Case Files 07: Jesika Jones Part 2 with Derek Jones

Summary

Nobody Should Believe Me: Case Files 07 – Jesika Jones Part 2 with Derek Jones

Introduction

In the gripping second part of the Jesika Jones case files, host Andrea Dunlop delves deeper into the harrowing experiences of Derrick Jones, the father of Jesika Jones' victims and Jessica's ex-husband. This episode unravels the complex web of deceit, manipulation, and the devastating impact of Munchausen by Proxy abuse on a family. Through Derrick's candid recounting, listeners gain a profound understanding of the psychological and emotional turmoil that ensues when a trusted partner orchestrates such heinous acts.

---

Derrick Jones on the Jessica Jones Case

Background and Relationship with Jessica

Derrick Jones introduces himself as the father of Jesika Jones' oldest and youngest victims and Jessica's ex-husband. Reflecting on their relationship, Derrick shares how they met and the rapid progression of their union.

“We met through Facebook, actually… I was in a dark place back then, and so I don't think that helped with my judgment very well.” ([05:18])

Derrick emphasizes his initial impressions of Jessica as a seemingly organized and caring individual, unaware of the darkness lurking beneath her exterior.

---

Meeting and Relationship with Jessica

The couple's relationship blossomed quickly, culminating in Jessica informing Derrick of her pregnancy with twins.

“We started dating, we started hanging out, and she would come up and see me… I was like, I'll be there for my kid.” ([06:01])

Despite the joy of impending parenthood, Derrick begins to notice subtle red flags, such as discrepancies in Jessica's employment and sudden health concerns.

---

Marriage and Pregnancy

Jessica's revelation of her twin pregnancy marks a significant turning point. Derrick recounts the overwhelming responsibility he felt as he moved closer to Jessica, prioritizing his family's well-being despite personal struggles.

“I was really in that place… I didn't know that I was in a depression and everything.” ([10:14])

Their marriage was swift, aligning with Jessica's desire to formalize their union before the twins' arrival. However, the initial happiness soon gave way to mounting stress and tension.

---

Children’s Health Issues

Jesika Jones' children, particularly the oldest, began exhibiting health issues that initially seemed manageable but hinted at deeper problems. Derrick describes the challenges of balancing work and family amidst these concerns.

“They started getting older and… they had some speech problems and stuff like that.” ([19:34])

Despite medical interventions, the children's health issues persisted, laying the groundwork for the unfolding tragedy.

---

Growing Friction and Signs of Trouble

As the years progressed, Derrick noticed increasing frictions in his relationship with Jessica. The stress of parenting and his unresolved depression exacerbated their conflicts, leading to Jessica's alarming declarations of having leukemia.

“She was a very good liar.” ([34:30])

These fabrications served as a facade for her manipulative intentions, further entangling Derrick in a web of deceit.

---

Jessica's Fake Leukemia and Deception

Jessica's claim of leukemia was a pivotal moment that marked the transition from suspicion to undeniable evidence of abuse. Derrick recounts the shock and confusion he felt upon discovering the truth.

“I was in shock. I was in a fog. I was like… I didn't know this is what it was really going.” ([50:44])

The revelation that Jessica had fabricated her illness shattered Derrick's perception of their relationship and exposed the extent of her manipulation.

---

Confronting the Lies and CPS Involvement

The truth emerged as Jeffrey, Jessica's deception became too blatant to ignore. Derrick describes the painful process of confronting the lies and the subsequent involvement of Child Protective Services (CPS).

“I felt like I was losing my daughter… how could I stick around through all this?” ([36:49])

Jessica's actions led to legal interventions aimed at protecting the children, ultimately forcing Derrick to reassess his involvement and prioritize his children's safety over the fractured marriage.

---

Divorce and Aftermath

Filing for divorce was a tumultuous decision for Derrick, compounded by his own feelings of guilt and responsibility. He reflects on the missed opportunities to safeguard his family earlier and the lasting impact of Jessica's actions.

“I know why I did it. I did it for the kids. I didn't do it for her.” ([38:02])

This admission underscores the complex emotions Derrick grappled with as he navigated the aftermath of betrayal and abuse.

---

Reflections on the Experience

Derrick concludes by sharing his introspections on the ordeal, highlighting the importance of recognizing red flags and seeking support during dark times. His story serves as a poignant reminder of the insidious nature of Munchausen by Proxy abuse and its profound effects on families.

“I look back now, I know why I did it. I did it for the kids. I didn't do it for her.” ([38:02])

Through Derrick's narrative, listeners gain invaluable insights into the psychological manipulation inherent in such abusive relationships and the resilience required to overcome them.

---

Conclusion

In this compelling episode, Andrea Dunlop masterfully guides listeners through the intricate and painful journey of Derrick Jones. The detailed account not only sheds light on the specific case of Jesika Jones but also exemplifies the broader implications of Munchausen by Proxy abuse. By providing a platform for Derrick's voice, the podcast underscores the critical need for awareness, understanding, and support for those affected by such devastating circumstances.

Notable Quotes:

• “I was in a dark place back then, and so I don't think that helped with my judgment very well.” – Derrick Jones ([05:18])

• “She was a very good liar.” – Derrick Jones ([34:30])

• “I was in shock. I was in a fog. I was like… I didn't know this is what it was really going.” – Derrick Jones ([50:44])

---

Additional Information

• Podcast Title: Nobody Should Believe Me
• Host/Author: Andrea Dunlop, True Story Media
• Episode Title: Case Files 07: Jesika Jones Part 2 with Derek Jones
• Release Date: December 5, 2024
• Publisher: St. Martin's Press (for Andrea's new book, The Mother Next Door)

---

This episode is a testament to the resilience of a father confronting unimaginable betrayal and serves as a crucial narrative in understanding the depths of Munchausen by Proxy abuse. Through Derrick's story, Andrea Dunlop continues to unravel the complexities of this dark form of abuse, offering hope and insight to those who have endured similar traumas.

Transcript

[Andrea Dunlop]

True Story Media hello, it's Andrea Dunlop. Welcome back to Nobody Should Believe Me Case Files. This is part two of our miniseries on the Jessica Jones case. Today is the first half of my interview with Derrick Jones, the father of the victims in this case. I so appreciate Derek's candor about his relationship with Jessica and just his willingness to share his story with us. Our new season is coming out on January 2nd and a reminder that if you subscribe on Apple Podcasts or Patreon, you will get the entire season, all eight episodes, on the launch date. And I have to tell you, I think you're gonna wanna binge this one. We are getting these episodes in the can now and my team has just really knocked it out of the park with this season. Subscribing is a great way to support the show and if monetary support is not an option, leaving us a review on Spotify or Apple helps a great deal, as does telling friends about the show on social media or wherever you talk to people. You can watch a video of this episode on our YouTube channel if you like to see faces and on Instagram you can follow me at Andrea Dunlop and the show, which is Nobody should believe me. Pod now here's the interview. Well, friends, it's 2025. It's here. This year is going to be. Well, one thing it won't be is boring. And that's about the only prediction I'm going to make right now. But one piece of news that I am excited to share is that the wait for my new book, the Mother Next Door is almost over. It is coming at you on February 4th from St. Martin's Press. So soon. I I co authored this book with friend and beloved contributor of this show, Detective Mike Weber, about three of the most impactful cases of his career. Even if you are one of the OG est of OG listeners to this show, I promise you are going to learn so many new and shocking details about the three cases we cover. We just go into so much more depth on these stories. And you're also going to learn a ton about Mike's story. Now I know y'all love Detective Mike because he gets his very own fan mail here at Nobody Should Believe Me. And if you've ever wondered, how did Mike become the detective when it came to Munchausen by proxy cases, you are going to learn all about his origin story in this book. And I know we've got many audiobook listeners out there, so I'm very excited to share with you. The audiobook is read by me, Andrea Dunlop, Your humble narrator of this very show. I really loved getting to read this book and I'm so excited to share this with you. If you are able to pre order the book, doing so will really help us out. It will signal to our publisher that there is excitement about the book and it will also give us a shot at that all important bestseller list. And of course, if that's simply not in the budget right now, we get it. Books are not cheap. Library sales are also extremely important for books. So putting in a request at your local library is another way that you can help. So you can pre order the book right now in all formats at the link in our show notes. And if you are in Seattle or Fort Worth, Mike and I are doing live events the week of launch, which you can also find more information about at the link in our show notes. These events will be free to attend, but please do RSVP so that we can plan accordingly. See you out there.

[Derrick Jones]

This episode is brought to you by Amazon. Sometimes the most painful part of getting sick is the getting better part. Waiting on hold for an appointment, sitting in crowded waiting rooms, standing in line at the pharmacy. That's painful. Amazon One Medical and Amazon Pharmacy remove those painful parts of getting better with things like 247 virtual visits and prescriptions delivered to your door. Thanks to Amazon Pharmacy and AmazonOne Medical Healthcare just got less painful.

[Andrea Dunlop]

Derek, thank you so much for being here with us. So we are here today to talk about the Jessica Jones case, which we have also spoken to Detective Mike Weber about. And we just. I am very anxious to talk to you about your story and just your perspective on this. And so, yeah, can you just start by telling us who you are and how you relate to this case?

[Derrick Jones]

All right, so my name is Derrick Jones. I'm the father of the oldest and the youngest victims in the case.

[Andrea Dunlop]

You're also Jessica's ex husband, is that right?

[Derrick Jones]

Well, hopefully soon.

[Andrea Dunlop]

Okay.

[Derrick Jones]

Been trying for a while.

[Andrea Dunlop]

Oh, boy. Okay. So you're in the process of becoming Jessica's ex husband. So how did you and Jessica originally meet?

[Derrick Jones]

We met through Facebook, actually.

[Andrea Dunlop]

So. And when was this?

[Derrick Jones]

I want to say it was towards the end of 2016.

[Andrea Dunlop]

So we're. Or where or whereabouts do you live?

[Derrick Jones]

I live around the Fort Worth area. @ the time, I didn't. I lived over in Archer City, which was a good hour and a half from Fort Worth. Roughly, I think.

[Andrea Dunlop]

Okay. And so you guys are chatting for a couple of months online. And what were your kind of first impressions of her and who she was?

[Derrick Jones]

I Mean, nothing stood out that was, like, alarming or anything like that. You know, I was like, hey, this is. You know, I was enjoying the conversation. It's hard because I look back at it now, and I have a different perception. I. Look, I was in a dark place back then, and so I don't think that helped with my judgment very well. But, I mean, back then, I looked at it as I didn't see anything alarming. And, you know, this nice girl that had her stuff together, and like I said, I was a single guy, so I was like, hey, why not?

[Andrea Dunlop]

And then did she eventually suggest that you meet up in person? And how did that piece of things develop?

[Derrick Jones]

We both were, like, talking back and forth about meeting up in person. And then finally I was able to have a free weekend when she had a free weekend. And so then we finally just made plans to meet up. And I said it was about three months after we started chatting that we finally met up. I came up to Fort Worth.

[Andrea Dunlop]

I completely understand where you're at with all of this, because it's really hard once you have the kind of revelations that you've had about someone to sort of put yourself back in that position where you're trying to remember what it was like when you first met them. And I think, like, one of the things that people sometimes don't understand about what being close to a situation like this does to your brain is that, like, it kind of splits your life in half, Right? Like, I feel like not only do I sometimes have trouble remembering, you know, because I think, you know. You know, I have a sister who's a perpetrator, and that's what brings me to this work. And, you know, not only do I have trouble remembering, like, what she was like before I knew all of this, I have trouble remembering what I was like. I have trouble remembering who I was before all of this happened. Because it feels like, you know, it feels like this. The situation sort of broke my brain, and I just didn't look at the same. Like, I don't look at the world the same way. And so it's sort of like you end up, like, also questioning yourself a lot, right? Like, why did you know. I think I can hear you kind of doing some of that. Like, why would I ever, you know, choose a person like this when reality is, like, a lot of people, you know, are like, if you're a nice person and you're an honest person and you go through life, like, not doing things like this, like, it's not something that you're just on the lookout for. Right.

[Derrick Jones]

A hundred percent. Yeah, it definitely makes you stop. And when everything came out, it made me. And once I got clear headed and understanding of everything and I was like, where was my judgment at? You know, but it also makes you stop and look at it. Like you said, it's like, it's hard to remember how I thought back then. Yeah. Because I'm leaps and bounds ahead of where I was even back then. And so it's, yeah, it's, it's hard to think about it, like to the point of remembering exactly what were your thoughts? Because myself nowadays, I'd have been like, what in the world? Something's off here. But at the same time, going through this has also made me heighten my awareness. Like little things throw, you know, catch. Red flag, red flag, you know, and it's, it's made me harder to trust people. Yeah. Because it makes you, like I said, it makes you question your judgment, but it also, it's like you, you thought you know yourself better than that, but now you're like, now that you've come out on the other side, you're like, before I'd have been just like, oh yeah, no problem, like I believe you. Now I'm like, yeah, yeah. And then I'm gonna, I'm gonna take some time and evaluate it and think about it.

[Andrea Dunlop]

Yeah, yeah. And I mean, I think, you know, one of my big hopes with the show is that for other people who are somewhere earlier along in that process that by hearing it, you know, they may have that moment earlier. And that, that's helpful because it's just, you know, if you've never been through it, if you've never been through anything like it, if you've never heard about it, if you, you know, haven't spent years studying it like I have, then it's like you're not going to, you're not going to see it coming. And I think it's, yeah, it's, that's just, that's just human. So I hope you can also find some, some grace for yourself. But so nonetheless, you guys end up meeting in real life and you start dating and it was a tough moment in your life, which I'm sure also, you know, that's like, I think sometimes people think, oh, this would never happen to me. I would know what was happening. But the reality is that like we all have moments in our life when we're more vulnerable for whatever reason. So it sounds like this was kind of a moment like that for you. Maybe what was going on in your life. You had. I think, do you had kids from a previous marriage also?

[Derrick Jones]

I had one from a previous marriage, and I was just in that place in life where then I didn't know that I was in a depression and everything. And I. I really didn't learn how deep of a depression I was in until actually all this came out. I didn't realize how far I'd had disassociated myself with family and everything else. And so I look back now and, you know, like I said, my judgment wasn't the best, and I could. I will put 100 that it wasn't now that I look back. But, you know, we started. You know, we started dating, we started hanging out, and she would come up and see me, and I would go up there and see her, and it ended up moving really quick. I want to say it was around April of 2017 that she had called me up to let me know that she was pregnant.

[Andrea Dunlop]

So you. You hadn't been dating for very long, and you were still kind of living. Living in two different places, and so you were just sort of in that getting to know each other phase. And then she calls you and tells you she's pregnant?

[Derrick Jones]

Yeah, she calls me and tells me she's pregnant. And I was like, well, you know, I'll be there. I'm not going nowhere. You know, I'll be there for my kid. We keep dating. She calls me one day and she goes, hey, I just got back from the doctor. And he says, there's two of them. And I said, now you're kidding. And she says, no, I'm not. I'm like, no, this is not funny. Like, you know, all joking aside, how did the appointment go? She's like, really? There's. We're having twins. And I was like, wow. You know, and so I ended up making plans and moving up to Fort Worth with her because I wanted to be here through the pregnancy.

[Andrea Dunlop]

And I mean, that must have been so overwhelming. So you're going from being, like, divorced out of one sounds like, to dating a new woman now you've got twins on the way. That's like. That's just a lot to figure out. And what. What do you do for work? Like, was your work based, I assume, where you live, or was it sort of flexible?

[Derrick Jones]

At the time, my work was where I lived, and then I found a job up in Fort Worth. When I moved up here, looking back on it, it should have been an alarm that, hey, she was in transition of houses, so she was staying at her grandmother's house. But she's like, you know, my grandmother said, you can move in here with me. And I said I wasn't in the best mindset. And so I ended up moving in there with her, with her grandmother. And.

[Andrea Dunlop]

And you. You'd said earlier that when you first met her via Facebook and sort of your first impressions of her, that it. You know, she, like, had her stuff together. Like, she. She had her act together. Like, what. What did she. Did what. What was she doing for work? Like, what. What else did you sort of know about her? What kind of came to light as just maybe even in this period while you were dating and she gets pregnant.

[Derrick Jones]

She told me she had been a nurse at Cook's, but then she had told me when I moved in there, she was working at a nursing home. And then right before I moved in, she had been working at a nursing home. Once I moved in, pregnancy was getting hard on her. And she told me that the doctor said, hey, if I don't start taking it easy, they're gonna bed better. What is it?

[Andrea Dunlop]

Bed rest.

[Derrick Jones]

Bed rest for the rest of the pregnancy. And this was way early on, me being a young dumb guy, you know, I didn't know nothing about it, and I fed right into it because I'm like, okay, you know, there's two. I've only been. You know, my first one was just one. And so maybe the twin pregnancy is different. Maybe, you know, it's a lot of stuff.

[Andrea Dunlop]

I mean, sure enough, they are like, they. They are higher. It is a higher risk pregnancy situation. I mean, that. That much is true. Were. Were you going to any appointments with her during this time, or was this all kind of what she was reporting to you?

[Derrick Jones]

This is what she was reporting to me. I went to one or two when they had the ultrasound. I was actually three or four. It was only when they were doing the ultrasound.

[Andrea Dunlop]

Okay.

[Derrick Jones]

The regular doctor's appointments, I usually didn't make to. I was working. Yeah.

[Andrea Dunlop]

I mean, you have about a. You have about a billion of them when you're pregnant. So that's not how you go all the time.

[Derrick Jones]

Well, and I was the only one working since supposedly she had to take it easy. So it was hard to get off work. You know, I just started this job, didn't have a lot of flexibility of asking a lot of time off. And so time goes on. We get. Later on in the pregnancy, she starts having more at risk, you know, in and out of the hospital. And they were gonna, you know, hey, we might have to Keep you just to watch, you know, in case they try to come early. They ended up coming. I want to say it was 37 weeks, so a little bit.

[Andrea Dunlop]

A little bit early, but not too early.

[Derrick Jones]

They were tiny. Tiny, though. One was three. Seven, I want to say. And the other one was four. One.

[Andrea Dunlop]

Oh, wow.

[Derrick Jones]

If I remember my numbers correctly. So they were tiny. They were. At that point, I was like. I was scared to hold them. I'm like, I'm gonna break them just if I move wrong, you know, I made a couple of the first doctor's appointments when we would go see their pediatrician, and everything was fine.

[Andrea Dunlop]

And how were you guys kind of settling in as a couple? Like, did she. Because she had also some other children from a previous marriage. Is that right? Did they live also with her or, like, what was the situation? Did you meet the ex husband? What were kind of the family dynamics that were coming together as you were settling in?

[Derrick Jones]

Yes, they. She had three other ones. They all lived with her. I met the mech. Ex husband, you know, as a. Hey, I'm Derek. Hey. I'm so and so. You know, other than that, never really chatted throughout all this. She had fed me stuff that put me against him and made him, you know, oh, he's like this. And when you're. When you're in that situation, you're gonna support your other half, you know, and no reason not to believe or. I didn't have any proof against it. So that's about the extent with him, you know, we didn't really care for each other. You know, I would meet him to drop the kids off or meet him to pick the kids up, but, you know, the old.

[Andrea Dunlop]

So you kind of just had the impression that that was not a good. That they hadn't had a very good relationship, and they weren't on, like. Sounds like they were on, like, okay terms, but just a generally sort of negative vibe.

[Derrick Jones]

Yes, ma'am. You know, I would go or I would help out and watch the kids when she'd have to take the oldest one to her, you know, neurology appointments and stuff. And I would. I tried to make some of those, but the ones that I would make were few and far between. Like I said, I was still new in my job, and.

[Andrea Dunlop]

Yeah, and you said the older one was going to neurology appointments. What was. What was the health. Did the old oldest child also have health issues?

[Derrick Jones]

Supposedly had epilepsy.

[Andrea Dunlop]

Okay.

[Derrick Jones]

Apparently it supposedly had epilepsy since I was told by her one year old, since she was A year old. Looking back on reports and stuff, it looks like she started reporting it around like three months.

[Andrea Dunlop]

Okay. And. And then the middle two, did they have any health issues, the middle two?

[Derrick Jones]

One had some gastro issues. The other one, no, the oldest one, you know, like I said, I was told she had epilepsy. You know, she'd have. She could have seizures and would. Had had them here and there. She was on, like she was taking. Dude, I want to say at times it looked. I think it was like anywhere from five to seven pills. You know, I can't remember if it was morning and evening or per day. There's quite a few. We had the hill thing set out for each day.

[Andrea Dunlop]

And so it sounds like. So that the eldest lived with y'all full time. And then the two middle ones that were from her ex husband, because they were from different dads. Is that right? And so the two middle ones, they were sharing custody?

[Derrick Jones]

Yes, the two middle ones were sharing custody. The oldest one was with her full time. So as time went on, the girls started getting older and, you know, they had some speech problems and stuff like that. And one was always closer to me, and one was always closer to her.

[Andrea Dunlop]

And are they. Are they both. Both girls or boy, girl or both girls. So it sounds like in the beginning, you know, they're born like a little bit early, but not super scary. They're a little on the small side. Probably have some issues because of that. And then so maybe had like a few developmental delays, but like nothing super serious. Right? In the beginning?

[Derrick Jones]

Yeah, they. They were just, you know, small. We had to put them on the growth formula to help try to gain weight. They weren't really gaining a lot of weight. Still to this day, they are tiny, but their speech was behind and stuff like that. But they had a speech therapist that would come out to the house and help out. That was, I think around two years old, I believe. But other than that, we had. We'd go to the doctor. They still saw the doctors for like, trying to, you know, watching growth plates and trying to gain weight and stuff like that.

[Andrea Dunlop]

So were they having like, failure to thrive issues?

[Derrick Jones]

Kinda, yes.

[Andrea Dunlop]

Okay.

[Derrick Jones]

Not.

[Andrea Dunlop]

Maybe not. Not super. Did they have like feeding tubes or anything like that or just.

[Derrick Jones]

No, no. More.

[Andrea Dunlop]

More mild. Okay.

[Derrick Jones]

Well, I believe they said it, you know, failure to thrive, but it was just no matter what you fed them or how many times you fed them, they just. They didn't. They wouldn't gain weight. I don't know where it went. You know, at least when I was there. They would eat all the time.

[Andrea Dunlop]

And it sounds like you were, you were. So you're working full time. Is she a stay at home mom at this point? Does she go back to work at any point or she's just, she's sounds like she's the primary caretaker.

[Derrick Jones]

She never went back to work. She was a stay at home mom. I was the one working all the time. I want to say when they were around year and a half, two years old, I got another job. So it had been a year and a half roughly because I, In August of 2019, I got a new job, but I started traveling with this job. So, you know, she was at home with them all the time. I'd travel a couple days a week. Sometimes I'd be gone a full week. As far as I knew, you know, everything was going all right. You know, we were, they were doing their speech and everything. The oldest one was, you know, she was up and down. She'd have her good times and she'd have her bad time. She had behavioral depression. Looking back on it now, I see why and I don't blame her. You know, taking medicine that you didn't need and all that, I'm sure played a major role in it.

[Andrea Dunlop]

Our house has two working parents, a six year old, a two and a half year old and zero time. And you know what is my least favorite part of parenting? Trying to get my kids to eat anything other than junk. So I am so glad that I discovered Thrive Market to help me get some decent nutrition into my little snack monsters. Thrive Market makes it so easy to find better options without the hassle. They have this cool feature called the Healthy Swaps scanner in the Thrive Market app where you can scan any item and it will instantly suggest cleaner, healthier alternatives. This is how I discovered their Snackmates sticks, which I got in the chicken and maple flavor. I got these for my kids, but honestly I have been chomping on them too. They are so delicious. I also found out that Thrive Market sells Sahali snacks. These are my husband's favorite thing ever and for some reason we can never find them anywhere. So I felt like a dang hero when I brought him these. Another thing I love is Thrive Market's smart cart feature. When you create your account, Thrive Market asks questions and automatically builds a grocery cart tailored to your needs filled with healthier alternatives to your favorite brands. From there you can adjust, add or remove items before checking out. Easy peasy. Ready for a junk free start to 2025. Head to thrivemarket.com nobody. And get 30% off your first order plus a free $60 gift. That's T H R I V E market.com nobody thrivemarket.com nobody. And remember that shopping our sponsors helps support the show. I genuinely could not be more excited to tell you about our next sponsor because I am obsessed with this brand. I had already done some holiday shopping for other people on Quints because I had heard so much about their iconic Mongolian cashmere sweaters. I got one for my husband and I got a Quint gift card for my daughter's teacher. So I was thrilled when they came on as a sponsor and I got to shop for myself. I picked up one of their cashmere hoodies and one of their beautiful cashmere pullovers. They are my new favorite things. And I also got one of their washable silk tees which I can tell is just going to be a go to for me. I am at a stage in my life where I want my clothing to be simple and classic and I want it to be nice. So basically I don't want to shop anywhere else now. Quint's is all about everyday luxury at an affordable price. They are famous for their Mongolian cashmere sweaters which start under $50. They've got Italian leather handbags, European linen sheet sets and 14 karat gold jewelry. And all Quinn's items are priced 50 to 80% less than similar brands. They are able to do that by partnering directly with top factories and cutting out the cost of the middleman, passing the savings on to you. And Quince only works with factories that use safe, ethical and responsible manufacturing practices so you can feel good about shopping there. I genuinely cannot recommend this brand more. I am going to be out and about on tour this year and friends, you're going to see me in my quints. So treat yourself this winter without the luxury price tag. Go to quints.com believe for 365 day returns plus free shipping on your order. That's Q u I n c e.com believe to get free shipping and 365 day returns. Quince.com believe and remember that shopping our sponsors is a great way to support the show.

[Derrick Jones]

I'd started noticing things, you know, we had started growing apart, man.

[Andrea Dunlop]

Jessica, you and Jessica. Okay.

[Derrick Jones]

But I'm one of those people that I would stick around, you know, I'm going to be there for my kids and I just noticed, I noticed little things that weren't adding up, you know.

[Andrea Dunlop]

And when did you get, when did you and Jessica get married? Did you get Married before the kids.

[Derrick Jones]

Came or before the kids she wanted. She was big on being married before the kids were born. So I found out, I want to say it was April, that she was pregnant and we were married in June.

[Andrea Dunlop]

So that is. That's a quick. That's a quick trajectory all the way around.

[Derrick Jones]

Alex said, I look back and I play a part of not being in the right mindset on that, because nowadays I would have never done that, but I was right along with, hey, I'll do what, you know, I'm on board, I'm all in. And like I said, so down the road, I started noticing some, you know, things, like I said little things not adding up. We weren't getting along as much. And I noticed that she would lay around, I'd come home and clean the house. I'd come home and cook dinner. I was doing the laundry. And it was. The more and more that I was working, the more and more it was frustrating me because it was like, hey, I'm working the leashing to his help out around the house. You know, I don't expect you to do it all. Just, I'm asking for some help. I'm wore out. And so we started, you know, we were. We were stressed out with each other and we started arguing more and more. Around three and a half years old, the youngest one started showing sign. You know, like, it was like she was slowing down. She wasn't. She's. She was never really super vocal. She was always the quiet one, but she just was more and more not herself. And I'm like, maybe she's just having a rough patch. You know, I started noticing things more and more with Jessica, and I'm like, hey, the rougher we got, the more she started almost like backpedaling to try to find things. Like she came up with that she had cancer and like, that she had.

[Andrea Dunlop]

A current cancer diet. So. So things are. Things are getting tough with you guys. And then she tells you that she's been diagnosed with cancer. Okay, what. What, like what type of. I mean, that must have been. That must have been really. Okay. So she says, she. She tells you she has leukemia. I mean, that's. That's very serious. Especially as. As an adult. Actually have had an adult cousin that died of leukemia. So, I mean, that must have been terrifying.

[Derrick Jones]

The crazy thing was, is her mom had actually had cancer. And so looking back on it, it was like, you. You're so messed up because, like, your mom actually had it and you ended up making up this fake thing of having. But at the time, she made it real believable because she. I started noticing more and more bruises on her and it, you know, she'd wake up with two new bruises. And I mean, she was covered in bruises head to toe. And I'm like, something's wrong. And then that's when it came out, you know, hey. She went to the doctor and she had leukemia and.

[Andrea Dunlop]

And this is. Are you still living with her grandmother or had you guys moved out into your own space by then?

[Derrick Jones]

We had, we had our own space. And I was like, you know, I didn't know a lot about leukemia. I'd never known anybody that had it. I knew of leukemia, but I didn't know a lot about it. So I was googling and you know, you get, you can get bruise easy and stuff like that. And so it was, she was playing it all to where it was very believable.

[Andrea Dunlop]

You know, I mean, that's, that's really scary. Like, you have two little kids at home. You're. You're already sort of like super stressed just because it's stressful and you have, you know, other kids that are living part time with you and you're working full time. And so, I mean, did she start treatment? Like what, what happened next?

[Derrick Jones]

She said that they were, had caught it on early and they were trying this new. They wanted to try on this new thing they had for. Is like a pill based thing. And supposedly she was taking those.

[Andrea Dunlop]

Like a, like a drug trial or something like that.

[Derrick Jones]

Yes, before they went to chemo or radiation, they wanted to try this. And it had gotten so bad that at one point I, I think she had like 98 bruises on her. I don't know, looking back, I don't know if she was just. Because at this time we still weren't getting along great a lot of time. Most of the time I was sleeping on the couch and I don't know if she was just hitting herself in the night. I, I really don't know how, how she was making it happen. I.

[Andrea Dunlop]

But it sounds like it was pretty dramatic. Like she.

[Derrick Jones]

Oh, it was awful.

[Andrea Dunlop]

Yeah.

[Derrick Jones]

I was scared to go out in public thinking that somebody thought I beat her or something. You know, like I said, I'm not. When I say head to toe, I mean arms, chest, legs and that, or she was taking something to lower, maybe iron or I don't know, to where she bruised easier because all she, all you had to do is barely. I mean, if somebody walked up and like tapped her to like get her attention, she might bruise There.

[Andrea Dunlop]

Wow.

[Derrick Jones]

And she had never really been like that before. And so I was like. I said it played hand in hand and was real believable. I had no reason not to believe it. You know, at that time, I'm like, why would. You know, I never crossed my mind of why would somebody lie about having cancer, of all things.

[Andrea Dunlop]

Most people. Most people wouldn't, but. So, yeah, it's not something that you're watching out for. Not something that you see coming, for sure.

[Derrick Jones]

So time goes on and the youngest starts, you know, showing more signs and stuff of not being okay. Her health is, you know, lacking some. And I want to say it was right before trying to remember when it came out that she didn't have cancer. I want to say it was right before the youngest actually started going to the hospital really for, you know, seizure like symptoms. And it came out that I finally had people pointed out to me. They're like, hey, you're not looking at this, right? Like, where's her paperwork? You know, where's this? Where's that? And every time.

[Andrea Dunlop]

So some other people sort of who weren't as close to the situation, we're seeing that. Yeah, yeah.

[Derrick Jones]

Yes. And so during a lot of the reverse. For a little bit, she had had me so brainwashed that I'd quit. I quit talking to my fan. My side of the family for. Or at least my mother and stepdad. I quit talking to them for year, year and a half.

[Andrea Dunlop]

Wow. What. What brought that on?

[Derrick Jones]

She. They had some disagreements and I was backing her. You know, I look back and she had me pretty dang brainwashed.

[Andrea Dunlop]

So it sounds like it became kind of a. Like us and them, like, if you're either with me or you're against that, you know, like, that kind of thing. And maybe they had some questions about her and she turned you on them. Basically.

[Derrick Jones]

I look back. Well, I look back and there's. I should have left a law. I should have left a long time ago. There's things I'm not proud of. The biggest thing that caused the rift between her and my parents was they had a. They had let her borrow a handgun one time, and they kept asking for it back and kept asking for it back. And welcome to find out she sold it. So he filed a police report that, you know, it was. And it turned out as a stolen gun simply because she had sold it and it wasn't hers to sell. So I should have left then. But I can't even remember the whole scenario, but somehow this came out. I want to say right before the twins were born or right after somewhere right in that time frame, and somehow she got me to stay.

[Andrea Dunlop]

Well, I mean, we all like to think that we're making these sort of, you know, logical, rational choices where we, like, evaluate the evidence in front of us and act accordingly. Right. But I mean, the emotional reality there is like, you're in this relationship that went from 0 to 100, and you either just. You either have brand new babies in the house or you have twins that are about to arrive. That's not. That's. That's a place where you have a lot to lose if you decide to do that. Right. Like, I mean, there's a lot of reasons why you would want to believe whatever her story was about the gun rather than that she just did something that seems dishonest and shady and questionable. Right?

[Derrick Jones]

Yeah, she was. She was a very good liar. I will say that.

[Andrea Dunlop]

Yeah. And, like, I'm sure even if you don't remember exactly what her story was, I can. I can imagine in my head, I'm sure there was a story of, like, why she had to do it or why it wasn't what it looked like or, you know, some big, long explanation about, like, how she was the victim, actually, because, you know, your stepdad filed that police report, and how could he do that? And, you know, that was so meaningful, mean to her. And like, it's. I can really. I can. I can hear the whole thing.

[Derrick Jones]

It turned out it was, you know, it's either me or them. Like, we. We're not seeing eye to eye. And I had these babies right there, and I'm like. I told my parents, I'm like, it's not what y'all think, you know, And I. I took her side. Exactly what you just said, you know, it's one of those where you look back and you're like, man, if I was somebody else listening to my own story, I'd be like, slapping myself up beside the head, like, what in the world were you thinking, man? You know, but they're so good at manipulating you and lying to you. I look back and I'm like. Because once this all first came out, I'm gonna fast forward for a second. When it's all first came out, it was a real hard on. I took it really hard about the leukemia or once everything came out about what she had done overall, because I was like, I. I felt like I didn't protect my kids, and how could I stick around for through all this? And what kind of dad was I or man was I. And so looking back, yes, it's like through everything. So we'll go back to the leukemia. So she says she has leukemia. And then it comes out. She don't, you know, started asking for paperwork and stuff and she's like, I'm waiting on them to email. And I kept on, and I kept on and I'm like, okay, you know, something's not adding up. And then finally it came out that she didn't.

[Andrea Dunlop]

And did you confront her on this? And what was her expl. What was her explanation for the fake leukemia?

[Derrick Jones]

She said that she was just in a really dark place and we weren't doing good. And she just. Something was off with her, you know, health wise, and she just. It wasn't the right decision. She knows that. But she. She wishes she could change it, but she could. So I ended up. I went and filed for divorce.

[Andrea Dunlop]

What was that.

[Derrick Jones]

From? The director of the Invisible Man.

[Andrea Dunlop]

What's wrong with daddy? He got infected.

[Derrick Jones]

And Blumhouse, producers of the Black Phone. Something's happening too. Can you hear?

[Andrea Dunlop]

Hear me?

[Derrick Jones]

I can't understand you.

[Andrea Dunlop]

Mommy.

[Derrick Jones]

He's changing.

[Andrea Dunlop]

Wait. Daddy, is that you?

[Derrick Jones]

Wolfman attracted by Le Bonnell rated R. Under 17 out of middle without parent.

[Andrea Dunlop]

Only in theaters Friday. Oh, such a clutch off season pickup Dave. I was worried we'd bring back the same team.

[Derrick Jones]

I meant those Blackout motorized shades.

[Andrea Dunlop]

Blinds.com made it crazy affordable to replace our old blinds.

[Derrick Jones]

Hard to install?

[Andrea Dunlop]

No, it's easy.

[Derrick Jones]

I installed these and then got some for my mom.

[Andrea Dunlop]

She talked to a design consultant for free and scheduled a professional measure and.

[Derrick Jones]

Install hall of fame son.

[Andrea Dunlop]

They're the number one online retailer of.

[Derrick Jones]

Custom window coverings in the world.

[Andrea Dunlop]

Blinds.com is the go go to blinds.com for 40% off site wide. Blinds.com rules and restrictions may apply. So that was. That was it for you? Like that? The fake leukemia. You were like, this is not a normal thing to do. This is. Yeah. Like, I mean, that's a. Yeah under. That's an understandable next step. Right?

[Derrick Jones]

Well, that's. That's where I. That's where I really start to judge myself because then I'm trying to. We're still living in the same house at the time. I'm trying to save up money to get my own place. She says she's going to counseling. Shows me this counselor she's going to and everything. You know, she wish she could take it back, but she couldn't. And she was trying to work on herself. And then the. The oldest starts getting, you know, Starts having more seizure stuff and everything, and I just get. I got roped back in. I stuck around. I look back now and I know. I know why I did it. I did it for the kids. I didn't do it for her. I did it for the kids. But I was still in such a shaded place. That and me nowadays, I would have been 100 miles down the road. Oh, I don't care if I had a place to live or not. I would have been living in my vehicle. Like I said when we first met, I was. You know, looking back, I was really depressed. I never got out of that because of everything we had went through.

[Andrea Dunlop]

Yeah. Then you just start piling on like, stressor after stressor after stressor. And, like, it's not like. It's not like she came out the gate with the leukemia lie. Right? It's like there was like, this and this and then and this and this and this. Then the gun, then the.

[Derrick Jones]

You know, we're like, yeah, you know, three and a half years in and four years in, somewhere along those lines, and we're. We're on thin ice. I still have the paperwork turned into the court. I ended up pulling it out, and I tell her, like, hey, you've really got to show me that you're going to change. Like, I don't want to have another set of my, you know, kids growing up in a broken family, but I can't stick around. You do anything like this again, I can promise you I'm hightailing. Like, this is your last saving grace. And deep down inside it, I just doing it for the kids. The love I felt, I. This is me being true and honest now. It's the love, it was already gone. But growing up, always want. I grew up in a broken family, and I was like, I don't, you know, already have one kid with a broken family. I don't want my others. If. If there's any chance that she can turn her life around. You know, people make me. We're all human. We all make mistakes. I know that. But it was like, that was a pretty big mistake, you know? But I'm like, hey, this your final shot. So I went back, and then the youngest starts getting sicker. And November 2021 should be. That's when the youngest went into the hospital the first time. Procedure, like, symptoms, and that's where everything started falling into place of things happening. She started, you know, becoming a kid. Over the next couple months after that that I didn't recognize, it was. That's my daughter but she's completely different now.

[Andrea Dunlop]

How so?

[Derrick Jones]

Sleeping all the time, just less vocal. Just. It's hard to even explain. It's. As a parent, when you see your kid, like, and something's off, you can tell new something was off in it, but it was like. And that's where. By saying like that, like, it was my kid, but it wasn't like it was off. Like, she wasn't her normal self. And it just kept getting further and further from her normal self. And so she was going, you know, she. Back and forth in. To the hospital, in the er.

[Andrea Dunlop]

And did she have. To your knowledge, at this point, did she have, like, a diagnosis or just like, she's having these symptoms and we don't know what's wrong with her?

[Derrick Jones]

She was having these symptoms. They couldn't figure it out, but they wanted her to start. She would send, you know, she'd be like, hey, she's having seizures. I'm gonna take her to er. I need you to come home and stay with the kids. So I'd leave work, come home. And first couple times they didn't know. So they started telling her, like, hey, when you witness these episodes, please record it. So. And send it to us or bring it into her next doctor's appointment so we can view it.

[Andrea Dunlop]

Right? Because part of the problem with things like seizure disorders is they can put them on, you know, the machine you were talking about before with the older child. They can put them on an EEG for observation in case they happen to have a seizure during that time. But it's very. It can be really hard to catch it, so it can be hard to sort of get that information, which is why they ask parents to record so the doctors can look at what the episode actually looks like. Right?

[Derrick Jones]

So they'd done a. I want to say, I can't remember if it was a 24 or 48 hour at the hospital EEG. She told me they caught a few little ones, but it wasn't enough for them to find, you know, go off of anything. And so they, you know, they had moved us over to neurology at Cooks to start seeing them so that, you know, you could. You see the doctor once or twice while you're in the hospital. But they wanted, you know, where they could get on a more personable level. The doctor said, hey, I want you to video if you see anything. So time, you know, month or two goes on. She's getting worse. One day I get a video from her, and she'd send it to my mom, too. Of this episode and growing up, you know, never being fully around somebody that had had seizures other than her older sister. But I'd only witnessed very glimpse of that also of the older one. So when I see it on the video, my assumption is, hey, she's shaking and stuff. I think that's a seizure. I full heartedly, you know, when your daughter's sitting there like this, you know, I'm thinking she's having a seizure. To me, that's what it figured it looked like.

[Andrea Dunlop]

Well, and sure enough, there can be a pretty big range of, of what a seizure looks like, right?

[Derrick Jones]

Yeah, it's not hey, one set standard, you know, they're, you know.

[Andrea Dunlop]

But something in the video, when you saw it, that something was something.

[Derrick Jones]

She was laying on the couch shaking. You know, she was getting to the point where she was having these episodes of peeing on herself more. It was her, like I said, her, her health was declining. And I'm. You get more and more concerned as a parent. You're like, something's got to be done. You know, we need to figure something out. If it's not this, it's got to be something. And week or two after that video, she ends up having more seizures. She's like, hey, I called the emergency number. They want me to take her in when you get home. Because she's had a couple today and she's real lethargic right now. Okay, I'm rushing home. She takes her up there. They end up admitting her for a day or two to Observator. And then I was like, did you show them the videos? And she's like, yeah, they see it. You know, they said those are small ones, but she never had one in there. So they ended up, they're like, hey, we're gonna send her home and do a 72 hour EEG at home where she's more relaxed, more comfortable, where, if you know where they've been happening. So maybe we can catch one there. So here she comes home, she has to keep this backpack on her for three days. Has her, you know, all this stuff on her head all gauzed up. And they'd even went in and done mri I think was it an MRI of her brain? They had to put her to sleep and do to test her while she was asleep. They put her asleep and everything, which that was hard to witness the first time because she started shaking a little bit, you know, when she went to sleep. And so 72 hours they go back in, take it all out or take it all off. Next day they Tell you it's going to take, like, two days to get the full readings of everything for the doctor to look at it. She calls me when they get it. She said they saw a few little ones on there because we had a button. Every time we thought we'd see one, we had to hit it. You know, we're supposed to hit it. And she was supposed to, I believe, log it all. Also every time she thought she saw one in that 72 hours. And supposedly she was doing all that on her phone.

[Andrea Dunlop]

Jessica was supposed to.

[Derrick Jones]

Jessica, yes. Okay.

[Andrea Dunlop]

Yeah.

[Derrick Jones]

So I'm thinking, okay, now they know there's a few. She's like, hey. They said they're gonna call her and they call in this medicine to put her on to start. They want to start on this low dose of the. I can't even remember what it was called. And a week or two later, this whole time, right before she got caught in June of 2022. May, April, May. I'm like, I'm really honor. I'm like, hey, we need to get with these doctors. Like, I'm losing. I. I felt like I was losing my daughter. Like, I felt like this kept on. She was gonna die. Like, that's how much she was declining. Like, she was just. She was pretty much a vegetable at home most of the time. She wanted to sleep all the time and just have an accident. Like, we were going backwards, but she just didn't really talk. And she'd just lay on the couch, you know, and she was just out of it. And I'm like.

[Andrea Dunlop]

And she's like around 4 years old at this point?

[Derrick Jones]

Yeah, she was 4. And so I was like, you know, this is. I'm losing my daughter. Like, they've got to figure I was starting to get mad. I'm like, they had to figure something out. And so she takes her in of June for more seizures and they admit her. She tells me, you know, that they're. They're observing her and they move her up to this room that. Where they could have cameras on or watching her, you know, see how she reacts and stuff like that. They're running tests. I would get calls saying, hey, she's doing better. You know, she's starting to improve. Then I'd get calls saying, hey, she went to, you know, she went to the bathroom and she came back in here. And now it's like been an hour or two and she's starting to go down. And I'm like, so she's up and down. Like, what are they thinking? She's like, they're wanting to run more tests. They just took. Came and took more blood.

[Andrea Dunlop]

And this is. Jessica's reporting this to you from.

[Derrick Jones]

This is. Yes, Jessica's reporting this to me from the hospital because I went up there once because it was hard for me to go with all the kids. Yeah. I wasn't going to take them into that setting. You know, you could only have, like, two people in the room at once. Anyways, she was in there for four days. I get a call from her or a text from her saying, hey, somebody from CPS is about to be calling you or gonna be getting in contact with you. And I was like, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa. What are you talking about? He's like, they'll explain everything. I'm like, what's going on? Like, that's serious. How do I go from my daughter's up and down, you're in here in the hospital with her to now cp? Like, what? I need some background. She said, I gave the youngest one too much medicine. And I'm like, what do you mean you gave her too much medicine? I'm going back and forth with text because she won't answer her phone. So I get a call from CPS, and they're like, hello, Mr. John, is this Mr. Jones? I said, yes, it is. And she's like, has Jessica reached out to you? I said, she texted me saying somebody from CPS was going to be reaching out to me. And, you know, I'm trying to figure out what she just said. She gave her too much medicine. She said she's been giving her medicine when she didn't need it, and she's been overdosing her on it. She's been making her have these symptoms, and I'm, like, froze, and I'm like, whoa. Like, it just caught me off guard. Like, what do you mean, like? And come to find out, you know, she was giving her Benadryl. That's all I knew of at that moment. And she's like, she's gonna be removed. I need you to come. You're gonna need to come up here to the hospital to stay with her, the youngest, so that, you know, she's not, you know, or she'll be here by herself. You know, we'll have, you know, somebody from cps, like, no, I'll find. I'll get somebody to come sit with other kids, and I'll be up there.

[Andrea Dunlop]

I mean, what's. What's, like, going through your mind with this information? Because this is. It sounds like they're pretty, like, at Least the piece of sort of like the. The connection is. Is fairly clear, right? They're like, she's been giving. She's been over medicating her.

[Derrick Jones]

I was in.

[Andrea Dunlop]

Were you just shock and like, you not even processing yet. You're just in, like, in it. Like, just in sort of crisis mode?

[Derrick Jones]

Yes, I was in shock. I was in a fog. I was like. It was like the one thing you never think you're gonna get hit. You know, up until this point, this whole disease, I had never heard. The only thing I'd ever heard about it was, you know, the gypsy rose. And I'd only seen a little bit of that. I'll tell you now. Most people don't know much about it at all, if anything. And so I was at. I was one of those people, and I'm like, I didn't know this is what it was really go, you know, Link going that way. But. So Jessica didn't have a vehicle with her, so I had to go pick her up. She couldn't be around the other kids either, so she had to go to a hotel room. Her uncle got her in a hotel room. I went and picked her up from Cooks and took her over there. The whole way over there, I'm like, I'm. I'm like, questioner. I'm like, what. What do you. What. What is. Like, why. So at this point when all this happened, we were living with her aunt because we had to be supervised. Really? She had to be supervised because one time when I was out of town for work, we'd been living with her aunt about a year. Not even quite a year. Eight, Seven. Eight months I was out of town. I get a call from her saying, hey, I had to run to Dollar General. They were. We were at the grandmother's house at the time. She said, hey, I had to run down the road to Dollar General. And while I was gone, the youngest got a hold of some of my grandmother's Ambien, and so we're rushing her to the ER to get her stomach pump. Well, because of that, the hospital has to report. So CPS is like, hey, since you left her with your grandmother and your grandmother isn't in the best of health, you're not making good judgment. You either we're going to take the kids, or you can go stay with somebody that we approve that will supervise you.

[Andrea Dunlop]

So they say it was like. It was like a nucle, like a neglectful supervision type of finding. Okay, so that had happened like a year previous to this?

[Derrick Jones]

Yes, maybe a few Months. Less than a year, but somewhere around in there. Okay, so we went and stayed. We moved into the aunt's house so we could be supervised for. I can't remember how long. It had to be for six months to a year or something like that. So now fast forward on the ride to that hotel. I'm like, why? And she's like, I've been telling you. Like, I just need. We need to. I need to get out of there. I can't stand my aunt. Like, she's on me. And I was depressed, and this is the only way I knew how to act out and get people's attention. And it got me out of the house, taking her here. And I'm like, that's. That is no reason at all. Like, that's no excuse. So instead you want to harm your kid to get everybody to get away. Like, okay, say you need to get away. I will watch the kids go. But, you know, that's all I ever got then.

[Andrea Dunlop]

Just trying to sort of justify the behavior, which is completely unjustifiable. Right?

[Derrick Jones]

Yeah. Yeah, it was. It was my fault because I didn't get us out of there six or eight months. We had to do it. So we had our time, had, you know, been out for a month or two. I was trying to find a place, but we hadn't found one yet. And so I'm like, you're not putting this on me. You're. You're not. You're not putting this on me. Like, never in a million years could I do this. Never in a million years did I think you would do this. Like, who would harm their kid?

[Andrea Dunlop]

Right. And not, like. Not in any universe. A normal, like, stress response. Right. To start harming your child so you can get out of the house.

[Derrick Jones]

I've been stressed before, but I can say, yeah, I never in a million years would go to, like, thinking about harming my kids. So I go up, get to the hospital, and I'm sitting there, and she's doing a lot better. My youngest is doing a lot better. She wants to go to the playroom. We go the playroom, we play. The nurses say she's doing a lot better. So the way they found out was they were doing blood tests, and it. They did one, it came back with Benadryl in the system, and it came back. They did a second just to verify, and there was still Benadryl. If it was, like, one, you know, had given her some before she came in, it would have been out of system for the second one. So that's how they knew. So they started watching video. And every time she would take her to the bathroom, she would carry her purse with her. So every time they would come out of the bathroom, 30 minutes to an hour later is when she'd start declining. So my. I get her, you know, so I'm there that night. Next day, the next afternoon, we get to leave. I get her home. And from that point on, she just. She kept getting better and kept getting better. Wasn't on any medicine. It was a few days later, two days. I had to go up there and meet with. I had to take them all up to cooks. The three girls, I had to take them, the oldest and the two youngest, up to cooks to meet with. It's this doctor they have in there. And she. She's checking them out, making sure, you know, like, how they're doing.

[Andrea Dunlop]

Oh, like the child abuse pediatrician.

[Derrick Jones]

Yeah. Doctor.

[Andrea Dunlop]

Dr. Kaufman.

[Derrick Jones]

Kaufman, yes. So go in there. She's talking to them, she's checking them out, and she pulls me to the side. We go talk, and she's like. Starts telling me these things that the video that she had sent me and my mother, she never showed the hospital when she said she did. The actual EEGs didn't show anything. Come to find out, the oldest one, they had never really saw much of anything on any of her tests. So for. At this time, she was 12. So for 11 years, she's had epilepsy that she didn't have.

[Andrea Dunlop]

Nobody should believe me. Case Files is produced and hosted by me, Andrea Dunlop. Our editor is Greta Stromquist, and our senior producer is Mariah Gossett. Administrative support from Nola Carmouche.