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Inside Kevin Hart’s Heartbeat with Jannine Lundy
00:23:12
Kevin Hart’s Heartbeat is redefining comedy and branded entertainment. EVP Jannine Lundy joins to discuss creative ownership, co-creating with brands, and why humor still drives connection in media today.
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Transcript95 lines
- [00:00]
Janina Lundy
Is who are you? An easy question?
- [00:02]
Mike Shields
No, not actually. Not for me, now that you think about it.
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Podcast Host/Announcer
No.
- [00:06]
Janina Lundy
Try to figure it out.
- [00:07]
Mike Shields
It depends on how you define yourself, just on, like, what your jobs are.
- [00:09]
Podcast Host/Announcer
Like, who are you?
- [00:10]
Mike Shields
I don't know.
- [00:11]
Janina Lundy
But it's also to take some of the success that Kevin himself has seen and take that DNA and sort of pass it on to other emerging talents. So we're working a lot with up and coming comedians and creators who are sort of in that comedic space. Even for us, we're playing a lot in sort of a comedy plus plus area. So we've been thinking about how do you bring comedy into everything that we're doing? And I think that's probably part of the benefit of, of me being here even. You know, I started out on the ad agency side. I know what's going on.
- [00:41]
Mike Shields
Yeah, those people think they're looking for.
- [00:43]
Janina Lundy
And then I'm sort of like bridging between entertainment and the advertising side.
- [00:48]
Mike Shields
This week on Next to Media, I.
- [00:49]
Podcast Host/Announcer
Got to talk to Janina Lundy, head of marketing at Heartbeat, the production firm founded by movie star comedian Kevin Hart. Janine and I talked about the company's long running talk series Cold and Miss Balls, which is funded by Old Spice, as well as the appetite among brands and streamers right now as consumers become harder to reach and every CFO wants perfect roas. Janine and I also talked about whether marketers are spooked by comedy right now during this period of potentially getting canceled. Lots to get into. So let's get started.
- [01:14]
Mike Shields
Hi, everybody. Welcome to Next in Media. I'm Mike Shields. My guest this week is Janine Alondi. She is the EVP and head of marketing and brand partnerships at Heartbeat. Hey, Janina, thanks for being here. How are you?
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Janina Lundy
I'm good. Thanks for having me.
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Mike Shields
Excited to talk to you. I think we'll just start from the really easy hopefully who are you? Question, because I think you have a pretty interesting career and then I want to get into what you're doing at Heartbeat. But tell us a little about your journey here in this industry.
- [01:38]
Janina Lundy
Is who are you? An easy question?
- [01:41]
Mike Shields
Not actually. Not for me, now that you think about it.
- [01:44]
Podcast Host/Announcer
No.
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Janina Lundy
Trying to figure it out.
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Mike Shields
It depends on how you define yourself, just on like, what your jobs are. Like, who are you?
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Podcast Host/Announcer
I don't know.
- [01:50]
Janina Lundy
Yeah. But yes, thanks for having me. I lead marketing and partnerships at Heartbeat. I have been here for two years now after 20 plus years in this delightful industry, working in all sorts of areas from the ad agency side to in house and kind of moved into media and entertainment in the latter half of my career. Heartbeat is a multi platform entertainment company started by Kevin Hart and we lift Kentucky of at the intersection of comedy and culture, creating all sorts of content and experiences in that world.
- [02:28]
Mike Shields
All right, so you, you kind of led me there. I actually saw Kevin speak about this can a couple years ago.
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Podcast Host/Announcer
How old is Heartbeat?
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Mike Shields
And what was the, like, what was the vision or what's, what's the. Did this come from? You know, he probably gets a million commercial requests. Hey, let's build a team for that. Or is this like. No, I want to do something that's pretty distinctive and unique in the space.
- [02:48]
Janina Lundy
Yeah, I think kind of all of the above. The company as it exists now was a merger between two companies that he already had. So. Lol, which was sort of our distribution side of the business, lol Network and Heartbeat, which was more of the production and studio side of the business. And those merged together three years ago. A little over three years ago, you know, right before I really joined. And the idea was, yes, to have some ownership within the industry, which I think is kind of a shift that a lot of talent wants and why you're seeing a lot more talent led companies. So it was partially for that, but it's also to take some of the success that Kevin himself has seen and take that DNA and sort of pass it on to other emerging talents. So we're working a lot with up and coming comedians and creators who are sort of in that comedic space and sort of providing that blueprint for them in the studios business. But then also in this brand world that I live in.
- [03:49]
Mike Shields
You're right. We are in this talent led company moment, which is pretty interesting and different and I want to go back to that. But I look at your background, your title, and I think you must get all these like branded content RFPs. You get the brand that wants to reach this tough audience. But you think it's difficult with advertising traditionally. So they want to make a show that they're featured in. I'm probably simplifying it, but what is that? Give us some examples of the kinds of projects you work on and like what's the market like right now for that? Because I imagine it's we're in a moment of high pressure on every dollar kind of thing.
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Janina Lundy
Yeah, I think a lot of brands want to be in this space, but don't necessarily know how they want to be in the space. So I think everybody's kind of figuring it out as we go. And There's a lot of different ways to approach it. We do get a lot of RFPs, but a lot of times we'll get an RFP that's more traditional, that somebody's looking for a commercial. We get a lot of calls of people who are looking for Kevin specifically. You know, where we're really focused is expanding beyond that and sort of bringing comedy and bringing other talent to the table and really bringing humor into everything that we do. I think people are trying to figure out, okay, how do I enter into the space? And so there's the world of entering into the space space by just putting your brand into content, which I think is how it has been done in the past. Just like a traditional integration, what we're looking to do and the way that we're working is more either co creating content with a brand. So for example, we just had a feature length film that we had that lives on Amazon that we did in partnership with WPP and AKA which is called Group Therapy and is all about mental health. But the way that we got the, the message across, like what was important to AXA was talking about talk therapy being important and sharing therapeutic. And so what we did was put together a feature film with a number of comedians who did a round table. Sort of like.
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Mike Shields
Because what you think of with comedy is heavy subjects like mental health. Perfect.
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Janina Lundy
That's kind of what we're doing across the board with, you know, whether it's allergy medicine that we're working on or you know, or mental health. How can we bring humor and levity to that, to connect with audiences knowing that that's what works. Right. And so that film, it's a full length film that never mentions axa, but they fully funded it and it lives on Amazon and they're able to have that piece of entertainment out there, but then also cut it down and use it in their paid and in their owned and operated and that, you know, know we want a few can Lyons for that, for that work. And then there's work that we're doing that's a little bit. And, and Kevin doesn't even show up in that film. But then we have stuff that's a little bit more blatant. Like we've been doing Cold as Balls for. We're into a hundred episodes now, so twelve season in seasons into that show where he is in ice baths talking to athletes. I've seen this very, very strong placement of Old Spice, but we poke fun at ourselves for that, you know.
- [06:58]
Mike Shields
Right. So yeah, I guess I was going to ask that you get. You give us a nice range. Our most. It might be hard to generalize our most brands looking to. I just want to own a subject matter and have some great content. And we're. It's more like a soap opera in the old days versus I want to be heavily integrated into something original versus just a product placement. I imagine. It's all over the map.
- [07:20]
Janina Lundy
It's all over the map. And I think, you know, know we are trying to help brands to expand their thinking on how they show up. I think it's very rare to have a brand that shows up in the way that AXA did for that. I mean that's, that's an extreme.
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Mike Shields
Yeah, not everybody's gonna do a full.
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Podcast Host/Announcer
Full.
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Janina Lundy
Yeah, well not everyone's gonna do a feature and not everyone's going to do something where their brand doesn't show up at all.
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Podcast Host/Announcer
It's not.
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Mike Shields
Not usually the answer they want.
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Janina Lundy
So. So like that's, that's taking it to the extreme. But there is balance that's available. I mean I think I, I have one that I can give you an example that I can't tell you what it is, but I can talk about some of it which is we're thinking about sort of. We have this idea of brands can be movie stars too. So how can we personify the brand? So we are creating a character within the story that sort of is the brand and that shows up in an authentic way where afterwards you think to yourself like was that an integration or was it just a coincidence? But alongside of that we're creating sort of a short, like short film that can live on say YouTube or within again like paid or, or in their owned and operated. And it is a little bit more heavy handed on the branding. So they have both pieces and we're shooting that all at one time. But you have, you know, the one piece that, that feels very natural and organic and then you have the other that's a little bit more paid.
- [08:39]
Mike Shields
Okay, coming back to the kind of content you're talking about, the kind, the kind of talent in. It's interesting for a couple reasons because I think sadly some people think comedy is like scary now. Like, oh, we can't be funny anymore. We can't do anything. So I wonder if you get any of that with brands or that's just something we like to say. And then are you looking for up and coming traditional comics or creators who are funny? And there's probably another whole range in there. I guess that's a lot of Questions at once. But what's, Go back to the first one.
- [09:11]
Janina Lundy
I'm like, you're challenging me early in the morning.
- [09:13]
Mike Shields
No, no, I'm, I'm, I'm. Or I've just done what I'm saying.
- [09:16]
Janina Lundy
Okay, let's see the. Let's start with. Are we looking for comedians? We are backwards. Yeah. Well, we're working with both. So we're working with comedians all across the board and that means in front of and behind the camera. So we're working with talent who are writers, who are helping us with the content that we're developing both for brands and not. And we're also, because we have this business that's functioning in multiple different areas, we're able to say, okay, there's talent that we're identifying that's writing on our series or on our films. Let's bring them over and help us on the brand side. Let's maybe put them in front of the camera as well. So we're sort of the comedians and comedic writers and then same thing. We're also keeping our eye on creators that are out there that are in the comedy space and seeing how we can bring them into our ecosystem. And I think again, this is a place where we do have the benefit of our founder and leader being one of the biggest comedians in the world. So he's also looking at talent that he'll see within his own social feeds and passing them on to us and identifying people that he sees potential in. So that's a great tool for us to have. Let's see, you asked me what was the question before that?
- [10:35]
Mike Shields
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- [10:39]
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- [11:05]
Mike Shields
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- [11:07]
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- [11:20]
Mike Shields
I'm not even certain whether, whether brands, I guess, how do they come to you? Is it more, Is it more through like are they are they are. This is coming through the like special budget that they have set Aside, is this coming through their YouTube money, their social money? Is it all, is it kind of all over the place?
- [11:35]
Janina Lundy
Yeah, I feel like my answers to all of your questions are all of these. So yeah, I think they're coming all different ways. So some are coming brand direct, where we're having conversations, some are coming, some are coming from media agencies that are coming to us and looking. Because I think one of the big differentiators between us and some of the other studios and talent led companies is in our scale is that we have our own distribution with LOL network. So sometimes we have media agencies who are coming to us knowing that they want this to go through a media buy but need us to just develop the content that's going to go with it. And some of it is creative led, you know, and then I think as far as where the budgets are coming from in house and where the projects are in house, they can come from an influencer team, they can come from, you know, some of the entertainment teams within different orgs, within the brand team. So it's coming from all over. It can come from social and sometimes they're coming saying here's the problem we're looking to solve or here's the product we're looking to launch. And sometimes, you know, they know exactly what it is they're trying to do.
- [12:39]
Mike Shields
And sometimes that's like one is a much bigger picture macro conversation and one is like further down the path, I guess.
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Janina Lundy
Yeah. So we're, we're operating all over the place.
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Mike Shields
I know what I was saying before, are you encountering this like I'm afraid of being, you know, edgy and comedy scary right now for everyone gets freaks, freaks out on social media or not really.
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Janina Lundy
Yeah, I mean I think sometimes. So we tend to, I think we have a lot of trust within the brands that we're working with. We've kind of been in this space for a long time and people kind of have seen our track record of how we're working with talent and how we're working with creators and comedy and understanding the brand side. And I think that's probably part of the benefit of, of me being here even. You know, I started out on the ad agency side. I know what's going on.
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Mike Shields
Yeah, those people think they're looking for.
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Janina Lundy
And then I'm sort of like bridging between entertainment and the advertising side and even we're working on a project right now where I just saw some cuts of some spots and I was like saying to my creative director, we're going to need to turn the brand up here. You're going to need to zoom in on the brand here. They're going to want to see the brand in the first three seconds. Like, you know, these are the different. And he says to me like, okay, yeah, I hear you, like you're being the brand right now, but like I want your feedback, you know, as a fellow creative. And I was like, okay, so you.
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Mike Shields
Have to shift your.
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Janina Lundy
Here's my feedback as a fellow creative. Also zoom in on the machine. Right.
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Mike Shields
So you got to play all the different roles when you're trying to evaluate these things.
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Janina Lundy
So yeah, I mean I think there's some trust that's coming from that. And I think, you know, we, we don't do too much brand integration on the standup side. So we kind of let the artists go there.
- [14:14]
Mike Shields
That is not easy, I would think.
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Janina Lundy
Yeah. And so I.
- [14:16]
Mike Shields
Natural way.
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Janina Lundy
Yeah. And so I think we focus more on providing guidelines and parameters for a brand on the content development side.
- [14:24]
Mike Shields
Okay, you mentioned distribution because I, you know, I think again it's traditionally if there is one for this kind of stuff, you think of either, you know, brand commissions a show and they want to, you want to get a deal with Hulu, a deal with Netflix to make sure it gets seen or you could throw it up on YouTube and hope it gets found because. Because of the creator's following what tell us about your distribution network and how it works and how you kind of make sure these things deliver what you're promising.
- [14:51]
Janina Lundy
Yeah, I think so. The distribution is kind of, it's broad. So for our own distribution for LOL Network, we have our YouTube channel and then we're available basically on fast channel. So anywhere where find those, whether it's Samsung, Roku, et cetera. But in addition to that we have partnerships with pretty much everyone. So we have, you know, a strategic partnership with Sirius. On the audio side, we have Netflix for Kevin's films and other films that we're working on. We have stuff that we're doing with Peacock, we have Hulu. So there's, there's broad distribution. So I think one of the biggest challenges with developing branded content or brand funded entertainment or whatever we're calling it.
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Mike Shields
Going to call this stuff.
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Podcast Host/Announcer
Right.
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Janina Lundy
I think is really figuring out where it's going to live. So that's something that we have these relationships where we're having these conversations on a consistent basis of, of where, where there's acceptance on brand integration, how these different platforms want to work with brands and want to work with Studios who are working with brands, but we also have that opportunity to distribute within our own platform where, you know, we kind of can do as we please.
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Mike Shields
Has it changed the fact that like the last couple years you've seen YouTube really hop on television where it's almost like you don't need that, theoretically you don't need that streamer deal because YouTube already is there. Does that change the calculus at all or is it still like success to get to getting an exclusive distribution deal with a big streamer or something like that?
- [16:19]
Janina Lundy
Yeah, I think you know that and I know that and I think everyone's reading that. YouTube is where people are watching, but I think there's still education for sure that exists with brands. I think, you know, a lot of brands still don't see it as premium and it's a conversation that we're having on a consistent basis because, you know, we find a lot of success in YouTube. That's where the audience is and we're doing more premium content within YouTube, both short and long form. So you have, like I said, the coldest balls show that we've been doing for years. And I would dare to say maybe we were like pioneers there, but you know, we've been doing that for a long time. But then we also have longer form content that we're doing, such as we have this show called Caddy and the Kid that we're doing with Ken Griffey Jr. That lives on YouTube. We're partnered with YouTube, they're out alongside us bringing it to brands.
- [17:16]
Mike Shields
They've got a little bit of a stake in it. They want to push it.
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Janina Lundy
Yeah, but it's a 40 minute show, premium golf travel.
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Mike Shields
It lends itself to hanging out on the couch and watching a full episode.
- [17:25]
Janina Lundy
And so, yeah, so we're having that conversation and educating on the fact that there's really something for everyone there. You want short form content, they have the YouTube shorts. If you want longer form, you know, they have that too. And you can watch that on mobile or TV or wherever it is. So we're having those conversations with brands and, and you know, sort of educating on some of that. And sometimes there it's living in YouTube and sometimes it's living on other platforms. Right.
- [17:50]
Mike Shields
As we kind of mentioned earlier, like we're in this moment. It's always been true that brands care about, you know, accountability, but we're, it's like almost like this intense pressure moment where everything's gotta be outcomes driven and accountable by nature. Some of this doesn't always lend itself to, like, everything being shoppable and immediately, you know, driving roi.
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Podcast Host/Announcer
But how do you.
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Mike Shields
How do you deal with that? What is there. Have you found a way to, like, commonly measure all these things? What does it look like?
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Janina Lundy
Yeah, no, there's not a common way, and we don't have the magic formula. But what I will say is, again, like, sort of coming from the brand side and coming from the advertising side, I understand sort of what they're looking for and, you know, what they have to report on, on their side. And we're. We're in it. You know, this is a business on our side, too. So we want the content to be successful, both for us and for the partners that we're working with. So that's the bottom line for us, too. I think we're building what the metrics are dependent on the brand. So different brands have different things that they're looking for. So some might be just about building awareness, some might be about the engagement. Some people want awards for the content that they're developing, and that's at the core of their strategy.
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Mike Shields
I think there's nothing wrong with that.
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Janina Lundy
No, I like an award. I would like an award, but I think, you know, best case, it's a combination of things. And I think, you know, we work together with the brands to understand what their objectives are, what they're doing in the rest of their marketing. Because this is, you know, all working together. And the idea is, you know, if we're developing content, you know, in one place that on the platform, it's about the views that we're getting and the reviews and the. And the. And the awards. What are we doing with that content? To put it out into other spaces that can be a little bit more direct to. To the results.
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Mike Shields
Right. Give us something you're. You're probably, you know, on the pulse of modern comedy, especially comedy that's bubbling up on these social channels. It might mean that everybody, everybody in my audience might not know, like, what are some interesting trends right now in comedy? What. Who is. What are some formats or talent that maybe people should know about?
- [19:58]
Janina Lundy
I think, like, sketch is having a moment, and I think looking at how this different talent is working in the sketch space is really interesting. I think there's a lot happening that's sort of at the fusion of comedy and music and sort of bringing those things together. And you're even seeing, like, somebody like Cardi B, who you may not think of as a comedian, but who just released an album, and there is humor all throughout that entire thing. And I would, I would say it's potentially a comedic album. Right? I mean, yeah, maybe I wouldn't go quite at that far, but. But I do think there's a really interesting fusion between all of these different areas. And even for us, we're playing a lot in sort of a comedy plus area. So we've been thinking about how do you bring comedy into everything that we're doing? We're living a lot in sort of a comedy and sports space right now.
- [20:52]
Mike Shields
Interesting.
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Janina Lundy
A lot of room happening there, particularly knowing that sports is what everybody wants to talk about. So we're thinking about how comedy and sports goes together even beyond sort of a coldest balls area. How does, you know, comedy work together with beauty? How does it work, like I said, with music? So I think that's where we're having a lot of fun and where we're seeing a lot of growth is how do you bring it into spaces that you haven't necessarily always thought of it?
- [21:16]
Mike Shields
Is there room? You just, it's. You don't really see like the old fashioned comic driven sitcom that was like a staple for so many years. And you don't, you don't see that so much on YouTube. You're seeing some scripted. But is there any, is there any interest there among brands? Are you guys looking at that at all or is that, is that just not the format right now for these, these mediums?
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Janina Lundy
Yeah, I think everything kind of goes, comes and goes. Right. So, yeah, I think we did a sort of parody 90s sitcom piece for Pampers last year.
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Mike Shields
Okay.
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Janina Lundy
And had some fun with that. And we've talked more about, like, what, what else can we do in that space? So I think there's sort of an evolution. It's almost like a testing ground, the sketch comedy side of things or something that could then be turned into something longer form or more consistent or like.
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Podcast Host/Announcer
A sitcom, I guess.
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Mike Shields
Lastly, what's your brand's takeaway? They don't really, if they don't totally understand the. How this sausage gets made, how this, how this part of the business operates, it's maybe less of a traditional media buyer or traditional ad campaign. Like, what are some takeaways that they should kind of keep in mind?
- [22:16]
Janina Lundy
I mean, one of the ways that we're really thinking about it is sometimes you can invest here on the entertainment side and it's not really a much bigger investment than you'd be making on your traditional TVC or something. So you do that with us or with a brand like us, with a studio like us.
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Mike Shields
People assume it's like these are like shooting billion dollar movies or something. Crazy.
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Janina Lundy
Yeah. It's all really modular. And so I think like people can think about developing some piece of entertainment that again, can be cut down and used in your page. So you have that piece taken away. It's not an either or. There's a way to kind of do this all together in one, one fell swoop.
- [22:54]
Mike Shields
All right, that's a good, that's a good idea. Awesome stuff. You're great talking to you. And let's, let's do this again sometimes.
- [22:58]
Janina Lundy
Awesome. Thanks so much for having me.
- [23:00]
Podcast Host/Announcer
Thanks again to my guest this week, Heartbeats, Janina Lundy and my partners at View Planner. If you like this week's episode, please take a moment to rate and leave a review. We have lots more to bring you, so please hit that subscribe button. We'll see you next time for more on what's next in media. Thanks for listening.