← Nonprofit Nation with Julia Campbell
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In a world hungry for change, nonprofit impact matters more than ever. Yet you're asked to constantly do more with less. What if you could do more with more? That's the promise of Bloomerang, the giving platform built for purpose. Fundraising, CRM and volunteer insights are integrated to reveal opportunity and generosity so you can make more connections with more funds raised for even more impact. Now that's more like it. Learn how you can do more with more@bloomerang.com that's B L O O M E R A N G.com now on to the episode.
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Hello, and welcome to Nonprofit Nation. I'm your host, Julia Campbell, and I'm going to sit down with nonprofit industry experts, fundraisers, marketers, and everyone in between to get real and discuss what it takes to build that movement that you've been dreaming of. I created the Nonprofit Nation podcast to share practical wisdom and strategies to help you confidently find your voice, definitively grow your audience, and effectively build your movement. If you're a nonprofit newbie or an experienced professional who's looking to get more visibility, reach more people, and create even more impact, then you're in the right place. Let's get started.
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A
Hi, everyone. This is Nonprofit Nation with your host, Julia Campbell. And with me today, I have the nonprofit maven, Julie Edwards, a fundraising strategist and coach who helps organizations move from reactive chaos to strategic clarity. And we're going to talk about how to raise money with newsletters, why donor focused storytelling sort of beats, internal updates, direct mail best practices, and how we can really kind of get back to the basics with fundraising. So, Julie, welcome.
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C
Thank you. I'm so glad to be here. Thank you for inviting me.
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A
Yay. If anyone could be like a fly on the wall for our 20 minute conversation we had before we recorded, it was pretty great. Yes, I know we'll just keep that between us, but you are the nonprofit maven, and I've always loved that name. So tell me about how you chose that name. Like how you went off on your own kind of. What drew you into the work of fundraising?
- [02:34]
C
So I was in the nonprofit sector. My background is in marketing, communications, and PR, which I did for about 15 or 20 years. And then in 2010, I entered the nonprofit sector as a director of development marketing, the first one for a local humane society where I live. And then I became the executive director about four years in. And at first I was a little daunted by the fundraising part, but I quickly realized that fundraising is sales. This is one of the things I preach, because nonprofit is A business that people don't treat like that always and that you are selling your mission to a donor who then buys your mission by giving you a donation. And when I realized it's just sales, which sounds a little horrible, but it's true, you know, I could do it. So I was like, I can do marketing. Because you're basically marketing your mission right when you're doing fundraising. So I was very successful in that role. I basically built their fundraising program from the ground up. And after I Was there about 11 years, I decided to go out on my own because I saw so much need, especially among, you know, smaller nonprofits, to just have more strategy. I really love strategy and some. And I really talk about planning and how important it is and you just can't fly by the seat of your pants. And you need to have a budget and you need to have a plan. It doesn't have to be like a three year strategic plan, but just even plan for one year about, you know, where you're going and what you're doing and that I really just wanted to help as many people as possible, which I know sounds a little corny, but it's true. So I'm, I'm a type 2 enneagram, which is the helper. So that's my nature. And then as far as the maven, I will give credit. I actually had a great VA three years ago and she came up with that name. But I thought it was so fitting. I loved it from the start because, you know, and it's a different. And I just, I think it fits, fits my personality. Yes, a little bit. And that people don't necessarily know what that means. But it means expert though. That sounds a little self patting myself on the back.
- [04:20]
A
But no, it means like jack of all trades, but very specific to non profits.
- [04:26]
C
I think that is me. So, you know, I sort of have done a little bit of everything like most people in the non profit world, you know, they. They do a little bit of everything. So. Because we have to. But yeah, that's the basic backstory.
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A
I love it. And you have raised over $15 million for clients, which is amazing.
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C
Probably closer to 20 or maybe more than 20 now.
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A
Yeah, it's got to be more than that. Okay.
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C
Yeah.
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A
What is sort of one lesson that's been consist across all that fundraising?
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C
Actually I, I said I'm going to write a book about it, but I have.
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A
Yes, you should.
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C
That are, that are. I call them Juliasms. But you mentioned it when we started this podcast. The basics are so important. And I think a lot of nonprofits get very caught up in like the next big thing or like getting the next big donation, acquiring new donors. And it's like I am a big advocate of, to quote Ron Swanson, my soulmate to whole ass, one thing than half ass, two things. And I think that you should.
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A
Leslie Nop soulmate.
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C
That you should focus on. There's a lot of low hanging fruit and I know I hate that term in some ways, but, but you know, that you can focus on that. They're not like loving up the donors you have. You know, I always talk about, you know, that old childhood saying about make new friends but keep the old. For one is silver and one is gold, you know, and your acquisition donors or your silver donors. But if you already have a group of donors that have been regularly donating to you, love them up first and you know, and they will give more. I have seen it happen in my own organ when I was with the Humane Society and just, you know, taking one event rather than trying to have 10 and doing it really, really well or you know, doing your newsletter and doing it really, really well and you'll get further faster, in my opinion, than you will trying to like scattershot everything because you can't do everything. And so better to do the things that are the most. And it's not the same for every nonprofit. It's not the same for every nonprofit. But there are some basics I feel like that are for every nonprofit and that you can do regularly that will help you up your fundraising, you know, amount that you're bringing in.
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A
What's really caught my eye was something I saw in your email newsletter, which I am a subscriber. I will put the link in the show notes to subscribe to the Maven mailing list. You shared a really interesting case study from a client that had reworked their print newsletter and they raised 55% more than past issues. And what really caught my eye was print newsletter. So could you walk us through sort of like what wasn't working for them before and what changed?
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C
So first I want to say this is a small organization in the Midwest. They have way less than a million dollar budget, probably between 500 and 750 a year, small staff, about 1500 to 2000 people in their database. So this is not like some. Somebody has 20,000 donors. So this is a very good case study and that's very similar to a lot of other organizations. But I started working with them in March of this year and they just put out their spring newsletter so the first one I worked on them with was Summer, but we totally redid their newsletter. Completely redid it. I did not design it because I do not have design skills, but I did direct the person who designed it. And, you know, we used lots of photos, big photos. We changed the storytelling up completely to be more donor focused and more emotionally evoking and you know, to really, you know, include the donor in the story. Just to say, you know, you helped do this and we can't do this without you, because it's true. And so many people don't do that. And it's not even if they're bragging nonprofits, it's not even that they're bragging on their stuff, but they just don't fake the donors appropriately in the way that they should. So, yeah, we totally redesign the layout. We put in pull quotes because, you know, there is a lot of best practices with design. Like people don't read. They're not going to read everything. So you've got to give them the story in bold or in a couple of pull quotes that they can see very quickly. And then we did purchase a small local targeted mail list for them. And they did get three new donors, which wasn't a lot, but it's a start. You know, we just did it for a test, really. The comments she got back, that Ed got back were so validating, I guess. And actually I think I was. I was just looking at the email I sent. It said that they had raised $5,500. They now have raised almost $6,800 on that. So they've raised like over a thousand more since then. But I think their next highest grossing newsletter was like less than half that. So they've more than doubled at this point. What? They're less. You know, they did get one very big gift from a longtime donor, a $3,000 gift that was a surprise. But she said, wow, what a newsletter. This is incredible. And recently somebody who follows them also put on LinkedIn because Edie just shared this with me this week and she said every time I get stuff from this organization now, it makes me cry. They really know how to move people with their mission. And Lee's like, this is all because of you.
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A
Wow.
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C
I was like, well, I don't make the stories, I just write them. But, you know, another donor gave out their largest G gift ever. You know, they had a monthly donor that gave a 250 gift outside their regular monthly pledge. They had somebody that had donated since 2021 in four years gave a 150 gift. You know, that is, the thing is, is I was talking about earlier is your donors that you already have have more money. And it's not that they don't want to give it to you, but they're not being inspired to give it to you and they're not being asked to give it to you.
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A
Right. They're not being asked.
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C
Asked.
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A
They're not being asked. Well, for a small organization or a mid sized organization out there listening, that's thinking, oh, are print newsletters still worth it? Like, should we keep our print newsletter? It sounds like it might just be a problem of what you're sharing in your print newsletter.
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C
I think it's a thousand percent a problem of what you're sharing. If you're sharing stats and you're sharing and I hate says program updates without attributing the program updates to donations and donors and their part in that. You have to move people, right? I mean in life the way you get the best results in anything is to move people. Whether it's to anger or to.
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A
Right.
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C
Or to, you know, to tears. But you have to move people. And I do. And again, I don't know if print newsletters are worth it for every organization, but I don't think you should scrap yours before you look at totally retooling it or what is not working and try to make it work. I know printing is very expensive these days. You know, the cost of paper and postage and all those things keep going up. But you also have to use your newsletter as a fundraising tool. And a lot of people just send out the newsletter. They don't send a remittance or reply slip in it. And you don't have to hard ask, but you should always include a chance, an opportunity. Yeah. And people will send you back money. I mean it basically becomes a direct mail appeal, but in a different format.
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A
Right.
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C
And so if you're just sending it out and not asking for money in it, that's your number one problem. You know, you should always ask for money in it. Even again, if it's a soft ask, it just, there's no asking the text. But you put in the remittance and say your reply slip and say if you'd like to support us, you know, send in a donation because you will get donations as seen by these people who got almost 6, 800 from this one newsletter.
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A
My gosh, how often do they send newsletters?
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C
Quarterly, in fact, quarterly right now.
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A
Okay.
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C
One thing I, I'm, I'm mad about in the Last one, because I forgot is QR codes have been great since COVID Okay. You did forget to put a QR code in the newsletter for their donation page. And I'm going to do that this time. We'll make sure we do that this time. So if people get it and don't, you know, want to sit down and write a check or go to their website and find the donation page, they can just easily scan that on their phone and make the donation right there.
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A
So you also mentioned buying a small targeted mailing list. So for, for small organizations listening, like, how can you determine if and when that's a smart investment? Like, how do you go about it?
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C
I always will promote loving on the donors you have before promoting acquisition because acquisition is a long haul, long term process and it's very expensive. You do not make the money back that you put into acquisition, usually for a while. Now this particular list that we purchased was, was. They live in a small, you know, smaller, rural, ish area.
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A
Yeah.
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C
So it's only like 500 people. It wasn't a lot of people. I think the list cost $250 to use for a year. Oh, wow. You know, so it was a good deal. Like I said, she got three donations off of it, which did not equal the 250. But we can use that list for a year. And so I know that probably through this next newsletter, we'll probably make that money back. And as long as you're making that money back, even if you're, I mean, and she may only wind up getting 15 or 20 people off the acquisition list over the next year. But that's 15 or 20 more than you had. But I think to, to me, the. You can't ever know for sure. But like, can you at least break even on it? And I think that's what's great about purchasing smaller lists rather than trying to like shoot to 20,000. Because that is. I know we used to work with a direct mail company at my organization that does that. That is like their whole thing and that's what they do. And we would spend $100,000 a year on direct mail. Now we made about two. I mean, I tracked it the whole time I was there and we always made at least $2 for every dollar we spent. And you know, you're also looking at the long term, you know, lifespan of those donors and keeping them on. But it is, it is not inexpensive. But there are ways to, you know, if you work with a mail house to purchase smaller lists that are very targeted. Like I Think for her, we chose households with a certain income, which for her, for her area I think was like a hundred thousand and above that had a pet in the home and that had given charitably because you can, you know, really whittle down a list. So, you know, when you pick those criteria, it sort of like at least swings it maybe to your side that people are going to be more responsive. So, you know, made sure, you know, we're asking people who had probably had disposable income, already had a pet, hopefully that they loved and you know, they loved. They were animal lovers and that had given charitably in the past at some point or you know, in the past, however many years at some point, again, trying to target people who would be more likely to give.
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A
Not just completely, not just random, again, scattershotty.
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C
Being very focused and intentional about the lists we were purchasing.
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A
Exactly. That makes sense to me because I tend to think that especially when nonprofits are running an email newsletter, like not to purchase an email list. But I think the tendency with an email list is since it's so cheap, you could send this cost the same to send a thousand emails as it costs to send one email. The tendency is not. Not to be as strategic and not to be as focused and to do more scattershot spamming. But with direct mail, since it's. You pay for each piece and each postage, you really have to be intentional.
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C
Well, not even that. But when you purchase an email list, I mean, people change their emails all the time. I mean, I have three different emails. I have my junk email that I use for shopping online. I have my real email. You know, you have all these different emails. Yes, but people live where they live. You know, you can have three different addresses in one town. So you really can't miss, I guess, as much with, with that. And again, it's not for everyone and you have to be. But it was just a test. I will say the other thing that I wish I had done and I'm going to do on their fall newsletter, which again we're working on now, is I'm going to pull out those people, those addresses and put a letter specifically from the Ed up front that basically says in a very much better way than this, but like, we know you don't really know about us, but here's who we are and here's how we're helping in the community and here's what we're doing that makes us different and here's why we need your support. And I didn't do that in the last one. And I should have had an introduction to the organization. And I think if we can do a really warm. I'm interested to see if I do a really warm letter from the ED and put it at the front, you know, put it in there with the newsletter that will get a better response to the newsletter. Oh, wow.
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A
So you would segment the list out so current donors would get a different newsletter than. No, than brand new donors.
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C
Same exact newsletter. Okay, well, but the people that are on the acquisition list would get the letter. Introductory letter.
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Letter. I love that.
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C
So that, you know, to sort of say, we know you don't know us, but here. Because I think, I mean, you know, too, like, you get. You get mail from people and you're like, how the heck can I get this mail?
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A
Right, right.
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C
And I think that we can even say something. Well, you don't be too creepy. But like, we hope you like animals. We know you do, but we. Yep.
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A
We know you like animals. Yeah. And I think that just speaks to the organization really wanting to connect on a personal level. You know, it just goes into talking to people like they're humans and not talking to people like their numbers on a spreadsheet and being relational and not transactional.
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C
Exactly. And one of the other things that non profits don't do enough. Oh, yeah. And they weren't doing and I used to not do in my organization. Is bragging on yourself. Right. Is telling your story, is telling the good things you're doing. And there's a way to do it where it's very warm and inclusive of the donor. And it's not just, oh, look at all the things we did, but look at all the things you helped us make possible. You know, that couldn't have happened without you. They do a lot of special case work. And by special cases, I mean they take in kittens with popped eyeballs and, you know, dogs with shattered femurs because they have a vet on their team. And a lot of shelters do not have vets on their team. And we were the same way at the shelter I worked at that we had a vet so we could take in those hard cases that if they went to other shelters, they would be immediately euthanized, not because they wanted to, but because they didn't have the resources to take care of them. And so we really have started since I've been working with them. And this is a big part of the newsletter now is telling the stories of those special cases and carving them out. Because, you know, in nonprofit world, it's all about what makes you different. If you disappeared, what gap would be left behind? And the gap that would be left behind for them is they are the only shelter, probably within a 40 mile radius of them, maybe more, that has a veterinarian on staff and that can take those hard cases. And so we started telling those hard cases, which they weren't doing before and again they were humane society as well. People go, oh, it's all puppies and kittens. I always rebuke that with yes, puppies and kittens may be easier, but if you don't have good enough stories to tell about what you're doing, maybe you shouldn't be a nonprofit. Because everybody has a story, right? Everybody has a story. You just have to figure out what it is.
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A
Exactly. What's your advice for organizations that really struggle with their newsletter? Because, you know, I, I just know, I know for some, someone like maybe a library or an organization that really does have a lot of events and a lot of updates and a lot of things to share like that, and they might struggle to get those really good stories. What are some tips that you have for them?
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C
Well, some tips are, you know, some organizations are going to have more stories than others just because. Right. Like a humane society, you know, you're having many animals coming every day. But something again that I used to be hung up on, but I lived through my personal experience of is you can retell stories. I mean, I always walk. I had to have a new story for everything, right? Like every direct mail, every newsletter, everything had to have a new story. People don't remember. I know that sounds horrible, but they don't. And you can have one great story and use it in your newsletter and use it in your direct mail appeal and use it in your year end campaign. And we would even take stories toward the end and like go back and retell them. Like, remember this story back from April, here's an update on it. So you can read. You can take stories and continue to retell them over a year or maybe longer. They're really great because people won't remember always the great detail, but they'll remember that it was good. If it was that great of a story and that touching and that awesome, you should retell it honestly and keep reminding people of it. Right?
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A
And people want to hear updates.
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C
Yeah, they do. I mean, they do. And like, one of the things again that I've been doing with this organization that I'm working with is they weren't updating about their animals. Like they've taken Four kittens, I guess about two months ago that had. That were burned. One of them didn't make it. But. But, you know, but we told that because I also believe in transparency. And we tracked those kittens all along because we had an emergency appliance appeal, and people gave, like, almost 6,005, $6,000 for those kittens. In fact, we just sent one yesterday, and it's the last one because the last one got adopted. But we kept sending email updates on those kittens and saying, here's the kittens that you helped save and here's where they are. And so that'll be. And we'll probably. I'm probably at year end gonna pull out those kittens again and say, remember the kittens back from July? Here they are now. They're. They're hoes. This couldn't have happened without you kind of thing. So you. Again, it's just. Don't be afraid to repeat stories. And I also think that people that nonprofits. And again, things I've experienced don't see. Don't always see their stories as powerful or don't.
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A
Right. They're too close to it.
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C
Think it's a good story because. Yeah, exactly. They're in it. They're in the mission. And so they don't understand how it can move people or the difference it makes. And you really have to think about it from that perspective. Maybe a good thing to do is, like, I would go tell people things that were, like, friends and family that was happening, the Humane Society I worked at, and they'd be like, oh, my God, that really happens. I can't believe that. And I just thought, like, everybody knew this, right? Like, everybody knew the amount of pain and suffering that happened with an animal welfare in our country, but especially the South. But, you know, maybe go tell some of these stories to people and just see how they respond, you know, Because I was recently talking about a dance company, Right. A dance company. We're talking about a hard nonprofit. Right. And so we were talking in, and she's like, well, we don't really have, you know, because they just. They do rehearsal. They help pay for the rehearsal space. And I said, yeah, but think about right now the try not to curse the S show our country is in. Yes. And, you know, regardless of your political side and, you know, people need joy. People need to experience joy to escape, you know, not not being theater dance.
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A
I really think so important right now.
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C
I think theater, dance, art, heart is a lot of those things that people can use to, you know, immerse themselves in something that gives them joy and that distracts them from the day to day pains, even just personal pains and struggles. Right, right. And so if you approach it maybe from that way I told her, I said, you know, it's not you're just paying for rehearsal space, but you're paying for joy. I mean, you're, you're, you're investing in joy not for just yourself, but for other people.
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A
Yeah.
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C
And that's, you know, can be very powerful. And again, it's just the way you frame it and you look at it and yeah, maybe stepping outside your mission a little bit and thinking about it from a different perspective because it seems very common to you and not special, but it could be very special to other people the way they view it.
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A
Yeah. I love something you said earlier, like, even if you don't have a story of kittens, think about what makes you different and what gap you're filling. And if your door is closed tomorrow, what would happen either to the local environment or to children or to food insecurity, like what would happen in the community and what makes you different and what do you want to be known for and where are the stories that you can tell around that, like staff or volunteer or donor board stories. But the key here is really communicating, I think. And something I try to get across is like, we're not communicating enough. We think we're bothering our donors and we're not sending enough direct mail, we're not sending enough email. And, and you know, people want to hear, they want to hear the impact that they made and they want to be involved.
- [23:41]
C
Well, and I'm a huge proponent of donor surveys. In fact, that's usually the first thing I do with any new client. Unless my one caveat is if they have been doing super great donor relations, I don't do that right away.
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A
Yeah.
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C
Because I don't want to get listed. So I like give it a little bit of time and then ask, ask your donors, ask them why they give. I mean, it's so easy to just say, why do you give to us? And maybe give them some, some examples like, oh, I love this party mission or this party mission or this party mission. Or if you don't want to even do a survey, just pick up the phone and call some of your. And maybe not the major donors, but like the mid levels which, you know, give a good amount but maybe aren't just giving because they're super wealthy or something and say, you know, we're looking at, you know, our mission and, and what, you know, makes people drawn to it and why do you give to us? And I said they will have a story. It may be a very personal story, but I guarantee you, you can extract something out of that that will be more general to everyone. They may say, I give to, you know, I give to your. And I'm just continue to use animal shelters because that's what I, you know, I give to your shelter because I had a rescue dog years ago and it was. And I loved it to death and it passed away. And I was always grateful to the shelter that adopted it to me. And so I want to help other shelters. So the message there is I want people to be able. I want these animals to be able to survive and find homes. I mean, that is what you do. Right. So take out. Don't look at the story to like, look at the kernel, the part of it that is universal to everyone or more universal to everyone.
- [25:09]
A
Oh, I think that's such a great idea. You talked about QR codes and putting remittance envelopes. What are some other sort of best practices for newsletters that we often overlook?
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C
I think photos. I mean, I see way too many newsletters that have like little time made with like clip art or very. Yeah. Or no photos. And you really need to focus on real, actual photos. And again, it may be difficult, but do what you can to get them. And again, you can reuse them to a certain extent because again, it's about evoking emotion. Right. So you want to be able to show your mission literally in action.
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A
Yeah.
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C
And you know the newsletter that we did for. For this organization, it's a four page. It's just in love with my 17 folded. Right. The front page, the whole half of the front page is a picture. It's a photo. And like for the summer one, it's a very tight photo of a cat's face.
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A
Yes.
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C
That its face was shaved because it had come in with some medical issues. And so, you know, it was very, it was dramatic but also very touching. And we told the story in the, you know, of. Of why it became that way. And then we also put an after photo of it in there. It's sort of a. Here's this cat without you, here's this cat with you. And you know, this is a difference that you made for this cat. And I just. It's. Yeah, you got to use photos. I mean, I would rather have much more photos and much less text because people don't read. But you should be able to tell the story or try to tell a story in the photos that you're using and putting heavy captions. So again, if people just read the captions in your newsletter under your photos, they should be able to get the gist of what you're doing without having to read a word of the text.
- [26:46]
A
I mean people really keep these newsletters around. I know there's a couple organizations where I live that send a print newsletter and I'll put it, you know, on the coffee table or in the living room and people will come over and they'll look at it and they'll, you know, scroll through it. Because it's just we, you know, for my generation at least Gen X, we're used to magazines and we're used to, you know, print newspapers. So we are, you know, we're also used to digital communication. But I really like holding something in my hands as well. Like I really like to look at something.
- [27:15]
C
And that's another great point because, you know, you're gen. I think you're Gen X.
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A
Like yes, I am.
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C
And that's the thing about phone calls. My phone calls have been. Have worked so well for many years now. Owners. Because when you get away from what you used to do and used to be the norm, then it becomes special. Right? Right. Oh really? All stuff is online digitally now. If you send somebody something important print, it makes. It's more special. If you people used to call people, there's no option now people can text and all these things. And so if you call, actually call somebody and have a connection with them and actually talk to them, you know, it's special. And so I think you know when. So you have to remember that it's not that it's antiquated now maybe it's special.
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A
Oh, that's true. I know now maybe it's retro. So what are the next steps for this organization? You're talking about the fall newsletter, the Letter from the Edge. How can like how are else are you building on the. The success of this newsletter and retaining these, these new donors?
- [28:09]
C
Well, you know, again we've just set up a more robust banking cycle which they were really, they were good about things. They just weren't great about thinking and part of it was just a resource thing. They just needed somebody. And the Ed, she is a former vet, so she is not. Copyright is not her thing. And that's the other thing too. Like don't spend some money folks. I know, I know you may not have a ton of money, but some spend some money. Consultants maybe aren't as expensive as you think they are, but that organization in six months has already probably made double back what they'll pay me this year, you know, I mean, or at least that definitely have covered what they pay me this year in, in the amount of money I've helped them raise over what they normally had raised this time last year, year and date, or year over year.
- [28:51]
A
Especially if you're not a copywriter, hire a copywriter.
- [28:54]
C
Yes, it is an investment, but I truly think it is a worthwhile investment. And it just, it blows my mind how many non profits will not invest in fundraising. And you know, and I'm like, because it is what keeps your doors open, literally. Unless you have fees for service, which most non profits I think don't. But even then that shouldn't be the whole thing you lean on. We had fees for service at my humane society, we had a low cost clinic and we did adoption fees, of course, but that was like half. And I made sure fundraising was the other half because you got to have the balance right. Again, just telling their stories that they were not telling before, making people aware of what they're actually doing, doing with their money and that, you know, and to make them feel good about it. It's so simple. It really is. Simple basics. Yeah, it's just basic stuff. It's like, you know, people won't give unless you ask. It is crazy to me how many times I will talk to people like, well, when's the last time you asked for a gift? Oh, last, last holiday, you know, it's September now. I'm like, you haven't asked your donors, it's last Christmas for a gift? No, I don't want to bother them thanking people again, you know, at least once or multiple times. You know, loving on your current donors and making sure that they're, you know, that you're doing. Thanking them the best before you start acquiring others, making it ridiculously easy for them to give. I, oh my God, one client, it broke the camel's back that she wanted to send out her year end appeal without a reply slip. And I was like, are you crazy? And she's like, they just know to give.
- [30:26]
A
No, they don't. People really don't.
- [30:28]
C
Yeah, people don't know you need stuff unless you tell them. Yeah, you know, they're not just gonna automatically assume, oh, you're a non profit, you need money. And I know that sounds very duh, but again, people don't give unless you ask.
- [30:42]
A
Right.
- [30:42]
C
You have to ask them and make.
- [30:44]
A
It as easy as possible. That's why The QR code. That's why the remit a slip just. They knock down those obstacles to giving.
- [30:52]
C
Yeah. And I tell people this all the time. This is another Julius. I have never had anyone cuss me out for asking them for money, ever.
- [30:58]
A
I never have either.
- [31:00]
C
Yeah, I mean, they may tell you like, I can't do it right now or ignore you, but I've never had anyone just scream at me for asking them for money. And the thing is that they're already giving you money. That's half the battle. Right? So. And again, you can, this is a Rachel Muir thing, I think that she's told me is that you can never ask people too much as long as you're thanking them appropriately.
- [31:19]
A
Right.
- [31:20]
C
Ask, ask, ask, ask, ask, and never think. But if you ask like those kittens I was talking about and then send four or five follow up emails and then ask again for something else. I mean, but yeah, you can't just ask, ask, ask and never thank them appropriately. And I, I do think a lot of nonprofits drop the ball on that. And I honestly think some of it is just feeling like they don't have to, I mean, you know, like, oh, they should just give it to us because we're a nonprofit. No.
- [31:47]
A
They don't have to give you their attention. They don't have to give you anything.
- [31:50]
C
They should just know we're cheer team, we need it, so they should just give it to us. No, no.
- [31:55]
A
Wouldn't that be nice? But no, I know, wouldn't that be just a lovely, a lovely world to live in?
- [32:01]
C
But I think, oh, they'll just know to gift us. Oh my gosh. I'm sorry. I just have to laugh about that though. It made me so furious at the time. But it's just like these are the kind of like simple yet very detrimental mistakes that non profits make that are just very like, just put the dang replace up in there. Good lord.
- [32:23]
A
Well, I think that also donors do not, I mean, the average layperson does not sit around thinking about, like, what organizations am I going to give to? Like the average person I know every giving Tuesday, I get emails from friends and family that say, say, where should I give? Where do you Recommend? Does a $5 donation really make a difference? Should I give monthly? Like, we need to do a better job educating the average person on the importance of small dollar donations. People think like, if they're not Bill Gates, they're not going to make a difference a lot of the time. Or they, they wonder if their gift is making an Impact. So we have to show them that, yes, it is. It's super important and it's the lifeblood of our organization and it's the way that we exist. And here's how you can help. And just invite people, like inviting them to a party. Like, if you want to come to this party, that's great. And if you don't want to come, then maybe you'll come later.
- [33:18]
C
You know, I'm also a huge proponent of, again, not for every nonprofit, but doing peer to peer fundraisers.
- [33:24]
A
Oh, yeah.
- [33:25]
C
If you have. Because I'm doing one right now for an organization that I work for. And I don't necessarily want to mention their name because they're a national organization and they are disease. Like, they're disease focused. So they, you know, like, of breast cancer. It's not breast cancer, but like semiconductor. So they have. They have a very concentrated base of people who are already on their side because they have that disease that. That condition. Right. That they were doing a really poor job of. They were going after all these major donors and not building community among the people who have this disease and not making them feel included. And yes, those people do not have maybe a ton of money, but they will do peer to peer. Yes. And Gibson small donations. So we do a virtual 5k for them. And we did it last year for the first time in like three years because of COVID and I had a goal of 30,000 and we raised 52. Oh my gosh. This year we have a goal of 55, and we're already 2/3 of the way there. And we have another week and a half left. And we will make it. I know, Amazing. That's wonderful. You know, just. But again, it goes back to including people who already have an interest in or are giving to your organization. Don't skip over the people who might give you $5 because combined it can be a lot of money. And they feel so. And I know this is gonna sound a little horrible, but these people are so grateful to be asked to participate.
- [34:41]
A
Right.
- [34:42]
C
I mean, I do this. My name is on emails. And so people write and ask me questions and they're like, thank you so much for doing this. Thank you so much. I feel so great to see other people that have this. And you know, and again, it's about to meet, building that community. And again, maybe not for every nonprofit, but I think for most, again, if you think outside the box, it is even dance companies. There's people out there that love dance and have danced in their past. Maybe they were dancer when they were young but now they're 70 and they can't. But they love watching it and reliving their childhood. I don't know what I'm just saying.
- [35:10]
A
Right. Everyone has their own story. I love it. Well, we're getting to time. I want people to learn more about where they can reach you, Julie. Connect with you, learn more about your services.
- [35:22]
C
Is my website is the nonprofit Maven Co.com so it's do. But of course you're going to give them my newsletter and that's the best way. And I will say I'm not always super great about sending my newsletter, so bear with me.
- [35:34]
A
Oh no, I think it's great. And when it comes out it's always.
- [35:37]
C
Really helpful, you know. And I, I know I'm not everybody's cup of tea because I'm going to be very direct with people and honest and not everybody. I love it. But you know, that's what I feel like people need is the is more truth isms and not glossy stuff. I'm not, you know, because unfortunately I see too many consultants and I actually hate that word. I call myself a strategist just because I don't want to call myself a consultant.
- [36:01]
A
Yeah, I agree.
- [36:02]
C
Cookie cutter approaches.
- [36:03]
A
Yeah.
- [36:04]
C
It really puts a bad taste in nonprofit's mouth.
- [36:07]
A
Right.
- [36:07]
C
And I'm like I never do that. I always meet organizations where they are and within the resources they have. Time, money, people. Because you can't give every organization the same approach you do have to get and you know, look at where they are now and what they have that's working and how you can take that low hanging fruit again and make it better. And I do think you've already have a print newsletter that you're putting out and it's getting some level of response that with a few again, simple tweaks, bigger photos, more donor focused copy, less stats and stuff like that, more storytelling that it, you can make it generate more money.
- [36:43]
A
Yes.
- [36:44]
C
Putting a reply slip in it.
- [36:46]
A
Oh my gosh, just give it. Asking people and letting them, giving them the opportunity to give. This is just a huge, huge thing that I always say. Yeah, it's an opportunity. We're not manipulating anybody. We're not brow beating people. We're not, you know, forcing them to give. But we are giving them that opportunity and a lot of people want it and so they'll take again.
- [37:08]
C
It's the same thing as like Target saying here is clothes for fall.
- [37:13]
A
Right.
- [37:13]
C
Opportunity to buy them.
- [37:16]
A
Buy them or not. Here's the email you know, to another.
- [37:20]
C
Of my Julia's and over in the time is, you know, you can't tell people how to give their money. You can already give them options. And not everybody's going to want to attend event. Not everybody's going to be a monthly donor. So give them multiple ways to contribute and let them pick what works best for them, you know? And yeah, because if you just say, oh, we only asked him once a year at the end of year, that's not going to get it. That's not going to cut it.
- [37:41]
A
Well, I know this episode is going to be super popular. I'm going to have to have you back and we're going to have to just have another conversation again because we could talk for hours and hours and hours. But thank you so much, Julie, for being here.
- [37:53]
C
Thank you. I appreciate it. You have a great afternoon. Thank you everybody for tuning in.
- [38:04]
A
Well, hey there.
- [38:05]
B
I wanted to say thank you for tuning into my show and for listening all the way to the end. If you really enjoyed today's conversation, make sure to subscribe to the show in your favorite podcast app and you'll get new episodes downloaded as soon as they come out. I would love if you left me a rating or a review because this tells other people that my podcast is worth listening to and then me and my guests can reach even more earbuds and create even more impact. So that's pretty much it. I'll be back soon with a brand new episode, but until then you can find me on Instagram juliacampbell77 Keep changing the world, you non profit unicorn.
- [38:51]
C
Sam.