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- [00:00]
Henry
This BBC podcast is supported by ads outside the uk. Can you grab one more thing? I'll come back up for you.
- [00:08]
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- [00:23]
Henry
Really, you gotta have another one.
- [00:26]
Amica Insurance Advertiser
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- [00:37]
Tristan Redmond
As yet another British Prime Minister steps down, is the country still feeling the effects of Brexit 10 years on? I'm Tristan Redmond, one of the hosts of the Global Story podcast from the BBC. Keir Starmer has become the sixth leader to resign since the Brexit referendum. Ever since that vote in 2016, the country's been wracked with political instability. When will it end? For more, listen to the global story on BBC.com or wherever you get your podcasts.
- [01:07]
Joe
Hello, Henry.
- [01:08]
Henry
Hello, Joe.
- [01:09]
Joe
On Sunday's newscast, you were talking, some would argue, moaning, about how you balance major political events and major international football. How's that going for you?
- [01:20]
Henry
Very badly, very badly. And I was absolutely moaning. And I don't moan about the fact that I wake up very early for the BBC because it's privileged to do this job in this week of all weeks, but obviously I was starting from a position of disadvantage with the kickoff times of this World cup, but I haven't even had a chance to watch any of the highlights. Monday morning I was in Downing street from five in the morning hearing people say, oh, did you see when Cape Verde went a goal up against. I can't even remember who they were playing. Joe, this is. This is crazy. The last time there was a World cup in the Americas, I'd watched every single match and look at me now. So it is quite distressing. But I think things have calmed down little bit now, so I might be able to watch the England match tonight at least.
- [02:00]
Joe
Yeah, I mean, it's now Tuesday. Perfect timing because weirdly, Westminster was really busy yesterday and things have suddenly fallen silent. Really?
- [02:08]
Henry
And that's great because actually the Labour leadership timetable maps quite neatly onto the rest of the tournament. We will, assuming there is not a full contest, and we'll come on to that, have a new Prime Minister two days before the World cup final. But of course that means quarters, semis, it should be pretty quiet. No?
- [02:26]
Darshini
Do you think that's a coincidence?
- [02:27]
Henry
Well, look, I think it sets up a massive moment, doesn't it which is that when England are inevitably in the World Cup Final that Sunday, it could well present the new Prime Minister with their first opportunity to meet President Trump.
- [02:38]
Joe
And Keir Starmer will be very sad to miss that if it does happen. Plenty to discuss on this episode of Newscast, Newscast, Newscast from the BBC.
- [02:48]
Henry
I will resign as leader of the Labour Party.
- [02:50]
Darshini
And what will you do?
- [02:52]
Tristan Redmond
Stare at a wall? Humanity's next great voyage begins.
- [02:55]
Henry
You know, I like my buses. I'll come onto Supposed to be me as a doctor.
- [02:59]
Tristan Redmond
Ooh la la.
- [03:00]
Henry
Thinking about it like a panto helped.
- [03:02]
Darshini
Do we play music now or what do we do?
- [03:04]
Joe
Hello, it's Joe in Westminster.
- [03:05]
Henry
Hello, it's Henry in Westminster.
- [03:07]
Darshini
And it's Dashini in Westminster.
- [03:09]
Joe
Let's start, guys, with a email from newscaster Linda. She has emailed Chris. Dear Chris, Newscaster, she says, is essential listening for me, and for a long time, I've been amazed at how you all ooze stamina in every episode. Nevertheless, your vocal cords are delicate. I write as a retired speech and language therapist who did a lot of adult voice work. You don't need me to tell you how vital your voice is and how you've quite obviously been overworking it. If you listen to yesterday's newscast, you'd have heard Chris Mason's strained voice. He's today being given the day off in his place. Henry and Darshini, let's start with you, Henry. Where are we? Yesterday, Chris was talking about the likelihood of a Burnham coronation. Has anything changed?
- [03:52]
Henry
Not really. I think likelihood is still the right word to use to describe it. What we do have are two additional names of people who are at least publicly toying with standing for the Labour leadership. They are Darren Jones, Cabinet Minister, Chief Secretary to the Prime Minister, which is a new job that was invented for him. Before that, he was Chief Secretary to the Treasury. So essentially, Rachel Reeves is number two and the other name is. Is Al Khans. Some newscasters will remember that he resigned as a junior Defence Minister just a few weeks ago in protest at the Government's plans on defence spending, just after John Healey had resigned as Defence Secretary. But even though we now have those two names, it seems pretty unlikely still for each of them to actually go through withstanding. And even if they did, it feels pretty unlikely as it stands, that they would get the Magic Number of 81 MPs in order to then take on Andy Burnham, who clearly has 81 and then some.
- [04:50]
Joe
With the Labour membership and how visible are their campaigns? Do we have any idea who might be running them, if they have any MPs, or is it just the name and the speculation which is out there?
- [05:00]
Henry
I don't think we're at the stage of whether they have individual named MPs who are sort of leading surrogates, as they'd be called in America. But we can sort of see what wing of the party in particular Darren Jones's campaign emanates from. The argument being made by his allies is that Andy Burnham needs to be more clear in particular on what economic policies he would pursue. And I'm sure we'll come on to this, but the implication of some of the concerns they raise is, is he really going to make Ed Miliband his Chancellor?
- [05:34]
Joe
We'll come to that.
- [05:34]
Henry
So it is a sort of critique from the right as well as a call for clarity. But then, I think because he's been so close to the Prime Minister, Darren Jones seems to also have the backing, if he were to run, of a quite small group of MPs who are very passionately furious about the way Keir Starmer has treated. So it would be a more sort of. Sort of personal, individual loyalty to Keir Starmer and a particular fury with Andy Burnham for the way that they see him as having behaved. Al Khan's is a much more individualistic thing. He only became an MP in 2024. He had no political background because he'd been serving in quite senior positions in the military, instantly became a Defence Minister. His is a sort of slightly different, less ideological force and more about his own personality and his own background.
- [06:23]
Joe
And is it sceptical to say, are these two men just wanting big jobs in a Burnham cabinet?
- [06:30]
Henry
It's certainly what a lot of MPs are saying today, including people who I thought might at least be open to the idea of backing them. And that's one of the reasons why I say it feels pretty unlikely that. That either of them is much for goer.
- [06:41]
Joe
Andy Burnham was being followed yesterday by journalists, by helicopters, on his trip down to London. Do we have any idea where he is today, what he's doing? Is he coming to do TV interviews and face any scrutiny?
- [06:54]
Henry
Not today. On that last question, he's meeting MPs. I'm not sure precisely where, but I think somewhere in Parliament. But I've spoken to a good handful of MPs today, ranging from people who've known him for years to MPs who have never met him, who have been called to see him. Those meetings are being arranged by some of those MPs who we saw accompanying him on the train down and to his swearing in. So Sally Jameson, who represents a seat in Doncaster, and Elise Midgley, MP for Knowsley and Merseyside, and they are arranging for Andy Burnham to make his case in private.
- [07:29]
Joe
We saw them behind him on that sort of celebratory event he did in Makerfield. There's all these women in sunglasses who sort of run the campaign.
- [07:37]
Henry
Well, I wasn't there that day, but, I mean, it looked sunny, so, yeah, fair enough. But I forgot my sunglasses in Downing street this morning, so it's a bit of a sore point. They're much better prepared than me for all sorts of things. But, yes, I think Andy Burnham is meeting MPs, because I think you can't make the point enough. Sure, he's a familiar figure. He ran for the Labour leadership first, 16 years ago, second 11 years ago, but he left Parliament nine years ago. And there has been an extraordinary amount of churn in British politics and therefore in the parliamentary Labour Party since then. The 2017 election, the 2019 election where Labour lost so many seats, the 2024 election where Labour won so many seats. So actually, the vast majority of the parliamentary Labour Party barely know the man, even as the vast majority of the parliamentary Labour Party appears to have decided that he is the man, for the
- [08:23]
Joe
moment, a churn in British politics. What about the churn in the market, Darshini? We'll talk about Burnham's economic inheritance in a second. But when Starmer went yesterday, what did we see?
- [08:35]
Darshini
All the drama was on Downing street and not in the City, is the short answer to that one. We didn't see much at all. I mean, it was really fascinating because at the start of the year, when I went and talked to major investment houses, you know, British ones and international ones, and said, what's the biggest concern about the uk? What's keeping you awake at night? And they all said political instability and that risk. Here we are, the Prime Minister resigns and have they all gone to the beach? Actually, no, because they, like us, knew that this was likely to be coming. And the big question, they expected it. And the big question was, then, what next? Who are the personalities who are going to be number 10? Number 11? They've got a fair idea who is likely to be number 10 like the rest of us. But what does this mean for the policies and the way they approach the challenges facing us? And that is the big question. Cause ultimately, you know, that phrase, is it Bond villains that Wes reaching was these in last week. I used to work on the bond trading floor. So I'm not just speaking off on behalf of my former people, but he
- [09:29]
Joe
was saying then, the bond markets are not bond villains, I think was the line from that big economic speech last week.
- [09:35]
Darshini
They are the government's lenders and that's the way we've got to think of them. Right. So they are responsible for making sure they have the money to carry out plans, but we don't want the interest payments to get too high, which is why there's this kind of uneasy relationship between the markets and politicians at the best of times. So they're saying, we want to see how generous the plans are, if they are credible, and also, do they risk putting up inflation and interest rates. All of those questions, they've got months to be answered. We're going to have lots of speculation, of course, in the meantime about who the CH going to be, what the budget's going to look like, all those things, what the fiscal rules may or may not look like eventually. This is all very much deja Vu of 2024 all over again already.
- [10:11]
Joe
And what do we know about Andy Burnham's sort of economic prospectus? Maybe not much, but what little bits can we try and assemble together?
- [10:21]
Darshini
We know that Burnonomics is very hard to say. We also know that we don't.
- [10:25]
Joe
You do it smoothly.
- [10:26]
Darshini
Do you think so? I've had a bit of practice in the last few days, but we don't know exactly what that would look like. But when you look at some of the things that have been said over recent weeks and months, things like having more state control in utilities, we don't know what that'll look like. More social housing that will be paid for potentially. Well, this is the big question. So overarching. This seems to be a philosophy that to make money, make us better off, get that growth turbo boost again, you have to spend money. And then the question becomes, whose money?
- [10:53]
Joe
And in terms of that big question over who is Andy Burnham's chancellor if he were to become the next Prime Minister? Henry Darschini, who's your money on?
- [11:03]
Henry
Oh, Joe, don't tempt me like that. It feels like those who've been around Andy Burnham for a while have been proceeding on the assumption that he would probably want to appoint Ed Miliband. But he is now, very quickly, the sort of anointed one of a coalition that spans basically the entire ideological range of Labour MPs. And that poses an interesting question over how to rebuild unity in the Labour Party. And his appointments are absolutely core to
- [11:39]
Joe
that you spoke about Miliband and potentially being divisive, I think on Sunday's Newsfire, didn't you? What about how that narrative is being formed? Is there almost an anti Miliband campaign from someone on the right of Parliament?
- [11:53]
Henry
Yeah, absolutely.
- [11:54]
Joe
And are they acting on behalf of somebody they'd like to get the job?
- [11:58]
Henry
In some cases perhaps, but actually I think in most cases not. And I don't think we should make this sound pettier than it is. There is in some quarters in the Labour Party a 16 years lingering anger at Edmilliband for having defeated his brother David to the leadership in 2010. There are Labour MPs who will still tell you that's when it started going wrong for the Labour Party.
- [12:18]
Joe
Even if they weren't in Parliament at that time.
- [12:20]
Henry
Even if they weren't in Parliament at that time. However, I don't think that's really the main thing here. The main thing is ideological. It's a genuine divide within the Labour Party about the kind of political economy that a Labour government ought to advocate for. And Ed Miliband as Energy Secretary has espoused a particular vision of, well, growth fueled by a green transition. And he believes good green jobs are the way to re industrialize Britain. That is controversial that, you know, people who are currently sitting around the same cabinet table as him have, you know, furiously denounced to me in private and if he were to become Chancellor, that would be a massive endorsement of that view of what the UK's economy should look like in the years and decades ahead. So I think we shouldn't see this as a sort of personality based tussle, though obviously it does devolve into that. We should see it as a question of what kind of Burnham ism the country is going to get if Andy Burnham becomes the Prime Minister.
- [13:23]
Joe
Rachel Reeves was at that welcome photo call in Westminster yesterday. Does anyone you speak to, Darshini, think that Rachel Reeves will be able to hang on to her job as Chancellor? Because the argument for it is that would provide stability for the market.
- [13:36]
Darshini
Stability, credibility, all those words. Do you remember how the markets had that major wobble when she frankly had a bit of an emotional wobble in Parliament? She was in tears when she was in tears. And you know, that goes to show exactly how much door they put by, you know, the path she has chosen, put it that way. And she's been very keen to show that she has chosen that particular sort of path of stability. But having said that, is it the case that nobody else can take that one on Andy Burnham, you know, this whole kind of I'm not going to be in hock to the bond market seems to be a thing of the past. And he seems very intent on showing that he's going to stick to this path that she's carved out, you know, in some form or other. And does that message carry on and therefore, who do you pick to be Chancellor within that? Is it going to be someone like Ed Milibandy saying, no, no, but you have to stick to this particular. These are, you know, I am the First Lord of the Treasury. This is the path you are taking and you'll just have to work out things within that.
- [14:28]
Joe
Because that phrase, first Lord of the treasury is literally on the door to number 10. That is one of the titles that PM has.
- [14:34]
Darshini
That is. Or when I looked at that statement from West Reading the other day, it did read a bit like, didn't it? That kind of COVID letter you slap in with an application for a job and that bit about the economy. So is that a kind of a very overt. Actually, look, I get your vision. I'm going to be doing Pick Me.
- [14:51]
Joe
And you mentioned that the markets didn't react to Starmer going. Could they react to a choice of Chancellor?
- [14:59]
Darshini
Yes, they could react to a choice of Chancellor, but I think a lot depends on, you know, we're expecting to hear more from Andy Burnham on his vision for the economy and I think a lot will depend on what he sets out there. And at that case, in that case, it may become more than just about the personalities and it's not, you know, we all look at number 11. Absolutely right thing to do. But don't forget as well, that kind of the, you know, the panel of advisors who's forming around. So when you hear people like Jim o', Neill, Lord o', Neill, that sort of veteran minister, crossbench peer, you know, former chief economist at Goldman Sachs, comes with a certain pedigree and also a certain set of views. And also Richard Hughes, formerly head of the Office of Budget Responsibility, that is intended to send out a message, isn't
- [15:44]
Joe
it, Henry, other names for Chancellor. It can't just be Rachel Rees hanging On or Ed Miliband coming in. No.
- [15:50]
Henry
So Wes treating is definitely a possibility, at least as far as Labour MPs, who, I don't think I have particular access to Andy Burnham's innermost thoughts believe. And look, it's really striking that Wes treating in the several weeks that he was running a leadership campaign, even if he didn't ultimately go through it, almost all of his biggest pronouncements were about the economy. So whether that was, at that point intended for a leadership campaign or was always going to end up like this, it feels pretty clear what the biggest job possible he's auditioning for now is, you know, and there are measures that he talked about, equalising capital gains tax with income tax in certain ways, income tax rates that you could see appealing to Andy Burnham and perhaps allow a new government to square the circle, arguably, of the manifesto being quite constraining on personal tax while also raising more money for new government spending. So I think he is definitely a contender. Other names that I've heard, but, I mean, this is not necessarily informed speculation on the part of the MPs who have made the speculation to me, but in the course of my rounds this morning, someone mentioned Jonathan Reynolds to me currently.
- [16:56]
Joe
Rounds? Where are you? What are you doing?
- [16:58]
Henry
I'm just walking around Portcullis House, trying to find the most shaded area, but.
- [17:03]
Joe
And Parker's house is inside, though?
- [17:05]
Henry
Well, yeah, but it's like a greenhouse. What does it mean? Oh, okay.
- [17:09]
Joe
You know, Joe, I've not been there in this weather. That's.
- [17:12]
Henry
No, no. I could do a whole podcast on this. They used to have massive fig trees, like huge fig trees, which I think kept a lot of the heat out. They had a cooling effect. But they were also under the deal when they built Portcullis House. I think it was quite uneconomical and they also hadn't got deep enough roots. So anyway, they ended up taking the trees out and also there were some sort of reflecting pools there.
- [17:34]
Joe
That's very topical.
- [17:35]
Henry
Exactly. Not algae filled, but they got rid of those as well. Anyway, Jonathan Reynolds was mentioned to me in Portcullis House by a Labour MP who's very much in Team Burnham. They were just openly musing on whether he might be simultaneously able to reassure the markets. He was previously Business Secretary.
- [17:53]
Joe
He's currently Chief Witt, isn't optically happy in that job, but is also a Greater Manchester mp.
- [17:58]
Henry
Yeah. And was at Andy Burnham's campaign launch in Makerfield, which felt a little bit provocative at the time, but look ambitious for sure. And has had an economic portfolio in the past. As I say, the other name someone mentioned to me, actually a few people have mentioned is John Healey, who of course resigned as Defence Secretary earlier this month. He was a Treasury Minister under Gordon Brown in the treasury back in the New Labour years, I think, for quite a while. But obviously, given what John Healey has said, given the reason for his resignation that would commit a Burnham government instantly to. To really quite a steep increase in defence spending. And that is one of the many issues where we're not quite sure where Andy Burnham stands.
- [18:39]
Joe
For whoever walks into the treasury in maybe three and a half, four weeks time, what will they inherit and what dashini are the big challenges ahead?
- [18:48]
Darshini
It's really funny, isn't it? We talk about all these people who could be vying for this job or could be in the frame. And I also heard, by the way, Pat McFadden and Yvette Cooper, so many names, but why would you want this job? Because if somebody said, come in here, it's great, you've got the power, the money, but actually you haven't got much to play with. And I think that is going to be the reality. And do you remember, it feels like such a long time ago now when we speak about the spring statement, but at the time we heard Rachel Reeve stand up there and said, don't worry, I'm going to meet these rules and borrowing and I'm going to have over £23 billion to spare. £23 billion. Not bad. Not a huge amount by previous standards, but not a bad amount either. But then the war came along and we think. We do not know, we don't have clarity on it and we won't until near the budget time. How much of that might have been kind of used up by the kind of extra strains on the economy. But what that does signal is when you hear the kind of scale of plans that Andy Burnham has already hinted at, there may not be enough to stretch to that. And then you have to come up with other ideas, don't you? You're going to have to come up with other ideas about do you raise more taxes? Who does that go on. Are you going to have to sort of pull money away from other bits of spending, including perhaps welfare reform? So there's all those big questions underpinning this idea that however big your ambitions are, the economic reality is quite different.
- [20:03]
Joe
And talking of calculations, we have a new man with a calculator just appointed.
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Darshini
We do. I mean, this is exciting news in my world. Right. I mean, which gives you an insight into what the world is like. Yeah. The Office of Budget Responsibility has a new head. Well, subject to confirmation from the Treasury Select Committee, Professor Jonathan Haskell, which may not be a household name, but he is the man who had some responsibility for the roofs over the heads of many households because he used to be a member of the bank of England's Monetary Policy Committee. So he was an interest rate sett. He is not just the person who is going to be looking at the Government's plans or Andy Burnham's plans, as they may well be, and sort of rubber stamping those and saying, have you met the rules? And does this all add up? But there's something additionally a bit interesting about his background, which is that his specialty is productivity and the impacts of AI. And why does that matter? It means that the government can go to him and say, we want to invest in X, Y and Z. Can you say that?
- [21:00]
Newscast Outro Host
Yep.
- [21:01]
Darshini
You have the vision to believe that that can boost growth further down the road and that in turn means they've got a bit more resources further the way as well. So, one to watch and the answer to a question that many of us have been asking for a while.
- [21:13]
Joe
And also we seem to have had signs that a process that normally takes place in the run up to general elections, with possible changes of government, is also now starting in Whitehall.
- [21:24]
Henry
That's confirmed by the Prime Minister's official spokesperson, a briefing for journalists earlier today. We don't know quite how this will work, but there are going to be access talks for any Labour leadership contender. Of course, at the moment, there's only one publicly declared Labour leadership contender. So that means that Andy Burnham and or his representatives will presumably begin talking to Antonio Romeo, the Cabinet Secretary and the head of the Civil Service and Permanent Secretaries who run different government departments, I'd assume pretty soon. And that's obviously a very significant moment. I think it has happened, by the way, with leadership elections in the past, when the Conservatives had sort of longer handovers. You know, I think the summer of 2022, when it became clear that Liz Truss was likely to succeed Boris Johnson, she spent a lot of time with Simon Case, the then Cabinet Secretary, talking about what she would do. Obviously, that ended quite badly for her, but.
- [22:19]
Newscast Outro Host
Yeah.
- [22:19]
Henry
So it's a significant moment in. In terms of a symbol of what happened yesterday, which is Keir Starmer gave up office.
- [22:26]
Joe
And what's he up to now? He had some sort of drinks party yesterday evening. Are we aware of anything he's doing? Because of the sort of oddity of his situation, he's not really allowed to make many big decisions anymore, is he?
- [22:38]
Henry
No, that's right. Although we are told that he will still publish the defence investment plan long awaited, originally set for publication last autumn.
- [22:46]
Joe
The plan that the funding of which prompted John Healey's resignation as Defence Secretary.
- [22:49]
Henry
Exactly. And possible Labour leadership contender Al Khan's as well. And look, it suddenly becomes even more controversial than it already was. Because when it is published, obviously one of the massive questions is what do whoever is in the Labour leadership race at that point think of it? Because if they have a different answer to what the contents of this investment plan should be, then what this government has published under Keir Starmer is almost instantly redundant. So it is going to have a strange status. I think one of the reasons they probably still intend to publish it is that they had committed to publishing it before this big NATO summit in early July, which Mark Rutter, the NATO Secretary General, has sort of requested versions of from the different participating countries. And Keir Starmer will still attend that NATO summit on the current timetable and that will be one of his last big moments as Prime Minister and on the world stage.
- [23:47]
Joe
Is it clear what Team Burnham think of the fact that Starmer and co seem to want to plow on with this big plan?
- [23:55]
Henry
Not yet, but I think it will be fascinating over the course of the day to see whether there are any public signs of resistance to the idea that Keir Starmer should still be allowed to publish this.
- [24:04]
Joe
Darshini, you deal in big numbers and this plan does seem pretty enormous.
- [24:09]
Darshini
It does.
- [24:10]
Joe
What is the sort of give us the economic perspective of such significant decisions being made by politicians.
- [24:17]
Darshini
By politicians. Well, the economic significance, what I can say, it's already cost the Defence Secretary, frankly, the job. Saying this is not another was quite intriguing. What he said at the time is that there's an unwillingness by the treasury to commit this money and we're talking about billions and billions here. Right? There is that sort of sense when you read that statement, the treasury somehow being a bit sort of penny pinching and a bit sort of, you know. But, you know, the conversation we've had about the lack of financial resources in public finances, to find that money, you have to take it away from somewhere else, unless you're going to relax some of the rules.
- [24:50]
Amica Insurance Advertiser
Right.
- [24:51]
Darshini
Or else you're going to find it from somewhere else. So that is the kind of give and take that anyone is going to have to do if they are going to sign up to this and go, yeah, that is the vision for the future. And that is why, when they talk about difficult decisions, I mean, where do you get the money from? Are we going to be looking again at areas such as education, health? I should mention, by the way, that we look at the plans that Rachel Reeves has drawn up, the way she's made the sums add up and met these fiscal rules means that you've got some really tight spending figures for various departments towards the end of this Parliament. And that could mean some services feel the squeeze once again. So let's not pretend there's lots sloshing out there and you just have to sort of put your hand down the back of some sofas. That's not how you fund the defence plan.
- [25:30]
Joe
It's sort of been easy up to this point for Andy Byrne. It's going to get a lot more difficult if he is to get the top job. Well, to end where we started, I saw this from Tom Peck at the Times. Their parliamentary sketch writer, Harry Kane, John Stones and Jordan Henderson look set to become the first England internationals to go through a change of Prime Minister during a major international tournament for a record breaking third time.
- [25:53]
Darshini
Gosh.
- [25:54]
Henry
Well, I guess it's both a sign of their longevity as international footballers because it's slightly surprising that Tuchel called Jordan Henderson up to the squad. Much as I'm a big fan. But yeah, also that is the most creative way yet that I've heard of describing the political churn we've seen in recent years.
- [26:12]
Joe
Well done, Henry. Henry and Dashini, thank you so much. Good luck in trying to watch the game tonight. Adam will be back tomorrow. Hopefully Chris's voice has recovered. Newscast will be back very soon. Goodbye.
- [26:23]
Tristan Redmond
Newscast.
- [26:24]
Joe
Newscast from the BBC.
- [26:26]
Newscast Outro Host
From one newscaster to another, thank you so much for making it to the end of this episode. You clearly do, in the words of Chris Mason, ooze stamina. Can I also gently encourage you to subscribe to us on BBC Sounds? Tell everyone you know and don't forget, you can email us anytime@newscastbc.co.uk or if you're that way inclined, send us a WhatsApp on 33123 9480. Be assured, I promise we listen to everyone.
- [27:07]
Amica Insurance Advertiser
Foreign.
- [27:12]
Tristan Redmond
As yet another British Prime Minister steps down, is the country still feeling the effects of Brexit 10 years on? I'm Tristan Redmond, one of the hosts of the Global Story podcast from the BBC. Keir Starmer has become the sixth leader to resign since the Brexit referendum. Ever since that vote in 2016, the country's been wracked with political instability. When will it end? For more, listen to the global story on BBC.com or wherever you get your podcasts.