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Episode: What Toni Morrison learned from revisiting five of her most-read novels
Date: September 18, 2025
Host: Andrew Limbong
Guest: Toni Morrison
Interviewer: Renee Montagne
Episode Overview
This special episode features a 2004 interview with Nobel Laureate Toni Morrison, reflecting on her experience revisiting her most-read novels while preparing new forewords for a special paperback collection. Renee Montagne sits down with Morrison in her Manhattan apartment to discuss the ghosts that haunt her work, the unexpected personal revelations found when rereading her novels, the profound influence of her parents, and the emotional risks intertwined with love in her stories—particularly within the context of slavery and freedom.
Key Discussion Points & Insights
The Concept of “Haunting” in Morrison’s Work
- Toni Morrison explains her use of “haunting”:
- Morrison views ghosts and haunting as a heightened state of alertness, not something to be feared ([01:49]).
- Quote:
“If you are really alert, then you see the life that exists beyond the life that is on top. It's not spooky, necessarily. Might be, but it doesn't have to be. It's something I relish rather than run.”
— Toni Morrison [01:49]
Memory, Identity, and Autobiographical Echoes
- Morrison discovers her own life within her fiction:
- While writing new forewords, Morrison unexpectedly confronted how her own memories and experiences colored her novels:
“I loathe people who say, ‘Is this you? Is this your life?’... But somehow I had not recognized the haunting alertness to certain events which instigated or colored the novel that I was writing.”
— Toni Morrison [03:10] - She shares a childhood memory of exploring her mother’s trunk—finding Jazz Age clothes and injuring her hand—which later shaped “Jazz” ([03:10–03:54]).
- While writing new forewords, Morrison unexpectedly confronted how her own memories and experiences colored her novels:
The Enduring Influence of Family
- Her father’s vision and support:
- Morrison describes the double mourning after her father’s death—him, and the idealized daughter in his mind ([04:24]).
“What I didn't have was that girl that he was so convinced that I was. And that girl was really clever and so much fun.”
— Toni Morrison [04:41] - Though not a reader, her father enjoyed her work. Morrison fondly recalls overhearing him laugh while reading “Sula” ([04:41–05:19]).
- Morrison describes the double mourning after her father’s death—him, and the idealized daughter in his mind ([04:24]).
- How her father’s death transformed her writing of “Song of Solomon”:
- Morrison struggled with writing male characters, but after her father’s death, imagined confidence “from him” allowed her to write ([05:19–06:14]).
“No information came at that moment... It was just this sudden confidence from him that when I needed him for some information, in my imagination it would be there and it would be right on time.”
— Toni Morrison [05:23]
- Morrison struggled with writing male characters, but after her father’s death, imagined confidence “from him” allowed her to write ([05:19–06:14]).
Origin Stories Behind “Beloved” and the Power of Love
- A spectral vision leading to “Beloved”:
- Morrison describes seeing a woman walk out of the Hudson River—an apparition inspiring “Beloved”'s central characters ([06:14–06:52]).
- Literary depiction of love amid danger:
- Morrison recounts writing a scene where the union of two former slaves is described in poetic, intimate language:
“The language moves from what she thought and what he thought, so that in the end you don't know who's thinking what. Which is the way of describing their union...their love.”
— Toni Morrison [06:55] - On the ever-present risk of loving as an enslaved person:
“To love something is almost inevitably to lose it. Because these people are slaves and they are ex-slaves...which is why it's dangerous. It's so satisfying and so complete. And you are going to lose it.”
— Toni Morrison [08:24]
- Morrison recounts writing a scene where the union of two former slaves is described in poetic, intimate language:
Visualizing Her Younger Self
- The portrait in Morrison’s home:
- Renee notices a portrait of a young woman with “hopes you have for her she could fulfill”—it is a drawing of a young Toni Morrison ([08:34–08:54]).
- Morrison reflects that the image embodies the kind of girl her father believed she was—“really smart and whose company was really interesting.”
“That's just my fantasy about the kind of girl he thought I was.”
— Toni Morrison [08:54] - Montagne gently insists:
“As you say that, of course, I can't imagine that anyone listening wouldn't be thinking, but you are that girl, you say?”
— Renee Montagne [09:14] - Morrison simply:
“Yeah.”
— Toni Morrison [09:25]
Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments
-
On the meaning of ghosts and haunting:
“It's something I relish rather than run.”
— Toni Morrison [01:49] -
On discovering herself in her writing:
“I had not recognized the haunting alertness to certain events which instigated or colored the novel that I was writing at the time.”
— Toni Morrison [03:10] -
On her father's unique understanding of her:
“That girl was really clever and so much fun. Fun to be around.”
— Toni Morrison [04:41] -
On love's inherent peril for the formerly enslaved:
“To love something is almost inevitably to lose it. Because these people are slaves and they are ex-slaves.”
— Toni Morrison [08:24] -
On embodying her father’s hopes:
“That's just my fantasy about the kind of girl he thought I was.”
— Toni Morrison [08:54]
Important Segment Timestamps
- [01:49] — Morrison’s meaning of being “pleasantly haunted”
- [03:10] — How remembering her past shaped her fiction
- [04:41] — On her father’s view of her, and him reading “Sula”
- [05:19] — Writing male characters in “Song of Solomon” after her father’s death
- [06:52] — Spectral inspiration for “Beloved”
- [06:55–08:03] — Writing about love for ex-slaves in “Beloved”
- [08:54] — The portrait and Morrison's reflection on her younger self
Summary Conclusion
This episode is an intimate, enlightening conversation with Toni Morrison in which she candidly discusses the intersection of memory, family, and the supernatural—both in her writing and her life. Listeners are treated to rare insights into how Morrison’s personal history haunted and shaped her iconic novels, the profound risks and rewards of love under oppression, and the indelible impressions left by loved ones, both absent and imagined. Morrison’s reflections are rich, poetic, and deeply human—offering both seasoned readers and new audiences fresh reasons to revisit her novels.