Why Democrats Refuse to Embrace Angel Moms, the True Health of the Economy, and Trump’s China Strategy

Summary

Podcast Summary: Next Up with Mark Halperin

Episode: Why Democrats Refuse to Embrace Angel Moms, the True Health of the Economy, and Trump’s China Strategy
Date: May 12, 2026
Host: Mark Halperin
Guests: Mitch Modell (ex-CEO Modell Sporting Goods), Trisha McLaughlin (former Assistant Secretary for DHS)

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Episode Overview

Mark Halperin delivers an in-depth, three-part analysis in this episode of "Next Up." The show begins with a reported monologue on America's divisions, focusing on why Democrats have not embraced "Angel Moms"—women whose children were killed by people in the U.S. illegally. The discussion then turns to the true state of the U.S. economy with business leader Mitch Modell. Finally, national security and the impact of AI on political ads are explored with Trisha McLaughlin.

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1. America's Divisions & Angel Moms

[00:22 – 24:41]

Main Theme

Halperin investigates why the Democratic Party avoids the issue of crimes committed by illegal immigrants ("Angel Moms" cases), a topic championed by Donald Trump. He explores the political, moral, and emotional dimensions, asking why these families aren’t acknowledged across the political spectrum.

Key Discussion Points

• The search for unity:
  Halperin notes that past presidents (Clinton, Bush, Obama) tried and failed to unite the country, with both parties blaming each other for today’s division.
  "Almost every day...I talk to people in red America and blue America...And typically they'll say, well, it's the other side's fault." [02:21]

• Trump's use of Angel Moms:
  Trump has supported Angel Moms since 2015, elevating their stories at rallies, policy events, and State of the Union addresses.

  • Example from the 2026 State of the Union:

    "Delilah Colburn was only five years old in June 2024 when an 18 wheel tractor trailer plowed into her stopped car...The driver was an illegal alien let in by Joe Biden..."
    — Donald Trump, [09:40]

• Democratic silence and framing:
  Halperin investigates why Democrats rarely acknowledge Angel Mom stories, both as a moral and a political mistake.

  • Democratic consultant Doug Friednash calls it a “huge blind spot” for the party. [07:30]

• Contrasting responses:

  • Biden and top Democrats respond with general statements on immigration, statistics, or deflection (e.g., focus on the overall crime rate or referencing Republican failures).

  • Example:

    "But as we know, the research is that documented immigrants commit far fewer crimes than anyone else."
    — Rep. Jayapal, [14:35]

  • Senator Warnock expresses empathy but immediately accuses the GOP of exploiting tragedy:

    "Let me just say that my heart goes out to this family...But it’s unfortunate that in this moment of grief, there are those who are trying to score cheap political points."
    — Sen. Warnock, [18:17]

• Halperin’s Analysis:

  • Democrats are missing an opportunity:

    "I cannot tell you how important this issue was to his [Trump's] election. And I can't tell you the level of resentment that people...feel towards Democrats and many of my colleagues in the media for not treating this issue the way it should be treated..." [19:29]

  • This should be a bipartisan issue; helping families should transcend political divides.

Notable Quotes & Moments

• "Grief must not be in vain. We must figure out how to keep this from happening." — Mark Halperin [19:46-20:00]
• "That should be as bipartisan as anything is in America. And the search for solutions to try to keep it from happening again should be as well." — Mark Halperin [21:53]

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2. The State of the U.S. Economy – Interview with Mitch Modell

[24:41 – 41:50]

Main Theme

Mark Halperin interviews Mitch Modell about the confusing signals in the U.S. economy. They explore current strengths, ongoing challenges, and innovations in different industries.

Key Discussion Points

• Mitch Modell’s Business Background:

  • Built Modell Sporting Goods into a regional powerhouse based on service and community values.
  • Now involved in affordable housing (with methods to rapidly build housing), global sourcing, a new laundry service for college towns, and oat milk slice production.

• On Current Economic Strengths:

  • "Embrace AI. You have. You can't fight it. ... It's driving the economy, it's going to drive productivity." — Mitch Modell [32:53]
  • U.S. leads in AI investment/adoption.

• Biggest Economic Problems:

  • “I think it's about uncertainty. People like certainty. ... Whether it be tariffs, whether it be any...legislation, rulings...people need to feel certainty." — Mitch Modell [34:02]
  • The Iran War’s impact on oil prices and consumer costs.
  • Housing shortages due to U.S. steel costs and slow permitting—his company offers a turnkey, international sourcing solution.

• Local vs. National Issues:

  • Halperin and Modell discuss NY vs. Florida (sports, water, bagels), with Modell citing tax, climate, and quality of life for his move.

• Model’s Rules for Business Success:

  • "Understand what your reason for existence is. ... You gotta have a purpose, you gotta have a mission, and you have to have values." — Mitch Modell [40:00]
  • Remain optimistic and invest in American manufacturing.

Notable Quotes & Moments

• On leaving New York:

  "I always say Florida's worst day is better than New York's best day. Even when it rains here, it's cheerful..." — Mitch Modell [36:37]

• On values:

  "If Models went away, who would miss us? I never thought they would allow us to go away." — Mitch Modell [40:20]

Segment Timestamps

• [24:41] – Modell interview begins.
• [32:53] – AI’s impact on the economy.
• [34:02] – Economic obstacles & uncertainty.
• [35:17] – Housing supply crisis.
• [40:00] – Modell’s rules for business.

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3. Trump’s China Strategy and US–China Summit

[41:52 – 52:06]

Main Theme

Halperin previews President Trump’s trip to China for a high-stakes summit with Xi Jinping, exploring the strategic and cultural differences, and what's realistically on the table.

Key Discussion Points

• Cultural differences:

  • Trump understands the need to "save face;" U.S. approach is less scripted than China’s.
  • Chinese planners value stability, predictability; U.S. tends to operate more on the fly.

• Different time horizons:

  • Trump (limited political timeline) vs. Xi (essentially unlimited).
  • U.S. focuses on the next year or two; China plans decades ahead.

• Summit Goals:

  • U.S.: Economic agreements, more market access (especially for financial services), AI regulation, human rights, Iran.
  • China: Stability, world dominance, movement on the Taiwan issue.

• Domestic angle:

  • Treasury Secretary Scott Bessant is key to the economic negotiations.

• Overall outlook:

  • Little expectation of major Iran progress, more likely economic agreements.

Notable Quotes & Moments

• "AI is going to be on the formal agenda at this summit, unprecedented historically..." — Mark Halperin [45:30]
• "The U.S. thinks about this year, next year...The Chinese think in 10 years, 25 years, 100 years." — Mark Halperin [43:45]

Segment Timestamps

• [41:52] – US-China summit segment begins.
• [45:30] – AI featured on the agenda.
• [50:00] – Deliverables and expectations.

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4. The Growing Role of AI in Politics & Security – Interview with Trisha McLaughlin

[52:06 – 68:24]

Main Theme

Halperin and McLaughlin discuss how AI is reshaping political campaign ads and address domestic security for large events post-9/11, ahead of the World Cup and the Republican convention.

Key Discussion Points

• Midterm Elections & Iran War:

  • Gas prices are a concern but not the determinative midterm issue; the Democratic brand is “incredibly diminished.”

    "Democrats don't have a vision, they don't have a leader, and their brand is incredibly diminished." — Trisha McLaughlin [53:39]

• Political Ads & AI:

  • Virality depends on emotion, authenticity, and playing to the candidate’s strengths.

    "People can immediately smell out fake and phony." — Trisha McLaughlin [55:48]

  • AI-generated ads are increasingly cheap, fast, and hard to detect—raising risks for late-campaign attacks and misinformation.

  • On AI escalation:

    "I think it's mutually assured destruction with some of these ads. ... My recommendation...is I would come up with an ad of the opponent myself." [60:07]

• Campaign prep & defense:

  • Need for war rooms, rapid response, and influencer/“surrogate networks” to push back against disinformation.

• Security at Public Events:

  • DHS and TSA have modernized; "no fail" mission at events like the World Cup.
  • "America 250" events and FIFA will have top-level, modern screening.
  • On vigilance:

    "We are told time and time again in these briefings, that's what it really comes down to—is when lives are saved, it's so often just an everyday person who sees something." [66:30]

• General optimism & patriotic duty:

  "Don't bend the knee to terrorists. ... Go, be vigilant, have a great time with your friends and family." — Trisha McLaughlin [65:48]

Segment Timestamps

• [52:06] – McLaughlin interview begins.
• [54:19] – What makes viral political videos.
• [56:18] – Use and risks of AI in campaigning.
• [64:33] – Security at major public events.
• [66:30] – What “be vigilant” means in practice.
• [68:16] – Halperin closes the show.

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Memorable Quotes – Quick Reference

• "If Models went away, who would miss us? I never thought they would allow us to go away." — Mitch Modell [40:20]
• "AI is going to be on the formal agenda at this summit, unprecedented historically..." — Mark Halperin [45:30]
• "Don't bend the knee to terrorists. ... Go, be vigilant, have a great time with your friends and family." — Trisha McLaughlin [65:48]
• "Grief must not be in vain. We must figure out how to keep this from happening." — Mark Halperin [19:46]

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Summary Table of Sections and Timestamps

| Topic | Key Speaker(s) | Timestamps | |------------------------------|-----------------------|---------------| | Angel Moms & National Division | Mark Halperin, D. Trump, Doug Friednash, Sen. Warnock | 00:22 – 24:41 | | Economy & Business | Mark Halperin, Mitch Modell | 24:41 – 41:50 | | Trump’s China Strategy | Mark Halperin | 41:52 – 52:06 | | AI, Political Ads & Security | Mark Halperin, Trisha McLaughlin | 52:06 – 68:24 |

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For more details or to listen to specific discussions, use the timestamps to jump to each segment.

Transcript

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[Mark Halperin]

Hey, everybody, welcome. This is Next up with Mark Halperin. I am Mark Kalperin, editor in chief of the live interactive video platform 2way and your host here for about an hour as we talk through all the latest news information and always with an eye directed straight ahead over the horizon to what's next up. Grateful to you for being here. Two great guests and a couple of monologues, including my reported monologue on the divisions in America and an opportunity to try to heal them. First up after the monologue, next block, the former owner and CEO of Modell Sporting Goods, Mitchell Modell. He's a legendary business figure in New York and has moved to Florida. We're going to talk about the environment in the United States now for business. And then former assistant Secretary for Homeland Security Trisha McLaughlin will be here to talk about all the latest use of AI and political ads and whether you're safe with your family going to the World Cup. Eager to talk to them both, but before they come in, my reported monologue on the question of Americans coming together around something that really should unite everybody, which is the tragic story of Americans assaulted, often killed by people who are in this country legally and the Democratic Party's failure to grapple with it, but as a political issue, but also as a moral issue. Every time I speak now, just for the last 20 years or so, out in public or online, I get almost always get a version of the same question, what could bring the country together? And I always say, well, if we weren't brought together by Bill Clinton, George W. Bush and Barack Obama, it's going to be hard to do because those three guys were by inclination and history and intention determined to bring the country together as president. And each of them left office with the country more divided than before. And almost every day here on two Way and all my other stuff, I talk to people in red America and blue America, whether they're everyday Americans or political elites. And typically they'll say, well, it's the other side's fault. And if they're Republicans, they'll say it's the fault of the media and the Democrats that were divided. And if it's the Democrats, they'll say it's the fault the Republicans were divided. And honestly, both sides have some pretty good examples. President Trump is a divisive figure. And then Republicans will say, well, maybe you shouldn't have tried to put him in prison when he was running for president and was the front runner. Democrats will say, look at January 6th, a dark day in American history. And Republicans will say, how about the riots in around Covid? Both sides, as I say, have great examples. But last week, President Trump did something at the White House, which around Mother's Day, for Mother's Day, that really set me off on a round of intense reporting with folks to try to understand just one issue. And it's of a piece with a lot of issues related to President Trump's success, right? I hear all the time, all the time, all the time from Democrats, how could people support Donald Trump? How could someone support someone horrible? And I'll say, well, rather than approach it with incredulity or darkness in your heart, try to understand your fellow Americans who allowed Donald Trump to win the popular vote, who still support him. Some of it's because of a positive agenda, but a lot of it, a not insignificant amount of it, is because of Democrats failure to grapple with issues that really are passionately important to tens of millions of Americans. And one of them is an issue that I've heard Donald Trump talk about now for over a decade. It's people whose loved ones were killed by people in the country illegally. That was a big focus of the President's Mother's Day lunch in the Rose Garden last week. And here's some of what he said to those angel moms who were present and whose lives were changed forever by a criminal in the country legally. S5, please.

[Donald Trump (clips)]

With us this afternoon are a number of the angel moms who saw their precious children stolen from them by the open border policies of the radical left. Open borders, I call them stupid borders, not open. I call them stupid borders. Many of them murdered more than one person. What a shame. What a disgusting shame. That people can even think that this is okay is pretty incredible.

[Mark Halperin]

But now, not everyone loves Donald Trump's bedside manner, but he has spoken passionately with purpose and knowledge for over a decade now about these angel moms and other family members in this position. And one of the things that struck me early on about the Trump rallies starting in 2015, when his campaign team would arrange for members of this horrible community, just tragic community, to come appear with them at the rallies. Here's the president in 2015 at a rally in Phoenix with an angel mom. S15, please.

[Donald Trump (clips)]

I'm going to ask all of the angel moms to come join me on the stage right now. These are amazing women.

[Advertisement Voice]

Bye.

[Donald Trump (clips)]

Go ahead.

[Trisha McLaughlin]

Laura Wilkerson. And my son was Joshua Wilkerson. He was murdered by an illegal in 2010. And I personally support Mr. Trump for our next president. My name is Ruth Johnston Martin. My husband was shot by an illegal alien. He fought the good fight, but he took his last breath in 2002. And I support this man who is going to change this country for the better.

[Mark Halperin]

Now, if you're listening to the audio version only, you didn't see those beautiful family members wearing T shirts with their loved ones images on them. And one of the things that most struck me as I traveled around to Trump rallies in over 30 states in 2015 and 2016 was the, not just the emotion in the audience when the president would bring those families on stage, but how aware the members of those communities were of these cases, even if they happen in a different part of the country. They knew the names, they knew the circumstances of the crime. My colleagues in the media rarely did, but the people who supported Donald Trump did. And, and they weren't just saying, I'm going to support Donald Trump because someone with tragedy in their life supporting Donald Trump. They said, this is a matter of public policy. The reason these people's loved ones were killed was because open borders of the Democrats allowed them to come in here. And very powerful, very powerful. And I wondered, would the Democrats ever get the joke on this, the politically right thing? And the morally right thing would be to learn about these families, to reach out to these families, to maybe include them in their discussions of public policy, to maybe try to make common cause with them about how important it is to make sure this never again happens to a single American family. I'll say again, there are plenty of things that Donald Trump and Republicans have done that I understand why they cause outrage amongst Democrats. But on this one, I have still not been able to understand why wouldn't the Democrats do both the politically right thing and the morally right thing and say, President Trump is right? These families have just been put in such a horrible position, and we need to understand how Democratic policies may have contributed to this. So the night the president had that event at the White House that I showed you, I wondered, how much coverage would it get in the dominant media? Next to none, really. None, as best I could find. But I'm sure there's some I couldn't find. Can you imagine if Barack Obama had an event with families who'd suffered such tragedy? We'd get more coverage. So on two way tonight, I had on a very reasonable, very, very smart Democratic consultant, Doug Friednash. And I asked Doug, what's the deal with your party and these families? Here's what he said. This is S2, please. Have you ever heard a prominent Democrat talk about angel moms in the last decade? I have not. Yeah, why would that? Why? I'm not picky on you, but you're the Democrat here. Why not? Why wouldn't, why wouldn't Joe Biden have called Lake and Riley's family? Why, why wouldn't Democrats say how outraged they are by this? It's a fair question. And I think it's a huge blind spot for the Democratic Party. All right. A huge blind spot for the Democratic Party. I appreciate Doug Fresh being so honest about it because blind spot's a good word. Again, moral blind spot and political blind spot because Donald Trump didn't just talk about this issue in 2015 and 2016, he talked about it in the White House. He talked about it when he was running again in 24, and he's talked about it since he got back to the White House. Here's President Trump in the 2026 day the Union Address, once again highlighting a family of tragedy. S4, please.

[Donald Trump (clips)]

Delilah Colburn was only five years old in June 2024 when a 18 wheel tractor trailer plowed into her stopped car traveling at 60 miles an hour or more. The driver was an illegal alien let in by Joe Biden and given a commercial driver's license by open borders politicians in California.

[Mark Halperin]

So here's a political issue, a personal issue, a family issue, an issue of crime that Donald Trump has been scoring political points on for over a decade. And highlighting families. I don't know every particular of every case, although I've read a lot about them and talked to people connected to them. But there's no doubt that, that whatever you think of Donald Trump, these families deserve to be acknowledged. These families cases deserve to be highlighted, the facts deserve to be understood and we need to find better policies just to make sure as best we can that not one other American family deals with this, has to deal with this. And what we get from the Democrats is not acknowledgement, including acknowledgment of Democratic policies that have contributed to this over the years under Barack Obama, under, under Joe Biden, but also an acknowledgment that it's important to celebrate these families, to acknowledge them, to help them full stop. Not hedging, not, not changing the subject to things they don't like about Donald Trump. But instead, what we have is, and again, my colleagues and I did a lot of searching and, and you heard me ask the Doug Friednash there. You can't find almost any cases of Democrats on their own bringing these issues up or even, even when asked by reporters to do the right thing. And it's the right thing for these families, but it's also the right thing for the Democratic Party politically, I would say. But it's also the right thing for the country because we can't keep turning every issue into a red blue divide. And, and I would, I would contend that even though the politics of the border are implicated in this, there should be no red blue divide on helping these families and on looking for policies to keep this from happening again. So Donald Trump, in almost every State of the Union address, he's given a speech to Congress, he's highlighted these families, he's had the family sitting in the box with the first lady, he's talked about them. And many people, not just in maga, many people who voted for the president can tell you the stories of what's happened. Probably the most famous is Lake and Riley, the young woman who was killed in Georgia. Okay, that's probably the most famous. Here's Joe Biden when he was asked about Lake and Riley. Sorry. When he was speaking about Lake and Riley in his State of the Union address. This is in 2024, right before the election. Here's. He's heckled. Wasn't, didn't seem he was planning to bring her up. Then he gets heckled about Lake and Riley. Here's Joe Biden. Number S1, please. To her parents, I say, my heart

[Donald Trump (clips)]

goes out to you. Having lost children myself, I understand. But look, if we change the dynamic

[Mark Halperin]

at the border, people pay people, people

[Donald Trump (clips)]

pay these smugglers 8,000 bucks to get across the border because they know if they get by, if they get by and let into the country, it's six to eight years before they have a hearing. And it's worth taking the chance of

[Mark Halperin]

the $8,000 in that moment and in his overall treatment of Lake and Riley and her family, it was not equal. It was, it was not the same as what President Trump has done. I say that objectively. Here's a couple members of the House asked about situations involving violence against illegal immigrants, and look how they handle it. These are Democrats. Here's Summer Lee asked by a reporter about a case of a 12 year old girl in Houston who was tortured by people in the country illegally.

[Trisha McLaughlin]

S12 please quickly about the 12 year old girl in Houston that was tortured.

[Commercial Narrator]

Strangers.

[Mitch Modell]

I don't even know who you are

[Commercial Narrator]

and I don't know who she is.

[Trisha McLaughlin]

I live in Pittsburgh. Okay, but there was a child who was killed at the. You don't know about the child that was killed by illegal immigrants?

[Mark Halperin]

You know, again, she says I don't anything about it. Members of Congress are busy. She can't, she can't know about everything. But the attitude was of a piece with what most Democrats attitudes are. Here's Congressman Jayapal, leader in the Democratic Party. Same, same concept, talking to a reporter. S13 please.

[Trisha McLaughlin]

But as we know, the research is that documented immigrants commit far fewer crimes than anyone else. But aren't these crimes preventable if we didn't parole them into the country?

[Mark Halperin]

This line that you heard from Congressman Jay Paul. People in the country illegally commit far fewer crimes and sometimes they'll say it at the percentage of crimes, you know, per capita is lower and I don't challenge those statistics. But it is not what someone would say to these families. Well, your loved one was killed by someone in the country legally. But you can take solace from the fact that the percentage of illegal immigrants who kill people is lower than others or the absolute number of people they kill is lower than others who are here illegally. That's been a Democratic talking point on this from the start. Here's Senator Schumer talking about the Lake and Riley act and why he was opposing it. Some Democrats voted for it, but not Senator Schumer. This is from January of 2025. On the Senate floor, Charles Schumer explaining his position on the Lake and Riley act. S9, please.

[Senator Raphael Warnock]

Unfortunately, without more changes to address deficiencies in the bill, I'll be voting no. We Democrats want to see our broken immigration system fixed. We worked with Republicans last year on the strongest immigration bill in a decade. While I do not support this particular bill, I stand ready to work with both sides to pass smart, effective, tough and common sense legislation to secure our borders and reform our immigration system.

[Mark Halperin]

Now when I ask Republicans why do Democrats talk about these issues in such antiseptics way? Why do they turn away from recognizing that the tragedy that these families have dealt with towards saying, well, I don't like this piece of legislation or I don't like this bill or Donald Trump, January 6th, whatever. When I ask Republicans, they say, well, because Democrats love Open borders. Democrats want the borders open and they're willing to deal with people coming in illegally and committing violent acts because they need people here illegally in order to vote and mess with the census numbers and become Democrats. That's what Republicans will largely say to me when I say to Democrats, why would Senator Schumer speak about it this way, rather than saying, this woman, this poor woman and her family, her memory must be honored, we need a better bill to honor her because this, the, the savages who killed her, the savage who killed her, he must be brought to justice. Why wouldn't they do that? And I asked Democrats, and most of them will just turn back to statistics about crime or things they're outraged about. Donald Trump. And even when I have tried in the past and again this week, with the exception of the clip I showed you from two Way, even when I've tried to tee up Democrats, strategists, elected officials, don't you feel in your heart the sadness, the pain, the anguish of these families? I can't get an answer out of them that represents the way Donald Trump feels about this, the moral outrage, the outrage of failure by the American government to do the most fundamental thing, which is to protect our borders, protect our citizens. We were able to find one Democrat, maybe not a surprise, Senator Warnock, who's a minister from Georgia, where Lake and Riley was killed, we already found one Democrat, and I'm sure there are more, but we couldn't find too many. When he was asked about the case of Lake and Riley, here's what he said on CNN in March of 2024. S6.

[Senator Raphael Warnock]

Please listen. First of all, let me just say that my heart goes out to this family, the family of Lake and Riley. And I can tell you as a pastor who has done hundreds of eulogies and presided over all kinds of funerals, there is no grief worse than when nature is tragically reversed. And rather than the children burying the parents, the parents have to bury the children. And so it's unfortunate that in this moment of grief, there are those who are trying to score cheap political points. The border must be secured. We know this. There's

[Mark Halperin]

so the last thing I thought was lovely what he said at the beginning and again, unusual for a Democrat, but then he accuses the Republicans of cheap political points. And there's no doubt that the president, his political strategists, know how effective this issue is to rally folks, not just extreme maga, but people in the center and probably some Democrats who feel so strongly about this. No doubt they know the political Potency, but also no doubt that the president, the current president, has provided solace to these families that they did not get from Joe Biden. And no doubt that the underlying public policy issue. We must secure the border for many reasons, including to keep people in America from being killed and assaulted by people who come to the country illegally. There's no doubt that that's a legitimate issue. Okay, My job on the national town square is multifaceted, but one of them is to try to look for opportunities to point out both sides doing things that not only are politically stupid, but really divide the country. And I cannot tell you if you're listening to me now and your reaction is, Donald Trump has exploited these families for political gain. I cannot tell you how important this issue was to his election. And I can't tell you the level of resentment that people who agree with the president on these matters feel towards Democrats and many of my colleagues in the media for not treating this issue the way it should be treated by everyone. And that's what's so extraordinary about this. How could anyone have any different position than these families? Grief must not be in vain. We must figure out how to keep this from happening. How could anyone have any other position than that? And when people say, how can we bring the country together? The answer is on an issue like this, set aside. Set aside the division. I wish that the president had invited lots of Democrats that lunch. And I wish if he had invited them. And I have no reason to think, based on the questions I asked and the responses I got, I have no reason to think he did. I wish the Democrats would go that lunch celebrating Mother's Day and honoring mothers. He also under honored Gold Star Moms. But honoring these angel moms, that should be as bipartisan as anything is in America. And the search for solutions to try to keep it from happening again should be as well. This is not a hard thing to fix. Not a hard thing to fix. As long as people will think about what's underlying this issue that Donald Trump has adopted and rallied and championed now for over a decade. What's underlying it is the most fundamental thing. Let's all grieve for those families. Let's all support those families. Let's all try to fix what's broken, and let's all try to work together to keep them from being any. Any more of those families in the United States. All right, that's my reported monologue on the issue of American families touched by tragedy because we cannot control our border. What do you think? Am I being too hard on the Democrats or not hard enough? Let me know. Send me your feedback directly nextup halpernmail.com my email address again, nextup halperinmail.com am I being too hard on the Democrats or not hard enough? If you're listening to the program or watching the program on YouTube and you haven't yet subscribed to our YouTube channel, please do that. We put extra content up there so you want to make sure you're a subscriber to be notified whenever we load up something new. Go to YouTube.com@nextup halperin. And if you like to listen to shows of podcasts, same thing. Make sure you're not just listening to it but having your downloads toggled on so every new episode comes right to you. Tuesdays, Thursdays, and occasionally other times as well. You want to make sure you get every episode right away. And please share NextUp with your friends, colleagues, associates, enemies, random people you meet on the street. We want as many Nexters as we can have by the end of the year. That's our goal. So please, Tom, if you like the show, share it with someone else. All right, quick break. When we come back, Mitch Modell will be here, former owner and CEO of Modell Sporting Goods, a legendary operation here in New York City, and someone with a range of businesses around the country who understands what's going on with the economy. And frankly, I've been perplexed about it. Eager to talk to Mitch Modell. He's next up. Do you know that high blood pressure is the number one risk factor for mortality? One in two adults has it. That means there's a 5050 chance. You are a walking time bomb. But here's some good news. You can take control of your blood pressure naturally without having to rely on Big Pharma. 120 Life is a blend of great tasting super fruit juices that have been shown to help lower blood pressure. It's backed by hundreds of doctors and trusted by thousands of people who've seen measurable results. And here's the best part. It's completely risk free. Try 120 Life for two weeks and if you don't see a difference in your numbers, you get your money back. Go to 120Life. That's 120-Life.com and use code NextUp to save 20% and get yourself free shipping. This is serious. This is your life we're talking about. 120 life can help. All right, next up and joining me now, a man who's going to help solve the biggest mystery that I've dealt with lately, which is I look at the macroeconomic data, I look at the micro data, I talk to people, both business people and, and consumers, and I've never been more confused by the American economy. And that's even if you subtract the, the tariffs in the war. So. Next up here, former owner and CEO of Modell Sporting Goods, a, a, a iconic New York brand, and managing director and partner of GSH Development, Mr. Mitch Modell. Mitch, welcome and thank you for being here.

[Mitch Modell]

Thank you, Mark. It's a pleasure being here. Congratulations on your success.

[Mark Halperin]

You're very kind. I appreciate it.

[Donald Trump (clips)]

Yeah.

[Mark Halperin]

Models. Explain to people how you developed such an iconic brand in, in an industry that doesn't have as many iconic brands as some others. How did, how did model sporting goods get created and what was the trajectory of the success?

[Mitch Modell]

So it was started in 1889 by my great grandfather Morris, who came from Russia and set up a shop where people would come to New York City and sell haberdashery on the streets. Then we opened up one store in Cortlandt Street. Then he had a son, Henry. Henry opened up eight stores, took over De Vega Sporting Goods in 63. Then my father took over. He was the third generation and expanded to army Navy surplus stores. Then my brother and I, unfortunately, my brother passed away in 2001. We took over when we had 18 stores and we grew to 169 stores and converted to a sporting operation where we wanted to be like the community sporting goods store. Family values, great, great savings to the consumer and all about giving back to the community and every market we served.

[Mark Halperin]

Yeah. The thing for me, as one of your consumers for a long time, the most impressive thing is most sporting goods stores, I'd say, have pretty abysmal customer service. Walk in and there's nobody there to help you figure out what you want, how to get it. Every time I walked into a models, I knew I was going to get great customer service. I would be directed to what I needed. People would be knowledgeable, and that's been a big part of you and your families attitude about, about dealing with consumers. Right.

[Mitch Modell]

Well, you know what it starts, it's a great point, Mark, but it started with the associates. If you make the associates feel good, you've got a fighting chance. They'll make the customers feel good and they'll love working in that environment. And so we really had a big family business where the people knew we really cared about them, that they were first and foremost. Yeah. And if they were happy, they'd make our customers happy.

[Mark Halperin]

Remarkable success. Now you're in a bunch of other businesses. Now I want to drill down on some of them, but just tick off what, what businesses are you involved with now, directly or indirectly that you're engaged in? What, what industries and, and the scale of them.

[Mitch Modell]

So it's basically three industries I'm involved in. One is the construction and affordable housing. I partnered with this gal, Lawrence Golan about 10 months ago and she's been in this business for 20 years. She's a direct, direct manufacturer. And what we do is we could build homes literally in 15 days, a one unit house. In 15 days. We could build affordable housing which is like so desperately needed all over. So we're starting in New York, where I have all my contacts with developers in Florida, where I currently live now, and then of course the United States. We're even looking to bring production here from overseas to the US where we can control our destiny. But we could build a 300 unit house unit housing, affordable housing, student housing, workforce, workforce housing like for cops and policemen, firemen, etc. In nine months, which is unheard of, end to end. So we ask is that developers have shovel ready property. Well, we don't have to go through the permits, we don't have to go through RFPs. We have to get city council votes or community group votes that we have developers that have shovel ready property that we could start and then we take over the whole process. There are no cost overruns, we guarantee it. There's no construction fees. We're the gc. There's no engineering plans. We do that. So we provide a full solution, a turnkey solution, end to end to make it quicker, faster and cheaper than anybody on the planet.

[Mark Halperin]

And again, that's a for profit business. It's not, it's not Habitat for Humanity, it's a for profit business.

[Mitch Modell]

It's a for profit, but it's desperately needed.

[Mark Halperin]

So. So number one, housing. We'll get back to it. Arguably, in terms of the American dream, right now it's the biggest thing we need because young people don't think they can buy a home. That's number one. Second business sourcing.

[Mitch Modell]

Because of all the years we were in the buying business, I'm not in the business, I wasn't in the businesses that I'm, I'm specifically buying today. But in any business, you know, factories, I belong to an organization called ypo, Young Presidents Organization that gives you tremendous access to people. 38,000 companies all over the world. So we Source anything from produce from Latin America, from trash bags from Oman, where it's tariff free, TAA approved, as well as nitro gloves for hospitals and distributors from Malaysia. And that's what we do.

[Mark Halperin]

Yeah. So again, and the first thing in housing, you're dealing with manufacturing, you're dealing with importing, you're dealing with permitting, implicating a bunch of stuff in the economy and with sourcing. Again, you're dealing with bringing stuff in from around the world, supply chain on time, delivery, et cetera. Third business.

[Mitch Modell]

Right. So it's supply chain, but it's dealing directly with the manufacturers.

[Mark Halperin]

Yeah.

[Mitch Modell]

And working with the heads of government to make sure that we're all totally aligned. That's the key.

[Mark Halperin]

Yep. Okay. And then the third business.

[Mitch Modell]

And then the third business we have is called Waffle Wash and Fold Laundry. That will be launching in August when the kids get back to school in Boston. It's an app that we created where students could do their wash and fold laundry. Guaranteed delivery in 24 hours or it's free. So we, we have like an Uber type app. It's like Uber Laundry, but it's really like when you order Uber eats.

[Mark Halperin]

Yeah.

[Mitch Modell]

Anywhere you are, you put your zip code in. We're connecting with all the different laundries. We're starting in Boston because they have 46 colleges. They have the largest college town in the United States. And then we'll be expanding. All right.

[Mark Halperin]

And it obviously doesn't have to just be used by college kids. Could be used by lazy bodies too.

[Mitch Modell]

Correct.

[Mark Halperin]

Yeah. Okay, now you left out, you left out oat milk slices. You got that business too.

[Mitch Modell]

Correct. So the fourth business is Vita Prince, which is. If you see this, this is milkadamia. I don't know if you could see it.

[Mark Halperin]

Yes, sir.

[Mitch Modell]

So macadamia, the best thing since sliced milk. These are oat milk slices where we took out 87% of the water. This is equivalent. This package is equivalent to five 32 ounce cartons of oat milk. Takes up no space. It's not dated, it's fresh. And more important, it's got incredible healthy ingredients. All about nutrition.

[Mark Halperin]

Yeah. So you just mix, mix one of those slices with water and you've got some oat milk. No refrigeration needed.

[Mitch Modell]

No. We're putting in a blender.

[Mark Halperin]

Yeah. Where is that manufactured?

[Mitch Modell]

Right now it's manufactured in Germany and we're moving our facilities to Ohio in July. We're bringing equipment, so we'll be making the United States and saving a lot of time and money. But we tested it with somebody in Germany who was a manufacturer of that.

[Mark Halperin]

All right, so again, now you're in. Now you're in the food business, and you're also dealing with importing, and again, you're dealing with. On shoring. So my point in having you run through your businesses, ladies and gentlemen, is this man, Mr. Model, is at the center of understanding both the possibilities and the pressures of being in business in America today. So thank you for sharing all that. Here we go. What's working well in the American economy right now? We're dealing with the tariffs, which not everybody likes. We're dealing with the war, which is raising gas prices. What are the fundamentals, as John McCain might say, what are the fundamentals of the economy in America now? The are strong.

[Mitch Modell]

Embrace AI you have. You can't fight it. You can't be threatened by it. It's not going to replace human beings. It's driving the economy. It's going to drive productivity. It's going to give us access to information that we never had before. It's going to help solve a lot of medical problems. And you can see everyone's building these data centers. It's like. It's like a gold rush for AI. AI is going to have such an incredible positive effect. It's also going to have some negative effects. Obviously, it's going to cost people jobs. But the most important thing is companies will be more productive. And I think you've seen that in

[Mark Halperin]

the results as you're dealing with colleagues and suppliers and everybody overseas. Is the United States currently ahead of AI or is the German milk company, Are they using AI more than American companies are? Are we ahead?

[Mitch Modell]

We're definitely ahead. We're definitely ahead. And, you know, that's where the emphasis is on. In the whole economy right now, everything is AI it's like the wild, wild West. But I think it would be great in the long run and the short run.

[Mark Halperin]

What are the biggest problems with the American economy now? Is it the tariffs and the war, or are there other things that are more. Bigger obstacles to robust growth?

[Mitch Modell]

I think it's about uncertainty. People like certainty. And so the most important thing, the most important thing is that people have certainty. They want to know, tell me what the rules are, and we'll play by the rules. And that's really important. Whether it be tariffs, whether it be any. Any, you know, legislation, rulings, whether it be Congress or. Or the White House, you know, people need to feel certainty. And we got in the war. We got in the war in Iran. Get resolved, bring oil prices down. That's really killing the consumer. With today's CPI that went up to 3.8 today, it's all about gas. And we. The one thing that we have great going for us is that we are our own provider of gas. But unfortunately with this war, it's a global situation that brings down the prices for the consumer.

[Mark Halperin]

Let's talk about housing. We don't have enough supply in the country. Your company's trying to address that. Others are as well. But your solution, as you laid out, it's going to fast track it. It removes a lot of the obstacles, not all, but a lot of the obstacles to building more. What happened in America in order to learn to go forward, what happened? How did we end up with insufficient supply of housing?

[Mitch Modell]

Because you don't have the steel components. Steel in the United States is very expensive. We're a direct manufacturer with China and Vietnam for sourcing of steel. It's prefabricated light gauge steel. And so when you're competitive on pricing, when you could build construction end to end and take all the pain points away from everybody, they love our solution. And so it's not a Democrat issue, it's not a Republican, it's not an independent. This is a major issue for the country. So politics does not play into this. And so we're benefiting from it.

[Mark Halperin]

Who's got better water, Florida or New York to drink?

[Mitch Modell]

There's no better water than New York.

[Mark Halperin]

Correct.

[Mitch Modell]

People say, you want, you want a bottle? You want bottled water? No, give me New York's fine New York water.

[Mark Halperin]

New York, number one. You're correct. Number two, who's got more compelling sports teams, New York or Florida?

[Mitch Modell]

New York, New York. There's only one. There's only one New York.

[Mark Halperin]

Okay, who's got the Knicks? Who's got better live theater? I love the Knicks. I'm so excited about the Knicks. And I just hope Oklahoma City somehow loses because I don't want to play them. Who's got better, better Broadway, live, Live theater? New York or Florida?

[Mitch Modell]

New York.

[Mark Halperin]

New.

[Mitch Modell]

There's the only one.

[Mark Halperin]

Okay, so basically we've built a compelling case here. Why do you live in Florida, sir?

[Mitch Modell]

I moved five years ago when we closed down Models. I wanted to have a whole new fresh approach to life. And you know what? I always say Florida's worst day is better than New York's best day. Even when it rains here, it's cheerful in New York. In the city,

[Mark Halperin]

not for water. Bagels. Live theater bagels.

[Mitch Modell]

I miss bagels. And Chinese food. You can't get a good Chinese restaurant down in Florida.

[Mark Halperin]

Yeah.

[Mitch Modell]

And New York bagels, you got to go to like the old New York type deli.

[Mark Halperin]

So basically. Basically you threw away everything you grew up loving for decades because it's sunny some days. That's what you're telling me.

[Mitch Modell]

Sunny. Tax advantages.

[Mark Halperin]

Yeah. Quality of life advantages.

[Mitch Modell]

The weather.

[Mark Halperin]

Okay, we got a mayor in New York. Do you like the current mayor of Gotham City? Mr. Mondame? A big fan.

[Mitch Modell]

Do I like the mayor? Listen, whoever runs the city, I always support. No matter Democrat, Republican or Independent, you always want New York City to win. I think he's got to be a little more pro business and I hope he takes his time to understand that A lot of big organizations pay a lot of the freight with taxes coming into the government and you can't slap the hand that feeds you. So hopefully in time he'll learn that.

[Mark Halperin]

Yeah, I, I got a bunch of AI printed signs that say Modell for mayor. But you'd have to move back here. I don't think you're moving back. Who would be a good mayor of New York City who lives here now? Who would be good?

[Mitch Modell]

I would love to see a guy like John Cast in Adidas run. Yeah, you need a businessman, you need someone that, I mean, when you think about the City the last 25 years, the city was never run better when it was under the, the leadership under Michael Bloomberg.

[Mark Halperin]

Yeah, my former boss.

[Mitch Modell]

Michael brought in top, top people that ran big businesses. Really moved the needle, broke a lot of glass along the way and, and made New York what it is today. And you know, he was a standup guy. And today it's not about who's got the best talking points or who's got the best social media platform. It's who could run a hundred. One of the biggest businesses in New York, the city government.

[Mark Halperin]

So we got, we got a businessman. Mayor in the past, did pretty well. Kessner Castametides, he's a bunch of businesses. But he's in the retail business too and the customer business. So I understand why you find that appealing.

[Mitch Modell]

John Tish, I think would be, would have been a great mayor. Someone with. You're running $128 billion business.

[Mark Halperin]

Yeah. Today we should have one of the Tish's be mayor eventually. I don't care really which one it is.

[Mitch Modell]

Just I love Jessica. I think she is fabulous. She's a good stand up girl, dedicated to the city, knows the city inside out. Don't know if she's got the brand recognition, but anywhere that she's been, she's been unbelievable. Yeah, we'll make now in the police

[Mark Halperin]

department, we'll make some good AI ads for her. She decides to run. Lastly, you're lecturing to a group of young, up and coming small business people. What are Modell's three rules for success in business?

[Mitch Modell]

Understand what your reason for existence is.

[Mark Halperin]

Yeah.

[Mitch Modell]

You gotta have a purpose. You gotta have a purpose, you gotta have a mission, and you have to have values.

[Mark Halperin]

Okay, that's number one.

[Mitch Modell]

Or is that what you do?

[Mark Halperin]

Is that number one or is that all three?

[Mitch Modell]

Well, it's really combined because number one, you have to have a reason for your existence.

[Mark Halperin]

Yeah, Right.

[Mitch Modell]

I always ask the question, if models went away, who would miss us? I never thought they would allow us to go away.

[Mark Halperin]

Yeah. How about three piece of passion, purpose and price? How about that?

[Mitch Modell]

And values.

[Mark Halperin]

Values. Values. Start with the P, though. And start with the P. You're right. Very grateful to you for being here. And just to close, are you bullish on the American economy right now?

[Mitch Modell]

Yes, yes. I like a lot of the initiatives. I like bringing back manufacturing to the United States, particularly in the areas that we need to control. And I feel good about it. I think we just got to get through this war. You know, wars go on for years. We're still not even our third month over here. So I'm gonna.

[Mark Halperin]

I'm gonna go online and I'm gonna. Next time I have a slice of pie, I'm gonna have a slice of oat milk with it, too.

[Mitch Modell]

I love it.

[Mark Halperin]

All right, go on Amazon.

[Mitch Modell]

1999.

[Mark Halperin]

1999. And it'll sit on your shelf for longer than. Than a frozen milk or refrigerated milk. All right, Mitch Modell. Mitch Modell, owner and CEO before of Model Sporting Goods, and now in the housing supply and technology. And technology businesses. No retiring, but give up. New York Water. I'll send. You know what? I'm. I'm going to send you a court by FedEx every month.

[Mitch Modell]

Okay? Throw in a bagel. Throw in a New York City bagel

[Mark Halperin]

with that bagel and maybe a Brunson cap. Mitch, thank you for being here. Grateful to you.

[Mitch Modell]

Thank you. Have a great day.

[Mark Halperin]

All right, next up, my preview of the President's trip to China. An important meeting with lots of different differences between the two leaders. Trump versus Xi is next up. Are you being lied to? They tell you to defer paying your taxes by saving in, say, a 401k or an IRA because you'll retire in a lower tax bracket. But think about it. If that were true, why are so many retirees now in the highest tax bracket of their lives? It's time to get the truth and discover a better way to grow and protect your money. Bank on yourself is the proven retirement plan alternative that banks and Wall street desperately hope you never hear about. It gives you guaranteed predictable growth that doesn't go backward when the market drops. It can provide tax free retirement income under current tax law, putting you in control of your future tax rate. You also have control of your money. Access it when you need to with no government penalties or any restrictions and your money keeps growing even when you use it. Right now, get a free report that reveals how you can bank on yourself and enjoy tax free retirement income, guaranteed growth and control of your money. Just go to BankOnYourself.com mark and get your free report. That's BankOnYourself.com mark BankOnYourself.com mark all right, next up, the President's trip to China. He went there in his first term, but it's always a big deal whenever a president goes to China, particularly now what those two countries, United States and China, are considered the undisputed heavyweights of the American geopolitical scene. It's an interesting thing. The president loves having relationships with world leaders that carry over and I've reported on Asia my whole career and on President Trump's attitude towards Chairman Xi since his first term. And the president will frequently praise him as he'll praise many world leaders, including Vladimir Putin. He likes to show respect. And this is one of the areas where President Trump intuitively understands something big about Asian culture. Face is an enormously important concept in Asia. You have to allow your, your adversaries in business or politics or whatever it is in geopolitics to have face, to save face, to not be embarrassed. And the run up to this meeting, which has been rescheduled once because of Iran, has put the Chinese in a position they don't love being in. They don't love disorganization. They don't love lack of clarity of what the schedule is going to be. They like the whole thing to be scripted, really. And the US Just doesn't play that way in general as much as the Chinese, but certainly as compared to, to, to Donald Trump. So there are just some big differences here. First of all, the time difference makes a huge difference for people in the United States. Journalists covering the summit, producing content from Beijing, but also for coordination. She will have all his people there who matter and can coordinate on the, on the time difference. The President will have a big team with him, but they'll also have to coordinate back with Washington. So that's one big difference. The cultures are so different. President Trump is very confident on the world stage. We've all seen that. But he'll be dealing with a different kind of culture. And the Chinese, for instance, are, are you think the President of the United States is rough on the media? The Chinese are extremely rough on the media. And so on a trip like this, you can expect to see at times the Trump administration. Maybe there's some irony here standing up for the White House press corps. These are also different types of leaders, as much as they seem to get along. And of course, she had a long standing relationship with Joe Biden as well. They're on different time horizons. President Trump is out of office in a couple years, no matter what. And she can go for, I don't say forever, but there's no end date on his time in office. And that dovetails with the big difference between the political cultures of these two countries. The US Thinks about this year, next year, maybe a year beyond that. The Chinese think in 10 years, 25 years, 100 years. And that patience, that cultural patience is, is an advantage for them in most cases because it means they're not in as big a hurry. There's no midterm election coming up that's going to be decisive for Xi's time in office. And that gives him, I'd say, an asymmetrical advantage. Another big difference is the goals going into this summit. The United States cares about the economics. They want to have more investment, more business activity in China, for particularly things like financial services. They want to sell the Chinese stuff, including Boeing airplanes. And so there'll be a lot of prominent CEOs on this trip trying to be part of the end of the summit and the agreements about economics, US Cares about security for the world, and of course, about AI. AI is going to be on the formal agenda at this summit, unprecedented historically to have this kind of prominence. But the US Would like to see a lot of coordination for the threats from AI that threaten both the United States and China, according to my sources. And of course, the United States cares about human rights, China less so. And then lastly, the US Cares about Iran, although my sources are skeptical that this meeting will produce a lot of Chinese help on solving the current problem. What does China care about? Well, the US Says China cares about Taiwan and trying to move the United States towards a softer view of the reunification between Taiwan and Communist China that the Chinese would like to see. As I said before, China cares about stability in the summit order, certainty. They'd like to see that in the world. So they don't like the tariffs coming on and off. They don't like disruptions in the relationship. They want to be able to plan carefully. And of course, China cares about world dominance and the United States would like to check China. In the end, this summit will be almost certainly covered as if it's about Iran. But I don't expect from my sources much Iran progress. It'll be about economics. That's what will dominate. Both countries want, want to figure out a way to have win win in the relationship. Scott Bessant is a key figure at this summit. Treasury secretaries typically are not as front and center on a summit like this as Scott Bessant will be because he's really the point person for the relationship between the two countries and he deals with his counterparts in China at a very high level. To set up this summit going on for a while to set this up and to think about how you make the relationship less tense, make the United States less reliant on China for things like rare earth minerals and other things that the United States would like to decouple on medicine, but also to have a productive relationship. They don't want this to be so adversarial that it dominates and occupies the American military budget, the American diplomatic bandwidth. So you'll see a lot of symbolism, a lot of pomp and circumstance. The Chinese will roll out lots of red carpets for President Trump and extraordinary banquets. But let's focus as, as I always do for these summits. What are the deliverables? And while my sources are not optimistic that there'll be a settlement, a meaning related to Iran, there can always be surprises. We'll watch it. The president will be there for the rest of the week. Takes off Tuesday afternoon and a long flight and then heads into summitry. There you go, my reporting on where we stand on the US China summit. Next up, Trisha McLaughlin, former assistant secretary for Homeland Security and a proud Buckeye. Trish McLaughlin is next up. Think right now about the last 30 bucks that you spent, maybe on a streaming subscription you don't watch or a lunch you've already forgotten. That's $30. That's gone forever. Acre Gold lets you turn that lost money into physical 24 karat Swiss gold. You pick a plan, your balance builds and once you hit the price of a bar, they ship it straight to your front door. We're talking about real gold here, right in your hand at your home. And over time, you're sitting on something that's been valuable since the dawn of civilization. And for the collectors out there, they just dropped something cool. The limited edition Hot Wheels collection. These are officially licensed by Mattel, strictly capped, and once they're gone, they're history. 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[Mark Halperin]

All right, next up and joining me now, the Tricia McLaughlin of the Ohio State former Assistant Secretary for the Department of Homeland Security and a keen observer of pretty much everything. Tricia, welcome.

[Trisha McLaughlin]

Mark, thanks so much for having me.

[Mark Halperin]

I'd like to ask everybody on the program poll question. So here's a poll question. CNNs how much have you been affected personally in your finances by the Iran war?

[Trisha McLaughlin]

I will say I don't drive very often but today gas prices were pretty brutal when I was filling up my tank.

[Mark Halperin]

Yeah I talked to a lot of Republican strategists who tell me if the war doesn't end soon and gas prices don't come down soon, it will be the main factor in the midterms. How do you feel about that position? Strongly agree, disagree. How would you react to that position? I hear from a lot of your colleagues these days.

[Trisha McLaughlin]

Yeah, I feel like that's kind of the baked in consensus at this point. But the data isn't pointing in that direction. I mean that given the Voting Rights act decision and these new maps coming out and then of course you're looking at the cook predictions over the weekend, 11 of them moving into the Republican lean Republican space. It looks like it's a jump ball at this point for the midterms. I think that the American people are starting to probably get used to the fact yes, they're paying higher prices for for gas. It does look like inflation is up. But the Democrats don't have a vision, they don't have a leader and their brand is incredibly diminished.

[Mark Halperin]

I'm so fascinated by candidates who can make great videos for social media and TV and ones who can't. And in the last presidential you worked for Vivek Ramaswamy who made great videos. Maybe not totally love the playing tennis with no shirt, but he made a lot of great videos. And now we've got Spencer Pratt running for mayor of LA and people supporting him. Not all the great videos coming out of that campaign are official campaign videos. What's the what are the traits and we saw, we saw in New York Mandami made great videos. We what are the traits needed for a candidate to be able to make funny, interesting virally videos? What do they have to have?

[Trisha McLaughlin]

I think it has to make you has to evoke some sort of emotion. I mean you might not have liked the shirtless tennis video, but you surely remembered it with the Spencer Pratt video and evoked this emotion that you're seeing really the juxtaposition of what the politicians in LA where they live versus what the everyday citizens who are impacted by the fires like Spencer Pratt and his family live. And so Mandami again he did. He seems so Likable, very humanizing. And I think that that's what it takes. People are so used to politicians being so stiff. I think what Donald Trump brought to the table is you felt like you already knew him. And so what politicians like Vivek Ramaswamy, like, well, Spencer Pratt is a reality star, so to some extent, at least some of us millennials do know him. But I think what Donald Trump was able to bring is you felt like you knew him already. And so what these politicians like Mandami are trying to achieve is this human factor that you do know him, even if it's just through a screen or a digital platform.

[Mark Halperin]

But can anybody do that? Again, the four people we're talking about here, Mandami, Ramaswamy, Pratt and Trump, they're all great TV performers. They're great on camera. They. They like me. Can you make ads and videos like that for people who aren't, like, in the caliber of those four? Or really, if you got a candidate who's kind of a dud on camera, there's just no way to do that.

[Trisha McLaughlin]

I mean, I think you have to be authentic to. To your candidate. People can immediately smell out fake and phony. And so I think whatever your candidate's strengths are, you have to play to that. If they're really charismatic like Mum, play it up. If they're kind of nerdy or quirky, play that up. But really, whatever you're delivering from a video perspective, it has to play to their story and what their personality strengths are.

[Mark Halperin]

A lot of the Pratt videos are made by AI and in Hollywood, there's a backlash. The Oscars have now basically said, you can't have a movie made by AI and qualify for the Academy Awards. Golden Globes have a slightly less strict rule. Do you think there's any barrier now, like press backlash or voter backlash to making ads with AI or just whatever you make now with AI, everybody accepts.

[Trisha McLaughlin]

Yeah, I don't think you're going to be able to tell a difference. It's a much cheaper mechanism for these political consultants and their campaigns to be using out of Ohio. They just had an ad with Sherrod Brown. He was as a. He was as a clown. And everyone was thinking that this was an impersonator and commenting on social media. This impersonator is going to be making a ton of money through this cycle, knowing that Ohio, Houston versus Sherrod Brown is going to be a very expensive race. But it turned out it was AI and so I think you're going to be seeing more and more of that. And to some degree, some of these ads are going to get nastier and nastier because people aren't going to be able to tell the difference between a candidate in the flash or a candidate

[Mark Halperin]

made by AI you're talking about the ad where Sherrod Brown is portrayed as a guest who won't leave a party. Are you saying that entire ad was made by AI?

[Trisha McLaughlin]

No, that Jared Brown himself. There was no stand in. It was. The candidate was AI.

[Mark Halperin]

So somehow they superimposed. Fascinating. It's a, It's a very good ad. I've watched it about 100 times because it's funny every time.

[Trisha McLaughlin]

It's memorable.

[Mark Halperin]

Yeah, there's gonna be probably in November and maybe before some of the upcoming primaries, they're gonna be moments where somebody drops a really emotional, really effective AI produced ad at the very last minute where there's no fact checking, there's no press scrutiny. How can campaigns who are worried about being hit with that, how can they prepare for that? Or can they.

[Trisha McLaughlin]

I mean, that's a, that's a really tough one because I do think using AI, especially when you have an AI version of the candidate or the politician actually, you know, conducting that act that they're being accused of likely without fact checking, or there's a good shot that's incredibly compelling and it does evoke an emotion and it's going to be memorable for the viewers and the target. So, I mean, I think that the best you can do is get good oppo research against yourself and make sure that you're trying to control the narrative. If you have something that you know about your candidate that you know your opponent is going to get out there, it's better you give that to the press yourselves, friendly press, if you can, to try and control that narrative the best you can.

[Mark Halperin]

So again, just get into the nitty gritty here. I've been thinking about this lately as I see these Spencer Pratt ads. They get so much attention, they get so much free media, so much what some people call earned media, so much sharing on social. And so in the last 96 hours before election day, and of course with early voting, you know, that's a movable target. But when, when people are voting, you got to have like a war room, it seems to me, and track and tracking. And if your opponent puts up something about you, okay, you see it. So there's a, there's a, there's an AI ad that shows candidate for city council Trisha McLaughlin eating, stealing apples from a fruit from a fruit stand. And she looks like her, she's stealing apples from a fruit stand. You see that on social media, you see it on TikTok, etc. Then, then what do you do as a campaign?

[Trisha McLaughlin]

Yeah, I mean, I think that this comes down a little bit to hand to hand combat as well. You also have AI at your disposal. You also have hopefully opposition research at your disposal. And those AI ads are incredibly quick to make, they're relatively cheap to make. I mean, I think it's mutually assured destruction with some of these ads. So my recommendation if I was running that war room is I would come up with an ad of, of the opponent myself. But I mean, I think in general, in the year 2026, every single major campaign, if they have the funds, they should at least have a one man war room to be combating bad stories, to be pushing positive stories about their candidate. But as well they need a surrogate network so that, whether that means building relationships with the top influencers, say in the conservative movement, the Gunther Eagles, the libs of TikTok. But those are really, I mean there's a kind of core contingency about 10 to 15 of these guys. And if you can build relationships with them, they can blow up your material and really help debunk and defang the attacks against your, your candidate.

[Mark Halperin]

How developed is the industry of people who can make AI ads that are really good and make them really fast and then get them out there? Is that, is that, is that like, are there stars already in the party who know how to do it? Are they people who specialize in political ads? Or is this still growing from a pretty small base?

[Trisha McLaughlin]

It seems like it's still very much nascent based on my knowledge of it. Some of these guys, the bigger advertising agencies, they have, you know, AI specialists, but then some of the digital, smaller digital companies who don't typically do your larger scale TV ads, they've come up quick on this. And so I, I think this cycle alone we're going to be seeing a major evolution in the use of AI and how quickly, how cheap, but how realistic as well these advertisements can be.

[Mark Halperin]

Would you expect that there's a, what's it called, like the American association of Political Consultants, whatever that group's called. Would you expect they'd have an award for best AI ad?

[Trisha McLaughlin]

That's a good question. I mean, I think that they should, I mean, I think that, you know, if the Republicans aren't going to use it, the Democrats surely will. And so you have to be able to compete. It's, it's a tool that can certainly be used for bad, but it can be used for good as well. So I would, I would think if we don't see that for 2026 we will certainly see that kind of award for 2028.

[Mark Halperin]

Yeah, I'd be eager to see the contestants because, because as you said the, the cost is so low. So even if you're running for city council or, or, or school board, you can, you can make a pretty, if you learn how to do it, you can make a pretty good ad now with no production budget, just, just the cost of whatever AI platform you're using. And, and you can apply your own creativity. But these, these systems now you could just say make me give, show me five great ads attacking my school board candidate rival or show me a great positive bio spot and add some stirring music and you know, it can happen quick and at almost no cost.

[Trisha McLaughlin]

True. And it also actually poses kind of a problem for some of these political advertising consultants and these companies if, if it becomes incred, easy and cheap for these politicians, whether they be local or even statewide, they could become obsolete in the next I would say four to 10 years.

[Mark Halperin]

Yeah, I worry a little bit about your household here but I think, I know but I think human, human, human creativity will always be important and, and someone has to talk to the candidate spouse about why everything's okay. And I don't think disclosure.

[Trisha McLaughlin]

My husband has a political advertising company.

[Mark Halperin]

Yeah, yeah he does. He's very good at his job but he's not, he's not totally impervious to AI. Almost nobody, nobody is put on your homeland Security hat people have talked about this summer with the World cup and, and then also the Republicans are going to have a convention. They're going to be candidates out there. Question was asked regularly after 9 11, you know, 25 years ago. Are we safer now than before 9 11? What. How safe is our people now at public events whether they're political or sports or whatever it is? How safe are we now as compared to 25 years ago?

[Trisha McLaughlin]

Well, Homeland Security has a, whether it be Secret Service or tsa, they have a no fail mission. I do feel based on my knowledge, my experience there. I was at Homeland for 13 months and I mean the technology which I would say Mark, it was pretty lackluster. I would say in the last five years they've really modernized and caught up and it is impressive to see through TSA just the multi levels of screening and how they really do try to make it different at every airport. Different on an hourly basis. So that people can't game the system and try to get through. But that's going to be replicated at these America 250 events. Of course, the FIFA World cup, which is equivalent to something like 10 Super Bowls. So, I mean, they have, they've certainly been hiring up, which is something that they needed. That was a goal when the administration started for Homeland Security was that they needed to have even more of these TSA agents and Homeland Security personnel who could be deployed across the country so that they do have these events that are safe.

[Mark Halperin]

If a family said to you, trish, I know you worked at Homeland Security, is it safe to take my family to the World Cup? What would you tell them?

[Trisha McLaughlin]

Absolutely. Go. Be vigilant. You know, be smart. But I feel very confident even, you know, of course, the world isn't always the safest place. Today we are at war. There are these lone wolf attackers. But I think it's, the administration has done an excellent job. It's been incredibly proactive. It has, has been planning this since day one for all of these events. But as well, I think it's our patriotic duty. Don't, don't bend the knee to the terrorists. Don't bend the knee to these bad actors. Get out there, celebrate. Have a great time with your friends and family and just, just be smart.

[Mark Halperin]

When people say, as you did, be vigilant, what does that mean?

[Trisha McLaughlin]

I mean, it sounds so trite, right, Mark, at this point, we hear it all the time. If you see something, say something. But I mean, there are local law enforcement and federal law enforcement. They're on the ground for a reason. They won't always see everything. But if you do see something that doesn't feel right, doesn't look right, mention it to a law enforcement personnel and that can save a life. And does it sound right? Yes, but that is, I mean, we are told time and time again in these briefings, that's what it really comes down to is when lives are saved. It's so often just an everyday person who sees something and they prevent a tragedy from occurring.

[Mark Halperin]

Yeah. So like if you're at a hotel where the President's doing an event and you open the door and there's a guy in there with a gun, tell everybody there's a guy in there with a gun. Lastly, so happy and proud that you've joined two WAY as a contributor to the morning meeting. Just tell everybody what the reaction you've gotten is, both from the announcement, but also being on two way. What's the reaction been like well Mark,

[Trisha McLaughlin]

thank you so much. It has been an honor and I so enjoy not just being on two way, but I watch it every morning with you and Kevin and Larry. I was just actually at a party last night, non political people, but this woman knowing I'm involved in politics pulls me aside and she I guess didn't know yet that I was part of the two Way family. But she, she said, have you heard of two Way and Mark Halpern? You have to watch this show. So it's certainly broken through and I think it's refreshing. People want to see people who can disagree and agree and do it in a civil way. And I think every person watching two Way and you three, we all learn something every time we watch.

[Mark Halperin]

Well, very nice of you. Love having you on nextup. Love having you on two way and very grateful to have you be a part of it and and making time today. Trisha McLaughlin thank you Mark.

[Trisha McLaughlin]

Thanks for having me.

[Mark Halperin]

All right, that's it for today's show. We'll be back on Thursday. Brand new episode of the program. Subscribe here wherever you get the show, whether you watch it on YouTube or whether you listen to it as a podcast. And make sure all your friends know about it too, so they know what you know, which is what's coming next up.

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