Not All Hood (NAH) Podcast

Episode: He Lost His Son, Then He Changed the System
Hosts: Malcolm-Jamal Warner (not present this episode), Candace Kelley, Layne Fontes
Guest Co-Host: Pam Warner
Featured Guest: Alfred Shivy Brooks, activist, educator, and Atlanta Public School Board Member
Date: December 18, 2025

Episode Overview

This deeply moving episode centers on love, loss, and transformation, featuring educator and activist Alfred Shivy Brooks in conversation with Pam Warner and others. The discussion explores Brooks’ journey through immense personal tragedy—losing his 16-year-old son, Bryce, to drowning in 2023—and how that loss led him to advocate for systemic change in education and community safety. The conversation ranges from Black identity and educational responsibility, to healing, personal growth, and the ways community and legacy are forged through both pain and purpose. This is as much a celebration of resilience and hope as it is a candid look at grief.

Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Alfred’s Background and Philosophy (01:27 – 05:26)

• Upbringing:

  • Raised by a “militant” Morehouse man and Black Panther; high expectations at home.
  • Early exposure to activism (first protest: Rodney King, 1991), and organizing during Black Lives Matter era.
  • Learned that “fighting all the time is exhausting… I made a conscious decision to just live and center in love” (01:27).

• Teaching Style:

  • Teaches high school seniors, emphasizes “unlearning” over learning.
  • “We have more to unlearn than we have to learn.” (02:57)
  • Challenges students to be open and question assumptions.

• Authenticity in the Classroom:

  • Viral video: Black male teacher representation (“less than 1.8% of all teachers,” but at his school, nearly 40%).
  • Shows up authentically: “I’m not always wearing a suit… sometimes I’m wearing a baseball cap, a hoodie…” (04:09).

2. Black Male Representation & Systemic Barriers in Education (05:26 – 13:12)

• National Landscape:

  • Black male educators are rare and often isolated in their roles.
  • There’s informal support via social media, “Teacher Talk Live,” and personal platforms.
  • “If the majority of my colleagues looked like me across the profession, we would be much better compensated.” (07:47)

• Value of Education & Pay Disparities:

  • Observes that education is undercompensated and undervalued, partly due to being a “female dominated field.”
  • Discusses necessity for teachers to have side businesses to make ends meet (“If I was not an entrepreneur, I couldn’t afford to be a teacher.” – 10:39).

• Entrepreneurship as Survival:

  • Brooks runs a clothing line, curates conferences, and consults.
  • Pushes back on the idea of ‘side hustles’:

    “When we say side hustle and things like that, we kind of little ourselves, right?... We shrink ourselves.” (12:18)

3. What Alfred Teaches & His Approach (13:12 – 17:37)

• Core Values for Students:

  1. Centering joy over temporary happiness — seeking achievements that “can never be taken from them.”
  2. Understanding purpose over passion — living to benefit others rather than focusing solely on self (13:25).

• Subjects Taught:

  • Ethnic studies, personal finance, economics, government.
  • First lessons always clarify these philosophies before diving into curriculum.
  • Financial education: “How can you talk to someone about managing money if you don’t talk to them about how to get money?” (15:10)

• Network as a Resource:

  • Sees providing access to his professional and social network as critical for students.
  • “The most valuable thing I could ever give them is access to my network.” (15:38)

4. Family, Fatherhood, and Generational Teaching (17:37 – 24:16)

• Family of Educators:

  • Alfred’s father still teaches economics and personal finance; was once Alfred’s own teacher.
  • Recounts tough father-son relationship:

    “Not hearing that, not getting that affirmation from your father causes you to never feel satisfied by the things you achieve and causes you to work without rest.” (23:24)

• Multi-Generational Experience:

  • Recent meaningful memory with his father: joint interview and photoshoot for Ed Week magazine as generational Black educators.

• Healing and Father-Son Relationships:

  • “A lot of men go their entire life without ever hearing their father say, ‘I’m proud’… That’s one of the things I’m working to heal.” (23:24–23:37)

5. Breaking New Ground: Teacher on the Atlanta School Board (24:16 – 28:08)

• Historic Leadership:
  • Alfred is the first teacher elected to the Atlanta Public School Board in its 150-year history.
  • Had to lobby state government to change the law, which previously required teachers to resign their jobs to serve.
  • “If you have systemic issues, then you have to have systemic solutions.” (27:41)

6. Grief, Loss, and Finding Purpose (28:16 – 44:00)

• The Call That Changed Everything:

  • While preparing to announce his board candidacy, learned his 16-year-old son, Bryce, drowned attempting to rescue others from a riptide (29:41–31:30).
  • Bryce died a hero, saving other children.

• The Public Nature of Grief:

  • Bryce’s passing was highly public; Brooks experienced “the hurt behind people’s eyes.”
  • “I couldn’t wait to stop seeing the hurt behind people’s eyes.” (34:28)

• Navigating Grief:

  • For Brooks, the path was service:

    “I always found the most healing when I served others…Decentering myself and only thinking about how I could be a vessel of service helped.” (32:16)

  • For his wife, grief required privacy and closeness with her immediate village.

  • Emotional labor of being a “public griever” discussed candidly.

• Making Meaning from Tragedy:

  • Established a foundation and scholarships in Bryce’s name.
  • Got CDC funding to provide swimming lessons to Atlanta youth.
  • “My son lost his life in service to others and not to mention strangers… I had to make sure my son's legacy wasn't lost.” (41:38)

7. The Nonlinear Process of Grieving and Acceptance (44:00 – 54:33)

• Difference in Grieving Styles:

  • Both Brooks and Pam Warner found solace in action and legacy-building.
  • Rejecting traditional therapy for a “village” approach:

    “If we had better friends, we’d need fewer therapists… I needed people beside me who were on that same energy.” (39:26)

• Gratitude and Moving Forward:

  • Focus shifted from “Why” to “What”—not getting lost in asking why the tragedy happened, but focusing on “What am I supposed to do now?” (76:46)
  • “Gratitude is an intentional directory… say, ‘Thank you God,’ on the day my son passed.” (75:31)

8. Legacy, Parenting, and Continuing Bonds (54:33 – 67:56)

• Parenting after Loss:

  • Warner: parenting shifts from active to passive; legacy and values transmitted even after letting go of daily involvement (52:59–54:33).
  • Brooks: Focus on continuing his son’s legacy; “parenting” transforms into legacy-building.
  • “You’d be surprised how much in part gets imparted on these kids… I just knew you weren’t listening when I was talking, but you went out there and did all the right stuff.” (53:04–53:31)

• Significance of Financial Literacy & Representation:

  • Warner insisted son Malcolm-Jamal participate in financial meetings from the age of 14 for empowerment and protection (55:00–57:17).

9. Spirituality, Signs, and Goodbye Conversations (57:17 – 71:57)

• Signs from Loved Ones:

  • Brooks: asks Bryce to appear as a hummingbird; finds symbolic comfort in those encounters (59:50).
  • No direct dreams, but many indirect signs.

• Last Words and Blessings:

  • Pam Warner: Most meaningful moment—son told her he always felt safe with her; also shared a “goodbye conversation” about knowing each other deeply (62:23–65:02).
  • Brooks: Last conversation with his son centered on faith (“I am a believer. I do believe in God.”—Bryce) and aspiring to “have a street named after you.” (68:34–71:50)

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments (with Timestamps)

• “Fighting all the time is exhausting and it doesn’t necessarily bear fruit. So I made a conscious decision to just live and center and love… I found peace and impact.” — Alfred Brooks, (01:39)

• “We have more to unlearn than we have to learn.” — Alfred Brooks, (02:57)

• “Black men represent less than 1.8% of all teachers. At my school, almost 40%.” — Alfred Brooks, (04:09)

• “If the majority of my colleagues looked like me across the profession, we would be much better compensated.” — Alfred Brooks, (07:47)

• “My depression was always heaviest when I centered myself the most. I always found the most healing when I served others.” — Alfred Brooks, (32:16)

• “My son lost his life in service to others and not to mention strangers… I had to make sure my son's legacy wasn't lost.” — Alfred Brooks, (41:38)

• “We'd need fewer therapists if we had better friends.” — Alfred Brooks, (39:26)

• “Not hearing that, not getting that affirmation from your father causes you to never feel satisfied by the things you achieve and causes you to work without rest.” — Alfred Brooks, (23:24)

• “He felt safe with me as a child. That meant more to me than all the love and respect… The feeling of safety, that you’re protected from harm, that you’re in a safe place.” — Pam Warner, recalling conversation with her son, (63:06)

• “You’d be surprised how many things get imparted on these kids. You think they don’t listen, but they go out there and do all the right stuff.” — Alfred Brooks, (53:04)

• “The trap of ‘Why.’ …to believe that God owes us explanation… is audacity beyond what I will allow myself… Not all things are for our knowing.” — Alfred Brooks, (76:14)

• “I have a heavier heart than I ever did, but I have more peace than I ever have.” — Alfred Brooks, (79:29)

Important Timestamps

• [01:27] – Alfred’s activist upbringing and educational approach
• [04:09] – Viral video and significance of Black male teachers
• [07:47] – On pay disparities and representation in education
• [13:25] – Teaching students to ‘unlearn’ and discern joy from temporary happiness
• [23:24] – Father-son relationships and healing without affirmation
• [24:38] – Becoming first teacher on Atlanta School Board, changing the law to serve
• [29:41] – The loss of Bryce Brooks and its immediate aftermath
• [32:16] – Decentering self in grief, focus on community service
• [39:26] – Friends vs. therapists in grief processing
• [41:38] – Founding a foundation and swimming lesson initiative post-loss
• [53:04] – Passive parenting and legacy after loss
• [63:06] – The importance of “safety” in parent-child relationship
• [68:34] – Goodbye conversations, faith, and legacy teachings
• [75:31] – “Gratitude is an intentional posture...”
• [76:14] – On not asking “Why” but focusing on “What”

Ending Reflections & What’s Good (80:12 – End)

• “What’s good is living and being present, being intentional and being focused.” — Kim Fields (80:17)
• “What’s good is that the village is alive… seeing a room full of community and a village...” — Alfred Brooks (80:31)

Pam Warner closes the episode with gratitude for the connections made and the community present:

“What’s good is connecting… and connecting with all of these people.” (81:22)

Tone & Feel

The conversation is raw, honest, and hopeful, carrying both humor and heartbreak. The room is filled with community support, vulnerability, laughter, and deep, generational wisdom rooted in Black lived experience.

Summary for Listeners

This episode stands out for its depth and realness—whether discussing policy, pedagogy, or personal pain. It’s about the power of showing up authentically in one’s community, the challenge and beauty of Black identity and legacy, how tragedy can be transformed into a force for systemic change, and the necessity of gratitude, presence, and community in the hardest moments of life.

For anyone navigating loss, seeking inspiration in education, or invested in the health and legacy of Black communities, this conversation is a gift.

Skip to the important segments above for focused listening, or tune into the entire episode for a full experience of storytelling, healing, and community in action.