britain is not working and that there is entrenched low growth, entrenched low productivity, entrenched inequality. And if you're a Scottish Nationalist, a supporter of Scottish independence, you might say, yeah, look, everybody's had a crack at fixing this. The Conservatives and the Liberal Democrats have been in government. Labour have now been in Government and still the UK's deep rooted underlying problems persist. Now, I'm not getting into an argument here about, I'm not making this about Scottish nationalism or Scottish independence. My point is that's just a vehicle through which to ask the question. But the question, and whether or not that's a better solution or not is sort of moot for the purposes of this discussion. But you get my underlying point. Is there something fundamentally going wrong with the UK that is leaving it unable to be governed by Prime Minister after Prime Minister after Prime Minister, and if so, what?
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Chris Mason (BBC Political Correspondent)
So I think the key thing to recall or remember here is that when we talk about Keir Starmer's successes and failures, that the judgment that matters more than ours or matters more than any newscasters is the judgment of the Labour party and Labour MPs. It's they who have decided that he's a failure and should go. Now why have they done that? Because principally they fear the march of reform UK politically. The wider point where we try and delve into, well, how come this happened to a succession of Conservative leaders as well, I think is the deeper and more profound one. To what extent is it about a sense of an expectation of immediacy in a culture where we can order a pizza or a book or a bath plug that arrives within a couple of hours or whatever? To what extent? And there are plenty across the political spectrum who think this is a big, big factor. Is it about the lack of any sense of solid economic growth going back 15 years to 2008? Best part of 20 years now. And if you're in a environment where there isn't much economic growth, don't be surprised. Goes the argument that people are lacking in patience and very quickly tire of politicians who promise change that word on the Labour manifesto and then in the view of plenty, don't actually deliver it. And to what extent is that the underlying factor that has done for successive Conservative leaders and now a Labour leader?
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Joe Pike (BBC Political Correspondent)
And we shouldn't also let Keir Starmer not allow us to mention his errors. He made quite a few errors and some of them really quite quickly. I mean, winter fuel payments was something they announced, Victor Reese announced in the comments Less than 30 days in, although it took them 11 months, almost a year to u turn on that. The second big error was surely the appointment of Peter Mandelson, Lord Mandelson, as U.S. ambassador, certainly when the extent of his relationship with Jeffrey Epstein became clear and that was announced in December. So, you know, still in the early months of the Starmer premiership and that's before we talk about other bits of policy that the government. You turned on inheritance tax for farmers, all the welfare cuts and inquiry into grooming gangs. And the sort of. The instincts of Keir Starmer certainly seemed slightly sluggish. That's certainly what we heard from his critics. So I certainly agree that we are in a very difficult political environment, an unforgiving political environment, and people don't seem to have a huge amount of patience. But Keir Starmer did make some errors. He made them quickly, he didn't correct them quickly. And that surely is sort of central in contributing to the fall in his personal popularity and his MPs just running out of. Of hope in his skills.
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James (BBC Newscast Host)
So on on that, Joel. And we'll come on to the man who might take over in a minute. Obviously, we'll talk about Andy Burnham. But on that, I've heard some people today saying, look, what is needed now in the UK is what we used to call leadership, and that is different from popularity. And that what is arguably. I'm not making this case, I'm just saying this is the case. Some people are advanced, is that the government, for example, announced that it was going to bring in welfare reforms to try to cut the amount of money paying out in benefits, to try to have a bit more money for public services, or to reduce the country's borrowing, or both, and then it retreated from that under opposition. You've mentioned quite a few other things there where the government announced there was a campaign of individual groups here and there, didn't like this, that or the next thing, and then they retreated. And the argument goes that it's going to take a particular. Particular character with particular skills, a statesperson with great leadership, to say to the country, to fix the problems in the country is going to require some very difficult things in a world where you, the. You newscasters, you voters, have already experienced a lot of difficult things and that if things are going to move forward under whoever's in power in Downing street, it's going to take something that is someone who's able to ride out criticism and unpopularity to make things different. Does that make sense? Is that an argument that you hear in Westminster? Is that something you. You recognise?
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Joe Pike (BBC Political Correspondent)
I think so. I mean, I think so in the. In the sense that tough decisions do clearly need to be made. I suppose Keir Starmer took some tough decisions, including on winter fuel payments, to save some cash, and then couldn't manage his own parliamentary party. I suppose it's not just about the statesperson who does Sort of helm all of this, but also that there are people in Parliament who are able to back and go along with those decisions. I suppose we shouldn't let Labour MPs get a. Get a sort of free ride here. They are ultimately responsible for a lot of Keir Starmer's problems, and I think whoever takes over from him will certainly hope they can unite the party and take them through some difficult times, which may lead to backlashes and may lead to protests, may lead to awkward constituency meetings, but ultimately, in the long term, could be positive for the country.
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James (BBC Newscast Host)
Now, I'm going to ask you one more, Joe, because this is the. This is the section where I'm trying to be a sort of doctor to Chris's voice and just leave him for a minute. Don't say anything, Chris. Don't speak. I hope you're drinking something that helps you. But I'll ask you one more, Joe, and then let's get on to Andy Burnham. And this is a question from newscaster Andrew. Andrew, thank you very much indeed for your question, which is a very good one. A simple question here tonight. Who is running the country? Is there an interim PM or is Starmer staying on until a new PM is sworn in? It's a good question, Joe, tell us a bit about the process, how these things work.
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Joe Pike (BBC Political Correspondent)
He remains the Prime Minister, but he doesn't really have the full power of that office in the sense that I don't think if he wanted to do anything big or bold or expensive, he would be allowed to do it. Certainly coming in the next few weeks is that big NATO summit in Turkey. That summit was the deadline by which we'd expected the Defence Investment Plan to be unveiled, the funding of which, and controversy over it, resulted in the Defence Secretary's resignation. Now, I don't know what Chris thinks, maybe I shouldn't ask him because of his vault. But does Keir Starmer really have the power now in this sort of odd, slightly sort of interregnum period to make any big decisions, like cut some departments to fund the Defence Investment Plan? I mean, he's in an odd situation,
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Chris Mason (BBC Political Correspondent)
is the short answer.
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Joe Pike (BBC Political Correspondent)
And therefore, yes, he's an office James, but not necessarily in power in terms of what happens next. He has set out some dates and the Labour NEC officers group met this afternoon to discuss those dates. Two key dates. One is the 9th of July, so two and a half weeks time, that's when nominations open for potential leadership candidates. A week later, on the 16th, they close just as the summer recess for Parliament begins. What Happens between now and then. Is there the consolidation of one candidate, potentially getting a lot of support and blocking others? Or is the pitch offered by Andy Burnham, which is some of his critics claim is unclear, unscrutinised. Will that encourage a challenger? Of course, we've heard a lot about the 81 MPs. You need to stand to be the next leader of the Labour Party. You also need either 5% of the constituency labour parties or at least three affiliates, including two unions, to stand. And therefore, to conclude, James, we could at the soonest have a new Prime Minister the day after nominations close, which would be the 17th of July. If there isn't a contest. If there is one, we're looking at the end of summer and Keir Starmer will stay in post until then, but not be able to make any decisions that cost too much of our taxpayer cash.
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James (BBC Newscast Host)
And, Chris, having rested your voice on Andy Barnum, now, are we assuming it's going to be Andy Burnham? I mean, certainly, if you've been watching any coverage today, we'll be assuming it's be Andy Burnham, because what it. I mean, just let's take a moment to talk about how extraordinary the choreography was today and how. How extremely unusual this is a guy who wasn't even in Parliament, I think, at the day began, and then there was a helicopter following his train all the way to London from Greater Manchester, or the train was following his taxi, then I think, from London Euston to Westminster, and just this incredible focus on this one person who is just like. I mean, it's mad. It's really odd, isn't it?
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Chris Mason (BBC Political Correspondent)
Yeah. This a man who wasn't an MP the early hours of Friday morning, who wasn't back in Parliament until 2:30 this afternoon and within an hour or so was posing for a picture with a couple of hundred Labour MPs, an image that just oozed the transfer of power from Keir Starmer to Andy Burnham. Now, it's not impossible somebody else decides to have a crack at running for the Labour leadership, We should just say that. But all the indicators point in the direction of Andy Burnham being Prime Minister probably within a couple of weeks. And that is extraordinary. Absolutely extraordinary. And in that period between now and then, boy, there's a lot of scrutiny for us journalistically to do of him, as you'd expect, but also for Labour MPs and indeed opposition MPs to do of him, you know, what does he stand for? Particularly say, on the international agenda, because clearly that wasn't part of the job remit as The Mayor of Greater Manchester, as well as all sorts of other domestic ideas. We've got a sense of where he stands on some things, but my goodness, there's a lot of things where we don't.
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Joe Pike (BBC Political Correspondent)
And one odd thing as well for me is that he doesn't seem in a huge rush. This is a job Andy Burnham has coveted for decades now. It seems to be potentially being offered to him on a plate and, and yet him and his team don't seem to be in a rush to get to number 10 because they want time to prepare. Now don't forget Keir Starmer was criticised for not having a plan for government. But Keir Starmer had four years in opposition, Sue Gray, to put together the plan. Andy Burnham has a matter of weeks and that is, that is clearly going to be a real challenge. Chris also mentioned that photo in Westminster hall at the heart of the palace in Westminster that Andy Burnham took with loads of Labour image of the day. I say it was so revealing. And what was most revealing was the fact that Rachel Rees, the Chancellor, was
- [28:09]
Chris Mason (BBC Political Correspondent)
there on the front row. I think.
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Joe Pike (BBC Political Correspondent)
Yeah, she was just behind him in a pink dress. Rachel Rees was not, though, as far as I could see, outside her own house in Downing street, on her own street, watching her colleague Keir Starmer make his resignation statement. Of course, many people blame Rachel Reeve for a lot of the errors of this premiership which has ended in that resignation speech, and yet she decided to hot foot it to Westminster hall, seemingly perhaps because she doesn't just want to support Andy Berman believes in him, but maybe, as I think many ministers and MPs are thinking, wants to serve in his government. Chris mentioned the speed of the change, James, the fact that we've had not just sort of part one of a change, which is, you know, who's leaving, but part two, who is potentially coming in a matter of hours is just completely astonishing. And it leaves people not really thinking about Keir Starmer and his legacy, but you know, who and what's next.
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Chris Mason (BBC Political Correspondent)
Totally. Because today could have turned out like this. You could have had Keir Starmer doing his thing in the street and that was it, you know, no real, isn't it? No real word from Andy Burnham who just comes down and gets sworn in and okay, there's a helicopter and all that, but doesn't really say much and we're streating, keeps his head down as well. And instead the whole shebang, it feels almost the whole shebang in one day.
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Joe Pike (BBC Political Correspondent)
And the Wes treating letter that he tweeted less than two hours after the Starmer speech. That seemed to be quite a consequential moment because, yeah, we don't know exactly what's going to happen, but that seemed to be the moment where the leadership contest could have been coming to an end even before it started, because he's backing Andy Burnham.
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James (BBC Newscast Host)
And I suppose then the question is, what's he getting? I mean, is he going to be Chancellor, for example?
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Chris Mason (BBC Political Correspondent)
I asked him exactly that. Either that or Foreign Secretary. He insisted he'd not been offered any job. But he'll get a big job. It's entirely possible. He hasn't been offered a job absolutely nailed on yet, but he'll get a big job because he's a big part of the Labour Party, seen as arguably their best communicator. So he will have a senior job in cabinets, probably within a few weeks.
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James (BBC Newscast Host)
And if newscasters are listening to this, thinking, what does this mean for me? As well, they might be as well. We all might be. Just tell us, you know, as I understand it, I'm not sure, and we've discussed this before, that the terms left and right are as helpful as they used to be in politics. But just for the sake of argument, Andy Burnham was broadly thought of as being maybe the candidate of a little bit over to the left and West Streeting more over to the righter side of the Labour Party. A, am I right? Is that fair? B, what happened to all these other contenders like Angela Rayner on the left? And C. C, I don't know what C is. What's gonna happen?
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Joe Pike (BBC Political Correspondent)
Well, let's try it with A and B, I think Andy Burnham we would see in his sort of most recent incarnation on the soft left of Labour, so probably a little bit to the left of Keir Starmer and to the right of Jeremy Corbyn, but he has obviously served under Tony Blair, under Gordon Brown, under Mr. Corbyn. And his critics claim something he really hates is this claim that he's a bit of a political chameleon and he changes his opinion with the win. So I think soft left is what we'd focus his sort of political beliefs around. In terms of Angela Raina, from everything we we're hearing from those close to her, she will not be standing in a leadership contest. She certainly seemed to be very active in the maker field by election. She, of course, is a Greater Manchester MP too. I suppose she may be happy with somebody like Andy Burnham, someone with his sort of politics, and also somebody from the northwest getting the job as leader of their party, but Also, maybe she realized that she'd have a better chance of getting a job with him and a contest with her, and it wouldn't necessarily turn out how she wanted. It's not quite clear. Have you worked out what C is yet, James?
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James (BBC Newscast Host)
No, but I've thought of another C, or rather another C's been thought of for me and fed to my ear. And that is what next. This is the. You know, just to wrap it all up, really. What should we be looking out for next in the next, say, 24, 48 hours or so?
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Chris Mason (BBC Political Correspondent)
Andy Burnham appearing on a public stage and telling us what he's all about. That's the. That's what we await, I think, later this week. I don't know what. I don't know at what point it will happen, but he'll need to set out his stall. Does it amount to a launch? Maybe it does, maybe it doesn't, because who knows if there's a contest? But he's got to do it. He's got to come out, set out what he stands for. Absolutely demonstrate, although we got a fair chunk of it today, but absolutely demonstrate the depth of his support and then I think, probably subject himself to a lot of questions over the next couple
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Joe Pike (BBC Political Correspondent)
of weeks, which he hasn't really.
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Chris Mason (BBC Political Correspondent)
Which he hasn't done really, since the
- [33:12]
Joe Pike (BBC Political Correspondent)
Newsnight interview he did with Victoria Derbyshire, which people close to him didn't feel had gone well. I mean, he seems to have stepped back with media interviews. Certainly Labour MPs who saw that Newsnight interview and had been more positive about him, but started to have questions. He doesn't want a repeat of that. But that means we're in a situation where it seems very possible he could be the Prime Minister within weeks. And yet there is just this enormous gulf where we don't really know necessarily what he would do in office, what he really believes and what a Burnham government might mean in terms of all of our lives, in terms of taxes, in terms of a welfare reform, in terms of funding the armed forces. There's just so many question marks in a way that is. Is it unprecedented, Chris?
- [33:57]
Chris Mason (BBC Political Correspondent)
I think it probably is when we're thinking of a government and administration that is perhaps just weeks away. Because even if we think of Rishi Sunak, for instance, who, you know, became Prime Minister having lost leadership race. Granted, during that contest, not a vast amount of attention was paid to him because it was expected that he would lose. And so when he arrived in Downing street, there were a lot of questions. I remember asking him some fairly basic questions. About where he stood on crime or whatever, because we didn't feel like we knew. But he had been through a leadership contest. He'd spent an entire summer four years ago going from hustings to hustings to hustings, plenty of them on camera, doing a lot of interviews, et cetera, et cetera. And Andy Burnham has probably got a matter of weeks for that to happen, or maybe quite a lot of it ends up happening when he's already in the job.
- [34:53]
James (BBC Newscast Host)
Well, I do not doubt that in the next hours, days, weeks that you will both be pursuing all of these questions and the scrutiny, assuming you can ask any questions at all. Chris, thank you very much. Chris, thanks very much, Joe.
- [35:09]
Joe Pike (BBC Political Correspondent)
Cheers. James.
- [35:10]
James (BBC Newscast Host)
That's it from this episode of Newscast. On an amazing, incredible day, yet another one the UK's heading for yet another Prime Minister. Bye for now.
- [35:19]
Chris Mason (BBC Political Correspondent)
Newscast Newscast from the BBC.
- [35:22]
Newscast Outro Host
Thank you so much for making it to the end of Newscast. You clearly copyright Chris Mason Ooze Stamina. Can I gently encourage you to subscribe to us on BBC Sounds? Don't forget, you can email us the at anytime. It's newscastbc.co.uk and if you would like to join our Discord community to talk about everything newscast related, there is a link in the description of this podcast. And don't be scared. It's super easy to click on it and then get set up. Or you can WhatsApp us on 033-01-239480 and I promise you we read and listen to every single message. Thanks for listening to this podcast. Bye.
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Narrator (Good Bad Billionaire Podcast)
He's widely recognized as one of the greatest footballers in history.
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He's won the prestigious Ballon d' or award five times, he's the all time
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leading goal scorer in professional football, and
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according to the Bloomberg Billionaires index, he's the first active footballer in history to achieve billionaire status.
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Guess who we're talking about yet?
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That's right. Good Bad Billionaire is exploring the life and fortune of football icon Cristiano Ronaldo.
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That's Good Bad Billionaire from the BBC World Service.
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Listen now, wherever you get your BBC podcasts.