← Nonprofit Leadership Podcast
Nonprofit Leadership Podcast
Where Fundraising and Strategic Planning Meet
00:43:15
Mandy Pearce Marie Palacios In this episode, Rob Harter is joined by nonprofit experts Mandy Pearce and Marie Palacios from Funding for Good to explore how strategic planning and fundraising go hand in hand.
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- [00:02]
A
This is Dr. Rob Harder with the Nonprofit Leadership Podcast, Making youg World Better. What does it take to be an effective nonprofit leader today? What are the biggest challenges? What are the biggest obstacles? How should nonprofits fundraise in an economy that is constantly changing? All these reasons combined led me to start this show and it's my hope that through this series people can learn not only what it takes to be an effective nonprofit organization, but to hear from effective leaders who are who are successfully making a positive impact in their communities. We hope you enjoy the show as together we hear how they are making their world better. Well, welcome to the Nonprofit Leadership Podcast. My name is Rob Harder, your host. Thanks so much for tuning in and being part of this community. You know, I'm really excited to continue this four week series focused on all things fundraising. I'm really hoping this special four week series will help launch you into the year end giving season with a renewed sense of clarity and excitement. Now, I realize we just moved into the month of September and we're one month away from officially being in the fourth quarter, but if you're anything like the fundraisers I'm speaking to on a regular basis, this is go time. In fact, my guests today on the show believe the best time to start planning your year end giving is no later than August. My guests on today's show are two very experienced social impact leaders who lead funding for good. This dynamic duo is Mandy Pearce and Marie Palacios. Today we're going to cover a lot of ground with Mandy and Marie. We're going to talk about from strategic planning and why strategic planning is the most important tool in your fundraising toolkit. We'll also talk about how you can inspire your board to be all in when it comes to their engagement with fundraising for your nonprofit. There's a lot of important topics that we cover today and they both have a wealth of experience. They are full time coaches and consultants for the social impact sector and you'll pick up right away why they're so effective in what they do. Well, as always, thanks so much for tuning in.
- [01:55]
B
Thanks for watching.
- [01:56]
A
Now on to the show. If you run a nonprofit, here's some good news with ze, you keep every cent of every online donation. No platform fees, no credit card fees ever. My clients have used it. It's quick to set up, super clean to use and it just works. Check it out@ze.com register and make sure every dollar goes where it's needed. Most. Well, welcome to the Nonprofit Leadership Podcast. I'm so excited to have Mandy And Marie, two expert consultants and coaches in the nonprofit sector. Thanks so much, you two, for being on the show today.
- [02:33]
B
Thanks for having us.
- [02:34]
A
Absolutely. Okay, so this is going to be a fun podcast because we have a lot to cover. We're going to cover everything from fundraising to board development and leadership development. And they both have extensive experience in both areas. I'm going to start with you, Mandy, maybe just start our conversation. Of course. We're in a series right now where we're really emphasizing the beginning of year end season. We're about a month away from that fourth quarter of the calendar year, but people already have it on their mind. The fundraisers, I'm talking to, the executive directors, I'm talking to have that year end fundraising mindset already on and they're ready to go. So let's talk about some things, all things of fundraising. Let's talk about consensus driven strategic planning process as well, when it comes to fundraising success, because you do this a lot. You come alongside nonprofit leaders, you coach them. In what way does a consensus driven strategic planning process really strengthen an organization's fundraising success? What have you found?
- [03:28]
B
So, as a previous development director, for my whole career, it was always the most successful when I had a strategic plan that the board and the staff had agreed upon because there wasn't a conversation of, we want to do this, we want to do this. And then where do you focus your time and energy on fundraising? And additionally, when you have a plan in place, then you have the ability to say, oh, this is what we're agreeing on as two groups coming together. And we're saying, this is the direction we want to go in. What are the things we need to do to accomplish the goals we've set in place? What dollars do we need? What dollars do we have? What dollars do we need to raise? What are the best ways to raise those individual dollars? And it really helps for the planning process when you can say, this is where we are and where we're going. And it is in writing, greet upon, voted by the board. And. And it's not something that you're just flying by the seat of your pants every day being like, maybe we should do this, and perhaps we could do that. And that seems like a great idea, which is what happens in a lot of organizations.
- [04:31]
A
So it kind of gives those guardrails. Sounds like.
- [04:33]
C
Yeah, I was going to say, at the end of the day, the board approves the budget. So if a strategic plan is created by staff only and presented for board approval, there's often a lack of Context, it might get pushed through. But every time you go and ask for those dollars in the budget, there might be pushback and resistance. So if there was conversation leading up to that, it's already informed the budget, the dollars are already allocated. There's a lot less resistance in the budgeting and fundraising process now.
- [04:57]
A
Very good to know. Okay, so let's talk about the strategic plan again. Why should a strategic plan be considered the single most important resource, according to your recommendation, in a nonprofit's fundraising toolkit? Let me give a little context. Like, oftentimes, we think strategic planning, this is on the leadership side of things. Fundraising is over here, Leadership's over here. We demarcate those two. But you're saying that the strategic plan really should be the single most important resource when it comes to the nonprofit fundraising toolkit. So how do you integrate those two? Mandy?
- [05:25]
B
It is because in order to know what you're fundraising for, you have to know what are you trying to accomplish. In order to know what you're trying to accomplish, you have to have a plan in place. And that plan for nonprofits, business plan, strategic plan, whatever you want to call it, is that tool. So if you know where you're going and you can say, these are the things we need to raise money for, within that, then when you talk to a donor, whether it's a foundation, a family, a corporation, doesn't really matter. You have a document that says, hey, so this is where we are today, and this is where we're trying to get. These are the next steps, and this is how you can help us get there. Right? You can't do that if you're just, again, flying by the seat of your pants and saying, right now we need to raise money for this, or a crisis fundraising, or we're just trying to keep the doors open or, you know, this comes up a lot. I'm sure, Rob, you've heard it since you do fundraising coaching, too. You'll have a client. Let's just take direct mail, for example. You'll have a client that says, what should we put in our direct mail for this year or the end of year appeal? And I'm like, well, that shouldn't be the question. The question should be, what are we raising dollars for this year, and what do we still have to bring in? Unless you have a theme for the year, which some people do, and then you follow that theme throughout the whole year. But you shouldn't just be, like, doing fundraising events and engaging in certain fundraising activities, because you think you're supposed to you should know what you're raising dollars for, why you need them, how they're going to impact the community that you serve, which is really hard to do if you don't have a plan in place and you don't know what your goals are. So for me, as a fundraiser, it was always really clear and easy to say, this aligns with what we're trying to do. This hasn't been secured yet. This is how you donor can help us with that, and this is the impact you're going to create when you do.
- [07:00]
A
Well said, Marie. Do you want to add anything to that?
- [07:02]
C
We have to remember that donors are investors. They're just not looking for return on investment in dollars. They're looking for return on investment and meaningful impact. If you walk into the bank for your small business and ask for a loan, the first thing they're going to say is, what do you need and how much? Where's your plan? They're going to look at your current capacity and then they're going to look at your credit score to see if you're a viable option. And in the nonprofit sector, our donors are investors. They want to see the plan. They're going to look at our current capacity. And our ability to say we exceeded last year's goals is like a positive increase in your, what I call your credibility score. So you have a credit score in the for profit world and you have that credibility score in the nonprofit world. And when we can report impact through the lens in the context of a strategic plan, we're able to say we exceeded our goals, we met our goals, it's increasing that credibility score. So at the end of the day, donors want to fund our impact, not our existence. And a strategic plan is the best way to show them how to intend to do that.
- [07:55]
A
Donors are investors. You're absolutely right. And sometimes we just forget that. And you're right. They're not looking for monetary return per se, but they're looking for social impact return. You know, life's changed return. And so love that perspective. Okay, let's continue to play this down a little bit in terms of that strategic plan. What specific operational or fundraising plans typically emerge from a well crafted strategic plan? Maybe Marie, you can answer that first, then Mandy.
- [08:17]
C
Mandy typically does all the budgeting on that end. I start on the high end, but we look at the strategic plan and say, you've got business as usual. So this is the reason we encourage people to plan their cycles, their, their planning process in a way that informs their operating budget. So if your Fiscal year is January to December. We want to see. And you approve your budget not to October of the year before. Then we would encourage you to have the plan in place by August. September. So it informs your next year's fiscal budget. And then you're looking at business as usual budget. You're looking at capacity building budget, and those two together become the operating budget. So that's how we start out on the front end. And then once our clients move into the operational side of it. I've worked as an executive director, but Mandy's entire background was development director. Then she kind of takes over and says, okay, let's flesh this out in the budgetary piece. And Mandy, do you want to share more on that? Yep.
- [09:06]
B
So once we have the budget that aligns with the strategic plan, we take that budget and say, now, out of this budget, what do we need to raise through development? Because some of that might come in through program revenue. It might come in if you're like a Habitat for Humanity with house sales, that's not necessarily the development department. Some of that's going to come in through earned income. If you have an endowment or some investments. Again, that's not the development department. So we have to look at that and say, which pieces do we need to fundraise for? And that becomes what you use for your fundraising plan. Right. Because you don't need to know how all the money's coming in. You need to know the fundraise from the fundraising plan. Then we can say, how are we bringing dollars in? Maybe we're doing giving Tuesday direct mail and a major event. Well, those are three very different types of donors. So then we create our donor cultivation plan, and we say, hey, what are all the donors? How are we going to segment them? What are our donor touches for the year? And then we can talk about a marketing plan. Once we know who the donors are we need to get in front of, we can put the marketing together. Say, how do we get in front of them? And how do we get them to take action on with the whatever call to actions we have for all those various fundraising streams. So again, if we start with high level strategic plan work down to the budget, then those other plans become much easier to put together and realistic. Sometimes people just randomly come up with numbers and you're like, how did you come up with that? You want me to increase the fundraising budget by 25%? I'm like, where does that come from? Exactly. And so it's just a lot easier to have that conversation when it's grounded in reality?
- [10:35]
A
Well, Mindy, you've had, again, extensive experience as a development director. And throughout your career, what was one of the most common or significant fundraising challenges that you kept encountering? And now as a consultant, do you see that challenge differently? Perhaps?
- [10:48]
B
I think the biggest challenge that I have seen in any organization doing any type of fundraising is a lack of a prioritized needs list. And again, this is going to come from your budget, right? Whether you have a strategic plan or not, you need to have a budget. And I know some organizations don't, but let's start there and say you do. What are your prioritized needs? And when we say prioritize needs list, I'm just going to use number three as an example because it's easy. What are your top three needs that you need funding for this year? And then how much do you already have? How much do you need to secure and by when? And then let's put those in order. Like, this is what we need first. This is what we need second. This is what we need third. We already have our timeline, so we know we need these dollars by August, these dollars by October, these dollars by December, whatever. Then you can really, as a fundraiser, sit down and say, how can I bring these dollars in by this time? Are there grants I can write? Are there fundraising events? Are there specific campaigns, whether it's direct mail or Giving Tuesday or whatever that would align with this particular request? Are there individual donors I already know in our database who would have a passion for this thing? Like, it just becomes so much easier to fundraise effectively when you do that, as opposed to just being like, hey, we need money for this, and, hey, can you go out and get money for that? And, ooh, this thing just came up. That is not a great way to fundraise. It's stressful and it's very ineffective. So for me, I see that still today as a consultant. All the time, I talk to people and they're like, I don't know what we should ask for.
- [12:11]
C
I'm like, that's a problem.
- [12:14]
A
That's why they hired you, right?
- [12:16]
B
They're like, we just need Gen Ops. And I'm like, oh, let's have a deeper conversation about that. That's what I see. What about you? What do you see? Because you've been doing fundraising for a while.
- [12:25]
A
Yeah, that's what. You're exactly right. I think there's. Sometimes there is that kind of, okay, let's throw the dart and then draw the circle around the dart in terms of what's our goal in terms of fundraising. I think the second thing is there's so many great tools out there. I've had a lot of conversations, as I mentioned before, we hit record with AI tools and sometimes people get so caught up in the latest tools or technology, they forget. To me, the bread and butter of fundraising is relationships. It's connecting with your donors, connecting with your people. And so having those personal contacts, you just can't replace that. Now there's of course a lot of things you can do with technology, a lot of things you can do to improve your efficiency on things. But when it comes to that face to face, particularly your major donors, but even just your regular donors, having that contact, connecting with them, picking up the phone, writing handwritten notes, like some of those old fashioned things now we call it, those go a long way in today's world. And in fact, I've had many conversations on the show about staying high touch even in the midst of our high tech world. In fact, maybe sometimes the high touch is even more important now with our high tech world. So that's what I found is that just sometimes focused on the wrong things, thinking that you'll actually get ahead when really it's those main things of that relational connection, really treating people not just as investors, but just as people to get to know and really understand who they are and what they're driven to give to and why they're excited about your particular nonprofit. So those are just a few things I've seen.
- [13:43]
B
I agree with all of that.
- [13:44]
C
We call it the spray and pray approach. When people just spray something out through strategic planning, you can have a little bit more strategic approach.
- [13:54]
A
Yeah. Okay, so now this podcast is actually running this fun series of four weeks, really preparing people for this fourth quarter, year end, calendar, year end, you know, push for fundraising, you know, year end giving, essentially, because that's oftentimes for most nonprofits, that's where going to get a lot of your money that comes in. So for you two, what have you found is the ideal time for nonprofits to really begin preparing for its year end or Q4 fundraising strategy?
- [14:21]
B
I'm going to answer that from a drill development director perspective. And Marie, if you have a different answer from an EDP perspective and a program perspective, because you were a program director too. For me, I say I'm a planner. Anybody that knows me or has worked with me knows I'm like the uber planner. Like we're already planning.
- [14:36]
A
Okay, that's good.
- [14:37]
B
September 2026, like you know, we're way out There I start my planning process at the beginning of the year, but I start my implementation of that plan in August. So I'm working on handwritten thank you notes to the board. I'm working on the direct mail appeals that are going to happen in the fall because most of my clients have two. And so we're getting all the prep ready, sending it to the printers, getting all that stuff ready in August, September, so we don't have to do it during the holidays. We're sending out Thanksgiving cards, Christmas cards for whatever your organization is doing in the fall. Many organizations have fall events. So again, we're planning all that stuff in the summer. So I start to know what do I have to do, and then I actually start implementing it in August.
- [15:22]
A
That's great. I love that. Marie, what would you add to it?
- [15:26]
C
And I come from the grassroots nonprofit where I served as executive director, development director, outreach, all the things. So I had to wear lots of hats. I found myself in a position that I was working with the board of directors a lot to do fundraising events and that things would creep up on us and we would be in the middle of something, putting out a fire, and then it's like, oh, next month is the golf tournament or the 5K or this thing. And one thing that we found really effective is creating what we call our executive kind of outreach and fundraising calendar. And for every month, I would say, what's the report? What is a conversation topic, and what's an action item? So if the action item was we are facilitating or we are hosting our signature event for the end of the year at this date, if it's the end of the year, mailing campaign by, when do we need it? We worked backwards. When do we need to have the marketing approved, when do we need to have the sponsorship? Because otherwise we're the printer saying we need the marketing materials. And we're still working on securing sponsorship. So for us, having just a little calendar and forcing our team to work backwards helped us kind of get ready for that end of the year. So we had to start that in January as well if we wanted to be on track. A lot of people don't start thinking about the end of the year until June, July, August, and there's not a lot of time to course correct or get the other things in place if, if we wait that long.
- [16:39]
A
I love both of yours. Focus on planning ahead. I find that's another. Going back to a question you asked earlier about fundraising. Well, it's hard, right? Like you said, Marie, most executive directors wear Lots of hats. And it is difficult to just stop long enough to say, okay, what do I need to start doing now, three months from now to impact three months from now? That's difficult because there's so many fires you're fighting, there's so much on your plate today, it's hard to look forward. But I think that's how people get ahead of the game and they actually start really becoming successful in creating more of a sufficient and long term sustainable plan for their organizations is planning ahead. So I love your focus on that and I thought this a good segue in terms of you mentioned about, you know, writing notes to the board, engaging with the board, then let's shift a little bit and talk about some board development issues. Because that's something that comes up all the time with people that I'm working with. I'm leading a mastermind group right now and that comes up almost every session. And so I know this is a lot of experience, particularly you have had Marie, but both of you have had this. So what role should the board play in shaping and guiding the strategic planning process? People, let's start with that.
- [17:40]
C
It's really on the board to spearhead the process. There's a difference between spearheading and creating and owning all the content. So we say if, if the executive director is wearing lots hats, they're managing the day to day. They shouldn't also be thinking, wait a second, it's time to do xyz. The board should be coming and saying, okay, we need to be setting direction. It's one of our core functions. It's one of our fiduciary roles. Let's talk about this with the executive director and they should be bringing that up. An executive or a board meeting with the executive director. So spearheading, making sure it stays on the calendar, that's on the board. And then we would say the board should definitely be involved in the scan, the organizational scan. It's very hard to make decisions if you're not involved in those internal organizational scans, at least at a cursory level. We're not saying you have to roll up your sleeves and get into the minutiae of every day, but being a part of those questions, and I like to tell our organizations that we address four fundamental questions in strategic planning and the board shouldn't be involved in all of them. And one is, where are we now? You can do that at an internal operating level, you can do it at a community level or external level. Where do we want to be at certain points in the future. And the very first of those conversations is long term future is core identity, vision and mission. And that is absolutely on the board's plate. It needs to be board and maybe one or two executive staff. And that's the first part of the strategic planning process. Because all the plan needs to fall within the context of approved vision and mission. So we say you want to review it and either reaffirm or review and revise or overhaul it before you start strategic planning that's on the board. What might block us identifying those really deeply rooted blocks in the community. The board needs to be aware of those things because they're in a governing function. And then finally, how do we achieve the goals of this plan? The board and staff come alongside each other for those things. So four questions and the first two the board really needs to be a part of and then some of the more implementation operational stuff, the staff can lead that.
- [19:30]
A
Those four questions, you know, leadership development. This is an important piece that often is the outgrowth of really good strategic planning. So maybe that would be another good question for you when it comes to coming up with this strategic planning process, both within the board and the staff level, how does it interrelate and how does it improve leadership development from what you've seen?
- [19:50]
C
I like to say that running an organization without a strategic plan is like running a three legged race without a finish line. Many of us remember that game. Just imagine standing in the middle of a baseball field. And I found myself in this position in elementary school and you're tied together with someone and you're told to run. And I remember being tied together with my brother's best friend and he was tall and lanky and his motto was, we're going to take off running to home base and we're going to go as fast as we can. And I always ended up eating dust. My brother, who was on the same age as the friend but just a little bit wiser, said if I slow down and you speed up just a little bit, we can get to our pace. But he would always look at me and say, do you see the finish line? What's our pace? He would set the pace and we were able to move through and we became quite the champions in the three legged race.
- [20:35]
A
And that's impressive.
- [20:37]
C
I know. It's the one accomplishment in life I'm really proud of.
- [20:41]
A
I love it.
- [20:42]
C
It's like running an organization without a plan is like doing that. The staff is looking at first base or second. The board is looking at a finish line. We all are on the same field, but we're looking in different directions, as we should be, because board is tasked with oversight, board with staff, with operation. So when you know this is the plan, these are the major milestones, and these are where the things we need in place. We can all be working in unison. We're traveling at the same speed for the destination, towards the destination. It allows us to select leaders who can play to those strengths or help us overcome those weaknesses. So if we know that our strategic plan includes a capital campaign or construction project in the next three to five years and we're filling board seats, I would be interested in having someone that could at least be a part of the conversation, be a sounding board for construction, maybe a general contractor, a realtor. So I think knowing what the goals are and being able to say, what are the skill sets at the governance level that will help us accomplish this goal informs onboarding processes. It will also inform who you need in the executive director or other staff positions, because you'll have to assess, do we have the skill sets? Do we have the positions in place to accomplish this plan? So it is fundamental for accomplishing leadership development goals.
- [21:53]
A
Excellent. Mandy, would you add anything to that?
- [21:55]
B
Just everything she said is 100% accurate. I think also knowing what your goals are helps you, if you have leadership skills, to be able to say, do we need to recruit someone for the board that has this skill set, or do we need an ad hoc committee? Do we need a working committee? Do we need a separate capital campaign committee and not take a board seat with that type of thing? Or do we need both? And again, that comes with lots of experience and lots of knowledge on how you can and should run your boards and other leadership groups for your organization.
- [22:29]
A
We'll be right back. If you run a nonprofit, you know how fast fees can eat into donations. Well, with Zephy, you keep every penny. No platform fees, no credit card fees. Donors can choose to tip Zefy, but your organization pays zero. You can set up a live form in just a few minutes. It's super easy. If you need donation forms, event ticketing, or donor management all in one place without the costs, go to zefy.com register and give it a try. Well, leadership transition, it happens in all nonprofits. Eventually, the executive director will move on, or key people in the C suite, so to speak. We'll move on, talk about the importance of the board of directors when it comes to those transitions. What can they do to to ensure there's smooth transitions there and, you know, how much should they take over so to speak, when there's a transition again, maybe Marie, you could start with that one.
- [23:25]
C
So we come in at two different angles. Mandy does a lot of executive search, and I've served in the executive director role. So we kind of, we work together really well on this topic. Most board members, when they tend to be either micromanaging or rubber stamping one of the two, and we want to find Goldilocks somewhere right in the middle that they understand the role of their ed, they're checking in, they're doing those performance reviews. Because if any point there is a leadership transition, they're where the buck stops. When it comes to the ed, most of the staff can pull together and cover other things, but we like to tell board members they need to be prepared for four potential situations. Most of the time, the board's focused on a friendly expected turnover. They're like, our executive director is going to tell us when they're going to move on, and that is the best case scenario. Friendly expected. Then there's friendly unexpected. There was an accident, someone's becoming a caregiver, they're moving away, and they love the organization. They just can't continue to serve. So friendly unexpected happened quickly. But what boards are not typically prepared for is the hostile expected or the hostile unexpected situation. And those are two other types of transition. So when we are looking at organizations, before conversations of transition ever take place, we want to work, have secession plans that account for all four scenarios. Friendly, expected, unexpected, hostile expected, hostile unexpected. With the hopes that you'll never have to go into the hostile realm. But often, unfortunately, organizations find themselves there and the board finds that they're carrying a load they never anticipated carrying and that they didn't sign up for. So Mandy leads executive searches. I'll let her share a little bit more about what she's looking for and kind of the process she engages the board in to make sure that that new. That position is filled with quality candidate.
- [25:03]
B
Yeah. So executive search work is something that some boards are super well prepared for and are happy to handle in house, and they should. And it's also a process that is vital to the ongoing success and sustainability of your organization. So if there is an internal evaluation and it's discovered that, yeah, I don't think we have the skills we need for this, please outsource it to someone that you feel like you can partner with to do that process, because this is a major role in your organization's next steps. And if you just hire somebody to fill a seat much like a board member, then there's going to be a lot more work in the future and you're probably going to have to do that process over again. So yeah, I always like to have a conversation about all the different aspects that a board can participate in in the hiring process. And I like for them to be involved with that when they're comfortable with it. But it can be a process that I tell people, plan for three months, if it's sooner, outstanding. And that does happen sometimes it can take longer. You can hire someone and they can leave in the first week again, had that happen before too. So, you know, work with someone and create a process that your organization is comfortable with. But know that the ultimate goal there is long term sustainability, longevity in the position. Like you said, retention. Most people don't have retention plans. How are you going to keep these people once you hire them? Right. And no one's having that conversation. Succession planning is becoming a little bit more of a conversation and we do a lot of that with people. But hardly anybody asks or brings up retention planning ever.
- [26:29]
C
It's strange because we don't see nonprofit boards really saying we'd love to have a former executive director on the board and that would be an incredibly important position. So that, you know, Mandy doesn't work with the entire board for a search process. There is a committee because sometimes there's too many hands in the kitchen. But having that committee, having someone to understand someone, the role and as liaison is so important. We can avoid a lot of communication issues in that way now.
- [26:54]
A
Well said. I agree with all those things. And yeah, having no retention plan is a problem and I think that continues to be a problem. Particularly in the last couple of years I've noticed that just retention is an issue that really is plaguing a lot of non profits. So this is really good when it comes to then the training of board members. What have been some of the more effective ways that you found for practical ways to equip and empower boards not just with how they can just be good board members, but specifically, specifically with strategic planning so they can really have confidence and really engage properly when it comes to that process of leading as a board member.
- [27:27]
C
When Funding for Good began kind of streamlining our strategic planning process, we were fascinated by those statistics that you can double your chances of success, you can grow 30% faster. But I was really intrigued by the one that said 70% of written plans fail and started looking at why are those plans failing. And sometimes it's because the right people aren't in the room. It's all board's been charged to do it or staff and they're not coming together. Sometimes the plan's too broad or too narrow, but the majority is. There's a lack of accountability and implementation processes in place. That's why we've added in components to our plans, our planning process with clients, to safeguard them. So when you wrap up a process with us, we have everyone together and we say, not only do you know where you're going to be in three to one years, we break out their first year into quarters and say, these are the accomplishments that you have committed to in the first year, broken into quarters. And then we give them a 90 day implementation plan. That 90 day implementation plan forces them to say, how are we going to get from point A to point Z? Who's involved? Were their timelines? Are there third party partners? What's the budget? And it forces them to think through all the steps. Because typically people will volunteer with good intentions and not realize, I can't do it on that date because the printer is unavailable, therefore I'm out of town for the next three weeks and everything goes on hold. So we like to provide them with a little calendar in the one page calendar of the year. And then we highlight, we assign the task to individuals, at least two people so that there's always someone to pass the ball to. If you have to drop it for any reason, you can pass it, not drop it. And then we also identify with the board, priority 1, 2, 3. We let them know you can drop some balls, they're rubber, they'll bounce to the next quarter, they'll bounce to the next year. But there are glass balls, safety, security, compliance that we can't drop. So we go ahead and prioritize before it becomes an emergency. We say, these are priority one, these are glass balls, priority two, priority three. So going through a prioritization process, going through an assignment process, and then we check in each quarter and we do a simple red light, green light, green light, it's completed, yellow light, it's in progress, maybe completed on time, a little late. And red is at risk or requires further discussion. And keeping that in front of the board regularly allows them to say, this is what we're doing. And having their name on something helps with the accountability as well. Because no one wants to be in a board meeting and saying how are you doing with this? And them having no right. So we reduce the bystander effect and schedule regular. That little sheet stays in front of every board meeting. But a regular quarterly review and then an annual, like, annual retreat at the end of the year to review everything and map out the next year is always in order.
- [29:57]
A
You know, when it comes to leadership development, we often think about staff leadership development. Typically, board leadership development is part of the process, too, and it's actually just as important. How have you incorporated that into how you train boards, how you equip boards to really incorporate intentionally leadership development, again, not just for the staff, but for the board as well.
- [30:15]
B
I mean, we have a lot of things that people ask us, you know, when you're working with an organization that has a founder still involved, there's a what's the founder's role in the nonprofit they create? And that's a conversation we have with folks a lot. And sometimes it's educating the board on this is what this process should look like as you grow. This is their role, These are their options. This is how they can continue to participate. Sometimes it's how to transition from working to a govern or govern. Yeah, working to a governing board. People really have this baby when they first get started and they're doing everything from checking the mail to answering the phone. And then as they get staff, it's kind of like, how do we let go? What should we do? What should we not do? And people don't necessarily understand that role. And then from there you get even more like, where does the board roll in and the staff role begin? Right. People are like, oh, we have staff now. Like, they may or may not know how to do that. So, I mean, there are variety of topics depending on the stage of development of the organization. And we work with people on training in all of those stages. All the way up till now, we have committees and we have an executive committee. And, you know, like, what are all the different roles? How do we do executive sessions? What are. So, I mean, at every level of development, there is a ton to cover. And Marie does a majority of our board development work. I do mostly the effective fundraising with your board. So I'll let Marie take the next step, stab at that.
- [31:39]
C
So I'm working with a group right now to onboard their new leaders. And one of the first things that we were able to do is take the strategic plan and walk through bullet points. So if they said they wanted to see robust something something programs underneath, they had success indicators. What does that look like for them to them? We were able to ask board members, you know, this is what the people in the room at the day of planning said robust leadership looks like or diverse robust leadership looks like to them. What does it mean to you? And capturing their thoughts. So we like to make sure that new board members can add their, their stamp on that plan. Even though it's approved. We're saying, we've already approved that. We want to see this type of leadership. What does that mean to you? And going through each part of the plan and saying, okay, we've identified these blocks to success. Did we miss something? And allowing. Because it is really a work in progress. And then when we get down to the goals, we say, these are the three year goals, these are the milestones. Does this seem practical? Where could you see yourself plugging in? And we let people really identify where they see themselves bringing the most skill set. Because most. A lot of boards I work with have cookie cutter responsibilities. And they say all board members must. And it's just insane that we still continue to kind of perpetrate that reality when we should be saying, here's the goal. Who can help us get closer to this one? How can you help? Use your skill sets, your connections, your circle of influence. So we use the strategic plan and say, this is what we're trying to accomplish. Tell us what you can do. I'll give an example. I was working with the board and they said, we want everyone to sell 10 table tickets for our annual dinner. And I asked, what's the goal? Is it friend raising or fundraising? They said, does it matter? I said, yes, because if it's fundraising, we want to get 10 new people and we want them sitting there. If it's fundraising, if you get the money, it doesn't matter if they're sitting there. That's one less chicken dinner to serve.
- [33:15]
B
Right?
- [33:16]
A
Right, exactly.
- [33:17]
C
Everyone, tickets. And I said, what if I can get you 5,000 in business sponsors versus the thousand dollars worth of dinner tickets, which you're not going to get? The four, they're 100 tickets each. You're going to lose half of that to the meal. No, you must sell the tickets. But if I can bring you five times more than what you're asking for and cultivate new business sponsorships that you can continue to grow, why would you turn that down? And that's the conversation we have with strategic planning about. It's not just strategic planning, it's strategic doing and looking at it and saying, not everyone's going to be involved in every single one of these goals. We're going to use you where you're best equipped and use your time in a way that's respectful for the organization and for yourself. And I think that people want to Be involved in meaningful ways and if they're using their skill sets, that's the best way to do it. So we like to use the strategic plan as the primary thing of saying, where do you want to plug in? And then immediately you have space to put their name in on the plan and identify where they're going to be supporting the most.
- [34:12]
A
I'm going to keep hearing you say this and this is, I think it's really good. The strategic plan is kind of your true north. You just keep orientating all the activity and all the hard work towards this true north of the strategic plan, both from the board and the staff perspective. Now let's go back to accountability. You mentioned that before and I think that really is important. How do you build in accountability and ensuring both the board and the staff are all moving towards the goal and actually seeing goal achievement? What do you do and what have you found successful in that?
- [34:39]
C
The most simple thing is assign a plan monitor. And we always have a plan monitor from the board and the staff. Now a lot of people say, well, it's the board chair. That may be a great one, but we typically look at the board and say, who's that person that is detail oriented? They're going to drive you a little bonkers filling up your inbox saying, where are you with on this? So I was working with an organization recently and the, the, the director or the chair was an attorney and he said, I'm not the one that does this detail stuff, but this was a school administrator over here and she was fantastic. You know, we met each quarter, we said, how are things going? We mapped out the 90 day implementation plans. We worked backwards and she was able to keep the board on track. And what we reminded the board is the board is responsible for managing the board. So if your executive director is having to come in, manage the board, they're abdicating their own roles with staff to do that. So at the end of the day, the board is signed up to be on the board and you have hired an executive director to manage the staff. So we have to assign a plan monitor and then it might fall under the executive committee's purview to say, are we falling short on our particular portion of this plan? Because we typically define we color code and have board stuff in one color and staff in the other. And when all the staff tough is turning green and all the board stuff is hanging out in the yellow red zone, it's a really clear visual of who's abdicating their role. And it's the simplest way I've found to let people go, okay, staff is knocking this out of the ballpark or the board is doing a fantastic job. And that quick visual without having long reports, it takes five seconds to update in a way that people can grasp we're on track or not. So plan, monitor for sure. And then tasking in the executive committee or I have one group that has a core strategic planning committee. They're a very large group and they've tasked some of their best strategic thinkers and doers for tracking the plan.
- [36:22]
A
Love the color coded idea. That's like, say it's a nice visual and having them monitor, it's a brilliant idea. I think it's excellent. I really like that. Okay, maybe one last question. When it comes to combining board development, board responsibility and fundraising, talk to the executive director and the executive team that has a board that has a huge heart for the mission, but just is not willing or is just not moved forward and actually helping with fundraising. What would you speak to somebody who's kind of feeling stuck where their board is just not moving forward and helping them with fundraising?
- [36:54]
B
I think the most important part of the board's role in fundraising initially is making a gift. Making a gift at a leadership level that is impactful for you. Right? Leadership levels are going to be defined differently by every organization. And something impactful for you is obviously personal. But as a development director, if I didn't have 100% board giving, it was really hard to go out and fundraise. So the way I always did that was start at the beginning of the next fiscal year. So probably, let's say your fiscal year is January. I'm starting this process in November at a board meeting. And I would get up and at every seat, every. So I was, I did a lot of corporate things like the YMCA and corporate office stuff. So we'd have the corporate board, everybody would have their pledge card in front of them at this meeting, the board meeting, and they would give me 10 minutes at the beginning and I would go through all the exciting things we're going to fundraise for this year, all the things the board has agreed upon and wants to do, all the capital campaigns and the renovations and increasing the giving in the annual campaign to help more kids go to summer camp, you know, get them really good and inspired there at the beginning and be like, how many people are excited for that to happen this year, for us to reach our goals? And of course everybody in the room raises their hand and I'm like, great. In order for me to do that, I need to have 100% board giving, because foundations and individual donors want to know that our board, who's our governing body, have made a gift first. So your pledge card's in front of you. I need everybody to go ahead and fill your pledge card out for the year. And if you don't have time to do it today, I'm happy to come by your office and pick that up. And they learned very early I was the one that was going to do that. And so my entire time at the corporate office at the Y, for example, I always had 100% board giving, because without it, the things they said they wanted to accomplish weren't possible. And I made that very clear at the beginning of every year. So that's the very first step. There's way more involved with opening doors, thanking donors, participating in campaigns as a chair. I mean, there's just tons and tons of ways. So we do moves. Management people have probably heard, like, who moved my cheese? That kind of like, how are you going to move up in whatever it is you're doing in your business? Cora is the same. How are you going to move people up from doing the bare minimum, showing up for meeting and making a gift to the very end of the spectrum of this person leads our capital campaigns, makes a gift, open stores, calls and says thank you hands, write thank you notes, all the different things, right? And so there's that whole process of. There's a lot of ways to engage in fundraising, and I like to say development work, because some people are scared of the word fundraising. So thanking a donor is development work. Handwriting a thank you note is development work. And if you're participating in that, you're participating in the fundraising process. So helping people feel like they're participating, even if it's something they're scared of, helps open that door a little bit to get them a little more comfortable over the years.
- [39:43]
C
Yeah.
- [39:44]
A
Nice. What would you add, Marie?
- [39:45]
C
Expectations. Expectations. Expectations. The bait we use is the fish, where it determines the fish we're going to catch. And while Mandy's talking about she's got her board there, I'm looking at before those people are already sitting on the board. We teach a training called building an A list Board. And I, I share a quick story where I was in middle school and we had this girl come in who played basketball, North Carolina free throw champion here. And her dad came in and said, I want to start a club so my daughter can play. And they said, who wants to be in this club? And my sisters and I signed up and we flitted around the basketball court the first week and he kind of let us play. And then the next week he shows up with uniforms and he says, congratulations, you're on a team. And now you don't get to flit around the court. You're doing gut busters and suicides and just miserable activities. And I remember saying, coach, we didn't sign up for this. We didn't sign up for this. And he said, girls, you know what, you're right, you didn't. But I saw a lot of potential out here and I believe in this team. And if you want to stay in the innermure of the club, we're going to find a place for you because you've committed to engage and you want to engage. But for those of you who want to step up, I'm going to require more, but we're going to accomplish more. So I chose the team and we went out on the court that next week and lost 113 to 3. True story. Oh, wow. And I carry that into nonprofit development and say, we always go to board members and say, you just have to. All you have to. So we're recruiting intramural board members and then we get upset when they won't step up and fundraise. So if we're going to expect our board members to engage in strategic planning, to fundraise, then it needs to be part of the job description. Saying, every third year we're going through a master level planning. During the, in between years, there's a full day retreat. These are the things you're committing to, you're coming to practice, you're doing these things. And when those expectations are clear, you can recruit people who understand them. And then you can come in and say, now we said you were going to support fundraising and we give them the roles that Mandy just mentioned. Maybe it's writing thank yous, maybe it's opening doors because everyone has a different position on a team. You know, at a hulking 5 foot 3, I'm never playing center. I'm a shooting guard. So you wouldn't want to put me in a, in a center position. So we don't want to put all our board members in positions they're ill equipped for. And if we, if we lay out those expectations to say all board members are responsible for, get or give or participating in the annual thing, how do you see yourself helping us accomplish those goals again and getting it in writing saying, I understand my commitment. And then we have that monitor that's checking in, then that's a great way to make sure that the board is equipped. And then there's always training opportunities, fun challenges, and things that you can do to to inspire the board along the way.
- [42:14]
A
Well, Manny and Maria, this has been such a fun conversation. You've provided so many great insights and ideas for my listeners. Thank you. And thanks for all you're doing in this sector to really improve leadership, improve board development, and particularly when it comes to fundraising. That's such an important thing, particularly now as we ramp up for the fourth quarter. So thanks again for taking time to be on the show.
- [42:31]
C
Thank you.
- [42:33]
A
Hey, friends. Well, I wanted you to know that this podcast can be found on itunes, Spotify, Amazon, Google Podcast, and wherever you listen to other podcasts. I also want to encourage you to, like, subscribe and share this podcast with others. This will actually help us get this great content out to more nonprofit leaders just like you. You can also join the nonprofit leadership podcast community, find other resources and interviews of past guests, all on my website, nonprofit leadershippodcast.org well, thanks again for listening and until next time. Next time, keep making your world better.