NPR’s Book of the Day: ‘Dinner with King Tut’ — Exploring the Past Through Experimental Archaeology

Episode Date: August 26, 2025
Host: Andrew Limbong
Guest: Sam Kean, author of Dinner with King Tut
Interviewed by: Ayesha Rascoe

Episode Overview

This episode highlights Sam Kean’s new book, Dinner with King Tut, which delves into the fascinating world of experimental archaeology—a branch of archaeology where researchers attempt to re-create the experiences, challenges, and daily lives of ancient people by living as they did. The conversation explores the appeal and limitations of learning history by “doing,” the insights gained from firsthand engagement, and the tensions between experimental practitioners and traditional academics. Kean also reflects on the storytelling techniques he used to weave together research and imagined narratives, and the enduring mysteries that keep archaeologists searching.

Key Discussion Points & Insights

The Limits of Reading and the Power of Doing

• Andrew Limbong opens: “Do not get mad at me for saying this, but there are limits to what you can learn from reading… Doing is the better way to learn. And doing is what Sam Kean’s new book is all about.” [00:02]
• Experimental archaeology goes beyond text and artifacts—by embodying ancient practices, practitioners can experience history’s sounds, smells, and challenges directly.

Living the Past: Eating, Crafting, and Surviving

• Sam Kean recounts: sampling foods like caterpillars, walrus, acorn bread (“which did not turn out well when I made it”), and describes how knowledgeable teachers transform the experience:

  “I was amazed, first of all, by just the sheer variety of things that people were eating thousands of years ago and also just how delicious some of it was... you don't get the sounds, you don't get the smells, you don't get the tastes the way you do in experimental archeology.” —Sam Kean [02:40]

• Insights into ancient weapon- and tool-making:
  • Flint “napping” for weapons and stone tools
  • Crafting poisons
• Grueling traditional tasks:
  • “I brain tanned some leather. So you take a hide and you mix the brains in, essentially, to treat the hide and turn it into… clothing for yourself, that's just what you would have had to do in that time.” —Sam Kean [03:28–03:59]
  • “It was a little squishy... My shoulders are pretty sore. The flies had a field day…” —Sam Kean [03:59]

Blending Fact and Fiction: Deepening Empathy

• The book’s structure features each civilization as a chapter, mixing:
  • Kean’s own experiences
  • Historical research
  • Short stories with fictionalized characters to vividly imagine the past

  “To really get deep down into the character, I realized that fiction would be a better way to do that. So everything that happens to this person, to the main character, could and would have happened to people at the time.” —Sam Kean [04:48]

• Kean is candid about the harshness of ancient life:
  • “The past was a rough place.” —Sam Kean [05:23]

Ancient Egypt & Pyramid Mysteries

• Discussion of the enduring puzzle: constructing the pyramids without modern tools or even wheels.
• Story of Roger Larson, a Mississippi carpenter experimenting with practical methods:
  • Traditional ramp-and-roller theories seem unworkable
  • Larson’s pyramid machine uses A-frames, winches, and ropes—showing how blocks might be lifted efficiently

  “He and some friends got together and they were essentially using this machine to drag these blocks that weighed thousands of pounds up a slope in the quarry to show that this might have been a way that they could have gotten blocks up the side of the pyramid.” —Sam Kean [07:01]

Experimental Archaeology vs. Academic Tradition

• Not all archaeologists support hands-on experimentation; skepticism persists:

  “There is a bit of a tension within the field... there’s a contingent... that kind of the whole idea of it is off, or that you can't really learn any true insights by running an experiment.” —Sam Kean [07:21]

  • Some skepticism is justified due to risks of inaccuracy and poor methods.
• Role of indigenous and native communities:

  “...to them, this isn't, you know, archeology. This is actually their ancestry... they're actually correcting [archaeologists] and ...showing them how their ancestors lived and sort of bringing their knowledge to bear on this.” —Sam Kean [08:16]

Enduring Mysteries and Next Frontiers

• Kean’s fascination with “quipus,” the knot-based record-keeping system of the Incas:

  “They actually recorded information on knotted strings. So they would tie a knot into the string to encode information... there's a swath of them that we just don't know how to read.” —Sam Kean [08:54]

• Even with reconstruction and experimentation, history still holds countless secrets.

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• “Archeology in general does a very good job of what the past looks like... But you don't get the sounds, you don't get the smells, you don't get the tastes the way you do in experimental archeology.” —Sam Kean [02:40]
• “One thing that page after page of the book drove home was just how hard it was sometimes to do basic things like get a meal.” —Sam Kean [03:28]
• “The ramps that you would have had to build to get to the very top of the pyramids... ends up being something like two or three times the volume of the pyramid itself. It seems impossible...” —Sam Kean [06:34]
• “In a lot of cases, this is, you know, academics, professional archaeologists doing this work. But one really... interesting aspect of this field is that you have a lot of, you know, indigenous communities, native communities, who to them, this isn't, you know, archeology. This is actually their ancestry.” —Sam Kean [08:02]
• “I actually just wrote a story recently about something they're called the quipus, which are a language maybe that the Inca used in Peru... there's a swath of them that we just don't know how to read...” —Sam Kean [08:50]

Timestamps for Key Segments

• 00:02 — Introduction: The limits of learning by reading, experimental archaeology explained
• 02:09 — Sam Kean on immersive, edible, and practical adventures in the past
• 03:28 — Uncovering the difficulty and mess of ancient crafts
• 04:16 — The hybrid format: Mix of research, memoir, and fiction
• 05:26 — Ancient Egypt: Unraveling the pyramid-building mystery
• 07:21 — Tension between experimentalists and professional/academic archaeology
• 08:50 — The Inca quipus and the allure of ancient unresolved mysteries

Conclusion

Dinner with King Tut uses experimental archaeology not only to crack academic mysteries, but to humanize and vividly recapture the sounds, tastes, smells, and lived experience of lost civilizations. Sam Kean’s narrative blends direct immersion, collaborative practice with indigenous knowledge holders, and creative storytelling to bring the reader—and, by extension, the listener—a step closer to understanding how ancient people survived, struggled, and thrived.

For anyone fascinated by history’s hidden corners, Kean’s work and this discussion offer a unique window into the power and pitfalls of seeing the past through hands-on experimentation.