Podcast Summary: Not Just the Tudors
Episode: Queen Mary II & the Glorious Revolution
Host: Professor Suzannah Lipscomb
Guest: Dr. Holly Marsden, Assistant Research Curator at Kensington Palace
Date: February 23, 2026
Overview
This episode focuses on Queen Mary II, a central yet often overlooked figure in the so-called Glorious Revolution, which saw her and her husband William III overthrow her father, James II, and reshape the British monarchy. Professor Suzannah Lipscomb and Dr. Holly Marsden discuss Mary’s upbringing, marriage, personal life, political influence, cultural legacy, and the complexities behind her reputation—with an eye to correcting the long-standing historical overshadowing of Mary by her husband and the period’s male-dominated narratives.
Key Discussion Points & Insights
1. Mary’s Childhood and Formation
- [05:41] Mary and Anne, daughters of James II and Anne Hyde, spent their early years outside the court but maintained regular family contact. Their mother’s status as a commoner and early death deeply affected Mary.
- Dr. Marsden: “Mary and Anne grew up in quite an interesting time in court... knowing her mother's reputation must have been very difficult.”
2. Religious Upbringing
- [08:27] Despite her parents’ Catholicism, Mary was raised Protestant due to King Charles II’s determination to secure a Protestant succession.
- Dr. Marsden: “Her Protestantism is the very reason she gained the throne... She becomes more devout in her Anglicanism as time goes on.”
3. Marriage to William of Orange
-
[11:14] Betrothed at 15 in a political move, Mary’s marriage was bittersweet—personally daunting but strategically essential.
- Mary was perceived as lively and attractive, William as dour and less impressive, leading to public and personal ambivalence.
- Dr. Marsden: “On the wedding day, her chaplain records that she was crying all day... it's not just being married to this man, but being shipped across the seas.”
-
[13:20] Their early married life was marked by distance—William busy with republican duties and wars, Mary learning soft-power strategies and palace management.
4. Mary’s Female Relationships
- [16:55] The episode explores the “lesbian-like” (Judith Bennett) nature of Mary’s intense same-sex relationships, such as with Lady Frances Apsley. While not definitively sexual, these relationships challenged boundaries of friendship, desire, and identity in the 17th-century court.
- Dr. Marsden: “They both adopt a play name... and they're very sexually charged. Mary talks about wanting to be impregnated with Francis's discourse.”
5. The Glorious Revolution: Myth and Complexity
-
[20:32] The narrative of a “bloodless coup” is contested. Dr. Marsden highlights bloodshed (e.g., Battle of the Boyne, Glencoe Massacre) and the political anxieties following the Catholic birth of James II’s son.
- Paranoia over a Catholic heir led to rumors (the “warming pan” scandal) and culminated in Mary and William’s invitation by anxious bishops to depose James II.
-
[24:27] Mary’s reluctance to rule alone:
- Dr. Marsden: “Mary writes at this time that she feels uncomfortable in the prospect of ruling by herself... I'd rather rule alongside my husband.”
6. Mary’s Regency and Political Skills
- [28:02] While William was away at war, Mary ruled as regent and proved to be an active, decisive leader.
- Oversaw the navy, issued orders, shuffled council members, and showed growing confidence.
- Dr. Marsden: “There is a wealth of evidence... letters, tracts, accounts that show her buying ammunition, telling generals not to invade...”
7. Personal Anxieties and Family Dynamics
- [32:13] Mary’s relationship with Anne broke down due to suspicions over Anne’s confidantes (notably Sarah Churchill). Their estrangement was permanent after Anne was evicted from court lodgings in 1692.
- Dr. Marsden: “Their letters are becoming few and far between... they don't see each other again before Mary dies.”
8. Cultural Influence and Court Life
- [34:47] Mary was a major patron of music (Henry Purcell), enjoyed both high culture and folk ballads, and innovated in palace decoration and fashion.
- Preferred small, domestic palaces and fostered a more private, less ceremonial court than predecessors.
- Dr. Marsden: “She really understood the importance of the multisensory nature of court... She loved decorating, she was consistently tearing things down, putting things up.”
9. Public Image and Popular Media
-
[41:21] Mary’s influence extended to elite collecting (notably porcelain), household decoration, and popular culture through commemorative ceramics and medals.
- Her image was subject to interpretation—sometimes celebrated, sometimes vilified (likened to parricidal Tullia by Jacobites).
- Dr. Marsden: “Commemorative ceramics were a way of celebrating the monarch... collecting and displaying these plates would show their allegiance.”
-
[44:48] Discussion of bare-breasted representations of Mary on ceramics—connected to ideals of beauty, fertility, motherhood, and political symbolism.
- Dr. Marsden: “A quick way of portraying her... it was fashionable for women to be portrayed in very, very low Mantuas... This was popular media.”
10. Mary’s Death and Legacy
-
[48:23] Died at 32 from smallpox; mourned with an unprecedented state funeral. William was devastated and wore Mary’s hair in a locket.
- Dr. Marsden: “William is absolutely bereft by her death... this was the biggest funeral in state history.”
-
[53:16] After Mary’s death, William ruled alone until his death in 1702. Queen Anne then succeeded, inheriting some aspects of Mary’s governance and image control, though their interests and approaches differed.
- Dr. Marsden: “Anne was interested in visual art... but she doesn't really follow Mary's suit in her administration of soft power.”
Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments (with Timestamps)
-
On Historical Overshadowing
“Mary had a very difficult task of shaping her own identity within this William and Mary moniker... She's written as being apolitical... when in fact, she was very, very active in all of these areas.”
— Dr. Holly Marsden [04:49] -
On Mary’s Reluctance to Rule Alone
“I’d rather rule alongside my husband... She was quite a naturally anxious, worried person. And I think the idea of ruling with her husband would alleviate a lot of those worries.”
— Dr. Holly Marsden [24:27] -
On Same-Sex Affections
“Mary talks about wanting to be impregnated with Francis’s discourse... they really explore the boundaries of women’s letter writing at the time.”
— Dr. Holly Marsden [16:55] -
On Her Cultural Influence
“She really understood the importance of the multisensory nature of court... The design schemes of Kensington were pretty wild. She had striped hangings and a spotted couch at one point.”
— Dr. Holly Marsden [34:47] -
On Public Mourning
“This was the biggest funeral in state history... She was snatched in the prime of her life... These beauty and having an heir were two of the key facets of queenship... and they were kind of taken from her in her prime and people really mourned her.”
— Dr. Holly Marsden [48:23]
Timestamps for Key Segments
- Mary’s Shadowed Reputation: [04:49]
- Her Unusual Upbringing: [05:41]
- Religious Indoctrination and Significance: [08:27]
- Marriage Dynamics: [11:14], [13:20]
- Mary’s Female Friendships/Affections: [16:55]
- Myths of the Glorious Revolution: [20:32]
- Refusal to Rule Alone: [24:27]
- Mary as Regent and Political Operator: [28:02]
- Estrangement from Anne: [32:13]
- Cultural Innovation at Court: [34:47]
- Mary’s Image and Sheer Popularity: [41:21]
- Ceramic and Popular Portrayal: [44:48]
- Her Death and National Grief: [48:23]
- Mary’s Legacy and Anne’s Succession: [53:16]
Conclusion
This episode repositions Queen Mary II as a far more dynamic, politically engaged, and culturally influential sovereign than traditional narratives suggest. Through Dr. Marsden’s extensive research, listeners gain a nuanced understanding of Mary’s personal struggles, her masterful use of soft power, and her continued relevance to debates about gender, monarchy, and national identity in restoration England. Her story bridges private vulnerability, profound public impact, and a monarchy on the cusp of transformation.
Next Episode Preview: The life and reign of Queen Anne, Mary’s sister and the last Stuart monarch.