S3E4: "Animals 'R Us" with Anne Gordon

Summary

Northern Disclosure – S3E4: “Animals ‘R Us” with Anne Gordon
September 30, 2025 | Evergreen Podcasts

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Episode Overview

In this episode of Northern Disclosure, hosts Rob Morrow and Jeanine Turner revisit Season 3, Episode 4 of Northern Exposure, “Animals ‘R Us.” The episode centers on the sudden appearance of a stray dog in Cicely—prompting Maggie to believe her lost love Rick has been reincarnated—and Maurice’s latest get-rich-quick scheme involving ostriches. Joining them is longtime animal trainer Anne Gordon, who reveals behind-the-scenes stories about working with the show’s many memorable animals (including the iconic moose in the credits) and spotlights the critical role animals and their trainers played in making Cicely feel real.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Recap & Character Highlights

[03:14 – 05:02]

• Rob provides a succinct episode summary: Maggie adopts a stray malamute, believing it’s Rick reincarnated; Maurice tries to launch an ostrich farm with Marilyn; Ed makes a heartfelt movie about Cicely.
• Jeanine reminisces about the quirky, sweet tone typical of Northern Exposure, and how this episode embodied the series’ essence.
• Ed’s charming idiosyncrasies—being pen pals with Scorsese and Spielberg—spark discussion on the blend of rural quirkiness and worldly wisdom that characterized the show.

“His favorite filmmaker is Louis Malle, which is just so idiosyncratic. And Louis Malle, who, by the way, was aware of Northern Exposure.”
—Rob Morrow, [04:33]

2. Thematic Depth: Spirituality and Animals

[06:08 – 07:52]

• The motif of animals as spiritual messengers is explored, with Jeanine drawing a personal parallel between Maggie’s story and her own experience after her father’s death—a bluebird lingered in her backyard, comforting the family.
• The episode’s engagement with Native American themes of reincarnation and animal spirits is praised as both beautiful and universal.

“A lot of people believe when their loved one dies, they see something in nature that feels like that person's essence making a hello.”
—Jeanine Turner, [06:28]

3. Noteworthy Scenes & Use of Music

[08:11 – 11:10]

• The hosts dissect the memorable montage set to Aretha Franklin’s “Natural Woman” and the playful choice of “My Boyfriend’s Back,” illustrating the series’ deft mix of humor and heart.
• Rob lauds the silent visual storytelling and Ed’s black-and-white tribute film as “lovely” and “very Woody Allen.”

“You just so want to believe that it’s Rick that…they did most of it with music—no dialogue, just looks and gestures.”
—Rob Morrow, [09:59]

4. Working with Animal Actors: Introducing Anne Gordon

[12:34 – 15:32]

• Anne Gordon shares her path to becoming an animal trainer, from zookeeping to film work, and her current work leading whale and dolphin retreats.
• She became “the it girl for anything film in Oregon, Washington”—hiring out both her own and locally sourced animals.

Memorable Animal Moments

• Anne recalls playing the beaver handler in the pilot—a stretch outside her comfort zone as she preferred being off-camera.
• The dog “Wolfie,” who played the malamute mix in this episode, is remembered for his natural performance and successful training.

“That’s an animal trainer’s dream, to have the dog be a major character.”
—Anne Gordon, [20:47]

5. Behind-the-Scenes Animal Challenges

[20:47 – 24:42]

• Anne addresses the pressure of training on a tight timeline—sometimes with just one animal and no backup, as with Wolfie.
• She details convincing dog actors to perform specific behaviors (ears back, growling) using play, tone, and trust, underscoring the complexity and stress of her role.

“You have a rhythm as an actor…then you have to pause because the dog walked off its mark…It was all part of the atmosphere.”
—Rob Morrow, [17:58]

6. The Ostriches & Maurice's Scheme

[27:47 – 30:29]

• The show filmed the ostrich scenes at their actual home to minimize animal stress. Maurice’s actor, Barry Corbin, had a fear of birds but performed professionally.
• Ostriches were led with food buckets off-camera; John Corbett once attempted to “join” the birds dangerously.

“One kick from an ostrich can disembowel a lion…I am not going to be responsible for injuring any actor.”
—Anne Gordon, [29:00]

7. The Iconic Moose in the Opening Credits

[37:28 – 41:19]

• Anne reveals how she sourced Morty the moose for the opening credits—he was a bottle-raised orphan used to people. The crew lured him around Roslyn with branches and bananas.
• Fencing off the whole town to film the opening was “a big effort—but, man, did it pay off.”

“Everywhere…all they ask is, ‘Did you do the moose?’ I said, yes. His name was Mort.”
—Anne Gordon, [41:06]

8. Challenging and Memorable Animal Episodes

[41:44 – 47:38]

• Bear-centric episodes involved special precautions—using string “electric fences” and food rewards.
• Horses, goats, porcupines, and birds required a wide array of skills. Anne shares a story about John Corbett tensing up on a horse and unintentionally cueing the animal to move.

“Horses feel everything. They’re such sensitive creatures and very intuitive.”
—Jeanine Turner, [47:38]

9. Animals as Characters & Spiritual Partners

[47:49 – 53:15]

• Jeanine and Anne reflect on the soulful, intuitive side of working with animals, both personally and on-set.
• The hosts praise Anne’s ability to train animals to interact naturally with actors, avoiding tell-tale cues.

“You never sensed that they were trained animals—they just felt so organic.”
—Jeanine Turner, [51:09]

10. The Legacy of Northern Exposure’s Animal World

[51:23 – End]

• The group notes the rarity of main characters actually keeping pets—most animals were part of the community fabric instead.
• Anne expresses pride in the show’s writing and spirituality, which set it apart from other projects.

“My goal as an animal trainer was to make it easy for you to work with the animals…I wanted them to make eye contact with you.”
—Anne Gordon, [51:44]

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• “That’s dad. It must be dad. This bird is just sitting, having dinner with us.”
  —Jeanine Turner, [07:24]

• “Confrontation with the other…That’s what distinguishes it, always going against what’s expected.”
  —Rob Morrow, [34:35]

• “She had this quiet wisdom that just came in.”
  —Ann Gordon on Elaine Miles/Marilyn, [35:44]

• “Did you do the moose?” “Yes. His name was Mort.”
  —Rob Morrow & Anne Gordon, [41:06]

• “One kick from an ostrich can disembowel a lion.”
  —Anne Gordon, [29:00]

• “You never sensed that they were trained animals—they just felt so organic.”
  —Jeanine Turner, [51:09]

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Key Timestamps & Segments

• [03:14] Episode synopsis & themes
• [04:33] Ed’s movie-maker idolization & Louis Malle anecdote
• [06:08–07:52] Spiritual connections between animals and the departed
• [08:11–09:59] Montage & use of music
• [12:34–15:32] Anne Gordon’s career backstory
• [20:47] Training the malamute “Wolfie”
• [27:47] The ostrich farm subplot & animal safety
• [37:28] How Morty the moose became the show’s mascot
• [41:44] Bear stories & animal safety on set
• [47:49] Reflections on animal intelligence and spirit
• [51:23] Animals as part of Cicely, not as pets
• [53:15–End] Anne’s closing reflections & onscreen legacy

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Tone & Style Notes

The episode brims with warmth, playful nostalgia, and genuine affection among cast and guest. There’s a balance between irreverent humor and sincere reflection (“Skeptical, rational, imperial know-it-all”—[27:00]), mirroring the original show’s blend of quirkiness and depth. Anne Gordon brings practical expertise and gentle pride, offering fans an insider’s view of old Hollywood animal magic—with the humility and wit of someone more comfortable behind the scenes than in front of the camera.

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For New Listeners

This episode is a perfect entry point for fans of Northern Exposure, television history, or anyone curious about behind-the-scenes animal magic. It’s a love letter to the unsung animal actors and trainers of TV, revealing how four-legged (and sometimes two-winged or even antlered) characters, just as much as the humans, created the heartbeat of Cicely.

Transcript

[Jeanine Turner]

Your teen adjective used to describe an individual whose spirit is unyielding, unconstrained. One who navigates life on their own terms, effortlessly. They do not always show up on time, but when they arrive, you notice an individual confident in their contradictions. They know the rules, but behave as if they do not exist. New team the new fragrance by Miu Miu defined by you. When did making plans get this complicated? It's time to streamline with WhatsApp, the secure messaging app that brings the whole group together. Use polls to settle dinner plans, send event invites and pin messages so no one forgets mom 60th and never miss a meme or milestone. All protected with end to end encryption. It's time for WhatsApp message privately with everyone. Learn [e-mail] hello everyone. Welcome to Northern Disclosure, where Rob Morrow, my handsome co star, looking all dapper in his white button down shirt, fresh from vacation on the east coast. And I, Jeanine Turner, are your host of Northern Disclosure, where we walk through episode after episode, episode after episode of Northern Exposure. So welcome everyone. We're glad you're joining us. Don't forget to hit that subscribe button. And so you can always know when these drop. They drop every Tuesday. You can watch them wherever you listen, Spotify, you know, whatever it is, Apple, but also YouTube you want to watch.

[Ann Gordon]

So.

[Jeanine Turner]

And you can watch the show if you want to watch along with us. The actual Northern Exposure shows on Amazon Prime. Today is season three, episode four, Animals Are Us. And I have to say I texted Rob after we both sort of watch it in the morning. I think. I know I do. I said, what a sweet show. I mean, I think the show was just quintessential, quintessential Northern Exposure. And our special guest for today is Ann Gordon. We're going to introduce her in about a few minutes after Rob and I sort of repartee about this episode. And she was our animal trainer. So this is going to be so fabulous. It was a great show. It's a great show for her because there were so many animals in this show as well as my cat. You see my cat right here? Here's my cat. You could just suddenly see a tail. You could just suddenly see a tail crawling up my shoulder here.

[Rob Morrow]

Animals Are Us. Perfect. That's the name of the episode.

[Jeanine Turner]

Hi, Rob. Welcome back. How you doing?

[Rob Morrow]

Hi, Janine. Love the look. This is my favorite look out of all the episodes. It just looks great. Your hair looks great. I love the glasses. You look very youthful. And maybe I'll Stick with this.

[Jeanine Turner]

Rob is always for those. I was always changing my look, trying to figure out what look I wanted. I just do that all the time. Anyway, I always get bored with my hair. And Rob's like, your real hair? Your real hair? Because a lot of my hair has been courtesy of Raquel Welch, who has this great wig line, you know. So yesterday I washed my hair and I put Velcro rollers in my hair, and I kept in my hair all day at the ranch. Rob, just for you.

[Rob Morrow]

Well, thank you. I appreciate it. So. So I watched this episode this morning. I'll read the synopsis really quick. It's called the. The episode is called Animals R Us. It was written by Robin Green, you know, who we had on a couple episodes back, and directed by Nick Mark, who we had a couple. So we got our. All our regulars. And I think, you know, as per your point, that it's a quintessential Northern Exposure. So there wasn't any new elements. We were all kind of cooking on all cylinders. And then this gave Ann Gordon a real chance to do what she does so well with the anim. Animals. But the. The synopsis is Maggie finds a stray malamute that attaches itself to her. She is convinced that the dog is Rick reincarnated. Maurice dreams of making millions with an ostrich farm and tries to get Marilyn in on his scheme. And Ed makes a film about Sicily.

[Jeanine Turner]

Yeah. What a sweet episode. What. What a sweet episode. And it had all the quirkiness of, you know, Woody Allen's mother, you know, talking about radical subjectivism, which was supposed.

[Rob Morrow]

To be Woody Allen. It was in original draft. It was Woody Allen's young. A young Woody Allen. I don't know why they changed it to Grandma Woody.

[Jeanine Turner]

Oh, well, they did. Yeah.

[Rob Morrow]

There's a little trivia for fun, actually.

[Jeanine Turner]

A little.

[Rob Morrow]

She was great. That was a great. Those are great scenes between. I mean, Darren was great in this episode, and his storyline was so sweet and tender, and I love all his references, like, you know, that he's penned Pals with Scorsese and Spielberg and. And Coppola and. And all these guys. And yet his favorite filmmaker is Louis Mall, which is just so idiosyncratic. And Louis Mall, who, by the way, was. Knew the show because I bumped into him once and he had. He was aware of Northern Exposure, so.

[Jeanine Turner]

How cool. French director, for all those who are wondering. Who.

[Rob Morrow]

Louis. Yeah. Married to Candy Bergen.

[Jeanine Turner]

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Wasn't she then she was married to Mike Nichols. No, no, no, no. Diane Sawyer. Diane Sawyer was married to Mike Michaels. That's right. Super sweet.

[Ann Gordon]

That.

[Jeanine Turner]

That scene. That scene was. Was a lot of fun. I have two funny stories that correlate with this show. So. So the show is, you know, Rick got hit by satellite. What was that this season? Was it.

[Rob Morrow]

Maybe season. The end of season two? Two, Yeah, I think so.

[Jeanine Turner]

And so now this. This malamute shows up, and she lets him come into the house, and he starts doing all of these things that Rick did. He, you know, she fixed him eggs with peppers. He wouldn't eat the peppers. He stretched on the. On the door frame the way Rick used to do. If you're. And she says, if you're Rick, bark three times. And he did. And I have to correlate this with when my father died because, you know, all the ways that we're similar to our characters.

[Ann Gordon]

You know what I mean?

[Rob Morrow]

Sure.

[Jeanine Turner]

But this was years later. My father didn't die till 2014. But when. But a lot of people say. And of course the Native American culture is going to say this, but a lot of people believe when their loved one dies that there's something they see something in nature that they feel is the essence of that potentially that person making. Saying hello or whether.

[Rob Morrow]

Such a beautiful notion.

[Ann Gordon]

Yeah.

[Rob Morrow]

Such a beautiful.

[Jeanine Turner]

Well, it happened with my father. You know, my father was a pilot for. For years in your. You know, Air Force pilot and then pilot for Brandif International. And one day where. I'll make this quick, but one day we're in the backyard. He had just passed, like, a week, and out of the blue came this bluebird. I'd never seen a bluebird in this particular backyard. And. Scrawny little bluebird. And it came up and it sat right on the table with us while we were trying to prepare dinner outside. And then it got up, this little scrawny bluebird and went over when mom was cooking at the barbecue and stood right there, like, right next to my mom on the barbecue while she was cooking barbecue. And then when we sat back down, the bird came back to us and sat right there on the table while we ate. And then the bird went up to the bird bath and started taking a bath. And the really funny thing about that is my mother used to always say, turner, take a bath, because he was. Turner, take a bath. So he goes over the little bird bath. He's taking a bath, and he comes back. And he stayed for, like, two days and went. Whenever I went outside, he would fly this bird right at me, like, right toward my face. I would kind of Duck. It was a little frightening, actually, but. But, you know, we. We. Who knows? And, you know, it's all surrealism, but. But it was sort of like, that's dad. It's dad. It must be dad. This bird is just sitting, having dinner with us. And so that's very similar to what happened with Rick.

[Rob Morrow]

I love that. And I love. You know, once again, I love that. I mean, it's not just the native culture that has those kind of ideas, but. But that we mine the native culture once again, you know, for that aspect of. Of this. This, this story. Mm.

[Jeanine Turner]

Mm. Well, so what did you like about the show, Rob? What were some of your highlights?

[Rob Morrow]

Well, I mean, I did. I really have to say I love the. The film at the end, Ed's film, his tribute to Sicily. And I'm. I was trying to remember who shot it.

[Jeanine Turner]

There was the second unit producer credit I saw.

[Rob Morrow]

Oh, was that it? Huh? But. Cause, like, you know, there was these subjective shots of the camera pointing down at the feet and so they're wearing Ed shoes and stuff, but I. I guess they sent off someone to do it, but they did such a lovely job, you know, capturing aspects. And what I also love is how they. They explored all these people that we didn't Real. We don't really know. These elderly people that live in Sicily.

[Jeanine Turner]

You know, that was very Woody Allen, those shots of all the Native Americans in the window, all the people from the town. That was very Woody Allen.

[Rob Morrow]

Those for sure.

[Jeanine Turner]

Gritty shot headshots, you know.

[Rob Morrow]

Yeah, yeah. And the black and white of it all. So I love that. I loved your. I loved your relationship. I guess I. The montage of what was the song that's playing. Natural Woman is so funny. And also they use. They use music very well. Martin, Bruce Lee, once again showing his talent. But when. When Rick comes in and they playing in the background. My boyfriend's back. My boyfriend's back, and I want you, you know, and then. And then your montage with Natural Woman, Aretha's song, is. Is pretty priceless. And you were so great the way you relate. You know, it's just. You just so want to believe that it's Rick that you. You know, like, there's this moment like they. It was mos. You know, which is what they. No, no dialogue, no sound. It was just music, so you couldn't hear what you were saying. But you were occasionally saying things to Rick and he's.

[Jeanine Turner]

You.

[Rob Morrow]

You kind of. You gave him. You let him have some wine. He was drinking out of the wine. Glass. And then you kind of. You could see. You say something like, that's enough. And I almost think you said, like, you know how you get with red wine or something.

[Jeanine Turner]

It was so fun. I remember filming this episode. There are going to be certain episodes that you're not as clear after 30 years, right? You just go, I kind of. I mean, that's a great scene, but I don't know that I remember filming it. I remember filming this. And I remember. Especially remember. Oh, all of it. It was just so cute. The R. Stool in the bar with all of us and Rick Stool and how everybody believed it but you.

[Rob Morrow]

Right.

[Jeanine Turner]

You know, and. And then Cynthia Shelley has that great line when she goes, oh, I. What you say, what are you gonna do? Get married to, you know, to the dog? Or somebody says that. Shelly says, oh, I love weddings.

[Rob Morrow]

She's so. She so goes along, you know. There's also something interesting about this show. There was no cold opening, which they're often it. You know, usually the cold opening for our audience, if you don't know, is the show just starts cold in the middle. A scene starts, and you don't know anything. And then after that, the end of the scene, the credits come. But in this case, we just start on the credits.

[Jeanine Turner]

Kind of nice, actually.

[Rob Morrow]

Yeah, it was. It was nice. Yeah, it absolutely worked.

[Jeanine Turner]

And. And I thought, you know, working with the. The dog. And I remember the scene where she kicks him out where she's. I remember filming that scene with Nick Mark. I have a clear memory of Nick Mark, and I. And I thought. I kind of had a hard time finding that tone when she finally kicks him out. But in retrospect, when I watch it, I. I was like, oh, okay, you know, it worked, but she kicks. But also all the sound effects that they did with the dog barking and whining and. And the way the dog didn't like Fleischmann.

[Rob Morrow]

And then Fleis means I love. I'm walking around with my hands taped up. I remember shooting. I do remember that. You know, because, you know, what it is, is you're there for. For 12 hours and, you know, you don't want to keep taping the hands over and over. So basically, I. I had no use of my hands for that. That one or two days because they were taped up with. With the dog bites. But it's. It's a funny. It's a funny, funny episode.

[Jeanine Turner]

It was a funny episode. And. And what Anne did with the. What are those things? They're not ostriches, are they?

[Rob Morrow]

Ostriches yeah, they are. Well, they're. They're kind of blue. Ostriches. No, no, they're blue. I think they're blue ostriches. But Anne will tell us that.

[Ann Gordon]

Yeah.

[Rob Morrow]

Should we bring her in?

[Jeanine Turner]

Yes, let's do. Let's do it. Ladies and gentlemen, let me introduce Ann Gordon. Ann Gordon was our animal trainer. We love and adore her for five years on Northern Exposure. And she has a great filmography. Not only does she do Northern Exposure, I have so many memories with Ann Gordon. Because you were there every day. We worked together.

[Rob Morrow]

She did the. The Good Son. She did My own Private Idaho Practical Magic, A River Runs through it, among many others. She did this for 20 years and. Hey, Anne, how are you?

[Ann Gordon]

It's great to see the both of you. It's been way too long. And it's fun to go back through all the memories. I've been watching all your episod, so it's so. It's like, oh, yeah, I remember that.

[Rob Morrow]

I just want to touch on before we jump into it. I know you're doing some interesting. I just love what you're doing now. Can you explain a little bit about what you're doing? Because it's. I think the audiences might dig it and might even come on one of your retreats.

[Ann Gordon]

Well, thanks, Rob. Thanks for the opportunity. So I now lead what I call whale and dolphin wisdom retreats. I take people around the world to connect both physically and spiritually with wild dolphins and whales. So right now I'm literally on a retreat with the orca whales in Washington state, in San Juan Islands. In two weeks, I'll be in Tahiti swimming with humpback whales, with people. And I do this all over the world. It's really magical and life changing for my participants.

[Jeanine Turner]

How would they find you? I think, like, how would they book something with you?

[Ann Gordon]

WhaleWisdomRetreats.com Pretty simple.

[Rob Morrow]

What led you to become an animal trainer? I don't know. How does someone do that?

[Ann Gordon]

My gosh. Well, I'll try to make this brief. I studied biology and animal behavior in university in Washington, and then I worked as a zookeeper. I was actually the first woman to work as a keeper in the carnivore department in Seattle's zoo, Woodland Park Zoo. And then as I worked there, I left the zoo after three years. I don't do routine very well. I like spontaneity. Which film. Perfect for that, for sure. Right. And so then I started working for a trainer in LA for about eight months. Learned a lot, never Got paid and said, okay, next.

[Rob Morrow]

That was like a trainer. For what? For just for people's dogs or.

[Ann Gordon]

No, he had a school. It was wild animals. He had a school to teach people how to train wild animals.

[Rob Morrow]

Aside from movies, why would people train wild animals? Just.

[Ann Gordon]

That's about it. It would be eventually for film work for sure.

[Rob Morrow]

Oh, I see. Okay.

[Ann Gordon]

And then I came back to Washington and I started a educational outreach program where I would get. I had some of my own wild animals. I had a tiger, lion, cougar, wolf, reindeer, raccoon, the whole thing. And I would take them up to schools and do educational.

[Rob Morrow]

You should take them down to Janine's ranchine's. Got all the land.

[Ann Gordon]

Yeah, right.

[Jeanine Turner]

Yes. I don't think I want a tiger, though.

[Ann Gordon]

No, no, no, you do not. And as I was doing that, I realized there was nobody in the Pacific Northwest providing animals for film. So I became a big fish in a small pond of film world and I became the it girl for anything film in Oregon, Washington, in that area. So for many, many years. And that's how we got connected.

[Rob Morrow]

What about this episode? What. What do you. Did you watch it recently?

[Ann Gordon]

I did. I watched it before I came on this retreat because I wanted to refresh myself. And this was. It was, you know, as an animal trainer, we get, you know, you know, I did all the background town dogs, but you're kind of unnoticed, uncredited. You're, you know, it's just. It's background.

[Jeanine Turner]

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[Ann Gordon]

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[Rob Morrow]

Are you. Are you playing me off?

[Ann Gordon]

That's what's happening, right? Okay, give it a try.

[Jeanine Turner]

@Mintmobile.Com Switch upfront payment of $45 per three month plan. $15 per month equivalent required. New customer offer first three months only, then full price plan. Options available. Taxes and fees. Extra C. Mint mob.

[Rob Morrow]

Janine and I always talk about how, you know, you'll be walking by and there'll be a dog and a truck, and it's, you know, and that. That.

[Jeanine Turner]

Crossing the street or whatever it may be, We. We point you out all the time. We've talked about you many times. Or, you know, there'll be, like, a long shot in the background. In the back of a pickup truck is a dog just sitting there. It's pivotal. Pivotal. Organic stuff. Sense of the town.

[Ann Gordon]

Yeah.

[Rob Morrow]

Also, I remember so many times if we'd be, like, either about to start a take or in the middle of a take, and we'd have to hold because the dog walked off its mark. And then Ann would come running into the shot and make the dog stay, and then we would pick up, which is hard to do because you have a rhythm of flow going, as an actor, and. And then you have to kind of pause. But it was all part of the atmosphere. No, no, it was all good.

[Jeanine Turner]

You were. You reminded us this morning. Of course we knew this, but you were. You were the. The actor in the pilot holding the beaver that the beaver had.

[Ann Gordon]

Oh, my gosh.

[Jeanine Turner]

Or something. Talk about that.

[Ann Gordon]

Oh, that was funny because I read that. I got the script right, and I'm reading it, and I see that how it's written for a young teenage girl to carry this beaver and put her hands in its mouth to show Dr. Fleischman the teeth. And I'm like. I said to Tom Leach, producer, I said, you know, that's going to have to be my hands as an insert. I'm not having this actress put their hands in the mouth of a beaver. And they said, well, why don't you just do the whole thing? And I was like, oh, now, animal trainers, most of us on the crew, we don't want to be in front of the camera. I was more terrified of the four lines I had to say with you, Rob, than opening the beaver's mouth. That I know how to do.

[Rob Morrow]

That's funny.

[Jeanine Turner]

You were excellent. You did an excellent job in the pilot, Ann.

[Ann Gordon]

Well, thank you. And the funny thing is, you know, as Josh was directing, and my first line, I said with enthusiasm and feeling like I think his teeth hurt. And Josh says, no, no, no. Just play it flat. Wait, what? Okay.

[Jeanine Turner]

I think it'd be fun to talk about this episode. And the. And the dot. The malamute. Is it a malamute?

[Ann Gordon]

He was a malamute mix. And his name was. Remember his name? Do you remember?

[Jeanine Turner]

Oh, no, I don't.

[Ann Gordon]

Wolfie.

[Jeanine Turner]

Wolfie.

[Rob Morrow]

Well, that's what they call him at the end, right? Oh, no.

[Ann Gordon]

Butchie.

[Rob Morrow]

They call him. No, they call him Butchie.

[Ann Gordon]

Right, right.

[Jeanine Turner]

Yes, the traitor.

[Rob Morrow]

Which is a great moment, by the way. The moment at the end. The moment at the end when the dot. When the woman comes to retrieve her. Her dog. And Butchy, Rick looks first looks at you and then looks at the. And doesn't know which way to go.

[Ann Gordon]

That was funny.

[Jeanine Turner]

It's like, whoops, I'm caught. Just which was the parallel to their. Their own real life. But he was a great, great dog. And all that training, the looks. He had to talk to us a little bit about that. I mean, the looks and the scratch. Be on the scratching post and the little barks. And of course, we did a lot. I'm sure a lot of that was in post in the wines. But, man, he was a he. I guess he was a wonderful dog.

[Ann Gordon]

He was a great dog. And I mean, that's an animal trainer's dream, to have the dog be a major character. Right. And to actually play a part. And it was a. He was a dog I've used before. I didn't own him, but he was a great dog, and he had a lot of training on him already. And then I spent a lot of time before training specifically for the behaviors that were required in this one. And I remember the producers were a little nervous because I only had one dog. I didn't have a backup dog. And that was a little bit of a challenge. Especially Rob. I don't know if you remember the bite scenes. I mean, he was a sweet, sweet dog. And so I knew the bite scenes. He didn't want to bite. Right. And we did that scene like the last scene of the night, and he'd been working all day, and it was. That was a tough one to get. But editors are always the animal trainer's best friend. They can make or break us.

[Rob Morrow]

You get the script, you know, it's not. You say you have a lot of time, but maybe you're getting the script, what, seven, ten days in advance.

[Ann Gordon]

Go right to work.

[Rob Morrow]

Right. And you. What do you have, like a Rolodex of. Of animals that you can call if you don't and you own. You owned a lot of pets that we used.

[Ann Gordon]

I did. Remember Scout, the big gray.

[Jeanine Turner]

Scout.

[Ann Gordon]

Scruffy guy.

[Rob Morrow]

Right.

[Ann Gordon]

Scout Magpie was your favorite. The border collie. And then Flapjack, the little Jack Russell. So, yeah, all those guys. I had a bunch of my own. And then A ranger, Mingo, those guys. And then I also had let people, almost like an agency, I would let people list their well trained animals with me so that I had a broader pool to pull from.

[Jeanine Turner]

Like the bear.

[Ann Gordon]

Like the bear, exactly.

[Rob Morrow]

You get the script and you're thinking, okay, I gotta do, I gotta get this dog, you know, up to speed in, in within a week. And I do remember many moments of looking over at you and, and the stress on your face because the animal was not doing what it was supposed to and the clock was ticking and people were, you know, the producers are angry. It's, it's hard pressure.

[Ann Gordon]

It's tough because here's the thing with animals, the directors get to direct all of you actors directly. But with an animal actor, they have to go through the interpreter, the trainer, right. And so it's a little frustrating for directors. And some of them, Nick was great, but not all understand animals or give us what we need to make it work, right? Give us like one run through and then we can make it easier. So. But this Nick was easy and I did discuss with him ahead of time. You know, this is how it's written, this is how I think we can do it. So we worked it out ahead of time and then I would train for that.

[Jeanine Turner]

How did you get him to get. Put his ears back? I mean, how do you train a dog, you know, because he had to do that little growl and have his ears kind of go flat. How do you do that?

[Ann Gordon]

It's funny. You can play with a dog if it's a dog that you know well. And I did know Wolfie quite well. I've worked with him many times that I can pretend like I'm mad at him or. But it's all a game, right? And I can, I can use my tone of voice and he will react. You know, it's like when you have a dog at home and you go. When I go for a walk and they get all excited, right? And you're like, oh man, Wolfie. And it's like, okay, you bring your energy down, their energy goes down.

[Jeanine Turner]

Oh, he gets concerned. Well, you know, I know that the montage of. What is it? I'm natural. I'm a natural woman. You know, the entire natural woman, right? I know that's one of Joshua Brand's favorite all time scenes. He just loved that moment. And we. I remember that. I remember the. I could feel, I can feel the blanket and the picnic. I remember the frisbee. But see, I love animals so much and I've always Dogs. And I have a ranch. I think it was very organic for me to just absolutely love this dog.

[Rob Morrow]

And we look so comfortable with that. That dog. I mean, the way you let it lick your face and, you know, you were just so comfortable.

[Jeanine Turner]

It was great fun. But he did nip me somehow. He didn't bite me, but he. Do you remember that? He nipped me somehow. And I remember asking you. He does have a rabies shot. Right, Right, I remember. That's all I was gonna do. He doesn't have a rabies shot. I asked you like five times. He does have a rabies. Okay, I'm gonna let it go. But it wasn't like he bit me, but I think maybe he was jumping for something and the first of that at all.

[Ann Gordon]

Yeah, he was, remember? Yeah, I do remember because it was an easy scene for me. Because you were just playing with him. Right. And he loved the Frisbee, so I'm sure he was just going for the frisbee while you had it. And I'm sure it was just an accidental meeting of the teeth on skin when he was really trying to get the Frisbee. So it was not in behind the.

[Jeanine Turner]

Scenes story for you.

[Ann Gordon]

Right.

[Rob Morrow]

Where'd you shoot that? That didn't look like Roslyn. It looked more like closer to the stages. Do you remember any, by any chance?

[Ann Gordon]

Oh, you know, I don't remember either.

[Rob Morrow]

Right. It just looked like it looked too suburban.

[Ann Gordon]

It was a park. I don't remember. Gosh, I don't remember.

[Jeanine Turner]

No. No clue. Well, you did. You did a great job. And the dog did a great job. Little wolfie, didn't you do a good job? Such a good boy. And I, I just. I love the whole storyline of everyone believing that it was actually Rick that came back. Except Fleischman, of course.

[Ann Gordon]

That was fun.

[Jeanine Turner]

And of course, you and I, as animal lovers, we certainly see the souls.

[Ann Gordon]

Of course, of course.

[Rob Morrow]

Which I love. You say, you say Janine, you say you. You deflect me. You, you skeptical, rational, imperial, know it all.

[Jeanine Turner]

I was going to write that down, so I'm glad you did. And you know what was fun? It was kind of an offhanded comment. You. We had Rob, so many scenes in the street where we met right in the middle of the street. Remember that? We had so many iconic scenes in the middle of the street where it was. We walked and then we would turn and then the camera would be on this side on this, and camera would be on the other side. But we're eating popcorn. You have Your Milk Duds. But I love how that was just kind of thrown away, you know, it was just sort of as I'm walking in. But say that line again, though, because it's really great. What was it?

[Rob Morrow]

You. You. Because you're you. I'm. I'm doubting that, you know, that this was Rick and all. And you say you. Oh, yeah. Okay, well, you're. You're skeptical, rational imperial. Know it all.

[Jeanine Turner]

Skeptical, rational imperial. Know it all. That's right there with Filanodius. I'll have to write that one down. That's fun. Writing again was. Was really terrific. And you know, we didn't talk about. Now we need to talk about the whole scenes with Marilyn and Bear, Barry Corbin, Maurice with the ostriches or whatever they were. I mean, though, that was hilarious and the way they would. But I noticed, you know, when you're filming for those who aren't in the biz, you do wide shots and close up shots and cowboys, which are at the hips where the holsters used to go. You know, westerns. So they call it the cowboy shot. There are all these different shots, and in every shot you had them running back and forth, you know, doing. Doing really funny things. And that scene with Corbett seemed very improvisational. When he's feeding them the lettuce at the end, he was having a good time with that. But what were they, by the way? Were they ostriches or.

[Ann Gordon]

Yes, they were ostriches. And when I got the script for the ostrich, I'm like, okay, this is a challenge. And what I really didn't want is to have to haul ostriches somewhere, get them all stressed out. And so we actually went to where the ostriches lived.

[Rob Morrow]

Ah, interesting. That's so smart.

[Ann Gordon]

Yeah. And filmed it there. Look. Fortunately, it worked as a location. And I have a couple funny stories about those scenes. One, I don't know if you guys remember, but Barry Corbin has a phobia of birds.

[Rob Morrow]

Oh, I didn't know that.

[Ann Gordon]

He came to me because he and I were friends, like you, Janine and Barry. We all bonded over our horses, right? And Barry came to me, he says, ann, I hate birds. My grandfather's rooster attacked me as a three year old. I hate all birds. Poor guy had to act like it was no big deal. I mean, that's true acting right there.

[Jeanine Turner]

How did you get the. How did you get them, the ostriches, to go back and forth like that in the scene? It was. They were hilarious.

[Ann Gordon]

They were following food. They were following food. And here's a funny lettuce.

[Rob Morrow]

Let's just explain that. So basically, you're off camera, correct. With like, what? Stick?

[Ann Gordon]

Food Bucket. Yeah, food.

[Rob Morrow]

What do they eat? What do ostriches eat?

[Ann Gordon]

There's all kinds of produce. Soft vegetables, the lettuce, different fruits, grapes, melons, things like that. So. And the owners would be on one side, I'd be on the other, and we'd go back and forth. Now, here's another funny story. So John Corbett is. I love his spontaneity, you know. You guys know that he's. He's amazing. And he was talking to the owners who were a little starstruck, and they said. He says, can I go in with them? And they're like, sure, of course Corbett said that. Right? Of course he did. And I'm freaking out because one kick from an ostrich can disembowel a lion. And I am not going to be responsible for injuring any actor. And so John goes running in there, and he's waving his hands and arms like he's an ostrich circling in the. And I yelled in my loudest stop. A tiger in its tracks. John, get out of there right now. And he just froze. And the producers looked at me like, what did she just say to him? And John came out and I said, look to the producers. I'm saving his life. He should not be in there. That is too dangerous. No, Right, right.

[Jeanine Turner]

Nick can disembowel a lion.

[Ann Gordon]

Yeah.

[Rob Morrow]

Amazing.

[Ann Gordon]

I wasn't gonna put John in that. And I was like, oh, my gosh.

[Jeanine Turner]

No ostriches out here at my ranch for me.

[Rob Morrow]

By the way, I think these scenes are the most. Elaine. Elaine. Marilyn has spoken in. In the show to date. Right. I mean, she's never had scenes. This is where they. You can sense they're really starting to trust her. They gave her a storyline. I think that's the first, really, at least where she has dialogue.

[Jeanine Turner]

Yeah. And then the dinner with the long table.

[Rob Morrow]

Right.

[Jeanine Turner]

You know, and there. There's Maurice again, cooking this delicious meal and telling everybody how he cooks. I love that aspect, that juxtaposition of. Of Mott machismo. And then he loves to cook. And then he walked down the very, very, very end of the table. And. And of course, Mary's like, sure. Is that she talks about the wine. She knew all about the wine. I think that's something Rob and Anne, I really love about the show, which was in the writing, of course, but the way. The way Ed Chigliak knew all those Great directors. And then he goes into this Ruthanne store. And Ruthanne knew all about them as well, and made comments. Esoteric, sort of philosophical. Philosophical conversations. And. And then Marilyn knows all about the wine. And I just love the wisdom that everybody just sort of quirkily just manages to have in their back pocket.

[Rob Morrow]

It's funny, you know, the. The. The way the show, you know, the characters are often unexpected amalgams of things you don't, you know, they. They play with conventions. You know, the fact that this kind of rural, you know, uneducated character in Ed would be so versed with world cinema, you know, not just. Not just, you know, Hollywood, but the world cinema, you know. And Ruthan's, you know, references to, you know, and Ruthanne is a, you know, cinemaphile as well. I just. Those bring, you know, they open up the world so much, which I think is one of the things people love about the show.

[Jeanine Turner]

I love the. That Woody Allen sent him a script, you know, a page from the script with all of his personal notes. And I have a funny seg story about that. I used. I was. I was famous for sending Christmas cards. Did I ever tell you this story?

[Rob Morrow]

I'm not sure which. Go ahead.

[Jeanine Turner]

Okay. Okay. With Martin Scorsese. And it's very. It parallels the letters that. That Ed Chigliak received from all the directors. I would always send letters and Christmas cards to directors and people that, you know, and I would write letters to Martin Scorsese and say, that was a great movie. Da, da, da. So when we were nominated for our Golden Globes and showed up at the Hilton, wherever it was, Beverly Hills Hilton, I walked in and there was Martin Scorsese. And so I didn't know if he would know me from Adam. And I walked up to Martin Scorsese. I said, martin Scorsese, Hi, Jeanine Turner. I send you Christmas cards.

[Rob Morrow]

He was like, security, security.

[Jeanine Turner]

He was so sweet, though, because he looked at me and he said, yes, yes. And then later he. He wrote letters back to me. Thank you so much for your nice letter and this and that. So it was a little bit, you know, reality versus creativity.

[Rob Morrow]

You were pen pals with Martin Scorsese is what you're telling us. I never heard that. That's so cool. You know, one thing I just want to point out, I'm reading a book right now that Dan Attias, who directed multiple episodes of Northern Exposure, is a great director, went on to direct the all whatever was great in tv. Since Northern Exposure, he's directed on it, and he Wrote a book on directing, which I'm reading now. And he talks about Northern Exposure and he's, he says, just, you know, he says it's one of the best shows, you know, in, in. In modern television. And one of the things he says, Janine, which I thought was really interesting that Josh said to him, was that Northern Exposure to. Is a confrontation with the other. Right. So. So, you know, we're talking about the juxtaposition of the. You know, that you're talking about the aspects of characters that are different. It's, it's. That's what distinguishes it is always going against the other. What, what. What's the other? What's the. You know, the, the.

[Jeanine Turner]

The.

[Rob Morrow]

The thing that's not expected. I just love that synop, you know, that, that, that.

[Jeanine Turner]

Yeah.

[Rob Morrow]

That distilling. Distilling of. Of what it was. Confrontation. Other.

[Jeanine Turner]

That can mean a lot of things. It could mean absolutely characters. It could mean with actual character. To character or within our own souls or.

[Rob Morrow]

That's why, that's why it becomes a theme that they can work with that. If you look at, you know, if you look at all the episodes and all the scenes, you'll see that kind of going on. You know, Joel with the dog, you know, you know, Ed with the. With making movies, you with. With. With this kind of metaphysical notion of Rick Spirit. Confrontation with other.

[Jeanine Turner]

Yeah, well. Or with Barry Corbin. I mean, Maurice trying to overtake the ostriches real life. And, And Marilyn says they don't like you.

[Rob Morrow]

Right. And how good is she? She's so good, man. She's just so. I just watch her and I do. She's just so present and doesn't try. I mean, she. She makes all of us act. All of us actors, you know, have to not act.

[Ann Gordon]

She had this quiet wisdom that just came in.

[Jeanine Turner]

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[Rob Morrow]

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[Jeanine Turner]

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[Rob Morrow]

There let's talk about Morty the Moose.

[Ann Gordon]

Oh, there we go.

[Jeanine Turner]

Yes, yes, I have to talk about Morty the moose.

[Rob Morrow]

So Morty the Moose opens the is in the credit sequence. Everyone all around the world asks me about that moose. Let's hear about how that came about and what how you, I know you can't train a moose.

[Ann Gordon]

I remember that well, kind of. So, yeah, so again, one of my first meetings about the show and they said, hey, we'd love to have a moose walk around for the opening credits. And so I get on the phone, I didn't know where to find a moose. So I called my Hollywood colleagues and said, where do I get a moose? And they all said, oh, we get that call once in a while. It just can't be done. Well, I'm the kind of person where if you tell me no, I'm going to say, well, how? How can I make it happen? I'll make it happen. So I called and I called and I called and I called and I found out that Washington State University had a nutritional research program for moose because moose unfortunately don't live long in captivity and nobody's figured out their dietary needs. And so they had this orphan moose out of Alaska. And by the time we called, he was one year old, so he was a yearling just starting to grow his little antlers and we brought him over and we fenced off the entire town and then Just let him loose and we pulled him or attracted him around town with maple willow branches and bananas. He loved bananas. So when you see him looking at the different, you know, the different antlers on the walls, it's me shaking the willow or a banana on one side and then the owner on the other side. So that was fun.

[Rob Morrow]

I'd love to see the raw footage of that. It'd be fun. All that. See you running into the shot and all that.

[Jeanine Turner]

How did you make sure the moose didn't decide to stampede the crew?

[Ann Gordon]

He was a. He was a bottle raised orphan, so he was raised by humans. So he was very. Not tame, but very calm around people. Very used to being around people. But we also gave a crew like, okay, guys, watch where you're moving equipment. No fast movements, you know, nothing surprising. And by the end, everybody was totally relaxed. He was totally calm.

[Rob Morrow]

It also looked like a lot of long lenses. So it didn't look like the cameras were that close.

[Ann Gordon]

Not until we did those close ups, which we did the last at the beginning. Yes. Long longer lenses. But then he was just so calm. And they were able to get the close ups. Not far at all.

[Rob Morrow]

Yeah, well, talk about iconic.

[Jeanine Turner]

Right in front of the Fleischmann's, you know, office too. It was right.

[Ann Gordon]

Yep.

[Jeanine Turner]

Right around there. He walks around the corner. It was perfect.

[Rob Morrow]

You don't remember how long that took, do you? Like how many hours or something like that?

[Ann Gordon]

Oh, well, we had. It was. We had to be. It was tricky because we did fence off the whole town, which meant we had to fence off the highway that ran through and so.

[Rob Morrow]

Which only went to the. I mean, and the townspeople hated us already at the beginning. They really didn't like us. So that must have really pissed them off.

[Ann Gordon]

Yeah, they didn't like that. So we could only do it for certain hours. So we started like right at daybreak and then we went. I think we could only do it till about 9 o' clock and then we went into the close ups. So that was. But it took, I would say five, six hours to do the whole thing, right.

[Rob Morrow]

Yeah, well, that's right. The light's so pretty.

[Jeanine Turner]

Yeah, it is. That's not cheap to fence the whole town. No, because I have these. Those things out here, you know, the little portable gates or whatever you might be doing. That's a big effort.

[Ann Gordon]

It was a big effort for opening credits, but, man, did it pay off. Because every. Like when people find out that I did the show as well, like you, Rob, all they ask is, did you do the moose. I said, yes. His name was Mort.

[Rob Morrow]

And Morty passed away some years ago. Is that correct?

[Ann Gordon]

He lived about four years or so. It was just. There was something missing in the diet that we had not figured out yet.

[Rob Morrow]

Let's kind of just do a broad brush of all the episodes, if you remember, like which ones jump out at you as tricky and difficult or fun that you were involved in.

[Jeanine Turner]

Anything with a bear.

[Rob Morrow]

Oh, yeah, the bear's a great one.

[Ann Gordon]

Remember we had the bear. We had a couple different bears. And I brought in the bears from the Olympic game farm, and they had done all the old Disney shows way back when. And the bear trainer. I don't know if you remember or you guys were around, but we had. Remember that circus bear we had in the brick in the bar?

[Rob Morrow]

Yeah.

[Ann Gordon]

Right. And the trainer was this tiny little Brazilian guy named Mourinho that would handle this gigantic bear and lead him around with canned peaches and heavy sweet syrup and donuts and that bear. And then when we did Jesse the Bear out in the woods, they would put an electric fence around so that the bear thought he was enclosed. But it really wasn't an electric fence. It was just a thread, just a string. And one of my jobs was because I wasn't handling the bear specifically. I just arranged it and coordinated it. But the trainer said, ann, if the bear comes too close, just grab the string and yell hot. And the bear will back up. And I'm with the string between the camera and the bear. And it's ironic to think this gigantic bear that could take us all out was afraid of this little string that he thought was electric.

[Rob Morrow]

Huh? It's just like Pavlo is just trained.

[Ann Gordon]

It's just trained that. It was amazing that that's.

[Jeanine Turner]

That's. We do that a lot at ranches. You can. You have like.

[Ann Gordon]

Right, yeah, exactly.

[Jeanine Turner]

Around. And you don't do it very often unless you have a pro kind of a problem situation. But yeah, yeah. Hot. He knew what hot meant.

[Ann Gordon]

He knew what hot meant. At one point, he did come, so I grabbed it and yelled hot. And he backed up.

[Jeanine Turner]

Wow. So that was with Jesse the bear. And then also there was a bear the bear comes back to dance with felt, falls in love with Maggie o'. Connell. So I had a bear scene. I remember.

[Ann Gordon]

Yep.

[Jeanine Turner]

I was pretty.

[Ann Gordon]

I remember that as well. Yeah. You were not super close because we had the. There was a shape shifting element going on there. Right. And so, yeah, so, like, the man would walk out and then you would look out of the Cave. And there would go the bear walking away.

[Jeanine Turner]

Right.

[Rob Morrow]

I remember we just would. I just remember I have these images of walking on the soundstage, and the light was dark. You know, on the soundstage, the light. The only light is where the set is. Everything else falls off, so it gets kind of dark. And I remember there'd be a cage right off the set where the bear would be. And we were told, you know, and it was like on every day before, we'd get the call sheet that say, you know, when the bear's there, everyone has to be quiet. No one on the set that doesn't need to be there. And it was just this sense of, you know, of fear permeated. Because then they'd walk it onto the set and we'd all be there.

[Jeanine Turner]

I don't remember the bear. Pauline's bar.

[Ann Gordon]

I don't remember that he was in the bar. That was. That was a little scary. But that bear was. I don't remember the episode, which name it was or when, but it was. It was when the circus came to town. And he did have a muzzle season.

[Jeanine Turner]

I think that's. Oh, yeah, yeah. That's coming. That's coming up this season. Well, any other. Any other animals? Because we did so many. You had horses, you had dogs, you had birds. What. What else?

[Ann Gordon]

There was porcupines, there was goats. Remember, we had goats in your cabin there, Rob, one time. And we had. Remember? And Sophie Sanderson's dogs all end up in your cabin. And the horses, Remember the horses in the snow.

[Rob Morrow]

That was so beautiful, that episode.

[Ann Gordon]

That was. That was a tough one, you know, keeping the horses warm and working in that thick snow. But why?

[Rob Morrow]

The horses don't like snow.

[Ann Gordon]

Well, they do, but you have to make sure they're warm and, you know, keeping. You know, you can't just, like, throw them out there and expect them to be okay. But any horses. With Barry, I never worry, because he was so good with horses. But there's a funny story. John Corbett will probably hate this one. When we did the Sicily and we went back in time, right, when the whole town was the origin story.

[Rob Morrow]

The origin story of the town.

[Ann Gordon]

And we had a lot of horses. And John was on my horse. Who was this? Remember Barney, Janine. I did. At the barn, Remember? Sweet, sweet quarter horse, babysitter horse. Anybody could ride this horse. And anytime I get an actor that I have to put on a horse, I always say I always want to see them on the horse before we shoot. Because actors always say they can ride a horse, but they can't always. And John was like, no, no, no. I know how to ride a horse. And he gets up there, and they would rehearse the scene, and everything would go well. And then before the camera would start rolling, they go to shoot it, and Barney would start moving forward. And John, of course, blamed the horse. This stupid horse. He keeps moving before action. And so I had to be very diplomatic, and I went to John and I said, you know, I'm not an actor, but if I was just before the camera rolls, I might tense up a little bit. And if your legs tense up, the horse is gonna feel that and it's gonna start.

[Rob Morrow]

Wow. That's so interesting. Wow.

[Ann Gordon]

I knew that's what was happening, but of course, John wouldn't admit to it.

[Rob Morrow]

I don't get tense. I don't get tense.

[Ann Gordon]

Right. And it's not even a nervous. I mean, it's just, okay, I'm on. Right?

[Rob Morrow]

Yeah, of course.

[Ann Gordon]

It's Is just normal. But. But we got through it.

[Rob Morrow]

Right.

[Jeanine Turner]

They feel everything. They're such sensitive creatures, and they're very. They're very emotional creatures, and they're intuitive and they feel everything.

[Ann Gordon]

Exactly.

[Jeanine Turner]

That's like my Labrador. I. She. She. This Labrador that I have is sort of trained from a breed of emotional support. And I've never had a dog. I've had so many dogs that I've loved. I've lived forever and everything, but she will look me right in the eye and hold the look. And I'll look at her and she'll hold the look, and she'll hold the look forever, and I'll hold the look. And she waits for me. And if I, like, lift an eyebrow, she'll be like, does that mean I can come over? It's amazing how intuitive they can be.

[Ann Gordon]

Yeah.

[Jeanine Turner]

How what? You know, you were really put to the test, Ann. There were a lot of animals. We really kept you busy.

[Ann Gordon]

You did? I worked on almost every episode. It was.

[Rob Morrow]

It was true. Every episode. I didn't realize.

[Jeanine Turner]

Almost.

[Ann Gordon]

Almost. There were a couple. I remember in, like, season two or three, I got a script, and there was no animals. And I was like, what am I gonna do? Wait? I'm disappointed. And one of the crew says, anne, you should go on vacation. You've been working hard. Take it as a break. And I did.

[Jeanine Turner]

You did. Then you had to leave. You had to find someone to take care of all your animals when you.

[Ann Gordon]

Well, that was the hard part. Yeah, always. Because I had. That's. You know, you. You've been to my Place where I had all the animals in the backyard.

[Rob Morrow]

How many animals do you have these days?

[Ann Gordon]

Oh, I have none.

[Jeanine Turner]

I know.

[Rob Morrow]

Wow.

[Ann Gordon]

Well, that.

[Jeanine Turner]

That's the reason you can travel away around to the various resorts.

[Ann Gordon]

Exactly. I travel so much. I'm home for. I was home for a week before I came here. I'll be home for two weeks, and then I'm gone for three weeks. So now I just can't have an animal around. But I miss having a dog or a cat around.

[Jeanine Turner]

I've got four in my bedroom right now.

[Rob Morrow]

Oh, what do you have in there?

[Jeanine Turner]

I have Tinker and Bell. They're sisters. They're half poodles, half Chihuahuas. They look like thing one and thing two. They're about 14 years old. And I groom them now, so they really look like Thing one and Thing two. And then I have my Labrador, and then I have my rescue kitty.

[Ann Gordon]

Kitty.

[Jeanine Turner]

So.

[Rob Morrow]

Yeah, that's right. So, Ann, anything else we haven't touched on that that you can think of?

[Ann Gordon]

I love the writing of the show. I'm just gonna go off animals for a minute, but I love the writing. I love the spiritual aspect and the. The deepness to every single episode was just something to be proud of, because as an animal trainer, I've worked on shows everywhere where I'm just like, the background. I'm there on a whole movie for one day, or I'm training the lead character, everything in between. And a lot of times we're just like, animal trainer. Yeah, just go away. But this one was something I really felt proud of. And I cannot say that about a lot of the shows I worked on.

[Jeanine Turner]

And, you know, to your credit, I watched some show. Random show one time, and it was so obvious that the dog that they were. They were kind of have the treat in their hand or. And then I heard the. I heard the gal and character say settle. And I'm like, okay. Like, the fourth wall. Like, I know that's a training thing. And you just didn't sense that. Whether we were working with the animals ourselves, like, all the. All the dog scenes that I. That I did when Rick came back or whatever it may be, I never sensed that they were trained animals. They've. They just felt so organic. You. You never felt.

[Ann Gordon]

Thank you.

[Jeanine Turner]

Any. Any of the. You didn't really see any of the signaling that sometimes is obvious. So you did. You did a wonderful job. You were a big. You. And all the animals are just a big part of the richness in the character of the show, wouldn't you say? Rob.

[Rob Morrow]

Absolutely. You know, but you know what I was just thinking? None of the characters on the show had animals.

[Ann Gordon]

No, other than that ostrich thing.

[Rob Morrow]

Like, we never had. Like, you never had a dog in your house or mine or. It's funny. Yeah. I mean, there were so many random ones around the town, but none of us, I guess it just. It became complicated.

[Ann Gordon]

Yeah, it can. But I. You know, back to what you said, Janine, and thank you both for the kind words, and that is that my job as an animal trainer. I know that sometimes animal trainers can have a bad rep because a lot of people get into working with animals because they're not good people. People. Right. And so for me, I love. I love being with people. And animals taught me how to be good with people. And my goal as an animal trainer was to make it easy for you to work with the animals. I didn't want to take over you guys. I didn't want to compete with you guys. I wanted to complement and make your job easier. And we would train the dogs to look at the actors. Not look it. Look just off camera at me. I wanted them to make eye contact with you.

[Jeanine Turner]

And that's hard to do because they know you're right there. I had a Labrador before this one. Her name was Chubbs. Believe it or not, I didn't name her that. And I was directing my short film and I had the character that was running through the woods, and I would put. I'd put my Chubbs with her, and Chubs would just run with her and stay with her. She wasn't trained or anything. And then we went out to the pasture, way out in the. You know, and there was a pond. And I thought it would be great if, you know, she literally, without any training, I would say, action. She would go be with her. The actress followed her around the pond, got into the water, got out, ran after her. I'm like, wow, that's just.

[Ann Gordon]

That's awesome.

[Jeanine Turner]

That's crazy because I didn't train her or anything. So it's. Animals are. They just have beautiful spirits. Animals are us.

[Rob Morrow]

Animals are us. I think that's a good place to wind it down. And. And you were just such a great presence on the show and you did such a great work and made us all look good. And I'm glad you're doing something interesting. I'm fascinated with what you're. What you're doing now. Your retreats, they just sound great.

[Ann Gordon]

Super fun. Thank you so much for having us. Having me. It's been so fun.

[Rob Morrow]

Our pleasure.

[Jeanine Turner]

Fun. Isn't it fun, Rob? It's so fun. So cool. When, when, when the guests come on and we just. We haven't seen so many of you in about 30 years. It's sort of like Monty hall who. You know what's behind curtain one, right?

[Rob Morrow]

It's truly. It's truly one of the gifts of doing the podcast is just getting together. You know, there was such love between so many, so many of us on the show. And, you know, the way showbiz is, you go your separate ways, but it's nice to be able to catch up with people, and you in particular. So. So thanks for coming.

[Jeanine Turner]

Yes, thank you, Ann. And maybe someday I'll come swim with the dolphins with you.

[Ann Gordon]

Oh, I would love that. That would be super fun. You're always welcome.

[Jeanine Turner]

Oh, that's so fun. I love dolphins. All right, well, that's it for the show today. We will see you again next week. And we're signing off from o' Connell and Fleischman.

[Rob Morrow]

Actually, I think it's. It should be Fleischman o'. Connell.

[Jeanine Turner]

In your dreams, Fleischman.

[Ann Gordon]

Northern Disclosure is a production with Evergreen.

[Jeanine Turner]

Podcasts and executive produced by Paul Anderson.

[Ann Gordon]

And Scott McCarthy for Workhouse Media.