Lucy Biggers (3:49)

It's funny because I think the climate movement and the left as a whole loves to throw the word privilege around. And now I'm like, yeah, I am privileged. Yes, you're right. Like I own it. Like if I'm privileged enough to like make content about not using a plastic straw or whatever, like I come from a privileged background and I think you totally nailed it. It's the person who is college educated, grew up not really wanting for something, probably maybe went to private school, has, you know, working parents who make enough money that they're not worrying about that and they have the time to worry about the climate and the environment and they're high educated and the schools that they're going to are teaching them this message and it's so enticing. I think one person I talk about in my series that's really inspiring to me is Michael Shallenberger and he talks about how the climate movement has taken the place of religion for a lot of young people because they weren't, they're not growing up in the church, they don't have a lot of faith, or maybe they, they grow up in that, but they don't believe it. Which is for my, my case. I grew up going to church, but I didn't really believe it when I was growing up. And the climate movement took for me a place of faith, of thinking I was part of something good. I thought I was saving the planet. I thought on the right side of history. And now what I talk about in my videos on my TikTok is that I think the road to hell is paved with good intentions. Because when you start to really look at what the climate movement does, what it would really require of us, you know, how much solar and wind we would really need, and where is that solar and wind going? The rare earth minerals that it requires for the solar or for the batteries or the lithium that you need, and the shipping and everything from China, it just becomes its own environmental disaster very quickly. Not to mention also so higher gas prices hurt working class people. We're also preventing developing countries from developing with natural gas and fossil fuels the way that we were able to in America. So I now think I am, now I think I'm on the right side of history again because I've reframed my beliefs to be more pro human, pro industry. Another one of my inspirations is Alex Epstein, who wrote Fossil Future. I read his book probably two years ago, and he just talks about how, you know, humans are good. And the climate movement teaches us that humans are bad, that we're pests on the Earth and that everything that we're doing is horrible. And so, and especially if you're in the west and you're, you're, you're in a wealthy country because we have so much waste and all these things. But now I kind of think of the exact opposite.

Hailey Karenia (6:11)

Yeah. You know, there's a difference between caring about the environment, which I think a lot of people do, and, you know, preserving the planet. And then on the other end of the spectrum, there's this climate a lot alarmism.

Lucy Biggers (6:22)

Right.

Hailey Karenia (6:23)

Why do you think so many people fall for the doom and gloom? We're all gonna die.

Lucy Biggers (6:27)

Yeah. Oh, my gosh. And I. That. I'm so glad you made the distinction too, because I think people think I'm like a climate denier. Which I'm not saying that I'm talking about the climate movement and specifically what you're talking about, that alarmism. Yeah, I think people fall for it because again, humans, we have like monkey minds. Right. Like, we always think the world's gonna end. I feel like it's always we have prophets that have been telling us that since the beginning of time. That I know when our parents were growing up, it was nuclear war. Right. And I think there's always a new crisis. I don' that says about us as humans. And maybe it's some glitch in how we evolved, but I think it's just very. It's very seductive for just the average young person who. Your brain's not fully developed. You're not think. You're thinking in black and white, good versus evil. And I think it's just a seductive thing that people have fallen for since the beginning of time. And the climate change movement is sort of the one of our generation, the climate alarmism.

Hailey Karenia (7:19)

I mean, I remember growing up because I was born in 1994, and then I remember when 2000 came around, it was like, the world's going to end. Everyone was going to end Y2K. Then it got pushed. I think there was another crazy thing in 2010. Everyone was like, the world's going to end in 2010. Or then the Mayan calendar, 2012 or something. I was like, okay, this is insane because it's one thing and then we survive that, and then it's the next thing and then we survive that and the next thing we survive that. It's very. Yeah, to, to the point that you made enticing for people. It's like, oh, my gosh. I mean, this is going to happen. So we have to get on this now. We have to do something now. That's where I think the alarm ism comes from. Because these people who haven't seen the grand scheme of it, they just see these little pockets of panic. We have to do something now. And that's how they get into it.

Lucy Biggers (8:17)

Right? And now you see with the movement, which is. Which really bums me out is I think it's gotten a lot more radical than when I left, which I think I 2019 is kind of the last time because we hit the pandemic. So I was making content, but I wasn't really out. I think it's gotten way more radical now. You see the kids throwing the paint on the paintings. I'm waiting for them just to become violent terrorists. It's a logical next step because the mindset that they're getting indoctrinated into is if the whole world is over and if the Western world is evil, then what isn't justified? Right. You're seeing it with the Palestinian movement right now and the violence there. Like that's what happens with these movements. And Knock on wood. I don't want that to happen. But I think when you teach panic and you teach this good versus evil mentality, again, you have these young people who are thinking to themselves, well, this is justified and it's really sad. And again, the reason I made my series, I started it about two weeks ago and it already has 700,000 views, by the way, I calculated today because I'm just really happy that it's resonating. I was really nervous to post it because it was just being my vulnerable truth and kind of having to let go of what anyone might say. But the reason I did it was because I want to counter this narrative of fear and I think it's so destructive for people and I want my videos. Yeah, I call climate movement a scam. That's sort of like a bit to get it to go viral. Right. Because. But what I'm really trying to get at is like young people should not be afraid. Young people should be proud to be human. And that. Look around like we have these amazing abundant lives that our ancestors, especially if you're a woman, would be so grateful to have. Our grandmothers, I don't know how many hours a day they were spending washing clothes.

Hailey Karenia (9:54)

Yes. Yeah.

Lucy Biggers (9:54)

And we are so freed up because of the abundance that we have. And so I want to hopefully transmit a message of hope and also like higher self esteem for people that humans are not bad. We are not pests.

Hailey Karenia (10:08)

No, not at all. And the climate ebbs and flows. Right. I mean when we talk about global warming or like the ice age, it's supposed to ebb and flow. Certainly we don't want the global warming to get so bad where we can't inhabit Earth, but that would be so far down the line. And I just think people get caught up into these like minute the temperature is moving like this much warmer and it's like. Okay, okay, I, I agree with that so much.

Lucy Biggers (10:42)

And actually it's a video I've been thinking about making, but I haven't quite figured it out yet. But this is again, Alex Epstein shows how. And it's on the, it's actually on the, one of these government websites now where they show the warming in the scale. It's like this, it's like going directly up to the right like and there's a red blinking light.

Hailey Karenia (11:03)

Yeah.

Lucy Biggers (11:03)

They try to make it seem like the NOAA website. Noaa, it's on there right now. Okay. So like that even of itself is like so crazy.

Hailey Karenia (11:10)

Yeah.

Lucy Biggers (11:11)

And then if you take out the scale, it's like one degree of warming. And like, actually it's like if you make it five degrees of farming, the, the Y axis, it's like, yeah, exactly. And so that's when I start to be like, okay, is this really like, you know, people, Are you trying to really scare us? Like, I have. I, I don't, I don't think that. I think they're trying to scare us into action maybe.

Hailey Karenia (11:33)

Yeah.

Lucy Biggers (11:33)

But it's just like, oh my God.

Hailey Karenia (11:34)

And it begs the question, I mean, they're just making money off of this, right? And they need vessels, like soldiers to go out there and do their bidding for them. But, but I want to ask you, what was the initial turning point for you when, you know, you're an activist, you're going to all these events, you're meeting with AOC and Greta Thunberg, and you're in it. So what was the first initial turning point for you where you thought, maybe this isn't what I thought it was.

Lucy Biggers (12:03)

I think it was death by a thousand cuts, to quote Taylor Swift. I mean, that's an expression too. But I think that I always had a pit in my stomach when I would be reporting on these things. And I would even get drunk with friends and be in a small environment and kind of talk about why I thought Standing Rock, the protest against a pipeline back in 2016 was kind of not right. And so I always had this other side of me that was critical, but my forward facing side was trying to be holier than now and present forward. Like, I'm low waste, I'm sustainable, like I'm pure, I'm good. And so I think over time that voice sort of just got louder and louder and it kind of just became uncomfortable in my body to hold both of those spaces. And it felt really inauthentic. Like I never took money as a climate activist from a brand or anything because every time I would think about doing it, it made me feel so uncomfortable. It, like, wasn't my truth. And like, even now with the response to my series in the last two weeks that it started, like, I feel like so free because I'm just really speaking my truth. And even when I do get criticized, I don't. It doesn't bother me. It doesn't get under my skin because I just am like, I know what I believe and I believe that I'm saying what I need to say. And in the past, one comment that would maybe imply that I'm privileged or I'm not perfect, I would spiral about it because I was holding up like a false Persona. But I will say, and it wasn't conscious, you know, only looking back, obviously you can, like, make sense of it. And then I will say, because I've been reflecting on this now, too, making this series. I've had two kids. I had my son in 2022, and I stopped posting because I just couldn't keep it up. And then I will say, but before that, Covid, I remember when the whole world shut down. We were not flying. No one was moving. There was a short period of time in March, the climate emissions, the carbon emissions went down a little bit, like 5% or something. And I thought, if this is the whole world shutting down and this is the only emissions we get, what does the climate movement want us to do? Well, because that would ruin our lives.

Hailey Karenia (14:12)

Their goal is like, zero emissions by whatever year. It makes no sense moving the goalposts. And you're right. I mean, what would this entail? Like, what would we actually have to do? Our lives would have to be drastically different for us to even get close to that.

Lucy Biggers (14:29)

And I don't want to live in that world. Like, that was also the thing was, like, I, I make another. I made another video about this. Like, I think that the cure for climate change is worse than the disease. Like, I, like you said, I'd rather live with a little bit of warming. Like, we can adapt. We build some seawalls in places like, get better drainage, storm drainage, heating, cooling, like, efficiency, energy efficiency. Great. I'm on board. And like, we get a little bit of warming. I don't want to have an electric car that I have to charge that doesn't work. And then, oh, then it's e waste. And then you have solar panels that break and we have to throw those out somewhere. And then there's winds, wind farms out on the Cape. Like, my family goes to Martha's Vineyard, privileged. And we see these wind farms out there that now have been stopped because they've been like, litigated, whatever. And I'm like, this was the stupidest thing ever. But, like, thank God that it's stopping there for now.

Hailey Karenia (15:18)

Yeah.

Lucy Biggers (15:19)

And it's not everywhere. Because what happens when there's one nor' Easter and they go through that wind farm? You're having plexiglass wiping up on the beaches. It's a huge cleanup. It's so dangerous. And that area cares about the environment so much. The Cape, Martha's New Nantucket places. But because it's for the climate, they're like, they throw all of their Other held beliefs out the window because it's like the carbon tunnel vision. They just want renewables and no carbon. Even if the solutions don't even work.

Hailey Karenia (15:46)

Yeah, they have their sights set on this like very narrow goal and they don't care. It's like an ends to a means. They don't care. They'll burn everything down in the meantime to get to this, this one goal. And even, you know, you brought up the pandemic. And I was living in New York City at the time and I was living in Battery park and I remember these videos would go viral of dolphins swimming around the Statue of Liberty and everyone was going nuts saying, like, see, nature is healing. My, of course my like earpiece is falling out here. Give me a moment. Everyone would say nature is healing. And you know, this is what we have to do. We all just have to like stay home forever so that the dolphins can frolic.

Lucy Biggers (16:27)

The dolphins can frolic. Like, this is insane.

Hailey Karenia (16:30)

Insane.

Lucy Biggers (16:31)

It's so insane. And again, it's anti human. It's very anti western. That's a theme that's been coming up for me a lot like plastic ocean pollution. A study came out back in the day that was saying how human, sorry, the US is only responsible for 2% of ocean plastic pollution because we have modern waste infrastructure. Right. Even though we consume like 85% of the world's trash, we make like most of the trash, but we don't pollute most of it because we have modern waste infrastructure. But instead of saying, okay, why the climate movement? I would be behind this cause, right? Oh, Bali, all they're throwing their trash in the rivers. Let's make modern waste infrastructure for Bali, for Guatemala, for Asian countries. Like, that is a really great environmental cause. No, no, no. The climate movement says if you live in the Upper east side of Manhattan, you cannot have a plastic straw.

Hailey Karenia (17:18)

Oh, of course, of course.

Lucy Biggers (17:20)

And I was, I was doing that, by the way, because. Oh, because it goes back to my point. It's anti western. Like they don't even want to know. Like, the US is actually good at something. So they're like, no, you' still bad. Yeah, you still need to feel guilty. And we cannot do anything right?

Hailey Karenia (17:33)

100%. I'm bringing this up because, you know, in the same vein, this whole war on plastic straws that was waged, I.

Lucy Biggers (17:39)

Mean, I started it. I was a fighter. I'm so sorry. I was a big fighter. It was you.

Hailey Karenia (17:45)

It was you. You're the reason I go to a coffee shop and there's a Paper straw in my cold room.

Lucy Biggers (17:50)

Every day I feel the guilt.

Hailey Karenia (17:51)

Oh, my goodness. So I'm on hinge and my profile. I need to pull my profile up because I have something like one of my prompts is on plastic straws. And everyone loves it. How I'm not married. I don't know. Someone says my. It says, my most controversial opinion is, I don't care enough about turtles to use a paper straw. Everyone loves it.

Lucy Biggers (18:10)

That's actually a bipartisan issue.

Hailey Karenia (18:12)

Yes, it is a bipartisan issue, for sure. But, you know, when I was living in New York City, there was this massive climate protest in Battery Park. I was living downtown at the time. You were probably there. Yep. This was you, too. This is all your fault. No, I'm just kidding. But I remember I came out of my apartment to go to work, and I was going to the subway, and I looked outside and I. I said, oh, my gosh. Like, what is going on? I mean, there was just people everywhere, and there was some event happening in Battery Park. And I looked over and I. It was just some protest. I didn't know what the protest was for, but I just. I kind of, like, went along my way and went to the subway. And when I got home from work that day, there was garbage everywhere, all over where all the protesters were. And I thought, oh, my gosh. I don't. I didn't know what they were protesting. So I went into Battery park, and the entire park is littered with cardboard signs about the climate. I said, ain't no way.

Lucy Biggers (19:13)

And the cardboard signs were the garbage.

Hailey Karenia (19:15)

Yes.

Lucy Biggers (19:16)

You can't make it up.

Hailey Karenia (19:17)

And I'm like, they didn't even use the garbage.

Lucy Biggers (19:19)

They got me their cardboard.

Hailey Karenia (19:20)

And you would think.

Lucy Biggers (19:21)

Use the cardboard.

Hailey Karenia (19:22)

Yeah. And you would think that if the garbage or the recycle is full, if you care enough about the environment to go march about it, you would care enough to go find another garbage pail or a recycling bin to put it in. But they didn't. And that's when I thought to myself, these people don't actually care about the movement. They care about being seen. They care. It was like a virtue signaling thing.

Lucy Biggers (19:47)

I thought, oh, my God, I think that's so true. Virtue signaling is such a great, like, way to think about this movement in so many ways. And I. Yeah, Standing rock, same thing. They left a million pounds of trash behind, and they cared so much about the reservation and preserving it, and then they leave with all this trash and they don't. They don't care. And again, even the pipeline that they were protesting would actually be better for the environment than the trains that now currently transport the oil that, you know, requires more energy to do that. So the amount of contradictions in it are. So they never end. The entire movement is that way.

Hailey Karenia (20:23)

It's a lot. Do you think that climate anxiety is part of the reason why some young people aren't having children?

Lucy Biggers (20:30)

Yes, probably. I hope that they grow out of it. I mean, I probably, at 25, was like, I'm not having kids and now I have two. I, like, want to have more when I can afford them.

Hailey Karenia (20:38)

I think it changes your mind about it, right? I mean, having children changes your perspective on the whole world. I don't have children yet, but I hope to. I hope to one day. And I know that my perspective on a lot of things will change.

Lucy Biggers (20:51)

Yeah, I think one thing that I really realized when I was looking at my son was I had so much guilt about just being a human being consumer in a modern life. Like, you know, we have this narrative that's almost pushed into us subconsciously that we're like fallen angels, sort of like, well, like, we used to be perfect, but now we live in these modern consumers lifestyles and, like, we're pests on the earth, we're killing the earth. And you just have, you know, you kind of carry that around. You don't even know you carry that around. And then you have a kid and you're like, this child's perfect. I want to give him everything. I want to give him the world. And I want him to go through life feeling excited and empowered and proud of being a human in, like, the civilization that we live in. That's so amazing. And so I think whether it was conscious, subconscious, like, that was a shift that totally happened for me where I was like, I'm not gonna live, like, small and worried about a piece of, like a straw that I'm, you know, using when I have my son and I have to take care of him and I want to make an amazing life for him. Not to mention the amount of diapers you go through. Like, you drive yourself crazy. And I'm not doing the reading usable.

Hailey Karenia (21:47)

No, no, no.

Lucy Biggers (21:48)

Reasonable diagnosis.

Hailey Karenia (21:49)

We can't be doing that. I totally understand. I mean, you got to draw the line somewhere. You know, you talked about what it would take for us to get to these, like, net zero emissions or whatever this lofty goal is. Do you know what life would look like if the climate movement was successful?

Lucy Biggers (22:07)

You know, you can only imagine. But I think we can look at Europe which is a very good example of what could happen there. Because you have places like Germany that have shut down nuclear plants. It's happened a in the States, but it's really happened there. And they have to, you know, be importing way more, you know, natural gas and, and fuels from Russia, which is obviously really good for them, smart geopolitically. And then you had Spain just had a big rolling blackout because they have so much solar and wind that when there was a fluctuation in like the way the energy was going, solar and wind, it's not like consistent, right? So like the wind can stop or the sun can go behind a cloud or whatever. And then if you have a huge drop, I guess you need to have a consistent hum of energy that you need to get from like natural gas or a hydro or nuclear. And they didn't have enough. So when the system went down it like went everywhere and it was like a domino effect and they didn't have power for like a few days. So I think that's examples on a small scale of what we could see. I think like even in California, so much regulation, it prevents people from building homes. Energy levels or energy costs are so high. So you have just cost of living and inflation is so much higher. It's so much harder for just normal, working class, everyday people to live. And those are the people. I want all people to just be thriving and living their best life and have an affordable life. And I think we should stop worrying about our carbon footprint. I carried that around my neck like a weight and now I'm like, wow, that's so great. I have a carbon footprint. That means I got to drive my kids in my car to go get dinner with someone. Or I flew across the country to see a friend. That's so awesome and we should be grateful for what we have instead of feel horrible about it.

Hailey Karenia (23:49)

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Lucy Biggers (25:45)

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It's not just for celebrities. So do like I did and have one of your assistant's assistants switch you to Mint Mobile today. I'm told it's super easy to do. @mintmobile.com Switch upfront payment of $45 for 3 month plan equivalent to $15 per month Required intro rate first 3 months only, then full price plan options available, taxes and fees, extra fee, full terms@mintmobile.com yeah you know when you say about flying around to seeing friends and things like that, I mean AOC Bernie Sanders, they're on this fight the Oligarchy tour. They talk a lot about, you know, I mean AOC was, she was the face of the Green New Deal that was a few years back. And they claim, and there are a lot of like famous people too who claim to care about the environment or they'll, they'll tell the sorry people, you know, take Tisk Tisk Tisk like you should do this or use your, don't use a reusable water bottle, don't do this or plastic straws or what have you. But then they're the ones flying private to and from and they're the ones that are actually doing all the damage. They're just telling us to. You know, it's like, rules for you, not for me. Yeah.

Lucy Biggers (26:55)

It must be also very hard to live with that cognitive dissonance in your mind. Because I do remember being in the sustainability movement, and, like, I felt guilty about everything. Like, I felt guilty to, like, fly to go to my honeymoon.

Hailey Karenia (27:08)

Yeah.

Lucy Biggers (27:09)

You know, like, you know, I felt, like, guilty about my, like, wedding. Like, you know, like, whatever. I just felt guilty about everything. And it's just such a depleting, like, sucking. Like, it sucks the life out of you. And so obviously they want to fly private. Who doesn't? Own it. Own it. Yeah, just own it. Like, but they can't, because their. Their ideology that they're pushing, it doesn't. It doesn't align. And, like, at the same time, I'm like, how have you been in the movement as long as I have? Like, AOC and I, our peers were the same age. I actually interviewed AOC was, like, one of my first. I, like, was one of the first people to interview aoc. I had met her at a small event and I interviewed her at my old job back in, like, 2016, 17, and the video I did of her went viral. And so I know her, and I actually really like aoc. Like, we had a really great rapport. Like, I really like her. Having known her personally, you know, that doesn't always come through. I feel like you have these caricatures of people and people really don't like her. But, like, I genuinely know that AOC is, like, a good person in my mind and, like, is doing what she thinks is best.

Hailey Karenia (28:05)

Yeah, but.

Lucy Biggers (28:06)

But what I don't get is, it's like, are you so entrenched in the world that you're in with the money from the donors and the supporters? Are you so afraid to change your opinion? Because how can you be a thinking person and be in the movement for this long, raising the alarm for this long. Nothing you're saying has come true and not have, like, some sort of Maya Culpa.

Hailey Karenia (28:25)

Right.

Lucy Biggers (28:26)

And, you know, and maybe they're afraid. She's afraid to. Or she just is, like, whatever. Things change. It definitely. I will say, too, I feel like the climate movement fever, like, was, like, 2018, I think, and then it's been Covid. We've had so many other things. And I think that's also a reason why I felt comfortable talking about it. Like, it took me, like, five years to feel like I could talk about It.

Hailey Karenia (28:46)

Yeah, yeah.

Lucy Biggers (28:48)

Because it's just thinking about all the people that I know that are probably watching my videos, like.

Hailey Karenia (28:52)

But yeah, I mean, I feel like with all the people who talk about the climate and stuff, like, I don't care if you fly private. I don't care if you're on a jet. I don't care. Just don't talk down to other people. Because then people don't like the hypocrisy. Then it's like, okay, well, right. You know, this just looks bad on you. But I want to talk about Greta Thunberg too, because you also interviewed her. You were ingrained in this movement. She has become a fake face of the climate movement. She is the face of the climate movement. She has 14.1 million followers on Instagram. I mean, people. People listen to her when she talks. I mean, CNN platformed her when she first came on the scene. She was. She was huge. And I feel like now she has turned her efforts to the war in Gaza. And war is horrific. We should try to end war at all costs. There is certainly a need for humanitarian aid. But to me, this seems like an opportun thing where climate isn't so sexy right now. So she'll just hop onto the cause that everyone's talking about. Do you think that she is genuine or not?

Lucy Biggers (29:59)

I totally agree with you. I think that she is genuine and that she thinks the Western world is evil.

Hailey Karenia (30:05)

Yeah.

Lucy Biggers (30:06)

And so the new cause for that is Gaza. And I think it's. But it's sort of the same thread. Before it was we're ruining the planet because we are these evil consumers and like, yada, yada. And now it's because of Israel and what's going on there. And we're evil because we're supporting that. And I think. So the through line is that she thinks we're evil. She thinks she's evil. She thinks her country. Not she's evil, but she's descended from evil people. Her country's evil. And so the latest way to, you know, exert that energy is this cause. And I think she just thinks in very much black and white thinking. And like, it's so ingrained in her that like, the western world is evil. Someone. I made a video about her and someone commented, like, she's never calling out the Middle Eastern, like, you know, Qatar for its oil development. What about the uae? Like, all these countries, oil developers in the world. But she's like focused on, you know, Gaza. It doesn't make any sense.

Hailey Karenia (31:00)

Yeah, it just seems like also she's quick to just hop on a boat and hop over there. But it's okay because she's pushing the right climate narrative. So it's okay that she's on this gas guzzling vessel to go preach to other people about what they should be doing. It's just, just. Yeah, the hypocrisy, it just, it just reeks of all of that. Does she walk the walk? Like, does she hand wash her clothes? Like, I know she claims to make no income, but I feel like she has to be paying fines from protesting. She has all these Instagram followers. She has to be making money off of this.

Lucy Biggers (31:33)

No, she's got to be making money off. I said, I interviewed in one of my videos. I said we interviewed. And I'm pretty sure her, you know, maybe she didn't take the money, but like, her nonprofit got $25,000 to like take, take part in like a 20 minute conversation. It was over zoom. It was like a pandemic. So, like, she's definitely. I mean, I think she comes from a wealthy family. Like, I can't speak into, like, her specific things, but, like, I think that she is a young person who. I think she thinks she's on the right side of history. I think she thinks she's fighting against these causes just in the same way that people fought for civil rights and these other movements that were so successful and were so amazing. Maybe even the first generation of environmentalism. Right. Or the first wave feminism, these movements that were so amazing and did separate modern world. I think she thinks that she's doing that now, but I see it as sort of like a distorted half cousin of that. That is not doing what she thinks she's doing. And she's sort of being a puppet for like, anti Western ideology that I think is ultimately really destructive for her and for the people who follow her who think that the world that they grew up in, in their country is evil.

Hailey Karenia (32:36)

Yeah. I think this is indicative of how a lot of younger people feel about America as a whole. They're not proud to be American. They hate l here they say that we're oppressed. When it's like if you just opened your worldview just a little bit, you could realize how not oppressed we truly are here. We're very, very lucky. But the climate movement and the veganism movement are sort of going hand in hand. Climate activists will warn about the evils of cow farts releasing methane gas and all this stuff into the air. How do you feel about veganism?

Lucy Biggers (33:09)

Can you hear me? Like can you see me rolling my eyes? I was like my eyes were going to the back of my head. Veganism was one of the first like sacred cow cows not to not wrong. You saw cow but one of the cows for me to fall, I just started to be like this doesn't make sense. Like I mean like the fake meat like they're like this is better for the environment than the cow. So it's going to be grown using genetically modified GMO corn and soys that are commercially agriculture take up so much land. There's no biodiversity. It requires so many inputs which also, also is fine. Whatever. We need it for certain things. But don't pretend it's environmentally better than a cow that you can have graze on grassland and sequester carbon. By the way, all of the US land evolved with bison, the buffalo grazing like that's actually really good for the US land. I actually think we should have more grazing cattle and it would be really amazing. Maybe turn some of those soybean farms into grassland. So the veganism, I mean it's not good for you. It's all these like this like you know, corporate made sludge and it's just marketing and, and I don't know it just, I feel like there's like this thing where people are like, there's almost like a horseshoe effect where if I criticize that and I'm like so capitalistic in like marketing there's like a certain segment of the environmental movement's like yeah, you're right. And I'm like, but I'm like coming at it from like a different angle if that makes sense. So I think I don't like veganism. I think it's dulu.

Hailey Karenia (34:34)

Yeah. I mean there's no way that it's.

Lucy Biggers (34:36)

Not good for you.

Hailey Karenia (34:37)

There's no way that lab grown beyond meat is good for you. Who knows what the hell is even in it. Then there are people pushing like insect meat and all these other alternatives to, to just not eat animal protein. And it's like no people have actually been living off of this for millennium and it. And it's fine. So why would we stop now? And I feel like this is where this climate movement loses the majority of the population.

Lucy Biggers (35:04)

Right. Thank God. I don't want them to get the population. Stay crazy guys. Well also I feel like there's such a health impact for too like even mental health. This is a really funny anecdote that's so embarrassing for me. But you, this, this puts you into my mindset. 2016 when, when Trump won. I went. I went vegetarian in protest. What does that even mean?

Hailey Karenia (35:25)

What did you think you were doing?

Lucy Biggers (35:27)

I don't know. I was like, I'm going to. I'm going to make a stand. Like, I'm becoming a vegetarian. Like, not even vegan, which is also hilarious.

Hailey Karenia (35:34)

You showed him.

Lucy Biggers (35:36)

I know. Showed him so hard. And then. But then I. And also, then I, like, started to have, like, you have anxiety and your mental health is awful, especially for women. And so now I am totally, like, on the camp of, like, as much red meat as you can have. Like, I think it's so good for us. Like, I think our ancestors ate it. And so I'm all about that life now. And I feel bad for she. Greta has been vegan for many years, so that might be why her brain isn't working very well.

Hailey Karenia (36:02)

Yeah, it might be catching up with Draw the conclusions. Do you keep in touch with anyone that you used to protest with? Like, have you. Have they seen your videos on why you left the movement?

Lucy Biggers (36:14)

So I have. I grew a lot of my following on Instagram in, like, back in the 20 teens, so that's where I had 50,000 followers. And then I have done a few posts on there, like, a few years back, talking about, like, how my mind had changed around plastic after I had a kid. But, like, the thing is, it's so visible, and I get so much feedback and from family, friends, old coworkers, like, everybody that. An old climate activist that I. I did this whole series on TikTok intentionally, so I haven't. I feel like there are people who don't like me, but I just sort of block it out because I'm kind of feel like I'm in this cocoon phase of just sharing for the first time. And so I'm trying to create, like, a safe container before it gets seen by a wider audience, because I just want to feel more confident in what I'm saying. But, yeah, there was, like, so much hate on some of my past posts on my Instagram, but I never read the comments sense. My sister told me. She was like, wow, those are really bad. I was like, I don't need to know.

Hailey Karenia (37:07)

Like, you can't listen to that. You just got to keep pushing because what you're doing now, you feel confident about. And I think that speaks volumes. I'm assuming you still care deeply about the environment and protecting the planet. I think most people do at some level. I think half the country gets a bad rep about not caring about, you know, the environment or being climate Deniers. Deniers or anything. I don't think normal people deny that the climate is changing. They just, they're not on board with the alarmism. Like, this needs to be the one issue voter. You know, it doesn't have to be the one issue that they're going to the ballot box about. So what are some ways that we as a global community can protect the planet? Within reason.

Lucy Biggers (37:53)

Right. You know, I'm not like an expert on that. I've kind of gotten out of the business of like, giving advice on the environment. I feel like I. I'm more like live and let live. Like, I want people to feel that they can have prosperous lives and like achieve the American dream. And I think right now, for me, that comes in the form of like cheap, abundant energy in whatever form it comes in. I don't think it's solar and wind. I kind of think that those are duds. I think nuclear. Like, I'm not the most studied up. I mean, I'm not a nuclear, you know, scientist or anything like that. But from what I've read, I understand and people that I look up to in this space that, that there's a lot of regulations right now on nuclear and if those regulations could be removed, which maybe Trump has done a little bit of that with executive orders, we could proliferate more nuclear and we could really have low carbon energy that's reliable and can run 24 7. So I think I'm bullish on nuclear and I think there's so much out there that we don't know. Like, the world universe is a mystery still. I think we're still discovering how everything works. So I'm sure we're going to discover even more. But I don't think. I think we're going to look back at solar and wind and be like, what? Like, yeah, a lot of people of a lot of waste. I think they're going to be like skeletons of this era and we're going to figure out something way smarter that's actually reliable. And it's. Maybe it's like thermo nuclear fission or fusion or. I don't know. I don't know. Well, but. Well, that's what. Yeah, like, don't pollute, obviously. Like, don't pollute. Like, don't go out and like throw your garbage in the ocean, like, obviously.

Hailey Karenia (39:12)

Yeah. I mean, cheers to that. I think we've got to move in the right direction. I think unleashing American energy and bolstering American farmland. I mean, these are things that we can all get behind. Thank you so much, Lucy for joining me. I really, really respect you because I mean, I don't know where you stand politically, but I think you have to be such a free thinker and you have to be so open to new ideas to have to be able to challenge yourself in the way that you have done and kind of come out on the other side. I really, really respect the hell out of you and I think that this conversation was very interesting and I thank you for coming on the show.

Lucy Biggers (39:53)

Thank you so much for having me. I had so much fun.

Hailey Karenia (39:56)

Me too. All right, I want to take a quick break to tell you about fatty 15. You know, if you follow me on social media, I am in the gym. I need to have my sleep right. I need to have my joint supported. And you probably want to find something too that will help you make you feel younger and slow down aging. So I'm excited to share with you guys. C15 from Fatty 15 is a first. First essential fatty acid to be discovered in more than 90 years. Fatty 15 co founder Dr. Stephanie Van Watson discovered the benefits of C15 while working with the US Navy and based on these studies we know that when our cells don't have enough C15 they can age faster. So fatty 15 can help repair and protect age related damage to cells and help activate pathways in the body that support our overall wellness. Fatty 15 is a science based, award winning 100 pure C15 supplement that comes in a gorgeous reusable jar. I love it. It comes in a little glass jar. Then you can get more. You get the subscription sent to you. You can just refill that jar. It's really, it is gorgeous and I am having so much more energy since fatty 15 sent me some to try and it's really helping me get through my long days. Fatty 15 is on a mission to help optimize your C15 levels to support your long term health and wellness, especially as you age. You can get an additional 15 off their 90 day subscription starter kit by going to fatty15.com scroll using code scroll at checkout. These statements have not been evaluated by the fda. This product is not intended to diagnose, treat or cure or prevent any disease. All right, and on that note, it is time for my favorite segment of the show. Scrolling time. Have you guys heard of icks? Like when you get the ick from someone. You've heard of this? Yes, many times from Evita. Well, you don't want your own wife to be icked out by you. But especially in the world of dating people Will say, oh, you know, he's a ten, but he's short, or he's a ten, but he'S bald. Or she's a ten, but she has pronouns in her bio. So this guy was asked about that exact scenario on the street. Listen to this. She's a 10, but she has pronouns in her Instagram bio. Oh, that's. That's not a 10. That's a walk in HR department. Why do you say that? You know, every date with her is like a ethics seminar with girls like that. So I like to use the approach I started called the AWA method.

Unnamed Speaker (42:46)

You ask yourself, is the ass worth the arguments?

Hailey Karenia (42:50)

Spoiler alert. It's not. And you know that there are a lot of arguments coming if you are date. If you are dating a girl with pronouns in her bio, get ready for lecture. And I'm better than you, and you know, you just can't be dealing with that. Dating's hard enough. I can't imagine being lectured by someone who feels that they're more morally superior to me because they have pronouns in their bio. F that. I'm not dealing with that. Then this next video is just. I mean, this was shocking to me. But this girl, she says that anti fatness is really rooted in racism. Watch this. It says anti fatness is rooted in anti blackness over and over again. This is the point that she's making. Anti fatness rooted in anti blackness. Huh? And I will. I remember this. So I. I think it was Time magazine. Yeah, here it is. Time magazine. They put out something in. When was this? 2022. The white supremacist origins of exercise, and six other surprising facts about the history of US physical fitness. I mean, there are mainstream media outlets in this country that are trying to tell you that working out is racist. And if you're skinny, you're racist. If you have. If you eat healthy, it means you're socioeconomically insensitive and all these other things. It's totally rooted in this lack of accountability. If you want to be skinny, you can be skinny. Unless there's something seriously medically wrong with you, which in some cases there may be, but for the most part, if you are not skinny, it is your fault. People don't like to hear that, though. Anytime I talk about fitness and exercise, I get hate comments. People will tweet at me. They will rage, tweet at me. They will tell me that I am fat, but I am healthy. Okay, who are you trying to convince? Because you're not convincing me. I'm just saying no one wants to hear the truth. That sometimes the truth hurts. I'm sorry, this next video. Well, no, actually I have to. Even I have to go into this because the comment section here, she says, and this was the caption on this video. And you better not fix your fingers to say nothing if you haven't read the required reading. Fearing the Black Body by Dr. Sabrina Strings. Things that will not be on my summer reading list. That book. I don't think so. And honestly, the comments were totally in agreement with where I stand saying correlation does not equal causation. Hope this helps. Did you just say that hating fatness is the base of hating black people? She's too lazy to articulate her claim. And someone said, well, what if I don't like fat people from any color girl? Come on. That girl who's too woke. So even the comment section on TikTok, people were saying, this girl's out of line with this one. Now this next video is sort of in line. We were talking about robots taking over the world earlier this week. And this is a throwback video from 2016 where a robot sunk a hole in one at the Waste Management open on the 16th hole. Watch this. How about this? Yesterday, a robot taking a swipe at this day it. And what else would you expect here at the Waste Management Phoenix Open.

Lucy Biggers (46:13)

Really?

Hailey Karenia (46:13)

That robot is called L. Drick.

Lucy Biggers (46:16)

How's this?

Hailey Karenia (46:16)

Of course. And both Eldricks have done that at 16. About that.

Lucy Biggers (46:22)

Only here could that happen.

Hailey Karenia (46:24)

The robot just sinks it. Of course, because they can have everything lined up perfectly. They're not human. They're. It's a robot. Of course you get a hole in.

Unnamed Speaker (46:34)

One, but what a perfect tournament for this to go down.

Hailey Karenia (46:37)

Oh, yeah.

Unnamed Speaker (46:37)

The way that, that hole right there is amazing. I mean, people, even golfers, are jump jumping in the water.

Hailey Karenia (46:44)

I know. Waste Management is so much fun. I went not last year, maybe two years ago. Unreal. So much fun. I will say not to brag, but when I got a hole in one, I just dunked it. So I actually did a better job than this robot. Just saying maybe robots are not taking over after all. But could a robot do this? This is a bartender for those watching. He's got 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6 of these little mixers and he's pouring five martinis all at once. It is like the most amazing thing I've ever seen in my life. Did I just do a good job explaining that? I mean, he's got this like. It was almost like a slinky. The way that he had all the shakers, and he poured five different martinis. Different martinis. It's not like it was one mixer and he was just making all five dirty martinis. I mean, I think it was a cosmo, a dirty martini and espresso martini. Maybe a lemon drop, something else. That is talent, and I would say that he deserves one hell of a tip for that. Let's get into the blind reactions. How many do you have? Two. Let's hit it. Okay. It's a little baby goat. Oh, God. Is this goat getting electric fence? He's getting zapped. Yes, it is.

Lucy Biggers (48:23)

No.

Hailey Karenia (48:25)

Oh, the little noises he's making is so cute. I mean, I guess you have to learn at some point. Ugh. I don't like that one. This one better make up for it. What you're gonna do? I'm gonna disappear.

Lucy Biggers (48:39)

Are you?

Hailey Karenia (48:40)

Yeah. All right.

Lucy Biggers (48:41)

I'm gonna disappear.

Hailey Karenia (48:42)

Okay, now do a trick. Ready? One, two, three. Oh, good job. Good job. That's when you have to just say, like, oh, and you. You have to be, like, happy and so that you don't start crying. You know, you just have to be like, oh, like, that was awesome. Yeah. Anyway, I did have some questions from last Friday that I didn't get to. I think it was last Friday when I didn't get to my question. So here are some of the questions that you all sent in, and I will answer them to the best of my ability. If I could interview anyone for fun outside of politics, who would it be? And wow. Outside of politics. Recently, I reached out to Jenny McCarthy because of the whole, like, autism vaccine thing. I wanted to have her on. It has not come to fruition yet, but that is someone I would really. I guess that's still in the vein of politics. I got very, very close at my last job to interviewing Dylan Mulvaney. He was, like, dming with me back and forth. And then I think he found out that I was conservative, and he got, like, spooked. But I wasn't going to. Like, I wanted to actually have a sit down, like a respectful sit down with him because he was making videos about going to church and meeting with a priest. And I thought, well, this would be an interesting conversation. Like, I'm a conservative Catholic woman, and maybe we have something in common. I would like to figure it out, but. But we never got there either. Okay, so interview someone outside of politics. Outside of politics. Outside of politics. Bryson DeChambeau. I have interviewed him. It was just two questions. Maybe one or two questions, but I maybe, like, a Singer or. I don't know. This is actually a hard one. I like these questions, and I really can't think of anything. I feel like maybe, like, a child star would be interesting. Maybe like Miley Cyrus, someone who grew up with very famous family and kind of had to navigate that. I feel like that would be interesting. And she's very talented, so maybe. Maybe that. I've got to think there's. You know, you're hitting me with this on the spot, and I can't think of anything. If you could have dinner with someone dead or alive, who would it be? And I have to say it would be my great, great aunt. I have never met her, but she was really cool. Her name was Adele Jurgens. She was an actress in the 40s and 50s. She dated Ronald Reagan, and she was in movies with Marilyn Monroe. So, yeah, if you want to pull her up. Adele Jurgens, if you want to screen cap it so people can see. But. But yeah, she is my grandma's aunt. My great great aunt. But that would be really cool to see. I don't know, just to talk to her about what it was like being a movie star, and she was, like, a model and all these things. But that would be very cool. I feel like I would want to know what it was like to date Ronald Reagan before he was the President of the United States. Gosh. If she sealed the deal, I. My life would be totally different.

Unnamed Speaker (52:10)

What a cool time to be alive, though, and do all that. I mean, that's.

Lucy Biggers (52:14)

Aw.

Unnamed Speaker (52:14)

That's iconic.

Hailey Karenia (52:15)

Yeah. Very cool. And, you know, that's that picture with her. That's her with Marilyn Monroe on the bottom, right? Yeah. That's crazy, right? So I would want to get dinner with her. Someone asked my middle name. It starts with a J. I will let people in the. I'll. I'll give the people in the chat like, five seconds to guess, but it starts with a J. Can you guys guess? You're not going to be able to. Joe, you're Googling me.

Unnamed Speaker (52:46)

Haley. Joe.

Hailey Karenia (52:48)

No, Michael's Googling me right now. I don't think you're gonna find it. I mean, maybe it's Jennings. Jennings. Yeah. It's different. You wouldn't guess it, but it's my mom's maiden name. And someone asked my favorite pizza toppings. I would say pepperoni. I guess that's boring, but pepperoni is classic. You cannot go wrong. Extra protein. I love it. Someone asked me my best and worst concert experience. I tried thinking about this one. I can't say That I had any, like, really bad concert experiences. And I've been to so many concerts, it's hard to think of the best ones. But off the top of my head, Billy Joel was incredible, amazing live. And for a Long Islander like me, it was just iconic. So iconic. Also, for the record, I can find anything on the Internet. Well, why is my name spelled wrong in that other one? I don't know. The Internet is only sometimes, right? So true. I saw Britney Spears when I was in high school. That's iconic because she's gone crazy now, so she'll never be on tour again. I loved Maroon 5 in high school. I saw them. They were really good live. Lady Gaga, incredible live. Like, very, very talented. Just an amazing vocalist. So for my worst concert experience ever, the concert itself wasn't bad. I went to Lil Wayne and Nicki Minaj in high school, and I was supposed to go to this, like, mandatory graduation practice, but Lil Wayne was in town. So I was like, I'm gonna go to the concert and I already know how to walk. I mean, what am I gonna do at graduate? What are you gonna teach me at graduation practice that I don't already know how to do? Do you know, grab with my left hand, shake with my right hand, and walk like. I got that down pat. I don't need to go to practice. So I said that I had a family obligation. Then I went to Lil Wayne, Nicki Minaj, then sister Rosemary. Rest in peace, she's no longer with us. She stalked my Facebook, saw my mup loads that I went to the concert. Got me in trouble.

Unnamed Speaker (55:05)

Sister Rosemary got you.

Hailey Karenia (55:06)

Yeah, she's my opinion. She's my OP in high school. But then I was thinking of, like, best concert experiences, and I kept thinking of comedians. I have seen so many amazing comedians. Ricky Gervais, Louis ck, Bill Burr, Dave Chappelle.

Unnamed Speaker (55:29)

How much of this was in Nashville?

Hailey Karenia (55:32)

Dave Chappelle was in Nashville. Bill Burr was in Nashville. It was actually like an hour or so outside of Nashville. It was in the Cavern. Have you ever been to that concert venue? It's literally in a cave. So cool. So that was really, really cool. And then I saw Nate Bragazzi at Bridgestone in Nashville, and that was really cool because that was the largest crowd ever. He broke the record.

Unnamed Speaker (55:56)

Was that the taping?

Hailey Karenia (55:57)

Yeah, that was cool. Yeah, the largest crowd there. So, so very cool because he was performing in his hometown, so I love that. Someone asked me what my guilty pleasure song is. I don't know guilty pleasure songs. I mean, I've Been listening to the new Morgan Wallen. Morgan Wallen album, and I've seen him twice in concert, and I think I'm gonna go see him in Miami, too.

Unnamed Speaker (56:25)

Well, my daughter just bought. My daughter just bought tickets for my.

Hailey Karenia (56:28)

Weekend, so I'm like, should I go for a third time? Third time's a charm. I gotta go. And everyone's been hating the song Miami on his album, but I love it. It's one of my favorites. So I think I'm gonna go. Guilty Pleasure song, though. I think just back to my childhood. Maybe like a good old Hannah Montana. Hannah Montana song. Can't go wrong. Those slapped.

Unnamed Speaker (56:53)

I think I would live in the 80s with all of that, like, 80s music. I love, like, Starship. All the 80s stuff with the, you know, the synthesizer, the 80s pop, Billy Ocean. Like that. That stuff is like some 80s music. Billy Joel. Like, you can admit. You two. You can admit to, like, lichen, but, like, some of it just stays under the radar. Like, you know, you're not saying I'm a. I'm a. I'm a Billy Ocean.

Hailey Karenia (57:16)

Fan, You know, like, yeah, you know, you too. They remember when they put their album out on everyone's iPhone, and it was just, like, against our consent 100%. Yeah, that was really annoying because I was in middle school, and I was like, what the hell? This is ruining my playlists. Last question someone asked me. What gets you excited each day? Most days I go to the gym. I get excited to go to the gym. I go to work every day. Love this job. My morning coffee gets me excited. I mean, it really is the little things that get me excited these days. So. So morning coffee, a good workout. Love coming here, talking to all of you. So that's my guilty pleasure. That's my. That's what gets me going each day. On that note, thank you so much for spending your Friday evening with me. In the meantime, you can always follow me @haleycarandia on all social media platforms, but you can see me right back here on Monday. Rumble.com Haley is where you can watch Nightly scroll or you can catch it on Apple Podcasts, Spotify. Bye. And I'll see you right back here next week. See you.