The Brand Forum Bonus Episode

Summary

Next in Media - The Brand Forum Bonus Episode Summary

Podcast Information:

• Title: Next in Media
• Host/Author: Mike Shields
• Episode: The Brand Forum Bonus Episode
• Release Date: April 4, 2025
• Description: This bonus episode features a special interview from the Brand Forum, hosted by Jeremy Bloom and Josh Palo, with Alex Berschmeyer of ConAgra Brands. The discussion delves into the evolving landscape of media, marketing, and advertising, focusing on brand building in an ad tech-centric world.

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Introduction to the Brand Forum

The episode begins with an introduction to the Brand Forum, a new show by Marketecture hosted by Jeremy Bloom and Josh Palo. The hosts explain that the Brand Forum aims to provide an insider’s perspective on advertising, media, and marketing, focusing on brand building rather than just ad technology.

Notable Quote:

• Jeremy Bloom [00:58]: “Our goal is to focus on brand building, not ad tech.”

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Guest Introduction: Alex Berschmeyer

Alex Berschmeyer, a seasoned marketing leader from ConAgra Brands, is introduced. Celebrating his sixth anniversary with the company, Alex oversees the marketing activation team, handling media strategy across various sectors, including retail, food service, owned websites, and CRM capabilities.

Notable Quote:

• Alex Berschmeyer [02:44]: “Happy I did all of them, but really excited to be here talking about all things marketing.”

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Defining a Strong Brand Identity

The conversation shifts to defining a strong brand identity. Alex emphasizes the importance of ensuring that a brand is ready for the market by aligning internal value propositions with external perceptions. He advocates for prioritizing product quality and availability before embarking on marketing efforts.

Notable Quotes:

• Alex Berschmeyer [04:32]: “Marketing cannot solve your business challenges all the time. You just can't market yourself out of a bad product.”
• Alex Berschmeyer [05:10]: “The human truths of the product, the value propositions and then what people actually care about with relevancy.”

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Navigating Brand Perception Disconnects

Jeremy probes into situations where there’s a disconnect between internal perceptions and consumer views of a brand. Alex shares that sometimes the reasons to believe (RTBs) that marketers focus on may not resonate with consumers, highlighting the need to align marketing strategies with actual consumer motivations.

Notable Quotes:

• Alex Berschmeyer [07:00]: “From a ConAgra perspective, we buy fast moving goods all the time. People are buying on price, convenience, speed...”
• Alex Berschmeyer [07:37]: “We got to meet people where they're at and why they... What they consider value at the end of the day.”

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Challenges of Marketing Legacy Brands in a Modern, Digital World

The discussion delves into the complexities of marketing legacy brands amidst rapid technological advancements and changing consumer behaviors. Alex explains that marketing strategies now require constant adjustments rather than annual plans, leveraging the agility of digital and social platforms to test and learn in real-time.

Notable Quotes:

• Alex Berschmeyer [08:53]: “Gone are the days of create your one to two spots... measure it six months later and then replan it all over again.”
• Alex Berschmeyer [10:15]: “The attention spans of people right now are kind of fleeting. So you kind of can build a brand back up quickly, but you can also build a brand down very quickly as well.”

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Partner Integration and Managing Multiple Vendors

Josh raises a point about integrating partners into the planning process, especially within a multi-brand organization like ConAgra. Alex emphasizes the importance of prioritization, focusing on key brands and target audiences while selectively engaging with tier-two partners that offer differentiated ideas and creative solutions beyond what major platforms like Google and Meta provide.

Notable Quotes:

• Alex Berschmeyer [15:07]: “Bringing the partners in and having a simple brief that a creative agency, a media agency, a partner can literally all look and gravitate towards...”
• Alex Berschmeyer [17:54]: “Those partners actually excite me a lot more. You have to be diligent on how many of those types of meetings you take.”

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Preparing for Next Generation Consumers

The conversation shifts to strategies for engaging with emerging consumer generations such as Gen Z and Gen Alpha. Alex outlines a framework that involves understanding who these consumers are, where they are, and how the brand can authentically connect with them. He underscores the necessity of authenticity, as younger generations are adept at identifying insincerity and are quick to disengage from brands that fail to resonate.

Notable Quotes:

• Alex Berschmeyer [19:35]: “If that brief can now apply to this new generation, let's test and learn it. But if we find that we're not showing up right, let's go back to the drawing board.”
• Alex Berschmeyer [20:10]: “Continuing to do the same thing on not resonating is just not going to be worth it at the end of the day.”

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Integrating Brand and Performance Marketing

Josh poses a critical question about the distinction between brand and performance marketing. Alex advocates for a unified approach where both aspects are integrated within a single budget and strategy, serving the overarching business goals of driving sales and market share. He believes that brand and performance marketing should complement each other rather than operate in silos.

Notable Quotes:

• Alex Berschmeyer [22:10]: “Brand and performance, no, there is no separation. We have one budget and they should all be in service of the same exact goal.”
• Alex Berschmeyer [22:35]: “They should complement each other in a way that... they have different metrics... but it should always be in service to the business challenge that we're servicing.”

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Closing Thoughts and Future Aspirations

In the final segment, Jeremy asks Alex a reflective question about his career choices. Alex humorously recalls wanting to be a substitute bus driver as a child but expresses a desire to work within the sports industry if not in marketing. The hosts commend his insights and emphasize the importance of balancing technology with authentic brand messaging.

Notable Quotes:

• Alex Berschmeyer [24:14]: “I think about working for a sports organization... something like the USTA, where I would be doing something I used to do all the time.”
• Josh Palo [26:20]: “If you don't have a good product, good message, a reason to believe, a good tug of the heartstrings... it doesn't matter how much meta ads you buy.”

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Conclusion

The episode wraps up with acknowledgments and a lighthearted exchange between the hosts and Alex. The discussion reinforced the significance of authentic brand building, strategic partner integration, and the seamless integration of brand and performance marketing to navigate the dynamic landscape of modern media and advertising.

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Summary: This bonus episode of "Next in Media" featuring the Brand Forum provides valuable insights into effective brand management in today's rapidly evolving media environment. Through Alex Berschmeyer's experiences at ConAgra Brands, listeners gain an understanding of the importance of aligning internal brand strategies with consumer perceptions, the challenges of marketing legacy brands, the necessity of prioritizing partnerships, and the integrated approach to brand and performance marketing. The conversation highlights the critical balance between leveraging technology and maintaining authentic, consumer-centric brand messaging.

Transcript

[Unknown Host]

This week Next to Media is featuring a special bonus episode from my friends at marketecture. It's their new show, the Brand Forum, hosted by Jeremy Bloom and Josh Palo. In this episode, they interview Alex Berschmeyer of conagra Brands, maker of Slim Jims and Ready Whip. Take a listen and let us know what you think. Thanks.

[Jeremy Bloom]

Welcome to the Brand Forum, everybody. We are very excited to release one of our first episodes. What is the Brand Forum, you might be asking? Well, the Brand Forum, we dive deep into the world of advertising, media and marketing through an insider's lens. The people strategizing and spending on moving the needle. You, the marketer. Our show centers on how companies build brands in an ad tech centric world. Our goal is to focus on brand building, not ad tech. To hear how experts like yourself navigate the murky waters of swimming up and down the funnel.

[Josh Palo]

Awesome. And hey guys, I'm Josh and I'm excited to be here with you, Jeremy and our guest today. Just as a, as another piece to it, as we were talking about this, this program, again, the idea of talking to brand people who are again trying to navigate this like ad tech, AI, data centric world, which are all incredibly important. But what we really want to get to the heart of is, is how do you, how do you really build the brand? Because ultimately the job of the marketer is to make that meaningful connection. And how do you do that in a space that's just changed so much? And so we thought about this idea of a podcast. Hopefully it lasts more than four episodes. We've bucketed the questions to be very much more specific around brand strategy, general marketing, you know, some future stuff and also just like just some fun stuff. And so we're really excited about the, about bringing this to everybody.

[Jeremy Bloom]

Josh, that was, that was an awesome intro and I'm laughing because here I was reading this. I've done many pods, many different videos, so. Hey everybody, I'm Jeremy Bloom. I'm the co host of the Brand Forum. I'm the co founder of Market and the founder of. Oh hello AI. We are so excited to introduce you to our next guest. The man is a legend. He is a marketing leader with experience on the agency, sales and most recently client side at a fantastic CPG company known as conagra Brand. Just hitting his sixth year anniversary. That's a lot in our space. He leads the marketing activation team which encompasses media strategy across three sectors of the US and Canada. Retail and the food service segment, as well as owned, website and CRM capabilities. This gentleman Is also known for his insatiable love for Ready Whip, Guardian, and Slim Jims. But hold on. I found this in my fridge. Some Vlasic pickles, everybody.

[Alex Berschmeyer]

So thank you.

[Jeremy Bloom]

Hear that? To hear that pop. We're gonna start this pod.

[Josh Palo]

This is where we really test how good the mics are.

[Alex Berschmeyer]

Oh. Oh, thank God. There was a crunch. Oh, my gosh. I was like, how sad would that have been if it was just like a little mush sound that happened?

[Jeremy Bloom]

Yes.

[Josh Palo]

And I want to verify for the. For the audience, like we. This is one take. Like, there was not a soft pickle in that batch right there. You hit it on the first one.

[Alex Berschmeyer]

And I did not know that Jeremy was hiding pickles next to his desk. I will. I will say that.

[Jeremy Bloom]

What do you expect anything less from me? Come on, Alex. We've known each other for a very long time.

[Alex Berschmeyer]

I love it. You know, that's one of my favorite brands. We have 85 brands that. 85 plus brands, I should say at Niagara because it keeps changing. But that is definitely one of my favorites. Pickles are definitely having a moment right now.

[Josh Palo]

Oh, absolutely. And probably. And by the way, that's probably a great. A great part for us to jump in on. So. Great intro from. From Jeremy. But Alex, like, let's hear from you.

[Alex Berschmeyer]

Oh, man. Yes. Thank you, Jeremy, for that intro. Yes. I've seen. I've seen all the sides of the coin from a marketing perspective. I started an agenc, went to the sales side, back to the agency, and now I find myself on the client side. Pros and cons to each and every one of them. Happy I did all of them, but really excited to be here talking about all things marketing. It's been a journey for all of us. Navigating a pandemic, all of that. And now marketing in 2025. Here we go.

[Jeremy Bloom]

Yeah.

[Josh Palo]

I mean, it's incredible. And so I think that's what. And that's. I think it gives. You talked about. This is what made us really think about the program is. Is how do you. How do you think about that brand piece? And so, I mean, mean, if we look at. Just dive right in. I mean, I think. I think first off, like, one of the things that's interesting about where you work is. Is like you said, there's just a vast number of brands, but I'm sure there's sort of some commonalities, but in themes and in sort of the marketing piece of it. So, like, first and foremost, like, how do you define a sort of a strong brand Identity.

[Alex Berschmeyer]

Yeah. I mean, yes, we have 85 different brands, but there are, to your point, commonalities between, like how we would get started on a brand that we want to focus marketing on. And I think the first thing we always have to think about is, is the brand even ready to market? Because if there are value propositions or perceptions of the product or things that are just not aligning with what internally you're thinking the product has versus what externally people are saying, or if they're even saying anything about your product, you got to align those and match those first. So we always, we always talk about first and foremost making superior products so that when we do go to market with those, there isn't this, oh, horrible taste, oh, this isn't worth it. This, you know, you are going to get that immediate feedback whether you like it or not. So we always focus there first. Secondly, making sure this thing is available, whether if you're a D2C, if you're a service, if you are in store, wherever you can be bought, make sure that actually people can buy you. So those are kind of the first two elements that we always start with first before we're like, are we going to actually market this thing? Because marketing cannot solve your business challenges all the time. You just can't market yourself out of a bad product. So start there and then, then we go from there and go, okay, what are those perceptions people have of us? It's not just a one way communication anymore of here's our ad, we're going to slap it to you and you're going to, you're going to enjoy it. There are so many options, endless kind of ideas of what people think your product is, do they align? And let's see if there's any commonalities between that. If there's a perception that your product is that you have, that you think you have with them, great. You can kind of really start moving forward with that. If there is a disconnect, start back to, you know, step one of where I was kind of talking about, but from my perspective, start there with your product. The human truths of the product, the value propositions and then what people actually care about with relevancy.

[Jeremy Bloom]

Alex, can you walk us through a time when there's been a disconnect of the brand perception of how internally the team has potentially looked at or thought about a particular product or how it was going to launch?

[Alex Berschmeyer]

I think, you know, from that perspective, there's oftentimes where you have just a slew of RTBs, reasons to buy that you think some part consumers really think that they really want this product or I'm not going to give it, I'm not going to give examples of the exact ones because it would you colleagues.

[Jeremy Bloom]

We get it. We have colleagues and comps teams and PR teams. We get it.

[Alex Berschmeyer]

Exactly. So I won't give the exclusive specifics but there definitely are times where you're like is, does the consumer really care about that attribute that we think we care about that people really think that they're. This is the reason why they're buying the product. From a ConAgra perspective, we buy fast moving goods all the time. People are buying on price, they're buying on different types of value whether that be convenience, speed, those types of things. So oftentimes these grand old huge RTBs that we think are. That is why they're buying the product. Absolutely. Aren't the why they're buying the product at all. We got to meet people where they're at and why they. What they consider value at the end of the day.

[Josh Palo]

Yeah, that makes sense. It's funny the reasons to believe I've lived through a few of those in consumer backgrounds and clients and you're, I mean stating the obvious but you said it, it's. Yeah, I mean it's. What would you think is the unique selling proposition or the reason that consumer is going to care? It may be, but it could also be price. It could be distribution. It could just be. I like the color of the bottle. You know it's like but there's, but there is something about winning that out that's, that's kind of interesting. So when you so like if you have to. So taking that, that initial question then looking at like today's landscape and again not, not going to leave the witness but you know, building a brand today versus building a brand, I mean gosh, even 30 years ago or even when I first got in this space was 25 years ago, very different. And so just curious like what are the, what challenges are you facing? And I think, I'm sorry but I'm going to add to this question like you also, you're also working at a place that is a legacy like company that has got brands that have been around forever. You know like these new brands that have popped up are interesting but like you're, you're in a brand that has a history and a legacy and so like what, what challenges today? Yeah. Yeah. Where is Orville these days?

[Alex Berschmeyer]

I know from Valparaiso, Indiana but Orville, rested soul, but no, these, this is okay. I'm going to take the question in two parts here because, because I was.

[Josh Palo]

Because I was long winded.

[Jeremy Bloom]

No, I know.

[Alex Berschmeyer]

Absolutely not. But I just, I don't want to make sure I blend these together because I think it's important to of bifurcate what, what these questions are because if we take the first part of that where it was, you know, how do we plan in a, in a crazy kind of like in a new world of advertising than it was 15, 20 years ago? And I, I started in digital at the digital investment part of a agency which got in 2010's Wild Wild West. I had probably no idea what I was buying with all these ad networks, all of these different places, but we were printing money and saying we need to be in digital. Which was, we were a success I guess at that point. But the thing with it now is we are in a constant state of planning. There is no annual plans anymore. That is long gone. There are, there are the, gone are the days of create your one to two spots, your one to two print insertions, your maybe one Facebook post and call it a day, measure it six months later and then replan it all over again. So I would say we are always kind of adjusting the plans, whether that be the targeting strategies, whether that be the creative messages, whether that be the partners that we're leveraging, like that is in constant state of flux now. We just have to kind of live with that world. But it's social and digital is great because you can test really quickly, you can fail really quickly, you can learn really quickly and all of that. But it also makes it. The curse of that is you could test really quickly, you can learn really quickly and you could, you know, you, you're in this constant kind of state of just change, change, change. But I think that is the norm now. So, so that is kind of the difference that I'll say 15, 20 years ago than today, which is always planning. But then legacy brands, so now taking legacy brands and I'm going to take conagra brands out of this because it's not really a consumer facing company like our competitors are, you know, like we don't really have a strategy to you know, go after and say, hey, this is ConAgra. This is, this is what, you know, we, but we do have businesses and brands though that are legacy brands and accumulation of our fridge frozen brands, our grocery snack brands. We have again 85 plus brands. They're all in different kind of, I call it buckets though. There are people that love manwich it's not a brand that we market that much, but there is a legacy and something like that to it. There are brands that we've accumulated over the years that have these legacies. And if we are going to plan on marketing that kind of like how I brought up in the beginning, what are people saying? Are they saying anything? Are they not saying anything? What are their perceptions of that? And really diving into that, you can play it up. You can also try to change those perceptions over time. It's going to be a little bit harder to do that because of the legacy that they may have. But in this day and world, the news cycle is constantly moving our attention spans. I know you guys just talked to Adelaide. I want attention and all that kind of stuff. So, like, the attention spans of people right now are kind of fleeting. So you kind of can build a brand back up quickly, but you can also build a brand down very quickly as well. So you kind of have to play with that legacy if it's good for you. And if it's not, you have to really try to rewind the tape and, and make it right.

[Jeremy Bloom]

And now we'll be tagging in Jaclyn Keller and Sam Mark from Comscore to give you a taste of something we'll be cooking up together this year. A sponsored pod Buster. Dishing with Divas.

[Jaclyn Keller]

Hi, I'm Jacqueline Keller, Comsmore cmo, and I'm here with Sam Mark, one of our commercial leaders, host of Dishing with Divas.

[Josh Palo]

Here.

[Jaclyn Keller]

We've got a full course ahead. So, Sam, what's on the menu?

[Sam Mark]

I'll be inviting data divas from across the industry to sit at the table with me. Together, we'll take a bite of today's biggest challenges, from linear TV to programmatic pipes. Soup to nuts, if you will.

[Jaclyn Keller]

Yum.

[Sam Mark]

We'll get into DSPs, DMPs, SSPs, CTV, SVOD, AVOD, SAS, DAS. Fast quality and performance guaranteed.

[Jaclyn Keller]

Well, that's about full. Sounds like it's going to be sweet and spicy.

[Sam Mark]

Savory, too. We're going to help folks take home that bacon.

[Jaclyn Keller]

So you'll be writing a new recipe in each brand forum drop.

[Sam Mark]

Yes. It's going to be a really divine treat. Will be like two peas in a pod.

[Jaclyn Keller]

Nothing half baked. Well, except for cookies. We've been adjusting the heat on those since 2020.

[Sam Mark]

We're looking at cookies crumbling and hotcakes selling.

[Jaclyn Keller]

Sounds like kids. I mean, divas in a candy storm.

[Sam Mark]

Promise we'll have our cake and eat it too. And there's Even icing on that cake.

[Jaclyn Keller]

Sam, this is ridiculously cheesy.

[Sam Mark]

Diva dish with a cherry on top.

[Jaclyn Keller]

I'm sure it'll measure up.

[Alex Berschmeyer]

Can't wait.

[Josh Palo]

How about let's, let's go to like, future, I guess, or actually, I know I want to go back to the planning thing, if you don't mind. So I'm a big partner integration person. I can, I can share multiple times where I've had partners email me and say, hey, you put me on the email with the other partner. I think you mis. Made a mistake. I was like, no, I was like, I just wanted to send one email, guys. And again. And it's not for any sort of like Game of Thrones, you know, maneuver. It's just like I want to have everybody in the room at the same time. How do you guys bring your partners, like, into the planning process?

[Alex Berschmeyer]

I think you kind of have to now at this point. Like, it's, it's. It's not just an agency does the planning and the strategic thought comes from the client and then the I idea comes from, you know, the vendor. Like, those days to me are long gone at this point. I. Good ideas can come from anywhere, whether that be from a vendor partner, whether that be from an agency or be internally. And sometimes, you know, even if you're talking to your random friend that goes, what about this? And you're like, I didn't even think about it like that. Like having outside perspective in this day and age, I'm like, I'm all for it. So you have an idea, let's talk about it. Some ideas are better than others, but at the end of the day, bringing the partners in and having a simple brief that a creative agency, a media agency, a partner can literally all look and gravitate towards. Because if that simple brief, though, that has those human truths that have those things that you want to really kind of drive, and if they're all working from that one document that has been a huge help in kind of just corralling all the different pieces together. Because at the end of the day, it shouldn't just be a media plan and a creative plan and all these other plans, they have to come together if they're going to break through.

[Josh Palo]

Yeah. Makes a lot of sense in your.

[Jeremy Bloom]

Kind of role then, Alex, how If you're across 85 different brands, you are working with hundreds and hundreds of different vendors. We might even be hitting thousands of vendors based on all the different formats of, of media. I'm not even going to go down that pipe of how many different factors and divisions and different deferential treatments there are in terms of formats of media. How do you balance your time as a marketing leader, as a media leader within our ecosystem. Before we start recording, we were talking about a big event that's coming up and how you are going to be allocating some of your time going to big meetings, going to big events. Like how do you do that? How do you breathe like this Question.

[Alex Berschmeyer]

You're a person, right? I am not AI yet. So prioritization is critical here. Like I am not, I will tell you right now, I'll be the first to tell you I am not working with hundreds and thousands of partners. I have to be focused on a certain amount of brands. I'm not working on all 85 I unless you want to start cloning me or you know, pulling a higher SGA budget, which is not going to happen. So we do have to prioritize from a brand perspective all in. And then from there I do have to prioritize where the target audiences that I'm going after and where those people are. So what platforms are they on? What type of targeting tactics am I looking for? And then based off of where those people are, what type of formats work the best. So that we're kind of making this list of prioritize platforms, prioritize brands, prioritize messages and prioritize formats. Because you're right, it can't, you can't do it all. So you have to, you have to have some sort of kind of gauge of what you're going to do and what you're not going to do because what you're not going to do is going to be 90, 95% of it. What you can do is the 5 to 10.

[Josh Palo]

Yeah. So I want to add to that or not add to it. I want to ask a follow up question on that one. So because I find super interesting about multi, I guess multi brand organizations is like you. So I look Meta and Google are going to cover a ton of what you guys need, right? So when you look at it at the lens, you're looking at it. How much are you able and no specifics around numbers but like how much are you able to spend time with the like I don't know, call them tier 2, tier threes or like innovation partners. Because I think about this a lot when it comes to again multi brand companies of just, you know, look, the meta will sell. Meta can manage 90% of your brands.

[Alex Berschmeyer]

Right.

[Josh Palo]

But, and there's nothing wrong with that. But, but and there's a scale issue to having to manage for that and the time issue. So, like, how do you, how do you find the fringe ones to bring in? Is it, is it brand specific? Is it just like opportunity? Like, what's the, what do you, what do you think there?

[Alex Berschmeyer]

No, I, That's a good question. And oftentimes you're totally right. Like, you could work on a plan with Google Meta all the time and it would, it would work, it would be fine. It would be a fine plan. You're not probably getting fired over it because they, they know, you know, you kind of know what you're getting with that. But where I find, like, the fun, though is like these other, like, let's call them tier two partners that are really willing to kind of pull up their sleeves and really give you kind of some differentiated, not only treatment, but also just ideas and things that you aren't probably going to get from the tier ones of the world. And that's where the fun and the magic and the ideas really can kind of get born from. So those kind of, those partners actually excite me a lot more. You have to now be diligent on how many of those types of meetings you take and kind of have some calculated bets on that. But if you have a great agency partner, if you have a, you know, if you have good partners in general and not even like JBP partners, but just like some contacts, not people that are chat bots that they're. They're going to tell you that you need to go to, but actual human interaction where you're like, actually, that's a great idea. Let's talk more about that. That's where I think the best kind of fun and ideas marketing should be fun. At the end of the day, let's, let's be real. Like, it shouldn't just be the spots and dots. Here's a, Here's a Facebook story, here's a Google Ad, display ad. You know, the fun comes from the idea. And then how you can creatively break through to that idea is what I look for.

[Jeremy Bloom]

How are you preparing for the next generation of consumers? So we've talked about, you mentioned AI, you mentioned chatbots, you mentioned being able to clone Alex Berchmeier. I don't think that's gonna happen.

[Alex Berschmeyer]

I know. Yeah, actually, I don't think they need another Alex Berchmere. I think one is good enough and.

[Jeremy Bloom]

That will be that one is great enough, my friend.

[Alex Berschmeyer]

But no, I mean, here we go. I mean, it was just yesterday. We're talking about Gen Z and how we're gonna figure out Gen Z and now we're talking about Gen Alpha and how we're gonna figure out Gen Alpha. And Now I think 2025, is it gen Beta that we're gonna beta?

[Jeremy Bloom]

I just read an article two days ago about Gen Beta.

[Alex Berschmeyer]

I was like, oh my God, I haven't even gotten my head wrapped around Gen Alpha yet. So here we go. But no, it is a great question. I mean, especially for legacy brands where gen, you know, Gen Alpha, Gen Z might not even know your brand, you know, like, they might not even have ever heard of you. Like, how do you even like start even thinking about that? So how I, so how we've been thinking about it is okay, if we're gonna like divide these groups up, where are these groups? What are they doing? Why are they doing it? Why are they there? Why would our brand have any right to play there, right the first in the first place? So like, that's kind of how I kind of identify it. First is who are they? Where are they at? And then how do we show up is kind of the three answers that I, that I would ask. And if there's one that's like, I just don't think that's right. A, these kids know and they know deep big videos. Like, they know the algorithms. Like, they understand that that kind of stuff is just part of the gig now. So they're going to sniff you out for not being authentic, for just kind of pandering, all that kind of stuff. So, so from my perspective, same brief, but if that brief can now apply to this new generation, let's test and learn it. But if we find that we're not showing up right, let's go back to the drawing board because continuing to do the same thing on not resonating is just not going to be worth it at the end of the day.

[Josh Palo]

Yeah, that makes sense. I, I think also it's just, it's interesting to again, go back to your Manwich example. It's. It, you know, does that, does that click with it with a, with a Gen Alpha gen? Even, even the generation which I forget the generation. This is actually my kid's generation. Like, I don't know if it does, you know, because they're. Are they healthy? That's it. Yeah, like health conscious. Not. It's just right, you know, it's. And by the way, not that I think. Not that it's not healthy. It's just more of like they make different choices, unlike what they're having. So it's such a. Again, it's very interesting to have to like navigate this. This sort of space of yours. I. Before we get to. There's a fun question at the end.

[Alex Berschmeyer]

I do.

[Josh Palo]

I am curious. And. And it's you. You sort of, you sort of talked about it a little bit with the just the general conagra like overarching company, but in terms of the brand versus performance. So this is by the way, also just as a personal note, this is my like hill. Like do you. Do you separate out and I'm not even talking from like a budgeting standpoint, but like how do you guys do you treat brand and performance separately? Do you bucket them together? Like, how do you think about brand?

[Jeremy Bloom]

I love this. Love this.

[Alex Berschmeyer]

I. This is. Okay, I love this question too because I think there are. People will die on the hill in the other way too of this. But from my perspective, brand and performance, no, there is no. We have one budget and they should all be in service of at the end of the day doing the same exact goal, which for certain companies may be something different, but for us it's we want to drive sales and share of our products full stop. And brand and performance should do both of that. They should complement each other in a way that, you know, brand being more reach, driving. You may have different metrics that you're looking at. You may be looking at more efficiency, you may be looking at more scale, more reach, those types of things. But it should always be in service to the business challenge that we're servicing. And then same with performance marketing, which is maybe your cost per acquisition, your, you know, your video view metrics, those types of things that are like a little bit more down funnel, which I know the like, do we still want to talk about the funnel or not? That's a question. But no one else has come up with a better idea. So we're going to say the funnel. But all of those need to be in concert at the end of the day trying to achieve business challenges. So to me, brand and performance marketing are one.

[Josh Palo]

Yeah. And it's in the with as any like sort of. I'm not calling myself a good podcast, but I feel like in all these things you're supposed to let your guests talk and like they would give their opinions. But there is a right answer. You just gave it just to that question. I'm just gonna.

[Alex Berschmeyer]

But I was also like, oh, I could be dying on the other side of the hill too here. And this could have been a fun little reveal yeah, no, no, it's.

[Josh Palo]

I mean, I've got. I've talked to the other side of that one. I agree with you wholeheartedly. I think it's really smart way to look at it, so. Awesome. Great. Jeremy, you want to ask the big question?

[Jeremy Bloom]

Yeah. Well, Alex, if you could be doing anything else and like, when you decided you wanted to go into marketing, media, advertising, when you look back at nearly 20 years, 15 to 20 years ago, when you decided to enter this ecosystem, jump into all this craziness, and because you have been on every side of our ether, call it, what would you be doing? How would you be spending your time?

[Alex Berschmeyer]

Oh, man. Okay, so you know when you get asked this question when you're a kid and if it's still like, do you.

[Jeremy Bloom]

Mean, like when you're 44?

[Josh Palo]

Because.

[Jeremy Bloom]

Yeah, I do.

[Alex Berschmeyer]

Yeah. When you grow up. What other age that could be? But I always said I wanted to be a substitute bus driver, which I will say now I don't think I want to be that. But that was what I said back then when I was like four or five. So I'm like, wow, I've come a long way from, you know, and nothing, no, wrong to any substitute bus driver out there. I did, I guess I didn't want my own route. So I just.

[Jeremy Bloom]

A big listenership of substitute bus riders.

[Josh Palo]

Just to be very clear.

[Alex Berschmeyer]

I know, and I think they do a big T. They do God's work for those regular bus drivers that get sick and can't do their route. So props to all the substitute bus drivers, but I don't think I would pick that one. Now. I honestly, I think about this and, like, I played tennis in college and I. I did sports most of my life. I think, honestly, working for, like, a sports organization, maybe like the ATP. God, would it be in marketing, maybe, but, like, just working for something that I would be, like, have really close ties to, growing up and working at that, maybe the usta, you know, like something like that, where I would be doing something what I used to do all the time. But just helping a sport grow would be maybe what I would go for if I wasn't doing this.

[Josh Palo]

That's awesome.

[Jeremy Bloom]

Alex, this has been great. We appreciate your time. Thank you for being one of our earliest guests. Josh, this was fun.

[Alex Berschmeyer]

We did all right.

[Jeremy Bloom]

We did all right.

[Josh Palo]

Considering I found out that was going on today. We did great.

[Alex Berschmeyer]

No, I'm just kidding. I knew.

[Josh Palo]

Yeah, I figured it out.

[Jeremy Bloom]

But, yeah.

[Josh Palo]

But no, this is great. Thank you so much. I mean, again, like, the goal of what we're trying to do is just hear more from the marketers. And, and by the way, like, I have to balance it. Like, I'm not, we're not, we're not against ad tech guys. Like, and I am, I am, I am on that side of the fence too.

[Alex Berschmeyer]

That's a part of the equation, for sure. I mean, it's, it's, it's honestly both. You need, you need both of these to make it all work at the end of the day.

[Josh Palo]

Yeah, exactly. But we want to just make sure we don't lose sight of the fact that, again, there's a consumer out there that you're trying to reach and you can use all the AI and machine learning and technology that's out there, but if you don't have a good product, good message, a reason to believe, a good tug of the heartstrings, like, it doesn't matter how much meta ads you buy.

[Jeremy Bloom]

Love that you both said that. We want to just provide a lens into how the marketers are thinking that that's as simple as it comes. So, Alex, thanks again, Josh. On to the next one. Thanks everybody for listening and watching. And if you're interested in being on the show, reach out. Josh and I are going to create a forum soon and thank you for being part of the brand forum. Thank you, guys.

[Josh Palo]

See ya.