Episode Overview

Podcast: NPR's Book of the Day
Episode Title: 'The Definitions' features dorm room conversation – with a dystopian twist
Date: January 12, 2026
Host: Andrew Limbong (A), Interview by Lauren Frayer (C)
Guest: Matt Green (D), author of The Definitions

Main Theme:
This episode spotlights Matt Green’s new novel, The Definitions—a philosophical, dystopian tale about college-aged survivors in a world where a memory-erasing virus has upended their lives, forcing them to grapple with language, meaning, and authority at a mysterious institution. The conversation explores how language can both connect and isolate, and how dystopian fiction can raise lingering questions rather than provide answers.

Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Inspiration for the Novel

• Global Politics and Pandemic Influence (01:41–02:15)

  • Green discusses the novel’s roots in observing recent global political trends, particularly a “rush towards authoritarianism” and concerns over the “disconnect between language and meaning.”
  • Parental experience inspired the story: Green’s son recently started school, and the author observed how swiftly social hierarchies form among children after pandemic isolation.
  • Quote:

    “The sort of rush towards authoritarianism from electorates across the world was definitely a big consideration... But the main thing probably was that my oldest son started school.”
    — Matt Green (01:41)

• Children’s Socialization Post-Pandemic (02:15–02:33)

  • Green reflects on his son's lack of childcare before school and how quickly children reestablish social norms.
  • Quote:

    “It’s fascinating seeing kids socialize... and seeing how quickly these social hierarchies and structures develop.”
    — Matt Green (02:15)

2. The Setting: The Center and Its Students

• Structure of the Institution (02:33–03:37)

  • Students arrive nameless, stripped of memories, and acquire names through cryptic “cartridges.”
  • The initial premise is that they will recover memories, but the institution is more of a re-education camp, instilling a specific political ideology.
  • Quote:

    “They are essentially infantilized. They’ve been reduced to this childhood state... What becomes clear is that this centre is less a medical institution and more of a re education camp.”
    — Matt Green (03:00)

• Dystopian Twist

  • The ambiguity over whether students can ever leave, or if the ideological programming is the true aim.

3. Language as an Imperfect Tool

• Debate Over Definitions (03:37–04:30)

  • Novel includes a memorable philosophical debate: what makes a bench a bench or a chair a chair?
  • Lauren Frayer reads a passage highlighting the characters’ struggle to agree on core definitions.
    • Quote from Novel:

      “In the end, we decided a chair was a chair if it was close enough to the image of a chair that we had in our minds when someone said the word chair. But this too, proved impossible to apply... Who was to say that my perfect chair wasn't really a bench or a horse or a bicycle?” — (03:37)

• Impermanence and Ideology in Language (04:30–05:41)

  • Green explains the premise: language is a fallible conduit for meaning. The students’ only hope for connection lies in language, but at the same time, definition is inherently fluid and susceptible to ideological influence.
  • Quote:

    “Language is this really imperfect conduit... At the same time, it offers them their most feasible possible opportunity for meaningful connection... nothing can truly be defined in an uncontroversial way. There’s always some ideological input that is driving that.”
    — Matt Green (04:30)

4. Dystopian Curriculum: Control and Subservience

• Curriculum and Power (05:41–06:18)

  • Classes include not only biology and grammar, but also “Politeness” and “Intermediate Subservience,” reminiscent of Orwellian or Huxleyan dystopias.
  • Only some characters start to question the system; for most, suspicion comes slowly, if at all.

• Reader’s Dramatic Irony (06:04–06:36)

  • Frayer and Green note how the reader perceives danger or manipulation before the characters do, creating a horror-esque tension.
  • Quote:

    “It’s kind of like watching a horror film and watching them go down to the basement with the flashlight. Right. You know that something is afoot and they certainly don’t.”
    — Matt Green (06:18)

5. Open-Endedness and Reader Reflection

• Lingering Questions (06:36–07:07)
  • Green intentionally leaves many questions unresolved, hoping readers will continue to grapple with the novel’s themes after finishing.
  • Quote:

    “I was quite keen that the reader go away with some questions and I didn’t want it to be something that it resolves for the reader in a way that they can then package it away and not reflect on it. My hope... is that they’ll sit with the questions and arrive at their own answers.”
    — Matt Green (06:39)

Memorable Moments & Quotes

• Philosophy of Language Echoes:

  • Frayer describes the novel’s word debates as “straight out of my philosophy classes in college,” capturing how the book tackles big ideas in accessible, character-driven ways. (03:37)

• Dystopian Recognition:

  • Green’s aim: characters do not recognize their own dystopia, maintaining reader suspense and engagement. (06:18)

Important Timestamps

• Inspiration and Themes: 01:41–02:33
• Worldbuilding: The Center: 02:33–03:37
• Philosophy of Language Passage: 03:37–04:30
• Language, Meaning, Faith: 04:30–05:41
• Control/Ideological Education: 05:41–06:36
• Lingering Questions and Reader’s Experience: 06:36–07:07

Conclusion

The Definitions blends collegiate philosophizing with a chilling exploration of memory, language, and ideology. Through dynamic conversation, Matt Green and Lauren Frayer delve into how the novel interrogates the basics of understanding and the frightening ease with which meaning—and memory—can be remade. Green’s hope is for his novel to instill questions rather than provide comfort, leaving readers contemplating both language and the world long after closing the book.