← Nonprofit Nation with Julia Campbell
Nonprofit Nation with Julia Campbell
From Vacant Spaces to Vibrant Places with Kathleen Guillaume-Delemar
00:34:18
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- [00:00]
A
In a world hungry for change, nonprofit impact matters more than ever. Yet you're asked to constantly do more with less. What if you could do more with more? That's the promise of Bloomerang, the giving platform built for purpose fundraising, CRM and volunteer insights are integrated to reveal opportunity and generosity so you can make more connections with more funds raised for even more impact. Now that's more like it. Learn how you can do more with more@bloomerang.com that's B L O O M E R A N G.com now on to the episode.
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B
Hello and welcome to Nonprofit Nation. I'm your host, Julia Campbell, and I'm going to sit down with nonprofit industry experts, fundraisers, marketers, and everyone in between to get real and discuss what it takes to build that movement that you've been dreaming of. I created the Nonprofit Nation podcast to share practical wisdom and strategies to help you confidently find your voice, definitively grow your audience, and effectively build your movement. If you're a nonprofit newbie or an experienced professional who's looking to get more visibility, reach more people, and create even more impact, then you're in the right place. Let's get started.
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C
Hi everyone. This is Nonprofit Nation with your host, Julia Campbell. Happy, so happy to be here with you today. Today we're going to talk to Kathleen Jeanette Guillaume Delamar. Lovely name. President and CEO of the center for Community Progress. And with more than 20 years of leadership in community development and philanthropy, Cat is driving bold equity centered solutions to end and prevent property vacancy nationwide. I'm so excited today to welcome Kathleen to the webinar.
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A
Welcome, Kat.
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D
Hi, Julian. Thank you for having me.
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C
Yeah, I'm really excited. So let's talk about sort of maybe how you got started. You know, your career has really taken you from grassroots leadership in your own community to national influence. As president and CEO of the center for Community Progress, sort of. Can you take us on this journey and share some experiences that shaped you most along the way?
- [02:39]
D
Absolutely. So I will try my best in the interest of time to just focus on my actual presence. Because whenever I try to tell the story of how I got here, I always reference my mother. I grew up in a single parent household with my mother, my older brother, and my mother's insignificant other. And I consider him an insignificant other because he was a crack cocaine addict and he terrorized our home. He terrorized me especially. And I was a victim of all types of violence as far as physical and sexual and emotional, verbal, et cetera. And this is in the 80s 90s. And so in addition to that, I am also first generation Haitian American. So it's important for me to actually start there because growing up at that time and experiencing what I had been experiencing at home and living in an impoverished disinvested community, I saw firsthand how it felt to be unseen, to be not just black, but dark person of complexion, to be a female, to be an immigrant, but not just an immigrant and an immigrant from Haiti, and to also be poor. So I was in this community where a lot of people looked like me. They were also from the Caribbean or from brown communities. And so I saw the disinvestment not just in the neighborhood, but also at home and how I was treated by my significant other. At the same time, I also saw. It's like a dichotomy of sorts, because my mother went from being a scholar to being on welfare. And while she was on welfare, one thing that was not something that she was willing to negotiate was our education and our self worth as Haitian people or as Haitian descendants. And so my grassroots really started from what my mother saw, from her grandmother and mother before her, where she was like, you're always gonna have to speak up and speak out. So I literally would speak out, would go and protest with my mother, with, you know, see my mother protest. And then I too would follow suit. And this is in Brooklyn, New York. And later on, when I decided to go to college, I wanted to make sure that I brought the experiences that I saw where people were disenfranchised and needed support. And I brought in my own personal experience, my lived experience with it. So I wanted to make sure that wherever I went in life, I would advocate for the communities that I came from or the experiences that I went through that I didn't have to. So from there I left New York, went to D.C. i interned. While in college, I interned at the Equal Rights center, which later became the National Fair Housing Alliance. Because I always, in my mind, I always said, if my mother had supportive mechanisms attached to housing, or if she had dignified affordable housing, would she have kept us around her insignificant other out of desperation? So in turn, I always wanted to make sure that whatever I did, I saw what could help the little cats of the world, the, you know, my mothers of the world. And so I started looking at discrimination and housing. And that was like my entree into the community development space. In addition to protesting, I was protesting even things that didn't.
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C
I love a protest.
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D
Oh yeah. You know, the running joke was just even though we, we grew up poor. It was like, we need to raise, we need to make sure we have bail money set aside for Kat because she's going to get arrested. I mean, I would, I'm not Muslim, but I would protest for the Muslim rights. I'm not part of the LGBTQIA community, but I'll go protest because I just, you know, morally wanted to make sure that people always felt seen. And so fast forward, I later went into the full affordable housing space where I worked for a wonderful nonprofit in Washington D.C. called Jubilee Housing. I was a longtime director there, focusing on affordable housing with wrapped around services attached to it. Then I went deeper into the space by looking at homelessness because my mother had experienced homelessness before arriving in New York with, with me. And I wanted to see how did people get here? Like, what are these systems that keep making these things happen? And then from there I then wanted to go deeper into looking at what are the tools that can alleviate a lot of the things that are plaguing communities. Because when I grew up in Brooklyn, in New York, there were vacant lots, you know, surrounding my, my community. And I landed at Community Progress. But while even landing at Community Progress, I had gained the respect from my local community at the time, which is the D.C. metro area, to my, I would say regional community. Because I was then chosen to be a commissioner for the Housing Authority in my city in Prince George's County, Maryland. And then I was uplifted to serving as a commissioner on the Prince George's County Affordable Housing Commission. And then as if I wasn't crazy enough, while I was at Community Progress looking at the tools, the amazing tools for grassroots leaders to policymakers, I decided to just be bored, I guess, and throw my name in the ring to run for office.
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C
And yes, I saw that.
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D
Crazy enough, I won, you know, like, I love that.
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C
Congrats. That's the, the Glen Arden City Council.
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D
Yes. And I made history there. And still I became the very first Afro Caribbean, Afro Latina, Haitian American to ever.
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C
Amazing.
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D
So I know you love this quote because I have it too. And this is both of us here. So I, I smiling as I say this, but well behaved women don't make history, right?
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C
Yes, that's my poster. Absolutely. I mean, I'm on the school board here, so I know about running for a local office and how just hard it can.
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D
Yeah.
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C
And draining and difficult. But it's so important. And I am like you, I believe in addressing systems. And I think we're not really going to get anywhere. There's so much need for, you know, first responders and for emergency aid. But addressing systems of oppression, I think is incredibly important to do. That brings me to the center for Community Progress. So I had never heard of the center for Community Progress until I was approached, but the only national nonprofit dedicated to working with policymakers, local leaders and community members to take a comprehensive approach to addressing vacant properties, one that uncovers and disrupts unjust systems and creates opportunities for people to thrive. How do you accomplish this mission?
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A
How.
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C
How do you tell people about this mission and explain this mission in a way that people can understand? I think people listening will understand, but I'm sure a lot of people don't get it right.
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D
And I would say that especially under my leadership, it's very important to be human centered. So I make sure when I reach out to people, because sometimes, especially with the field or the subfield, subsection of the field that we're in, people probably think, well, this is not my issue, it's not my problem, you know, because it sounds very nuanced. But by bringing a human centered approach to it, you start seeing more people paying attention. So for me, for example, if, you know, I'm putting my fund development, national partnerships, AKA relationship broker hat on, right, I would always try to paint the picture before I speak about the issue. That's always my entree. So I would say, who, regardless of where you are in life, who would like to live in a neighborhood that is completely disinfected? Who would like to live, imagine a neighborhood where right next door to you is three or four vacant lots where the drug dealers and drug addicts are hanging out, or where there's nothing but trash or there's nothing but violence. Who, you know, with a show of hands, who would like that and who thinks that people are deserving of that, regardless of where they are in life, whether it's you or anybody else who, you know, so now you're bringing them in from an emotional perspective, right? And so when I speak about the issue, I always make sure that I say what it is. Like the way you eloquently stated who we are. But then I go deeper into saying, so what that means is I work to tackle unjust policies and systems that exist or existed way before all of us were here to make sure that neighborhoods and communities around this country are not plagued by. And that that's when I start painting the picture by systemic disinvestment, systemic vacancy, poverty. And so I do that by working with. And that's when I go into the different folks and then I say, why is that? Because on every single level, the human voice matters, and the human voice is what truly influences the path that we are to take to undo this unjustice. So that's where I kind of go to make it seem more relatable as opposed to technical.
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A
Oh, I love that.
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C
And because I think that many nonprofits really struggle telling complex stories in a way that inspires, you know, funders and donors. So you're framing the issue of vacant properties like something that maybe people are thinking, oh, this doesn't affect me. Or this is like, I don't even know what this means. So what kind of stories do you tell, and how do you do your storytelling at this organization? That's something that I always love to talk about, is storytelling.
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D
I will say, Julia, that for me, one of the greatest things that I have been able to do is twofold. One is I work with amazing people who come from different walks of life, but who are equally committed to working the mission, and they have their own stories as to why. So that's one aspect, because we. I recently came back from Montana with a colleague of. Of mine. We were chosen for a leadership conference and a leadership program. Excuse me. And to hear her story and her connection is vastly different from my story and my connection, but it was still very much relatable to different folks. And that's important because you always want to make sure who your audience is and to see who should best be the person to speak to said audience versus it always being cat, for example. So that's one. Number two, which is very personal, is my lived experience alone is what I use. I'm very unapologetic about my story. I started off, for example, by saying that I grew up in Brooklyn, New York, in the neighborhood called Flatbush. And I grew up in a disinvested neighborhood. But what I didn't share was when my mother's insignificant other wasn't terrorizing our home, he was outside hanging out in the vacant lots with the neighborhood drug addicts and drug dealers. And so here it is. I'm being terrorized at home. I'm being terrorized outside when I have to go to school or just go around the corner to get anything from the store. And that's what I just saw. I just saw no escape. And no child should be witness to that. No adult should be a witness to that. No community should be a witness to that. So when I spoke earlier about how I felt, you know, what I experienced as a person who was poor or was black because I Saw that we were over policed, but not treated with dignity. It's not like they chase the drug dealers or addicts away, but the neighborhood, meaning my neighbors, they stood up.
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A
Yeah.
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D
And they chased it away. So it's important for me when I speak about the issue, I bring a story in for me, I bring my personal story in. And I don't just bring it in as far as here's the issue, but I also bring up the outcome as far as possibilities are concerned, because the possibility is limitless. Why? Because I too witnessed that. I witnessed my neighbors taking control of the vacant lot, chasing the drug addicts and the drug dealers out of the neighborhood, cleaning those vacant lots, turning one of them into a park, you know, that is vibrant right now, turning the other vacant lot, working with a community developer to turn it into a dignified affordable housing space. So these two vacant lots that symbolize trauma are now thriving, are leaving a positive legacy for others. So it's important to show that story and to make sure that you attach different people to the story when you're sharing it to the public.
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C
And language is so important. And I know that you've talked about moving away from using words like blight, you know, maybe, or towards certain other words, certain other phrases, toward more like human centered narratives. Like what messaging strategies have worked for you in terms of shifting perceptions of the issue.
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D
Thank you, Julia, again for this question. Because if the listeners were able to see me, they could see that I was like, ugh, when I hear that word light, I usually always try to not just say why. I don't just say, I don't like that word. I also give an explanation as to why.
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C
Yes.
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D
And what it's rooted in. It's rooted in racist ideology. It's, you know, if we look at the word belight, it's a disease from plants. And when we started using it for communities, it started being attached to urban renewal, which was the removal of black and brown people bodies to actually change into something else for wealth or for just displacement. And so also attached to that is there's a connotation that the blacker and browner a neighborhood received. It infected the community, you know, like that plant. So we try not to use that word. So now it's attack, you know, so now they say, oh, it, you know, it's because it's black and brown that there's blight. It's, you know, like they brought the blight as opposed to know the systems that are in place that actually create black and brown people to be Impoverished are what's causing blight, you know, so it's, it's. So that's why I don't use that word. But I've, I tend to use systemic vacancy. It's important for me to use the word systemic because I don't want us to lose sight of the systems that were put in place that created the vacant situation in the first place. So I tend to really use that a lot or I even just give a descriptor. We see a lot of boarded up houses. Like I'll actually paint the picture as opposed to just saying blight.
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C
Right. That doesn't. It's not descriptive. Not descriptive at all. So Community Progress works with so many different groups like funders and policymakers and local practitioners for the fundraisers for the nonprofit leaders. Listening. What lessons can they take from your experiences about sort of building and sustaining cross sector partnerships?
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D
Sure, now it's getting fun here. My mantra has been for decades, relationships that lead to results. It's about relationships that lead to results. That's a cat ism. Okay. So we have to make sure that when we are doing the work that we do, we are not siloed. We have to make sure that we see all the pieces of the puzzle and how they can come together. So what I would always do is I look at the role that philanthropy plays from a public and private sector. I look at the role that people play and I look at the role that policy plays. Now when you're trying to enact change, it would be disingenuous to believe that only one sector can change the system. So what we need to do is make sure that all parties are brought to the table in a way where they all see where they need each other versus they just can do it alone. And once they get that aha moment, like, wait a minute, the grassroots slash community leader, they can see that they can protest all day long like I would. And I'm, you know, I'm raising and I'm spotlighting the attention, the awareness. But the nonprofit leader is the one that could also get the funding. The funding from who? Philanthropy, in order to support the grassroots leaders. And guess what? While they're protesting, they also need the policymakers. The policymakers need to enact, need to actually enact change by legislation, by listening to the people and the practitioners and everything in between. And so for me, it's very important for myself and others in the space to make sure that they know their audience. So the way I go to speak to community leaders, I show them exactly what I just said right now to you, right now. When I go to corporations or philanthropy, I know for them, they're interested in their brand, they're interested on the return of, you know, return on the, on their investment. So if I'm pro, if I'm speaking about systemic vacancy, I'm not. And let's just say it's to a bank, bank X, Y and Z. I know that here's this community in Mississippi that is a bank desert. And it's a bank desert because systemic vacancy is right there. Right. I am going to, number one, work with the community leaders, work with legislators to try to bring what's needed in regards to what the community wants, which is they want investment, they want banks. And I'm going to go to the bank, AKA corporation, philanthropy, to say there's a need for you in this community versus my going to same argument going to New York, for example, in Brooklyn, where there's no need for a bank. So my argument would have to be different. Am I really going to go to a bank and try to get the same thing that I'm trying to do in Mississippi? So again, it's knowing your community and what you're pitching, but also making sure that you create relationships with each of these different sectors and show them that they cannot be in a silo by themselves. They have to actually be in partnership with each other. Because if you really want a result to take place, you have to have that relationship that would lead to the result.
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C
Yes, no, I totally believe that as well. I think it's the organizations that are creating these collaborations and partnerships and working with others and not operating in silos that are really going to succeed. So how do you convince or how do you approach potential funders or partners who don't immediately recognize the connection between like systemic vacancy and housing? They don't see it as sort of part of their mission. They don't see it as something that is tied to other things that they might be funding.
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D
This is the real story here where I'm realistic. There's a difference between idealistic and realistic. I'm realistic and I know that those who don't see the connection, it's going to take a little bit more time than those who already see the connection. And I stress this again, it kind of goes back to what I said. I make sure that time is spent after you identify said funder or potential funder because you have to go through the identification stage of trying to see, okay, there's this group and now let me go deep, let me Start doing my research to see if they can really support our work. Not just because they have the money, but because I see a connection there, even if they don't see it. So after I've done my research and my due diligence, this is where I actually start cultivating, and this is where I actually start making the relationship again. I don't go straight from here. Let me go ahead and apply and hope that you are going to support my organization. No, I actually try to broker a relationship. I legally, emphasis on legally, stalk organizations and individuals. I see who's on their board, I see who they are, I find out where they're going to be. Especially. It was easier pre Covid because I could go. You know, a lot of things were done outside networking and. Yeah, right. Whereas now I'm just going into virtual rooms and following up. You know, I loved your presentation. I. And I purposely call out, like, I especially liked the way you framed X, Y, and Z, because my organization works in this space right here, and there is a connection to X, Y, and Z. And I would love to just have some time to speak with you now. What ends up happening is that they end up seeing me as an individual reaching out to them as an individual. I'm not soliciting them as yet. I'm just trying to cultivate that relationship. After, you know, we get that time in, that's when we start having conversations and you start. And I go in not trying to make the case off of what I know. I go in trying to make the case off of what I believe they will try to tell me is not right. Mission aligned.
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C
Okay. Like, coming in with the obstacles already addressed.
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D
Actually coming in with, you know, people tend to come in on the defense. I come in on the offense. So I've already done my work. I've already, you know, I already know, like, what they're about. I already see who they funded. And so the other thing is, I would typically look at who they funded, and then when I speak to them, I could also make that alignment where I'm like, okay, I see you support this, this. And that's so great, because we too, believe that. And so I'm making that connection to who they've also funded, you know, in a different arena. And I. What I have seen and this has happened. This happened in 2020 where there was a real big funder who didn't see the connection between what we did and what they were focusing on in public health. I was able to show them by showing how, you know, some people Want to see statistics and the human element. And so I said, let's look at the statistics. If you want to talk about data, I can give you the numerical and I could give you the real life human data. And this is, you know, you see asbestos, you see, you know, due to poor coding and things like that. And so this funder eventually started.
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C
It's a public health issue. Absolutely.
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D
Exactly. They started to see the connection. And from seeing the connection, they supported us. Multi year gift three, I believe it was three years to 750. And then after that, the next year when the cycle was over, they gave us a two year, 1.5 million. Then they gave us another grant for 250. Then they gave us another grant For a million five. You know, so. And this is off of no connection at first, but brokering that relationship.
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A
Yep.
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C
Wow, that's amazing. That's so inspiring. I think that's really helpful because people, all of these issues are so intertwined. I just don't see any issue that a nonprofit's working on as completely 100% separate from anything else. So you talk about mentorship.
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A
Mentorship is central to your work, which.
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C
I think is wonderful. So for nonprofit professionals just starting out or those hoping to grow into a leadership role like you have, what guidance.
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A
Do you have for them?
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D
The guidance that I would have for the guidance that I had for them, I would say pre January 2025 was much more different than, oh, yes, right now.
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C
Yep. This moment. Yeah. What guidance do you have for us in this moment? I should say this lovely moment we're in.
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D
It is not criminal to look at the community around you and to want to raise awareness and dollars to be part of the change. It is not criminal to take sacrificial salaries because the end result will always be you trying to be on the good side of history, the right side of history. It is also one of the most trying careers to be in when you're in the community development, economic development, nonprofit space, because people just automatically look at the very first part of the word, which is nonprofit, and you automatically attach yourself to, oh my goodness, there's no money in it. But in the nonprofit space there, the rewards are much greater. And so for me, regardless of the places where I've mentored, whether it's at Community Progress or when I was an elected official or even the other places before, it's important for me to, to make sure that whatever the issue, whatever the mission is, that you actually breathe that issue yourself. You go and you see it and you hear if you're not one of those folks with the lived experience, you actually go and engage with the people who are actually being impacted. Because you, believe it or not, because you're on the ground, you are going to be able to lift their voices in spaces that they're unable to be at. So when I'm mentoring, I'm showcasing that to my mentees, that they have the power. They have a special gift and a special power to actually go into spaces and into rooms where they can actually represent and open doors for people who are being impacted by systemic, unjust.
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A
Absolutely.
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C
What gives you hope right now?
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D
I am a compassionate revolutionary. I am undeniably a thorn to society's side. So what gives me hope is when people are choosing to fight the good fight, when people are choosing to speak, spotlight real issues that are not sensationalized news. What gives me hope is my being able to see so many people attend conferences because they know what the conference is about. In regards to what nonprofits have to do to raise funding for their work and to see that people are still attending because they are still committed to the fight. That means I'm not alone. Because working in a nonprofit space, it can be a very lonely place because you know that you have to find funding. You know that you, especially right now, you are being attacked on the federal level unlike any other. What gives me hope is the fact that I am surrounded by people who, day in and day out, when I am not even looking for it, are dreamers like I was, who dreamed of living in a community where they were seen, where their voice mattered, where change actually is going to come. And being able to go around the country. Every place that I go, there's a tour that's being done to a disinvested community that was underestimated. And I have to give credit to Daquan Oliver, who did that term, where underserved communities are really underestimated.
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A
Communities underestimated. Okay, I like it.
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D
And so seeing the issue, but then seeing the folks who are underestimated tackle that issue in a city where now you see a vibrant rain garden, you see a vibrant school, you see a vibrant park, you see a vibrant housing development that was once a sign of severe disinvestment, that's what gives me hope. Knowing that we're still fighting the good fight.
- [32:25]
C
Yes, I know. I'm still every day trying to fight the good fight. So, Kat, where can people learn more about your organization, the work you do, and connect with you? Online?
- [32:38]
A
Yes.
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D
So they can find me online at. Or they can find us online at www.communityprogress. that's one word. Community progress.org and for me, you can always email me. I get a lot of emails@k guillaume that's k g u I L L A u m e community progress.org thanks.
- [33:05]
C
So much for being here and I'm just so excited to see what the organization does next. I'm so excited to see what's next for you.
- [33:13]
D
Oh, thank you for all that you do, Julia.
- [33:22]
B
Well, hey there. I wanted to say thank you for tuning into my show and for listening all the the way to the end. If you really enjoyed today's conversation, make sure to subscribe to the show in your favorite podcast app and you'll get new episodes downloaded as soon as they come out. I would love if you left me a rating or a review because this tells other people that my podcast is worth listening to and then me and my guests can reach even more earbuds and create even more impact. So that's pretty much it. I'll be back soon soon with a brand new episode, but until then you can find me on instagram @ Julia Campbell, 77 Keep changing the world, you nonprofit unicorn.