S3E6: “Roots” with Jessica Lundy

Summary

Northern Disclosure – S3E6 “Roots” with Jessica Lundy

Podcast: Northern Disclosure (Evergreen Podcasts)
Date: October 14, 2025
Hosts: Rob Morrow (Joel Fleischman), Janine Turner (Maggie O’Connell)
Guest: Jessica Lundy (Elaine, Joel’s ex-fiancée)

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Episode Overview

This episode of Northern Disclosure revisits Season 3, Episode 6 of Northern Exposure, titled "Roots." Rob and Janine welcome Jessica Lundy, who played Joel’s ex-fiancée Elaine, to discuss her memorable return to Cicely, behind-the-scenes dynamics, and the episode’s unique blend of humor, vulnerability, and the show’s signature quirky warmth. The hosts and guest reflect on character arcs, on-set stories, and the enduring legacy of the series.

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Key Discussion Points and Insights

1. Episode Context & Creator Credits

• Episode Details: "Roots" is S3E6 (or S3E7, depending on the source), written by Dennis Koenig and directed by Sandy Smolin [03:00].
• Synopsis Recap: Joel’s ex-fiancée Elaine, now a widow, visits Cicely. Maggie finds herself unintentionally playing matchmaker while Chris confronts dreams of Africa with Bernard; Adam takes a job for insurance [03:40].

2. Revisiting the Character of Elaine

• Jessica’s Return: Jessica Lundy recalls the challenge and excitement of revisiting Elaine, especially bringing depth and somberness compared to her earlier, more comedic turn [08:35].
• Creating Chemistry: Both Rob and Jessica discuss instantly clicking on set, which translated into believable relationship history [16:53].
• Notable Scene – The Goodbye: Jessica highlights the emotional impact of the scene at the end of "Russian Flu" and surprise at Elaine’s storyline in "Roots"—remarriage to an older judge [18:04].

3. Thematic Layers & Storyline Analysis

• Maggie’s Jealousy, Joel’s Vulnerability: The episode explores a subtler, more nuanced dynamic between Maggie and Joel, with both characters showing vulnerability [06:00, 12:56].
• “You gave us back our past”: One of the episode’s most poignant lines, reflecting on reconciliation and the gift of being able to reclaim positive memories after loss [24:44].
• Chris/Bernard Dream Sequence: Hosts praise the exploration of brotherhood, the collective unconscious, and how these dream sequences brought philosophical dimension and joy to the series [05:00, 54:07].

4. Behind-the-Scenes Stories

• Costume & Wardrobe: Janine and Jessica share stories about wardrobe, including behind-the-scenes issues with bras and character authenticity [09:43–12:57].
  • Quote: "Maggie probably wouldn't wear a bra. ...Then they brought me in the office and said, you have to wear a bra." – Janine Turner [10:55]
• Improvisation & Direction: Discussion of improvisational moments on set—and how the show mostly kept to the script, but occasionally longed for more improvisation [45:27–47:05].
• Night Shoots: Recalling the unique, grueling, yet sometimes magical experience of shooting at night [55:48–57:47].

5. Changing Television Industry

• The Actor’s Journey: Jessica, Rob, and Janine reflect on shifting industry norms, including actors moving into writing and directing, and the luxury of producing 22–25 episodes a season [27:35–51:07].
• The Streaming Era: The hosts lament the current era’s shorter seasons and diluted productions, expressing gratitude for the opportunity to develop characters across multiple seasons [48:05–51:18].
• Audience Evolution: They celebrate how new generations continue to find and love Northern Exposure through streaming [51:18].

6. The Magic of "Northern Exposure"

• Timelessness and Tone: The group agrees that, unlike many shows from the era, “Northern Exposure” remains more timeless and relevant, due to its unique setting, universal themes, and lack of heavy-handed politics [33:16–34:56, 52:04–52:52].
• Signature Touches: Call-outs to Shelley’s iconic thematic earrings and the elaborate dream sequences that became a hallmark of the show [53:04–54:07].

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

| Timestamp | Speaker | Quote | |-----------|----------------|-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------| | 04:23 | Rob Morrow | "All the stuff with the African dance and the little subtle moments between you and I... it really plays on Maggie's jealousy of possibly not being able to have a relationship that possibly might happen between Joel and her." | | 10:21 | Janine Turner | "Maggie probably wouldn't wear a bra... Then they brought me in the office and said, you have to wear a bra." | | 13:21 | Rob Morrow | "I love when I say, when you come in with your hand and I say, don't join me, rap, and you're like, tie a knot around it. Tie a rope around it. Fleischman. I don't even know what that means, but it was funny." | | 16:53 | Rob Morrow | "You and I connected right away. ... As soon as you showed up, we just kind of got into step and it was easy." | | 24:44 | Rob Morrow | "You gave us back our past. What a great idea. That you can lose your past. It can be taken away...and then to restore it...Northern Exposure gives gifts, little philosophical gifts to people to think about." | | 34:25 | Janine Turner | "Because it's Alaska, right? And it's like you could still picture people wearing high waisted jeans and boots and big coats in Alaska. ... It's more utilitarian than it is fashion." | | 54:07 | Rob Morrow | "That whole storyline ... about the notion of the collective unconscious and how DNA is shared and how siblings have similar thought patterns or connections... it speaks to some kind of transcendent aspect of existence." |

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Timestamps for Key Segments

• Opening & Episode Context – 00:55–04:23
• Director/writer insights, character arcs – 04:23–06:48
• Truck symbolism and filming logistics – 06:17–07:49
• Bar scene: Maggie & Adam hangover, music absence – 08:03–08:32
• Wardrobe and network standards anecdotes – 09:43–12:57
• Jessica Lundy joins, chemistry & casting – 14:24–16:53
• Elaine’s arc, emotional moments, and notable scenes – 17:06–24:44
• Modern TV production vs 1990s—change in industry – 27:19–51:18
• Cultural timelessness, audience evolution – 33:16–34:56, 51:18–52:52
• Dream sequences and behind-the-scenes production – 54:07–56:15
• Night shoot stories, managing exhaustion – 55:48–58:06
• Closing reflections, series legacy – 59:03–end

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Additional Behind-the-Scenes Highlights

• Wardrobe Easter Eggs: Shelley’s plate-and-silverware earrings paying off the Adam cuisine subplot [53:04].
• Show’s Legacy: Hosts express gratitude for long-term character evolution and the ongoing affection from new viewers [51:07–51:40].
• Working with Directors & Crew: Fond memories of directors like Sandy Smolin and various DPs, and the camaraderie and struggle of low-budget beginnings that evolved with the series’ success [28:53–39:49].

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Tone & Chemistry

Throughout the episode, the hosts’ banter is warm, nostalgic, and peppered with trademark humor. Their genuine affection for each other and their guest, as well as their pride in the show’s offbeat charm and emotional honesty, is present throughout.

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Conclusion

This episode of Northern Disclosure offers a heartfelt and humorous deep dive into "Roots," spotlighting Jessica Lundy’s complex guest role, the show’s blend of comedy and poignancy, and enduring industry lessons from a classic era of television. Fans and newcomers alike are treated to insider stories, thoughtful reflection, and plenty of Cicely’s magic.

Transcript

[Podcast Announcer]

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[Rob Morrow]

Well, hello everybody. Welcome to Northern Disclosure, the podcast that follows the Northern Exposure TV series. And I am here with my lovely and talented host, Janine Turner. Hey, Jeanine, how you doing?

[Janine Turner]

Fine and dandy. How are you, Rob?

[Rob Morrow]

Fine and dandy as well. Yeah, you know, it's been, it's been fun doing this. Every week we get together and we, we look at an episode and we try to find a guest from the show. And week we have the lovely Jessica Lundy, who played Elaine, my f ex fiance, and she was on for two episodes. It'll be fun to talk to her and you can listen wherever you get your podcast and you can hit that subscribe button so you know what's coming down the pike. And also you can watch us on the Northern Disclosure YouTube channel. And that way you can see how pretty Janine is and Jessica when she.

[Janine Turner]

Comes on and how handsome Rob is.

[Rob Morrow]

Oh, thank you. That's why I say that, just so I can get it back. So what's. What's new, Jeanine?

[Janine Turner]

Well, you know, as usual, my life around me is. Is a whirlwind. And this morning was one of those days. And, and I think, oh, okay, I get to watch the Northern Exposure episode. I know I'm going to have an hour of happiness. And so I watched the show this morning, Roots, the episode Roots. And yet another endearing fun, special special show. I can't wait to talk with you about it. All kinds of uniqueness that you don't see on other episodes. And you and I had a lot of fun. I got to work with Adam and that was fun.

[Rob Morrow]

Adam was great. We have Richard Cummings and Adam Arkin on. It's got a lot going on. And John Corbett, Chris Stevens storyline is fascinating. So those. So Roots is in terms of this would be episode six, season three, although I DB has it as episode seven, but Amazon has it as episode six. It was written by Dennis Koenig, who I don't Think wrote any other episodes. And. And it was directed by the lovely Sandy Smolin, who also directed our episodes Sex, Lies and Ed's Tapes and the Big Kiss. He directed three episodes. And I remember having such a nice time with him. I became friendly with him. I knew his wife, and he was lovely. He did such a nice job. There were so many nice touches. You know, all the stuff with the African dance and the little subtle moments between you and I, you know, that kind of, you know, this really plays on Maggie's jealousy of possibly not being able to have a relationship that possibly might happen between Joel and them. Joel and him. Her. And, you know, it was fun to watch. I'll read the synopsis. Which is Elaine, Joel's ex fiance, who is now a widow, comes to Sicily to visit him, but he is not very happy to see her. Maggie unintentionally plays matchmaker for the ex couple. Chris, half brother Bernard comes to town with news that Chris begins to dream with news. And Chris begins to dream of Africa. Adam takes a job with Holling to cover his insurance premiums. Mm.

[Janine Turner]

So fun. So incredibly fun. And, you know, it's wild as I'm sitting here watching, watching this, as we record this, I think about my Texas qualities. And, you know, we're always raised to smile and whatnot. I'm always smiling. It's just the kind of thing I do, especially when I'm, you know, I don't know, I'm a smiler, I guess. And I remember on Northern Exposure, the producers said to me, quit smiling. Like, don't smile. Quit smiling. And that's why we didn't really get to touch on it. But when we were doing the episode Animals Are Us, when Rick comes back at a dog, it was kind of fun because you see. You finally see Maggie in a skirt and hat, and she's smiling. Anywho, it was great.

[Rob Morrow]

Yeah. You looked great in those outfits.

[Janine Turner]

Well, that's. I think that's the wonderful thing about the show is we get to do so many different things. And here is Corbett in his storyline. He's able to go out there and dance in the African dance. And I thought that coverage that Sandy did was really terrific. And the dancers, the casting of the dancers, they were amazing. And of course, so.

[Rob Morrow]

And then.

[Janine Turner]

And then he's having to learn the language, the native language, and they're speaking in the native langu.

[Rob Morrow]

Then he shows up with cornrows. Yeah.

[Jessica Lundy]

Yeah.

[Janine Turner]

He says he thinks he's black, you know, because. But he actually wasn't. His brother was Because I guess his father had an affair with an African American woman, I guess is what happened. But then Corbett was taking on that identity through dreams, which they resolve in the end.

[Rob Morrow]

It's one of my favorite storylines in the whole series is the relationship between those two, that. That. That their brother is one's black, one's white, and that they have unconscious, you know, connection in their dream life and the way they finish each other's sentences, that they are. That they share DNA, and it. It expresses itself outwardly often. I just find that charming. And. And the way they played it was.

[Janine Turner]

Just great, the way that dad was a. Remember, they remember dad. Dad was a traveling man. Yeah, I love that line. Dad was a traveling man. Which. He was a truck driver. You know, that's when he had Sigmund Freud in the. And all that. In the. In the episode when he first comes to town. But if you notice they're walking down the street at one point having this conversation about the brothers and the fair, and do you notice a truck went right. A big Mack truck went right past him. And I thought, oh, that could have been a little homage to, you know, dad was a traveling man. Dad was a truck driver. Did you catch that?

[Rob Morrow]

It happens. You know, it's a regular feature. I don't you. And we've talked about it before. It was like they would. They would pay these trucks to kind of hang around and drive through a shot, and we would have to wait for them to reset and have them drive all around the block to come back. And there's another one at the end, which is that lovely shot of you and I walking off into the horizon and a hay truck goes by. And, you know, it looks so kind of accidental, but that wasn't. They paid them, and they had to have them hang around. And at one point, there's a shot when. When Chris and Bernard are standing outside the radio station, a truck goes by, and there's a. A big pot belly. A huge pot belly. Pig on the back of a truck.

[Janine Turner]

Today in this episode.

[Rob Morrow]

Absolutely.

[Podcast Announcer]

Yeah.

[Rob Morrow]

It'. Huge.

[Janine Turner]

It would be interesting to talk to Sandy about it. You know, if that was a kind of a punctuation of dad was a truck driver traveling man. Because that truck was really close. You know, a lot of times we see him in the background, but the boom. That truck was just there. But it may have been something that I'm imbuing upon this situation. It may have just been coincidental.

[Rob Morrow]

Yeah, we know a lot about it. And, you know, look, a lot of things become Symbolic. Inadvertently, you know, by repetition. So I don't know if he thought about that, but it. It certainly works, right?

[Janine Turner]

Yeah, it does. And I thought our storyline. And I loved by the having that kind of hangover scene with Adam Arkin or Adam, you know, and my mother loves to watch it. She's 88, living with me, and it just makes her happy. So I, you know, she wants to always watch it. And I pop in when I'm going downstairs, upstairs, and I would. I heard that scene a couple of weeks ago when mom was watching it, and I. There was something different about that scene. Did you catch it?

[Rob Morrow]

Well, I mean, you're talking about the scene with you and Adam in the bar and you're hungover.

[Janine Turner]

I'm hungover, yeah. Which was a really good scene.

[Rob Morrow]

I thought it was a really good, really fun scene. I just. What was different about it?

[Janine Turner]

No music. Oh, there was no music in the bar. And I don't know that I would have caught it upstairs because I watch it on my phone when I'm upstairs. But downstairs, it was really obvious to me that there was no music in the bar. But. But that was. That was fun to be able to work with him. I loved the fact that Maggie, you know, would have these sort of hangovers and, like, the depth of. And all. All that dialogue was so rich, you know, like, really pal. And. But the scenes with you and Jessica or Elaine were also very touching in a very different note for Jessica, because the actress, Jessica, who's portraying Elaine, because in the first episode when she was here, it was more comedic, but it had depth as well. But this one, she was much more somber, and I thought she did a terrific job. But the whole interplay. Oh, and that dancing bears. I remember filming that scene. There's scenes I don't always remember filming, but remember when I'm trying to intercede at the bar, when y' all are sitting there having dinner and I said, do you want to go watch the bears dance? You know what I mean? They throw food and it's really funny. I remember filming that scene and how much fun that was, but the way I'm kicked out.

[Rob Morrow]

And do you know what I want to mention. I know I don't want to. I'm not going to say this for tawdry reasons, but I'd love to hear your thoughts, because I noticed that you weren't wearing a bra and you looked great. And the reason I noticed it was, I mean, aside from that you looked great was it always seems, you know, network TV insists that Women wear bras. It drove me crazy. When I was direct, when I direct and stuff, you'd be, they'd be in a nightgown in bed and they'd have to wear a bra. And I'm just wondering if you remember how it is that no one's. Was that your identity?

[Janine Turner]

I have a story, I have a story about that. It's interesting that you would bring that up. Really interesting that you would bring that up. So I'm such a sensory sort of Actors Studio type of actress that I, if you recall, when I first got there, I was wearing a belt around my waist and learning how to fix things. And I wanted to get into it sort of in that method acting sort of way. And I thought, Maggie probably wouldn't wear a bra. You know what I mean? She would just, she'd just be this natural. You would catch that. And I don't know if it was that episode or it must have been after this episode. Then they brought me in the office and said, you have to wear a bra.

[Rob Morrow]

Right? That's.

[Janine Turner]

And I must have been where I.

[Rob Morrow]

First started becoming conscious of it, because I must have known about that.

[Janine Turner]

And I said, I don't, I don't really, really, I don't know that she has to. But they want. And they also said to me, by the way, you also have to lose weight. You're becoming a superstar now, and you need to lose weight, and we're going to get a trainer for you. And that was fun. That was really fun.

[Rob Morrow]

Who said that?

[Janine Turner]

Oh, well, it doesn't really matter.

[Rob Morrow]

Well, but, but the bra thing is interesting because women are beautiful without bras. With bras. But it's like, it, it so restrictive and so kind of patriarchal that these networks would say to you, as this character, and you didn't, it didn't seem anything except real. And, and, and, you know, and I think even Jessica wasn't wearing bra now, because when I saw that, I was like, well, who else is wearing a bra?

[Janine Turner]

But, like, you would say that.

[Rob Morrow]

Well, I, I, it could be because it's a pet peeve of mine, like we should. As I said, I'd be shooting these scenes with people in bed and they'd be in a nightgown and they'd have to have a bra underneath it because you weren't allowed to, quote, see the nipple. It was like, what, I thought this was way beyond.

[Janine Turner]

I thought they had said that to me much earlier, but maybe not, because, quite frankly, I didn't catch whether I was wearing. I did Kind of look. I think I did kind of look. But I thought I must have been wearing one because I thought it was earlier. But I, I think the thing that when they told me I had to lose weight, I thought, wow. And I look back there, I wasn't anything heavy about me at that time, right. Especially in today's standards, but I had all those high waisted jeans. So finally I said, look, if you want me to look thinner, then put me in side zip pants and more peg leg type of pants and take me out of these jeans. And so we did. We changed. Maybe, maybe after this episode or two, you'll start seeing that I was wearing different types of pants.

[Rob Morrow]

Huh? I do remember the sides. Yeah, you did. That would be tough to hear for sure.

[Janine Turner]

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Rob Morrow]

Well, you look great. And you're really charming in this. And you're, you're. The way you played, the jealousy and the, the subtlety of the way you did it, the little looks, you know, it was good. It's a, it's a. It's a. You know, whenever there's a triangle dynamic, it's always fun.

[Janine Turner]

You had so many wonderful subtle moments. The honesty of the way you played when she arrived was beautiful. And then the. But also, there was a moment maybe when I came in with my hand, there was just a little sparkle. You know, you could see that little flint of attraction there. And the vulnerability that we both had in this episode, I think made when we came together at the end even more charming, is sort of. We were both, both pretty vulnerable.

[Rob Morrow]

I love when I say, when you come in with your hand and I say, don't join me, rap, and you're like, tie a knot around it. Tie a rope around it. Fleischman. I don't even know what that means, but it was funny. All right.

[Janine Turner]

So my hand really wasn't hurt, you know?

[Rob Morrow]

Right. Totally. So Jessica has been acting forever now, just like all of us. She. She was on the show the inspectors from 2015 to 2019. She wrote 25 episodes, which I want to hear about. She has been on everything from Two and a Half Men to Castle to Criminal Minds to my show Numbers. She was on Without a Trace. She was on Seinfeld, which plays on a loop in my house because of my daughter. And she was in the movies Caddyshack and Bright Lights, Big City. And she was also on the reboot of the Carol Burnett Show. So she is like, like, you know, a journey woman actor who's, who's has incredible credentials and credits and, and we Just adored having her on the show. And. Howdy, Jessica.

[Jessica Lundy]

Hi, you guys. I've been listening and enjoying so much everything you talked about. And for the record, I did wear a bra.

[Rob Morrow]

You did.

[Jessica Lundy]

Okay.

[Rob Morrow]

Everyone's gonna think, where's. Where's Rob's eyes going?

[Jessica Lundy]

But, you know, I. Rob, it was. I really. There's so many things that I want to remember to talk to you about, but. But I thought that point was actually really interesting because after watching the episodes, which was such an amazing treat, I hadn't seen them in so many years and just brought back such great memories and also a reminder of what a brilliant show it was, how you two were just fantastic, and the writing was exceptional, and every character, every actor was just perfect in their role. So it was such a treat. But watching both episodes, Russian Flu and Roots, what you said was absolutely true. Do you know, in Russian Flu, when you took off my nightgown, it was very clear that I was wearing. To smear on the.

[Rob Morrow]

I remember. I remember clocking. You could actually see a piece of the bra at some point.

[Jessica Lundy]

It was clear as day when I saw it, and I thought, ugh. I mean, it just takes you right out of it. But there was no chance on broadcast TV that you wouldn't be.

[Rob Morrow]

Except Janine got it. I mean, it would be interesting to. Not that we need to track the episodes, but it's interesting to know when it started and when it stopped.

[Janine Turner]

It probably stopped pretty soon after this episode.

[Rob Morrow]

So you came on the episode. Hi, Ohio, Ipsenio. Or I don't know if it was called that, but that was Russian Flu. Russian Flu, which was a great episode where we first met you. Did you have to go through a big process to get the part? Do you remember?

[Jessica Lundy]

You know what? I don't remember the audition process, but I'm sure that I read several times because it was an important role, and I was so thrilled to get it because I just loved the writing. The show hadn't been on. That was the first season.

[Rob Morrow]

Oh, wow.

[Jessica Lundy]

So it was kind of coming in blind to everything, but you two were so welcoming. And I remember worrying about how to create that kind of chemistry when you're engaged and they've been together forever. And I so worried about making that believable, but I have to say, I was thrilled to see it because I just watching it as kind of trying to be an objective viewer, it was. I thought we made a great couple, and I bought that. There was a long history.

[Rob Morrow]

Totally.

[Jessica Lundy]

And I really thank you for that.

[Rob Morrow]

You and I Connected right away. We just don't. We just completely. We just connected. It was easy. I remember it was like a. No, like, as soon as you showed up, we just kind of got into step and it was. It was easy.

[Janine Turner]

And that's always a wild thing, to show up on set and suddenly have to have romance. And it is. It's really interesting. And it's like bringing the. The organic chemistry, but also whatever you have to do, you know, to make. To bring that to life. But you had such a wonderful blend in Russian flu of sexuality, vulnerability, likability and humor. You were so funny as well. You just did an extra. You were exceptional.

[Jessica Lundy]

It was. It was a wonderfully written part. You can't. I mean, you can't go wrong with that. And the situation was just unbelievably perfect.

[Janine Turner]

When he was rubbing the high Ohio Ipsen aisle on you and your.

[Jessica Lundy]

And I used that for years on a demo reel because I felt like it was one of those magical things where you don't have to act. Do you know what I mean? Situation, that stuff. And Rob, your faces about the smell, I thought were. Were just pitch perfect.

[Rob Morrow]

But you, too, you were, like, crying. You're trying to not cry.

[Jessica Lundy]

It was cold, Rob. I don't know if you remember, but back then it was freezing. I think this was shot during the winter months in. In Washington. So the place was cold. And that stuff, whatever it was, it was mud, basically. So, you know, you just. If you let yourself be, it was all there. But I. It was such a treat to see that again. And I really thought that. Especially the goodbye scene there. I thought that's what made me so stunned when I read that script for Roots, I married someone else. I really. It took so much, and I wanted to ask you guys, were you in on any of that? Who decided that. How did they decide that Elaine went off and married an older judge?

[Rob Morrow]

I don't. We. We didn't have. We don't. We didn't have anything to do with the writing per se, although in the later years, we might have had more influence, but in that regard, I don't think we had anything to do with it. But they. I, you know, the. The trick for them was to keep the. The energy moving between Maggie and Joel, but without consummating, you know, will they, won't they? Was the whole thing. And so I think that, you know, how do you get Joel to let go of his, you know, disappointment for losing. For losing Elaine? You know, you have her, you have him marry someone else. And Then you know, there's no hope. I think so. It's probably how they came up with an older judge. I don't know. I wouldn't be surprised if one of the writers, you know, had some situation like that or something.

[Jessica Lundy]

I wondered because I was looking for it. There's a. I love that there's a scene. I love so many of the scenes when you were talking earlier, the one in the bar, Jeanine, with you and Adam, when he's psychoanalyzing both of you. One of my favorites. And the scene when you came back to let that. To warn him that Elaine's talons were out for him. And when he says that she's gone. Oh, that moment. And when you asked, are you okay? Oh, it was just so beautiful. And that. That's what. Because I was thinking. The scene I was thinking of was when Joel and Elaine are talking at night and they're in separate beds and the. The moonlight's coming in. And he asked why? Why? And Elaine's answer was, I can't explain it. I fell in love. I was like, oh, come on, give me more than that. Because that was a. I mean, I wondered. I had to work really hard for myself to figure out why. Especially when the last time you saw us together. Man, I would not have guessed it.

[Janine Turner]

When did making plans get this complicated? It's time to streamline with WhatsApp, the secure messaging app that brings the whole group together. Use polls to settle dinner plans, send event invites and pin messages so no one forgets mom's 60th. And never miss a meme or milestone. All protected with end to end encryption. It's time for WhatsApp message privately with everyone. Learn [e-mail] I just think it's interesting we don't ever think about this, really, because we're so busy in the grind of it all. All that we knew you had gotten married in other episodes, but when you came back, you didn't know that you had gotten married in other episodes. But see, we'd already gone past that. But you didn't. You didn't know that. And that's interesting. I didn't really think about that at all. And, you know, you talked about. You talked about that vulnerability between all of us. See, I think you were vulnerable, very vulnerable in Roots, and Rob was very vulnerable in the show, and then I was very vulnerable in the show. And when you touched on that last moment, when I come in and say, the talons are out, I was moved by that, too. It's Kind of rarely do you get moved by your own work, but I did kind of get a little teary. That was the sweetest moment between Rock, between Fleischman and o', Connell, so to speak. But it was so simple, too, right? And I think that's what I learned on Northern Exposure is just how to relax and let the camera be there and, you know, find my choice, but then just let it be simple. And in that simplicity, we had such a connection there. It was interesting that you would note that as well. But it was kind of moving.

[Jessica Lundy]

It really was moving. And it made that moment when you two. You were talking earlier about walking off into the sunset or onto the horizon, so to speak, it was just. It was so lovely because it came out of that moment. And just the ease with which you were together, which is unusual. Do you know what I mean? It seemed like there was a new closeness.

[Rob Morrow]

It's amazing how they were able to calibrate that over time without going too far, you know, because when we didn't get together until when janine. The characters.

[Janine Turner]

Fourth season.

[Rob Morrow]

Right. So four years. So that's like 66, 70 episodes or something like that. And it's such a hard thing. But what you get is. Which I think is really sweet about them is you see the friendship blossoming, you know? And I always think that's more important than the romance between two people when they come together, is that they can be friends and there is some kind of bond that just keeps getting deeper and deeper. In that moment when they walk off, you don't think they're going off to make out or get it on or anything. You just think they're going off to continue to get to know each other in a deep way, which is so lovely.

[Janine Turner]

It's very Casablanca. Like, this is the beginning of a beautiful friendship.

[Rob Morrow]

Yeah, you're right. It is Casablanca.

[Janine Turner]

You're right.

[Jessica Lundy]

And there's an ease. There was just such a comfortable feeling between you that. That kind of closeness is so rare, you know, that's really special.

[Janine Turner]

If you think about it. Y' all had the greatest sex. Elaine and Fleischman, when you knew it was gonna end.

[Rob Morrow]

Yeah, that's always great, right?

[Janine Turner]

Right when there was that kind of a disconnect. You had the greatest sex. It's kind of interesting the way that all part puts together.

[Rob Morrow]

Breakup sex.

[Jessica Lundy]

I thought, Rob, I loved your. I think Elaine says, you know, about what was a mistake to come here and I shouldn't have. And your speech about, no, you gave us back the past.

[Rob Morrow]

I love that. That's a great. You gave us back our past. What a great idea, you know, to have that. First of all, that you can lose your past. It can be taken away, you know, through. Through animosity or whatever. And then to restore it and, you know, again, it's that. It's the way that northern exposure gives gifts, you know, it gives little philosophical gifts to people to think about. You know, I always personally never understand when people tell me, oh, I hate my. My mother and father were that way. They hated, you know, each other until my dad died. Like, even though they were divorced for 70 years or whatever. Like, I never understand when people break up that they. That they hate each other. I feel like even I understand why you might, when you do break up, but that you don't find your way back to some. Back to the place that was the. The germ of love.

[Janine Turner]

Like my parents who divorced and married each other three times.

[Rob Morrow]

That's an amazing story unto itself. We'll have to talk about that.

[Janine Turner]

That's a whole nother story.

[Jessica Lundy]

That sounds like I would watch, but they.

[Janine Turner]

They would never let anybody. Anyway. That's a whole nother story.

[Rob Morrow]

That would be a good series. I like that. Like the three. The three marriage. Just call it Three Marriages and watch each one. What it's like, you know, whether it's different or the same or. That's a good idea.

[Janine Turner]

The one in the 50s, the one in the 70s, and the one in the 2000s, you know.

[Rob Morrow]

Well, Jessica, you're a writer. I didn't know you were a writer.

[Janine Turner]

Yeah, tell us about that. That's really cool.

[Jessica Lundy]

That was just a very interesting. I mean, I've always dabbled in, like, sketch comedy writing, punch up dialogue, just, you know, little things along the way. But that situation we were. We shot in Charleston, South Carolina, and the actors were union, but the writers were not. So they were just. They had a few writers at the beginning and then were picking up scripts wherever they could. So it kind of became out of necessity the executive producer and I started fixing what we had to. And then it became. It rolled into just being in the writers room all the time. And we had a bare bones staff. There were maybe two other people writing. And we just kind of churned out episode by episode. We were never ahead. And it was the most exhilarating experience to go from, you know, writing all day until they said you'd have to go to the set and to go film a few scenes to get to. And we were filming two episodes at once. It was really done.

[Rob Morrow]

That's Exhausting.

[Jessica Lundy]

Yeah, it was exhausting. I have to say. It was just creatively the most. One of the most fulfilling experiences. Because talk about immersion. It was just total immersion. And you use every part of your brain. If you're acting and writing well, it's empowering, too.

[Janine Turner]

It's empowering to know that you're not just in it, because all of us. Rob directs and writes. I direct and write. And I think that's one of the things that producers need to be a little more clued into, which it sounds like on that show they were. You've got an acting talent, but you have. These actors have a lot more potential than just the one thing. So the fact that you could have that kind of empowerment and that sort of enlightenment and that joy and that fulfillment and then go out to act, I'm sure it just. It made everything feel.

[Jessica Lundy]

Yeah, it was the most wonderful thing. And I'm sure you both feel the same way. It's. I think if you look back, maybe. I can't believe in the 90s, when this show was happening and so many things, there was a real delineation between you're an actor or you're behind the camera, you're a director.

[Rob Morrow]

Absolutely.

[Jessica Lundy]

That has changed, I think, so much.

[Rob Morrow]

Every show now has. I mean, any. Any kind of. Any. Anyone with any kind of name, even not a huge one, is a producer on their show now. And I remember when I. When I was negotiating for numbers, I was like, you know, in that point, I had been directing, I had been producing, and I wanted to be a producer. And they were like. And. And they were like, absolutely not. That does not happen. We don't allow it. And, you know, since then, it's just like, it's a given that you're gonna make an actor or producer. Do you remember working with Sandy Smolin?

[Jessica Lundy]

I do. He was very kind. I remember everybody behind the scenes was. You had a wonderful crew. Sandy was lovely. He was just. I remember because it was more of a challenge. I was more known for and had done more comedy. And this was a. Like Jeanine was saying was a very different note and a different tone. And I think he was really helpful.

[Janine Turner]

Did you find it hard to walk in the room and have to have all that. That kind of different tenor, different tone, the emotional. You had a death. You bring it to the. Although you were bringing the guilt. Did you find that difficult to find that note? You did a beautiful job, but that's not easy to get there. Thank you.

[Jessica Lundy]

I do. I think it got easier over the years. But I think when I first started out, I was just more comfortable with the comedic lighter roles. And this was definitely a challenge. And I think it was so helpful to have known Rob from the work in the first episode. And Sandy was so kind and generous. That makes a huge difference.

[Rob Morrow]

So the Carol Burnett show was a sketch show that was.

[Jessica Lundy]

Oh, my God.

[Janine Turner]

I want to talk about the Carol Burnett Show. I love the car. I wish we could bring back something like that today.

[Rob Morrow]

Wait, Jeanine, do you remember this? Because this was one of the highlights of my career. This was one of the great moments ever. So I was obsessed with the Carol Burnett Show. The first. The original one. Right. And I. I mean, I just. It. I feel like so much of it influenced me. One day we're shooting Jeanine. I don't remember who it was. I think it was in my. My Fleischman's cabin. And the wall was open and they yelled cut. And I looked, and behind the camera was standing Tim Conway and Harvey Korman. And I was like. I couldn't. I was like. I don't. Like, no one told me they were coming. They were huge fans of the show. They happened to be in Seattle for something, and they asked if they could come watch us shoot. And I was just like, on cloud nine. Because Tim Conway, you know, was just such a huge influence.

[Janine Turner]

It must have been one of the days I wasn't working. You know, maybe we can bring Carol Burnett on this show. That would be fun. I've spoken to her a couple of times. That would be really fun.

[Rob Morrow]

Wait, so how was that working with her?

[Janine Turner]

Carol Burnett?

[Jessica Lundy]

It was really. It was wonderful, but it was difficult because I, too, had the best memories. Watched it growing up. Loved that show. Tim and Harvey. That would be an amazing thing. And I think it was very difficult. It was in the 90s, and to try to. The idea was good to try to reboot a sketch comedy show because it was just. What they had was such magic that I think it was hard for her to say, okay, I'm going to do something the same, but different.

[Rob Morrow]

Right, right, right.

[Jessica Lundy]

Because it was all young writers, and they were shooting for almost. Not a Saturday Night Live vibe, but something closer to that. And I think there was a lot of stress within that about feeling comfortable with newer material. So we kind of veered back and did some older sketches that they had done previously. So it was a lovely experience. Like, everybody on the show was fantastic. They had a really nice ensemble, and the writers were great. But ultimately it didn't work out because I almost feel like it was. You can't. It was such magic the first time around.

[Rob Morrow]

Very tricky. Yeah. That's what Janine keeps saying about. Well, when we talk about doing a reboot. I've tried. We've tried. But Janine's mind is, you know, why mess with something? You know, if it worked, you know.

[Janine Turner]

Not that I wouldn't want to be a part of it, but it just seems so risky. Like that's exactly what you're talking about. And it's interesting. They should have trusted that if they brought back Carol Burnett from the 70s to the 90s, that people would still love it. And that's what I afraid. I'm afraid what would happen with Northern Exposure. They would try to do the same thing. They try to modernize it instead of letting it just be what it was. Because I would personally love to see the Carol burnett of the 70s here today. I think that would be hilarious.

[Rob Morrow]

It's tricky though. It's tricky though, because stuff is contextual and time, you know, certain stuff, although that's one of the beautiful beautif were learning watching Northern Exposure is. It is somewhat timeless. It does. Like, did you notice, Jessica, that it didn't look like you were watching a period piece? You know, if you watch Law and Order now, it looks dated.

[Jessica Lundy]

I agree. Except there are certain telltale signs. Like I had eyebrows then and I realized how different in the 90s you plucked to oblivion. And I did that later. And I thought, and the hair, I mean, the certain things I remember of that time and the shoulder pads, it made me. You and I, in one scene, I definitely were competing for who had the biggest shoulder pads.

[Rob Morrow]

That was in the other show. Right, with the. At the plane when I'm wearing that yellow jacket.

[Jessica Lundy]

Yes, that yellow jacket. Oh, that was so perfect.

[Rob Morrow]

Yeah, you're right. But stuff. But it still doesn't. Because fashion is so fluid nowadays. It doesn't take me out of it. I don't, I, I don't know why.

[Janine Turner]

Because it's Alaska.

[Jessica Lundy]

It's.

[Janine Turner]

Because it's Alaska, right? And it's like you could still picture people wearing high waisted jeans and boots and big coats in Alaska. And I think if you're watching LA Law, they're wearing the big, like you talk about big shoulder pads and thing, but it's Alaska, I imagine. I mean, I was in Alaska recently. They still wear jeans like that there. It's. It's more utilitarian than it, than it is fashion.

[Jessica Lundy]

I have to tell you though, in the dialogue and in the tone and everything. You're absolutely right. There's a timeless quality to everyone's delivery because it was so real and so natural.

[Rob Morrow]

Right. And the themes were universal. But I was noticing that, you know, since we're talking about, you know, the contrast between comedy and drama, you know, it was. It's so. For the first, I don't know, three or four scenes, she's so down and so kind of frightened and heavy. And I think that's interesting that Sandy allowed that. He didn't try to take you out of that. Do you remember what was going. I mean, how much of that was you? How much was in the script? It was just this, I guess, having lost her husband and now hoping to rekindle with Joel. Joey. She's the only one who calls him Joey.

[Jessica Lundy]

I know, I know. That's why I thought it was so interesting to see that first one. The lightness and the attraction and the fun between them. And then I think this was a lot me, because there was definitely great fear coming back and. And guilt, tremendous guilt. So I certainly wasn't talked out of that or directed away from that.

[Rob Morrow]

It was nice. I liked. I liked how deep they. You know, because, I mean, Janine talks a lot about them trying to not let her get too dark.

[Janine Turner]

I was never allowed to have a tear. I never allowed. I had one in that. This. What's the. The one we just did where Ed did the. The little movie. But I actually had a little tear, and I'm like, oh, my gosh. They let me show it because when Rick got hit by satellite. What Rob's referring to, Jessica, is when Rick got hit by a satellite, I wanted to have emotion. My boyfriend just died. But they're like, yeah, it's a comedy. It's a comedy. So Rob makes a good point that they let you go there, which they really never would let it.

[Jessica Lundy]

But Jeanine, was it because they wanted to make sure that the tone was light or they didn't want you to be. To be perceived as weak at all?

[Janine Turner]

They wanted comedy. They wanted it to be light and. And. And. But that's okay to me if you have one character that's. That's being. You know, and the rest is. Anyway, it is what it is. But Rob. Rob makes a good point that. That they let you do that. So that was nice.

[Jessica Lundy]

Yeah. And I. I didn't. I thought even. There was. Almost. The only time there was a lightness was when we were in the bar when you came up to us and tried to convince the bears. Yes. And the look. And there was a moment, too, when we both said, we're tired. And you knew where that was going. And you almost wouldn't get out of the booth. I had to.

[Janine Turner]

Yeah, you nudge me.

[Rob Morrow]

You nudged me out of the booth.

[Jessica Lundy]

I love that. There was definitely humor in it, in the scene. But you're right, overall, it was kind of a very melancholy.

[Rob Morrow]

But then it shifted. It did shift. It just. I just remember clocking that it was going on for a couple scenes longer than I thought they would normally allow. And then. I think Sandy was great with actors. You know, his wife, Pamela Reed, was an excellent actor, actress. And so he just was very sensitive. And it was. You know, it's funny why he only directed three. I don't know how that happens. I guess they go on and there's no slots left or something. But I could have had him direct more. I'm sure.

[Jessica Lundy]

The cinematographer was Jim Heyman, wasn't it?

[Rob Morrow]

At this point? It was Frank Prinze.

[Jessica Lundy]

Oh, Frank Prince.

[Rob Morrow]

Jimmy was there when you did the first Russian Flu. And then Frank Prinzee came in and then Gordon Lonsdale finished it. So there were three over the course of the five, six years, and all distinctly different.

[Janine Turner]

Yeah. Well, talk to us about the memories of. Of just being on the set.

[Jessica Lundy]

I have to tell you, and I'm sure you remember this much more clearly than I do, but I know that the first time I got there, and it was. I know it was winter and it was cold up there, and it was almost like shooting an independent film.

[Rob Morrow]

Absolutely.

[Jessica Lundy]

The trailers were small and everything was. It was. It just felt like it was. We were doing like. Like a gorilla shoot.

[Rob Morrow]

The budgets were so low that. That I. I mean, I used to have to fight for them to give second meal to the crew that weren't even coming up. You know, we would. They'd be like, oh, we did it last night. I'm like, yeah, well, we're here tonight.

[Janine Turner]

I'm hungry now.

[Jessica Lundy]

But did that change? I remember a change coming back when the show was a huge hit and all of a sudden it was like, this was a different world, which was so thrilling to see. It was like. Like being rewarded in a way.

[Rob Morrow]

We move sound stages. We moved. The first sound stages you were on were just in a kind of tiny little warehouse. Then we moved to a bigger warehouse. And then I got a big trailer, and then Janine got a big trailer. And then we all got big cars and drivers. And, you know, it changed as success. And, you know, success is a Double edged sword. It has a lot of good things, but it also corrupts.

[Jessica Lundy]

Did you feel increased pressure then to maintain the things or was.

[Rob Morrow]

I mean, there's always a sense of pressure, but I, I wasn't aware of it in terms of ratings. I just have, I just personally always have a pressure to, to, to do better, to, to strive to do more. You know, I'm rarely satisfied with what I do. I watch the dailies. I got, I got in my contract that they would give me a copy of dailies. And so I watched them every, every day for five years so I could kind of understand what was going on.

[Janine Turner]

And, and I did too.

[Jessica Lundy]

Did it. Now how did that affect you though? Because sometimes I've, I've done that myself and sometimes if you're too critical, which I think we all tend to be in that when we do this, it can. Did it affect you feeling free to, to do things on set?

[Rob Morrow]

I had to learn how to get over the vanity aspect of it, you know, how I looked and stuff like that. And then I was able to get objective and you know, and it helped me because a. I learned how to direct. I learned much. I learned a lot about film grammar watching those, those dailies. But I did calibrate my performances. If you watch my performances from the first episode to the hundredth episode, it's a very different actor. You know, you're watching someone who's come out of the theater for a decade. Everything was demonstrative and, and big and, and, and, and physical. And by the hundredth episode I'm like really quiet and much more still. And you know, and, and, and that, and I think it, it helped me, but I do understand that it can. A lot of people don't like, you know, Johnny Depp is a guy who's never watches his stuff. He can't watch it, it freaks him out. And I don't feel the need to watch it at this stage in my life. But then it was, it was hugely valuable. But I remember having a fight with Josh because I started asking on day one to watch the dailies and they were like, no. You know, it was the same thing. We were talking about the delineation between actors and production and they were like, no, no, no. And, and I remember Josh saying that he thought it would affect my performance, you know, that I would start to change it. And it did, but it, but, but as I maintained, you know, I was a professional and I wasn't looking to hurt my performance. I was looking to improve it.

[Janine Turner]

And Rob was like Big brother, right? So he got it. And I'm like, I want it too. Like the little sister, you know, I want it too. But, But I, I, I learned what worked and what didn't, you know, you know, when I make choices, how is it, how is it going through emotions of my soul and projecting on my face and how is it being captured on the screen? And so I, it really taugh about how to, how to motivate myself, what choices to make, what the camera re. And, And I think it to. I echo what Rob was saying by, by the third season, I probably relaxed into it all a little bit. I think that's one of the things I remember the most about being sort of a, a troop actor where we had, we had so many episodes is the more and more that it went on, the more I could just trust my instrument, you know, that it would be there. That to just relaxation was the biggest part. When I teach kids and work with kids, you know, I'm like, relaxation is the biggest. Make your choices, but you've got to relax. If you don't relax, everything's blocked. Nothing's going to come out. And so I think that watching those dailies gave. And you're right, Rob. A lot of actors, a lot of directors don't want you to watch it.

[Rob Morrow]

Jessica, are you someone. Are you someone who doesn't like to watch yourself generally?

[Jessica Lundy]

No, I don't like to. But I agree with you that when I get past the cringe factor and the vanity, I learned so much. And I, I have to say, even watching these episodes, it was something Janine mentioned, too. I was able to separate enough to think, oh, I really like that, or that was interesting. Or I, you know, I don't remember doing that. And to actually appreciate the performance, which is weird to say of your own performance, I can always do that with other people. But to be able to give yourself a little bit of credit, and I realized I wish I had done that more along the way because maybe it would have given me more confidence, the way you were talking about, to be able to calibrate things more instead of being so afraid to be disappointed.

[Rob Morrow]

It gave me great confidence. That's a good way to put it.

[Jessica Lundy]

And Doug, Limu and I always tell you to customize your car insurance and save hundreds with Liberty Mutual, but now we want you to feel it. Cue the emu music. Limu, save yourself money today. Increase your wealth. Customize and save. We save. That may have been too much feeling. Only pay for what you need at liberty mutual.com savings. Very underwritten by Liberty Mutual Insurance Company affiliates, excludes Massachusetts.

[Janine Turner]

I'll also say sometimes we saw great takes that they didn't use. You know what I mean? It's like, why didn't they use that moment? Because there. There was some. Sometimes so many free moments. Remember, Rob, all those moments where we would go. Which is very sort of popular now. And I've done it with Robert Altman and Friday Night Lights. But we have these improvisational moments, these kind of really free moments, and then they wouldn't use them. So that's what producers get afraid of. You know, they get afraid that we're going to go up. Like, why didn't you use take four?

[Rob Morrow]

Sometimes they got a little precious with their. You know, and I understand it, but. But I think the real wise creatives go for whatever's the best thing. And I think a lot of times they got. Got stuck on their writing. I remember watching multiple takes of me, like, taking off my glasses, and then you cut to me and I take off my glasses again, and I'd call them and say, what? Why would you put that? Why would you put the shot? You just. It just. It takes the audience away. It's. The continuity's off. You know, I took off my glasses, I take them off again. They said, well, because you said you didn't say the lines right in the other ones, you know, and I probably changed a word. But like. Like that. To me, you know, the film dictates the cut, not the script.

[Jessica Lundy]

But they were very. If I remember correctly, there wasn't a lot of. Especially early on. Not a lot of improv.

[Rob Morrow]

Definitely not.

[Janine Turner]

No, no, no, no. And that's okay. But in this case, because the writing was so beautiful, especially it was the first four seasons, you know, it was just so incredibly impeccable. And you didn't hear any words like stuff or, you know, it was no slang, no cursing.

[Jessica Lundy]

Smart, I have to say. Yeah. There were moments, Rob, when you would have these massive monologues almost of just so much great material. And there was some moments in your delivery. It was almost like Woody Allen esque. There was such a New York feel to it.

[Rob Morrow]

I heard a couple Woody Allen jumping. I can't remember which one. But in this show, it's like, oh, that's so Woody.

[Podcast Announcer]

Yes.

[Janine Turner]

Well, you've had quite the career, Jessica. Moving on. You have a wonderful body of work. Thank you.

[Jessica Lundy]

You know, you mentioned shows that I had forgotten. It's interesting. I look back and I think, yeah, I've been around a long Time. I mean, you have that feeling too, I'm sure. It's like this started so long ago. And I look back, though, I really think we were very lucky to have been around in that time, the late 80s and 90s. There was so much available, there was so much opportunity. And I mean, I know there's a lot of production now, there's a lot of streaming alternatives, but the business itself is very different.

[Janine Turner]

Well, the business. The business now is diluted. I mean, and it's hard to make. It's hard to get a hit show or to make stars or anything of that nature, because we just have a plethora. I mean, we just have this monumental amount of choices. It's almost staggering. It's like going into a Blockbuster store.

[Rob Morrow]

It's amazing how many people come up to me and tell me about a show they're watching that I've never heard, you know, and then I'll look and hear it's a huge hit. And you're like, it's, it's. But they.

[Jessica Lundy]

A season or two and they're short seasons and then they're gone. I think what you were talking about is to have that. It's an amazing luxury and a gift to have season upon season when we're doing 22 seasons, 22 episodes a season, because you learn so much about the characters, about the process, and you can't help but get better at it.

[Rob Morrow]

Yeah.

[Jessica Lundy]

And feel more comfortable. And it shows. And I realize it's so rare now to see that. I mean, if you get. They were talking about the Pit having, What was it, 15 episodes being a remarkable thing nowadays.

[Rob Morrow]

Right.

[Jessica Lundy]

I mean, we were really fortunate in the broadcast world to have that be the norm.

[Rob Morrow]

We got an order. We got an order after this, going into the third season of two seasons of 25 each. So we got a 50 episode order.

[Jessica Lundy]

What a dream.

[Janine Turner]

It was the most fascinating thing for me when we were picked up for 50. I purchased a house. Rob, I don't think you ever did, but my. My whole family, they're all in real estate. So I purchased a house. And, you know, I'd had that Tinker toy rental furniture in, you know, New York. And finally I had a. A bed. I had a washer and dryer. You know what I mean?

[Jessica Lundy]

I had.

[Janine Turner]

I had a. A house. But what happened for me when Northern Exposure was picked up for 50 that I didn't know was even lurking within me was my desire to move to Texas. I couldn't allow myself to even acknowledge that that existed within me. But the minute we were picked up for 50, I was like, okay, I want a pickup truck, a horse. It was bizarre because it was this sort of freedom. They don't even do that anymore. You never get picked up for 50.

[Jessica Lundy]

So rare.

[Janine Turner]

I don't think they even did it then. I think it was so rare. Right, Rob?

[Rob Morrow]

It was pretty unprecedented. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, I think on some of the procedurals, you know, over the years they've done stuff like that once they were established, but it's very, it was very rare.

[Jessica Lundy]

It's so nice in a way to see the upside of streaming is that people gravitate again toward the shows that we watched in the 90s and over the years and find that there are six, eight, 10 seasons and fall in love with characters the way it was meant to be and to have. But I'm glad to never lose touch with those shows. I'm, I'm grateful for that aspect of it. But the, you know, two, two seasons and out of eight episodes each, it's hard for anyone to, to number one, get attached the way we used to as an audience, but also to make a living.

[Rob Morrow]

Right. You forget like when the show comes back, you have to give. Dude, you're like, wait, what happened on that show? Like it's a year later. Like the morning show just came on and I was like, I don't even remember what was going on on that.

[Janine Turner]

Well, the rising generations can watch the episodes too now, which I really like. And there's just so many, the youth that the right are loving the show and so that's, that's fun. There's a. The legacy could continue because, you know, DVDs. No, the Rising generations, they barely even have televisions.

[Rob Morrow]

But yeah, we, we keep coming upon, you know, 20 somethings and you know, 15 year olds that are watching Northern now.

[Janine Turner]

So.

[Jessica Lundy]

Good to hear that.

[Rob Morrow]

Yeah. Mainly because it feels like, you know, I watch everything, I sample everything. I'm, you know, I really see a lot of tv. I don't necessarily stick with it, but I, I check it out and there's such a strain of cynicism, understandably, you know, in, in so much of it that, you know, I love that there's an example of something that, that had a heart and a soul.

[Janine Turner]

Well, Northern Exposure was not political. Right. Northern Exposure, it wasn't overtly small town. Yeah. And if it made a comment, you know, it was just sort of organic within these, these sort of sincere individuals trying to find themselves there. It wasn't really made. They didn't Feel it was.

[Rob Morrow]

It had its political. It just didn't. It wasn't partisan, you know, it didn't have a political agenda.

[Janine Turner]

Yeah, well put, Rob. Well, yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Jessica Lundy]

Oh, yeah. It made me think of that scene. I think it was in the Russian flu. And they were talking at the town.

[Janine Turner]

Hall, the Trotskyites, they called Fleischmann a Trotskyite. There's.

[Jessica Lundy]

Yeah, there's something. And I can see why nowadays there would be a real audience for that, the kind of independent thinking, that Alaskan spirit.

[Janine Turner]

We talk all the time about the town halls, but if you think about it, Alaska's so close to Russia, so the Alaskans would have been very aware of what was happening in Russia.

[Rob Morrow]

I also want to point out, you know, because every episode, and this was the wardrobe department, Catherine and Mimi and Sandra, they. They would give Shelley earrings that were thematic. And in this episode, I happen to clock. Sometimes I can't clock it, but, you know, the idea that Adam comes back and is offering real cuisine at the Brick, and Shelley is wearing looks like silver or pewter earrings that are plates and silverware.

[Jessica Lundy]

I noticed that. Stunning.

[Rob Morrow]

Yeah. Yeah, it's so. They were. They were so thorough in that way. I mean, there's such a great idea. I don't. I guess it was Catherine's idea originally. I think Cynthia even tried to start a. An earring line at one point. I don't know if it went, but.

[Janine Turner]

Oh, that would have been.

[Jessica Lundy]

What a great idea. And the other thing, I loved that the show did and that I think you were talking about earlier, the dream sequences were phenomenal.

[Rob Morrow]

They were phenomenal. And this one, too, you know, that. That whole storyline I was talking a little bit about at the top of this episode, you know, about that notion of the collective unconscious and how DNA is shared and how siblings have similar thought patterns or connections. And, you know, that the way it manifests in the way that whole storyline manifests with, With. With Chris, John Corbett having these dreams about Africa and then realizing that they were. They were. They were Bernard, Richard Cummings dreams is just so. It's just so bold and fascinating and. And I think it speaks to some kind of transcendent aspect of existence that, That I. I love well, and they.

[Janine Turner]

Took risks with that today that people. They may not have taken today. You know, they. They were willing to. To do some things that. That they would never do today.

[Rob Morrow]

Right. Even putting John in. In cornrows. Like, they probably say, no, that's not PC. You're going to get canceled. You know, Appropriating misappropriating culture or something like that, when in fact it was the very opposite. It was celebrating culture. And, and yeah, I think those, those dream sequencers were always. I know the directors love them because they were free to do whatever they wanted.

[Janine Turner]

And the cost, I don't know if those were their organic costumes or if Catherine did those costumes, but they were amazing.

[Rob Morrow]

They were probably a troupe that they hired, you know, and, and because that was. The choreography was so specific and the, and the musicians were so specific, I wouldn't be surprised if they were a troop.

[Janine Turner]

I agree with that. And you know, we, since people want to know behind the scenes things. It was a night shoot. You know, night shoots are always tough and the older I get, the less I like night shoots, you know, but that it was nighttime and gosh, that means, that would mean they would either start at 6pm and go to 6am or they would shoot half a day at noon and rep by midnight. Of course, if it was on a Friday, it was going to be 4am because of 12 hour turnarounds.

[Rob Morrow]

The hard thing about it is on a TV show it's one thing, if you're on a movie, you probably had this on cliffhanger. You probably shot your share of nights on that show, you know, but in a movie you're geared up for it, you know, like you're gonna have a week of nights. But on, on a TV show, a night comes out of nowhere and all of a sudden your schedule is flipped and you're, you're trying to sleep till noon or one so that you can have some rest because you're gonna be working till 6am but then the next day, two days later, you're going to be getting a 6am call. And that really, you know, wreaks havoc with the, their circadian rhythms and all that. But there's something magical. I always. And, and it's, I'm the opposite, Janine. Like I, I've kind of falling more in love with night shooting as I get older. I just, there's something magical about what happens is, you know, you, you, it's, it's almost like a getting high night on being exhausted. And there, there's something about the energy in the evening that, that allows for creative choices that, that normally wouldn't happen.

[Janine Turner]

Creatives are often up late at night anyway. We're not usually young people, we're night owls. But I remember walking out to the set at 2am, remember Rob all those times? And my hands would just be so hot. You Know, that would just be okay. And you're. You're correct that there would just be a vulnerability. There'd be a sort of like, okay, it's just going to be whatever it is at 2am Right. Which is freeing.

[Rob Morrow]

Yeah.

[Janine Turner]

Sometimes that's your best work.

[Rob Morrow]

I agree. It's. That's, That's. You know, it's funny when I'm. When I'm sick and I have to work, you know, if I have a flu or a cold or something, I always. My act between takes is awful, but the actual acting is usually better than ever because I just don't give a crap, you know?

[Janine Turner]

Well, and the crew that has to work all the time, you know, we would get breakfast breaks, we could go rest in our trailers or whatever, but the crew has to be there the entire time. And they started changing those. Those union rules because of the crew members. And they would send us home at 2 in the morning, 3 in the morning, 4 in the morning. Like, go home now, and you're so exhausted. But crew members had that they would be there sometimes a lot longer than we were. And they finally changed the crew rules that they. They had to. They couldn't work a certain amount of hours. They had to be able to cut those hours, and they had need to be able to drive home safely because they would drive home at night and have a rest and whatnot, because it was just. They were so tired. People don't understand that in showbiz how long the hours are, right, Jessica?

[Jessica Lundy]

No idea. No idea. Especially for an hour show.

[Rob Morrow]

It is.

[Jessica Lundy]

I have always told people that is the most grueling work on a regular basis, particularly for the crew, because they don't get those breaks.

[Janine Turner]

People would come visit on the set and they'd be there for about eight hours, and they'd say, okay, when are we going home? And I say, well, not for about another eight.

[Rob Morrow]

I just want to point out, I'm looking at my list of lines that I wrote down, and I just love when Joel says about Sicily. I think he says it to you, Jessica. He says, it's not beyond the middle of nowhere. It's the end of nowhere. Anyway, this has been so lovely catching up with you, and I'm glad you're doing well. You look great.

[Jessica Lundy]

Thank you. You guys. Great. And I have to say, I'm really enjoying the show. I've been catching up on episodes. I can. I. I'm so glad you're doing this well.

[Rob Morrow]

Thanks.

[Jessica Lundy]

Really. I. I'm thrilled. And. And I was so surprised and happy when you reached out. So I'm so glad I got to see you.

[Janine Turner]

Oh, it's. It's always a treat for us because, you know, we haven't seen each other in, what, 30 years or so, and. And so Rob and I are on, and our guest comes on, and we haven't seen him in so long. So it's. We joke. It's kind of like, you know, what's behind curtain number one? Curtain number two, Curtain number three. And it's so fun.

[Jessica Lundy]

It's so good to see everybody, your crew members and other actors again after so long.

[Janine Turner]

It's a reunion, and we were sing. We've been singing your praises when we were doing Russian flu and whatnot, about what a terrific actress you are and a lovely person. And thank you for joining us today because you just. You brought that character to life and. And your character, even though you weren't there, we talked about you, you know, and. And there was a whole episode where I had to pretend like I was Elaine. Did you ever see that episode? And I wore the spaghetti. Spaghetti strap dress.

[Rob Morrow]

I think it was the episode where I get the Dear Joel. Where I get the Dear Joel letter.

[Janine Turner]

She probably didn't see those. If she didn't watch the episode, she wouldn't have gotten the script.

[Jessica Lundy]

It's definitely time to go back and revisit everything. Yeah.

[Janine Turner]

So you were mentioned, and you had voiceovers that you did in certain episodes. So even though you were.

[Jessica Lundy]

That's right. I remember working with Martin. Right, Martin, Bruce Lee.

[Rob Morrow]

We love Martin.

[Janine Turner]

Well, thank you, Jessica. You're terrific, Rob. Always a joy. This is like the joy of my work week.

[Rob Morrow]

Working.

[Janine Turner]

Seeing you again, Rob, and seeing you, Jessica. And thank you for listening. Do hit that subscribe button. Share the. Share the. Share the the joy is what I like to say.

[Rob Morrow]

Share the joy.

[Janine Turner]

Well, share the joy. Share the joy. North to the future. And, Rob, it was great. And we'll see you next week. And we're signing off with o' Connell and Fleischman.

[Rob Morrow]

Actually, I think it should be Fleischman o'.

[Janine Turner]

Connell. Oh, yeah, right. In your dreams, Fleischman.

[Jessica Lundy]

Northern Disclosure is a production with Evergreen Podcasts and executive produced by Paul Anderson and Scott McCarthy for Workhouse Media.