Nightcap Hour 1: SGA and Thunder TAKE CARE of Spurs + Wemby STILL CONFIDENT

Summary

Nightcap Hour 1: SGA and Thunder TAKE CARE of Spurs + Wemby STILL CONFIDENT

Date: May 23, 2026
Podcast: Nightcap
Hosts: Shannon Sharpe ("Unc"), Chad "Ochocinco" Johnson ("Ocho"), Joe Johnson ("Joe")

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Overview

This episode dives into the instant postgame reactions after the Oklahoma City Thunder decisively beat the San Antonio Spurs 123–108, reclaiming momentum and home-court advantage in their NBA playoff series. The conversation is raw, insightful, and full of the hosts’ signature banter as they break down the Thunder’s deep, unflappable bench, dissect Victor Wembanyama's performance, and consider what's next for the Spurs. The legendary Nightcap trio also riff on sports psychology, team-building, and share classic locker room tales.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. The Thunder’s Bench Dominance

• Thunder’s bench continues to outscore the Spurs: Through three games, OKC’s second unit has outscored the Spurs’ bench 107–28 in only two games—highlighting the depth that has carried them through adversity this season.
• "The Oklahoma City bench have outscored the San Antonio second unit 107 to 28 through the first two games. It's pretty rare for the bench to outscore starters." — Joe (06:44)
• Major contributors included Jerry McCain (career-high 24 pts), Jalen Williams (hot three-point start), Cason Wallace, and Alex Caruso.

2. The Value of Depth and Confidence

• The Thunder have thrived despite injuries, with role players stepping in confidently during high-stakes playoff minutes.
• "What's underestimated about this Thunder team is how they've played significant time without a lot of their key guys...and you have other guys who've just stepped right in and haven't blinked a damn eye." — Uncle (08:37)
• The second unit’s playoff composure was repeatedly contrasted to the Spurs’ struggling reserves.

3. Thunder’s Poise and Second-Half Takeover

• Spurs started up 15–0, but the Thunder bench steadied the ship. Once SGA settled in, the starting lineup and bench linked up and controlled the pace.
• "They didn't blink, bro. They stayed with it and was able to fight back in the game...after the first quarter, hell, they controlled the whole game." — Uncle (18:21)
• Importance of offensive rebounds and timely threes deflating any Spurs momentum.

4. SGA’s Impact and “Flopper” Narrative

• Shai Gilgeous-Alexander finished with 26 points, 12 assists, leading both offense and controlling tempo despite not scoring in the first quarter.
• The crowd’s “flopper” chants were addressed, but SGA shrugged them off: "It does nothing. Doesn't fuel me, doesn't discourage me. It's part of the game. I've been dealing with it for a long time. I don't really hear it." — SGA via Joe (69:46)
• The crew discuss foul-baiting as an “art”, comparing SGA to Harden and Dwyane Wade.

5. Victor Wembanyama's Confidence – and Burden

• Wemby posted another big scoring performance but had only one rebound in the second half and was neutralized with physical play and double-teams.
• "When the ball goes up...somebody find Wimby. It might be Caruso, Wallace, Shay, Chet, or Hardenstein, but they're putting a body on him. Yeah, ain't no free runs to the basketball." — Joe (24:39)
• Spurs’ lack of bench support increased pressure on Wemby, who remained confident and accountable: “We’re gonna see what we’re made of. I need to be more of a team player.” — Wemby quoted by Joe (41:01)

6. Constructing a “No-Miss-A-Beat” Roster

• Thunder lauded for their roster build—drafting and acquiring tough, defensive, versatile players who maximize opportunities and step up in big moments.
• "There are not very many teams where your key players go out and the bench comes in…and you don't miss a goddamn beat." — Ocho (20:06)
• OKC’s combination of homegrown talent and shrewd acquisitions credited to GM Sam Presti.

7. The Spurs’ Young Core and Learning Curve

• The hosts draw parallels to previous playoff learning experiences, noting the Spurs need to “go through it” for growth (reference to OKC’s own struggles against the Mavericks).
• "The Spurs are going to have to go through what OKC went through…in order for them to get to ultimately where they need to be." — Joe (13:16)

8. Playoff Mentality: Poise, Adjustments, and Grit

• Playoff success, the hosts argue, is about being unfazed, making quick adjustments, and maintaining collective belief—even when taking an opponent’s best “punch”.
• Numerous football/basketball analogies used to articulate the importance of reading-and-reacting during games.

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On Thunder’s mentality:
  "Ain't nobody scared no more. And you can tell by how efficient they not only coming off the bench and hitting shots. Look how goddamn efficient everybody is." — Ocho (14:47)

• On OKC’s star–role player synergy:
  "If I'm Shay…you look at the starters for OKC, everybody was a minus when it comes to plus minus except Shay…you look at, though, they bench plus 28, plus 26, plus 22. Bro, I don't know if it's ever happened like this in the postseason." — Uncle (17:08)

• On constructing an elite bench:
  "When you got great bench players, those are guys who come in the game and they feel like they can start or should be starting." — Uncle (50:18)

• On the art of drawing fouls:
  "That's art in itself too…everybody can't do it. Making it look like it's a foul." — Ocho (67:47)

• Wemby on adversity:
  “We’re gonna see what we’re made of. I need to be more of a team player.” — Wemby via Joe (41:01)

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Timestamps for Important Segments

• Thunder’s bench domination & series stats — 06:16 to 07:18
• SGA’s slow start and Thunder’s comeback — 08:21 to 09:24
• Breakdown of key bench players (McCain, Caruso, Williams, Wallace) — 12:20 to 17:39
• Analysis of Spurs’ issues and lack of bench production — 13:41 to 15:51, 21:07 to 22:11
• Debate: Are any other teams as deep as Thunder? — 18:58 to 22:26
• Discussion on roster building, Sam Presti’s role — 22:28 to 23:27
• SGA “flopper” talk & the art of foul-drawing — 66:27 to 68:16; SGA’s response 69:46
• Wemby introspection and postgame quotes — 41:00 to 42:59
• Adjustments needed for Spurs, future predictions — 29:51 to 32:07, 40:12 to 40:52
• Comparing championship teams, bench effectiveness, and the importance of depth — 55:49 to 56:29
• Classic sports anecdotes and locker room tales — 82:06 onward

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Tone & Style

The conversation is fast-paced, playful, and full of vivid sports metaphors. Shannon Sharpe (“Unc”) brings passionate, seasoned analysis, Ocho provides animated, sometimes brash takes, and Joe delivers a cool, methodical breakdown—mirroring the classic “barbershop” or locker room vibe of Nightcap.

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Takeaways

• The Thunder bench’s overwhelming depth, confidence, and readiness are the clear story—making them look like a potential dynasty.
• SGA’s maturity and his ability to handle criticism, lead, and deliver in the clutch are lauded by all.
• Victor Wembanyama continues to produce but faces mounting pressure; he’s already owning responsibility and calling for more team play.
• The Spurs are learning tough playoff lessons, with the hosts predicting more adversity will be needed for this young team’s growth.
• The role of coaching, front-office team building, and the “art of the bench” are recurring themes.
• Mental and tactical poise under playoff intensity are spotlighted as hallmarks of legitimate contenders.

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For listeners:

Missed the episode? This summary covers the pivotal basketball analysis, player breakdowns, philosophical takes on sports development, and the fun, competitive banter that define Nightcap’s “instant classic” NBA playoff coverage.

Transcript

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[Ocho]

Yes sir.

[Joe]

And after game three, it's one. It's one. Hold up how you get. No, no, no, no, no, no. I was talking about it. Through three games they've outscored.

[Ocho]

Hold on.

[Joe]

How you outscored them over the first two. First two games by. And it's 30, 32, 34 and 32. That's only 66.

[Ocho]

Okay, I see you over there. Plus I see you over there. Little math major. Okay.

[Joe]

Lord have mercy. Hey. Hey Joe. You might need to come out of retirement to help. You might help the spurs out. They need some help. But anyway. The Oklahoma City bench have outscored the San Antonio second unit 107 to 28 through the first two games. It's pretty rare for the bench to outscore starters. The last time it was in game five in 2022 Eastern Conference Final between the Heat and the Celtics. Miami outscored their starters 45 to 18. And again tonight the Thunders bench outscored their starters. Remember who's in that starting lineup. The back to back mvp.

[Ocho]

Yes sir.

[Joe]

The starters and the bench outscored those guys. Victor women. Yama had one rebound in the second half of game three. The Thunder has six different players to record more second half rebounds than Wimy. Wemby had 26 points. He was perfect for the free throw line six or 17 to a throw from the the three point line. He didn't get much help from his, from his bed. They got no help. I mean, all five started within double figures, but that's not enough because they get out to this big lead, Joe. And then when they come in, when the Thunder bring, they shock drop in, they take off and. And kick dust up in the eyes. McCain had 24 points. Jason Wallace had 11 points. But it was Jalen Williams that got him off to the great start. He had four threes in the first half, and that was really the difference in the ball game. He was 5 of 6 from the three point line. Alex Caruso is still shooting the lights out the gym from the three point line. He was three or five from the three point line. Jerry McCain got up 10 threes, but he had 24 big points. Joe, is this series over?

[Uncle]

I'm not gonna say it's over. I just think. I think the Thunder took. Took back command of this series. They got home court advantage back, fellas. They had to win on the road in order to, you know, survive this series. I think the most glaring thing for me, Uncle Ocho.

[Joe]

Yeah.

[Uncle]

I mean, you talk about next man up, bro. You know, you get your all star, Jalen Williams, who's out, but then you get the big hog, another former razorback, Jalen Williamson. The big Jalen Williamson. He come in the man go. What he shot from the three. He shot five or six. Yeah, like I, I think what's underestimated about this, this Thunder team is how they've played a significant amount of time without a lot of their key guys throughout the season. And you have other guys who've just stepped right in, I'm talking about, and filled that void and haven't blinked a damn eye, fellas, you know what I mean? Shay got off to a rough start. He didn't even score the first quarter. And hell, then when you think about it, I thought they f to run them boys up at the gym.

[Joe]

Yep.

[Uncle]

They was up what, 15 to like 2, 15 nothing. Oh, man. I said, oh, Lord. Oh man. Th going to get ran up out the building. It looked, it looked very ugly to start, but once they subbed and you talking about McCain and Caruso and, and. And Wallace and. And Williams came in the game. Those guys changed the whole entire game, bro. They changed the whole game. And then, and then Shea settled in and next thing you know, he was getting whatever he wanted to. He had 12 assists, 26 points. I just think OKC has been tried and tested over and over again, bro. This is what you call a championship win right here, man. Championship win. Great win for them.

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[Joe]

Joe, you talk about how those guys come in and play because I think the thing is is that them playing so much because Jalen William goes out now you get a backup coming in, he's playing substantial minutes, you get Shay going out and you get a backup coming in, he's playing substantial minutes, you get check going out, you get a backup, you get Jalen Williams coming in, playing substantial minutes, you Get Hardenstein going out, A backup comes in, he's playing substantial minutes. Dort might miss some time, and you get a backup coming in. And so now when it's time for them to come in and play meaningful minutes in meaningful games, they're. They're unbothered by it.

[Uncle]

Yeah.

[Joe]

This is what we do.

[Uncle]

Yeah.

[Joe]

Just because you, you think there's more pressure because it's the playoffs. They still is still 12 minutes and a quarter. Ain't nothing changed.

[Uncle]

Yeah.

[Joe]

We still got three officials.

[Uncle]

Yeah.

[Joe]

Point line is still 22 in the corner, 25 at the top. It's a. Every don't nothing change. And so when you go look at them and you look at the moment, they're not in awe of it.

[Uncle]

They're not, bro.

[Joe]

And I think the thing is, Joe, and, and, and I, I like the spurs, but I think the spurs are going to have to go through what OKC went through. You remember the OKC was favored to beat the Mavs.

[Uncle]

Yeah. Yeah.

[Joe]

When the Mav shot them.

[Uncle]

Yeah.

[Joe]

They had to go through what they went through with the Mavs to get them where they are right now. And I believe the spurs are going to have to face a similar fate in order for them to get to ultimately where they need to be. Go ahead, Ocho. What'd you like about what you saw tonight?

[Ocho]

I mean, what I like about what I saw, obviously in the beginning, I thought they were going to run him out the gym, you know, Joe, like you said. But obviously there were eight. They were eight lead changes in. In the first half. And once that second half got there, un. And those young fellas coming off that goddamn bench were doing what they were getting to their spots, making those shots, I kind of knew the game was over and there was really no chance because we weren't getting anything from the spurs bench. And it was too much pressure, you know, for. For the starting five for the spurs to have to play well. And also not just play well, but be efficient and try to match with those. With those not only bench players, but what the starters were doing for the Thunder as well, and that kind of set them back. You know, me, obviously, you know, I did pick the spurs, you know, to win this series simply because of Wimby and him being the complete difference maker and me not really using my mind and thinking about the depth and the way the goddamn Thunder constructed and thinking about the time that Shay missed and them in the regular season not missing the beat. And uncle, like you said, this moment when players are coming in off the Bench and getting quality minutes. Ain't nobody scared of that moment.

[Uncle]

Damn.

[Ocho]

Ain't nobody scared no more. And you can tell by how efficient they not only coming off the bench and hitting shots. Look how goddamn efficient everybody is.

[Uncle]

Yeah.

[Joe]

And that's the thing, when you think about it, guys. I mean, they played really well. The problem that they're getting is that when Wimby goes out, they lose so much steam. Coordinators giving them absolutely nothing. Think about how many offensive rebounds they got. And then hit a three, they miss a shot. You play great defense, and then all of a sudden, they get a rebound. They get a rebound. Okay, now they miss that shot, they get another rebound. Kick to Jalen Williams. He knock a three down. They make the shot. We play great defense, Joe, for five, set for all the way down to five seconds on the shot clock. They took a take to take a tough shot. They get the rebound. They kick it to Caruso in the corner. He let off a three. That's so. That is so demoralizing. That's so debilitating to your team because we can't play any better defense. And the only thing, it doesn't matter how well you play defense, you don't really play defense until you secure the rebounds.

[Uncle]

Right? Right.

[Joe]

That's when you. That's when defense is done.

[Uncle]

Yeah.

[Joe]

Until then, nothing. Nothing has changed. Look.

[Ocho]

Look.

[Joe]

And that's where they won the ball game. You look at McCain make big shot at the big shot. Caruso make big shot at the big. Caruso make big shot. And I think the singles. Biggest mistake that Rob Polink has made, and he's made some for the Lakers, was letting Caruso out of the building.

[Uncle]

Oh, yeah. Oh, yeah.

[Joe]

I think that is his single. That is his single greatest mistake that he's done. Because you had a three and D guy, a guy that you developed.

[Uncle]

Yeah.

[Joe]

A great glue guy, great blue guy, outstanding defense. He can play. He can go. He'll guard a point. He'll guard a two, he'll guard a three. Hell, throw him in there a couple of minutes on the floor to give him something. He's stronger than he looked. I know he looked frail, he looked fin, but he's stronger than he looked.

[Uncle]

Yeah.

[Joe]

He's not afraid of the moment to take a big shot. He plays defense. Hey. He'll take a charge. He'll block a shot from behind. He's phenomenal. He's exactly what they needed. And when you look at this roster and you get a Jerry McCain, you got a Caruso coming off the bench. You got Wallace. Wallace, second team, all defense. Caruso could have been an all defensive player.

[Uncle]

Yeah, yeah.

[Joe]

Chad, second team, all defense.

[Uncle]

Yeah.

[Joe]

Lou Dort plays outstanding defense. Isaiah Joe comes in and he knocks down a shot.

[Uncle]

Man, listen, if. If I'm Shay, you. You look at the starters for okc, fellas. Everybody was a minus when it comes to plus minus. Except. Except Shay, he was a. He was a plus 11. Everybody else was minus. You look at, though, they bench plus 28, plus 26, plus 22. Bro, I don't know. I don't know if it's ever happened like this in the postseason. I mean, J. McCain, I think that's a career high for him tonight. But.

[Joe]

But when you look. That's a career high for him also.

[Uncle]

Yeah, yeah.

[Joe]

But when you look at it, when

[Uncle]

you look at it, you thinking to yourself, man, who gonna come along on the ride with me if you shade?

[Joe]

You like.

[Uncle]

Cause you really don't know Jada about you wish you could get more scoring output from Homebridge, but, you know, he's just not giving you that. And you get McCain come in, he act like he AI out there. I'm talking about getting to his spots, shooting the middies, shooting the three, being disruptive. Him, Caruso, J Dub, man, I'm talking about. It was such a special performance. I enjoy watching it. Because when you get down like that early in the game, you take they best blow. That was the best blow that San Antonio threw. They trying to get him out of there early.

[Joe]

Early.

[Uncle]

Them boys didn't blink, bro. They didn't blink. They stayed with it and was able to fight back in the game. And from after the first quarter, hell, they controlled the whole game, bro. They controlled the rest of the game.

[Joe]

First team, all defense. Go ahead, Ojo.

[Ocho]

You know. You know, I. I got a question, and y' all would be. Y' all would be well versed to be able to answer this. You think about the way the spurs are constructed, not only the five starters, but the way the bench is constructed and the way they're able to score, not miss a beat when some of their key players go out. Name another NBA team that has been constructed where the starters can go out and everyone else will still just be efficient and you don't miss a goddamn beat.

[Uncle]

The spurs has been pretty good. You know, they just didn't. They bench just didn't have a great night tonight, you know, unfortunately. You know what I mean? I just think OKC understood, like, damn, we got to go down here and get at least one. It'd be great if we can. If we can win game three, you know. Now try and be a little greedy. Get game four, see if you can go and get these boys out of here.

[Joe]

But when we go back home.

[Uncle]

Yeah, yeah. I just thought. I thought they were so poised, especially in that second half, coming down the stretch, you can't really. It's like, you know, you. You watch the Knicks. Knicks in the Cav series. You can kind of see, okay, you come set this pick. Let me get this mismatch. It ain't no damn mismatch. They ain't really got a whole hell of a lot of mismatch because Vasile can guard, Champion can guard. Hell, Fox can go. They all can guard. You just trying to put them in a hucklebuck to where they can mess up, make a wrong. Make the wrong decision, and y' all can get something easy for. I thought he started using his guys around him to the T. Meaning McCain, castle. I mean, not Castle, Caruso, Wallace. Yeah, I thought he started using those guys to the T, which is why he had 12 assists. Man, it was just a hell of a performance, bro.

[Ocho]

Yeah, but. But hold on, Joe. Hold on now. I'm saying the way they're constructed, the way the Thunder are constructed, right?

[Joe]

Yes.

[Ocho]

There are not very many teams where some of your key players go out and the bench comes in, and those that are playing that don't start, that get quality minutes come in and be this goddamn efficient. Everything isn't built like.

[Joe]

That's like saying where they. Very many players like Shade. No, they're not. But look at Dylan Harper that comes off the spurs bench.

[Uncle]

Yeah.

[Joe]

Is he not good? Yeah.

[Uncle]

Yeah.

[Joe]

Kelvin Johnson, that comes out that bench. Cornette, in the regular season and even in the postseason has been better. He's minus 37 and 33 minutes in the postseason.

[Ocho]

Yeah.

[Joe]

So he. He's underperformed where these guys were. The. The Thunder have performed or overperformed what we're used to seeing them. So that is the difference. You got one team that's underperforming, you got another team that's. The bench is really good, but that's over performing. Because if you look at what they're doing to the starters, they got 77 points from their bench. Their bench outscored the starters.

[Uncle]

Yeah. Yeah.

[Ocho]

I mean, that's. That's what I was asking. The way. The way that Thunder constructed. Has there been many teams that are constructed like this where you don't miss a beat when you go to your bench?

[Joe]

Well, you really don't know what you have.

[Uncle]

Right.

[Joe]

Until you get in there. You try to put. You try to put pieces together. They. What they've done is done a great job. This team is homegrown with. Except, okay, they trade for Shay early, but look at. They drafted. Check. They drafted all these guys. Yeah, they got. Yeah, they get Hardenstein on, they get Caruso. Chicago was having a fire sale. They basically gave him Caruso feelings. Like, we got Edgecomb, we got Maxi, we got Paul George. We don't need a fourth guard. They basically give him away. Yeah. And so now you. What you've done is that you made a team that was already strong. You made them stronger.

[Ocho]

Yeah.

[Joe]

Because defensively they can guard out of the. Yang. Yang. You look at Caruso, you look at Wallace, you look at Dort, you look at Chet. So you got guys. So you think about it when you see them on the court. They'll never have less than three defenders on the court at any given time.

[Uncle]

Nah.

[Joe]

Nevertheless, hey, a lot of times you'll see them with three defenders. Shay and a big. Sometimes it's chat, sometimes it's Hardenstein.

[Uncle]

Yeah.

[Joe]

But they're gonna have three guys and they can switch everything.

[Uncle]

Yeah. Hey, hey, hey.

[Joe]

That's what makes them so unique.

[Uncle]

And you got. And you got to give Sam Presti some credit, fellas. Like Unc said, hell, he went out there and got Caruso, you went out there and got McCain for a bag of chips and some donuts. It's like, bro. How. How. I mean, McCain, I think the aggressive. The. The aggressiveness that McCain plays with, bro. You know, he understood the assignment, Uncle Ocho. Meaning, damn, we need a second score tonight. You know, we need somebody to be aggressive because there's so much attention on Shay and. And as bad as we want Shay to get loose and break out and have One of these 35, 40 point games, San Antonio too damn good for that. I'm gonna just be honest. He had 30 that last game, had 26 tonight. But if they get contribution from these other guys to where they can play above and beyond like tonight, I'm not saying it's gonna happen every night. Maybe, maybe OKC bench gets outplayed in Game 4 by San Antonio bench. But tonight their bench won them this game, bro. They bench won them this game.

[Joe]

And I also thought, oh, oho. And Joe, I thought San Antonio let their emotions get the best of them.

[Uncle]

Yeah, you see?

[Joe]

You see what happened? Because Caruso, their talk. I'm not giving you no layups. No, I'm a Fire. You go to the free throw line. You go make it.

[Uncle]

Yeah.

[Joe]

Breakaway Castle was getting upset. Yeah, you see, they fought. He's like, no, no, no. You're not getting no layup, you're not getting no breakaway, you're not getting no dunk. You're not going to get this crowd right up, riled up. Take your ass to the free throw line and make them. Yeah, I thought they'll message. And you see they got some ticky tag files. You pick up a file in the back court and then you get another file. They picked up three files in the first half, Joe, in a matter of 20 seconds.

[Uncle]

Yeah.

[Joe]

Three fouls.

[Uncle]

Yeah.

[Joe]

Now guess what? You got them going to the free throw line. You know, Shay, he gonna pump fake you, you gonna get up and then he gonna jump into you. I ain't going to the free throw. Like, you look at it official. Like what? No, you fouled it. Right? They did the same thing in the second half. And then I thought their emotion. They let their emotions get the best of them. Yeah, they're doing a great job. Whatever they decide to say, you know, look, Wim is an outstanding player, but 24 rebounds, they got a body on him every time. That's why you only got four rebounds. It's not his lack of effort. Yeah, go look at him when the ball goes up and see, won't somebody find Wimby?

[Uncle]

Yeah, you're right.

[Joe]

It might be Caruso, it might be Wallace, it might be Shea, it might be Chet, it might be Hardenstein, but they're putting a body on him. Yeah, ain't no free runs to the basketball, bro. Sorry.

[Uncle]

Nah. Hey, hey. And as a series go, if you okc, this is what you playing for. Hopefully we can wear his big ass down. Yeah, he may give us 25, 26 points, but we got elite.

[Ocho]

He.

[Uncle]

He only had two blocks tonight. Obviously. He's still altering shots. But the non Wimby menace, Unc, that you talking about? Hell, he played 39 minutes tonight.

[Joe]

39.

[Uncle]

I mean, what you want him to play 48? He got to come off the court.

[Joe]

He got to come up. But see, I thought. What I thought, Ocho Joe, is that he came out of the game in five with five minutes. Five minutes. So. So basically, 704 on the clock. They put Cornett in. By the time he come back in, they only down four points.

[Uncle]

Yeah, you're right.

[Joe]

Now, I've given you everything I got, Ocho. You know what I'm saying? We got three touch. We got two first. We got a OO done gone off. OO got 105, two touchdowns. Corey Dillinger rush for 84 yards. He got two touchdowns. Like, oh, you looking at the Scott like, damn, we only up three points. We done did all that. We only up three points, right? Think about it. As well as they played in the first quarter, hitting everything, crowd going electric. You look up at the clock, damn, we only have three.

[Uncle]

After all of that, after 15, nothing.

[Joe]

So now, so what did that do to you mentally? We gave you everything we had. Hey, we all up in there. You know what I'm saying? You get, hey, you, hey. Power drive.

[Uncle]

Yeah.

[Joe]

Trampoline.

[Uncle]

Yeah.

[Joe]

And next thing you know it, when you ready to go again, ain't nobody going anywhere but to the ER. Cause if I do anything before 7:30 tomorrow morning, I'm going to the ER so leave me alone. Yeah, so that's what happened to San Antonio. They gave everything they had. Yeah. Okay, okay. What about the second quarter?

[Uncle]

Yeah, man. Yeah.

[Joe]

I don't know what to tell you. And you look at this. The way they built this team.

[Uncle]

Yeah.

[Joe]

They gonna be good for a minute.

[Uncle]

Yeah, yeah. Hey, I was impressed, bro. I was impressed because to be able to fight back in like that on the road in that hostile environment, down 15, nothing, bro. To be able to climb back in that game and Shay don't score in the first quarter. Fellas, come on, man. Come on. I'm gonna keep it real. I'm like, damn. Okay, see in trouble tonight. They in trouble. But you had guys step up and play big bro. Damn.

[Joe]

Hey. In game one, Cornette played nine minutes, he was minus nine, he played 10 minutes. Game two, he was minus 10, he played six minutes. Tonight he's minus 18.

[Uncle]

Cornet.

[Joe]

Cornet.

[Uncle]

Yeah.

[Joe]

Game one, he played nine minutes, minus nine. Game two, 10 minutes, minus 10. Game three, play six minutes, Joe minus 18. It's a wrong direction.

[Uncle]

It said he played 12 minutes.

[Joe]

Well, that's too many. That's 12 too many.

[Uncle]

Yeah, yeah.

[Joe]

That's too many.

[Uncle]

Yeah. He, he, he not he non existence. You know what I mean? He, he don't. He don't clog up the paint. How Wemby does. Like when we down there, it's like they're a little reluctant to even go to the cup, you know, you see a lot of them guys shooting midi, shooting floaters, things of that sort. They. They won't wimby off the damn floor, man.

[Joe]

They do. Yes, absolutely.

[Uncle]

If we ain't in the game, I don't have to second guess none of My decision making. Let's get right to it. Yeah.

[Joe]

Hey, bro, they look at Wimby like the devil. Well, if the devil ain't home. I drive through hell every day.

[Ocho]

Every time.

[Joe]

Oh, Jojo, he ain't home. Yeah, yeah, but I care about going to Courtnet, right, man. Hey, the joke going out of the lane like this. Here in the lane.

[Uncle]

Yeah, yeah. Hey, it's. And. And you gotta look at some Hardenstein and Big Jalen Williams. They two totally different bigs. You know, they both play hard. J Dub, Big J Dub, he gonna take charges. He ain't no, you know, fly. He ain't gonna be blocking no shots. But, man, you talking about somebody who can stretch the floor and make the defense. Be honest. That's what J Dub does, bro.

[Joe]

You gotta play him on his. Joe, you.

[Uncle]

Yeah, because he.

[Joe]

He ain't. Look, he ain't going down there. No. He ain't going past the three point line.

[Uncle]

Nah.

[Joe]

So if we. So basically you like. I don't want women to guard him because he ain't gonna come down there and win. There gonna be no factor at the top of the kill sitting in the damn corner, Right?

[Uncle]

Yeah.

[Joe]

And then you go to hell. And everybody knows the guy when he's on the court, the guy is going to help off of him.

[Uncle]

Yep. Yeah.

[Joe]

Because he. And guess what? He just gonna sit out there with his feet set.

[Uncle]

Yeah.

[Joe]

And let it fly.

[Uncle]

Hey, he did his job tonight. Hey, the. The bench mob won them this game. Now we'll see what type of adjustment San Antonio made.

[Ocho]

But hell, man, I. I hope they make them, Joe.

[Joe]

What.

[Uncle]

What kind of adjustment you think they're going to make, Ocho? I mean, I don't know what the hell they could do, honestly.

[Ocho]

I mean, what else can you do outside. Outside of your starting five and those who are scores? Castle, you know, being a little more efficient. He was very well tonight. Unki had no turnovers. Cast ain't having a turnover. Now back he went out again. He hurt his ankle again. So I'm not sure. I'm not sure what that's going to. What that's going to look like. But obviously you want. When some of your starters go out and they got to get a little breather. You want some more from your bench, Joe? My bench got. My bench got to give me something. Because if the game. If the damn Thunder bench playing the way they playing, I mean, you. You got the match Imano for Imano. If they do. If the bench is playing that well, somebody gotta. Somebody gotta give me Something.

[Uncle]

Well, man, you gotta look at it. If Dylan Harper is hurt and he banged up and he can't give you that 100%. Yeah. OKC got thoroughbreds in that second unit, bro. Ain't nothing wrong with them boys. They could do everything. They can guard, they can shoot the three, they can playmate. They got everything, dog. They got everything.

[Joe]

And the thing is, when you get. Once you get to this point and the Thunder said, we not gonna let you half ass come out here and think you're gonna do anything, Right? We're going to attack you.

[Uncle]

Yeah.

[Joe]

It's like on the Serengeti. The old and the injured get eaten first.

[Uncle]

Yes, sir. Yes, sir.

[Joe]

So I'm coming at you.

[Uncle]

Yeah, yeah.

[Joe]

All they do is start. Okay. With the fact, oh, you young. I got you. He injured, Paul. He limping. They look at. They look, hey. They looking at Dylan Harper. They're looking at Fox. They injured.

[Uncle]

Yeah, yeah.

[Joe]

I'm attacked.

[Ocho]

You know what? Even. Even though the game looked tonight and it was in, it was in, it was in a Thunder favor. I still got the Spurs. I still got the spurs going to seven. This ain't nothing, but hey, this ain't number the goddamn 12 round boxing match, you know? And right now, round three, the Thunder got round three. We gonna let him have that?

[Uncle]

Yeah. Hey, hey. I don't expect you to switch up, bro. I expect for you to stick with your guns. You know what I mean?

[Ocho]

Yes, sir. Yes, sir. Yes, sir.

[Uncle]

Yeah.

[Ocho]

Yes, sir. Hey, listen, I ain't been wrong all playoff long, Joe. It's just a minor setback. That's it.

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[Joe]

Boy, stop.

[Ocho]

I'm feeling good tonight, Joe.

[Joe]

I'm just. And you know, Fox, he hurt that ankle again. Joe.

[Uncle]

Yeah.

[Ocho]

Hey, hey, Unc, he got about 37 braces on his damn shoes, man.

[Uncle]

Yeah. Hey, hey hey. He wearing them damn Under Armours. You see Steph Curry then got out the damn.

[Joe]

Yeah, yeah, he wearing them too. Better get up out them bricks. Hey, hey. I understand that they pay you some money, but what good is that? Yeah, you staying injured in them bricks.

[Uncle]

Hey hey. Cause he looked good, boy, that when he came out to shoot to start the game.

[Joe]

And you see, I can't quit that joke.

[Ocho]

You can move, boy.

[Uncle]

He's twitchy so fast ain't nothing you could. You can't even get there fast enough.

[Ocho]

Hey, he's twitchy, huh?

[Joe]

Twitchy room and cut the light off and be in bed before it get dark. Joke. I saw him, man. That's bad. I don't know what it is with a joker left handed and if he got. If he left handed and quick. Boy, you got hell on your hands.

[Uncle]

Oh, we.

[Joe]

It's just something. It's just something about a left handed guy, period. Whether it's a pitcher, whether it's a bowler. You know what I'm saying? Ocho? A court. Whatever it is, it's just something About a left handed guy.

[Ocho]

It looked different.

[Uncle]

It seemed like they got an advantage, don't a man?

[Joe]

They do. Tennis players.

[Uncle]

Yeah.

[Joe]

The way they, the way they can spin the ball. You look at, you look at Nadal, you look at who's left handed for women. Martina Navratilova.

[Uncle]

Yeah.

[Joe]

You look at kitable. I mean, it's just something about. It's just something about go around. Ivanisovich was lefty.

[Uncle]

Yeah.

[Joe]

It's just something about left handed pictures. Look at the big unit. Man, when that joker stand up on that mile six, ten and a half and he throwing that thing and his arm out here coming from first base.

[Uncle]

Bing.

[Joe]

It's just some. Ah, man.

[Uncle]

Great game though. Great game. It was.

[Joe]

But you know, sometimes, Joe, I can give you. I can get. You can give somebody everything you got

[Uncle]

and it's just not.

[Ocho]

Not enough.

[Uncle]

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Joe]

And that. And that might be the case. We'll see. Like you said, they're going to be adjustments. You see, the last two games, what the adjustment was, what they were for the Thunder. Make sure we get the bot. The ball goes up for the Spurs. Make sure we find some. I don't care who. Find Wimby and put a body on him.

[Uncle]

Yeah, it's, it's. Hey. And OKC need check to step up in, in game four. Because if I'm the Spurs, probably the adjustments I'm going to try and make is to try to calm some of these role players down that's coming off the bench. The McCain, the Carusos, the Wallace J. I mean, I don't know what type of defense you gonna put on Big J Dub because he always gonna pick and pop and he always gonna be out there at the three.

[Joe]

Yeah.

[Uncle]

So they got some.

[Joe]

Don't play him the role, just play him the pop.

[Uncle]

So, hey, look, they got some real decisions to make. Because they do. You know, when you guard Hartenstein, you don't really have to worry about all that. You just have to worry about his hustle, his hard working, you know what I mean? Getting second chance opportunities, things of that sort. But J Dub just brings a different element to the game. They bench bring a different element to the game because they play so hard defensively. They fuel off turnovers and you let them get going and you let them make a shot or two. You see what happened tonight. They'll run them off on you.

[Joe]

Yeah. Yep. And that's. And that's what happens, Joe. I mean, and you know, the thing is confidence is everything in sports, man. You. Hey, Ocho, Let me. Let me. I tell you what. You let me catch two or three pass on that first drive and think y' all gonna be able to do anything with me the rest of the game?

[Uncle]

Yeah. Not at all.

[Joe]

Not.

[Ocho]

Not a chance in hell.

[Uncle]

Yeah, hello.

[Joe]

You mean to tell me we just had a 10 play driver? I got three passes today.

[Uncle]

Yeah. Yeah.

[Joe]

Okay.

[Uncle]

Yeah, because.

[Joe]

Hey. Hello.

[Uncle]

Yeah, hello. Yeah, listen, listen, because all your focus is on Shay. You ain't expecting McCain to come in and drop and get down like that. Yeah, you know, Caruso, he gonna be solid and effective. You ain't expecting J Dub to come in and play the way he played, bro. Yeah, you can't. You know what I mean? So now that you may lock in on those guys, you're gonna need your star players to step up, bro. Hey, they need Check. I. I've always said, since they won, I said, man, listen, the OKC Thunder can be a dynasty, but Chick has to come along and be Shay's co star. He has to. Okay, Ocho, they need. They need him, bro. They need him so bad, Joe.

[Joe]

But the problem is, even when Chad don't give you anything, think about it. Check gave you 14. You had Jayla Williams. Caruso and McCain have more points than him. Yeah, and they play less minutes.

[Uncle]

And how they shoot. How they shoot more damn shots than him. That's what I'm saying. Like, he. I. I think there are opportunities where he can be aggressive, but he just kind of getting it within the floor of the game. He ain't forcing nothing. He just kind of letting it come to him. But there are gonna be times, bro, they gonna need him to. To force the action a little bit.

[Joe]

If. If. If a Wim beguarding you. You shooting?

[Ocho]

Nope.

[Uncle]

No. No.

[Joe]

Hey, he open. Hey, I'm turned. Hey, I've turned into a cell. Magic Johnson. He ain't gonna throw my stuff up in the stairs.

[Uncle]

Hey, you gonna have to outwork his big ass or something. But you got me seven shots in 28 minutes. Come on, man. This. This. I. This my co star. I mean, I've heard Shay ran rave about him, how they've been this championship caliber team since they've acquired, you know, Homer, since they drafted him. Yeah. So I know they looking. They looking for him to step up, man, and have one of those big games. 2512. I'm. I'm looking for that. He gon that in game four.

[Ocho]

Don't happen game four. It might happen game five, but game four is us, though. Spurs gonna make the property you know, the necessary adjustments. Them boys coming off the bench, I mean, the chance of them playing like that again, I mean, it's not likely. They might give you something, but ain't. Ain't gonna look like it.

[Uncle]

Look tonight, I don't know, Ojo. I don't know, man. That's why I said, you know, we talked about what it would look like coming in game three. We, we said the start of the game gonna determine what we were thinking about the refs. We think that San Antonio was come out guns ablazing, 15 0. But the rest ain't had nothing to do with this, fellas. This is all one too.

[Joe]

We'll be on facing the deficit for the first time this playoffs. It's my first playoffs. It's the first playoffs for many of us. Of course there are going to be hard trials, you know, it is to be expected, but now we're going to see what we're made of. They're fit, they're being physical. That the difference maybe with this team is their experience, but they're boying more, more smart about it. But we just have to find answers. There's no place for frustration. It's annoying, of course, but we got to use that energy. When we later said, I feel like I have trouble making my teammates better right now. I need to be more of a team player, Joe.

[Uncle]

Well, I mean, they ain't really. They ain't collect. I mean, they ain't collapsing that hard.

[Joe]

What are.

[Uncle]

What they doing? What they doing is they trying to stay home with the shooters. But hell, Versaille had 20, you know, champagne. I thought he played great. You know, he made some shots. Castle went one for eight. I think that kind of hurt him, you know what I mean?

[Joe]

I did too.

[Uncle]

And I think the thing that you have with Castle is if he has a ball in his hands, Uncle Ocho, he can kind of find more of a rhythm. I know he turnover prone, but when he playing that two spot, you know, he don't get to handle as much. I don't really think he hadn't been that effective, you know what I mean?

[Ocho]

Yeah.

[Uncle]

So I think he has to figure out his happy medium in that way. But I don't think Wimby has to, you know, put too much on himself. Hell, he doing what he can do.

[Joe]

Exactly. I mean, hey, bro, you gave us 26 tonight. You shooting 50 from the floor. You was aggressive. Because he got it to the free throw line 10 times. Castle got to the line 14 times. They shot 33 free throws. They turned the ball over 15 times. They probably need to be down there somewhere around eight or nine, but I don't really know because in order. He makes them better just by him being on the court, Joe.

[Uncle]

Absolutely.

[Joe]

That's it. That's it, Ocho. That's it. Him being on the court makes them better because he draws so many eyes, so much attention.

[Uncle]

Hey, but you look, you look. You look. In that Minnesota series, though, when Castle played great. They. They hard to beat, fellas. Yes, they hard to beat. I'm talking about when he. When he doing a little bit of everything. It's hard to beat him. Even in okc. Them first couple games. Yeah, they weren't getting blown out. You know, they won. They won one and lost one.

[Joe]

Yeah.

[Uncle]

I just think with him being, you know, one for eight, it's gonna be. It's gonna be hard for them to win because when we gonna give you. He gonna give you women gonna get

[Joe]

what women's gonna get.

[Uncle]

Now, if he get 40 something. If he get 40 and 20, hell, it's gonna be hard to beat him. But you can live with this. 26, 27, 28, and, you know, a few rebounds, you know, a few assists, and you keep the rest of these guys at bay. You got a great chance of winning, bro. I think what we have to remember is now OKC a hell of a defensive team, too.

[Joe]

Yes.

[Uncle]

You know, I know Wimby got out on him in that one game where

[Joe]

he had 40, 41, 42, 41, 41 and 21.

[Uncle]

Yeah, yeah. But outside of that, you know, they. They're hella.

[Joe]

I mean, he. I mean, what's with me averaging? It wouldn't be. Oh, Joe. Women probably averaging 32 and 13 in this series.

[Uncle]

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Joe]

At least 32 and 10. I mean, 32 and 10.

[Uncle]

Yeah, yeah.

[Joe]

He had 41. I think he had 27 the last game. He got 26 in this game.

[Uncle]

Yeah.

[Joe]

So he in 33, 34 points a game.

[Uncle]

Yeah, absolutely.

[Joe]

Probably averaging nine, 10 rebounds a game. He's probably averaging three blocks a game. He's never going to be an assist guy. That's not what he is. We understand. Understand that, but damn, he gonna need somebody to come along with him. Just like shape. Go look at the Lakers. Shay really had one outstanding game. That was the last game. Yeah, but the other three games, he had a lot of guys coming along with him and was aiding him.

[Uncle]

Yeah, yeah.

[Joe]

That's what Wimby is going to need.

[Ocho]

You know what I. I like what he said, Uncle Joe. That's what you want to hear from your goddamn leader after a game like that? We gonna see what we made of and, And I need to be able to do more. There's really no, there's really not much more he can do himself.

[Uncle]

Yeah.

[Ocho]

And just, Just like Unc said, Joe. But everybody else got to show up to the party.

[Uncle]

They do.

[Ocho]

When we got his ticket into the party, y' all gotta.

[Joe]

Hey. 29 and 15.

[Uncle]

Oh, damn.

[Joe]

And he's shooting over 50%.

[Uncle]

I mean, okay, see stuff. I mean, look at OKC starters, bro. They just, they ain't play, they ain't play worth nothing tonight. I'm just gonna keep it real. I mean, you look at A.J. mitchell.

[Ocho]

Hey, Joe. What Lou Dork gave you tonight, Joe boy?

[Uncle]

Donut in 23 minutes. But, you know, they really, I, it really don't surprise me, Ocho, because he ain't gonna do a whole hell of a lot of scoring, you know. He's gonna play, huh?

[Ocho]

Except on defense.

[Joe]

Yeah.

[Uncle]

Yeah. He gonna play hard defensively, you know, be disruptive. So this, that donut don't really surprise me. I think when you look at it, you see how great AJ Mitchell was against the damn Lakers. It's just a different story, bro. Against the spurs, man, because they defeated.

[Joe]

Not looking at, I mean, look at him with like, Boy, that's, hey, he looked like James Harden in his prime. Against the Lakers. The man had fight. The man had two points tonight.

[Uncle]

Yeah, he ain't really got.

[Joe]

Yeah, you got to be really, I mean, you got to be really good to shake these guys because everybody can defend.

[Uncle]

Everybody. Everybody, bro. It don't matter who you sit that damn pick with. They gonna sit down, they gonna switch it, and they gonna guard. And that's what I love about the spurs, bro. I, I, I love how they play. I, I love their togetherness, their grittiness. And they gonna be a scary team in years to come. But OKC still got some work to do.

[Joe]

Yes. Going Back to Jerry McCain. Daryl Mori traded McCain. Morris said, I'm quite confident we're selling high on McCain. Obviously. Time will tell. Three months later, he dropped 24 points in the Western Conference finals to lead the thunder to a Games 3 victory. McCain has scored more points in the conference finals than the last six 76ers lottery picks combined. Did the 76ers make a mistake? I'll go to you first, Joe, and then you, Ocho.

[Uncle]

I think it was a blessing in disguise for McCain to get hurt, because by him getting hurt, Uncle Ocho obviously You know, they drafted Edgecombe. He comes in on fire. Young phenom. You thinking, I ain't gonna lie. Hell, I probably would have traded McCain ass, too. You know what I mean? Just to keep it 100, you know?

[Ocho]

Yeah.

[Uncle]

I just. I'm gonna be honest. I ain't really see this. I know he had. He had a. He had a great spurt his rookie year with Phil.

[Joe]

Yeah. Joe. Joe. Wasn't that enough? I mean, enough to show you, Joe, that like, hey, this kid. This kid pretty good.

[Uncle]

But damn, look at all the guards. We got Maxi Edgecomb, we got Grimes. We got. We got out. We ain't really got no we. Where you gonna play at, Maxi? Playing 40 minutes a night.

[Ocho]

Yeah.

[Joe]

My thing was, Joe, based on what I had seen, I'm not. But I guess because it was so guard heavy, you had Ace Bailey and you had Dylan Harper, and you had all these guys, Edgecomb coming out. And so I guess it really didn't give you a whole lot of choice because it was the top of the draft. Was so guard heavy.

[Uncle]

Yeah.

[Joe]

So you had to take a guard. So in that aspect, I can. I can see what you. I agree with you because I understand who's the.

[Uncle]

Okay.

[Joe]

Got. Cool.

[Ocho]

Yeah.

[Joe]

It had been great if somebody would have been dumb enough to pass on Cooper flag. And you could take Cooper Flag, but nobody was gonna be that dumb. Nah.

[Ocho]

Right.

[Uncle]

Hell no.

[Joe]

So now you got Edgecombe, now you got Dylan Harper. Now you got Ace Bailey. Look at the. Basically, the next four or five selections were guards.

[Uncle]

Yeah, yeah, yeah. So Philly. Philly was in what we call a hucklebug. They had to. They had to. I just felt. Yeah. They ain't getting nothing back from him, though. They didn't. They just traded him for real talk like two bags of chips. They ain't getting that one.

[Joe]

Yeah.

[Ocho]

And you know. You know when that happened, Uncle Joe? When they traded us up for bag of chips. They don't really value. They don't really think you are who you may think you are. Then you got to come out. You got to come out and play like this.

[Uncle]

Yeah, yeah. You.

[Joe]

You.

[Uncle]

You have to come out electric. You have to come out determined because you like, damn. They gave up on me. Hold on. I'm gonna show them. I'm gonna show them where they messed up at. And he's played like that. You can. You can tell in his interviews when he talked. Yeah. He's even said things about, you know, being in Philly. You know, he gonna make them pay. He gonna make him, you know what I mean?

[Joe]

That's what you should do.

[Uncle]

Yeah, yeah. They. Yeah, yeah.

[Joe]

He was like, hey, when she shot that shot in game two, he was like, hey, Shay, Shay. He called him by name. I'm in the middle of the shot.

[Uncle]

Hey, listen.

[Joe]

Yeah,

[Uncle]

hey, hey, Shay was looking for his ass tonight though, I tell you that.

[Joe]

Hey, sure was. But I told you, Joe, the Lakers had that lead in the fourth quarter and dude came in and hit two big threes and then one, he hit one hard stop. Maybe it was Hardenstein or Chet had set a pick behind the three point line. Yeah, he just turned and let it. I was like, I was like, yeah, it ain't looking good for us because I say if a bench player comes out, if Shea hits that shot, I ain't giving the second thought. I was like, oh, that's Shay. Yeah, but you talk about a bench player coming off and hitting a 25, 26 foot 3 off a pick and just lets it.

[Uncle]

Well, I think when you got, when you got great bench players, those are guys who come in the game and they feel like they can start or should be starting.

[Joe]

Yes.

[Uncle]

So they play with their sense of urgency, they play with their confidence. It's oozing out of them, you can tell. They look comfortable out there on the court. I mean, McCain, great in the pick and roll, getting into the teeth of the defense, shooting his floaters, shooting his midi. He plays well off Shay. Cause he's a catch and shoot guy.

[Ocho]

Yeah.

[Uncle]

And he, and he, and he's tough minded defensively, bro. Like he has all the makeup of being a hell of a. Hell of a player in this league.

[Joe]

And see, that's what. When you got a guy like that, a guy that's a great one on one player, he need guys that can catch and shoot. Yes, guys that can catch and shoot. LeBron want guys that can catch.

[Uncle]

Yes, sir.

[Joe]

Harden wanted guys that can catch and shoot, Steph. That's why he and Clay works so well.

[Uncle]

Yeah.

[Joe]

And when they got Kevin Durant. So now you got three of the all time great shooters. I wish you would help off either one of them and see what happened to you.

[Uncle]

Absolutely, absolutely. Because. Go ahead, Ojo.

[Ocho]

Now I was gonna say you could tell coach and his teammates also believe in him and gave him that green light.

[Joe]

Yeah. 21 times.

[Ocho]

21 times tonight Shay only shot 17, so you know that he got the green light from somebody. Once you get in there, man, do what you do. Don't even think about it.

[Uncle]

You. Yeah. Hey, you have to be A great complimentary piece, bro. When you got a star player who demands so much attention like Shea, you need these other guys around them who are not indecisive on what they gonna do offensively, whether they're shooting or driving to the basket. You need guys who make quick decisions. It's like a quarterback. Uncle Ocho, hell, when he dropped back, can he. Can he process things real quick, you know what I mean, Versus holding on to that damn ball. Three, four, six.

[Joe]

Number one thing, Joe, huh? That's the number one thing a quarterback gotta have.

[Uncle]

Yeah.

[Joe]

All that measurable. He's 6, 5, he can run 4, 2.

[Ocho]

Don't mean nothing.

[Joe]

100 yards. I don't give a damn about none of that. How quickly can he process information?

[Uncle]

There you go. They. Hey, hey. That's the same thing for. For intelligent Hooper, for a great Hooper. It's how fast can he process what it is that's gonna happen? Because you don't really have predetermined moves. You run a pick and roll. Hell, you don't know what's gonna be open. You know what I mean? But within a split second, you have to be able to make a precise decision on what it is you want to do. I'm gonna get a teaser. The defense. I'm gonna shoot this jump. I'm gonna shoot this minute. I see my bed coming. I see the corner, The.

[Joe]

The. The.

[Uncle]

The corner pass open way on. On the weak side. You know what I mean? Like, those are all reads that a point guard or that a guard, period, has to have in this game. And I feel like even when Shay comes off the court and McCain is at the one and he's running at the helm, and he looked like a damn starter at times, bro.

[Joe]

Yeah, he does.

[Ocho]

That's funny. You know what, Joe? And it. What makes it. What makes it different? Now, I. I can't really explain it in basketball term, but I can explain in terms of football. Like Unc was saying, it's really important if you have someone that can read and react. It's all about reading and reacting.

[Uncle]

There you go.

[Ocho]

And being able to improvise. Now, you know what's supposed to happen when you run a certain play, but being able to improvise when something that you don't expect happens, and being able to redirect and make those decisions really, really fast, no matter what, with no hesitation.

[Uncle]

Yeah.

[Ocho]

People. Great.

[Uncle]

Yeah, absolutely.

[Joe]

Because Ocho, we call plays based on what we think they're going to run.

[Uncle]

Yeah.

[Joe]

Now what happens if they don't run the Defense that we think we going to get.

[Ocho]

Ocho, you got to be able to adjust quarterback.

[Joe]

What you gonna do? I know we expected. I understand. We expect them to go single house safety. Yeah, but they run quarters. Not what you gonna do. Or they run quarter seven. They run cover five. Two. Cover two. Man under. Oh, they run cover six. And they kick it.

[Uncle]

Yeah.

[Joe]

Quarter, quarter, half. And they kick once. The front side.

[Ocho]

Yeah. Goddamn.

[Joe]

So now what do you do? How soon can you process that information? From the time I know I'm supposed to go, damn it, they ain't get by your third step, the great quarterbacks that already process it. This is not what I anticipated. Now what did I go through? Where am I supposed to go? Because they already done took one away. The coverage took one away. The sooner you understand that they taking one away. And now one. I'm going. Now he's one O. Cho's. TJ was one to begin with.

[Uncle]

Yeah.

[Joe]

Now Ocho's one.

[Uncle]

Yeah.

[Joe]

The tight ends, too back. Here you go.

[Uncle]

And you gotta be at the point

[Joe]

guard like you said, Joe. Are they gonna trap me? They gonna bless me? Is he gonna show? Is he hatching? What's he gonna do?

[Uncle]

Right?

[Joe]

I gotta. But I can't be thinking about that.

[Uncle]

Hell no.

[Joe]

I got to see it. It's really good. Ones can tell before it even happens.

[Uncle]

Yeah, they. They see plays and they see them unfold and develop in real time. Meaning, you know, it's not a lot of guys who can read and react, Ocho, you know what I mean?

[Joe]

That's.

[Uncle]

That's a. That's an attribute that a lot of the greats have, bro, to be able to do that on the fly like that. Especially when you got teams mixing up their coverages. Sometimes they trapping, you know, sometimes they. The.

[Joe]

The.

[Uncle]

The big is in a He in a low stance. Like, you have to read and react and be able to process all these things. And I think obviously OKC has that. Just. Just a true, true championship team, bro, from top to bottom. I mean, I don't know who else outside of the spurs, really, who has a bench like this who can come in and change the entirety of a game, bro.

[Ocho]

No, ain't Nana.

[Joe]

You know, Golden State bench was like that. When they bring in the Eguadala, they bring Livingston, and they had Leandro Barbosa and they had all those guys and they just keep. They just come out in waves. And like I said, we saw this with the Lakers. They were down five points. Shay goes to the bench. When he checks back in There up nine.

[Uncle]

Yeah, yeah, we see this.

[Joe]

He gets in foul trouble, okay?

[Uncle]

And

[Joe]

guys look at it as an opportunity. This is our opportunity to show. Because I keep telling guys all the time, you're not only trying to impress your teammates, you're trying to impress other general managers.

[Uncle]

There you go. There you go.

[Joe]

Because, you know, OKC ain't the only one that got a payroll.

[Uncle]

There you go. There you go. There you go.

[Joe]

Guys need to understand that I just. And. And everybody doesn't have basketball iq. Joe Ocho, we know that. You ask a guy, bro, why you. Man, I thought. What you mean you thought? So how long you think the quarterback got? You think this seven on seven, that he can sit back there and just pat the ball like this here and let you run whatever route you want to run, right? Oh, Joe, we had a guy one time. I ain't gonna call his name, but we had a guy. We going playing one. We doing one on one. Yeah. You know what he asked the coach? He asked the coach, what, you want me to run a man or a zone route? It's one on one. What you mean, a man or his own route? I said, go. Don't put that. Hey, don't put that man on the field with me. He literally asked the coach is one on one, the guy, you and the DB sitting right here. What, you want me to run a man or zone route?

[Uncle]

Yeah.

[Ocho]

That's funny.

[Joe]

Hey, but you wonder why. And. And people and. And. And, like, when you around it and you listen to guys talk and they be in the game, it's like, okay. What you see? Okay. What happened to you? Yeah, coach him up. No, no, no, no, no. I ain't coaching. Ish up. If he spend time. If he get off his phone and every break we get, he run to the truck.

[Uncle]

Oh, man.

[Joe]

To get on the damn phone.

[Uncle]

Come on, man.

[Joe]

Get your damn playbook.

[Ocho]

It's a. It's the thinking man's game, Uncle Joe, regardless of what sports you playing, whether it's hockey, whether it's baseball, whether it's. Whether. Whether it's. Is it soccer? It's a thinking man's game.

[Uncle]

I. I think. My bad, Ocho. I think. I think it's more of a read and react game. Meaning. Meaning, like in basketball, you can't have predetermined, you know, decision making, bro. You know, you. You have to be decisive of what it is the defense is doing. You have to read and react off the defense. Okay. Damn. Okay. We come down, they in a damn zone. Well, we had to Run a zone offense. So we had to do something to get them out of that zone. If they ain't man to man, obviously, you know, pick and roll or, you know, run down picks, or we run a flex, you know, some. Something to kind of loosen up the defense. But it's hard to play. I will figure. I mean, I only play basketball to be able to play any other sport, and you going out there predetermined on what it is you already want to do.

[Joe]

No.

[Uncle]

Have to read and react of what the defense is doing. You know what I mean? Basketball, that's essential.

[Joe]

Yeah. Because the thing is, Joe, Coach would have to say was 84. Why'd you do that? I say because when you drew it up on the blackboard, that guy didn't move at all. I promise you, I'd rather read it just like you drew it up how you explained us to do it in practice, and it walked through. Yeah, I did it like that.

[Uncle]

Yeah.

[Joe]

But it just so happened that mofo moved.

[Ocho]

I love. I love. I love doing the. Hey, Uncle Joe. You know, you come out that huddle they call the play, Joe.

[Uncle]

Yeah.

[Ocho]

You know, let's say just for instance, for. For. For hypothetical sake, I got a curl route.

[Joe]

Yes. I.

[Ocho]

Coming out that goddamn huddle, I have in my mind on how I want to run that curl. I'm already playing it in my head coming out the huddle. Now, once I line up, based on how you play me, Uncle, I got about three or four ways I can run that goddamn curl. Yeah, let me take that down to three. Let me take it three different ways. You know, if he's off, if he's. If he's head up, if he's outside, if he's inside, I got ways to run it. Now, when that ball snap, if he happened to move or they happen to rotate, then I got to be able to think on the fly, Joe.

[Uncle]

Yes, sir. I can't hesitate.

[Ocho]

My quarterback got two seconds.

[Uncle]

Yeah. Yeah.

[Ocho]

That's it.

[Uncle]

Facts, facts.

[Joe]

And then like, hey, man, you a little short on that. Did you see the last four plays? Carson got hit in the back of his damn head. I could keep going. I could get the 12, but cars are gonna be looking out of their hole when you throw it, bro. I want. Trust me, I want to get the depth. But I don't know if you notice our offensive line ain't doing a good job of picking them up right now.

[Uncle]

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Joe]

So everything need to time up. When his back foot hit, I need to be coming out the break.

[Ocho]

Yes, Sir.

[Uncle]

Yeah, so.

[Joe]

But also, I don't need to be coming out the break before he. Before he ready to throw the ball. Cause all I did. Because if I'm open and he's not ready to throw, by the time he's ready to throw, I'm covered.

[Uncle]

Yep.

[Joe]

That ain't no good.

[Uncle]

Nah. Look, think about this. In basketball, you get 24 second shot clock. So if you in ball the bot. The in ball, inbound the ball and you bring it up, let's say you got 16 seconds left on the shot clock. Well, damn, we got to run our offense within 16 seconds and get a good damn shot. You know, I think when you've done it for so long, it's just second nature to you. But when you first get into it, bro, and you, and you trying to learn a new system and you got new guys, you dealing with that damn clock, get down to five seconds real quick, you know what I mean? And you need guys who can get in their bag and really get to it. And those are the special ones, bro. Those are special. OkC got them.

[Joe]

And that's what OkC has.

[Uncle]

Yep.

[Joe]

O.C. okC got guys. They're great system guys. But if the system breaks down, they got guys that can go get a bucket.

[Uncle]

Yep.

[Joe]

And that's what you gotta have at the end of the day. Yeah. I want to have a system. And the system is the triangle free floor and all this. But at the end of the day, it had Michael and it had Kobe.

[Uncle]

Yeah.

[Joe]

It had two guys that I could throw the system out the damn window.

[Uncle]

Yeah.

[Joe]

And they can go make a play.

[Uncle]

Yep. Because if the system don't work and you got three, four seconds on that damn clock, you need a guy who, who don't panic in those situations and can still get to the money.

[Joe]

Yeah. And people. Oh, I love the west coast system. I spent the better part of my. But look at the quarterback that's been in the west coast system. And you tell me if they played a role. Joe Montana, Steve Young, John Elway, Brett Favre, Aaron Rodgers, Patrick Mahomes. Are they any good? What about. What about Matthew Stafford? Yeah, he any good?

[Ocho]

Great.

[Joe]

So I. I get the west coast system. It's fine. Lovely. It is.

[Uncle]

Yeah.

[Joe]

One, two, three. One, two, three, four, five. One, two, three, four, five, six ball. The ball's out of your damn hand. We got something short. We got a shallow cross. We got the back running a wheel route. We got the tight end on the short cross. Hey, we got oo on. On 10. Roll to 12 we got somebody on the backside. We got all that. We got it covered.

[Uncle]

Yeah.

[Joe]

If you look at the quarterbacks that's been in that system.

[Uncle]

If you're a receiver, you love that west coast, huh?

[Ocho]

Yeah.

[Joe]

Montana was starting Montana. Then you had Steve Young.

[Uncle]

Yeah.

[Joe]

Then Mike brought up the John Elway, Brett Far. Mike Holman took it up to Green Bay with Brett Favreau, then he left. And then you had Sherm, Mike Sherman, and then you had. What's the guy's name? Mike McCarthy.

[Uncle]

Yeah.

[Joe]

So he had Brett Favre and Aaron Rodgers in that system. Guess who else in that system? Patrick Mahomes.

[Uncle]

Yeah.

[Joe]

Guess who else in that system? Matthew Stafford. Donovan Mitchell, Jordan Love.

[Ocho]

Hey, hey, Joe. I ain't never had an opportunity to play in that boy.

[Uncle]

You ain't playing the West Coast?

[Joe]

Nah.

[Uncle]

What you playing in Ojo?

[Ocho]

Shoot, what that was. I'm just traditional, huh?

[Joe]

Traditional? Yeah.

[Uncle]

They done cheated, my boy.

[Joe]

They cheated.

[Ocho]

They ain't cheating, Joe. I was out there getting to. I was out there getting to the chicken, Joe.

[Uncle]

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Ocho]

I was getting.

[Joe]

And so it's just. Man, it's just. It might be a situation where sometimes the guy just too damn good.

[Uncle]

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Joe]

And that's okay to say. That's okay to say. And it might be a situation. We'll see. The spurs gotta bring everything. They gotta throw everything they got at em.

[Uncle]

They gonna have to play harder, man, you know? I know.

[Joe]

And smarter.

[Uncle]

Yeah. It's cliche, but I just feel like ever since that game won, OKC has been different. Obviously, the physicality has been there and they've been precise on what it is they're trying to do. We gotta. We gotta. We gotta take Wimby out this damn

[Joe]

game, man, for sure.

[Uncle]

And I know he averages 20, 29. And what'd you say, 15?

[Joe]

29 and 15.

[Uncle]

Yeah. I mean, that's. That's great now, but the. His supporting cast, them. Boy, we gotta limit them boys. We can't let them get off, man. I remember. I remember playing here for the Hawks. We was playing Orlando Magic. I don't. I think it was like 2009. This one, Dwight Howell was Dwight Howard. You hear me? Okay, Ocho. Okay, Ocho. When I tell y', all, hey, Super Superman. Ocho. We had no answer for this, man. No. But guess what? Guess what we did. We said, damn it, we just gonna let him get 40 and 20. But we ain't gonna let Turkaloo. We ain't gonna let Jamel Nelson. We ain't gonna let nothing we Them boy gonna have about five points, seven points together. Yeah, right. Yeah. Cause we gonna stick on there. We. We're gonna let them throw it down there to Dwight every time. He gonna eat. The rest of these boys ain't eating. Yeah, right. And that's how we was able to get about that series. Just sometimes, bro, because you can't open up the floodgates with somebody like that. You go to Dublin, he kicking it out to his shooters.

[Joe]

Yeah, you.

[Uncle]

You at his mercy now.

[Joe]

Yep. Yeah, I met Donald McNabb, I think they said. I said Donovan Mitchell. I meant Donovan McNabb because he had. He had Andy Reid all. I mean, basically, he had Andy Reed his whole career. That's all he ever know.

[Uncle]

Yeah. Yeah.

[Joe]

Tom Haberstroke did a great piece on Shay and Floppy. How often does Shea Alexander fall compared to his peers? You see, on non foul, he falls on 120, 187 shots. He followed 20. He fell 20 times. That's almost 11. And you can see the chart right there then with James Harden, Jalen Brunson, Donovan Mitchell, and Victor Wimanyama only failed one time on 164 shots. On the ones he was fouled. 39, 37 shots. 19 over 51% of the time.

[Uncle]

Damn.

[Joe]

On all shots.

[Uncle]

Hey.

[Joe]

Falling down depth 17 of the time, Joe.

[Uncle]

Hey, that's that. He's selling it, boy. Hey, you. Hey. Hey, from. From a. From a score standpoint, guys who love to score. Yeah, you look at the great ones. Uncle Ocho, I ain't gonna lie. I never had that in my bag. To like to be a. To. To. To be a foul seeker or none of that. I just enjoy. I just enjoy scoring the ball. But these guys, this is what you call greedy, you know what I mean? These guys agreed, hey, they want to score the ball by any means. The boy try and get 30 every night, man. Yeah, yeah, yeah. They ain't playing, so however I gotta get it, you get too damn close to me when I shoot. Yeah. I'm hitting the dick.

[Joe]

Yep.

[Ocho]

Hey, that. That's art. That's art in itself too, though, you know, being able to do it. Everybody can't do it.

[Uncle]

Yeah.

[Ocho]

Making it. Making it look like it's a file.

[Uncle]

Yeah.

[Joe]

Happy to hurt my damn self, Ocho and Joe.

[Ocho]

Yeah, well, hitting the flow.

[Joe]

Yeah. Yeah. Cause you got to know it. You got to know how to hit the floor and slide. Them guys. You see them guys, they shoot it and they be sliding with it, man. I'll be hitting them up one time. Oh, damn.

[Uncle]

Yeah, yeah, you got. Hey, it's knowing how to seek contact, bro.

[Joe]

Right.

[Uncle]

When they get in traffic and they play in a lot of traffic, they understand. They don't panic in those situations. Yeah, they use different bodies to like, kind of ping bang off of. You know, you get. You reaching that, get your arm in that. Hell, that's. That's their dream. They gonna. They gonna be flailing up through there. They got all kind of little tricks and trades, bro.

[Ocho]

Yeah, it's. It's art to it.

[Uncle]

It is, it is.

[Joe]

But right now, the spurs, hey, they're scratching the head. They can't play better, any better than they played, say, the first eight, nine minutes of the game, Joe. Yeah, they can't play any better than that. But what happens is, is that when they. When the stomacher starters go to the bench, I don't know if the bench brought that intensity, because I think they thought it was going to be sweet.

[Uncle]

Yeah, the.

[Joe]

Okay, see, like, hey, man, hey, that bench came and said, hey, we got. Hey, we got to do something. We got to change the trajectory of this or this thing might get out. This thing might get bubble sparks. It might get ugly.

[Uncle]

Yeah. Hey, hey, hey, hey. Think about it. You know the success that the spurs has had against the Thunder throughout the regular season, beating them 4, 1. Then you go in their house, win game one. Hell, yeah. You confident we going home? Oh, yeah, man. Hell, we probably. We should. We should go back to okc. Up three ones. Probably what they were thinking. Yeah. You know what I mean? But OKC had a. They. They had a different plan, bro. They had a different plan. They had guys step in. I'm talking about play great basketball. Them guys off that bench, they won you this game tonight.

[Joe]

SGA was asked after the game about the San Antonio crowd chanting flopper. It does nothing. Doesn't fuel me, doesn't discourage me. It's part of the game. I've been dealing with it for a long time. I don't really hear it.

[Ocho]

Hey, someone like sga, hey, hey, Joe, as long as he's been playing the game, this is nothing that he just started doing. That art of being able to flop, that fl. That art of being able to use your body and contort your body in the right ways to be able to get some of those fouls. Once you're aggressive, you put the ball on the floor. He been hearing that. This ain't nothing new. It's not like he just, you know, got this art of being able to. To. I hate using the word foul bait. But I mean, that's what it is. So anything hearing from the crowd, man, he definitely don't care.

[Uncle]

Yeah, I think, I think Uncle Ocho, I think he does hear him and I think it fuels him. You know, sometimes, bro, we don't want to give up the secrets. You know what I'm saying? Like you, you can. It's like sometimes a lot of the great players, they can hear one look, one little thing about them that's negative and they can change it into a positive fuel to where they come out and try to be a different player. I think he hears it and he understands, bro. You know, hey, this is my job. This is what I do. I'm a two time mvp, one time champion. I'm gonna show y'. All. I'm gonna show y' all why I'm arguably the best player in this league.

[Joe]

But that's. Look, we all hear the negative. It could be 80, 000 fans cheering. Two people boo what you hear, Ocho.

[Uncle]

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Joe]

You got 80, 000 fans. Oh, Joe. Oh, Joe. Two people. Yeah. Oh, you suck.

[Uncle]

Facts.

[Ocho]

Hey, I'll get be loud. It'd be. It'd be clear as hell. Too clear.

[Joe]

All the cheering is just like harmonious. But it's. But it's like that in the comments.

[Uncle]

Yeah, yeah, man.

[Joe]

We love you, Ocho, man. We love you, man. Ocho, turn your light on, man. Ocho, take your glasses off. Damn. But my glasses bother you, right? Man, you gossiping. All you do is gossip like the old. Like them old aunts back in the south, just gossiping. I said, well, hell, Iran, they gossiping about Iran, they gossiping about Israel and Palestine, they gossiping.

[Uncle]

Yeah.

[Joe]

Oh, that's different. Why is it different? So, and it shades to come to the point, like, bro, and if you play sports, you know, you ain't gonna make everybody happy.

[Uncle]

Yeah, you.

[Joe]

No, sir, you not the only difference between now and way back then, everybody has social media. Everybody gonna put out. I don't like Steph, I don't like Braun, I don't like Harden, I don't like Mitchell, I don't like Shay with his foul bait himself, so forth and so on.

[Uncle]

Now

[Joe]

probably a billion people got social media. Yeah. So you got a billion different platforms that can disseminate and sometimes people only put out stuff because I just need a couple of people to get. Yeah. Hey, man, I don't like this episode. Me either. I don't even know why he had this person on. Yeah, well, you get you a podcast and you can put on whoever you want to take.

[Ocho]

Yeah, yeah. Hey, everybody. Hey, everybody.

[Joe]

If you don't like the person. I've never gone on who goes to a movie, man, I can't stand this person. But you watching the movie, right? So you go watch a movie that you don't like the person that's acting in the movie just so you can come out the movie say, man, I ain't like that. I don't even like such and such.

[Uncle]

Yeah, yeah, I get it.

[Joe]

Going nowhere.

[Ocho]

Yeah. Hey, I got a question, too.

[Joe]

Okay. Hopefully I get an answer. You.

[Ocho]

You think about this, Joe. They complained about Shea and the foul baiting. Did they complain about Harden when he did it?

[Uncle]

Yeah, they did.

[Ocho]

They complain about D. Wade when he did it? Because D. Wade did it, too.

[Joe]

He had.

[Ocho]

He had. He had a nice one there. Tried to get you up in the air.

[Uncle]

I know D. Wade was known for his pump fake. That's in the scout report. That's in the scout.

[Joe]

Hey.

[Uncle]

That's in the scout report. Hey. The one thing coaches will tell you, you fall for that damn pump fake we find in your ass.

[Ocho]

Yeah.

[Uncle]

Don't go for that damn pump fake. Hey, the pump fake and the reject on D. Yeah. Reject the pick, and his ass gonna pump fake. You get it? That's a guarantee. Yeah, yeah. But Harden, hell, Ocho, guys stop even reaching on hard and they just play. Play with their hands like this. You gotta play with your body. You know what I mean? He changed the game when it came to, you know, drawing files, you know what I mean? I don't think it was more flail. I don't think it was flailing on James part. I just think he was so crafty and sticking that ball out there and you thinking you had a steal and he'd come up through your arms, you know what I mean?

[Joe]

He was the best at that, Ocho. Somebody said, well, ain't that many social media platforms out there. On YouTube, they say, YouTube, there are 2.8 billion damn. Damn YouTube, YouTube users on Facebook, there are 3 billion monthly active users. On Instagram, 3 billion active users, and tick tock, 2 billion globally. So I was. I undersold it. I said, a billion.

[Uncle]

Yeah.

[Ocho]

And everybody got a voice. Everybody got a voice.

[Joe]

It's hard for me to believe out of 8 billion people, there are not at least a billion platforms. Just being conservative, Ocho. Well, obviously, you know. You know, kid, they're really old people. That's not on social media, and there's really, really young people. That's not on social media.

[Ocho]

Right.

[Joe]

But when you got that, that, that sweet spot, let's just say from the ages of. Let's just do ages 12 to, to 55.

[Uncle]

Yeah, right.

[Joe]

You don't think it's a billion people that have. That's on IG X, YouTube, Facebook, tick tock. You don't think it's a billion people out there?

[Uncle]

I do. Yeah. Yeah, yeah.

[Joe]

Why, why you think everybody trying to control it?

[Uncle]

Yeah.

[Joe]

How do you get information out? Don't nobody watch the evening news anymore to get information. Where you going to get information from? Social media?

[Ocho]

All you need is your phone.

[Joe]

And guess what? I'm only going to the sites that give me the type of information that I want.

[Ocho]

Yeah.

[Joe]

If I'm trying to learn how to bake a cake, what? Hell, I'm on a car while I'm on an auto parts site. They gonna tell about to make no damn cake. So I'm gonna go to a site that's gonna give me the information that I want to consume.

[Uncle]

Yeah, yeah.

[Joe]

But what I'm gonna do in the meantime, I'm gonna inundate you now because I know. Oh, oh. Won't you like to get on this thing about, from, from 9 to 5? Okay, okay.

[Uncle]

Yeah, yeah.

[Joe]

I' ma let you see what you want to see, but I'm gonna put something up there. So man, what they talking about, man, what they going on with this woman? Damn inflation. Oh man, they about to raise interest rates A damn kid. I get you. I know you're gonna be on there. You can only ignore it so much, Ocho. You only ignore it so much. The only way you can't get it, you gotta put it down.

[Ocho]

Yep, yep, that's it.

[Joe]

But if you own there, I'm gonna get you. I will get you. Todd Monkey was asked about the defensive plays made in practice, a couple of interceptions, the forest fumble. Here's what he had to say, guys. Yeah, we throw, we threw interceptions and seven on seven, for God's sakes. I mean who does that? There's no pass rush. I mean it is embarrassing. Is he being for real, Ocho?

[Ocho]

Nah, nah, hell, he trolling.

[Joe]

He definitely, he gotta be trolling because I played with John and John threw interception in 707.

[Ocho]

Hey, I, I would get ready to say the same thing. I've seen, I've seen the greatest quarterback of all time during my tenure there in 707 throw interceptions.

[Joe]

Yes.

[Ocho]

I've seen Carson Palmer throw interceptions. I've seen Achilles Smith throw interceptions. Everyone throws interceptions in 707. I think he was trolling, though. He had to be trolling.

[Joe]

He gotta be trolling. Hey, got to be.

[Uncle]

He got me.

[Joe]

He.

[Uncle]

He got me.

[Ocho]

He got you? Yeah, yeah, he got. He gotta be.

[Joe]

They said he was. Ocho. We. I mean, we used. The guys used to get boots. They would get gifts if they picked John off. Oh, they're trying to get the pick. They're trying to get that money.

[Uncle]

Yeah.

[Joe]

Oh, yes.

[Ocho]

You got. You got to think, too.

[Joe]

And some. Some guys. That was their game, Joe. Yes, Their game was. Was Wednesday, Thursday, Friday. That's their game.

[Uncle]

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Joe]

Oh, I ain't gonna make you make me look bad because guess what? If you make the guy. If. If you make that guy look too bad too often, they'll get his ass up out and they're gonna put somebody else in there, and I ain't telling what I'm telling. I ain't telling what somebody told me. I'm telling you what I know. I feel right.

[Uncle]

Yeah. Damn.

[Joe]

Hey, listen, I don't know what he got. I don't know what they think. I mean, what, what do they think they supposed to just let you complete passes?

[Ocho]

Do you know they get paid on the other side of the ball too, now?

[Uncle]

Man, what you.

[Ocho]

Now what you. What you do want to do, Joe, Uncle Joe, especially in 707 because there's no pass rush, you would like for the decision making to be a little bit better.

[Uncle]

Yeah.

[Joe]

Yes.

[Ocho]

Being that there's no pressure, but again, those that are on the other side of the ball, they get paid to play ball, too. It ain't gonna be that easy every single time.

[Joe]

But the problem is that what you got to do, Ocho. But there still has to be a clock. How many times do we say, bro, what you think you in? 707.

[Ocho]

Yeah. Playing around. Yeah.

[Joe]

That clock better go off of your damn head.

[Uncle]

Yeah, absolutely.

[Joe]

Hey, you. Hey, you. You up on the center and you got a route. That's obviously, if it's a three step route, you throw it. You throwing slants or you throwing spot routes, you know what I'm saying? You throwing something quick. But if it's a five step, hey, when that back foot hit, you know the coverage. That ball better come out. Okay? You keep on doing this right here and watch Miles G put his helmet right between your damn shoulders. Okay? So I don't know what he's up just. Oh, so you want to have the pat. Holy guy just hold the ball? That's. That's exactly what's going to happen. And that's why you see guys. Because they get so used to nine and seven on seven, Joe.

[Uncle]

Yeah.

[Joe]

Isn't a pass rush. That's why you see guys helmet coming off. Like, bro, how you not see that? Because in 707, they told him to wait until somebody came open, right. And the clock doesn't go off.

[Uncle]

Dang.

[Joe]

What our quarterback do. You throw that ball down to throw it out of bounds.

[Uncle]

Get your damn head rattled and hold on.

[Ocho]

And Coach Monkey better understand now. You know what defense he got over there. I forgot what.

[Joe]

That's a top three defense over there in Cleveland, Joe.

[Ocho]

Yeah, yeah, man, the boys ain't no joke. You complain about interceptions. Understand who you got now. Know your personnel.

[Joe]

I mean, you tell them, say, hey, you got to make your decision. Obviously, you know. Hey, the thing is, Ocho, when Joe, what we did, the way we list, we have so we would have like five. We'd have like four to five periods.

[Ocho]

Yeah.

[Joe]

And it's ten plays per period. Now, you can look and see. I never did. You can look and see what the coverage is versus the play that you're gonna run because you got. You know, you're telling the defense, okay, we want you in this coverage.

[Uncle]

Yeah.

[Joe]

What they run this formation, this play, this area of the field. So, you know, so you could look and see. I ain't want to look and see that cheating. I ain't gonna be able. Hey, hey, Greg G. Lloyd. What covered y' all in?

[Uncle]

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Joe]

Now, me and Crab, we really agree. We brought. We did, brother. Lost some stuff.

[Uncle]

Yeah. Hey, hey.

[Joe]

A. Sharp. Hey, all right. Hey, hey. You see the power coming, pull me out the way. Hey, yeah, come on. Yeah, good for the camera.

[Uncle]

Yeah.

[Joe]

Hey, good job, Sharp.

[Uncle]

Hey, hey, hey. It's just. Hey, the thing is, in basketball, bro, like, even in practice, we play five on five. Hell, the damn defense know all our damn plays. So they cheating plays and all them. Yeah.

[Ocho]

I hate that. Hey, Joe. I hate that. Joe.

[Uncle]

Come on, man. Y' all already know what the hell we running you already over there before I get my ass over there.

[Ocho]

Damn that. And don't. Hey, Joe, don't met. Hey, hey. Don't let him make a play in practice. They get to celebrate.

[Joe]

Oh, you see? There you go. There you go, Ocho. There you go. See, now I'm mad.

[Ocho]

I'm bad, you know, to play.

[Joe]

Yeah.

[Uncle]

What are you doing

[Joe]

now, man? So now I got to go back in there, get that lick back, right? No, no, I ain't out. Come on.

[Uncle]

Hey.

[Joe]

See, I used to like it with 7 get mad because he 7 get mad. He called everybody back.

[Uncle]

Yeah.

[Joe]

Hey, hey, Sharpie foots. Ed, come on.

[Uncle]

Yeah.

[Joe]

Oh, yeah. Trouble now. Yeah, you should have put seven off. Hey, it ain't nothing like y' all ass up.

[Uncle]

Hey, it ain't nothing like when practice get a little spicy, though, boy. I'm talking about yeah, y'.

[Joe]

All.

[Uncle]

Hey, hey, hey. Yeah, well, I'm trying to been on some teams. I'm talking about practice used to be so fun, bro. I'm talking about competing at the highest level. Yeah. I'm talking about going at it. It's nothing better than that, bro.

[Joe]

That's how you know what Ocho, the best time. Cause don't nobody know nothing, right? Two minute.

[Ocho]

Oh, yeah. Because everything unscripted.

[Joe]

Yeah, yeah.

[Ocho]

Everything unscripted, Joe. So they can't cheat. They got. They gotta call everything honest.

[Joe]

Oh, you could look at the sheet.

[Uncle]

Yeah.

[Joe]

Now you got your ass cooked.

[Uncle]

Yeah.

[Ocho]

You got to play honest.

[Joe]

Yeah, man, I remember when I first got. I first got back to Denver, and, you know, like I said, you can look at the card and see, oh, Titan's gonna do this, Titan's gonna do that. Man, them jokers cheating they ass off. So, you know, Ocho, you know, hold up this year 13 for me.

[Uncle]

Yeah, quick.

[Joe]

You know, I ain't as quick as I was, you know, look, you know, the quickness ain't what it used to be, but they cheating.

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[Uncle]

That's the worst.

[Joe]

I think you know, I remember house in the back of Titus. Goddamn, homeboy, what going on? I said, man, how do you cheat their ass off? I said, looking at the car. He said, I know. Might say two minutes. Ones versus the twos. Because normally that's how we go. We go ones versus the twos. Yeah. And the office, the defense go ones versus the twos.

[Uncle]

Yeah.

[Joe]

Cook them right down the field. I bet you we threw. We completed 10 passes. I caught seven of them. Dog tired. I'm talking about dog tired now, you know, I got to talk.

[Uncle]

Yeah.

[Joe]

Oh, you really, you really thought you could cover me, huh? That's riding get cut.

[Uncle]

Yeah.

[Joe]

You really thought that, bro. Do you know they didn't tell you who I was? Yeah, you better check my resume. But don't worry about it. You're gonna find out from that point on. Amen. No, no, we ain't gonna make it look good. I'm gonna cook you every chance you get. I'm gonna try to get you cut.

[Uncle]

Yeah? Yeah.

[Joe]

You want to come out here? Because, you know, hey, I'm still sharing a sharp now. I'm still 84. Yeah. Pro bowler, eight Pro Bowls. All Pro, all these all. All decade. So, you know they're trying to make a name off me.

[Uncle]

Yeah.

[Joe]

Oh, no, no, no, no, no, no. You ain't gonna make no name up. You ain't Gonna get no rep off Shannon. That's not gonna happen. So now I gotta. I. I'm trying to get you cut. That's my purpose. Every day in practice that you go against me, I'm trying to get you cut.

[Uncle]

Right? Right.

[Joe]

I ain't mad at you, bro. Nah. Cause you started this. You could have just left me alone.

[Ocho]

And the funny thing about it, too, Uncle Joe, with Unc talking the way he talking and trying to get him cut. Matter of fact, players that are trying to make it, make a team. If you look good against the ones enough times.

[Joe]

Thank you.

[Ocho]

You will get a job.

[Uncle]

Yeah.

[Joe]

Thank you.

[Uncle]

You get it.

[Ocho]

You get a job off that?

[Uncle]

Yeah.

[Joe]

Yes.

[Ocho]

Oh, we got to keep him. Well, he looked good against 84. We got to find. We got to find a spot for him.

[Joe]

I kind of got cut my rookie year. We playing the Raiders. Yeah, because, you know, Ocho. You know, hey, I was. I was a wide receiver then I had Tim Brown number. I had Tim Brown.

[Uncle]

Brown.

[Ocho]

He had the 81.

[Joe]

Had the 81 on. But I would, like, move with the ball. So I might be. The only person I wasn't gonna be was Sam Grady. Sam Grady was Olympics. He won the silver medal in 100 meters. I couldn't beat him. Yeah, I could be Tim Brown. So I was Tim Brown. I went deep like, three times in a row. I went deep. I went deep twice on Wednesday. I went deep Monday. Then I went deep twice on Friday. You know, Friday practice, everything supposed to

[Ocho]

be buttoned up and fast. Yeah.

[Joe]

Friday afternoon, he was gone

[Ocho]

fast. Friday, you got anybody there?

[Joe]

They look at like, hold on. This a rookie. This ain't Tim Brown.

[Uncle]

Yeah.

[Joe]

So what you think Tim Brown gonna do? Yeah.

[Uncle]

Hey, hey, hey. When they. Hey, I know what you're talking about. They put you in that situation. They say, hey, we need you to play Kobe today, or we need you to be AI today.

[Joe]

Yep.

[Uncle]

You know, so look, we. We had a guy. We had him to be AI. And it's like, you don't even get to think. You just play. You shoot. Shoot when you.

[Joe]

Whatever you want.

[Uncle]

Oh, that boy carved us up one day. I'm talking about carved and stuff. Because you just. You ain't gotta think. You just catch the ball. You get to do what you want right Once. You got to put some. Some thought into that. That's what guys started to mess up. But I know exactly what you're saying, boy, you take. They tell you somebody, you go out there. Yo, I'm talking about. You go off.

[Joe]

That's Rod Smith. That's how Rod Smith made the team. He was the Raiders, you know, he was a rocket, they say we called him bottle Rocket.

[Uncle]

Yeah, right.

[Joe]

Say get him by the rocket. Cause he's Rocky. Oh, yeah. We called him Slim Rice because he was Jerry. Hey was cooking everybody.

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[Joe]

They must rather put foots in the game. First game foots ever played in.

[Uncle]

Yeah.

[Joe]

Five seconds on the clock. A three by one put him on the back side. Matched up against Daryl Green. 40 yard Hail Mary. He jumped over the top of him and called it.

[Uncle]

Damn.

[Ocho]

Dg. Too short. He was too short.

[Uncle]

Damn.

[Joe]

Ever since then, Footsmith a. He played. He played next. That was in 95, 96. He backed up 97. They got rid of the starter. Foot's been in the starting lineup ever since.

[Ocho]

Ever since. Hey, man, I remember Ed McCaffrey, UNC man. And his arm was so big with them little tiny ass shoulder pads. His shoulder pad looked like it was for the little.

[Joe]

Ed had ticker shoulder pads.

[Ocho]

That's what it was.

[Joe]

Yeah. Why is that? This part. This part of his shoulder like it's. They wasn't even covered right. Like mo. Everybody shoulder pads covered it. Not Ed's edge. Wouldn't they so flimsy.

[Ocho]

You're right.

[Joe]

Don't show the plants was. So they was like. They were probably. He might have had Kristen shoulder pads. His son. Yeah.

[Ocho]

Hey, you know who else did that? Remember Michael Bennett? Remember Michael Bennett?

[Joe]

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Hell, yeah. But that. But. But Ed always. We cut the pants up. We cut the. We was the one. The first one to take all the lighting out of pants. All that stuff that y'. All. They got that from us.

[Uncle]

Yeah.

[Ocho]

Yeah.

[Joe]

I saw Ricky Jackson do it. Ricky Jackson was the first person I saw wear no pads in his pants.

[Uncle]

Yeah. And I don't know.

[Joe]

I said, man, if I ever become good, I'm definitely doing that.

[Uncle]

How you do that? How you play without no pads in

[Joe]

your pants, man, you got to be able to move.

[Ocho]

You got to be able to move.

[Joe]

Yeah.

[Ocho]

Yeah. All that's what. Hey, Joe.

[Joe]

I have no pain. I had a helmet and shoulder pads. No mouthpiece, no hip pads, no thigh pads, no knee pads.

[Uncle]

Hold on.

[Joe]

So.

[Uncle]

So. So when somebody hit you here, you feeling a little more right.

[Joe]

All right. Yeah. You feel it? But good luck. Try to. Hey, and your pants, they were like. They were like tights. Your compression pants to some of your. Yes.

[Uncle]

Yeah.

[Joe]

That's what our pants was like. Streamline, picking up, putting them down. They. They don't let you do that now. Oh, you got to wear pants. Talk about concussion. I said, I ain't never got hit in the thigh, but my head hurt.

[Ocho]

No, you know, you know, I. I like what they do if. If you see some of the. If you see some of the receivers.

[Joe]

Huh?

[Ocho]

It just. It's real flimsy. It's a little flim foam. And sometimes they have. It. Have a little design on it.

[Joe]

Yes.

[Ocho]

It don't really be. It don't really be nothing.

[Joe]

Yeah, in college, we used to put pre wrap. That was. We use pre wrap and for real. Yeah, but you. Hey, man, you know, we had a little. We tried to look. Hey, man, you know how we try to do.

[Ocho]

Try to be clean?

[Joe]

Man, we played. Cause, you know, we saw the guys. Cause Jerry Rice was the one. Jerry Rice used to have a towel. He had flash on it. Yeah, man, we had a fullback. He saw Jerry Rice. This joker done got a whole beach towel. So he. In his stance, the tower, dragging the ground. On your joke, I swear to God. He turned the corner and the guy called it, caught the tower. He came to that because there was a goddamn hole. Take this off. And that's why they say these. They're very impressionable because whatever they see them NFL players wear.

[Ocho]

Oh, yeah, college, high school, they do it.

[Joe]

Warner, they're gonna try to do that. Because we saw guys, whatever they did in the NFL, that's what we tried to do.

[Uncle]

Right, Right.

[Joe]

But he. He just saw the towel. Man. That joker had a beast towel. The towel here in the stand, the towel on the ground, Man. It was the day I look at. I was talking to Bucket the other day. Bucket said, man, hey, homeboy, you remember such and such. I said, yeah, I remember that. But I don't know what Todd Monkey thinking about Ocho.

[Ocho]

Nah. Hey, he trolling.

[Joe]

He's gotta be.

[Ocho]

Unless that's a way for him to motivate his quarterback. That's the only thing I can think of.

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