NPR's Book of the Day:

“A Psychoanalyst and a Priest Share Insights in 'Love's Labor' and 'Work in Progress'”

Date: February 27, 2026
Host: Andrew Limbong
Guests: Stephen Gross (psychoanalyst, author of Love’s Labor), Father James Martin (Jesuit priest, author of Work in Progress)

Episode Overview

This episode delves into the emotional and spiritual “work” underlying two of life’s most profound pursuits: loving and serving others. Andrew Limbong introduces two individuals with “container” jobs—roles that require holding space for others’ stories and well-being—a psychoanalyst and a priest.
Key Focus:

• Stephen Gross discusses Love’s Labor and the intricate, sometimes painful work of forming and sustaining love.
• Father James Martin shares wisdom from Work in Progress, reflecting on how varied jobs and life experiences shape spiritual vocation and personal growth.

Stephen Gross: Untangling the Labors of Love

Interviewed by H.R. Rascoe
(Segments: 01:31–10:12)

Key Insights and Discussion Points

• The Myth vs. Reality of Love (01:31)

  • Gross points out that, while love is glorified in art and culture, “love is work.”
  • "To me, we deceive ourselves about love...they know they've had experiences where they've not seen very clearly the who, what and why of who they love." — Stephen Gross (01:48)
  • Love, in his view, is a continual process of “undoing self-deception” and working toward clarity and authenticity in relationships (02:14).

• Story Selection and Hard-Won Truths (02:39)

  • Gross describes his book as "a collection of hard-won truths" uncovered over 40 years of practice.
  • He cites Vonnegut: “Write from what matters to you in your heart, and you want to matter to people in their hearts.” (03:06)
  • Stories chosen for their emotional resonance—“They got to me. These are the patients where I really felt, gosh, we learned something important here.” (03:18)

• Case Study: Sophie’s Dilemma (03:24–06:08)

  • Sophie, unable to mail her wedding invitations, symbolizes the fear that “all love involves letting go” (04:30).
  • Years later, she’s stuck at a marital crossroads. Gross reframes the crisis as an opportunity for “breakdown to become a breakthrough.”
  • "She came to me, like a lot of people do. There will be a crisis in a marriage. And in my chair...I'm thinking, can we turn this breakdown into a breakthrough?" — Stephen Gross (04:56)
  • Host remarks: “So many people will focus on whether they stay in the marriage—yes, but y’all not even together.” (05:36)

• Case Study: Ravi’s Heartache and Self-Deception (06:08–07:35)

  • Ravi’s conviction his wife is cheating is revealed to be projection, stemming from envy—he “wasn’t prepared to do [the] work” of truly loving.
  • Gross calls this “the ecstasy of sanctimony”—how hard it is to give up a righteous grievance to face one’s own faults (06:59).

• Why Change Is So Difficult (07:43–08:29)

  • Many are “attached to their unhappiness”—it’s familiar, even safer than risking joy or trust.
  • “Sometimes for various reasons, people are attached to their unhappiness. They grew up maybe in an unhappy family. It's more familiar to them than happiness or pleasure.” — Stephen Gross (07:43)

• How to Let Go—The Path of Vulnerability (08:29–10:06)

  • Letting go and truly loving requires time, honest self-examination, and learning from pain.
  • “Pain is maybe one of the best instruments we have for knowing our heart...Are we suffering because a person is putting us down or because we miss them? ... It's watching all those things, looking internally at our feelings and seeing how someone makes us feel.” — Stephen Gross (09:28)

Notable Quotes

• “All love involves letting go of something, to have the new thing.” — Stephen Gross (04:30)
• “If you really love someone, you're going to see things in yourself which aren't pleasant to see.” — Stephen Gross (07:13)

Father James Martin: Finding Vocation in Every Kind of Work

Interviewed by Scott Detrow
(Segments: 11:06–18:48)

Key Insights and Discussion Points

• Why Write About All These Jobs? (11:42–12:02)

  • Martin says Work in Progress aims to show “how God is at work in everybody’s life”—no matter the job.
  • He also wanted to share “some of the stories were pretty funny.” (11:49)

• Reading Teenage Diaries—A Glimpse at the ‘Unmediated Self’ (12:02–12:56)

  • Found his old journals: Surprised by how “shallow” and self-focused he was, mostly worried about being liked. (12:15)
  • “It was a shock to kind of, you know, meet myself unmediated.” — James Martin (12:50)

• Lessons from Being a Golf Caddy (12:56–14:11)

  • Caddying taught him “when to stop talking and when to be quiet”—and the sting of being treated as invisible labor.
  • A vow: “I’m never going to treat people like this...I’m going to talk to them and treat them like human beings.” — James Martin (13:44)

• On Vocations and the Challenge of Survival Work (14:11–15:40)

  • Explains “vocation” comes from Latin “vocari”—to be called.
  • Not everyone has the luxury to pursue their dream vocation; survival sometimes takes precedence.
  • “But to understand work as dignified and as humane, right. Even if you can't fulfill what you think God is calling you to be.” — James Martin (15:32)

• Confronting Loss and Anger at God (15:40–17:18)

  • Losing close friends in a tragic accident, Martin “rejected God” (16:07).
  • A pivotal conversation with a Christian friend led to a new understanding: one can have a relationship “with a God you don’t understand.”
  • “It was the first time I really understood that you could be in a relationship with God, a God that you didn’t understand.” — James Martin (16:36)

• Still a ‘Work in Progress’ (17:50–18:42)

  • Even as an adult, still motivated by a deep desire to be liked.
  • Navigating criticism, especially given his outreach to LGBTQ Catholics.
  • “That's still within me...I do a lot of work with LGBTQ Catholics and that means a lot of people hate me today. So it's still something I'm working on.” — James Martin (18:11)

Notable Quotes

• “I think we all have a vocation to be the person that God is calling us to be. That's the deepest vocation.” — James Martin (14:47)
• “I vowed to myself...I’m never going to treat people like this.” — James Martin (13:46)
• “It's not just me as a teenager and a 20-year-old, it's me now...” — James Martin (18:07)

Memorable Moments (with Timestamps)

• The labor of love is “breaking and making bonds”—each involving real, hard work. (02:14, 06:59, 09:28)
• Sophie’s paralyzed by fear—can’t mail her wedding invitations. (03:33–04:30; shows how love always costs us something.)
• Father Martin learns dignity and empathy on the golf course. (13:05–13:46)
• The challenge and grace of living with unanswered questions—about love, about God, about ourselves. (16:36, 18:11)

Conclusion:

This episode pairs moving stories from a psychoanalyst and a priest, each reckoning with the immense work of loving deeply—whether as a partner, therapist, or spiritual guide. Listeners are left with the reminder that being authentic and committed to love, vocation, or faith involves ongoing labor, vulnerability, and self-examination. Both authors, Stephen Gross and James Martin, invite us to embrace being, in their words and lives, “a work in progress.”