Podcast
Now to Next with Jason Averbook
Hosted by Jason Averbook · EN
A place to sit down with trailblazers, truth-tellers, and builders who are actively reshaping our world.
13episodes
Episodes
Newest firstAll episodes
EP27: Adaptability, Trust, and the Human Skills AI Can't Replace with Lara Albert
2w ago00:40:53Tap to summarizeWhat happens when AI can do more of the work we've traditionally assigned to people? For many organizations, the conversation quickly turns to automation, efficiency, and workforce disruption. But according to Lara Albert, the more important conversation is about adaptability. As AI continues to reshape how work gets done, leaders face a critical challenge: helping people develop the skills, judgment, and confidence needed to thrive alongside increasingly intelligent technology. The future will not belong to organizations that simply deploy AI. It will belong to organizations that help people evolve with it. In this episode of Now to Next, Lara Albert joins me to explore the realities behind AI transformation, workforce readiness, leadership responsibility, and the human capabilities that will matter most in the years ahead. Highlights: Why adaptability is becoming the most important workforce skill in the AI era The difference between what AI can do and what AI should do How organizations can drive AI adoption without creating fear Why leadership and trust become more important as technology advances The role of human judgment in an increasingly automated workplace How companies can prepare employees for continuous change Why AI should augment human potential rather than replace it What future career growth may look like as work continues to evolve Guest: Lara Albert is a senior marketing executive with more than two decades of experience helping organizations drive growth, innovation, and transformation. She has led world-class brands, launched breakthrough products, and guided teams through periods of significant market and technological change. Known for her strategic perspective and passion for leadership development, Lara brings a practical and human-centered view to the future of work and the role AI will play in shaping it. Follow Jason Averbook: Substack: https://substack.com/@jasonaverbook X: https://x.com/jasonaverbook LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/jasonaverbook Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/jasonaverbook YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@nowtonextwithjasonaverbook Facebook: https://facebook.com/jasonaverbook Follow Lara Albert: LinkedIn:https://www.linkedin.com/in/laraalbert/ (0:00) Introduction (1:25) Laura Albert's background and role at SAP SuccessFactors (2:20) Personal connection to early talent and evolving entry level jobs (5:16) Impact of AI on early talent expectations (7:47) Redesigning the career ladder and defining early talent (12:19) Developing foundational skills in the age of AI (15:04) Reworking HR processes, workflows, and readiness for change (19:17) Advice for students, parents, and hiring managers (21:48) The importance of adaptability and realism in career paths (24:04) Responsibility and strategies for redesigning entry level jobs with AI (26:24) Research insights on AI literacy for new graduates (27:37) Governance and guidance on AI tools in education (28:23) Concerns of CHROs regarding AI implementation (30:43) The rise of shadow AI and AI brain fry in the workplace (33:13) Importance of AI fluency and job evolution in the age of AI (37:17) Connecting with Laura Albert and accessing research (38:09) SAP's collaboration with industry analysts and thought leaders (39:32) Closing remarks
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EP26: The Human Side of AI: Trust, Fear, and Why Change Management Must Change with Dr. Xenia Wade
3w ago00:44:45Tap to summarizeWhat happens when employees walk into AI training already convinced the technology might replace them? Most organizations are treating AI adoption as a technology challenge. Dr. Xenia Wade believes that is exactly where leaders are getting it wrong. Drawing from her research background, enterprise transformation work, and recent move from Germany to Japan, Xenia explains why AI creates a level of fear and vulnerability that previous technology transformations never did. Employees are not just learning a new tool. Many are questioning their future, their identity, and the value of skills they spent years developing. In this conversation, we explore why psychological safety has become a prerequisite for AI adoption, why traditional change management is no longer enough, and why trust may be the most important capability leaders need to build right now. Highlights: Why AI triggers fear in ways previous technology transformations never did The connection between psychological safety and successful AI adoption Why employees often arrive at training with strong opinions before learning begins The difference between AI training and true AI education How leaders can build trust by modeling vulnerability and uncertainty Why honesty is more powerful than certainty during periods of transformation The hidden danger of measuring AI success through token usage and adoption metrics alone What "token maxing" reveals about flawed AI ROI measurement Why traditional change management still matters, but is no longer enough How organizations can create cultures where people feel safe experimenting with AI The role of judgment, confidence, and human capability in an AI-enabled future Guest: Dr. Xenia Wade is a transformation strategist, researcher, and advisor focused on the human side of AI adoption and organizational change. With a PhD in Human Resource Management, her research explored how employees learn from one another and how workplace dynamics influence behavior and performance. She later brought those insights into enterprise transformation work, helping organizations navigate large-scale digital change initiatives. Now based in Japan after relocating from Germany, Xenia combines academic research with practical transformation experience to help leaders understand the psychological, cultural, and human dimensions of AI adoption. Her work focuses on psychological safety, trust, leadership behavior, change management, and the future of human-AI collaboration. Follow Jason Averbook: Substack: https://substack.com/@jasonaverbook X: https://x.com/jasonaverbook LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/jasonaverbook Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/jasonaverbook YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@nowtonextwithjasonaverbook Facebook: https://facebook.com/jasonaverbook Follow Xenia Wade: LinkedIn:https://www.linkedin.com/in/xenia-wade/ Website: https://xeniawade.com/ Substack: https://xeniawade.substack.com/ Free guide, 3 moves to get a stalled AI rollout moving: https://xeniawade.com/field-guide/ (0:00) Introduction and Dr. Xenia Wade's background (2:35) The human side of change and technology (3:47) AI and human interaction (6:04) Psychological safety in the workplace (9:20) Creating a culture of safety and vulnerability (13:57) Human bottlenecks in technological adoption (17:37) Comparing AI adoption to past tech changes (20:52) External factors shaping employee perception of AI (24:08) Rebuilding trust in AI and institutions (26:11) Training AI versus building trust (28:07) Building psychological safety in organizations (30:23) Meaningful education for job security (32:31) Shifting focus from IT to people (34:32) Measuring ROI in AI projects (36:44) Psychological safety and trust in the workplace (38:53) Key takeaways for leaders (39:56) Optimism in the age of AI (42:37) Balancing benefits and downsides of AI (43:20) Connecting with Dr. Xenia Wade
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EP25: The Trust Collapse: Why Your Workforce Has Stopped Believing Your AI Strategy
May 2900:23:16Tap to summarizeBCG dropped two studies that should be taped to the wall of every CHRO's office. One shows that adding AI "employees" to org charts is making human workers sloppier and more likely to blame the bot when things go wrong. The other — "AI brain fry" — shows that cognitive overload from managing AI tool sprawl is driving errors, burnout, and intent to quit. Meanwhile, 48% of Q1 tech layoffs were attributed to AI, Gen Z workers are listing AI skills they don't have on their résumés, and boards are demanding governance answers most executives cannot give yet. But the story underneath all of that — the one you won't find in any headline today — is a trust collapse. Workers don't believe what leaders are telling them about AI anymore. And that gap is now a credibility crisis. This episode is about all of it. Highlights: Why BCG’s latest research found AI workers can reduce human accountability The rise of “AI brain fry” and the hidden cost of tool sprawl Why employees are increasingly disconnected from leadership AI narratives The growing credibility crisis around augmentation vs replacement How organizations are accidentally creating burnout through poor AI experience design Why eliminating junior roles without redesigning development pathways creates long term risk The dangerous rise of inflated AI skills data across the workforce Why boards are asking governance questions most executive teams still cannot answer The difference between deploying AI and redesigning work for humans Host Bio: Jason Averbook has spent thirty years watching the gap between where organizations say they are with technology and where work is actually happening. He has a name for it. He has a framework for closing it. And he built Now to Next to do exactly that. Now to Next is the AI studio Jason co-founded with Jess Von Bank in 2026 — built on practitioner intelligence, original research, and the conviction that human transformation precedes digital transformation. Always has. Always will. Before Now to Next, Jason co-founded Leapgen, acquired by Mercer in 2023, where he led global HR transformation strategy and the firm's generative AI practice. Earlier he served as CEO of The Marcus Buckingham Company, co-founded Knowledge Infusion through its acquisition by Appirio, and held senior roles at PeopleSoft and Ceridian. He has advised hundreds of Fortune 1000 companies, authored two books on the future of HR and workforce technology, delivered more than 1000 keynote presentations globally, and teaches as an adjunct professor at universities worldwide. He is consistently recognized as one of the top three thought leaders globally on the future of work. Follow Jason Averbook: Substack: https://substack.com/@jasonaverbook X: https://x.com/jasonaverbook LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/jasonaverbook Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/jasonaverbook YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@nowtonextwithjasonaverbook Facebook: https://facebook.com/jasonaverbook Sources Cited: BCG / Fortune: "Adding AI 'employees' is backfiring" (May 28, 2026) BCG / HBR: "AI brain fry" — 1,488 workers surveyed (March 2026) Oliver Wyman CEO Survey: 43% of executives cutting junior roles, up from 17% (Q2 2026) Fast Company: "Skills manifesting — workers citing skills they intend to learn" (May 2026) Society for Corporate Governance / Nasdaq: "AI in the Boardroom" (May 2026) (0:00) Introduction and the importance of designing AI for humans (1:17) Trust crisis and AI's impact on worker-leader relationships (1:52) BCG study and AI agents as employees (3:12) Leaders' reactions and responsibility for AI onboarding (6:22) AI brain fry, cognitive overload, and experience design (10:44) AI's impact on tech layoffs and junior roles (17:00) AI governance and executive challenges (18:14) Trust collapse revisited and key takeaways (20:34) Summary and closing remarks
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EP24: The Function Nobody Owned: HR, IT, and AI Finally in One Room with Tracey Franklin
Apr 2300:44:22Tap to summarizeWhat does it really take to integrate people, culture, and technology in a way that drives transformation, not just change? As organizations race to adopt AI and digital platforms, many are still treating technology and people as separate strategies. But what happens when those two become one system? In this conversation, I sat down with Tracey Franklin, Chief People and Digital Technology Officer at Moderna, to explore what it actually looks like to connect people and technology in practice, not just in theory. Tracey shares her experience scaling Moderna from 800 to nearly 6,000 employees during one of the most critical moments in modern healthcare, and how that growth required rethinking not just talent, but how work itself gets done. We talk about why integrating HR and digital technology is no longer optional, how AI is reshaping decision-making and operating models, and what leaders often miss when trying to modernize their organizations. This is a conversation about building organizations that are designed to evolve, where culture, capability, and technology are not competing priorities but deeply interconnected system Highlights: Why separating people strategy and technology strategy is breaking organizations faster than AI is transforming them What leaders misunderstand about scaling culture during hypergrowth moments like Moderna experienced The real reason most digital transformations fail even when the technology works What changes when HR and technology leadership sit under one vision instead of operating in silos How AI is shifting not just productivity, but how decisions get made across the enterprise The tension leaders must navigate between speed, innovation, and maintaining human connection Guest: Tracey Franklin is Moderna’s Chief People and Digital Technology Officer, where she leads the integration of people, culture, and digital innovation to shape how the organization operates and evolves. Since joining Moderna in 2019 as Chief Human Resources Officer, she played a critical role in scaling the company from 800 to nearly 6,000 employees during the COVID-19 pandemic while helping build a culture recognized globally as a top employer by Science. In 2024, her role expanded to include Digital Technology, reflecting the growing importance of aligning human capability with technological advancement, particularly in the age of AI. Before Moderna, Tracey spent 15 years at Merck & Co., Inc., where she held multiple global leadership roles, including Vice President, HR Chief Talent and Strategy Officer. Her experience spans global talent strategy, organizational transformation, and HR leadership across the U.S., UK, and Switzerland. She holds a BA in Communication Arts and Sciences from Pennsylvania State University and an MA in Industrial and Organizational Psychology from Fairleigh Dickinson University. Follow Jason Averbook: Substack: https://substack.com/@jasonaverbook X: https://x.com/jasonaverbook LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/jasonaverbook Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/jasonaverbook YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@nowtonextwithjasonaverbook Facebook: https://facebook.com/jasonaverbook Follow Tracey Franklin: LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/tracey-franklin-8b731b1/ (0:00) Introduction (2:28) Moderna's growth and pandemic response (3:35) The "blank sheet of paper" approach in HR and digital roles (5:12) Combining HR and IT: Challenges, benefits, and rebuilding vs. incremental changes (10:03) Managing human and machine resources (12:20) AI's impact on HR roles and democratizing AI access (14:52) Upskilling HR for AI and evolving skill sets (19:02) The future of HR: AI, human interaction, and rapid advancements (25:24) Vibe coding: Viability, practicality, and applications at Moderna (27:32) Importance of data in AI integration (32:22) K-shaped economy and the AI knowledge divide (33:29) Skills and mindset for future employees (38:04) Career ladders and AI's impact on entry-level jobs (40:10) HR's role in an AI-integrated work environment (41:10) Concerns and responsibilities with AI deployment (43:13) Closing remarks
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EP23: The Agent Illusion: Why Most “AI Agents” Aren’t What You Think
Apr 1000:24:28Tap to summarizeWhat if the “AI agents” your organization is investing in aren’t actually agents at all? I woke up one morning, checked my phone, and saw yet another company announcing they are now an “AI agent company.” I have seen it over and over again. Different vendors. Same claim. No clear definition. I walk through in this episode what actually separates a workflow, a copilot, and a true agent, and why that distinction matters more than ever. I also share real examples of where organizations are getting this wrong, and what happens when you layer AI on top of broken processes. This is not about chasing the next buzzword. It is about knowing what you are actually deploying, what you can trust it with, and whether your foundation is ready for it. Because putting AI on top of broken processes does not create transformation. It hides the problem until it shows up at scale. If we cannot define what we are deploying, we cannot govern it, trust it, or scale it. Highlights: Why “AI agent” has become one of the most misused terms in tech right now The critical difference between workflows, copilots, and true agents How to tell if a system is actually reasoning or just following a pre-built path The hidden risk of “agent sprawl” and why it mirrors the rise of shadow IT Why most AI demos look smarter than the systems actually are The real reason agents fail when deployed on outdated processes and bad data What adaptive reasoning and memory actually mean and why they matter The 5 questions every leader should ask before trusting any “AI agent” Why clean data and validated processes matter more than the technology itself Host Bio: Jason Averbook has spent thirty years watching the gap between where organizations say they are with technology and where work is actually happening. He has a name for it. He has a framework for closing it. And he built Now to Next to do exactly that. Now to Next is the AI studio Jason co-founded with Jess Von Bank in 2026 — built on practitioner intelligence, original research, and the conviction that human transformation precedes digital transformation. Always has. Always will. Before Now to Next, Jason co-founded Leapgen, acquired by Mercer in 2023, where he led global HR transformation strategy and the firm's generative AI practice. Earlier he served as CEO of The Marcus Buckingham Company, co-founded Knowledge Infusion through its acquisition by Appirio, and held senior roles at PeopleSoft and Ceridian. He has advised hundreds of Fortune 1000 companies, authored two books on the future of HR and workforce technology, delivered more than 1000 keynote presentations globally, and teaches as an adjunct professor at universities worldwide. He is consistently recognized as one of the top three thought leaders globally on the future of work. Follow Jason Averbook: Substack: https://substack.com/@jasonaverbook X: https://x.com/jasonaverbook LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/jasonaverbook Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/jasonaverbook YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@nowtonextwithjasonaverbook Facebook: https://facebook.com/jasonaverbook (0:00) Introduction and defining AI agents (2:49) Categorizing AI agents and system paths (6:22) Use cases and historical evolution from workflows to agents (11:28) Architectural differences: Workflow vs. agent (15:18) Key features of genuine agents: Adaptive reasoning and memory (19:34) Real-world application: Enhancing HR efficiency (21:48) Questions to ask vendors about AI agents
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EP22: The Embodiment Gap: Why AI Adoption Was Never the Goal
Mar 600:27:52Tap to summarizeWhat if the reason AI investments are not delivering value has nothing to do with the technology itself? Across industries, organizations are pouring billions into AI tools, rolling out enterprise copilots, and tracking usage metrics that suggest adoption is rising. But the outcomes are not changing. Productivity is not shifting in meaningful ways. Decision making is not improving. And leaders are starting to ask why. In my sixth solo episode, I unpacked what I call the Embodiment Gap. The growing divide between organizations that are simply adopting AI tools and those that are truly redesigning work so humans and AI become better together. Drawing on recent research from McKinsey, Forrester, Gartner, BCG, Harvard Business Review, and the Journal of Accountancy, I explore why only a small fraction of AI initiatives are delivering transformative value and why the real barrier is not technology but human design. This episode reframes the conversation from adoption to embodiment and challenges leaders to rethink how they measure success, build trust, and prepare for the coming wave of agentic AI that will reshape how decisions are made inside organizations. Highlights: Why only 1 in 50 AI initiatives are delivering true transformative value The hidden difference between using AI, adopting AI, and embodying AI Why tracking prompts and logins tells you almost nothing about real impact The psychological barriers that cause most AI rollouts to quietly stall What the “Silicon Ceiling” reveals about the real limits of enterprise AI adoption Why the coming wave of agentic AI will force organizations to rethink governance and accountability The dangerous risk of knowledge atrophy as AI begins to replace human judgment development Why the companies that win with AI will not be the ones that deploy tools fastest but the ones that redesign work first Host Bio: Jason Averbook is a globally recognized thought leader, advisor, and keynote speaker focused on the intersection of AI, human potential, and the future of work. He is the Senior Partner and Global Leader of Digital HR Strategy at Mercer, where he helps the world’s largest organizations reimagine how work gets done — not by simply implementing technology, but by transforming mindsets, skillsets, and cultures to be truly digital. Over the past two decades, Jason has advised hundreds of Fortune 1000 companies, co-founded and led Leapgen, authored two influential books on the evolution of HR and workforce technology, and built a reputation as one of the most forward-thinking voices in the industry. His mission is to challenge leaders to stop seeing digital transformation as an IT project — and start embracing it as a human strategy. Follow Jason Averbook: Substack: https://substack.com/@jasonaverbook X: https://x.com/jasonaverbook LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/jasonaverbook Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/jasonaverbook YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@nowtonextwithjasonaverbook Facebook: https://facebook.com/jasonaverbook References: McKinsey AI Research (March 2026) https://www.mckinsey.com Forrester AI Usage Findings (February) https://www.forrester.com Harvard Business Review (March–April Issue) https://hbr.org Journal of Accountancy AI Research (March 1) https://www.journalofaccountancy.com Gartner AI Governance Research (March 1) https://www.gartner.com BCG AI at Work Report (2026) https://www.bcg.com (0:00) Introduction to the episode "The Embodiment Gap" (1:05) Transformative value of AI initiatives and research sources (3:19) Understanding AI: Usage, Adoption, and Embodiment (5:30) The silicon ceiling and its implications for AI adoption (7:13) Measuring improvements in AI and the importance of embodiment (11:08) Psychological needs and trust in AI adoption (15:44) The evolution to agentic AI and its organizational impact (19:03) AI's role in decision-making, accountability, and knowledge atrophy (23:13) Comparing future-built companies and laggards in AI adoption (24:13) Summarizing AI's importance and concluding thoughts
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EP21: The Entry Level Collapse and the Rise of 22nd Century Leadership with Heather Jerrehian
Feb 2700:48:36Tap to summarizeWhat if by automating entry level work, we are quietly eliminating the future leaders we will need in five years? As AI accelerates productivity across enterprises, I see a silent fracture forming beneath the surface. Entry level roles are disappearing. Internships are evaporating. And Gen Z unemployment and underemployment are rising at rates that far too few leaders are openly discussing. In this urgent and deeply personal conversation, I sat down with Heather Jerrehian, Founder and CEO of H22 AI, to unpack what she calls an existential workforce crisis. From her vantage point in Silicon Valley, she has watched AI reshape workflows, hiring patterns, and corporate incentives in real time. What struck me most was this: the real danger is not automation itself, but redesigning work without redesigning pathways. Together, we explored an uncomfortable truth. Organizations may be breaking the very talent pipeline that built our own careers. As someone who teaches students and speaks with executives every week, I can feel the gap widening. This episode is a challenge to leaders, educators, and young professionals to rethink what career entry, leadership, and human AI collaboration must look like in a world that is moving faster than most systems can adapt. Highlights: Why Gen Z unemployment and underemployment numbers signal a deeper structural shift The hidden consequence of automating entry level work without redesigning it What the Four Dimensional Workforce reveals that org charts cannot Why transferable trust and proof of work now matter more than GPA The uncomfortable truth about short term incentives versus long term talent health How H22 is building a human AI collaboration platform for life and career navigation What leaders must redesign now before the talent gap becomes irreversible Guest: Heather Jerrehian is an entrepreneurial futurist and the Founder and CEO of H22 AI, an AI native platform built to help Gen Z navigate life, learning, and career in an era of rapid technological disruption. Working at the forefront of social and technological shifts, Heather focuses on human AI collaboration and workforce intelligence. With H22, she is addressing the seismic impact AI has had on early career pathways by helping individuals build a sovereign blueprint of their strengths, motivations, and skills. Heather has built and scaled multi million dollar businesses as a serial founder, CEO, COO, and CFO. She led Hitch through rapid growth and a successful acquisition by ServiceNow. She is a Founding Limited Partner of How Women Invest, serves on Fast Company’s Executive Board, and is the author of the international bestseller Sail to Scale. Her mission is clear. Help the next generation find their reason for being and build toward a future where human potential and AI strengthen each other. Follow Jason Averbook: Substack: https://substack.com/@jasonaverbook X: https://x.com/jasonaverbook LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/jasonaverbook Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/jasonaverbook YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@nowtonextwithjasonaverbook Facebook: https://facebook.com/jasonaverbook Follow Heather Jerrehian: LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/heatherjerrehian/ (0:00) Introduction (0:09) Heather's background and non-traditional career path (3:15) Building a company for human AI collaboration (5:49) Gen Z focus and workforce challenges (8:02) Crisis for Gen Z in the workforce and AI's role (14:58) Four-dimensional workforce model and entry-level job restructuring (21:36) Urgency of addressing Gen Z employment issues (25:00) Employment's future and political implications (27:09) Mentorship, intergenerational collaboration, and AI in career development (32:22) Global economic impact of youth unemployment (35:07) Support strategies for Gen Z from employers and universities (39:09) Career advice for Gen Z and business leaders (45:37) Closing remarks
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EP20: The K-Shaped Knowledge Economy: Why AI Fluency Is Splitting the Workforce
Feb 600:13:39Tap to summarizeWhat if the biggest divide in your organization is no longer about role, pay, or seniority, but about how people think with AI? In this solo episode of Now to Next, Jason Averbook breaks down a pattern that is accelerating inside companies right now and largely invisible to traditional HR systems. Drawing from fresh labor data, market signals, and real examples from his own work, Jason introduces the idea of the K shaped AI economy where the split is not between jobs, but within them. He explains why two people in the same role can now be operating at radically different levels of impact, why performance systems are failing to detect it, and why AI fluency is no longer about using tools but about changing how work and thinking actually happen. This episode is a direct call to leaders, HR, and talent teams to stop planning for the future of work and start responding to the reality already unfolding. Highlights: Why the AI driven K shaped economy is happening inside roles, not between them How AI fluency is creating massive performance gaps within the same teams Why performance reviews, engagement surveys, and training programs are missing the signal The shift from AI adoption to AI embodiment and what that actually means Why curiosity, not access or intelligence, is now the real barrier How hiring, interviews, and talent assessment must change in an AI first world Why buying more tools without changing mindset creates more risk, not less Host Bio: Jason Averbook is a globally recognized thought leader, advisor, and keynote speaker focused on the intersection of AI, human potential, and the future of work. He is the Senior Partner and Global Leader of Digital HR Strategy at Mercer, where he helps the world’s largest organizations reimagine how work gets done — not by simply implementing technology, but by transforming mindsets, skillsets, and cultures to be truly digital. Over the past two decades, Jason has advised hundreds of Fortune 1000 companies, co-founded and led Leapgen, authored two influential books on the evolution of HR and workforce technology, and built a reputation as one of the most forward-thinking voices in the industry. His mission is to challenge leaders to stop seeing digital transformation as an IT project and start embracing it as a human strategy. Follow Jason Averbook: Substack: https://substack.com/@jasonaverbook X: https://x.com/jasonaverbook LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/jasonaverbook Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/jasonaverbook YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@nowtonextwithjasonaverbook Facebook: https://facebook.com/jasonaverbook (0:00) Introduction (0:14) Vibe coding anniversary and labor market split (0:35) SaaSpocalypse, software stock losses, and the K-shaped economy (1:30) AI adoption impact on productivity and performance management (4:07) AI fluency in future hiring and embodiment in the workplace (7:34) Rethinking learning, development, and AI integration in people strategy (10:07) Talent reassessment, early adopters, and upskilling (10:34) Tech adoption versus human transformation (11:22) Recap on the K-shaped economy and final thoughts (12:53) Closing remarks
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EP19: Voice AI, Hiring Ethics, and the Future of Recruiting with Ophir Samson
Jan 2900:43:07Tap to summarizeIn this episode of Now to Next, Jason Averbook is joined by Ophir Samson, Founder and CEO of Ezra, to explore how voice AI is reshaping the front end of hiring and why resumes may no longer be fit for purpose in an AI-driven world. Ophir shares his unconventional journey from mathematics and autonomous vehicles to building voice-based interviewing technology, and explains why resumes have become a weak signal now that AI can generate polished applications at scale. Together, Jason and Ophir unpack how voice AI can surface richer, more human insight earlier in the hiring process without replacing recruiters or removing human judgment. The conversation dives into ethics, candidate experience, bias, trust, and why the future of recruiting isn’t about automation for efficiency alone, but about freeing humans to focus on the work they should be doing. This episode offers a grounded, thoughtful look at where AI belongs in hiring and where it absolutely doesn’t. Highlights: Why resumes are breaking down as a hiring signal in the AI era How voice interviews reveal insight that written applications cannot The difference between what recruiters can do and what they should do Why Ezra isn’t competing with recruiters—but with resume screening How candidates adapt quickly to voice AI when expectations are set clearly Where AI interviewing works best—and where it doesn’t belong (yet) Why trust, transparency, and ethics matter more than speed in hiring tech The “surface area of disappointment” problem in voice AI design What entrepreneurs should focus on now that building software is easier than ever Guest: Ophir Samson is the Founder and CEO of Ezra, a voice AI interviewing platform designed to help recruiters identify high-quality candidates beyond resumes. He brings deep experience across voice AI, autonomous driving, and enterprise technology, with previous roles at Aurora, Uber, and General Motors. Ophir holds a PhD in Applied Mathematics, was a researcher at MIT, and earned his MBA from Stanford Graduate School of Business. Follow Jason Averbook: Substack: https://substack.com/@jasonaverbook X: https://x.com/jasonaverbook LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/jasonaverbook Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/jasonaverbook YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@nowtonextwithjasonaverbook Facebook: https://facebook.com/jasonaverbook Follow Ophir Samson: LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/ophirsamson/ (0:00) Introduction (0:36) Ophir's journey from math to voice AI entrepreneurship (2:47) The role of hiring in quality of life and the magic in Ophir's life (5:51) Transition to entrepreneurship and building voice AI prototypes (8:12) Autonomous vehicles' connection to voice AI and its human component (14:04) AI and human roles in recruitment and the future of resumes (18:19) Overcoming challenges in HR innovation and AI-human collaboration (24:09) Candidate perspectives on AI interviews and their appropriateness (29:01) Comparing AI and human capabilities in resume screening (31:56) Analyzing AI's strengths, limitations, and societal impacts (37:10) Ethical AI development and entrepreneurship (42:22) Closing thoughts
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EP18:Leading Through Change, AI, and the Future of Work with Al Dea
Jan 1500:45:00Tap to summarizeWhat if the real challenge with AI is not the technology, but how humans respond to change? In this episode, Jason Averbook sits down with Al Dea, Founder of The Edge of Work, to unpack what talent, learning, and HR leaders are really experiencing as AI, transformation, and constant change collide in today’s workplace. Drawing from dozens of deep conversations with senior talent and learning leaders, Al shares what is top of mind right now. From change fatigue and fear, to middle manager overload, to why most organizations are using AI for efficiency instead of redesigning work itself. They explore why humans are wired to survive rather than thrive during change, why mindset matters more than tools, and what leaders must focus on to build resilient, human-centered organizations in an AI-driven world. This conversation goes beyond hype to examine leadership, agency, curiosity, and the deeply human skills that will matter most as work continues to evolve. Highlights: Why organizations feel overwhelmed even if change is not actually new How human survival instincts shape resistance to AI and transformation The hidden cost of constant change and why ambiguity makes it worse Why most companies are using AI for efficiency instead of rethinking work design The overlooked role of middle managers in driving real change Why reskilling often misses the point in an AI-powered workplace Fear versus agency and how leaders choose to play not to lose or play to win The deeply human skills that AI cannot replace but can amplify What leaders must unlearn to build more adaptive and human organizations Guest: Al Dea is a Talent, Leadership, and Workplace Executive Coach, Speaker, and Facilitator who is passionate about helping leaders build organizations that grow their people and bring teams together to achieve meaningful business outcomes. He is the Founder and Owner of The Edge of Work, a leadership development consulting firm that partners with organizations to address critical people and workplace challenges, including leadership development, manager effectiveness, team performance, and upskilling power skills such as influence, emotional intelligence, collaboration, communication, and career management. Al’s mission is to inspire leaders to build better and more human companies that unlock the potential and performance of their people. He does this by advising leaders on workplace trends and delivering leadership training that helps employees navigate and thrive in today’s rapidly changing world of work. Previously, Al worked at Salesforce and Deloitte Consulting, where he helped Fortune 500 companies drive organizational transformation through digital technology. His insights have been featured in publications such as The Wall Street Journal, MIT Sloan Management Review, Time, Fast Company, Inc Magazine, and The World Economic Forum. Follow Jason Averbook: Substack: https://substack.com/@jasonaverbook X: https://x.com/jasonaverbook LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/jasonaverbook Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/jasonaverbook YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@nowtonextwithjasonaverbook Facebook: https://facebook.com/jasonaverbook Follow Al Dea: LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/itsaldea/ (0:00) Introduction (4:01) Family Influence and Parenting Philosophies (7:29) Solopreneurship and Industry Impact (8:39) Conversations vs. Surveys in Organizational Change (11:47) Change Management and Human Instincts (16:31) Navigating Information Overload (19:02) AI: Automation vs. Work Design (20:58) Organizational Challenges and Middle Management (24:11) AI Integration and IT's Role (25:36) Reskilling in the Age of AI (27:24) Bridging IT and Talent Departments (28:30) Upskilling for an AI Future (30:34) Addressing Fear of Obsolescence (33:08) Embracing Change and Upskilling (35:18) AI's Impact on Personal Productivity (37:34) The Human Element in Business (41:38) Future Skills: Curiosity, Trust, Discernment, Agility (42:02) Al Dea's Focus on Developing Leaders (43:19) The Role of Curiosity in Change (44:35) Closing remarks
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