Why Does Pinterest Have a Chief Content Officer?

Summary

Next in Media: "Why Does Pinterest Have a Chief Content Officer?"

Host: Mike Shields
Guest: Malik Ducard, Chief Content Officer at Pinterest
Release Date: March 18, 2025

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1. Introduction

In this episode of Next in Media, host Mike Shields delves into the evolving landscape of Pinterest with its newly appointed Chief Content Officer, Malik Ducard. The discussion centers on Pinterest’s transformation from a digital scrapbooking platform to a dynamic hub for social commerce, consumer trends, and actionable inspiration, driven by strategic content initiatives and advanced AI integration.

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2. Establishing the Role of Chief Content Officer

Timestamp: [01:05]

Malik Ducard joins Mike Shields to shed light on his role as Pinterest’s first Chief Content Officer.

Malik Ducard [01:57]: "We didn't have a Chief Content Officer before I arrived. It was a signal of Pinterest being much more intentional about content, recognizing that content comes from various constituents like creators, merchants, publishers, brands, and advertisers."

Key Points:

• Creation of the Chief Content Officer role to focus on diverse content sources.
• Emphasis on growing content strategically to serve Pinterest’s user base, known as Pinners.

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3. Evolution of Pinterest’s Content Strategy

Timestamp: [02:59]

Malik discusses the unique intent-driven user base of Pinterest.

Malik Ducard [02:59]: "When our users, our Pinners, come through the front door of the platform, they really come with intent in mind. They come to do something, to create something, to make something big."

Key Points:

• Pinterest users are purpose-oriented, seeking inspiration and actionable ideas.
• Content strategy aligns with users’ proactive mindset, contrasting with more passive engagement on other platforms.

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4. Understanding Pinterest’s User Base: Pinners

Timestamp: [04:41]

Malik elaborates on the diverse makeup of Pinterest content.

Malik Ducard [04:41]: "It's really a mix... from creators to merchants to publishers and others. Content also comes from advertisers who are sharing content organically and in a paid fashion."

Key Points:

• Content on Pinterest originates from Pinners, content suppliers, and advertisers.
• Overlapping roles where users may act as creators or merchants, enhancing content diversity.

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5. Content Curation and Boards

Timestamp: [09:24]

The significance of boards in content creation and user engagement is highlighted.

Malik Ducard [10:10]: "Boards are format that bring together what the Pinner is saving... They are things that you want to come back to, things that you do, things that you want to buy, things that you plan to do."

Key Points:

• Boards facilitate storytelling by organizing diverse content elements.
• Extensive board usage (over 10 billion) provides deep insights into user intent and preferences.

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6. Inclusivity and the Inclusion Fund

Timestamp: [12:16]

Malik introduces Pinterest’s Inclusion Fund aimed at supporting emerging content suppliers and merchants.

Malik Ducard [12:16]: "We've worked with over 200 content suppliers over the years within the fund, providing education, training, and support to help them grow on the platform."

Key Points:

• The Inclusion Fund offers financial support, education, and resources.
• Enhances platform diversity and fosters growth among new and existing content creators.

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7. Brand and Creator Collaboration

Timestamp: [13:44]

Discussion on facilitating connections between brands and creators.

Malik Ducard [14:42]: "96% of product searches on Pinterest are unbranded... creators have an opportunity to help users down the funnel to make a decision."

Key Points:

• High volume of unbranded searches presents opportunities for brands to engage.
• Tools like the Paid Partnerships Tool streamline collaborations between brands and creators.

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8. Pinterest’s Shift Towards Commerce and Social Commerce

Timestamp: [23:44]

Malik explores Pinterest’s strategic move into social commerce.

Malik Ducard [23:44]: "People are looking for more joy in their shopping, in their commerce... Pinterest is delivering an experience where inspiration and shopping fun coexist."

Key Points:

• Transition from purely inspirational content to facilitating actual purchases.
• Enhancing the user journey from discovery to transaction with a joyful and engaging experience.

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9. Machine Learning and Personalization

Timestamp: [17:31]

The role of machine learning in enhancing user recommendations is discussed.

Malik Ducard [17:46]: "Leveraging machine learning to understand user journey stages allows us to make better recommendations at the right time."

Key Points:

• Advanced algorithms analyze vast data to personalize user experiences.
• Improved recommendation systems help guide users through their intent-driven activities.

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10. Special Campaigns: Holiday Gift Guides

Timestamp: [18:57]

Malik shares insights on Pinterest’s successful holiday gift guide campaigns.

Malik Ducard [18:57]: "We curated 1,000 holiday gift guides from various sources, which significantly enhanced user experience during the holiday season."

Key Points:

• Collaboration with publishers and celebrities to create diverse and appealing gift guides.
• Extended beyond holidays with ongoing initiatives like Valentine’s Day campaigns.

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11. Diverse Content Categories on Pinterest

Timestamp: [20:55]

Pinterest’s extensive engagement across multiple verticals is highlighted.

Malik Ducard [20:55]: "Fashion is really big... Home decor, food and beverage recipes, music, and art also see deep engagement on the platform."

Key Points:

• Strong presence in traditional categories like fashion and home decor.
• Unique engagement in areas like music aesthetics and festival inspirations.

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12. Future of Social Commerce and Pinterest’s Position

Timestamp: [23:07]

Malik discusses the future trajectory of social commerce on Pinterest.

Malik Ducard [23:07]: "We believe in creating a sustainable business model focused on joy and positive experiences, moving away from toxic social media environments."

Key Points:

• Commitment to fostering a positive and inspirational community.
• Emphasis on experiential joy in the shopping process, enhancing overall user satisfaction.

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13. Conclusion and Final Thoughts

Timestamp: [26:38]

Closing remarks highlight Pinterest’s journey and future aspirations.

Malik Ducard [23:44]: "Pinterest is at the center of search, social, and commerce, aiming to deliver actionable inspiration and joyful shopping experiences."

Key Points:

• Pinterest continues to evolve as a multifaceted platform integrating search, social interaction, and commerce.
• Future initiatives focus on enhancing user engagement and expanding commercial opportunities.

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Final Note: Malik Ducard’s insights reveal Pinterest’s strategic focus on intentional content growth, diverse user engagement, and the seamless integration of social commerce. By leveraging AI and fostering strong creator-brand collaborations, Pinterest aims to maintain its unique position as a platform that inspires and empowers its users to turn ideas into reality.

Transcript

[Mike Shields]

Collaboration is a new competition. The One Audience alliance by Elemental TV unites premium publishers to tackle CTV's biggest challenge, fragmentation. By collaborating over AI powered audience insights and inventory, we're creating an ecosystem where advertisers win, publishers thrive and audiences stay engaged. Join the movement redefining [e-mail] 1audiencealliance that's E L E M E N T a l t v.com Oneaud I e n C E A A L L I A N C E this week on Next to Media, I spoke with Malik Ducard, he's the Chief Content Officer at Pinterest, about how the company, once thought of as a digital scrapbooking network, has evolved into a hotbed of social, commerce and consumer trends, thanks in part to its early investments in AI Malik. I also discussed the unique Pinterest creator verse and whether the Internet can actually quit its rage addiction. Let's get started.

[Malik Ducard]

Foreign.

[Mike Shields]

Welcome to Next to Media. I'm Mike Shields. My guest this week is Pinterest's Chief Content Officer, Malik Ducard. Hey Malik, thanks for being here.

[Malik Ducard]

Happy to be here.

[Mike Shields]

Excited to talk to you. You're. I keep hearing really interesting things about Pinterest. Obviously. I've been following the company for a long time, but there's feels you're having a bit of a moment maybe right now. I think probably it's, it's worth starting. I think for folks in the industry that know Pinterest but are not like heavy users, they might wonder why do they have a chief content officer that there it's isn't an old ugc. They don't write, make shows or write stuff. What? That's a long way of asking, like what is your job all about? Tell us, tell us what you do there.

[Malik Ducard]

Yeah, well, again, thanks for having me. And I've been at Pinterest now for a little bit over three years. I'm the first chief Content officer. So we didn't have a chief Content officer before I arrived and the company.

[Mike Shields]

Really did you create the job, you could make it your own, create the.

[Malik Ducard]

Job, make it in my own. And it was really a sign and a signal of Pinterest really being much more intentional about content and recognizing that content comes from many different types of content constituents, whether it's, you know, creators, merchants, publishers, brands, advertisers. And also content comes in from many pipelines as well. And we really wanted to have a focus on really growing that content base and not just growing content for content's sake, but really growing it for our Pinner Base we call our users Pinners. And I think one thing that's so unique about Pinterest compared to other platforms is that when our users, our Pinners, come through the front door of the platform, they really, really come with intent in mind. They come to do something, to create something, to make something big.

[Mike Shields]

It's a purpose oriented kind of crowd here.

[Malik Ducard]

Purpose. And if I had to imagine what's the posture of a user coming to Pinterest, it would be leaned in to the platform and many other platforms are much more lean back. So the content really maps to that type of mindset and that's what we focus on within content at Pinterest.

[Mike Shields]

So you mentioned you've been at the company a few years now. Give us your, your journey. How did you end up in this role that you got to start and what's your digital background like?

[Malik Ducard]

Yeah, absolutely. So prior to Pinterest, I was at YouTube for almost 11 years in content and content partnerships.

[Mike Shields]

Talk about a period of change at YouTube.

[Malik Ducard]

Yeah, you know, I was there when creators were hobbyists before the creator economy. And then it grew into. That was a really, really interesting time. And past few years when I was at YouTube, the area that I led included, you know, areas like family and kids and social impact and health and education. And it was really the positive corner of YouTube and I was really excited to move to Pinterest, which is the positive and inspirational corner of the Internet. And, you know, been a great transition and yeah, been here three years since.

[Mike Shields]

Very cool. So compared to the early days when I feel like it was very much all ugc, I think, versus like a real class of creators or Pinterest being involved, like what is it the makeup of content look like right now?

[Malik Ducard]

It's really a mix. And the way we think about it is in sort of, you know, almost like three parts. You have our Pinners, our users who come to the platform for inspiration and to do things. You have our content suppliers. And that is a mix from creators to merchants to publishers and others. And then you have our advertisers. And content really comes from, you know, all of those constituents in a lot of ways, from Pinners as well, who pin content and share content to their boards onto the platform or save it to their profiles. It also comes from advertisers who are sharing content organically and also in a paid fashion as well. I think one of the interesting things is across those three constituents of Pinner, content supplier and advertiser, it's not mutually exclusive. And you really bring that. It's more of a profile of each when they're having that type of engagement and activity. But you will find an advertiser who's also providing content, and you'll find a pinner who is also a merchant and merchants.

[Mike Shields]

So you're going from. You're changing hats as you use this platform at different times and sessions.

[Malik Ducard]

Exactly, exactly.

[Mike Shields]

Okay, so again, something probably very difficult to generalize, but you know, like with, with a lot of, call it social media or entertainment platforms like the. You'll see creators have a home and then they kind of do versions like if I'm a YouTuber, I'll do TikTok, I'll do Instagram. Is there something that really works on Pinterest that can be replicated elsewhere? Is it. Is there a formula? Like, you know, the vlogger became a thing on YouTube and there was a format that kind of emerges standard. What is it? What really works on Pinterest?

[Malik Ducard]

You know, what I would say is that on Pinterest, it's really about the content itself and the expertise that's in the content, the guidance that the content provides. Like, there's a lot of sort of how to ethos on the platform where content will take a person from a notion of a thing to actually doing the thing. And one way I've thought about it is on Pinterest, it's really about content with personality as much as it is personalities with content. Like, if you are a content person, creator, provider, and let's say you want to show how you're making a tuna casserole on some platforms, if you're doing a tuna casserole, you also better have a good dance and a good joke to go along with it. You have to have other things other than being a great tuna casserole. On Pinterest, it's the content that matters. It's the guidance that matters. It's the authenticity and the expertise that goes into it. So content with personality as much as personalities with content.

[Mike Shields]

So many platforms go through like an evolution where they're, you know, maybe they're not sure what, how the creator world fits in. They really embrace them, they facilitate deals, they let them do their own thing. Again, again, probably hard to summarize, but what is like the state of creators on Pinterest? Is it. I know, I imagine it's evolved a bit. Is it, you know, is it much more professionalized and much broader than we might know? Like, what does it look like right now, that landscape?

[Malik Ducard]

Yeah, I would say that the landscape really is a range and it goes back to the content itself and what the content is looking to convey. And I would say it starts with the users, because our users are coming to look to do something. The type of content that you find really, really resonates on Pinterest is that kind of content that takes people from an idea to an actuality and the realization of that idea. So that means that that content is coming from, you know, sort of UGC end of the spectrum as much as it's coming from a more traditional publisher end of the spectrum as well, and everything in between. But I think that that's what defines content on Pinterest most, is what it's trying to convey over, you know, what category, you know, it's specifically in. And because curation is so fundamental to the platform, curation is a form of creation also. And really, Pinterest is the only curation platform that is out there. It has curation to the extent and the degree that we do. There are over 10 billion boards on the platform. And boards are format that bring together what the pinner is saving sort of in their own personal or shared surface area. So on that board you may get a video, you may get an image, you may get a YouTube link and video right side by side with an Instagram. But it's what's that board trying to convey and what's it doing for, um, that the user is, is really what stands tall in the platform.

[Mike Shields]

So that, that sort of inherent to the experience is that the, the creator or just any user is crafting what they want people to see with a bunch of different elements and, and telling.

[Malik Ducard]

A story that way or a hundred percent. And, and not only is that helpful for that pinner, like, let's say I, I am going to a party or a weekend, a wedding weekend, and I'm, I'm thinking through my outfits or let's say I'm planning a wedding. I'll have a board or a series of boards. Maybe I can collaborate with somebody on the boards or revisit the board for myself. And the data is really interesting because you'll also be able to, I mean, our systems are able to really see associations of one piece of content to another piece of content. These shoes go with this pair of pants, goes with this blouse and this hat and that type of signal. 10 billion boards, 1.5 billion saves a week at scale, actually helps us to understand the user intent and the content itself.

[Mike Shields]

You need to have some boards where people in the industry, when they're planning their first trip to Cannes, you can help them get their clothes ready and they're shopping. I can see that being a real.

[Malik Ducard]

Niche I have from that actually. My, you know, I've gone to Cannes, you know, many lives, many different, you know, years. But when I got to Pinterest was actually the first time I went to Cannes lion, you know, go to Cannes for mipcom and the film. Well, and I was just like, how.

[Mike Shields]

Do you need some help? It's a.

[Malik Ducard]

How do they address a can Lion? And I went to Pinterest, created a board and there have been other scenarios where I have like 3 sons, all gen Z, they're all pretty fashionable, but especially one. And I, I've have collaborative boards with him where he'll throw things in there to give me advice to, to up my game a little bit. So boards have a lot of different. That's great.

[Mike Shields]

That's funny. I want to ask you about the Inclusion Fund. Tell folks what that's all about.

[Malik Ducard]

Yeah, so we, we've been doing the inclusion fund since 2021 and this was really our effort to support emerging content suppliers, emerging merchants, to really, really help them to understand the platform, have support around the platform and grow on the platform. You know, there's a fund component to it, it's called the Inclusion Fund. But, but it's also like, I'd say that the support and the insights and almost like the lab type setting where we do education and training on, hey, you know, here's how you can drive your merchant business on Pinterest. Here's how you can add your products and really, really leverage Pinterest to build your business. We've seen some really, really great results and great retention out of that, both for the platform and with the participants in the fund. And I think we've worked with over like 200 content suppliers over the years within the fund.

[Mike Shields]

Yeah, I imagine it's, it's probably a little daunting if you don't, you know, speak the language and know the lay of the land. Yet when you're getting going, that's got to be helpful.

[Malik Ducard]

Absolutely, yeah.

[Mike Shields]

A lot of platforms sort of wrestle with how best to do this. How much do you get involved with connecting brands to creators versus staying out of the way, versus having tools to help those things kind of come to fruition. What does that look like?

[Malik Ducard]

Absolutely. So this, this is one of those areas that that is, is a really, really big opportunity. And it really goes back to what I was saying about creat, that creators and content suppliers on Pinterest are really Focused on actionability, helping to inspire users with ideas and then taking them through the steps to actually do the idea and realize that idea. So brands connecting with them is really, really important. And one stat that really is interesting is that of searches, product searches on Pinterest, 96% of those searches are unbranded. Meaning that if you are looking for jeans, you're not looking for, you know, XYZ pair of jeans, you're looking for jeans.

[Mike Shields]

You're not all the way at the bottom of the funnel yet. You're, you're, you're figuring things out.

[Malik Ducard]

You're figuring things out. So creators have an opportunity, their brands have an opportunity there to help that user down the funnel to make a decision. So what are some ways that creators are doing this and we're supporting that agencies that creators work with and that we work with to help matchmake. That's one. We've also built a tool called the paid partnerships tool that's essentially like a handshake tool tool that connects the brands with the creators in an elegant way. And then you know, just given that leaned in posture of our users and how creators are mapping to that and working with that, a lot of creators have their own products or their own shops, or their own owned and operated or their own affiliations so that the traffic that Pinterest provides helps the creators to turn that into maybe commerce for themselves through shops or you know, affiliate revenue as well. And Pinterest, you know, over the past few years we've gone through a really important evolution where we, we have really leaned in to this type of use case, this type of support. We are a visual search platform and an engine and through that we want to get you to where you're going and what you're looking for, whether that is on the platform or especially off the platform. Three years ago we really wanted people on the platform in more of a social media kind of.

[Mike Shields]

Yeah, you wanted people to hang out and stay, right?

[Malik Ducard]

We wanted people to hang out and stay. And links off platform just kind of became a little less potent, a little more below the fold. And we really have come around full circle, or I guess half circle, 180 to the other side where not only are links above the fold, so to speak, our systems are actually designed to get you to where you're going. So if you're looking to buy something, we'll send you to that retailer through a link or an affiliate link or to maybe the blog from the creator that you were looking for to get more information. Because Pinterest is really at that center of search, social and commerce. But it isn't social solely.

[Mike Shields]

Right. I guess the trick is to how do you know when somebody is in the. I'm just looking at outfits for a potential trip versus I'm going this, you know, in a month and we need to pull the trigger. I'm imagining you were able to figure out what stage people are in.

[Malik Ducard]

That has been a big focus of the company is to understand exactly what you just said. Where is the user on that journey? Is the user grazing, surfing, looking for kind of broad ideas, or are they more in the middle of the journey? Are they at the end of the journey? And you know, a lot of the work that we've done around even like leveraging machine learning to understand how to make the right recommendation for the right user at the right time. Going back to what I shared about, you know, boards, those signals on the boards when, when you have a range of content at this level of scale really help to instruct our systems to be able to make better and better recommendations to users at the. At the right time.

[Mike Shields]

That's where machine learning shines, right. When you've got a lot of data to make it. Tell me about the recently you had a. You had an interesting gift guide campaign. Can you tell us a little bit about how that works? A little bit different than perhaps the things we've been talking about.

[Malik Ducard]

It's different, but it's also like within the same zone of commerce, search and social. So with gift guides over the holiday season, we work to really program and curate 1000 holiday gift guides for our users, which came from a lot of different sort of pipelines from publishers, from celebrities like Alicia Keys and others, and also gift guides that we created directly as well to really help show great shopping opportunities for our users through these gift guides. And it really, really moved the needle in a major way in giving users at a critical time period great turnkey ways to find gifts for their loved ones, their friends, and even themselves. And it doesn't stop with holiday. This is something that, you know, on the heels of success that we saw over holiday, we're continuing on with this as well. And actually in February, around Valentine's Day, we had a great gift guide from Grammy artist Troy Siobhan where he really brought users kind of into the path of how he created this fragrance. And that's part of a gift guide. And specifically a product drop that we did where we really helped to show the behind the scenes of a content and initiative or a product like what Troy Siobhan was dropping.

[Mike Shields]

Are there any. You made me think of this. Are there any categories or topics that people might be surprised have a robust activity on Pinterest? People think of travel, obviously, and home decor and things like that. Are there any areas that you might be surprised at?

[Malik Ducard]

You know what? I think people would be surprised at the depth of engagement across a lot of different types of verticals and genres and interests. And I don't know if this is a surprise that this might be the obvious, but it doesn't hurt to state the obvious. Fashion is really big. Pinterest is a place of cultural zeitgeist, where people are looking for not only what's happening now, but what's going to be happening as well. And I'll get back to that in a second. But I think fashion is a big category. Home a big category. Home decor, food and beverage recipes is massive on the platform. Then you also have categories like music and art. And here's what you don't have on music. You don't come to Pinterest to listen to the latest great track from so and so. Music is big because you come to Pinterest to see the aesthetic around the music video, the aesthetic around the artist. Like with Coachella. Coachella's, you know, coming up in a few months, people come to Pinterest for festival gear, festival inspiration. And because on Pinterest, saving is so, like, big. 1.5 billion saves a week. When you think about, like, what in life, what. What is it? What are the things that you save? What are the things that you put into that draw? They are things that you want to come back to, things that you do, things that you want to buy, things that you plan to do. So that saving behavior is a little bit of a crystal ball because you're saving it for later. It's more powerful than an ephemeral like. So we have something called Pinterest Predicts, for example, where we. We actually look at that information in aggregate and share where. Where are things going? What are people.

[Mike Shields]

You've got a pulse on some of potential trends in those. In those. In those areas.

[Malik Ducard]

You have a real pulse on those potential trends. And you see it bubble up, like, in the near term as well. When people prepare for something, you know, like. Like a Coachella, for example.

[Mike Shields]

Interesting. I want to come back to social commerce. We were talking about how, you know, I think for. For a number of years, I've said this before, people are wondering whether this was going to, you know, this was. It was. It was always, oh, it's always big in Asia, maybe it's coming here soon. It's definitely had, you know, breakout last couple years. What do you think? Did something change? Did is this generational better tech and what's what. Why is this happening now and maybe where do you see it heading?

[Malik Ducard]

I think one, one thing that's happening now is that people are looking for a few things in a sea of toxicity that's out there in social media world. I think people, people are looking for something more positive and inspirational. Like we strongly believe that there's going to be a retreat from rage and that rage and anger is not as from a business standpoint, it's not as sustainable business model. So I think that people, users, businesses, brands are looking for better. So crossing that over with social commerce, I think people are looking for more joy in their shopping, in their commerce. I think that when you look out at the landscape, there's a lot of great transaction, there's a lot of great buying. But when I think back to the experiential joy and I think the Internet has gotten like hyper efficient in buying, which is great. But we think at Pinterest we have a real opportunity and this is what we're working on, delivering on this is our experience to have joy and shopping be together in an experience where you can see the inspiration but then also walk through those stages of the funnel to actually do it and have fun in the funnel. And I think that this notion of like fun and joy, you know, where we've been missing out on it and we're seeing that more and more. And one thing just to go back a little bit, you know, sort of three years ago. So Pinterest is a place of shopping. Like 50% of our users come to Pinterest to shop like over 50%, you know, a couple years ago that was expressed and experienced more as coming to Pinterest to window shop because the stores were actually closed. You would see something great but then not have an ability to longing for.

[Mike Shields]

That moment to be able to do that stuff.

[Malik Ducard]

And you couldn't on Pinterest or with Pinterest. And over the past few years we've been spending a lot of time and work building out that bottom half of the funnel so that you can complete that experience with Pinterest. Not give, you know, swipe your credit card on Pinterest. No, not that, but actually go to the merchant, go to the retailer, go to the brand. And that's been, I'd say one of our biggest business stories and shifts that's driven real opportunity, you know, for and with our partners and for Pinners.

[Mike Shields]

Well, I'm all for more joy, so it's a hopeful note to end on. Malik, thanks so much for an awesome conversation and taking the time out of here.

[Malik Ducard]

Thank you so much for having me. I really appreciate it.

[Mike Shields]

Let's do this again. Thank you. Thanks again to my guest this week, Pinterest, Malik Ducard, and my partner's Elemental tv. If you like this week's episode, please take a moment to rate and leave a review. We have lots more to bring you, so please hit that subscribe button. We'll see you next time for more what's next in media. Thanks for listening.