← Next Up with Mark Halperin
Next Up with Mark Halperin
Rubio’s Political Resurrection, the Next Blue Wave & Jessica Reed Kraus Spills Some Political Tea
01:14:07
From the "Little Marco" insults of 2016 to the most powerful foreign policy seat in Washington, how did Marco Rubio pull off the ultimate political comeback? In today’s episode, Mark’s signature monologue looks covers strategic reinvention of Marco Rubio. While many rivals faded into the background, Rubio played a disciplined long game, with a self-styled roadmap to Trumpworld through key alliances with Ivanka Trump, JD Vance, and Susie Wiles. Mark also explores how Rubio became the "structural engineer" of the current administration's high-velocity doctrine, balancing finesse and muscle to confront global thugs. Mark is then joined by Republican strategist Kristin Davison and Democratic strategist Kevin Walling. Join us as we look ahead to the 2026 midterms. Who are the Democratic standouts poised to challenge the status quo? From rising governors to swing-state stars, we’re mapping out the blue horizon. Rounding out the episode, the legendary Jessica Reed Kraus (House Inhabi...
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Everybody. Super glad to be back with you in this new year. Happy New Year to all of you. All nexters out there, old and new. Grateful to be part of your lives as we head into 2026. We're going to talk a lot about politics this year, but a whole bunch of other stuff too. I am your tour guide to everything. Next up, Mark Calperin, editor in chief of the live interactive video platform 2way and your host here. Glad to be back, as I said, and eager to jump in with some great conversations today. Many thanks to all of you. We built up a lot of steam in the first partial year. This is our first full year with you on the air. We have lots to tell you about in the coming weeks in terms of guests and formats and excited to cover everything alongside of you and to tell you always with a relentless push on what's next up? Happy to be part of your life and again, grateful my colleagues and I here to build up a head of steam headed into this election year. Today we're going to talk to two great folks very knowledgeable about what's going on in American politics and government. Republican Kristen Davidson and Democrat Kevin Walling will both be here. We're going to talk about about what's going on in our government and politics and what the year 2026 is shaping up to be. And then my friend Jessica Reed Kress will be here. She is a, she's just a phenomenon. She's an extraordinary creator of stories and talent and content and chronicler of our time. And I'm just excited to preview how she sees 2026 with Jessica in just a moment. Excited to talk to them all about the new year. Before that, though, my reported monologue, two parts of the Venezuela story that I don't think have gotten enough attention. I've been talking to people in and outside the administration about both Marco Rubio and about the strategy of Team Trump. We're going to talk about all that that is coming next up. 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Beams already improved over 28 million nights of sleep. So if you've been waiting for the right time to try Dream, this is the time to do it. Go to shop dream.com, use my code mark for up to 40% off. That's just 39. With the, with the code mark a dollar 25 a night for good sleep. Shopeme.com mark go there today. Okay, so my first reported monologue of the year in the midst of all this news about Venezuela, what I try to do in the reported monologues is tell you stuff you're not going to hear other places. And when a big story like this, when all you've heard for, you know, several days now is about Venezuela, I got to look for my targets of opportunity. So you're not just getting more of the same. So I've been talking to a lot of people about what's going on and I've teased out two elements of this that I think are pretty important and I hope you'll find pretty interesting. One involves Secretary of State Marco Rubio and one involves what's going on with the strategy here. Not the tactics of grabbing Maduro or the threats about running the country or claims to be running the country. But what is the grand vision here that Team Trump, the president are trying to execute? So those are the two things I'm going to talk to you about, informed by a lot of conversations I've had with people involved in the national security apparatus, some on Capitol Hill and the administration, folks advising the administration. But first, I want to start with Marco Rubio. Just an incredible story about a young guy who 10 years ago was basically at war with Donald Trump when he ran against him for president. And he goes from the very harsh relationship with Trump, mocking in both directions, which we'll look at in a minute, to now being really the top foreign policy figure in this administration. Not since Henry Kissinger has someone had both the jobs of National Security Advisor and Secretary of State in any administration. Secretary of State is really along with vice President. It's the plum job. It's the job that so many people want. And I can't tell you the number of very high level people over the years who said, I want secretary of State or nothing. I will not take a job in the new government. I won't give up my current life without getting that. So Rubio gets that job. But then also when the national security adviser is forced out, Rubio is asked to take both positions. And he is now one of a half dozen people around the president who are in the room where it happens all the time. And on, on national security, he, Rubio is the dominant figure. And particularly on this Venezuela matter, he is a super dominant figure because of his background, which I'll also talk about. But this story of how Rubio goes from being at war with Donald Trump a decade ago to being one of his most trusted and top advisors, it's an amazing one. And so what I ask people is walk me through it. How did Rubio go from point A to point B? First, a reminder about point A. Marco Rubio ran for president against Donald Trump in 2016. It was a very big field and Trump, one by one, mowed folks down, both by beating them in primaries and caucuses, but also because he would challenge them in the debates and in press conferences and brought them, whittled them down to size through insults, humiliation, all the things that, you know, Donald Trump does. Rubio, along with John Kasich, was effectively the last candidates standing against Trump. And rather than do more of the same, which is when Trump would insult other candidates, they would try to turn the other cheek and they would say, oh, this is beneath the dignity of the office. Jeb Bush called Trump a chaos candidate, said he would be a chaos president. They tried to basically say, I'm not going to get in the gutter with Trump. They followed Bill Clinton's famous adage, when you wrestle with pigs, you get dirty and the pig likes it. Rubio at the end, when it was clear that he was likely going to start losing a string of primaries and caucuses and be driven from the race, decided to kind of go for broke and to insult Trump right back to see whether he could beat him at his own game. So here's Donald Trump insulting a Rubio, famously calling him Little Marco. That was the nickname he gave him. This is S3, please.
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You don't worry about it.
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Don't worry about it.
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Little Marco.
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Gentlemen, let's hear the gentleman. You ought to show up.
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D
Gentlemen.
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You got it. You got to do better than those. This guy has the number one.
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Mr. Trump, may I ask.
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I'd like to ask your policy. So that chaotic scene was from a debate. Rubio against Trump. And here's another one again, very typical from the 202016 campaign. Donald Trump calling Marco Rubio a lightweight is S4, please. Senator Rubio is a lightweight. We understand that he wouldn't be able to do this.
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D
He wouldn't know a trade deal from any other deal.
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And so that was typical of the way Trump would insult his opponents when anyone looked like they'd be a threat. And Rubio was hanging around. He'd done well enough in the primaries and caucuses and fundraising to be the primary final threat to Donald Trump. So Rubio, as I said, decided he would hit right back and call Trump schoolyard barnyard names, just as Trump had done to him. Here's the second most famous thing Rubio said about Trump during this period. He called him a con man. This is S5, please.
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C
And over. He's doing well in the polls. So I admit I'm an underdog. I asked people to join my effort@marcorubio.com so we can put a stop to this lunacy. We are not going to turn over the conservative movement to a con artist who was telling people one thing, but has spent 40 years sticking it to working Americans and now claims to be their champion.
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One of the.
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All right, so here's the most famous thing that Rubio said about Donald Trump in 2016. It speaks for itself, but basically, he mocked him for his small fingers and small hands. Marco Rubio, 2016. S8. S6, please.
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C
He's always calling me Little Marco. And I'll admit, the guy, he's taller than me. He's like 6:2, which is why I don't understand why his hands are the size of someone who's 5 2. Have you seen his hands? And you know what they say about men with small hands. You can't trust them. You can't trust.
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B
So that was a total failure because he cannot beat Donald Trump at the dozens. And Rubio shortly after got out of the race. And if you, if you think about kind of the caricature of Donald Trump, never forgiving, not being nice or accommodating to people who've insulted him, you'd think, well, now that Donald Trump's president in 2016, taking office in 2017, Rubio is done, right? He's not going to be a big player in Washington or in Republican politics. He was. He was the opposite of maga. Right? Well, Rubio changed. And, and it's testament to how smart he is and what a strategic thinker he is that he didn't just resign himself to saying, well, I'm going to be in the outs. He sat down, he looked at the map. He looked at the roadmap people had used to get back in Donald Trump's good graces and ripped it up and said, I'm going to have my own map. I'm going to build my own relationship to Trump. Or he changed his views on some issues, like on immigration. But he also recognized that for Donald Trump, the personal is the political and vice versa. And so a big key to this story of how Marco Rubio goes in 2016 to. To being at war with Donald Trump, to being one of his top advisers, now involves building relationships. And the most important relationship you can build in Donald Trump's world, even more important than directly with Donald Trump, is with Ivanka Trump, his daughter. You'll recall she was a policy advisor in the first term. And Rubio worked with her on family, medical leave, family policy issues, and built a great relationship with her, very close to her, worked in tandem with her, and that helped him a lot. That was the first big relationship that I think Marco Rubio built, according to my sources, in Trump world, that gave him a fresh start, had the president look at him in a different way. When Ivanka Trump says to her dad, this guy's a good guy, it made a big difference. So that was one relationship. Another relationship, he had built ties to J.D. vance. He and J.D. vance share a lot. They're young dads. They care a lot about the work, family balance. They also are modern Republicans, very digitally oriented. They understand social media, but they're also policy wonks. They also are in the business of politics because they care about politics, government, and about policy. And so that alignment with J.D. vance played a big role here. Then, his relationship with Susie Wiles, his fellow Floridian, Susie Wiles is A big fan of Marco Rubio. She tells People that all the time and has done a lot to help empower him with, within the administration, another close relationship, Stephen Miller. Stephen Miller has been very visible, very involved in policy related to Venezuela, but also a lot of the other foreign policy issues. Even though historically he's been thought of as a domestic policy guy, he and, he and Rubio have a very good relationship. So Susie Wiles, JD Vance, Ivanka and Stephen Miller all. And Rubio, as powerful as he's become, these dual hats, head of the State Department, head of the National Security Council, doesn't have a lot of enemies. Very similar to Vance, very unusual to be rising that fast, to take that much power, and yet to be so well liked. And then finally, Steve Witkoff, you know, you think about a normal Secretary of State, wants to be the big dog on the big thing things, and yet he's delegated with the president, you know, planning. He's allowed Steve Witkoff to be the key guy on the Middle east stuff at times, the key guy on Russia, Ukraine, at times. Not threatened by that. Rubio's fine with that. He's also, I'm told, very happy to get more time at home with his kids and his family, not to be constantly on planes flying around the world. So he's so well liked and so well respected that he's able to comfortably delegate stuff and to, and to share power. On this Venezuela story, he's really become an even more influential figure, if that's possible, because this is the moment that his whole life, not just his whole career, has been. He's been preparing for. Cuban American identity has really shaped his instincts about authoritarian governments in Latin America. Maduro is a, is a type that Rubio is so familiar with, a Latin American dictator who, who runs his nation's economy into the ground, who uses thuggish tactics to suppress people. He saw that in Cuba. He sees it throughout Latin America. He sees that in Maduro. The, the, the Venezuelans put out, allegedly put out a hit on Rubio many years ago. He hasn't forgotten that. He, this is personal for him. And he understands the whole thing of Latin America. He understands the customs, the, the historical figures, the dynamics, the language, of course, the culture. This is something that allows him, in conversations with his colleagues, including the president and the vice president, to have a level of authority because he's native to this. He understands it in a way that they, they can't, no matter how much they might study it. And then he also brings his national security experience, intelligence Committee experience. He's a top Republican there. All of that has boosted his credibility with the president, with the vice president given him authority to help execute the early days of this Venezuela policy. That's, I won't say unprecedented, but it's substantial. He also become a very strong television presence. The president famously likes when people go on TV and are good. Couldn't help but notice he did interviews not just with the Washington Post and the New York Times in the aftermath of the Maduro operation, but did the Sunday shows. And amongst the things he did on the Sunday shows, which again, Donald Trump values is he spoke very favorably about the boss. Here he is on a Sunday show from last weekend, S7.
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C
And all these countries in the region have about what's happening in Venezuela and our involvement is they're afraid of another mass migration event. That's what they fear. This is deeply destabilizing stuff. It's not going to continue to happen. They are not going to come from outside of our hemisphere Democratic destabilize our region in our own backyard and us have to pay the price for it. Not under President Trump.
- [16:43]
B
Now, what Trump loves most of all, I'm told, is people who are loyal without being overly sycophantic. You can judge for yourself whether sound bites like that are overly sycophantic. But Donald Trump has great trust in Marco Rubio. He trusts him personally. He trusts him in terms of policy expertise. He trusts him to execute loyalty on loyally on this very tough assignment. And people can't help but notice also the fact that he's been deferential to the vice president regarding 2028 and has said if his friend, truly his friend, J.D. vance, runs for president 2028, he'll support him. But the ambition remains, the ambition of a guy who has run for president in the past. And his career arc shows now over the last 10 years. He can play the long game. He was born to confront thugs like this. He feels ready to do this job, particularly with Venezuela. But around the world, he's been trained to figure out how to use both muscle and finesse, which Donald Trump truly appreciates. And I think what you're going to see now is Rubio maintain in this job a cadence and a level of responsibility that demonstrates he understands how to work for and with Donald Trump. And that leads me to my second area where my reporting suggests a piece that's been missing the story of Marco Rubio over the last decade. Incredible story. Another incredible story, I think, is how people missing the point about what's going on with Venezuela. And the wider story about The Don Roe Dr. Doctrine, the President's desire to have great influence in this hemisphere, but also the wider. The wider story about Trump's use of national security strength and foreign policy leverage to try to get the United States what it wants in Latin America, in Greenland, in Europe, in Asia. And that's the key word, leverage. I think people misunderstand the level of risk involved when you get leverage. And that's a key word for Donald Trump, and it's a keyword for Marco Rubio. Listen to how often he talked about leverage on the Sunday shows.
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We have leverage. This leverage we are using and we intend to use, we started using already, and we intend to use every element of leverage that we have to ensure that that changes. And we intend to use the leverage we have to help achieve that. And that's a tremendous amount of leverage that will continue to be in place. Jordan, I've explained again that the leverage that we have here is the leverage of the quarantine. The United States will retain multiple levers of leverage, so that leverage remains. That leverage is ongoing. This is tremendous leverage, incredible crippling leverage.
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B
So nothing demonstrates Rubio's understanding of Donald Trump's theory of the case about foreign policy and national security and, frankly, life, than the use of the word leverage. This is how Donald Trump has operated his whole life, first in business now and then politics, then in government. He's a genius. I don't use the word lightly at sizing up situations and saying, where's my leverage? I want to buy that building away from this person, or I want to win the Iowa caucuses, or I want to deal with Maduro. Trump sizes up the situation and says, where's my leverage? Where's my country's leverage? And how do we take that leverage and get what we want? Okay, when you operate with leverage, when you correctly analyze what leverage you have and then you deploy it, you. You insert it into the situation, your chances of victory are greater. Right? And Trump is a genius at figuring out what's our leverage, what's their leverage, and how do we use our leverage to greater effect than they can use their leverage. And avoiding situations as best he can where people have leverage over him or over the United States. In this case, the leverage comes from the ability to crush the economy of Venezuela, to intimidate the Iranian forces, the Hezbollah forces, the Chinese, Russian forces, and out of the country, to make it impossible for them to operate there, particularly around the oil economy. That leverage is. Is how Trump operates And clearly now how Rubio operates and how Rubio explains it, there's been all this confusion, apparent confusion, you know, when Trump says, who's running the country? You know, the people, he said standing behind him at the press conference on Saturday, Rubio and Hegseth and Miller and, and then, and then Rubio said, well, we're not running the country. Here's, here's how you deal with the confusion. They're using the leverage to get the Venezuelans who are in power to do what the United States wants, so they're not literally on the ground sitting in the presidential offices in Venezuela making decisions about the economy or government or regulation, whatever. They're saying to Venezuelans, we have leverage over you. We have the US Navy surrounding you, we have your economy cut off. And so you need to do what we tell you to do. That's what, what they mean by running the country. They say they're going to do what we want because we've got the leverage. And when you have leverage, the risk of unintended consequences is lower because that's the North Star. It's not what's going to happen when there's going to be an election or who's in control today versus who's going to be in control tomorrow. In Trump's worldview, again shared now by Rubio, executed by Rubio and others. As long as you maintain your leverage. As long as what the dynamic guiding the relationship in this case between the United States and the government, of the ad hoc government is Venezuela. As long as what's guiding it is driven by American leverage, again primarily fueled by the military. The US can get what it wants and there's no rush. You know, the press is always going to, you know, when's the election? When are you going to fix this? When's it going to be resolved? As long as Trump has the leverage, he's fine waiting it out. And the, the whole point of the presidency. Heard me talk about this before. The whole point of the presidency for decades now is how do you get leverage over China and Russia and over Netanyahu? A different category of leader, but still someone who resists operating by the United States, desires as much as he can when he feels he needs to. How do you get that leverage is you emphasize the strengths of the United States in the long term play here. The president wants to use the current leverage country by country, maybe to Greenland, but. But certainly in Latin America, country by country. Leverage to say, we can come in and take your leader if they've been indicted in the United States. We can blockade you. He wants the sphere of influence, the United States, classic Monroe Doctrine, to be gained through leverage and then the leverage that comes. Next step, leverage in controlling the hemisphere, to have more leverage over our enemies, our allies, our rivals, particularly China, Russia, Iran. This is. This is what Trump sees. There are risks, no doubt. I'm not endorsing the policy. I'm just describing to you what he does and what Rubio is doing. Leverage begets leverage. That's what's going on here. Watch it. All right, that's today's reported monologue. Your turn to tell me what you think. If you agree or disagree. Maybe I missed something in my analysis. Send me an email with your thoughts on what I just reported for you about both Marco Rubio and about the concept of leverage and intended consequences. Send me an email@nextup halpernmail.com Would love to hear from you. You can watch the show on YouTube every Tuesday and Thursday. You can also listen to us as a podcast. Go to the YouTube channel next up, so you can watch all the episodes there. Plus, their bonus clips were@YouTube.com NextUp Halperin. Please do that. And then if you prefer the podcast version instead, or in addition, you can subscribe wherever you get your podcasts, Apple, Spotify, wherever, turn on the downloads to make sure you get every episode right when it comes up. All right, next up is going to be back in just a minute. We're going to take a quick break, and then Kristen Davison and Kevin Wallen will be here. That's next up. 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All right, next up and joining me now to talk more about Venezuela and everything that's going on in 2026 as we start our year together. Republican strategist Kristen Davison and Democrat Kevin Walling, both great, generous folks with their time on this platform and on two way. Glad to have them here. Happy New Year to you both.
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D
Happy New Year, Mark Hey Kristen, glad.
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B
To have you both here. Kristen, start with you. I'm. I'm struck by how relatively calm everybody seems to be in politics, media, government, about the president, United States ordering the seizure of the leader of another country and de facto leader. And. And then all this talk about oil and everything else like this seems like massive geopolitical stuff, and people are treating it like, yeah, whatever, it's the next chapter in the Trump book seven or episode six. Do you get that same sense that people are treating this like kind of like business as usual as opposed to some epic matter?
- [29:17]
E
Yeah, it's. It's funny. I. I was talking with just a few of my friends, and we were joking. You know, 20, 25 years ago, we were in a totally different world, right? We had. If we were in this situation there, people would be protesting in front of the White House and, you know, college campuses would be full. But it has, I mean, and, I don't know, some of it is a little bit of the holiday fog. I think a lot of people tune out and don't necessarily grasp what's going on. But I think Secretary of State Rubio said it best. The Western Hemisphere is a lot different than the Middle east and other places, and so it has a little bit of grace there. I think the other component here is the legal aspect of it that makes it different. Not just going into a country and taking over leader, but the actual drug trafficking and legal implications there make it different. And also, he was a dictator hurting his country. And so there's that part, too. I do think that the outrage that we're missing now, I do think we'll see some of it. There are a lot of, you know, Congress is just getting back into town today. People are just getting back to work this week. I think as people start to learn more and wonder exactly what the phrase run the country means and boots on the ground is okay, I think those two things will be big questions in both parties. And so I think we'll see it bubble up a little bit as people start to tune in and, you know, get more information and as it develops. I mean, the Act 2 of a situation like this is almost more important than the Act 1. And so what happens with who takes power and how things progress, and whether or not the administration goes and moves into another country like has been discussed, I think will be the next round of this where we may see more excitement, both good and bad.
- [31:01]
B
Kevin if Yogi Berra were still alive, he would say prediction is difficult, especially about the future, especially about Donald Trump. So I don't usually like to make Trump predictions, but I don't think There's a chance in heck he'll put troops on the ground in Venezuela. He'd just walk away if he had to. But he's not going to get the United States involved in a forever war, or even a kind of forever war where Americans could die on the ground in Venezuela. Am I right? As the kids say.
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D
I mean, to quote Yogi Berra again, it's deja vu all over again, potentially with our American adventurism with regards to oil, where the president has made that kind of the centerpiece of his argument in recent hours and days about, and less so about the narco drug element. But really talking about the elements of oil and the 300 billion barrels that sit under Venezuela. Listen, I think part of this is his bluster. And we're seeing this play out with Greenland, Cuba, Colombia as well. I think he uses those kind of literary techniques when it comes to boots on the ground, things like that, to force change, to bully, to manipulate, to push. And we've seen that play out with the vice president now taking over as President Rodriguez changing her tune from the first hours after the incursion to take out Maduro to now where she is pledging some level of cooperation with President Trump in this administration. So I think, I doubt that there's any appetite in Republican circles, certainly not in Democratic circles, for serious boots on the ground. Again, that is also determinative with the conversations at Bergam and the energy secretary are having with the oil companies. Right. So there might need to involve some American element on the ground to make it safer and more willing for these oil companies to go in and extract that oil. But again, I think this is more of a literary flourish of the president, less so an actual commitment of troops.
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B
Maybe I'll be wrong, but the extent that American companies need security on the ground, to me, it's going to be the Venezuelan government, Venezuelan military, or it's going to be like Pinkerton's or Blackwater or somebody like that. It's not going to be the American military. Because. Because you say Republicans are concerned about boots on the ground. The Republican most concerned about boots on the ground is Donald Trump. He hasn't suddenly, I don't think. And even though you see this speculation, Kristen, he hasn't suddenly become like a neocon. He hasn't sud said this is a good thing for the country or a good thing for me politically. He's just, he's just liked it, liked the tactical strike and likes the Navy offshore. But he's not going to. He's not going to start putting American military at risk, is he?
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E
The only thing that makes me disagree with you is that Trump said it wouldn't be the worst thing. So he already opened the door in his remarks the morning after Maduro was captured.
- [34:00]
B
I'm going to. I'm politely interrupting you. Isn't that just pure bluster?
- [34:04]
E
I don't think so. I think he really.
- [34:06]
B
Wow. Okay.
- [34:07]
E
I mean, most, most people who you talk to that are way smarter than I am on this foreign policy in Latin America and how things work down there. I have not talked to one person who knows how this can be done without some form of military on the ground. Now, I don't think it's a huge. Doesn't need to be a huge military operation, but most people who study what's going on down there say you do need some sort of boots on the ground and it could be the private contractors that could solve it. But I am not as confident as you are that there won't be some component there. And as the President said, I think he wants to keep all options open. I do think, compared to other situations, if there is a component where boots are on the ground, it will be quick and there will be a deadline and there will be. It's not going to be one of these things. I don't think Trump. I agree with you. He's not going to have this ongoing where there's no end date and there's no clarity as to what their mission is. I think it might be maybe a month type thing to help companies get into place and settle and then leave.
- [35:10]
B
Kevin, one of the smartest things Bill Clinton ever said, and he said a lot of smart things, is in politics, it's better to be strong and wrong than right and weak. And one of the reasons every Republican I talk to is so giddy about the politics of this is, is because for Democrats to be critical of Trump on the Maduro piece, they have to basically come off like they're sounding like they're pro drug dealer. They have to come off like they're pro anti American military. So how does the Democratic Party get on the right side of being ideally strong and right on this as opposed to playing into the hands of the administration?
- [35:51]
D
Yeah, it's a really good question. You know, I've actually had a few conversations with Democrats running for Congress in terms of having to kind of thread this needle very carefully. And my advice to them is to say this is a good thing. Obviously, you've had Democrats in the past, Leader Schumer, others calling for the removal, the decapitation of Maduro and his regime in Venezuela going back years. And when the president does this, we can't just default to this autopilot opposition that you see a lot of Democrats playing out. If Trump does it, then it must be bad. So you can couch it in. This is a good thing for the people of Venezuela, the 28 million Venezuelans. It's a good thing for the 8 million Venezuelans that have been displaced since Hugo Chavez took over the regime back 20 plus years ago, but also still have legitimate concerns about where this goes and what the future is and getting some concrete answers in terms of what the actual plan is. You know, Donald Trump is the president saying one thing, we're in charge here, and Marco Rubio saying a very different thing in terms of working with the vice president, now president and keeping the regime in place. So, again, I think you've got to couch it in a little bit of a delicate dance here where we can't be pigeonholed on being on the side of a known narco terrorist who tortured Americans in captivity in the country. We saw it with Soleimani, other actions that the president has taken unilaterally, where he paints, puts Democrats in a box. Well, okay, so you weren't for taking out Soleimani, you know, the head of the ira. The IRA in terms of the industrial or the Revolutionary Guard in Iran, you know, same with Maduro. So there's got to be some semblance of nuance here with Democrats and their response.
- [37:43]
B
We could talk about Venezuela the whole time, but I want to switch to just kind of previewing the year a little bit because it's our first show of the year. Midterms in terms of politics and government will be a big point here in November. So 10 months away. Kristen, what are the big tentpole things you anticipate happening this year? State of the Union speech. You got a bunch of primaries and caucuses, but if you were to kind of forecast the rest of the year, what are the big things you're anticipating or looking for more?
- [38:11]
E
I'm going to be particularly, especially in this first quarter to see how many members retire. I think we'll see a number both Republican and Democrat. I don't think it's necessarily indicative on the environment. I think there are a number of members who are getting older, who have family health concerns. I think we'll see a number of retirements coming down the pike. I think the map, the second thing is, I think the map that we're looking at for both the Senate and gubernatorial races. So statewide is going to shift dramatically. And so conventional wisdom would have us go into the midterms saying Georgia and Michigan are the top two states. They both have Senate races, they both have gubernatorial races. I think come August, we're going to see other states emerge as being, you know, hotbed races. It could be Maine, it could be Arizona, it could be New Hampshire, it could be Kansas. So I think we're going to see a surprise state emerge for a statewide race that we'll be talking about. And maybe Georgia might fall to the backside or Michigan as not as one of the most targeted states. So I think we'll see that. And then the third thing will be is what my party, the Republican Party, does on health care. That's the biggest thing I'm watching. I think it's going to help shape everything. It's going to affect whether there's a government shutdown. I think that even this morning in some reports, people were saying the Senate is trying to get to a bipartisan deal, but they're not optimistic. That's really going to drive here in the next few months how we're going to round it out. Healthcare has now moved to a top three issue. It's an economic issue. It is no longer this abstract thing that we don't have to talk about. We have to deal with it. I'll be really watching that to see how it impacts the overall discussion, really the overall affordability discussion.
- [39:56]
B
Outstanding list. Kevin, what's on your list of things you're looking for this year?
- [40:01]
D
Yeah, I'm with Christian in terms of the role of health care. Obviously that's in the short term with the government shutdown looming at the end of this month. I'm also looking at the state of the economy. Right. You had really strong GDP growth in quarter four, but pretty sluggish job growth. So where does this all play out in advance and what does the economic picture look like in the summer, heading into the fall? I think retirements are key. As Kristen mentioned, we're going to see a number more of them. Obviously. We're also seeing a shrinking House majority for Republicans. So it's a question as to whether Speaker Johnson maintains, you know, control over his caucus. 218, maybe 217. And heading south, we've got some specials coming up in New Jersey. Other places, Mikey Sherrill's seat. So those numbers are going to get even closer. Is the rule by, you know, default in the House with discharge petitions going to be the case going forward? That's a question as well. And then where are the remaining states that are considering, you know, mid cycle redistricting? You know, there's a push now in Virginia. Does that pick up two or three seats? What do the maps ultimately look like in California? In Texas, again, there was a big gamble placed on, you know, the Latino vote coming out of 2024 and the major inroads that President Trump made with that community. What does that look like for the midterms? Do they come back home to the Democrats or do they stay in the president's column? So changing demographics, the final maps in terms of what they're going to look like, and the state of the economy are the three kind of big indicators for me heading into November.
- [41:32]
B
Those are two great lists. Gavin Newsom was the star of the Democratic Party in 2025, along with Mr. Mamdani, Mayor Mamdani here in Gotham City. Kristen, who would you forecast as the Democratic star of 2026?
- [41:47]
E
Well, I think the conventional answer would be Mondavi would be the star of this year. I'm going to go out there and give a real outside the box answer. I think Graham Platner in Maine is going to pop and be more of a national voice. Despite all his issues, I still think he's going to be a powerful force for the party.
- [42:05]
B
Kevin.
- [42:08]
D
That'S an interesting race that Christian brings up, of course, running against Janet Mills, the older kind of popular incumbent Democrat in that primary. My money's still on Gavin Newsom. Again, we'll see if it's, you know, sustainable heading into the midterms, if he can maintain this kind of national presence. Obviously, he's going on a book tour and talking about, excuse me, the wildfire situation and things like that. So we'll see if his star continues to rise over the next couple of months.
- [42:37]
B
We saw in 2024 two big pieces of the puzzle for the president's victory were Elon Musk's wallet and Turning Point. And both of those are changed in the sense that Musk's had a on and on and off again, relationship with the president. Not clear how much he'll spend. And Turning Point obviously is dealing with different leadership now in the, in the wake of the murder of Charlie Kirk. Kevin, how big a factor do you think those two things will be politically in the midterms?
- [43:09]
D
Yeah, I mean, I think both will certainly be a factor. Again, the biggest factor is not having Trump on the ballot. And you know, why Turning Point was so effective? I think in 2024 was rallying behind President Trump and energizing the youth around that, energizing different demographics. You know, reporting is, you know, Elon sat down with the president this past weekend in Mar a Lago to kind of repair that relationship. We'll see how much money he ultimately puts up, and again, we'll also see the economic factors involved with critical minerals and things like that, things that actually motivate Elon Musk's attention and where he puts his resources. But again, I think the best bet is to continue to see disagreements, I think, within Republican ranks when it comes to Elon and the role of this money kind of fueling some of these different House races.
- [44:02]
B
Kristen, I've. I've taken a vow not to predict what things will look like post Trump, because I think it's impossible to say. But in this, in this year, the establishment of your party has seen over the last 10 years, the establishment lose power to podcasters, to Elon, to. To turning Point. Is the establishment of your party comfortable with the reliance it has on these outside factors, or is that still a cultural clash?
- [44:33]
E
I think there'll always be a little bit of a cultural clash. Kind of like a teenager and an aging dad, you know, coming home late, missing curfew. I feel like there's a little bit of that. But overall, both can be right and both can be wrong. And so I think while the establishment might have issues with some of the tactics and, you know, their overall principle is you have to run a good campaign and you have to be able to persuade. And so both sides should really have that, that focus. You know, the issue with these large super PACs, I mean, we have seen it, you know, since Citizens United. I mean, it's been decades where we've seen them come into play. Large money, the critical thing here, particularly in a post Trump election, it was one thing when Trump was on the ballot. He's larger than life. A super PAC can exist in that space and really emphasize it here. We're going into a situation where you have so many different scenarios and so many different races, and every single one is going to have, you know, almost like a snowflake. They're each different. Each path to victory is going to be different. And so if you go with blunt force, with money and packs, and have the same playbook in every single congressional race in every single state, it is not going to be as effective. And so I think where both the old guard and the new guard can come together is really in this philosophy to let data drive things. I think everyone kind of believes that, and then to also be very targeted and specific in the role. If you have a super PAC that's going to spread wide and spread far and kind of do the same thing, it's not going to be as successful versus sticking to one thing and focus on it. So if they're just going to go and focus on bringing out low prop Trump voters, that's an admirable cause. Go and do that. Don't try to play in too many races where you're going to spread too thin and not be effective. So I think both sides need to kind of, that's not even both sides. I think we over talk this division at the same, you know, at the same time. The donor pool is not as big as people think. There's like a thousand people in the country that they give that amount of money. And so it's the same folks that have been given 20 years ago that are given today to these groups. So there's a lot of crossover, there's a lot of talking and I think ultimately everyone needs to come together with that philosophy that we need to be smart, we need to be targeted and not try to do too much too, too hard. If that makes sense.
- [46:38]
B
Yeah, it does. Really well said. Lastly, AI I'm just so fascinated with AI as a technology story, as a business story, but also as a political, political story. A really important story in Politico a couple days ago about how the Democrats are so divided about whether to be pro AI or anti AI or what the posture should be. I think the Republicans are pretty divided too. Not as divided because the president sets the tone and along with David Sachs has turned the party into a pretty pro AI party. So AI is a political issue that candidates and parties can talk about. It's also a tool that campaigns can use. So just got a minute left. So briefly, which party will benefit more from AI in both ways as a political issue and as a tool in 2026 and why, which party will benefit more in this year from AI? Kevin.
- [47:27]
D
I think Democrats will. Again, you're seeing some internal divisions within Republican circles with this executive order from President Trump kind of superseding a lot of what the states are doing on this. And I think Democrats can effectively message that this is somewhat of a kind of a hostile takeover. You know, putting down any kind of efforts from the states that we've seen from the, from the White House.
- [47:50]
B
Do you. So you think it will be a better political issue for your party? Do you have any sense, is your part, is your party going to be able to harness AI Effectively as a tool this year.
- [48:00]
D
I think they are.
- [48:01]
B
Which would be, which would be a little bit hypocritical, but whatever. Yeah.
- [48:04]
D
I mean, you're seeing it already in field operations. Right. In voter contacts. Groups like Swing Left and others are kind of going down the path of bringing AI into the fold when it comes to voter contact at the doors, calls, canvassing, what have you. Again, it's still in its, its infancy, I think, though.
- [48:21]
A
Yeah.
- [48:21]
B
Kristen, I'm neither a predictor nor a mind reader, but I bet you think your party is going to be at the edge on AI.
- [48:26]
E
100%. I think we already are. And so here's, here's the difference. And it's just wild to see. Just didn't even, you know, I'm not that old, but I'm older. Just to see in my career how the parties have shift, shifted just in their tone on this. Republicans take more chances now, you know, back in the day, we really didn't do that. We were very careful, very B.C. trump has really opened us up to allow to take more chances. I mean, even during the presidential primary, you saw AI used in ads both on TV and on social media, and the press would, you know, they would lose their minds over it. But that just got the ad to go five more paces further. You're already seeing AI already been used two cycles now in the field. For us, it's going to keep evolving, keep getting better. But I mean, you know, I think there's so many opportunities where we as a party are not afraid to push the envelope, where Democrats have shown they're a little bit more cautious about it. I mean, just look, I mean, you had that Virginia attorney general, governor's race last year where the Democrat who won had some really terrible text messages. In this cycle, if that were the case, I think you'd probably see someone do an AI ad where they had a voice to those text messages that sounded like that guy and put it, put it on tv. So we're going to see a lot of things like that. It's going to be very controversial, but it's going to be newsworthy. And in a cycle that, you know, last an hour, if that AI is going to reign, I think Trump has really freed our party to go and take chances like that.
- [49:40]
B
Yeah, very, really brilliant point. And I'll just say the third way AI matters is money. Right. Because a lot of these very rich people who have a stake in AI are going to give way more to Republicans. Kevin, I'll just say, with respect, I think I'M not predicting it. It's possible the story of this year is going to be how your party falls horribly behind in all three areas. Maybe not that will be the case, maybe maybe not on the rhetoric because your party has some strong points. The anti AI wing has some strong points. The data is quite clear. A lot of people don't like the, the, the, the big data farms and the power that's required to run them and they don't like billionaires and a lot of the AI people are billionaires. But the Republicans have some points as well. And I, my sense, it's hard reporting to do, but my sense is right. Republicans are being more risk taking as Kristen said, are incorporating it more so far in their campaigns and then, and then the money is just going to be for the AI community. This is an existential election. They, they need to, they need to do well. And like we've seen with tech in the past when they decide student body right, we're going to spend to get our kind of candidates. And I think you're going to see again, this is a little bit ironic and, and it may be fitting. You're going to see AI made ads as Kristen suggested that they go after anti AI candidates in a really effective way. But we'll see. We'll see. But it's a huge story that I'm still trying to completely understand. Very grateful to you both. Happy New Year to you both and look forward to having you back throughout the year on the program. To Kristen and Kevin, thank you both.
- [51:14]
D
Thanks, Mark.
- [51:15]
B
All right, next up, the great Jessica Reed Kress. She's next up. Stay tuned. If you're a homeowner in America, you need to listen to this. The FBI is warning about a type of real estate fraud that's on the rise. It's called title theft and your equity is the target. Here's how it works. The criminals forge your signature on a single document. Then they use a fake notary stamp and file it all with the county. And just like that, on record, they own your home using your ownership. They can then take out loans against your equity or even sell your property. And you won't know about any of this until foreclosure notices or collection notices show up in your mailbox. That's why I'm partnered with Home Title Lock, so you can protect your equity. And find out today, right now, if you're already a victim, use my promo code. Mark, @hometitlelock.com you'll get the free title history report and a free trial of their million dollar triple lock protection. That includes 247 monitoring of your title records, urgent alerts to any changes, and if fraud does occur, their US based restoration team will spend up to $1 million to fix it. Don't be a victim. Protect your Equity today. That's hometitlelock.com promo code mark or you can use the link below. Sling is the live TV service that puts you in charge. Choose your plan. Orange for sports and entertainment favorites, BL for news and reality. Or select for the essentials. Only pay for the stuff you actually watch and pause your subscription anytime. Because paying for TV or not watching, that's just rude. No long term contracts, no nonsense. Pick your plan, add what you want. Sling lets you do that. Visit sling.com to learn more. All right, next up and joining me now, Jesco Recrest. If I could be cloned, I would have my clone spend every day with Jessica Reed Kraz because she is one of the most talented and best people I've ever met. She's a writer, a photographer, a videographer, a thinker, a creator, a connector, and the producer of content. Her house and habit substack her Instagram and everything she makes is like spun gold. Jessica Reed Krause, thank you for being here.
- [53:38]
A
Wow, Mark, that's. I've never had a better introduction.
- [53:41]
B
I've just.
- [53:43]
A
Thank you.
- [53:44]
B
Ever since we met and ever since I started taking in your content, I've told you this directly. I just for someone who didn't have a career in journalism or content creation, raising for rambunctious and gorgeous boys and then all of a sudden for several years now just just being so prolific in the amount you produce, but really more the quality of what you produce. I just am astounded by it. Every time you publish something. I just blown away by the degree to which you can produce things, multimedia things that are just masterpieces. So I'm always honored to have you on.
- [54:24]
A
Well, thank you, Mark. That means a lot, truly.
- [54:27]
B
So not everybody's familiar with your work but you. You started out covering a bunch of stuff and now you cover a bunch of stuff in, in your content. And you have a community that I think would be happy to read you on any topic. What are your interests in stuff you want to cover and create for 2026? Where will, where will you be going and what will you be telling stories about and who will you be telling stories about?
- [54:52]
A
Well, I, the problem is I feel like I kind of got stretched too, too thin as far as my interest. I was covering way too much 25. Are we in 2026? Yes. Yeah, I, So I kind of want a fresh start. I would like to maybe pull away from politics a little and go back to the trial coverage. That's, that's what I love the most is being on site for any of these high profile trials. And there's, there's a handful of them coming up, so I'll probably go back to that. And then I do want to go maybe do some features, like profiles on some of the women in the administration. If I'm in D.C. for that. I just, I, I think I'm doing the trials, I'm doing. What else?
- [55:40]
B
Well, let's start with trials. What trials are on Tap for 2026 that you're interested in? Mangione?
- [55:47]
A
No, I'm. I'm oddly not interested.
- [55:49]
B
Okay.
- [55:50]
D
All right.
- [55:50]
E
Yeah.
- [55:50]
B
All right, so which ones?
- [55:52]
A
Okay, so I've got the Alexander Brothers. Starts the end of this month. Do you know what's going on with that?
- [55:58]
B
I think I do, but tell me.
- [56:00]
A
Well, it's the three brothers. They're charged with, like, rape and drugging women.
- [56:05]
B
Oh, no, I was thinking of a financial thing. What, where, what, what state is that in?
- [56:10]
A
That's in New York. So I'm going to go follow these brothers. They're real estate tycoons.
- [56:14]
B
Okay, I know, I know, I know that case. There's three of them who are charged, or two of them.
- [56:18]
A
There's three. I think there's three brothers involved.
- [56:20]
B
And when does that start?
- [56:21]
A
That starts on the 27th. And then we have the Reiner, Rob Reiner's son.
- [56:27]
B
Right.
- [56:28]
A
I'll be there tomorrow for his arraignment, I believe, and he'll be there in person. So that's going to be really interesting because I think they're going to probably call in a lot of those celebrities who were at the party the night before. So we have that. And I don't love the murder trials, you know, it's not really my thing, but I think it's because it's in LA and it involves so many of these celebrities, it's going to be interesting. What else do we have? Trying to think who else is in trouble.
- [57:00]
B
And, and the Alexander.
- [57:02]
A
Charlie Kirk.
- [57:04]
B
Yeah, Alexander 1. Sometimes you, you, you have found holes in prosecution cases and at least intellectual sympathy for the defendants in that case. Do you think they're being unfairly charged or not?
- [57:20]
A
So, you know what was interesting about that one is usually what I do is I open up my inbox and I let sources come in and tell me what they think about the cases before they start to get a sense of who these people are. And in their case, I didn't really have anyone defending them. So I, I actually met, I think it was their PR guy. I was in the Harvey Weinstein trial last year for some, some hearing or maybe it was the verdict. He's been in court so much it's hard to keep track. But I met the PR guy and he was telling me about the, you know, the Alexander brothers and what was coming up. But so I looked into them and it was an interesting case, their family, the whole thing. But I haven't had anyone come forward to say, like, they're getting this wrong. So it's probably the only case where I can think that's okay.
- [58:07]
B
One case that's not expected to come to trial but is in the news that you've tracked brilliantly is Maxwell. And whether she is going to be released or pardoned or what her fate will be. What do you anticipate for her in 2026 as she waits to see whether she gets her verdict overturned or gets a pardon?
- [58:28]
A
Well, for me it's been a very fascinating turn of events with, you know, when they sat down with Todd Blanche sat down for the proffer and they finally interviewed Ghislaine Maxwell and nobody really listened to it. She actually did. I did. I listened to it twice because I had been waiting there, there was, I had gone so deep into the case and there was all these little holes and I felt like she, her, her side of it kind of filled a lot of those in. But I just, I mean, I am endlessly fascinated by her just because she's lived so many different lives. Like, I don't know, another woman who has gone through so many phases. We all know just the Jeffrey Epstein tenure decade. Right? But I mean, she's, she's lived many, many chapters and so, and she's brilliant. She speaks seven languages, she has a submarine license, a helicopter license, a pilot's license, an EMT license. And I just feel like nobody ever really investigated her beyond that 10 year.
- [59:32]
B
Yeah, your piece about her was so good because you not only listened to the thing, but you do have an archival sense of her history that you just hinted at. And your eye for your own photographs is incredible. But your eye for other people's photographs, the way you find great historical photographs is also just otherworldly. Has anyone written a great biography of her? Book length piece of better?
- [59:58]
A
No, because only so far it's been one. It's been one narrative. And you get that on repeat. And then the couple I've read are not just not great. She has a friend who writes for Airmel. Her name's Vashti Chamberlain. I think Vasti. She, she's written the best pieces on Ghislaine because she's known her from college. But I, yeah, I would, I like writing. I mean, she, she checks all the boxes. It's like this family dynasty, Freudian tragic cycle, you know, And I think she's interesting because she, her power was in not only like sexualizing these women who are part of Jeffrey Epstein's orbit, but also in herself. You know, she was, she definitely, you know, she had all these crazy dinner parties and stuff, teaching women how to control men through sex.
- [60:57]
B
Yeah.
- [60:58]
A
So.
- [60:59]
B
Well, let me just ask you. I, I, I'm, I, I again, you've opened my eyes to a lot of, of that story through, through the work you've done. But I'm still puzzled. First of all, do you know why she got moved to a minimum security prison? Have you solved that?
- [61:14]
A
Do you want me to tell you what I think?
- [61:16]
B
Yeah.
- [61:19]
A
I think that Donald Trump was very close to Ghislaine Maxwell, just like everybody in that area, location in Palm beach especially. I think he knows her well and I think he appreciates that she is fair to him because you see what happens with something like the birthday book, right? Like, of course, Donald Trump probably sent Jeffrey Epstein a birthday message and that caused such a stir. And I just feel like it doesn't take much to rattle media and they're going to twist whatever they have. And I think what Trump cares about loyalty above all else, and I just think he is, I don't think he thinks Ghislaine Maxwell is a monster. I think he knows her very well and I think there was maybe some kind of a deal made where she sat down and answered all these questions and they said, you know, we're gonna, I mean, I think that's where she should be in a low security prison. I've been to that prison before.
- [62:16]
B
Yeah. Do you think she'll be pardoned or commute, have her sentence commuted this year?
- [62:22]
A
I'm going to, I'm going to risk it. I'm going to say that he's going to commute her on his last day.
- [62:30]
B
Or his last week of his presidency.
- [62:34]
A
Of his presidency.
- [62:35]
B
Okay. And, and you, you're in regular dialogue with the man who was Jeffrey Epstein's cellmate. And, and do you talk to his brother also? I can't remember.
- [62:45]
A
I talked to Jeffrey Epstein's brother. Yes. And they. So the two men have conflicting views about how he died. And I wish. My goal is that they're going to talk, to sit down and talk about what happened.
- [62:57]
B
You don't think he killed himself, right? I don't think he killed himself.
- [63:02]
A
When I talk to you, I'm undecided. I go back and forth. When I talk to Nick, he makes sense. And I actually had someone who was part of the autopsy, one of the women. Well, actually I shouldn't. I'm not gonna say her name, but she said it was ruled initially forced suicide.
- [63:24]
B
Yeah.
- [63:24]
A
Which is interesting.
- [63:25]
B
Right? Why, why do you think President Trump has been so unenthusiastic about the release of the documents?
- [63:33]
A
Because I think he knows. I mean, when he says, oh, this is, this is a hoax. Right. Like it's, he's doing a terrible job at translating what he believes here. And I understand it because I do think it is a hoax. I went in thinking it was this sex trafficking, you know, global cabal, kids hidden in basements and stuff. It's not. And I think the files have proven. I mean, they've dumping millions of photos and files and emails and it's really kind of just a bunch of rich people gossiping about society scenes and, you know, you have pictures with Donald Trump and beauty queens and bikinis. But I just, I think he's, I think he's bothered by it. And I don't think he liked Jeffrey Epstein. I don't think they liked each other. And so I think he's annoyed that the ghost of Jeffrey Epstein is still, is still just harassing him.
- [64:26]
B
Yeah, I think he's irritated by it. Yeah. I could talk to you about that forever, but let's move on because there's stuff I still want to get to. Don Jr. You said you wanted to get away from politics, but you also said you'll dabble in the women of the administration. Is that wedding going to be in 2026? Where will it be and will one or both of us be there?
- [64:44]
A
I know, right? I think it's going to be in 2026. I think we're on a strict line. I think Bettina has a plans laid.
- [64:53]
B
Out and yes, she's never been married. Right.
- [64:57]
A
Bettina hasn't been married and yeah, I knew her before I knew that they were a couple. I really like her. It's going to be a fabulous, fancy, glamorous event and I think it'll probably be at the White House. Right.
- [65:07]
B
Well, or mar a lot could be mar a lago I think, because everyone.
- [65:11]
A
Gets married, I feel like it's too.
- [65:13]
B
Yeah. Okay, so. So Bettina, what's her last name?
- [65:18]
A
Anderson.
- [65:19]
B
Anderson. I only know her from Instagram and from your writing about her. Just. What's she like? Is she. She seems very funny, but, like, funny.
- [65:28]
A
And she's a. She's adventurous. So she likes a lot. She likes going to the cabin where he is at. Cabin in, in Florida somewhere. And they're always out hunting. And she's, she's really good with the kids. I've seen her with the kids. She was close to Vanessa, his ex wife. So they kind of are carrying on that, like, same dynamic where, you know, Donald Trump gets along with his exes and somehow they all make it work. And that seems to be the case here. But I think it's going to be a fun chapter. Bettina.
- [66:01]
B
So now if you get invited to the wedding, you're a multidimensional presence in the lives of Mar A Lago Palm Beach. If you get invited, are you going to go as a guest or are you going to bring all your content accoutrements and cover it?
- [66:19]
A
Mark, that's actually, that's a funny question because I think that's the. Every single event I attend, nobody knows if I'm there as a friend.
- [66:25]
B
Right. That's the idea to your. I went to your birthday party and all of a sudden I'm like, you know, posing for photos. So. But I'm asking because. Because I would want to read your coverage of the wedding.
- [66:37]
A
Well, I think if they're listening, they should invite me to the wedding because I think I would make fabulous content.
- [66:42]
B
Yes.
- [66:42]
A
And I, I would want to see the wedding through my lens. Does that make sense?
- [66:46]
B
Like, oh, I would want to see the wedding through your lens, too, and you're more likely to be invited than I am.
- [66:52]
A
Well, we'll see. We could. I'll take you as my date.
- [66:56]
B
So, so if, If Bettina said to you. Okay, I'm gonna hold you to that. If, If Bettina said, what month should I get married at the White House? When's a good month for a White House wedding?
- [67:06]
A
Well, I'm not a D.C. native. I don't know what. When is it pretty?
- [67:11]
B
Spring is probably cherry blossoms in the spring.
- [67:14]
A
What is it? What, what month are we in? January.
- [67:16]
B
We're in January. You wouldn't want, you wouldn't want it to be in the summer, I can tell you that.
- [67:20]
A
Are we gonna say, like, September?
- [67:22]
B
Yeah.
- [67:23]
A
Well, I do know there's another wedding. Dan Scavino. And Aaron Elmore. That's a White House wedding, I think. And I'll be, I think I'll be at that. So we, Yeah, I think this is what my audience wants. They want to see these wedding, all the details. They want to see the shoes and the flowers. And I mean, they live for this. Even, even people who are on the other side of politics, they will tune in for a, you know, glamorous wedding.
- [67:47]
B
Yeah. Now, I want to talk about your favorite topic. You. I know it's not your favorite topic, but it's my favorite because I'm fascinated by your business model and how it connects to your content and by your audience. And again, the first day we met at a book party that our friend Meghan McCain had for your friend Tulsi Gabbard. I know I wouldn't call her my friend just because I don't know her that well. Women age 22 and women age 80 came up to you and acted like they were meeting some combination of young Paul McCartney and Britney Spears. Like, they just, they just, they just look at you like they can't believe you exist. They can't believe that they're in your presence. So what, what is it that you provide your fans that they, they love so much? How would you describe it? Because again, it's, it's video, it's stills, it's writing. What is it that they see in you or they get from you, do you think?
- [68:46]
A
Well, I don't know that I know the answer to that, but I will say that I put a lot of effort into making them feel a part of everything that I do. And so that's why the behind the scene coverage works for me. And the whole idea with me getting into the White House to cover politics was taking all of these, I'm going to say women, because it's 90% women. I wanted to take all these women in with me. And so I guess it feels more like a community. And it's like they feel like they have one of them in there, and they know that I'm going to focus on the things that they want to see. They're going to want to see the, you know, the diamond rings we did. I just did a. When I was at Mar A Lago, those women were very happy to show off their giant diamond rings. Palm beach is like, you know, a gold mine for content and stories. Those women are, yeah, they're just natural born stars.
- [69:42]
B
Yeah. And, and they're, they're, they're, they're, they're interested in in visuals. In, in. In. In every respect. They're interested in what they wear, what other people look like in the setting of whether it's Mar a Lago or someplace else. It's just a, it's just a focus on visuals which is so good for you because you're brilliant chronicler of visuals through all your mediums.
- [70:08]
A
Well, I love that you notice that I take time and care with the photos because I actually that's a big part of it. And even if it's someone, if I'm writing about someone I don't like, and there are several, I will still always pick the best photos of them just because I want everything to be as pretty as possible. So even my knees are going to get flattering angles.
- [70:30]
B
Yeah. And there's the, that's the through line to me for, for your career. And by the way, I plan to write a, a biography of you, which is why I'm gathering data now. That's a through line. You started out House Inhabit. The name of your, of your substack and of your Instagram is. Was about designing and furnishing a home. Right. And, and, and the visuals of. For you and people can see it just in the limited shot behind you. Like your eye for visuals and, and, and the, the retro. I'm being inarticulate, but when I write the biography, it'll be better. Your ability to combine retro and modern imagery is. Is to me one of the keys to your success. You have a huge appreciation for hr. You love old magazines, you love the Kennedy era look. But you also are extremely modern in your sensibility. And the fusing of those two things is just not that common that someone can, can hold those ideas in their mind.
- [71:29]
A
When you think of that thesis, I think it's becoming. I love it. No, I love that you pick up on these things because they're very important to me. And I spend a lot of time making sure that everything that you're talking about is a seamless visual. And I love making videos. I like working fast. You know, I do even still doing scrapbooking, real scrapbooking. My favorite thing, like I wish somebody was just writing my newsletter and I, I just got to do the visuals, you know, because it's a lot. I'm doing the reporting, the editing, the arrangement and then the imagery, which is my favorite. And then the video. You know, the videos are a lot. I don't have help right now as far as putting together these reels and stuff, but I could do it all day long. I, I live for it.
- [72:16]
B
It's. Again, I just. People are going to. Who aren't familiar with your work are going to wonder about my gushing. But you're. You're a complete disorganized ditz, and yet you somehow. You somehow produce all this content that's at such a high quality because of your natural gifts, but also because you have such high standards, which somehow supersede your disorganized ditziness. I just. I don't even understand it. Oh, it's a huge compliment. What do you got there?
- [72:46]
A
All these old. So these are. I haven't seen these in. In years. These are from when my first son was born. These. You know, I even did videos. These little. What are they? CDs.
- [72:56]
B
Would you. Where'd you shoot those?
- [72:57]
A
On one of those little camcorders.
- [73:01]
E
Right.
- [73:01]
A
So I'm gonna take these, get them turned into whatever they need to be in modern media, and that's going to be a fun surprise. Those are the boys as babies, and I haven't seen them since they were filmed. So I just found those yesterday. But, yeah, I love. You know, I think if you're a person who cares about stories, you want to document, everything is in your path, so it's photos, too.
- [73:24]
B
All right. I said if I were cloned, I'd spend all my time with you because I'd just be like your assistant. If you were cloned and could send your clone to cover something or live somewhere for the next year and produce stuff that you wouldn't otherwise go, where would it be and why?
- [73:37]
A
If I could send my clown, like.
- [73:39]
B
To spend the year with Putin or to spend the year in Vietnam, like, what. What's the thing. What's the thing you'd like to cover?
- [73:47]
A
I'm going to send them to Brian prison, Federal prison. They're. They're going to cover Ghislaine Maxwell, Elizabeth Holmes, and all of the other random housewives who end up there.
- [73:57]
B
Now, would you. Would you do that? Would you apply for a job as a guard or would you try to break into the prison?
- [74:03]
A
I was trying to figure out, like, what crime I could commit. That would give me about, like, seven months in there. Like, is there a financial.
- [74:10]
B
That's awesome. Like, embezzle something or something?
- [74:13]
A
Yeah, I. I'm not smart enough to figure out what crime I would need to. But if I get curious enough, you might find me in a gray jumpsuit sitting down.
- [74:24]
B
Only you're only your. Only your clone. Your family needs you. People. Two types of. There are two types of people who are listening to this or watching this, People who are familiar with your work and are saying, oh, my God, this all makes sense. Or people who don't have any idea about your work and thinking, who is. What is Mark talking about? If people want to familiarize themselves with. With the magic you produce, like, what would you recommend? Not just going to your sub stack, but what's like a thing or two. They should look at that. They get the full Jessica experience.
- [74:54]
A
I mean, I don't know, Mark. Right now, it's like madness. I'm all over the place. I really need to streamline a little bit. It's like there's inmates and there's Palm beach socialites and it's the White House. And then it's like Candace Owen takedown. I'm everywhere right now. I need to. I don't know what represents me best right now. I think you know what's going to be fun is the Palm Beach Diaries. I'm going to start writing about all of these characters without naming any of them. Like, old style Kabot and Dominic Dunn. They went in and I mean, all.
- [75:28]
B
Right, so your best stuff is to come. They shouldn't go back and read any of the archival stuff.
- [75:32]
A
Forget it.
- [75:34]
B
Yeah. All right. House inhabit on substack. Jessica Reed Kress, follower on Instagram. And again, you don't have to agree with her philosophy or her politics or her point of view. Just as a matter of craft and, and, and chronicling the American experience, ain't nothing like it. Jessica, thank you for making time. Happy New Year. And I look forward to going to the wedding with you in whatever city.
- [75:58]
A
It'S in you to figure out what you're going to wear. So.
- [76:01]
B
I know what I'm going to wear, but I also know you might go back on your word, so just reaffirm. I'm your guest to the Don Jr. Wedding.
- [76:08]
A
All right, it's on.
- [76:09]
B
Awesome. Thank you. Great. Great to talk to you. Our thanks to Kristen and to Kevin as well as to Jessica for joining us today and to thank you for being back with us here in 2026. Looking forward to having a great year with all of the nexters. This is our first show of the year. Join us on Thursday for our second episode of 2026. Also remember, please be part of being a core nexter by subscribing to NextUp on YouTube or wherever you get your podcast. You want to be with us the whole year. You want to be a step ahead of everyone in knowing what's coming. Next up. Real talent is defined by what people can do, not where they learn to do it. So by stopping at the education section of a resume, you might throw away the perfect hire Skills first. Hiring helps you see talent others miss, like more than 70 million stars skilled through alternative routes, let their story unfold and gain a competitive advantage. Because hiring managers who start with skills are 60% more likely to find a successful hire. Hire Skill Skills first Learn why at tearthepaperceiling. Org, brought to you by Opportunity at Work and the Ad Council.