Best of NFL Offseason MOVES Part 1: John Harbaugh becomes NEW Giants HC, Maxx Crosby VOIDED Trade to Ravens, Dexter Lawrence TRADED to Bengals

Summary

Nightcap – Best of NFL Offseason MOVES Part 1
July 29, 2026
Hosted by: Shannon Sharpe ("Unc"/"Joe") and Chad “Ochocinco” Johnson ("Ocho")

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Episode Overview

In this episode of Nightcap, Shannon Sharpe and Chad "Ochocinco" Johnson dive deep into the wildest NFL offseason moves, tackling blockbuster trades, controversial front office decisions, and what these changes mean for the upcoming 2026 season. The main themes include:

• New York Giants trading Dexter Lawrence to the Bengals and acquiring two top-10 draft picks
• The collapse of the Maxx Crosby trade from the Raiders to the Ravens
• The Miami Dolphins’ shift to a rebuild after trading Jalen Waddle
• Evaluating the Giants’ hiring of John Harbaugh as their new head coach

With their trademark banter, Unc and Ocho give passionate, unfiltered takes on each move and its ripple effects across the league.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

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1. Dexter Lawrence Traded to the Bengals (03:41–16:19)

Trade Breakdown

• Giants trade Pro Bowl DT Dexter Lawrence to the Bengals for the 10th overall pick.
• Giants now own the 5th and 10th picks in the upcoming NFL Draft.

Ochocinco’s Reaction

• Ocho is ecstatic for the Bengals, believing Lawrence is a proven difference-maker:

  "When we talk about the top defensive tackle, Joe, in the NFL, Dexter Lawrence is still one of those difference makers… double team 60 to 70% of the time." (04:24)

• Cites Bengals’ poor run defense last year—sees Lawrence as a much-needed solution.
• Downplays Lawrence's “down” season, emphasizing historic performance and injury context.

Shannon’s Analysis

• Skeptical about giving up a top-10 pick for a veteran with declining stats and a hefty contract:

  "It’s incredibly rare for NFL franchises to trade draft picks this high in the draft for individual veterans." (10:04)

• Debates value vs. risk—highlights that Giants are betting on future production, not past achievements.

Key Quotes and Debates

• Ocho argues there’s “nothing in the draft better than Dexter Lawrence at his position right now.” (14:12)
• Sharpe counters with risk of paying for past performance rather than future returns:

  "That's why you couldn't be a GM, because you’re gonna pay everybody based on what they've done." (11:41)

• The two spar over Lawrence’s place among elite DTs—names dropped include Aaron Donald, Chris Jones, Jeffrey Simmons, and Cam Heyward.

Notable Moments

• Ocho: "Let's see somebody let's see Derrick Henry run the goddamn ball now!" (15:24)
• Joe: "10th pick for half a sack." (08:51)

Discussion on Draft Alternatives

• They debate prospects like Reuben Bane, Caleb Downs, and Big Mac from Ohio State as potential impact picks at 10.
• Ocho insists none could offer what Lawrence can immediately.

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2. Dolphins Trade Jalen Waddle to Broncos—Miami Rebuild Mode (31:11–41:11)

Trade Details

• Dolphins send Jalen Waddle and a 2026 fourth to Denver for a first-round, third-, and fourth-round pick.

Ocho’s Perspective

• Skeptical and disappointed:

  "You still need that dog, Joe, you still need that dog as a quarterback… I don’t think they have that right now." (31:46)

• Concerned that Miami’s young QB Malik Willis lacks proven receivers, potentially hindering his ability to develop.

Shannon’s Take

• More pragmatic, weighing the value of proven commodities versus prospects:

  "Everybody ain’t gonna be Jamar Chase coming out, right? Or Justin Jefferson." (32:51)

• Notes that A.J. Brown trade rumors are heating up—Broncos and Eagles now have higher leverage after Waddle deal.

Key Conversation

• What makes a true “number one” receiver?

  "I look at a number one Ocho, I look at a guy that says, they going in the game, they gotta stop him." (37:19)

• Both hosts agree the Dolphins, now with $200M in dead money, are entering a full rebuild.

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3. Maxx Crosby Voided Trade to Ravens (59:14–88:51)

What Happened

• Raiders and Ravens had agreed to send Maxx Crosby to Baltimore for two first-round picks.
• Trade rescinded due to Crosby’s medical evaluation—concerns over a previous meniscus surgery and possible degeneration.
• Ravens GM Eric DaCosta expresses regret:

  "Nobody is more upset than him… we will move forward as a football team." (59:50)

Analysis

• Sharpe dives into the medical risks and costs, outlining how knee degeneration is a “career alarm bell” for aging pass rushers:

  "If what the reports are true. That is a lot. That’s a big timetable." (61:00)

• Ocho is perplexed—argues every veteran has MRI red flags and insists Crosby’s on-field impact, even hurt, can’t be denied:

  "No one can stop him. You can only hope to contain a player like Max." (66:24)

Value Debate

• Shannon argues:

  "If the knee is as bad as the Ravens doctors think, two first-round picks is off the table." (73:34)

• Ocho: "To get a player that can change the direction of your franchise doesn’t come around that often—even with a limping Crosby, he makes a difference." (74:18)
• Discuss potential lower cost offers like a second and third or creative, conditional packages.

Maxx Crosby Social Response

• Sharpe cites Crosby’s own tweet:

  “‘Everything happens for a reason. Believe nothing you hear and half of what you see. I'm a Raider. I'm back. Run that ish.’” (88:35)

• Ocho campaigns for Bengals to make a play for Crosby if his price drops.

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4. John Harbaugh Hired as New York Giants Head Coach (93:09–107:11)

News

• Harbaugh inked a 5-year, $100 million deal, making him one of the league’s highest paid coaches.

Analysis

• Sharpe praises the hire:

  "It’s a proven commodity. Ain’t no guesswork… The man was just the head coach for the last 18 years.” (98:39)

• Ocho questions if the Giants are the most talent-rich landing spot, but acknowledges their “best quarterback situation” among current vacancies.

Factors

• Key to Harbaugh’s decision: roster control, existing quarterback (Jackson Dart), and a chance to turn around a once-storied franchise.
• The duo agree:

  "Without a quarterback in today’s game… you can’t win." (100:50)

Notable Quote

• Sharpe: “The quickest way to get to the playoffs, to get on the winning track, is to have a quarterback. They believe they have their quarterback. John Harbaugh, more importantly, believes they have their quarterback. That is why he took this job so quickly.” (95:10)

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Notable Quotes

• Ocho (on Dexter Lawrence’s trade):

  "There’s nothing in the draft better than Dexter Lawrence. I can tell you that." (09:46)

• Joe (on NFL trade risk):

  “I gotta pay you based on what I believe you’re gonna do moving forward. He already got a big contract. I can’t keep paying him based on what the hell he’s done.” (11:41)

• Ocho (on Maxx Crosby):

  "Even with a limping Crosby, he makes a difference. We have to understand who we’re talking about now—we’re not just talking about just a guy." (74:18)

• Joe (on Harbaugh hire):

  “It’s a proven commodity. Ain’t no guesswork…” (98:39)

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Segment Timestamps for Key Topics

• [03:41] Dexter Lawrence to Bengals: Trade analysis & debate
• [08:51] Ocho “10th pick for half a sack” – skepticism about value
• [14:12] Draft value vs. proven veteran debate
• [31:11] Miami trades Jalen Waddle – impact on Dolphins/Broncos
• [37:19] "What makes a #1 receiver?" segment
• [59:14] Maxx Crosby trade to Ravens collapses – injury details, franchise risk
• [73:34] Debating what Crosby’s value is now and Bengals’ possible move
• [93:09] John Harbaugh hired as Giants HC – what it means, coaching philosophy

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Tone and Style

This episode keeps Nightcap’s signature blend of lively sports debate, player’s perspective, and humorous real talk. The banter is fast, direct, and plenty opinionated—with Ocho and Unc both letting their “fan” out while leaning on years of football insight.

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Memorable Moments

• Ocho’s unfiltered optimism about his Bengals:

  "Now, let’s see Derrick Henry run the goddamn ball now, huh? Let’s see him run the goddamn ball." (15:24)

• Ocho and Shannon’s running argument over the true value of top defensive tackles, with Ocho ready to “put that on my cheetah pants.” (16:47)
• Joe’s analogy comparing trading for Crosby with buying an expensive house with hidden problems—a metaphor that lands amidst laughter and friendly taunting. (67:55)
• Maxx Crosby’s cryptic tweet, read on air. (88:35)

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Summary

Nightcap’s July 29, 2026, episode is a battle royale of offseason NFL analysis: from dissecting the Bengals’ bold move for Dexter Lawrence, reacting to Miami’s rebuild, breaking down Maxx Crosby's failed trade and long-term health, to exploring Giants’ new era under John Harbaugh. The episode brims with insider insight, heated debates on player value and team-building logic, and trademark trash talk—a must-listen for NFL fans and anyone tracking the evolving shape of the league.

Transcript

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[Joe]

it's your favorite sports thunk here. Don't forget to hit that subscribe button to join the fastest growing community on YouTube. Remember, Nightcap doesn't happen without you, so please subscribe or you're going to make Ocho cry. Oo. I know you happy about this? The Giants traded Pro bowl defensive tackle Dexter Lawrence to the Bengals for the 10th pick in next week NFL Draft. The Giants now own pick number five and pick number 10 in the first round, the Cincinnati Bengals. I no.

[Ocho]

No they not. No they not. They. Absolutely not. Hey Joe. Joe. We getting better, huh? Joe, listen, we getting better.

[Joe]

We.

[Ocho]

We gave up the 10 pick, right? You hear me?

[Joe]

Yeah.

[Ocho]

He gave up the 10th pick and let a first round pick go that you don't know. You don't know what you're getting with your first first round pick. Now we looked at that. You read off Dexter Lawrence stats, right? Based on what he did last year. Okay, we know what he was the year before that and we know what he did the year before that. When we talk about the top defensive tackle, Joe, in the NFL, Dexter Lawrence is still one of those difference makers. A difference maker who is double team 60 to 70% of the time.

[Joe]

Okay, okay, stay with me.

[Ocho]

Real quick. When we talk about the top defensive tackles in the NFL that can make an impact, we have opportunity to get one of those who had a down season. The Bengals were extremely, extremely bad on defense last year. 1. We couldn't stop the goddamn run.

[Joe]

Right?

[Ocho]

We got brother Jared Allen. Now we bring in brother Dexter Lawrence, who probably needed a change of scenery. And outside of having a down year, there were probably some internal issues. We didn't want to be there.

[Joe]

Yeah.

[Ocho]

What can we get?

[Joe]

Well, he was. He didn't have Joe. Joe. He had no more guaranteed money. He wanted to do that one. I got. Hey, bless his heart. I just. And I. And I said this. I don't believe the Giants can do that based on the half a sack that he gave them last year. That's it. I paid you for those. The Pro bowl years, I paid you for that. Now I've got to pay you based on what I believe you'll do moving forward. Now you trade for him. Who did. I remember, the Giants traded for the Giant. Not the Giants. The jets traded Hassan. Hassan Reddick. Remember, he's with the Eagles. Joe Ocho, he was with the Eagles. The jets trade for him. You trade for him and you're not gonna give him a contract. And you thought he was gonna come. So at the Bengals, if you're not gonna give him a contract, you just wasted.

[Ocho]

No, you know, we gonna give him a contract. Huh? We not playing no games. Joe Burrow already sent that message in the middle of the season, Joe. You know, that's why they're making the move. They're making defensively. Mike Brown, Katie and Troy. No, Joe is not playing build a team around me that is competent, especially on the other side of the ball. So if we score 50 points, the other team don't score 52. And they're showing. They put their money where their mouth is. And we talk about. Listen, hold on. We talk about Dexter Lawrence, right? You talk about last year. He missed time last year, too. You know, he had an elbow injury. He had elbow. His elbow was messed up, huh? The year before that, he was the seventh best player in the goddamn league. And we talk about from, you know, from. From a defensive tackle position.

[Joe]

But hey, hey, is. What have you done for me lately? Ocho, you know that. Ocho know that, too. I Don't know why Ojo did that.

[Ocho]

Uncle Joe, I understand that, but I'm

[Joe]

telling you, oo, that man played 17 games last year, Joe. He missed no time.

[Ocho]

Wait, hold on. What? But no, not let. No, no, he wasn't. He was hurt last year. What year was the elbow was.

[Joe]

He played 17 games, had 31 tackles, 14 solo, 17 assists, a half a sack, no force fumble, no fumble recovery. He had one interception. The year before he played, it was that.

[Ocho]

Okay, okay. I got, I got me years mixed up.

[Joe]

And guess what? That year he had nine sacks. The year before that he played 16 games, had four and a half sacks. Hey, so.

[Ocho]

Hey, hey, Joe, you know, you do understand it's a D tackle, right? Yeah, it's a D tackle we talk about. He's double teamed 60, 70% of the time, Joe, he got two people on him and he putting up the numbers.

[Joe]

I got you. I got you, bro.

[Ocho]

This ain't no dn.

[Joe]

Yeah, he had one. He had a half a sack more than I had. And I ain't been on the football field in two decades.

[Ocho]

Hey, and you know, you know what? He's in the right place. He's in the right place and Mike

[Joe]

Brown is showing you because think about this. He got a half a sack with Thibodeau, Abdul Carter, Ryan Burns, they went crazy. So now tell me, tell me the guy that's on the defensive line that matches nobody.

[Ocho]

But hold on, them boys had W sacks on both, on both sides.

[Joe]

So who gonna get double digits? So think about it. They had double digit sacks, he had us half a sack. So now you don't got nobody that gonna have double digit sacks. How many sacks he gonna actually gonna have?

[Ocho]

You don't know because the season hasn't started yet. But I know one thing. We've gotten better. We've gotten better.

[Joe]

10th pick for half a sack.

[Ocho]

And who's the 10th pick? Who we getting that's gonna come in

[Joe]

and make an impact? What about Ruben Bane for Miami?

[Ocho]

He gonna be gone. He gonna be, he not gonna be around in no.

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10.

[Joe]

You don't know that. They said that about Michael Parsons. He wasn't going at the 11th.

[Ocho]

Come on now. Reuben Bane, he's not going to be there. Not in no. 10. If anything, if anything, Caleb Downs ain't going to be there because that, that would have been the person I think we would have gotten to add to our secondary. He not even be there at 10.

[Joe]

How you know?

[Ocho]

I'm telling you because I know other, I know other teams.

[Joe]

I tell You. Yeah, I know I wouldn't give. I know. I'm not giving up the 10 pick in the draft for half a sack.

[Ocho]

I know I would because. Because there's in the draft that's better than the pro. There's nothing in the draft that has a better resume than Dexter Lawrence. Hey, I can tell you that.

[Joe]

There's nothing in the draft going to your guppies.

[Ocho]

There's nothing in the draft that better than Dexter Lawrence. I can tell you that.

[Joe]

We don't know. Oo. What, what, what he's proven.

[Ocho]

Okay, he had it down here, I had it down year. What that mean? And I came back and had three more thousand yard seasons after that. He had a down year.

[Joe]

It's incredibly rare with NFL franchises trade draft picks this high in the draft for individual veterans. We've seen a grand total of two veterans traded for first round picks that were already guaranteed to be top 10 since 2000. One of them was Randy Moss. He was dealt for the seventh overall pick in 2005. The other was Russell Wilson and he was shipped to the Broncos, including the ninth overall pick. How did that work out?

[Ocho]

It worked out beautiful. Are you talking about Russell Wilson?

[Joe]

Hold on. They traded him to the middle to the Vikings. I mean to the, the Raiders.

[Ocho]

Oh yeah, that didn't work out too well. But he, you see where he. When he went to the Raiders though. They weren't good back then. Huh?

[Joe]

Huh. But Randy Moss was already a Hall of Famer though. Ojo, hold on. He was 28. Hold on, hold on. How old is Dexter Lawrence, Neil?

[Ocho]

I don't know.

[Joe]

He gotta be at least 29, 30. Wait, how long he about to be 29.

[Ocho]

Ain't nothing wrong. Ain't nothing wrong with that. We talking like Dexter Lawrence is some scrub or something.

[Joe]

Are you talking about Dexter Lawrence like he, like he.

[Ocho]

Aaron Donald, defensive tackle in the league, Jeffrey Simmons, Chris Jones. Aaron Donald is going and Dexter Lawrence. What are we talking about?

[Joe]

No, I'm not shaking him. I'm not, I'm not taking him over Jordan Davis right now. I'm not. Even. Even though I have, I have concerns about his conditioning, I'm not taking him over what you call him, Jalen Carter.

[Ocho]

Okay, well that, you know, that's your personal opinion, but I'm just saying, based on what Dexter Lawrence has done since he's been in NFL, he's a very, very good pick and he's worthy.

[Joe]

I paid him for what he did in the NFL. I'm paying now. I got to pay him for what he gonna do moving forward. See, you will see, that's your problem. That's why you couldn't be a gm, because you're gonna pay everybody based on what they've done. I gotta pay you back. I pay you based on what you're gonna do moving forward. He already got a big contract. I can't keep paying him based on what the hell he's done. I gotta pay you based on what I believe.

[Ocho]

Have you seen our defense? Have you seen the Cincinnati Bangle defense the past two, three years?

[Joe]

Yeah, and I don't think it's gotten any better. That's Jim Show. Hey, we gonna show you. Hey, hey, hey. Uncle, he don't either. Uncle. He just in denial right now. We ain't talk about the river in Africa, you know. Yeah.

[Ocho]

Listen, y' all say, oh, he had a bad season. Why'd you go get him? There's nobody else to get. We have to. And then now you telling me, oh, my goodness, the draft is coming up. We're gonna get a player in the draft that gotta come in and make an immediate impact. It ain't nobody doing that either.

[Joe]

So, you know. So. So, so why should anybody take Reuben Bane, Caleb Downs? Because they right now, they got Caleb Downs in the mark going number 11 to your guppies.

[Ocho]

To my who?

[Joe]

Your guppies.

[Ocho]

Please stop disrespecting my teams.

[Joe]

No, we cannot.

[Ocho]

I don't say. Hey, I don't say nothing bad about your ponies. I don't say nothing bad about your ponies.

[Joe]

Okay?

[Ocho]

You can't.

[Joe]

We were in the playoff back to back year with a rookie. Some of your team didn't do it

[Ocho]

up on the couch two weeks after we did.

[Joe]

What you saying my quarterback got hurt? What was your excuse?

[Ocho]

Our quarterback was hurt too. Put our quarterback on the bench.

[Joe]

Yeah, his feelings was hurt. That's the only thing that was hurt. His feelings.

[Ocho]

Hey, you know what? I'm so. I'm so glad y' all talk about. I'm so glad y' all talk about my goddamn Bangles like this, huh? And the moves that we making, we showing y' all that we not being cheap. They always talk about Mike Brown being cheap. What is Mike Brown doing? He putting his mouth with the money. Yeah, he's showing y'. All. Okay, we have to improve defensively. So what do we do? We go and get proven players that have done it before.

[Joe]

Based on. Based on that 0.5 sacks. He was not the third best defensive tackle in football. I'm just saying. Based on last. Okay?

[Ocho]

Okay. Last year. Okay. But still. Still one of the better players, even though he didn't have the amount of

[Joe]

sacks you'd like worth the 10 pick in the draft. Absolutely. You gave up a 10 pick in the draft, and you're gonna have to pay him 28 to 32 million dollars a year. I wish I might.

[Ocho]

You might not do it, but there's nobody in the draft better than Dexter Lawrence at his position right now, and there's nobody defensively that's better him at their position.

[Joe]

I bet that you just talked. You just talked to Big Mac. You just talked to Big Mac. You just talked to Big Mac over Ohio State.

[Ocho]

So are we really doing that? So you saying Big Mac is. Is going to come in and be better than Dex Lawrence right now?

[Joe]

Are.

[Ocho]

Are we really doing that? Are you betting your money on that? Talk to me? Huh?

[Joe]

Yeah. All I'm just saying.

[Ocho]

Come on now.

[Joe]

To give him the 10 pick in the draft, and you got to give him a contract on top of it. Got him like it's sticky. Gots to be more careful. I ain't think they had no more money left over there.

[Ocho]

Hey, hey, Joe. Don't play with us like that, Joe.

[Joe]

No.

[Ocho]

Hey, the cap. The cap continues to go up every single year. There's always money. And if they ever tell you there's not no money because they don't want to pay you, if they want you, they gonna. They got some wiggle room. You hear me?

[Joe]

Yeah, yeah, yeah, they got.

[Ocho]

Hey, they know. They know how to make room.

[Joe]

Joe, when I saw this today, I said, man, Ocho. Good boy. Ocho gonna be so happy.

[Ocho]

You right. You right. Now, let's see somebody. Let's see Derrick Henry run the goddamn ball now, huh? Let's see him run the goddamn ball. Matter of fact, let's go.

[Joe]

Let's see him throw the ball.

[Ocho]

Knacking D.J. turner. They picking everything off like a booger. You hear me?

[Joe]

Hey, y' all already know Lamar owned Cincinnati. L. Jack owns Cincinnati.

[Ocho]

Yeah. Hey, well, I can't wait till football season, boy. Huh? Cause I'm gonna have you crying. Well, you. They gonna be crying. I want you to remember this day. I want you to remember this day. Joe, you over there laughing, too. Don't think I ain't forgot about you and your. And your goddamn Falcons, huh? We gonna see who get the last laugh.

[Joe]

Joe. Joe. Joe, like the Cowboys.

[Ocho]

Hey, Joe. You live in Atlanta, Joe.

[Joe]

Hey, man, I didn't even catch that you called me a Falcon fan. I'm not a. I Like the Falcons, Ocho. But I'm a Cowboys fan.

[Ocho]

All right. But I'm. I'mma pray for you too.

[Joe]

And. And Destin Laur ain't the third best because he ain't better than Cam Hayward for the Pittsburgh Steelers either. And Matabe is back from Baltimore and he's not better than him.

[Ocho]

Hey, have Matabe and Cam Ward and. And Cam Hayward ever had. Had the seasons that Dex Lawrence has win?

[Joe]

Yeah.

[Ocho]

When? When. When have they ever had a season like. Like Dex Lawrence, his best season? When have either one of them ever had a season like that? Oh, yeah. I'm ready. Come on now.

[Joe]

Come on.

[Ocho]

Yeah. Come on, sugar. Ready for this? I put that on my cheetah pants. Neither one of them has. Yeah. Come on. Come on, Ash. Bring it up. Ash.

[Joe]

Hey. Hey. Destin Lawrence has been the three point Pro Bowls. Cam Hayward. Cam Hayward is a first tag. First team all pro four times with seven Pro bowls.

[Ocho]

Who've been playing longer?

[Joe]

What we doing here?

[Ocho]

Who been playing longer? Yeah. Come on now. I'm ready. I'm ready.

[Joe]

I'm just telling you my guy better give me. Madam.

[Ocho]

I'm listening. Who been playing longer? Cam Haywood is what, 30? What 30? 37. 30.

[Joe]

Huh. Let that sink in. My guy 36. Your guy 28. And my guy putting foots in your guy who

[Ocho]

played six, seven more years. What we talking about?

[Joe]

And still. And still playing at a higher level than your guy. That should cause you calls for Paul

[Ocho]

a few years ago where they didn't want to pay him. What we talking about?

[Joe]

And he still. And he balled out.

[Ocho]

He have. He ain't have a choice. They had nobody else doing nothing out there. He ain't have a choice. What we talking about? Hey, we on my topic now. We on football. So I'm ready for everything you throw at me.

[Joe]

Yes. Huh?

[Ocho]

Let's go.

[Joe]

Hey, my guy missed all last year and he's been to one fewer Pro bowls with one fewer season. So my guy gonna be better than your guy.

[Ocho]

M m. Listen, I'm not here to disrespect anybody. I'm here to uplift my player that we just got. I'm not worried about what your uplifted. I'm not worried about what they've done in the past. I want to know what have you done for me lately? And the season hasn't started yet. And that's all that matters.

[Joe]

You just about. What have you done for me lately? Your guy had a half a. My guy missed the entire season. Your guy played in 17 games and. And had half a sack more than what my guys.

[Ocho]

I tell you what.

[Joe]

And you talking about, what have we done for me?

[Ocho]

It's 2026.

[Joe]

Your guy done nothing.

[Ocho]

It's 2026. And Dexter Lawrence is better than everybody you just named. I can tell you that. And you can add and ask and ask.

[Joe]

You realize matab bequest had 13 sacks in a season.

[Ocho]

Say it again.

[Joe]

All of a sudden, now, all of a sudden, you sit on a tree branch and turn your head.

[Ocho]

Wait a minute. Who has, who had 13 sacks in the se. What position does Matabue play? He doesn't play D tackle. When did he have a 13 sack season at D tackle? When?

[Joe]

You're scaring me, you're scaring Joe. And I'm gonna have to hang up

[Ocho]

on you in the upper echelon of the tackles with goddamn Aaron Donald. He ain't had no 13 sack season.

[Joe]

Chris Jones have had 15.

[Ocho]

Chris Jones is the best tackle in the league, along with Jeffrey Simmons.

[Joe]

Oh. Oo, yeah, I'm ready. Go look it up. Google him. I'm. Just the facts, ma'.

[Ocho]

Am.

[Joe]

Just the facts, huh? Just the facts.

[Ocho]

What are you talking about, Joe?

[Joe]

I'm talking about Matabe is a better defensive tackle than. Than, than, than, than. Than.

[Ocho]

Definitely not. And you only believe that because you're Ravens player and former player. That's the only reason you believe that. That's it. Where was. Where was Madam BK last year?

[Joe]

He was hurt.

[Ocho]

Why was he hurt?

[Joe]

Season. That's why they couldn't get. Why was he hurt? I don't know why it was hurt. I think he hurt his neck.

[Ocho]

Oh, my neck.

[Joe]

Oh, you mean to tell. Hold on. You mean to tell me your guy was healthy all year and only gave you a half a sack?

[Ocho]

Hold on. You know why he got half a sack? Because the goddamn greedy ass defense ends took all the goddamn sacks. Huh? Let me tell you that. Why did they have all the sacks on the outside? Because they refused to run the ball. Got up the goddamn middle.

[Joe]

Hey, Joe, I was just at Whole Foods this morning. I had more sacks. I had two sacks than what he had all year in 17 games. I was just at Whole Foods this morning. Ask him. I was in the self checkout, two sacks.

[Ocho]

Hey, so, yo, you mean. Hold on, your player. Your player had no sacks and he was hurt last year, right? But for some reason you think he's better than Dex Lawrence and he. He didn't even play last year. So you bet you think he's better off of something. He did two years ago.

[Joe]

I told you, my guy missed the entire season and had a half a sack less than your guy who played 17 games.

[Ocho]

That. That means. That means. That means my guy would still be better either way because yours didn't do anything last year.

[Joe]

What? Your guy just collected a check.

[Ocho]

So what's your guy. Did. He collected a check all last year and ain't do nothing?

[Joe]

I mean, he got a night. He got. He got a sexy dance, though. He got a sexy dance? Yes. He got a second.

[Ocho]

Don't be hating on us. Don't be. Hey, hey, hey. You know what, Unc. Hayden, I'm. Ha. Okay. Hey, don't. Don't hate on us trying to improve our defense.

[Joe]

I'm. I'm not mad. I just think you gave up a bit much, don't you? That's all.

[Ocho]

Cuz. Hey, cuz. It ain't nothing. Ain't nothing. F. To come in there and make the Bengals.

[Joe]

Wow. Oh, Joe. Oh, Joe, Joe, Joe. Here we go. Mat be played two games. He had two sacks. Your guy played 17. Half a sack. Your guy played two games last year. Had. Get up. Oh, yeah. See, Ocho, that's. Hey, I don't. I don't like this.

[Ocho]

They don't even. They don't even double team him, Joe. Yeah, they don't even double team him. Listen, when you play. When you look at the scouting report, when you. When you play the goddamn Ravens, well, they talk about Kyle Hamilton. You know, that's the focal point. You know, Kyle Hamilton, you know, we got to deal with him. He's the versatile one. We got to watch where he lines up at.

[Advertiser]

Huh?

[Ocho]

We ain't talking about nobody on that goddamn defensive line, you say the early 2000s. What are we talking about?

[Joe]

They were talking about. They was talking. Hey, they talk about Brian Burns.

[Ocho]

Yeah. Hey, double digit sacker.

[Joe]

I mean, look here. If you got a double digit sacker.

[Ocho]

Hold on both sides, though. Double digit sackers on both sides, and

[Joe]

you mean to tell me you can't get but a half because they.

[Ocho]

Hey, they going away from you, Monk. They going away from him.

[Joe]

Don't you think they should be?

[Ocho]

Why you. Why you think they not. They not allowing the pocket collapse and they running. They running outside away from him, huh?

[Joe]

Let me ask you a question. You believe Dexter Lawrence better than Quinny. Quinny Williams because you said he was the third best D tackle. Now, I done named a couple of them. He keep going lower and lower.

[Ocho]

That's. Hey, that's. That's a good one, huh? That's a good one. They up there. That's a good one. Can I ask you, can I ask you a question at, at any point when we talk about some of the better D tackles in the NFL? Was Quinn Williams ever in that conversation with Dexter Lawrence? Yes. Let me finish with Aaron Donald, with Jeffrey Simmons, with Chris Jones?

[Joe]

Yes, it was.

[Ocho]

Okay.

[Joe]

Yeah. I mean, first of all, Aaron, Aaron is, is a history.

[Ocho]

Oh, yeah, absolutely.

[Joe]

You talking about Aaron Donald. You talking about one. You, you, you can make a case. Aaron Donald is one of the greatest defensive all time. Not, not just in, in now in the last 10, 15 years. You talk about the history of the game. You can make a case for Aaron Donald. 3 Defensive Player of the Year, 8 First Team All Pros, 10 Pro Bowls. He went to the Pro bowl every year he was in the league. He was an eight time first team all pro and he was defensive rookie of the year. So we're talking about one of the historically great players in the history of the NFL. So all the guys that you're mentioning, they're good and great in their own right, but they ain't him. When you start talking about Aaron Donald, you start talking about guys like Ricky White. You talk about a guy like John Randalls. Talk about guys like Ray Luke. Yeah. You talk about his, the Pantheon. Pantheon players. I ain't taking Dexter Lawrence over, over the big D tackle out of Seattle that we had on boy.

[Ocho]

Good.

[Joe]

Yeah.

[Ocho]

Now that's, now at that, at that point, you know, when, when it, when

[Joe]

that big buck, a buck, the forest buck out of an indie, he keep going dark every time I name somebody.

[Ocho]

Vita Veya, I mean, that's, it's all, it's all based on preference.

[Joe]

You better stop. Stop while you behind. You behind right now

[Ocho]

again, y', all, you, you're disrespecting Derrick Lawrence and what he's done to date. We are, we are. We. We're disrespecting his resume and what he's done.

[Joe]

Acting like he just, I just think,

[Ocho]

yo, he act like we just talk about some slouch. Talk about one of the best in the game. Okay, he had it down.

[Joe]

All I'm saying.

[Ocho]

Does that mean I'm not good anymore? Absolutely not. Because after that down year, I had three more, I had three more 1,000 yard seasons. Yeah, come on, what are we talking about?

[Joe]

All I said is that I thought they gave up, yo.

[Ocho]

I mean, okay, if you're saying they gave it too much, who in the draft that is, that, that had, that blew college out of the water that's gonna come in and do what Dexter Lawrence has done through his NFL career right now. Who's gonna come in and do that?

[Joe]

You say you love Reuben Bane. Reuben Bane might be there.

[Ocho]

He's not going to be there. He's not.

[Joe]

I hope he is. Mesador, you got big, big big Mac. These.

[Ocho]

These players are not gonna be there. You know that. When it comes to the draft, the best are coming off the board. Forget what the team needs. If the best is there, he's gone. And you talk about the upper echelon, talk about they're gonna be there at 10.

[Joe]

Okay. All right. I hope you for your sake, Ocho.

[Ocho]

I'm never wrong. I'm never wrong when it comes to football, though. I'm never wrong.

[Joe]

You. You gave up. You gave up the 10th pick and you're going to have to pay him a contract. All right. We'll get you out of this. It's time for our final. No, no, no, no.

[Ocho]

I don't want to go. I don't want to go. Hey. I don't want to go. Hey. I took a nap.

[Joe]

Well, we will leave you on after Joe and I get off. Welcome to on the field. Today's hottest sports stories presented by on nicotine pouches. Breaking news here the onvitational is officially launching this October. Big names, big swings, even bigger energy.

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[Joe]

Miami traded Jalen Waller to the Broncos for 22 Jalen Wall and a 2026 fourth round pick to the Broncos for the first round pick this year as well as a third and fourth round picks going to Miami. Ocho clearly. Yeah, clearly the Dolphins are in rebuild mode piling picks. But don't you Got. Don't you gotta have something for your quarterback?

[Ocho]

I don't. I don't know what they doing. I don't know what they did.

[Joe]

They get draft picks though, Uncle Ocho. They got a first rounder and they got. They got a four. But the fourth round was cancel out. But they basically got a first, everybody

[Ocho]

first and the third joke. But we talk about somebody coming in and making a immediate impact, especially at the receiver position. You look at what Malik Willis had when he was at Green Bay, he had some dogs around him. He had some. Some really, really good receivers. They might have been young, but he had some really good receivers around him. Now when we come to Miami, I'm not. This is no disrespect to them. You got brother Tutu Atwell. You know, we. We have some guys, we have some good guys, but you still need that dog Joe. You still need that dog Joe as a quarterback. When you come out there and come hella high water, you know, this individual here, I can count on. I can. For him to get open every single time. They. They don't. I don't. I don't think they have that right now, Joe. They have some good players, but we need a difference maker, Joe. You need one now. You got a quarterback. You saw the situation he came from. You saw what he had around him. You know why he had success in the short amount of time that he did play when Jordan Love went out. I hope to do the Dolphins, they do that. They do. They do the young, young bull some justice. Are we gonna be right back in the same goddamn situation again, struggling?

[Joe]

Well, Ocho, you. You don't think. You don't think. You, you don't think they can go in the draft and get a dog?

[Ocho]

Hey, who do we have?

[Joe]

I'm asking, I'm saying think about this. Think about this. If they, if they rebuild and they reload, we getting rid of Waddle, so we getting rid of. So yeah, maybe we want to start young and grow with some of these. Some of these young talent I like. You know what the thing is? I kind of like a proven commodity now. Everybody, look, everybody ain't gonna be Jamar Chase coming out, right? Or Justin Jefferson have those title rookie seasons. Yeah. Or Randy Moss have the outstanding rookie season. But my question is, hell, the happiest people in the room are the Eagles because they said if Jalen Waddle went for a. A first and a third. Y' all got me a curse, though. Your old joke. If Jayla Waddle go for a first and third what the hell is AJ Brown worth about?

[Ocho]

About the same or better about.

[Joe]

I don't think anybody gonna say Jalen Waddle is a comparable receiver to A.J. brown. The problem that A.J. brown, that everybody knows is that they know Philly want to move him and they know AJ Brown want to be moved. Yeah. So that's kind of the thing. Like, we know y' all want to move him. We just not gonna flinch and give y'. All, we're not giving you two first rounders. That ain't happening. Right.

[Ocho]

I think first and the third. First and the third is good. The first and the third is good. I think he's still gonna get moved. I think it'll probably be after June. I think right now. Yeah, I think it's gonna happen in June. But they know he doesn't want to be there.

[Joe]

They hold on, though. But if it happens in June, I mean, you, you, you can't draft the draft compensation next year because, you know, they're working on the plan Ocho to try to extend draft picks out to five years. Basketball is seven years. Football is three years. So they're trying to work out a proposal and propose it like, you can trade draft picks up to five years in advance. So.

[Ocho]

Hey, I, I, I, I don't like it. On, I don't like it. Listen, I know they have a new regime over there in Miami. You want to tear it all the way down. I hope they keep Devon H. Hand.

[Joe]

Yeah, they say that.

[Ocho]

Don't think about giving him away because right, right now, that would be your best offensive weapon. They still need some type of veteran presence for those young receivers, someone that they can count on for that quarterback. You got, you got to have it.

[Joe]

No, the Broncos gave up a first round pick. They gave up this, they gave up their first round pick this year and a second round pick. But hey, they, they, the, the, the fourth Broncos to the fourth to do that.

[Ocho]

Look at the defense. They can afford to do that. They just.

[Joe]

Me, I'd rather have AJ Brown. I'd rather have AJ Brown.

[Ocho]

Wait, what are you talking about?

[Joe]

For the Broncos as opposed to water.

[Ocho]

Okay, I understand what you're saying.

[Joe]

Oh, you said you'd rather have wall.

[Ocho]

A.J. brown. A.J. brown is obviously the better player. But hey, Waddle ain't no goddamn slouch. Now, we can't do that.

[Joe]

Right, Right.

[Ocho]

We talk about somebody that can also take some short, take some intermediate and go, yeah, yeah.

[Joe]

He didn't take it out. He's a deep breath. Yeah.

[Ocho]

See, I, I, I, I don't I don't want to just put Waddle in that. In that boat. We're saying, you know what, he's just strictly a deep there because he's so.

[Joe]

No, no, no.

[Ocho]

I've seen him catch some short stuff, you know, take it.

[Joe]

Yo, for sure he got speed to burn now. But. But, I mean, all honesty, Ocho, I don't look at Waddle as a one. I don't look at Courtland Sutton as a one. No, I don't. You don't.

[Ocho]

You don't think. You don't see set as one, huh?

[Joe]

Nope, I don't.

[Ocho]

Okay. Okay.

[Joe]

I don't know. I think the thing is people like, well, he's the number one receiver. Okay. Yeah. Every. Everybody got. Everybody got to be somebody, got to be the number one.

[Ocho]

But we know. We know what makes.

[Joe]

But when I look at a number one Ocho, I look at a guy that says, they going in the game, they gotta stop him.

[Ocho]

Okay?

[Joe]

I don't think people go in the game saying that we got to stop Courtland Sutton, we gotta stop Jalen Waddle. They go in the game, say, we got to stop Tyreek, we got to stop Jetta, we gotta stop Chase. I think they go in the game, we gotta stop Puka. I think they jsn. They go in the game saying, we gotta stop those guys. Those are. Those are the guys I look at as.

[Ocho]

Okay, I see what you mean.

[Joe]

That's a one. I look at a Nico Collins, That's a one to me. Oh, now everybody got their own opinions, but I look at a one is that somebody put him the game plan, said, we gotta stop him.

[Advertiser]

Yeah.

[Joe]

And I don't. I don't. I don't.

[Ocho]

When I look at Waddle, obviously, and a lot of people probably wouldn't agree with me, for someone that has speed to burn, that can take the top off a defense the way he does, that can.

[Joe]

Yes.

[Ocho]

Shorten intermediate routes and turn those into 70 and 80 yard touchdowns at times. If he's the only viable option offensively, defense adjustments when they come out the huddle are made. We have to worry about this individual right here. When he goes.

[Joe]

Look at his number when Tyree got hurt, what his number looked like when Tyree got hurt.

[Ocho]

And we also know why that was.

[Joe]

See, but my thing is, Ocho, whether TJ was there or not, whether your Scott was there or not, you did what you did. That's what ones. It don't matter. It don't matter. Okay? The number two can go out. The number three can Go out. Okay, so that's. That's how. That's how. That's how I judge the number one. I. I get it. Yeah, he caught this. But no, like I said, I judge number one A differently than most fans judge number one. But, hey, to each his own. Yeah. And I'm not saying they're not. They're bad players. But I'm saying my criteria for being the number one. You got to be that boy. You gotta be. You gotta be that boy. You gotta require special attention. If somebody got a number one corner, they need to see you.

[Ocho]

Yeah, I know. What? Just got much, much, much better with what they have already. Much better.

[Advertiser]

Who?

[Joe]

The Broncos? Yeah, absolutely. But I don't know. I don't know what. I don't know what the Dolphins are doing. They got so much. Oh, Joe, they got damn near $200 million in dead money.

[Ocho]

Oh, they don't care. They ain't tripping. They're not tripping. We can demolish everything and start all the way over from scratch.

[Joe]

Damn. How you feel about your Broncos, man? I mean, what y' all missing? What you think y' all need now?

[Ocho]

Y' all got every goddamn whole field.

[Joe]

Nah, I still look. I. I, we solid. But if you look at the. Look at the teams. When I look at the teams that, like, I look at the Rams, they got a number one receiver, Puka. Yeah. And then you got devontae. You look at jsn, you look at the teams, and they got. I just like. And look, I. I think Bo is. Is. Is good. I thought Bo had an unbelievable season. It would have been great to see what the Broncos could have done had he been healthy. We'll never know. Do I think they would have won if they'd had both? Would it beat the Patriots? Yes, I believe they would have, but that's neither here nor there. I. I want to play making tight end. That's what I want. A playmaking tight end. They don't have that. They got guys. Yeah. Nothing special.

[Ocho]

Oh, I don't know. Y'. All. Y' all loaded everything.

[Joe]

Hell, go get Darren.

[Ocho]

Y' all loaded that receiver.

[Joe]

We got a bunch of receivers, but ain't no hell raisers. Man, I don't need. Ooh, you need a difference maker. The days okay. The Patriots could win with. With a hodgepodge of guys, man.

[Ocho]

Come on, now.

[Joe]

Everybody keep on thinking. Everybody keep on thinking they gonna be. They gonna be Kansas City. Well, you gonna be Kansas City. Your quarterback better be Mahomes, Cuz sometimes you need your guy to make that guy look good. We're gonna find out. Because guess what? Everybody start down in the bottom in the ravine. Ocho, you don't. You don't. You don't get to pick up where you left off. You don't get to pick back up at the AFC Championship, NFC Championship, or the divisional rounds or the playoffs. You got to start all the way at the bottom. What have you done for me lately? Hey, that's it. And don't nobody care about last year. Last year ain't got nothing to do with this year. Hello. You know, hey, you know, man, you know, you got the homeboy. Man, I used to date a. I used to date a lawyer or doctor. Where she at? Now, you ain't got no doctor or lawyer under your arm, so I don't know what you used to have. I'm telling you what you got right now. You know, homeboy. Man, hey, A. Man, hey, she a lawyer. Yeah. Hey, man, what I look, man? Sharp, man, you know, she was tripping. You didn't see like she was tripping when you slide out on credentials. Oh, yeah. She had med school. All right. Right, right. Hey, hey. They can't wait to brag on the girl, can they? Hey, you got a homeboy. Hey, Sean, what you think? She nice. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Got your little something. Yeah, you know, he'll heal a little old doctor. Yeah, okay, thanks. That's your cat dating for a little while. Yeah. She got her own paper. Yeah. She bad boy. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. This boy you gotta watch out for, man. I will. Hold on. Who's that? Simba Was topic telling the story about how he. He introduced this girl to the game and game sliding.

[Advertiser]

The girl.

[Joe]

Dm. Oh, man.

[Ocho]

Who's that? Who's the game?

[Joe]

Hey, hey, hey, hey, hey. You know, Hurricane game. The game. Hey, hey, hey, hey. But y' all know how the game played. Now, y' all know it's. It's some cats out here who don't mind now, hey, putting that knife in your back and twist it a little bit. Yeah, hold on. I introduced old boy to somebody. I said, hey, man, this okay right here? Yeah. Hey, y'. All. Now, mind you, I don't say no name, but I did put a word in for him. Help them get a job with a team in the league.

[Ocho]

Take your time.

[Joe]

Now, I enter right there. My people right here. Yeah, she nice. She nice. How? Two days later, she sent me a favor. You know him. He don't smell.

[Ocho]

Damn.

[Joe]

It was nice to meet you this weekend.

[Ocho]

Oh, that Dirty business.

[Joe]

Oh, boy, I done had something worse than that.

[Ocho]

Joe, what happened?

[Joe]

Joe, talk to me. Hey, I had. Did I call him?

[Ocho]

Oh, you called him.

[Joe]

I said, bro, I introduced you. Nah, man, I. I thought that was her. What difference does it make?

[Ocho]

Hey, he playing nasty, huh? He playing nasty. Joe, what happened with you? Joe?

[Joe]

Man, this was a long, long, long time.

[Ocho]

Take your time,

[Joe]

man. I was. I was. I was dating this girl, and one day after practice, she hit me.

[Ocho]

She hit me.

[Joe]

She going off. She was like, I can't believe you think I would try trying to run with one of your teammates, this. That. I'm like, what are you talking about? She was like, one of your teammates called me, said, he got my number from you. I'm like, so he got my number from you. I'm like, man, I ain't got nobody. So somebody didn't win. And my phone during practice, and they got the number out and then hit her, and now she think I'm the one put. I told him to. Yeah. I mean, yeah. I don't do no dirty business.

[Ocho]

Hold on. Time out, Joe. He went in your phone and got the girl number?

[Joe]

Yeah, man. Got the girl number, called her, then tried to throw his little whoop down that dirty outro. Yeah. I can't believe you ain't had no. Oh, man.

[Ocho]

Can I be honest with you?

[Joe]

Yeah. Hey.

[Ocho]

Hey, Joe. And all like, I normally never been number one. I always. Always been in the number two spot. Most of the time, most of my life, most of my, you know, career. Especially during my.

[Joe]

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Ocho]

That's why I'm so cautious. Cause I understand how the game goes. Because I'd have been number one so long, I didn't seen everything and had worked, you know, So I. I always thought.

[Joe]

You mean you'd have been number two?

[Ocho]

Yeah, I'd have been number two so long. So I didn't. Seeing all the plays and. And all the stuff that they do and the lies. And I didn't, you know, you sitting here with me, you on the phone with him. Oh, I'm about to go to sleep. And so I understand that. So I. I've always been real cautious about being number one because I understand how it was to be number two so long.

[Joe]

Absolutely. Absolutely.

[Ocho]

Anytime I see any kind of confusion on or I see any. Any signs.

[Joe]

Oh, that one thing you will do now, My homeboy got no. My homeboy Ocho ain't got no problem being around. He still circus coming. He dress up immediately.

[Ocho]

Hey, hey, Joe. Oh. Oh. Are you trying to be funny. Oh, baby, we can make it a comedy show. That's what you want to do, you know,

[Joe]

But, Joe, I can. Joe, I sit there, I. Hey. I walked up to him, I said, hey, but bad hey. This my boy right here. We worked out together. Yeah.

[Ocho]

Hey, hey. And Joe, Joe, You've been in the big league, Uncle. You've been in the big leagues. We live a different lifestyle. You hear the stories all the time, Joe. You know how. You know how the game goes. Yeah. Big face, big fish take little fish. It's always been that way. And most of the time.

[Joe]

But I, I. If I go around Ocho, I go around somebody. I ain't even looking. As a matter of fact, I don't even feel comfortable. I'm gonna move. I'm gonna. I'm not. Bro, Check this out. So we there. Me and I know. I know old boy. I know to do. I. But one of his homeboys. So, you know, I'm. You know, I'm doing what I'm doing. I'm working. Yeah. So. But leave. Go to another station. She like, babe, I want to get you upset, but do he know that I'm with you? I was like, yeah, why? He said, but because every time you look away and I look up, he winking and smiling. Oh, yeah. So I like, for real? I said, okay. I say. I said, maybe you. Maybe it ain't like that. She said, you know what? Maybe you right. So we go sit down. I'm done with my thing. We just sitting on the couch. We just sitting there. She lean over. It ain't my imagination. You're doing it for real. And I told him that I was with you, and I think it's disrespectful. Damn. So I said, well, let me. Let me have. She said, no, no. She said, if it's a guy, it's my job to handle it. If it's a lady, it's your job to handle it. She said. I said, don't worry about it. So I called old boy that he was with because I've been knowing him for years. I said, my man, I don't know if you know this, but let me. Let me pull you. Let me pull you. Let me pull your shirt on something. Yeah. He said, what's. He said, what's up, Shot? I said, oh, boy, that's with you. He's being disrespectful. I said, I didn't step to him and make no scene because of you, but him doing what he's doing is a reflection Of. Of you because you got him in your company. Absolutely. I said out of respect to you. He said, you know what? He said, I'm going handle it. He said, give me 10 minutes. I'm going call you back. He hit me back. He said, I handled it, everything that you said. You right. He said, you know, I ain't got nothing but love for you. He said, I've been knowing you since I was in college, and you always been straight with me. Yeah. So I will be straight with you. I handled that situation. I'm like, dude, I said, y', all. But it's. But it's all. It's always been like that with me. I mean, I'm talking to.

[Ocho]

I might.

[Joe]

I might. I don't go out that much. I might go out one time. Yeah. Talk to the girl. She called me. Oh, you. Why you tell such and such. I said, I didn't tell nobody nothing. You think I want my business out there? Well, he said that you said he done went back because he saw us talking. He done went back, told the girl that I told everybody the locker room I was having sex with her. Oh, man. Hey, see, that's why I move. That's why I move by myself.

[Ocho]

It's a dirty game, Uncle Joe.

[Joe]

Come on. It is. It is always been. If I. If I. If I see somebody with somebody, it ain't no misunderstanding. She with him. I don't care what the capacity is. Right. If I see y' all out of the club, I see y' all at a restaurant. I'm assuming y' all together. Hello. I'm cool with it. Yeah. It's too many. It's too many to try to butt heads with you over one. Absolutely. I don't care how good she. How beautiful she is, and there have been some beautiful women, but, nah, it ain't that serious, man.

[Ocho]

Hey, Joe, you know, for, you know firsthand, boy.

[Joe]

Yeah.

[Ocho]

You hear me?

[Joe]

It's a dirty game, Joe.

[Ocho]

You not Joe.

[Joe]

But see, Ocho, you keep the twelves, though. You keep a 12. That one thing about. Hey, look here. He keep a 12 over.

[Ocho]

I didn't say. I didn't say that. I didn't sat down, Joe.

[Joe]

I'm saying you. By you. You ready to get married?

[Ocho]

I'm about to jump. I might. Two brooms, huh? Hey, matter of. Matter of fact, I'm gonna say after. After I whoop your ass, I'm gonna jump the broom.

[Joe]

Hey, hey, bro, I don't want to love you up for your wedding now. I just need three minutes. Three Minutes just for us to swell, man. But who does that, Ocho? You. I ain't no way somebody say, hey, this is my girl, Ocho. Hey, how you doing? Such and such. And then you gonna slide on a dm, man, you gonna be winking at her.

[Ocho]

That's even. I didn't. What. What I done showed you.

[Joe]

You showed it to me now. You did. There's some cats out there like that.

[Ocho]

My grandma. My grandma always had a saying, Joe. My grandma, my grandma. How would you know about this? Why are you talking to me like this? Like, baby, I don't understand. I don't. I don't care who you're dating. Ask me. You make it. You have to understand most of the people that you're going to meet at this point now that you are who you are and you're making what you make. It's not who you are, it's what you can do. And she might say she love you. But if anybody asking your girl is single, depending on who the person is asking, Joe, you're not hearing me, Joe.

[Joe]

I'm picking up what you're putting down.

[Ocho]

Depending on who it is, trying to holler.

[Joe]

Absolutely.

[Ocho]

It ain't Sunday. I'm not here to preach. I'm not here to do that. But there have been many examples. Even in the chat, there have been many examples. I'm sure y' all can understand what I'm talking about. And at our level, it's even worse. At that point, it's about opportunity. Many of those that we have access to are opportunists. And when a better opportunity presents itself and they know they can't get caught, they gonna play the game.

[Joe]

Absolutely. But y' all do realize the night has a thousand. On most night, it has a thousand and two. Cause somebody see you. Hello, Hello. Could that happen? I mean, until this day, I shut it down. I ain't say nothing up.

[Ocho]

What.

[Joe]

I ain't saying what. I know who told me, but they saw it. Yeah. Getting out of one car, getting into another. Don't to this day, don't even know. I just stopped talking. Thought they were low as the floating. Found it 1:30 in the morning.

[Ocho]

You know the time and all the

[Joe]

time he called it, told me. Yeah, because this one, because he like, hey, hey. He's like. He's like, dog, you and such and such still together. So you know when somebody asks you a question like that? So I got. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. He's like, hey. I said, what? What you see, dog? Man, I saw her getting out of such and such car. Oh my. Yeah. Yeah. What time was it? 1:30. You know what I said? Like 1:30. He say. He say, homeboy. He said. He said. Cause he called me. He called me room. He called me room. He's like, room. He's like. I was creeping too. Yeah. Yeah. I said, okay. I said, there are certain people that'll tell you things. It's just like God. Just like God himself spoke it to me.

[Ocho]

And sometimes Joe. Joe and Uncle. People ain't got to tell you all you gotta do.

[Joe]

You already know.

[Ocho]

Just pay attention. They tell on yourself.

[Joe]

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[Joe]

We got to get into the shocking turn of events involving Max Crosby. Ocho Raiders broke the news that the trade had sending Max Crosby to the Baltimore Ravens for two first round draft picks had been rescinded. Raiders alleged in a statement that the Ravens had backed out of the agreement reached four days earlier. It was then reported that medical concerns arose during Cosby's physical and were a catalyst for the dissolution of the deal. Ravens GM Eric DaCosta said today, Nobody is more upset than him gutted by actually big regret for me, but we will move forward as a football team. DaCosta added that losing Senator Tyler Lindenbaum to the Raiders of the Ravens began envisioning a possibility of pairing Crosby with Henderson. Excuse me, with Hendrix, whom the team signed today. But Crosby's medical outlook prevented the possibility from materializing. Jane Slater reported that the Ravens considered renegotiating the Crosby trade to account for the team's discomfort with the edge Rusher's prognosis. Ultimately, however, the team opted to withdraw from the deal entirely. Ocho, we don't normally see this. Now. The Ravens have been in a situation where if I remember correctly, the Brock Marion, they really liked him, but he had a Yoda issue. Michael Brockers had a knee issue and they rescinded. They rescinded the the deal that was on the table. But you're talking about a Max Crosby. He did have a meniscus injury. Reports are that he had been dealing with this all year. This happened and started bothering me in the off season. He played through it. He ended up having surgery and the type of her surgery that he has, that's somewhere between a three and a six months month recovery time. And I don't know if it's a lateral meniscus or medial meniscus, but that is a long. Because he had it torn and I guess he had it repaired. If what the reports are true. That is a lot. That's a big timetable. But that puts him on to be recovered probably around June. Ocho training camp starts about six weeks later in late July. So who knows? Like I said, could be early June, could be late June, but still he would have three weeks and I'm almost sure he'd be a limited participant and you kind of build him up to get him ready to go come September. When you heard that the trade for Max. Max Crosby had been rescinded, what did you think? And you like okay, yeah, I've never

[Ocho]

seen anything like that. I've never seen anything like that. Especially a player like Matt Crosby. That's an impact player that makes your, your team exponentially better right away. Just his presence alone and the fact that he rescinded. I didn't know what was going on. The first thing that that that dawned on me, well, maybe he failed his physical. Obviously that that's the only thing I could think of because I know a player, a player himself wouldn't say, you know what, I don't want to be here. And he lets the team knows he doesn't. He. He rather wishes not to not to be here. But once that did happen, I thought about it. Well understand that he. They knew he had a knee issue. He. They knew about the.

[Joe]

He had knee surgery.

[Ocho]

Knew about the knee surgery. I mean I'm confused. What did you expect the physical to look like? Obviously he's in rehab. Obviously he's recovering. He would probably be ready in time for a football season to play. And the fact that he played on it and had 10 plus sacks or maybe 10 sacks this season and he was forced to sit out the last two games of the season, I think he would be okay. He would recover. So I'm confused on why they chose to do this, why they chose, you know, to rescind. To rescind him. Him being there. It makes no sense to me. And I like the fact that they were going to try to pair Hendrickson and Crosby together. Hell, that they would have been hell on wheels. They were able to pull that off.

[Joe]

Yeah, I think if you really look at it, Henderson might be a better pure pass rusher. But overall, I think because Crosby plays the run so much better than Hendrickson, I think he gives them a dynamic and, you know, you got to have somebody that can set the edge and Max Crosby can set the edge, but he could also become very disruptive. Pressure your quarterback and get to your quarterback. Hendrickson, we've seen over the last couple of years in which he wasn't injured, you see the numbers that he's put up. He is a pure pass rusher. Drafted by the New Orleans Saints and ended up going to became a free agency and go to Cincinnati and played extremely well. Reports are that he probably took a little less money to go to Baltimore. But I think there were some hard feelings. He's like, you had years to get this done. Now all of a sudden you want me because I could potentially be going to a division rival. Ocho, look, and I agree with you and everything that you said they knew he had surgery. And maybe you're looking at it because you're looking at it long term because you got Max Cross. I think you owe him one hundred and something million dollars on that contract. Now, if I'm not mistaken, I could be wrong in chat. Forgive me if I'm misspeaking. I think this is the only year in which he's had. He has guaranteed money on the contract. So now I'm looking at Nocho and he's only 29. Okay, yes, he had surgery on the knee, but what doctors can see is that what you, to the naked untrained eye, can't see is degeneration. That it looks good this year, but what happens next year? And as we move on now, you're talking about somebody that dealing with degeneration in the knee. So I got a very Arthritic right knee. Same thing with the left knee. And I got basically bone on bone on the lateral side, which is the outside. And I'm damn near bone on bone on the inside, which is the medial meniscus. And what has happened. As I've gotten older, stuff start to happen. This is why. And you see it with a lot of old people ocho that didn't play sports. Your body just get older and cartilage starts to dissipate, and you get that bone on bone. I'm fortunate enough to be in a situation where I can afford, you know, great medical care and I don't have to all this hangups. I can go, okay, what's going on now? Insurance company wouldn't take care of whatever I had going on, so I had to pay for my own mri, no problem. And then I go to one doctor. He says, okay, you can do X, Y and Z. I go, come to the doctor out here. I'm at curland job and go to the doctor that did my hips. And he looks at it like, well, Shannon, let me explain it to you. It's an X, Y and Z, so forth and so on. But, you know, you got degeneration, degenerative knees, and eventually, hey, I'm not telling you anything that you didn't already know. You're gonna have to have knee replacement. If not one, probably both of your knees. But the right knee that I'm looking at now, you're gonna have to. So I think that's what the Ravens doctors are looking at. That okay, yeah. This healing up properly. But we see some degeneration in this need, and that's never good because, you know, to be on the hook for a need. That could be just me speculating. I haven't talked to anybody, but I'm sitting as a doctor, you probably looking at his Ravens like, hold on now. In order for this to make sense to us, oo because you got to realize what we're giving up. We're giving up the number 14 pick this year, and who knows what that pick. You hope that if we. If the trade would have gone through, we somewhere 32. Ideally 32. If we give up the 32 pick next year. You know what that mean? Oo we won the Super Bowl. Most definitely 31. That means we were in the Super Bowl. Honestly, 29, 30. 29, 30. Oo we in the championship.

[Ocho]

This what I'm thinking about. You think about a player that's 29 years old. 29 years old, yeah. A player like Matt Crosby that's a disruptor. He's been in the NFL for a few years and if you give, if you take an MRI, if you do MI of all the players that have 8, 9 or 10, 10 years or more, I'm sure there's something alarming on everybody's mri. If you look at it, it, it always is. Nobody is 100% healthy. Everyone has issues, whatever it may be. I just know the Mac Crosby that we saw that was on the field last year with the Las Vegas Raiders was an impact player and he made a difference every time he was out there. Even doing a losing effort, he was still a disruptor. He still was able to set the edge. He was still able, able to disrupt, disrupt the pass depending on who they were playing. It really didn't matter. No one can stop him. You can only hope to contain a player like Max. So to let him go because of what you see, you know, in an mri, when he was already hurt last year and he's recovering, he has rehab and you doctors have the resources to get him as healthy as possible. And you know what you get with a almost healthy or even 90 or 95 Mac Crosby and you let him go. And understanding what he can do for your team and making your team exponentially better, you know, especially if you pair him with Henderson. I'm like, I, I don't, I don't, I don't, I don't, I don't see. Listen, it's a business decision on their part. I just understand, as great as he is, even with a, a messed up knee, where he's going to recover, where he's going to rehab, there's no way I, I sit him back and it, but obviously I. Listen, I don't own, I don't own the goddamn Ravens. It ain't my decision.

[Joe]

You ain't got a hundred plus billion dollars. I mean, look, I mean, but, but here's the thing, Ocho. What if I told you you can get a very similar player. Hold up. And this is what they do, Ocho. What if I told you I could get you a similar house for about six to seven million dollars cheaper. The payments will be cheaper monthly, pretty much the same house, maybe a, a 500 square foot different. But I'm it. But, but it's going to be probably over the course of it, I probably say you about $28 million. But I'm gonna get you a very similar house right there. A two acre lot, nice size infinity pool, probably about 12,000 square feet, seven baths, full baths, you know, two half baths, you know, eight bedrooms, gorgeous. A theater. If I told you I can get you a similar house to the one that you really love, but I'm gonna save you $28 million, would you be interested? And, and, and you're not gonna have to give up those two first round picks. Would you? Could I?

[Ocho]

You could, you could, you could. But I'm, I'm, I'm. I'm in the now right now. I'm in the now. I'm not. I'm not worried about down, down the road. I'm trying to.

[Joe]

Okay.

[Ocho]

If I'm playing poker, I'm putting all my cars on the table. I'm putting all the cars on the table and I'm trusting my. I'm trusting my doctors to an extent, because I want Max here.

[Joe]

You got to.

[Ocho]

I want Max Crosby here. We got. Goddamn. We got Trey Henderson in the building. We negotiated his contract. We have Max in the building. I'm taking all my cards and I'm putting on the table. I'm out. I'm out.

[Joe]

But here's the thing.

[Ocho]

I'm taking a gamble. I'm taking a gamble.

[Joe]

I. I'm not taking a gamble with two first round picks. If I can get them at a lower rate, I would. I can.

[Ocho]

You talk about two.

[Joe]

I'm not taking.

[Ocho]

You talk about two first round picks, you don't know what you're getting. There's no. There's no telling those two first round picks are coming to make any goddamn difference.

[Joe]

But what if his knee doesn't hold up this year? What if that knee is bad and then I'm stuck? What if that knee is like Dante Culpeppers me? Then what do I do?

[Ocho]

How did he look before they forced him?

[Joe]

How did Dante Cole.

[Ocho]

We're not talking about Dante Copeland. We talk about Max Crosby, the one that played all season.

[Joe]

You gotta base it on the medicals.

[Ocho]

Ocho, he was hurt all season long. He gave you 10 sacks. What are we talking about?

[Joe]

No, he didn't. He gave.

[Ocho]

They made him sit out the last two games.

[Joe]

If you go back and look at it, look at the numbers. Trey Henderson vs Max Crosley, 2019 to where they are now. Who has more sacks? Who has a high pressure rate?

[Ocho]

I don't have numbers in front of me.

[Joe]

And I can get Trey Hendrickson. I can get Trey Hendrickson for about five to seven million dollars a year cheaper than. And I don't have to give up ish. So I can get Ocho. I can get you in this house and you don't have to put a down payment.

[Ocho]

I understand what you're saying, but. I understand what you're saying, but I'm looking at it, I'm looking at it from a different standpoint. As a team, as an organization, as a team, at an organization that continues to miss in the first round. As a team, in the organization that was horrible on defense last year, especially at the beginning of the season, how our, how bad our backing is or was, you know, constantly getting beat. How can I make a difference? I'm, I'm gambling. This is this what, this is what it's all about.

[Joe]

Oh, but you make it seem like Trey Henderson, you make it seem like Trey Henderson is a bum. The man had 35 sacks.

[Ocho]

I'm not calling him a bum. You know, I wouldn't do that. I'm just saying he had two.

[Joe]

But I'm saying, you know, I'm not saying you are, but I'm saying you making it seem like Max Crosby is just exponentially. Hold on. This is not a Miles Garrett situation. If you're talking about Miles Garrett, okay, we have a conversation because that's a two time defensive player of the year and the guy that has like 100 sacks in like eight.

[Ocho]

But you mean to tell, you mean to tell me I get, I get the best of both worlds? I get the best of both worlds. Now on, on one hand, I have a player who's injured, who just had surgery, but I understand what I get based off the small sample size of how I've seen him in Las Vegas, huh? And what he's done on an injured knee. I'm trusting in the pro, I'm trusting the process, I'm trusting the doctors, I'm trusting rehab.

[Joe]

I'm trusting all you chance to trust who, doctor? So why do you have the, why do you have those doctors on payroll if you're not going to trust them to properly evaluate players that are coming in that you're going to have to spend a hundred plus million dollars and give up. First round pick this year, which is number 14 and next year's fourth rounder, a first rounder, I can understand. If it's 32, no problem. That means we won the Super Bowl. But, but, and I get it. Drew Brees had a very similar situation. Miami Dolphins flunked his shoulder on the physical. He goes to New Orleans and we see what happens.

[Ocho]

Now the same thing could happen and same thing it could, same thing could happen.

[Joe]

You know what?

[Ocho]

And, and, and, and for them causing this mess, this, this is what I'm hoping.

[Joe]

Huh?

[Ocho]

This is what I'm hoping. I'm not a crystal ball. But most of the time since we've been on this show, you know, sometimes I've been right. I've been right 98 of the time when I talk about players going certain places and it's come to fruition. You know what would be a funny thing that the bank could do, you know would be a funny thing that the bank could do? The bank go get, go get Max Crosby. They could take that chance. They can trust in our doctors, they can trust in the rehab process and hoping he's back and knowing even with a, a non healthy Mac Crosby, we saw what he did last year, we saw what he did last year where the Raiders forced him to sit those last two games out. I would love for it to happen. I would love for it to happen.

[Joe]

But the thing is, now you're saying I can get Max Crosby. I don't have a problem. I have a problem. If the knee is as bad as the Ravens doctor think it is, we don't know. I'm an untrained eye, you're an untrained eye. But if it's as bad as the doctors and the Ravens believe it is, two first round picks is off the table. Now he goes somewhere else and I have to give up a third round pick or a second and a fifth round pick. Now that's a deal. But two first round picks and gotta pay him $33 million a year. Come on.

[Ocho]

I hear you, I hear you. But, but, but I, I'm, I'm willing. I'm willing to take the chance. I'm willing just like owners do all the time. They take chance.

[Joe]

Well, you're not gonna be no chance. You gonna give her. You about to be, Nico.

[Ocho]

But you have to think about, though. Hey, Chat, stay with me real quick. You have to think opportunities like this to get a player that can change the direction of your franchise, especially defensively, don't come around that often. He don't come around that often. Even with the limping Crosby, he makes a difference. We have to understand who we talking about now. We're not just talking about just the guy. We didn't talk about a jag.

[Joe]

No, no, no, no.

[Ocho]

So that's, that's why, that's why I would be a little hesitant. Okay. We got a little hiccup. Okay. We understand. He had surgery, you know, and I, I, I don't know. I don't know. I'm not sure how I understand how you feel. On it. I'm curious. I don't have my chat up. I'm curious to see what the chat thinks about it, but I. I would take that chance.

[Joe]

I think they go. I think they're back and forth. Ocho. Now, it could. It could be a total situation like this buys remorse. Like, damn, we gave up two first round picks. Number 14 pick this year. We don't know what 27 is going to be. We're going to have to pay him somewhere. 32, 33, $34 million a year, and the knee situation. Or we can go get Trey Hendrickson, play him, pay him 5 to 7 million dollars cheaper per year and not give up anything. Oh, Joe. I can get you in this house. No down payment.

[Ocho]

Yeah.

[Joe]

And I'm gonna save you $28 million. So. Hey. And the thing is, you know, a house, I'm saving you $28 million, and you don't have to put no money down.

[Ocho]

I. I do play poker. I'm not. I'm not a gambler, you know. You know, I'm. I'm cheap. I'm financially celibate. I'm financially celibate. But in this situation, there's certain situations at the gm, as an owner, understanding how bad I was, understanding where my weaknesses are, especially defensively. And it all started. We talked about it all season goddamn long. Not only was the back end bad, Hell, they couldn't get. They couldn't get no goddamn pressure. Nobody. This is one where I'm folding. If I got a hand, I'm folding based on who the player is, regardless of what?

[Joe]

That.

[Ocho]

That.

[Joe]

No, do you mean the pill? But you're gonna play the hand. Fold means you throw your cards in.

[Ocho]

Oh, yeah, I'm throwing my cards in on Crosby. He. He coming. Come on. Oh, come on.

[Joe]

No. If you can't throw your cards in, you throw your cards in. Oh, now. Oh, so in other words, you're saying you shoving, you going.

[Ocho]

Yeah, I'm going all in with surgery. Whatever. Forget. Listen, okay? If the Costa. Is that his name? Dacosta? I would listen to what the doctors say. Okay? What? This is what you see. Okay, you know what? I'm taking a chance on him anyway. I'm taking a chance on the way.

[Joe]

I'm not. I'm not, so. Because anytime, you know, you start getting $100 million, you know, you got to go to the owner with that. So he's gonna ask. He's gonna come in there, he's gonna want to sit down with Dr. Curl. I know Leanne Curl. She was, she was the team doctor. She was there when I was there bringing her in. What do you think, doc? Look, I understand the player that is, but it's risky.

[Ocho]

I, I like, I like. Hey, hey, I'm taking that risk. We ain't talking about just anybody. We talk about a top five player at his position. That can change. Can you imagine Henderson on one side, Crosby on the other?

[Joe]

Like before you go any further, Diana receded reported as part of the proposed trades for Max Crosby, the Ravens were also prepared to sign him to a revised contract that would have paid him near the top of past Russia's market. Max agent C.J. lA Boy responded with two words, Fake news. So everybody keeps saying that the, the goal, the objective was to sign Crosby and Henderson. Max Crosby's agent said basically that's not true. Crosby still could get traded, but he ain't. They're not getting no first round on it. They're not getting no first. I don't believe they'll get a first round on it. Now, Ocho, now, because here's the thing with the Raiders. The Raiders spent quarter of a billion dollars bringing it, excuse me, new players because they thought they would have Crosby number off the books. Yeah. Now the question is, do you rehab him, keep him, or do you try, do you try to move him on you? I don't, I me personally, you're Definitely not getting two first. I don't believe you can get a first, but maybe a second and a fifth.

[Ocho]

Second. Second and a third. Second and third. Second and third. Hey, hey, Mr. Brown. Mike Brown. I know we got a lot, I know we got a lot of Bangle fans in the chat. Hey, he coming to Cincinnati?

[Joe]

Huh?

[Ocho]

He coming to Cincinnati. Why not? Why not make it make sense? And you know what I like? I like the fact that the Ravens did this. I like the fact that the Ravens played, played this game, you know, so basically they telling you how they feel about you anyway, so what better, what better message? What better message?

[Joe]

You go to the right, go to a division rival, and then not only

[Ocho]

that, now you got a chip on the shoulder. Now you done pissed him off, huh? Oh, so that's how y' all feel? Okay, I'm gonna show you. I'm gonna show you. And how can he get him back? He can get him back by his play on the field. You can get.

[Joe]

Yeah.

[Ocho]

And that, that's the type of player he is.

[Joe]

Do you think this hurts Baltimore's reputation around the league to have a deal in place? Because the deal is not consummated until the player now he has to pass that team that's training for him. Doctors, physical, they have to be okay with it. Do you think this hurts the Ravens reputation? Because prior to this, for the most part, the rep. The Ravens reputation has been.

[Ocho]

Yes. Perfect.

[Joe]

Pristine.

[Ocho]

No, absolutely not. It's still the Baltimore Ravens. It's still a. It's still. They still are who they are. When it comes to business, when it comes to money, players are going to go where they're wanted. Players are going to go where they're valued. If money talks, they will be there. Now, for us, the talking heads and those on the outside looking in, maybe we might feel this situation might ruin their reputation. But when it comes to business, when it comes to money and when it comes to. It's time to get paid and the team is willing to pay you, and if it happened to be the Baltimore Ravens and Mr. DaCosta and whoever else they going.

[Joe]

Right. I agree with you, Ocho. I just think the thing is it became. You look at it like, damn, two first rounders. I don't think anybody else had that kind of number. You hear Dallas had a first and a second. You hear some teams have some other picks, but nobody a first. Two first and, but still, even, even. Even first. When a guy coming off surgery, See, that's what. And I was telling you last year about Kirk Cousins, I said, ocho, you giving up $180 million guaranteed for a guy that's coming off Achilles, a quarterback that he wasn't mobile to begin with, and you draft the court and exacerbate the matter. You take a quarterback with the number 8 overall pick and so that's what that was. My concern is that a guy that's come. If max Crosby was 100% healthy, Ocho, he had no surgeries. I think two ones is fine. But coming off the surgery, I'm a little more apprehensive that I would be had he not been coming off that surgery. I know sometimes you got to roll. You got to roll the dice. New Orleans was willing to roll the dice. But here the difference is with Drew Brees. Drew Brees didn't cost you any compensation. And basically it was a deal worth $10 million. Yeah, we're talking about a deal worth north of 100 million in two first round.

[Ocho]

Yes, I understand it. I know what you feel. But those for those two first round picks, they ain't coming in making that kind of difference like Max, they ain't gonna make that kind of noise. If you get Matt Crosby at their healthy. I. I just know.

[Joe]

So if, look, he still could be dealt.

[Ocho]

Oh, he gonna be. He's gonna be there, you know, right there. He gonna be at Covington airport. I'm gonna pick him up. Don't worry about it. Yeah, I'm gonna pick him up. Don't worry about it.

[Joe]

Which would be. It'd be very interesting. Don't show you. I mean that could happen. But what if he goes to the Browns with Miles Gay?

[Ocho]

Oh, hell no. Hey, hey, come on, man. Hey, come on, man. Come on. Hey, hey, don't do that. Don't. Hey, don't, don't, don't do that. Don't do that. Don't do that. Hey, just the thought of that, that's. That's nasty work. That's nasty work.

[Joe]

Look, I. Would I be surprised the Patriots get involved? Would I be surprised if the Eagles get involved? Is there a situation where the Bears could become involved? Anybody that think they're close, if they are past Russia away, I'm like, okay, we know two firsts are off the table. I'm not so sure a first is on the table. How do we get a deal done with how do we get a deal done between you and I with Max for Max Crosby? Ocho, you say you'd be willing to give him for two and a three. Okay, maybe a two and a three this year and a, and a four or a fifth according to how he plays. The fifth goes to a fourth if he gets double digit sacks. X, Y and Z. But don't be surprised if somebody you like. Ah, man, how they let the Eagles get this man, how they let the Patriots get this, man?

[Ocho]

I mean in the.

[Joe]

Because I saw the Patriots, they let Anthony, Anthony Jennings go. Anthony Jennings go. Good pass Russia. Solid pass rushing. Not great, but solid. Set the edge, you know. Hey, the one thing that the Patriots linebackers can do is set the edge. They're big guys. Set the edge great against the run and pressure a little bit. So now you get him and you get Chase on and you get Milton Williams got something or you pair him with. With the Bears, you got something. So it, it, hey, Detroit, because you, you hear somebody was looking at, I think was it the Patriots or the Eagles was looking at Grinnerd from the Minnesota Vikings. He look, you can never have enough pass rushers. That's one thing you can never have. Just like pass catcher. You can't have enough of them. They're hard to come by. That is an art form. So Max, like He said, He Dr. Neil Elatroche at curling. Joe performed the surgery. He says he's tracking quite well, but at the end of the day, I don't think he's. That's what he's supposed to say. I think, you know, everybody's saying the agent said what he's supposed to say. The doctor that performed the surgery said what he's supposed to say. But at the end of the day, the Ravens and their medical staff have to feel comfortable enough when they go to Steve Bashadi, because Steve Bashadi is going to be cutting the check in excess of probably $100 million. 33 million dollars this year is guaranteed. No guaranteed money. On the Dallas Cowboy head team trainer Daniel Cooper was instrumental in the Ravens backing out of the trade. Cooper, who's a knee specialist, guess what, Ocho. He did the Patrick Mahomes surgery. Normally he does surgery that's really, really complicated. The Patrick Mahomes surgery. You remember Jalen Smith? He signed up on the. Jalen Smith.

[Ocho]

Yeah.

[Joe]

Yep. Malik Neighbors. He reviewed Crosby's recent niche surgery MRI and deemed it too risky. Oh, man. Now you're talking about. You talking about. Because here's the thing. When you know, when you like the kind of money that these teams have, they're sending you to the best of the best. Whatever. What, the spine got a head guy, the foot got a knee got a back. Whatever it is, you going to the best, you ain't going to. They. If you got something going on, they can't figure it out. They send the ass to John Hopkins, they sending your ass to the Mayo Clinic. They sending you to MD Anderson, they sending you to the Cleveland Clinic. They sending you to the best of the best. And. And it's like, that's why they command. That's why they get the big bucks. That's why they get the big bucks. And most of the guys, you go into the curling job office and you look up there, them jerseys on the wall, you see Aaron Donald, you see Clayton Kershaw, you see Verlander, you see Cooper Cup. And you see if it's somebody. Russell Westbrook, you see those jerseys on the wall? Thanks, Doc. Gave me my career back, got my life back.

[Ocho]

You understand why I got you. I just. Hey, I see them doctors. They. Man, hey, let me, you know, see, young man, I'm. I'm hot, boy. I'm hot. I'm. I'm hot. I'm hot.

[Joe]

But now y'. All. Now you guys might be in place.

[Ocho]

Yeah. I just don't like that you know how to. Doctors to me, it. It almost seems like, you know, not other doctors from other teams are speaking out about it and. And speaking about the knee and like, it's decreasing his value and what he can get and what his worth is. I hate that. I don't like the fact that they're diminishing. You know, this young fellow who had. Who had rehab, who had surgery and is trying to do everything he can to get himself back into the playing shape and playing form, and now we got all these doctors, and I just.

[Joe]

That's what they do, Ocho. I mean, teams, like, if you got a back injury, more times than not, Dr. Watkins is going to do it to do the surgery. If you got foot problems, you go into the guy Anderson, I think is in Charlotte. Hey, they got. They pay these guys. They put these guys on retainer, and they pay these guys a lot of money. You mess up, they're gonna fire your ass. They will fire you. There's a reason why. Dr. Andrews, you see what happened with

[Ocho]

the Dolphins, right, With Drew Brees. Now, this can be the same thing. They say, oh, no. They said, stay away from Drew. They. And look what he turned out to be. This could. This. Could. This could possibly be. I'm. I'm just saying I understand what the doctors are saying.

[Joe]

It could be.

[Ocho]

I understand these doctors. Yeah, they get PA the big bucks. Everybody heals differently. Now, what you see might not be the way or the outcome in which you think, based on what you see as a doctor, it might not affect them ever again. Again.

[Joe]

Mike. Max Crosby tweeted. Everything happens for a reason. Believe nothing you hear and half of what you see. I'm a Raider. I'm back. Run that ish.

[Ocho]

Damn

[Joe]

me personally, oo. I think there's a greater chance he's on some other roster. Eagles, Bengals, the Patriots, Chicago. I think there's a greater chance he's on one of those roster as a. As opposed to State. Now, he could. He could. He could.

[Ocho]

I'mma tell you what my grandma used to tell me long time ago. What you say, tell me why. When you speak, you got to understand that the tongue is powerful and you got to speak things into existence.

[Joe]

Power in the tongue, you know, and.

[Ocho]

And today, you know.

[Joe]

Oh, you finish. He tried to speak. He tried to speak to cars.

[Ocho]

Hey, man. But by the powers invested in me, I'm. I'm hoping and praying that. That brother Cosby, I. Hell, he might be watching the show. Come on down here to Cincinnati, man. We.

[Joe]

We.

[Ocho]

We gonna take good care of you, huh? Hell, you can have my goddamn knees. I don't need them no more.

[Joe]

Come on, brother Crosby. That's what you.

[Ocho]

Yeah, yeah. Yes, sir. He got. He got a chance.

[Joe]

What if. What if Cleveland jump in on it?

[Ocho]

Nah, that ain't gonna happen. They got. They got Brother Miles. They got. They got brother Miles.

[Joe]

Just imagine him and Miles on. What's he on one side, they have too many pieces.

[Ocho]

They need to pay. On the offensive side of the ball, they don't need to be. They don't need to worry about nothing else.

[Joe]

Defense, it seemed like they going to the draft because they damn sure haven't done a whole lot.

[Ocho]

Yeah.

[Joe]

As far as quiet.

[Ocho]

It's quiet over there. It's quiet over there.

[Joe]

Now, it could be a situation where I'm thinking Philly. Hey, man. Hey, Patriots. What y' all want? What y' all gonna give us, AJ the reports are they're holding sturdy. Sturdy on a first round pick for eight.

[Ocho]

I mean, I don't.

[Joe]

I don't see what doesn't seem to be. No one's biting on that.

[Ocho]

How you not gonna bite on it? I mean, I'm. We. We know what he is. We know what he can do. We know what he is. We know what he can do. Not too long ago, he was just the top five receiver in the NFL based on the production. Now, the production wasn't the same. We know why the production wasn't the same. That's neither here nor there. We don't need to get into that. We have a discourse on that. You know, first round pick for A.J.

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[Ocho]

What do we talk about? Makes us that much better. But hell, Romeo Dobbs. Romeo Dobbs went to the. Went to the Patriots.

[Joe]

The Patriots.

[Ocho]

Yes.

[Joe]

I think the thing is, look, it seemed like Cleveland's loading up on Lyman. They got. They got. Yes, Officer Lyman, Elkin Jenkins. I think they got another guy from Green Bay. That seems to be what they're doing, Ocho. They haven't really gotten the skill position players we know in. Joku's leaving and. And we feel that they need. Look, they got Harold Fanning, who had a fabulous rookie season. I think they need some help. I think they need some receiver help. I think they need a stud receiver. Now. I don't know if AJ Wants to go there, but that would be a great place. You gonna get targets. They might be inconsistent because until Shador grows and matures into that position or Andrew Barrett said that, look, we're gonna put this thing up, and it might be between Shador and Watson Deshaun Watson, I don't know. But dealing with Crosby, I, I think I, I see both sides of the prism. I see what you're saying. You said, hey, he been so good, man. Hey, I, I'm willing to shove all in. I'm go all in. I understand the risk that are, that is involved, but I'm willing to absorb those risks to get a player of Max Crosby. I also understand the Raven said, man, this is an awful lot of money and we got to give up two first round picks for a player that our team staff, our medical staff is saying has a degenerative knee. I see both sides of the equation. I'm glad, I'm glad. See, I want easy decisions. I want, I want, I want Lebron James coming out. Yep, I got him. I want, I want Shaq coming out. Yep, I got him. I want Tim Duncan coming out. Yep, I got him. I want it easy. Oo, man, you know what? Matthew Stafford coming out. I got Stafford. I got it away. I wouldn't even like that, Ocho. I don't want to have like, damn,

[Ocho]

that's a, that's a part of the game. That's right. That's right.

[Joe]

Jamar, jamarcus Russell or, or Calvin Johnson. I wanted Peyton Manning or, or, or Ryan Lee. I don't want it like that. I want to slam dunk.

[Ocho]

It's never like that.

[Joe]

I don't want. Hey, oh yo, I want those. I don't even want a free throw. I want a slam dunk. I want Shaq, I want Duncan, I want LeBron, I want Stafford, I want Elway, I want you. I want it easy. And, but this, that's why you bet your big bucks. I mean everybody talking about, oh, it's easy, it's easy. Boom, boom, boom, boom, boom. The breaking news overnight, Joe the John Harbaugh was in talks and made his decision. It is the new New York Football Giants. Jordan Schultz reports Harbaugh is expected to be worth five years. A hundred million. Excuse. Yes. Five years, $100 million. 20 million per year. What the reports were he was looking to get that 20 million PER. He was looking to get 10 million for his staff and he wanted total control of the roster. I don't know what all he got but the reports are it is a five year deal worth an estimated $100 million. I don't know if he got the 10 million for his staff support. I don't know if he has total control of his roster. But 10 years is a, is, is, is. I mean, excuse me. A hundred million Dollars is a lot of money. I think only andy Reid is $20 million per year. Eight years ago, John Gruden signed a 10 year, $100 million contract with the Las Vegas Raiders, which raised eyebrows. According to Connor Hughes of snn, in the days before telling the Giants he was going to take their head coaching job, John Harbaugh sought out and contacted positional coaches from Brian Dayball staff to pick their brains on the state of the roster. Several of the coaches had never spoken to Harbaugh before and they told SNY they talked for about 30 minutes about the INS and outs of the team when we, when, when Harbaugh was fired. Well, whatever the case may be, Steve Machado, when he was fired, relieved of his duties. Yeah. I felt someone of his, of his stature was looking for a team that had a quarterback. That is the quickest way. Look at Chicago. Yeah, Ben Johnson took that job. What did they have in place? A quarterback. The New England Patriots. When Mike Brable took that job, what did they have in place? The quickest way to get to the playoffs, to get on the winning track is to have a quarterback. They believe they have their quarterback. John Harbaugh, more importantly, believes they have their quarterback. That is why he took this job so quickly. Joe, what do you think? You like to hire? I, I, I, I like the hire, but I'm wondering what harbor. Do you think that was the best quarterback situation? You think that's the real reason why he took that job off? I mean, obviously they paid him what he wanted, but I mean it's, I think, honestly I think he could have got that from anywhere. But that's, I mean if he could have got that anywhere, it's a lot of enticing jobs out here, man with a lot of talent versus, you know, he got scatterable and the receiver, them dudes coming out with extremely, you know, unfortunate injuries. You know what I mean? Yes. I'm wondering from a talent perspective, do you think that was the best team that he probably could have went to? Okay, here are the teams. Arizona, they don't have a quarterback. They're going to move on from Kyler Murray, they have Jacoby Brissette. The question of the Tennessee Titans, they have Cam Ward. But he, it seems to me he believed that situation. With that roster, you look at the defense, Brian Burns, you look at Dexter Lawrence, you look at Abdul Carter, who they took very high. They had Wonder Robinson, that came off a great season. I get what you're saying about Malik Neighbors, but he should be up to speed because that injury happened so early in the season. He should have a full recovery. Scatter.

[Ocho]

Boo.

[Joe]

We don't know about that. We'll see how that thing. It seems like it's progressing now. They do need some offensive line because the problem is they. He took the before. Before Jackson Dark got in there. He was taking a lot. Russ was a quarterback that sacked a lot. Now you're gonna have to protect Dart, and Dart's gonna have to protect himself from taking unnecessary hits. You're not a running back. You're not Derrick Henry. So you need to get that thought out your head. You need to be smart. Don't be afraid to run out of bounds. Don't be afraid to get on the turf. Sometimes you have to know when the journey is over. But if you look at the jets, you like the Jets. They don't have a quarterback. And that. That. That franchise is in disarray is dysfunctional. The Giants has been. Have. Has been dysfunctional for a period of time. But all things being equal, I trust the Giants in that situation. And I don't know what. Maybe it's just. I'm hoping the Giant situation more than I trust the Jets. Okay, The Falcons, I think. Me personally, I think the Falcons have more of the talent, but they still have undecided issues at the quarterback position. So you look at the teams that have it, that have openings, I think the Giants have the best quarterback situation. Do they have more talent than Atlanta? I don't believe they do now, but they have a quarterback. And it doesn't matter how much talent you got, you better have a quarterback that can pull the trigger. Right. Okay, I understand that part. I just feel like it's a lot of other teams, especially when you look from the defensive side. Oh, I know. You gotta have a quarterback. You gotta have guys at skill positions. You gotta put points on the board. Well, if you can't stop nobody, man, you're gonna be in trouble. I don't know how great the Giants defense was, so, you know, that's probably what more I'm looking. I'm looking toward, you know, I'm like, okay, what. What are they? What is their defense like? Well, if you. You could predict the best way if your defense is subpar is to keep them off the field. If you got a quarterback that's turning the ball over, if you can't run the football, that is the quickest way to put your defense back on the field. Right now. You could be just porous and not be schemed schematically or don't have the pieces in place. A lot of Cowboys. Cowboys offense is sensational. What you trying to say? The Cowboys offense is sensational. It's your defense, whether it's schematically now. So look, you've had a history of this, Joe, for the last decade. You've gone through a ton of different defensive coordinators and with the same results. Your offense is in the top five, your defense is in the bottom five. That's not a good recipe, but I'm looking at just the coach just now. If Green Bay was available, I would tell him to take his ass to Green Bay. Right, Right. Because they're going to get Michael back at some point. Now, I don't know if he's going to start Week one, but there's a chance he's going to. He's going to play at least, let's just say for the sake of argument, somewhere between 11 and 12 games. If he stays healthy, they might start him on the PUP list and then he'll have to miss the first four games. But you look at them defensively, you look at the offensively. Their quarterback, they got Jordan Love. They got receivers, they got a running game. They got a nice. They got a nice offensive line. But of the position that were available, Miami. You like Miami. Their defense isn't that good. They don't have no quarterback. They're going to move on from Tua, it seems like. I like Ed Chan. I love him, he's sensational. But they need offensive, offensive line help. They got waddle. So we'll see. I like Darren Waller at tight end. He showed me enough that he still has juice in orange and he should be. He should come back. But I'm just looking at it from a standpoint of teams that have available coaching positions. The Giants have the best quarterback situation based on what I saw this year. Now, that could change. Cam Ward could come back and have a stellar sophomore season. Because we see it. Yeah. Yeah. And we don't know. I don't think it's. I don't think it's bad. Maybe if they had five or six more games, maybe he missed a game and he comes back. But of the. The coaching, the coaching vacancies that available. I like the Giants, I like the Falcons overall, but I like the Giants quarterback. And like I said, I think I laid out pretty good chat. If you look at the team, look at. Look at where the, the Patriots were last year or look at coaches now, they're in the division around the playoff. Look at the Bears. Yeah. In the division around the Playoff. Both teams playing at home. Now, they did go out. They signed, the Patriots, signed Stefon Diggs in free agency. They got big Milton Williams. They, they brought some guys in and so you like, okay, and you can do some things. I think the Giants are going to do that. And I don't know where they are cap wise, but they definitely need some offensive line help to make sure they can protect Jackson Dart. But I, I like this hire. It's a, it's a proven commodity. Ain't no guesswork. What I wonder if he can do. He's never been a head coach. The man was just the head coach for the last 18 years. Yeah, yeah. So I think he, I think he's a proven commodity. Yeah, I agree. It's, I think it's, it's a great high for the Giants. Obviously you want to be able to keep Jackson Dart on, on the field. Hopefully, you know, he's starting to, he starts to be a lot smarter going in year two. But I mean he, they, they got to put, they, they, they got to get a defense on this that can help the offense. Obviously, like you say, you want, you want the offense to stay on the field so the, so the defense don't have to work as hard. But for the most part, it looked like Harbaugh wanted more control than anything. Yeah, I, I, look, when you've been in that position, Joe, and you've had some control, it's hard for you to go to another situation and have no control. Right. Especially after you've been at the job for an extended period of time. He's been on the task for 18 years. And to go in most coaches, that's the hardest thing. I mean, when you look at Coach Belichick and coach, Coach Belichick has had total control. It's gonna, for me, it's gonna be hard for me to see him going somewhere where he has little to no control. Right, Absolutely. Because. So I think that's the thing. And look, the reports are Mike Tomlin's not looking to coach. But I like Mike Tomlin in Atlanta. Oh, man. Do you like Mike Tomlin in Atlanta? Man, you know how these people embrace Mike Tomlin. If he came here to Atlanta. Oh, we, he gonna have to find him a quarterback, though. Yes, for sure, for sure. And I think, I think I, I think as far as there's no question in my mind of the team, the openings that's available, they have the best talent, man. They got better talent than the car. Now I like the Cardinals. Now look, you look at what the Cardinals got. They got McBride, who arguably the best tight end in football. They got Wilson, who came on the show like gangbusters. Marvin Harrison Jr. Hey, got Nick this year. Kind of regressed a little bit, but I think he's talented. You get the offensive line, you get, you know, plug a few pieces in defensively. But they don't have what Atlanta has. No, sir. You look at Bijan Robinson, you look at Drake London, you look at Kyle Pitts, you're gonna have to sign him back. They have pieces. And defensively, oh my goodness, that defensive line they got is a monster man. Yes. But at the end of the day, Joe, look at, and we're going to talk about this. Look at every quarterback that's in the playoffs. Only one was drafted outside of the first round. You got number one overall pick, Matt Stafford. Number one overall pick, Caleb Williams. You see number three pick and number two picking CJ Stroud. Number three pick and Drake May. Yeah. Number three picking Sam Darnold. You got to have a bad boy back there. Bo Nixon, Josh Allen, all those number one picks, only one quarterback was outside. If you don't have that, I don't give a damn what your defense look like. Right. Because sometimes your defense is going to have to overcome bad play. They will now CJ Stroud can't play Sunday like he played Monday. They're going home. You for sure, because he gonna put his defense in harm's way. They're not going to have to drive the football very far. And they have more weapons and they're able to run the football and they're able to protect better than what the Steelers were able to do. So he can't have the type of game that he had. But without a quarterback in today's game, the way they have instructed, the way they set it up, you can't win without a quarterback. And so I like this, I like this hire for the Giants. Hey, but I like it too. Well, with these coaches, with these vacancies and let's say you a head coach going into a situation, don't you kind of have some say? So like if you go into a situation like Atlanta, you know, you need a quarterback and they ask you to be the head coach, don't you kind of got some say so some guys who you think you may want to bring in, if you're Mike Tomlin, yes. If you're John Harbaugh, yes. But sometimes you a first year coach, you don't have a whole lot of say. John Harbaugh had to Build up to get that. Mike Tomlin had to build up to get that. Coach Belichick had a lot of control, but he built up and got even more. Andy Reid got some control, but he built up. They got more as they started winning. You coming in and you haven't been a head coach before or you don't, you haven't won, you want to do. You said what, there's only 32 of those positions available. Right, Right. So you're happy to have one of them. Now if you win, you'll get more just like Ben Johnson. I believe he'll get more. More say. Mike Vrabel is going to have more say. But they, Mike was a head coach. He took a team to a championship. He, you know, he's, he's coached in big games before. And so with this situation, you turn that around, you go from 4 and 13 to what, 13 and 4. Ben Johnson, I mean, Chicago, you know what they were over the last several years. Yeah, yeah. But now that you got that quarterback position solidified, they're going to have a little bit more say. Now, mind you, those quarterbacks were already on staff. It wasn't like, you know, Mike Brable selected. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. It wasn't like Ben Johnson selected Caleb Williams. Absolutely. So it definitely helps if you've got a quarterback already on staff. Yeah. Now you can build out your roster how you want and, and, and have some success doing that. So it's going to be very, very interesting. But congratulations, John Harbaugh on the job.

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So I wouldn't have to buy a new phone? Yep.

[Advertiser]

Plus your plan price stays the same for 5 years on experience plans. Nice. Find your reason@t mobile.com

[Joe]

via virtual prebaid

[Ocho]

guard card typically takes 15 days after rebate submission price guarantee on Talk text and 5G data exclusions like taxes and

[Joe]

fees apply when you're teeing off and your clients are watching. It's on when the game goes to overtime and your squad is right there with you. It's on when you swap out that other nicotine pouch for something softer and feel the difference right away. It's on. Onplus nicotine pouches with Nikko silk mesh. No corners, no rough edges. Just the software softest pouch on the planet. When there's nothing between you and what's Next it's on with on plus nicotine pouches.

[Advertiser]

Not all varieties available in all geographies. Warning this product contains nicotine. Nicotine is an addictive chemical.

[Ocho]

I'm U.S. transportation Secretary Sean Duffy. The sound of a seatbelt it's one of the most important sounds in our car. It means everyone is ready and everyone is safe. The more our kids kids see us put on our seat belts, the more natural it is for them to put theirs on too. Make it a priority. Buckle up every time, hear the sound. Make it a habit. Paid for by NHTSA

[Joe]

if you're alignment in charge of keeping the lights on, Grainger understands that you go to great lengths and sometimes heights to ensure the power is always flowing. Which is why you can count on Grainger for professional grade products and next day delivery. So you have everything you need to get the job done. Call 1-800-GRAINGER clickgrainger.com or just stop by Granger for the ones who get it done.

[Ocho]

This is Tab Ramos from inside American Soccer and this summer topgolf is turning into the ultimate soccer destination. They've got a new soccer themed game you can play with your group, exclusive food and drink items.

[Joe]

They've even installed full size soccer goals

[Ocho]

so you can try to hit golf balls right into the net and every

[Joe]

match all summer long will be on throughout the venue.

[Ocho]

And if you want to keep the fun going all summer, you can get the topgolf Summer Fun Pass which lets you play every single day and bring

[Joe]

up to five guests every visit.

[Ocho]

Get yours [e-mail] FunPass.