Ep 287: Santiago Lastra

Summary

Off Menu Podcast Episode 287: Santiago Lastra

Hosts: Ed Gamble and James Acaster
Guest: Santiago Lastra
Release Date: April 9, 2025

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1. Welcoming Santiago Lastra [03:19 - 08:58]

Ed Gamble and James Acaster kick off Episode 287 by warmly welcoming Santiago Lastra, a renowned chef known for his exceptional Mexican cuisine. Ed praises Santiago as "one of our favorite chefs," highlighting their long-standing admiration since the podcast's early days (04:01). James adds, "We've been talking about him on the podcast for a long time," emphasizing Santiago's influence and reputation in the culinary scene.

2. Santiago's Culinary Journey and Restaurants [08:58 - 13:38]

Santiago delves into his entrepreneurial journey, detailing the evolution of his restaurants. He mentions Col, a fine dining establishment in London, and Fonda, a more casual dining space that focuses on regional Mexican cooking. Santiago explains, "Fonda is the food that I will make in my house here in London," illustrating his commitment to authentic and handmade dishes (13:38).

Ed notes the impressive growth, stating, "From popping up to now opening Fonda, it's all happened in about five years," acknowledging the challenges Santiago overcame, including navigating the competitive London restaurant scene during the COVID-19 pandemic (09:52).

3. Authenticity in Mexican Cuisine in the UK [11:38 - 13:38]

Santiago discusses the misconceptions surrounding Mexican cuisine in the UK, distinguishing between authentic Mexican food and Tex-Mex variants. He asserts, "Mexican food is made from scratch...needs everything to be made by hand on the day," criticizing the prevalence of pre-made ingredients in restaurants (11:56). Santiago emphasizes his dedication to preserving authentic flavors by using high-quality, locally sourced ingredients in Fonda (13:38).

4. The Dream Menu: Starters, Main Courses, and Sides [33:18 - 53:47]

Santiago unveils his Dream Menu, a meticulously crafted selection of dishes that reflect his culinary passion and cultural heritage.

• Dream Starter: Aguachile with Pink Snail (33:25)

  Santiago describes a refined version of aguachile, incorporating pink snails (conch) from Mexico. He explains, "the texture is like having the creamiest melon," and shares his experience of savoring lobster tacos in Baja California (35:57).

  "So this is the same as the hachipuri. You put sea urchin on it." — Santiago Lastra

• Main Course: Bonfire Cooked Lamb with Sides (41:28)

  Santiago details his method of slow-roasting lamb using a cross over a bonfire, infusing it with flavors from garlic, lime, and herbs. He compares it to traditional Mexican birria and barbacoa, highlighting the importance of technique and ingredient quality.

  "It's amazing. When you take the meat out, there's like, lots of juice, so it's amazing." — Santiago Lastra

• Side Dish: Guacamole (50:02)

  The guacamole is made from criollo avocados, with the unique addition of edible skin, offering a licorice-like flavor. Santiago emphasizes simplicity, avoiding additives like mayonnaise to preserve authentic taste.

  "Our guacamole doesn't have any olive oil or any mayonnaise or anything." — Santiago Lastra

• Dream Dessert: Santiago’s Cheesecake (63:45)

  Reflecting on his childhood, Santiago introduces a traditional baked cheesecake recipe brought from his hometown. The dessert features a cookie-like base blended with melted butter, condensed milk, and fresh Philadelphia cheese, topped with blackberry jam.

  "It was one of those things that I enjoyed a lot since I was like 8 years old." — Santiago Lastra

• Dream Drink: Mezcal (56:16)

  Santiago recommends mezcal for its natural ingredients and unique flavor profile that enhances the dining experience without the dreaded hangover, provided it's enjoyed responsibly.

  "Mezcal makes you feel like joy and gives you a boost of energy." — Santiago Lastra

5. Cultural Insights and Culinary Techniques [08:58 - 47:34]

Santiago shares anecdotes about his culinary explorations, including experiences in Eastern Europe and Spain, which have influenced his approach to cooking. He discusses traditional dishes like Georgian hachipura and Mexican consomme, emphasizing the blend of flavors and textures that define authentic Mexican cuisine.

James interjects humorously, connecting culinary techniques to pop culture references, such as Santiago recounting being "a lobster" or "the lamb," adding levity to the conversation (36:28).

Santiago also touches on the challenges and rewards of maintaining authenticity while adapting to different markets, noting, "It's about adapting and having this mentality of change and evolving" (10:30).

6. Light-Hearted Banter and Behind-the-Scenes Stories [47:34 - 77:23]

The hosts and Santiago engage in playful banter, recounting humorous moments from Santiago's restaurant experiences, such as James' imaginary lobster and lamb transformations. They discuss quirky traditions, like mezcal infusions with turkey breast, and Santiago's childhood cheesecake sales to teachers, likening it to a mini-business venture (66:44).

Ed and James share laughs over language translations and the playful misinterpretations of words like "aguacate," leading to a humorous exploration of cultural differences in food terminology (50:20).

7. Finalizing the Dream Menu and Closing Remarks [72:05 - 75:52]

Santiago and the hosts collaboratively outline the complete Dream Menu, reinforcing the uniqueness and cultural depth of each dish:

• Water with a dash of sea buckthorn juice
• Kachapuri with sea urchins
• Lobster tacos and aguachile with pink snail, the conch
• Bonfire-roasted lamb with mashed potatoes and purple cabbage
• Beautiful guacamole with sizzling tortillas
• Mezcal-infused drinks
• Santiago's classic cheesecake
• After Party: Slice of watermelon

Ed and James express their anticipation and excitement for Santiago's creations, urging listeners to visit his restaurants, Fonda for a casual dining experience and Col for a fine dining adventure.

"Pop along to Fonda. Go to Cole. Both delicious." — Ed Gamble

James concludes with enthusiastic endorsements, highlighting the delectable nature of Santiago's menu and the engaging conversation they've shared.

8. Conclusion [75:52 - End]

The episode wraps up with thanks to Santiago Lastra for sharing his culinary insights and dream menu, leaving listeners inspired to explore authentic Mexican cuisine and visit Santiago's esteemed restaurants.

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Notable Quotes with Timestamps

• Ed Gamble (04:01): "Santiago Lastra is an amazing chef. One of our favorite chefs."

• James Acaster (05:30): "If he says cheese slices, we will push him for the brand."

• Santiago Lastra (13:28): "Fonda is the food that I will make in my house here in London."

• Santiago Lastra (33:25): "Our dream starter is a combination... it's the conch."

• Santiago Lastra (41:28): "My favorite is the lamb. So you have these lambs that you cook in the cross, like a Patagonian style."

• Santiago Lastra (50:02): "Our guacamole doesn't have any olive oil or any mayonnaise or anything."

• Santiago Lastra (63:45): "We're doing this cheesecake actually in Fonda. We're gonna have the Santiago's cheesecake on the menu."

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Final Thoughts

Episode 287 of Off Menu with Ed Gamble and James Acaster offers a rich and engaging exploration into the world of authentic Mexican cuisine through the lens of celebrated chef Santiago Lastra. From his dedication to genuine flavors to the intricate crafting of his dream menu, Santiago provides listeners with valuable insights and mouth-watering descriptions that are sure to inspire food enthusiasts. The hosts' humorous interactions further enhance the episode, making it both informative and entertaining for those seeking to delve into the culinary artistry of Santiago Lastra.

Transcript

[Ed Gamble]

Huge news from Off Menu Towers. James.

[James Acaster]

Big announcements.

[Ed Gamble]

We've just added extra dates for Off Menu live the tasting menus at the Royal Albert Hall. We will be there on Sunday 15th March 2026 at 2pm Sunday 15th March at 7.30pm it's on Sunday 15th March two shows 2026 tickets from RoyalAlbert Hall.com and ctickets.com.

[Santiago Lastra]

Race the Rudders.

[James Acaster]

Race the sails.

[Santiago Lastra]

Race the sails.

[James Acaster]

Captain, an unidentified ship is approaching. Over.

[Santiago Lastra]

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[Ed Gamble]

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[Santiago Lastra]

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[Ed Gamble]

Welcome to the off menu podcast. Taking the egg of conversation, wrapping it in the sausage meat of friendship, rolling it in the breadcrumbs of humor and baking it in the oven of the Internet. Or frying it in actually in the oil of the Internet. Scotch egg.

[James Acaster]

That's scotch. Ed Gamble. My name is James.

[Ed Gamble]

James.

[James Acaster]

And together we own a dream restaurant, James Egg Caster.

[Ed Gamble]

Egg James Egg Caster.

[James Acaster]

And every single week, we invite in a guest and we ask them their favorite ever start a bagel, dessert side dish and drink. Not in that order. And this week, our guest is Santiago Lustra.

[Ed Gamble]

Santiago Lustra is an amazing chef. James.

[James Acaster]

Yes.

[Ed Gamble]

One of our favorite chefs. It would be fair to say we've.

[James Acaster]

Been talking about him on the podcast for a long time. We have since the early days. I'm sure we'll talk to him about the meals that we've had that he's made us both in his restaurant and once in his home.

[Ed Gamble]

Yes, he has Col, which is one of the best restaurants in London. Fine dining tasting menu, Mexican restaurants in London. But he has now opened Fonda, which is a more casual affair. And we are very excited to try it.

[James Acaster]

Yeah.

[Ed Gamble]

And we're very excited to speak to Santiago. But his dream menu. We love having chefs on.

[James Acaster]

We love having chefs on. You always get a little, you know, it's interesting to hear what the, you know, it's like, who cuts the barber's hair?

[Ed Gamble]

Yeah. That's a good idea for a podcast. Write that down, Benito. Good idea for a new addition.

[James Acaster]

Barbers on. And ask them who cuts their hair.

[Ed Gamble]

Who cuts their hair?

[James Acaster]

Well, Benito sending other barbers, by the way, I don't know if that's true.

[Ed Gamble]

Yeah. So there's a good idea for the podcast. We get a barber in. We say who cuts your hair? We get that barber in. Eventually we're going to find a barber who cuts his own hair because who watches the Watchman?

[James Acaster]

Listen, I know that we're messing around, but that I do that.

[Ed Gamble]

Yeah.

[James Acaster]

If you want to make the barber podcast.

[Ed Gamble]

Yeah.

[James Acaster]

And it can be a limited series. I don't, you know, we'll see how long.

[Ed Gamble]

Yeah.

[James Acaster]

Because I say we record all of them before we Release any of them.

[Ed Gamble]

Yes.

[James Acaster]

So we keep going until we get to the barber who cuts their own hair.

[Ed Gamble]

Yeah.

[James Acaster]

And then we release all of them as a series.

[Ed Gamble]

Yeah.

[James Acaster]

And it's one thing. And it's who cuts the barber's hair.

[Ed Gamble]

Yeah. And it's a quick. It's a quick podcast. So for you, Benito, in the edit.

[James Acaster]

Yeah.

[Ed Gamble]

There's not a lot that you'll have to cut.

[James Acaster]

Oh, brilliant. He's agreed to it. Santiago Lastra is a wonderful chef, but if he says a secret ingredient, an ingredient which we deem to be unacceptable, we will kick him out of the dream restaurant.

[Ed Gamble]

We will.

[James Acaster]

And this week, the secret ingredient is Dairy Lee.

[Ed Gamble]

Cheese slices.

[James Acaster]

Cheeses slices. Other Danny Dyer.

[Ed Gamble]

Danny Dyer, Yes. If you listen to the Danny Dyer episode, you'll know that he talked about eating a whole pack of dairy cheese slices, sat on his sofa with a fan, blowing the little wrappers everywhere. And look, I do it.

[James Acaster]

Yep.

[Ed Gamble]

But it's a good secret ingredient.

[James Acaster]

Yeah. This is something that we can do now is we can just pluck secret ingredients from other guests episodes and do that as well. So, you know, because, look, is it the format point we regret the most in the podcast? Sure. But actually, Ed probably regrets more the fact he has to come up with a little intro every single episode and.

[Ed Gamble]

Yeah.

[James Acaster]

Come up with a different meal and.

[Ed Gamble]

Well, I've definitely repeated some, haven't I? I must have done lasagna about eight times now.

[James Acaster]

And if you can find all those episodes, tweet Benito and he will send you a side chopping board. Hopefully Santiago will not say derelict.

[Ed Gamble]

I'd be surprised, but sometimes chefs come in and they're like, yeah, I don't have time to cook properly at home. I don't have time to do the fancy stuff. So when I get back, I'm just going to have a pack of dairy lychee slices. This is true shift, and that's my dream.

[James Acaster]

Yeah. So it might come up.

[Ed Gamble]

It might come up.

[James Acaster]

If he says cheese slices, we will push him for the brand.

[Ed Gamble]

Yes.

[James Acaster]

If it's dairy, he's out.

[Ed Gamble]

I beat. Look, he's been in the UK for a while now, but, you know, he is a Mexican chef. He was brought up in Mexico. I'd be surprised if Dairy Lee has reached its long udders over to Mexico.

[James Acaster]

This is the thing about this podcast is that we. We can find out. Yeah, we can find out how culture spreads around the world and how different cultures embrace other.

[Ed Gamble]

Good title.

[James Acaster]

Things of different kinds.

[Ed Gamble]

Good title for another podcast. Do they have Dairy In Mexico.

[James Acaster]

A great question. A great question. A great. That's like, no such thing as a fish.

[Ed Gamble]

It's going to be top of the charts. Do they have dairy in Mexico?

[James Acaster]

Yeah. Second will be who gots the barber's hair?

[Ed Gamble]

Yeah.

[James Acaster]

I guess old off menu will be in third place.

[Ed Gamble]

This is the off menu menu of Santiago Lastra. Welcome, Santiago, to the Dream Restaurant.

[Santiago Lastra]

Thank you so much. It's a big.

[James Acaster]

Welcome, Santiago, last year to the dream Restaurant. Been expecting you for some time.

[Santiago Lastra]

Thank you. Thank you. It's a big honor to be here.

[Ed Gamble]

That's what we like to hear. That's not enough people tell us it's an honor.

[James Acaster]

No, not at all. That might be a first, actually, for the podcast. We'll have to go back and listen to all of them, but. Just dropped his pen on the floor. Benito, we've just been told it's an honor to be on the podcast. And you drop. You're dropping your pen.

[Santiago Lastra]

Maybe you got too excited.

[Ed Gamble]

Yeah.

[James Acaster]

Get too excited.

[Ed Gamble]

I'm so excited to hear that. It's an honor to be here.

[James Acaster]

It's right.

[Ed Gamble]

Why don't we double check at the end whether you still think.

[Santiago Lastra]

Let's think of the end.

[James Acaster]

It's an honor for us to have you on the podcast. We've spoke about you numerous times on the podcast, about how much we love your food. The skate wing tacos have been shouted out more than once. And the lovely meal that we had at your house, which was like, you just moved to London at that.

[Santiago Lastra]

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. It was in London for about a year and a half or something like that, until we found this place when we were doing some research to find out what will be the food of a restaurant and invite a few people when we believe that we're ready. When we're ready.

[Ed Gamble]

Yeah.

[Santiago Lastra]

And I remember you guys were one of the first ones to try the crazy experiments. Yeah. Yeah. So then that's why I think that is an honor, because it's just like, it's one of those things that you don't really know. When you have, like, a vision of something that doesn't exist and you kind of like, you don't know how to do it, you know, you don't know how to really make that happen, but you're thriving to create it. And the people that you meet along the way that support you at the beginning and at the end all the time, it's just like. It just really feels great how it comes back into being here, you know?

[Ed Gamble]

Yeah.

[Santiago Lastra]

Which is great.

[Ed Gamble]

I mean, it's. It happened. It, from my perspective, happened quite quickly from going from the house and then you did a pop up and then Coal opened and now you've got a new place opening called Fonda. It's not, it's not been that long that this is all. This is all.

[Santiago Lastra]

No, it's. It's about like five years.

[Ed Gamble]

Yeah, that's a lot to happen in five years.

[Santiago Lastra]

Yeah.

[Ed Gamble]

Yeah, I think so.

[Santiago Lastra]

Yeah. Yeah, it's been, it's been quick, you know, like, we also have like, you know, like Covid in the middle. So it's been. Yeah, it's just so crazy. But yeah, it's good.

[James Acaster]

Yeah. Most restaurants in five years open and close forever.

[Ed Gamble]

Yeah.

[James Acaster]

So like to open it, then open another one and do all that, you know, when there's a pandemic kicking off as well, is pretty nuts.

[Santiago Lastra]

Yeah.

[James Acaster]

Is that a secret? Is there going to be other chefs? Listen to this. Wanting some tips of how to keep their restaurants thriving in the modern day. And this guy has opened two restaurants in five years in London during COVID Yeah.

[Santiago Lastra]

I think the secret is to be able to have an open mind in a way. And I have the support of my business partners as well. And we all believe that you have to kind of be flexible and adapt. You know, I think like something that Covid, like, really, really teach us all is that you have to adapt. And, and that is what we did from day one. It's just like, okay, well, how can we do this better? How can we do this in the less complicated way? But we're still trying to, you know, be successful. And London is such a competitive city and you have to adapt to the market as well, just to adapt to the guests, adapt to whatever is happening, the produce, the media, everything, you know. So I think, and I think we are part of a generation that it needs to have that. Like, it's not about, okay, well, things used to be that way and like, people have like a specific way of doing things and it's going to work forever is more like, okay, well, what worked yesterday might not work tomorrow. So it's about adapting and having this mentality of, of, of change and evolving. You know, I think work.

[Ed Gamble]

I think you did fill a massive gap in the market though as well, certainly within the uk. Like, sure, Mexican cuisine exists in the uk, but not particularly, you know, there's not like, I think there's an idea of what Mexican food is in the UK and it's not necessarily what Mexican food actually is. Is that fair?

[Santiago Lastra]

Yeah, yeah, yeah. I mean, like, it's. It's one of those things that there was a few concepts that the Americans came out with, and they kind of take over the world with them. And one of them, I guess, was, I don't know, chicken wings. And then you have burgers. And then you have, you know, like this kind of fast food, from pizza, different things to burritos, you know, and, you know, even the pizza is like, original. From Italy, you get. You get, you know, like Domino's and Pizza Hut and all these things that. And then at the end of the day, Mexican food, like Tex Mex food was one of those hundreds of concepts that they came up with. And it's food from Texas. Like Texas used to be Mexico a long time ago, but then they come out with their own cuisine. And there is amazing Tex Mex food in Texas, this amazing Californian food in California, but it's a cuisine on its own. And I believe what the mismessage is that that's not really Mexican food, and that is. Mexican food is made from scratch. You know, you can't get cans and just put them all in a burrito and wrap it. I mean, you can make an amazing burrito, but it needs everything to be made by hand on the day. And that's something that I guess is lacking around the world. And. And there's a few people that are starting to do it properly. And it's just cuisine on its own. And it's a story to be told, you know, in a way, and we want to be part of that kind of movement.

[Ed Gamble]

So Cole, the. The original restaurant is like more of a fine dining experience. Right. But then this new. This new restaurant, Fonda, is that more of a sort of casual. A casual space, yes.

[Santiago Lastra]

Yeah, yeah, yeah. So then the idea is that we still work with a really high quality, really high quality ingredients. The. The same suppliers that we work with cold, we use them in Fonda. But it's not a tasty menu restaurant where Cole is a fine dining experience. Now we're doing around 17 courses. So then you sit down at either you for lunch or dinner, you will have 17 dishes that every dish will tell a story. And we're using 100% ingredients from the UK. Well, almost just the chili and the corn we bring from Mexico, but everything else is from Britain and we're in Fonda. It's more of an a la carte menu and it's inspired in regional Mexican cooking. But you will have dishes like a quesadilla or like a gringa or like fish tacos and stuff like that that are made like dishes that already exist. But they are the take our take on those dishes. Sprinkle some amazing ingredients and seasonal ingredients from Britain. But also we will use like olive oil and stuff like that. I mean, in a way, like Fonda is the food that I will make in my house here in London. Know, basically.

[James Acaster]

We always start with still or sparkling water. Santiago, do you have a preference?

[Santiago Lastra]

Amazing. Yeah, So I actually was thinking about. I used to be a really sparkling water person when I go to restaurants. And. But then I think now I'm getting old now, so I'm gonna be a little bit more of a. Yeah, you.

[Ed Gamble]

Don'T look old at all, Santiago.

[James Acaster]

I'll be honest. Look very old.

[Santiago Lastra]

I gonna do combinations. So that's what I do normally now.

[James Acaster]

Oh, do you?

[Santiago Lastra]

Yeah. So there is always cooking interesting thing.

[Ed Gamble]

Always pushing the envelope.

[Santiago Lastra]

Exactly, exactly. There is. There is a very interesting thing about sparkling water that the gas that is in the water has. It gives you the feeling of some sort of acidity. So the fact that the sparkling water is slightly more sour will give you a little bit more pleasure, let's say, you know. Okay. Plus the bubbles, obviously. So what I will do is to have still water.

[James Acaster]

Yeah.

[Santiago Lastra]

With a little bit of sparkling water. Like half a half.

[Ed Gamble]

Yeah.

[Santiago Lastra]

And dash of seabockthorn juice. That is this sour berry juice from England.

[Ed Gamble]

You'll be. You'll be surprised to hear that's the first time that's come up.

[James Acaster]

Yeah. What did you say? What is it?

[Santiago Lastra]

It's called seabockthorn juice. That is a berry. Yeah, it's a berry. That is the color of your shirt, actually.

[James Acaster]

Yeah.

[Ed Gamble]

Orange for the listener, Seabockton, as soon as he walked in, I thought, he's wearing a Seabockthorn T shirt.

[James Acaster]

Seabuck for boy coming in.

[Santiago Lastra]

Yeah, exactly. And it's the equivalent of having a thousand orange juices. So it has a lot of vitamin C. It's insane. And it's really good. It grows here all over the coast in the. In the uk. Very good.

[James Acaster]

So you got a drop of that. Yeah. And still water in first and then the. Yes. People wanted to make this at home.

[Santiago Lastra]

Yeah.

[James Acaster]

Is it still watering first? And then you're putting in the sp.

[Santiago Lastra]

Yeah, exactly. And then instead of the sea box juice, you can put a little bit of like a squeeze of lime juice.

[James Acaster]

Or like a slice a thousand oranges.

[Ed Gamble]

Yeah.

[Santiago Lastra]

Yes, exactly.

[James Acaster]

That's right. Juice. A thousand orange. Just put one drop of it in. Put One drop in, yeah, you're done.

[Ed Gamble]

Sea buckthorn, I'd say, is one of those ingredients that I've seen on, like, fancy menus a lot. It's not really made the transfer into the mainstream, exactly.

[Santiago Lastra]

Not as. Like, there's some shops in Somerset that they sell seabockthorn jam or likethorn. So, yeah, so it's definitely going to get its moment in some point, I believe. But probably these will help seabukorn to become a thing. I mean, like, at the end of the day, it's really healthy and it's really delicious. It's very sour. But at the same time, I mean, who has lime juice on its own, you know, like, lime juice is very sour. No one will have lime juice on its own, but they just. You squeeze a little bit. So that's why a dash the fact.

[James Acaster]

That, you know that some shops in Somerset sell it, like, I think everyone, like, normal, like, if someone comes to visit them at their house and is like, where can I get, you know, whatever food it is, whatever drink it is, they might know where locally it is. Because you're a chef.

[Santiago Lastra]

Yeah.

[James Acaster]

If someone says to you, where can I get that? You know where in the. The whole country. Because it's your job to know where to get stuff and where to get the best version of it and the best. So when we brought it up, you're like, yeah, there's some shops in Somerset. Yeah, in Somerset, which is nowhere near where I live, that sell this stuff. And I know where to get seabuck for jab and juice and everything.

[Santiago Lastra]

Yeah, exactly. I mean, at the end of the day. Yeah, it's the job. The job is to know. Because you have to do a lot of these recommendations all the time. So it's like, oh, where can I get this? You're like, but at the same time, you can always get it online. So you can buy Seabox. Don't use online.

[James Acaster]

Yes.

[Santiago Lastra]

And they get it delivered. Like you can get it from Amazon or something.

[James Acaster]

On the dark web.

[Santiago Lastra]

Yeah, on the dark web. No, the orange web.

[James Acaster]

That's lovely stuff.

[Ed Gamble]

I much prefer.

[James Acaster]

That's harmless.

[Ed Gamble]

I much prefer you saying there's some shops in Somerset rather than just going online.

[Santiago Lastra]

Yeah, I mean, like Amazon. It's one of those things. But then. Then you can just make it a whole trip. You know, just ask ChatGPT, like, where can I get Seabockton in a shop in Somerset.

[Ed Gamble]

Yeah.

[Santiago Lastra]

And plan my trip. And then you just.

[Ed Gamble]

All based around that.

[Santiago Lastra]

Yeah, exactly, yeah.

[James Acaster]

If GPT knows where to get Seabuck. Fawn, we are in trouble. It is advancing too fast.

[Ed Gamble]

AI is taking over.

[James Acaster]

It's taking over your job quickly, man. If it knows where to get the best Seabuck for it is already overtaking most human beings. We are.

[Santiago Lastra]

I'm sure he. Sure he does. Yeah, he does know. Yeah. That's crazy. But, yeah, but we use it. I use it. I use it quite a lot, actually. Well, not a lot, but like, I use it just to like, ask things about my job, you know, like cooking and stuff. Like if you want a recipe before, you used to like, like watch like, like 50 YouTube videos.

[Ed Gamble]

Yeah.

[Santiago Lastra]

That you don't know which one is the good one. You know where. Now you can just ask whatever. I'm going to make a custard sauce, but I only have cream and eggs. How can I do it? And then it will tell you a recipe and then you can say, oh, well, I. I want a recipe that is lighter or I want to put mescal on it, you know, and it will tell you. And then you can. And then you can.

[Ed Gamble]

Does it work, though?

[Santiago Lastra]

It works. And then you can adjust it, you know, and then you can ask as well. I mean, I have an R and D chef as well, so don't worry, Dan, you're not. You're not going to lose your job. It's good to have the tool of asking things that you normally will Google, you know, basically. And. And it helps, you know, like also if. If you think that something is impossible or possible, you can ask as well. Is that possible? I was like, oh, well, that's not possible.

[James Acaster]

Maybe next time is like your Remy the Rat. You put it under your chef's hat.

[Ed Gamble]

Yeah.

[James Acaster]

Put your hat on top of it. And then as you're working, just be like, how do I make the best custom? And then it moves your hands for you.

[Santiago Lastra]

I mean, not there yet. Not there yet. Not one day. No, it's just. Just like a. References. References. For us, it's quite difficult for the team to research about, well, things in Spanish, you know, because a lot of information of Mexican cooking. Mexican food is available in Spanish, like not a lot in English. So then like that you can ask something and it will. It will just search in every language. So it doesn't search only in English, where that is something that you will normally a struggle. Or if you want to buy a spoon, you know, like, I want to buy spoon. So, you know, like, you're going to buy like a beautiful spoon.

[James Acaster]

Yeah, yeah.

[Santiago Lastra]

Then if you. If you type it's really interesting because if you type, I mean, it's going to be very boring. But anyways, the thing is that they.

[James Acaster]

All can drop him. Boy, they can always take this out.

[Santiago Lastra]

But anyways, the thing is that if you want to buy like a beautiful small spoon, it's more difficult in English. You have to search like in Japanese or in like. Or in Dutch. Like, Dutch are really good at cutlery. So if you. If you search for cutlery in Dutch, you will have more options. Or in French you have a different options. In English you will have like a bigger cutlery.

[Ed Gamble]

This. I had no idea that if you want a nice spoon, you can't search in English.

[James Acaster]

It explains everything. All our spoons are.

[Santiago Lastra]

That'd just be Ed, with all due.

[James Acaster]

Respect, I've been to your house. You cut them with jaw. It's a travesty. It is. It makes me ashamed to know you.

[Santiago Lastra]

No offense to English ones. You know, I love English ones.

[James Acaster]

Pop ups or bread? Pop ups or bread? Santiago last year. Pop. Dubs or bread?

[Santiago Lastra]

I always say bread.

[James Acaster]

Yeah.

[Santiago Lastra]

In Mexico, obviously, we have tortillas. So they are a bread made with corn. Yeah. So that's. That's something that I love, but something that you could probably get a little bit more of a. Of like a dish I like. It's gonna sound really niche. I don't want to be too niche in this conversation.

[Ed Gamble]

Niche away, please.

[Santiago Lastra]

Yeah. So there is this Georgian bread that is called hachipura. It's. It's amazing. So it's. It's like a. It looks like a boat. That is a bread, a bake in a shape of a boat. And in the corners you have a stuffed crust of these, like amazing fresh cheese that is like a mozzarella, but a little bit more like stringy and acid with more acidity. And then in the middle of this boat, you have egg yolk, more cheese, and clarified butter. And then what you do is to take the crust without like breaking the boat and then kind of dip it into the egg yolk. And if it's my last meal, I was thinking to pimp that up with sea urchins.

[Ed Gamble]

Wow.

[Santiago Lastra]

Yeah, so that's. That's what I was thinking. I never try it, but I think, I mean, if you just can't just drink whatever you want.

[James Acaster]

Yeah.

[Santiago Lastra]

I've been in Georgia a few times. I used to live in different places in Eastern Europe and making research. And that was one of the things that you're really like, oh, my God. Like, if you haven't have a hachipuri I recommend you because it's like life changing.

[Ed Gamble]

I've had it a couple of times.

[Santiago Lastra]

Yeah.

[Ed Gamble]

There's some good Georgian restaurants in London, actually, in North London. And it is just because, you know, you look at it and you go, why have I been eating just plain bread?

[Santiago Lastra]

Yeah, exactly.

[Ed Gamble]

Get an egg in it.

[James Acaster]

Yeah.

[Ed Gamble]

Pop some cheese in it, for God's sake.

[Santiago Lastra]

Yeah, and butter.

[Ed Gamble]

Yeah, and the butter.

[Santiago Lastra]

And sea urchins.

[Ed Gamble]

And sea urchins.

[James Acaster]

That's your addition to sea urchins. That's you pimping them up.

[Ed Gamble]

See, what I love about this already, Santiago, is quite often when we have, like, you know, proper high end chefs on, or food critics, you know, people of your standing, they'll often go, like, I just want simple. Just something simple, you know? But I like that you've come in here and you've gone, I'm putting sea urchins on.

[James Acaster]

I like that. You're not a liar. All those other people are liars. I'm like, oh, if you love them so much, why aren't you making that all the time?

[Santiago Lastra]

Yeah, no, but that's the. That's the thing that I was thinking, because I eat quite a lot of Japanese food all the time, and I was thinking, like, well, should I just have sushi or. Or like, I don't know, like a miso soup or like tacos or something, but then fried chicken, you can. You can have that all the time. So if it's your last meal.

[James Acaster]

Well, this isn't your last one. This is your dream meal.

[Santiago Lastra]

It was my last meal.

[James Acaster]

It's the same thing.

[Ed Gamble]

If.

[Santiago Lastra]

If your dream.

[Ed Gamble]

If your dream meal is your last meal. Yeah, then that's fine.

[Santiago Lastra]

Yeah.

[James Acaster]

If you want to die at the end of this, we can make it happen. Like, can't we do that?

[Santiago Lastra]

Yeah, sure.

[Ed Gamble]

How do you want to die?

[James Acaster]

Yeah, okay, that's fine.

[Santiago Lastra]

How do you die, mate eating? No, no, it's fine. Okay, well, we don't die then. Okay, fine. Well, I feel better now already.

[Ed Gamble]

I still think it's a good way to approach it of going like, yeah.

[Santiago Lastra]

Yeah, just really dream meal, I think, needs to be some sort of your last meal, because otherwise it's just so hard to think was the dream meal.

[Ed Gamble]

Yeah.

[Santiago Lastra]

You know, like, so then if you're like, okay, well, that's the ultimate. Yeah, the ultimate meal.

[Ed Gamble]

Because then you'll never. You'll never top it afterwards. Yeah, exactly.

[Santiago Lastra]

That's it.

[Ed Gamble]

Yeah.

[Santiago Lastra]

And. Yeah.

[Ed Gamble]

What's the point of living after you've had this meal?

[Santiago Lastra]

Yeah. Exactly.

[James Acaster]

There isn't one.

[Santiago Lastra]

Yeah.

[James Acaster]

Well, is it similar this. This bread to. I had something when I was in, I think Washington D.C. that was like this, but it was called like pied or some Pied. It was. It was.

[Ed Gamble]

Yeah.

[James Acaster]

The Turkish Peter, maybe not. What?

[Santiago Lastra]

Peter bread?

[James Acaster]

No, not Peter Bre.

[Ed Gamble]

No, P I T E is Peter bread. It is Turkish.

[James Acaster]

But it had the similar thing in it. It was like.

[Santiago Lastra]

But it's like more like flat maybe. Maybe similar.

[James Acaster]

No, it was like a boat, man.

[Santiago Lastra]

Like a boat.

[James Acaster]

No, I'm just saying. I'm going search food in my photos in the middle.

[Ed Gamble]

Was it like canoe shapes?

[James Acaster]

Yes.

[Santiago Lastra]

So maybe that's the one.

[James Acaster]

Yes, I think it was like a canoe. Fast food. Food. Wow. If you search food in my photos, it comes up with a load of stuff that is. There you go. That's what I had.

[Ed Gamble]

Yeah, that's Pete.

[Santiago Lastra]

Yeah, that. That's similar.

[James Acaster]

Yeah.

[Santiago Lastra]

Then you will have like an egg yolk in the middle.

[James Acaster]

Right.

[Santiago Lastra]

And then instead of having the cheese, like so much cheese.

[James Acaster]

Yeah.

[Santiago Lastra]

Is less cheese, so you don't really see it. And the egg yolk is floating in clarified butter. But it's similar. It's similar.

[Ed Gamble]

I guess there's, you know, I think it's just.

[Santiago Lastra]

There's different types.

[Ed Gamble]

But that's what's exciting about world cuisine sometimes is that there's countries that are near each other or that you can see how things have been taken to other countries and changed. And there's like. Yeah, so that must be. Yeah, yeah.

[Santiago Lastra]

But that's.

[James Acaster]

Maybe they took it.

[Santiago Lastra]

That's good memory skill. Cheese and butter down there. Well over.

[James Acaster]

Talk us through the addition of the sea urchin as well. That's your idea, right?

[Santiago Lastra]

Yeah.

[James Acaster]

Why do you want to add the sea urchin?

[Santiago Lastra]

I was just thinking. I just love sea urchin.

[James Acaster]

Yeah.

[Santiago Lastra]

And it's one of those things that, like, I think the searching had this like egg jolt kind of texture that it melts in your mouth, but also have this intense sea flavor. And there's this, like, sometimes when you think about food, you have references as you have reference. So sometimes you have these, I don't know, just like flatbreads with anchovies. You know, that's really like traditional around here. So then you have this bread with an intense fish flavor. So what I was thinking is to. Why not to add more creaminess to the creaminess and these like, incredible, like, sea flavor to make it more luxurious, you know, even, you know.

[James Acaster]

But you know, what's going to happen now is that people who listen to this. That sounds delicious. They're gonna go to your restaurants and be like, where's that amazing Georgian sea urchin bread that we heard about? Is it on the menu?

[Santiago Lastra]

Right. You're right. It's not in the menu. No. But I mean, maybe open request. I could do it at home, probably. Well, you need to sort some sea urchin.

[Ed Gamble]

You do a special night at Fonda.

[Santiago Lastra]

Yeah.

[Ed Gamble]

Where you cook this entire dream menu.

[James Acaster]

Yeah.

[Santiago Lastra]

Oh, that'll be sick.

[Ed Gamble]

For a small.

[Santiago Lastra]

That would be sick.

[Ed Gamble]

A small, selective dining audience.

[Santiago Lastra]

Yeah. That would be.

[James Acaster]

Only people who can keep hold of their pens are allowed.

[Ed Gamble]

Light. Went light when we. So just for the listener, we have mentioned this before. So you. You were renting a house in. Was it in Ealing?

[Santiago Lastra]

East Acton.

[Ed Gamble]

East Acton. And you were doing, like, research and development for all the dishes for coal.

[James Acaster]

Yeah.

[Ed Gamble]

And what you did was, is you ripped out the whole kitchen and put a professional kitchen in it.

[Santiago Lastra]

Yeah.

[Ed Gamble]

And you didn't tell the landlord.

[Santiago Lastra]

Yes.

[James Acaster]

Just like when I ripped out my living room and put a comedy club in there.

[Santiago Lastra]

I. Yeah. So I didn't have a kitchen. I moved here and I had, like, a couple of years. Well, like one year and a half of, like, just putting the concept together and traveling around the UK just to find. Just understand a little bit more of the ingredients, the nature, meeting people and then going to restaurants, etc. And then after that, I. I met my business partners and they were like, okay, well, we need to try the food. And I was like, well, I don't have the food yet. The food is going to happen, but I need to do some research while we were finding this location, because here in London, it takes forever to get a site.

[Ed Gamble]

Yeah.

[Santiago Lastra]

I was like, okay, well, I need to move somewhere where I can have, like, this kitchen. And that's what we did. So then my brother and I, we moved to that place. And then downstairs. Yeah. We transform this, like, kitchen, living room and dining room into one kitchen.

[Ed Gamble]

Yeah.

[Santiago Lastra]

So we put, like, some professional fridges there and there's some tabletops. And the kitchen of the house became the pot wash area. So that was only for making, like, washing the dishes. And then in the backyard, we set a tent with, like, a wooden floor. And there was the dining room. So it was like a whole things. At the end of the day was that were, you know, just like a pimped. Is like the same as the hachipura. You know, we put sea urchin on it. Yes. Like, it's cooking at home, but with some professional kit yeah. Because at the end of the day you need to get immersed. When you are creating something, you need to be there, you know, like. So I remember I had this chalkboard downstairs just waking up and just writing ideas and maybe blending something at three in the morning. So it was like, it was like at this like immersion process because at the beginning nothing really tastes good.

[Ed Gamble]

Yeah.

[Santiago Lastra]

You know, it took. We were doing like 14, 16 dishes a week.

[Ed Gamble]

Wow.

[Santiago Lastra]

And it's just, it was just not good until I mean, I guess it happens. Similar with the jokes. Not like sometimes. Yeah, no, like not good at the beginning. But then you have to like train yourself to be able to, you know, like pull out a joke, let's say, you know, and, and that is kind of what happened in that place. Yeah, just this training and then after that we just started doing these dinners and, and I remember my PR company was like, what? Like you're going to bring like a bunch of like high profile people and.

[James Acaster]

Journalists to these guys and two idiots.

[Ed Gamble]

Who literally couldn't believe their luck.

[Santiago Lastra]

And they will and they. But like thankfully everyone said yes. And everyone was really like, it was really unusual, you know, because it wasn't like, okay, well we're going to go to this pre opening of a restaurant in Mayfair. You know, it was more like, okay, well you guys going to get your way into that location in this random house and, and then we'll see what happened with. No, it was like IKEA furniture outside and some things that we bought in Facebook market, you know, like to have like these like a couch and you know, like whatever cheap glasses we had. Like, it wasn't like anything fancy, but the idea was the important thing.

[Ed Gamble]

It felt pretty fancy to us. I'll be honest, it was quite early in the life of this podcast as well, I think it was.

[James Acaster]

We weren't. And you know, we, we actually, we don't get invited to loads of like stuff like that. Very vaguely anyway, even now. But like you should. Ed does heads on Instagram. There's something in it.

[Ed Gamble]

It's through email normally.

[James Acaster]

Yeah, yeah, yeah. But they, they know you're going to post about it.

[Santiago Lastra]

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Right.

[James Acaster]

You know, you gotta scratch their back.

[Ed Gamble]

You gotta play the game. That's why I only say yes. The ones that I know I'm gonna like anyway.

[James Acaster]

Yeah, yeah, yeah. Good stuff.

[Santiago Lastra]

Yeah. But I think it's very important to be part of a wider community, like not only inviting food, like people that are like restaurateurs of chefs or journalists also to get to connect with other people. Because at the end of the day, the restaurant is not going to have only chefs eating there. You know, like, it's not. I mean, like, like, it's amazing when someone from the industry comes, because we get excited because, you know, like, we are, you know, part of the same industry, but at the end of the day you have like, guests that are like, from all different backgrounds, you know, so. And then also it's. It's just great to meet cool people like you guys, you know, so.

[James Acaster]

Yes, yes. It is your dream starter, Santiago.

[Santiago Lastra]

So the dream starter is a combination. So we have one that is just like a. Like a very simple aguachile. So our chile means water and chile. And. And it's this. Is this like a seafood, like traditionally, is this seafood, like bucket of like, it's like big bucket or as like a. Like a water glass with like big jug of seafood with cucumber juice and chili and lime juice and different things. So then I will. I will say I would love to have it with. I mean, it's going to sound really strange, but not strange, but niche. But anyways, it's a pink snail. So we have. In Mexico, we have this amazing snail that is the conch. So, you know, these like big snails, sea snail. So inside the flesh is pink and it's. And the texture is like having like the creamiest melon, you know, that you can imagine. So then that. And a little bit of onion and maybe avocado and. And then that will be kind of my. My aguachile. So it's something fresh. You have to have something fresh. And then that's just on the side.

[James Acaster]

And then.

[Santiago Lastra]

And then the. The main starter will be these lobster tacos. So in. In Baja, in Baja California, it's one of the best experiences I ever had. So there is a place called Porto Nuevo that is. It's around 40 minutes south of Tijuana in Baja California. So what they do there is they go and fish the lobsters and they cut them in half and then they have this big wok, like massive wok, where they put pork fat on them, on the wok, and they cook it in the open fire on the beach. And then they open the lobsters and they cook them from the shell side first. And then when they are like almost perfectly cooked, they flip them over. And then the middle of the lobster gets like. Gets like crispy and super golden, but still super juicy. So they give you a whole lobster like that with some flour tortillas that they do with. With Wheat flour and pork fat that they roll in there in the beach as well, and they cook them there with some rice and some beans and salsa. The idea is that they give you a plate, you take the lobster, you scoop it out, like, the whole half of the lobster, and you make, like, your own kind of wrap, and you put rice on it, beans, and then the salsa on top, and you eat it. And it just. You cry, basically. Yeah. It's just tears, you know, like tears of joy.

[James Acaster]

Ed, out. So my peripheral vision now, I was looking at you, but every time you would get, like, to another detail, Ed's body would just move as one. Like, like, he was like, oh. He nearly cried at the description.

[Ed Gamble]

Man, oh, man.

[Santiago Lastra]

No, he's really. Is real. Is real.

[Ed Gamble]

I was there. I was there with you.

[James Acaster]

Yeah. At the campfire.

[Ed Gamble]

I was a lobster.

[James Acaster]

I was completely.

[Ed Gamble]

I was like. I was a lobster. I was you. I was someone else. I was the sea.

[Santiago Lastra]

No, but this is a real experience, you know, and it's something that sometimes I'll be like, oh, I wish I was there. And. And it gives you hope, you know, it's just. It's just a great, great thing. And, you know, like, you can do it anywhere else. But, I mean, I think in this dream meal, you can travel to different places. Yeah. So. So then if you go there to have the starter, then we go somewhere else. Yeah.

[Ed Gamble]

Yeah, of course.

[James Acaster]

Can you guess what I want to ask about? The main thing I'd like to ask about out of all of the things Santiago just said.

[Ed Gamble]

Oh, I don't know. Sorry. I was so. I was so transfixed.

[James Acaster]

The conch.

[Ed Gamble]

You want to know about the pink snail?

[James Acaster]

Yes.

[Ed Gamble]

The creamy melon snail.

[James Acaster]

Yes. Because I. How long has that been? Have people been eating that? Because I would guess the big snail that lives in the sea for ages was getting away with not being eaten. I imagine for a while, he was, like, at the bottom of the sea, massive snout safe in his shel. One knows I taste like a creamy melon. No one has any idea I taste like a creamy melon.

[Ed Gamble]

But you think the snail knows instinctively that it tastes like a creamy?

[Santiago Lastra]

Maybe in between snails they know.

[James Acaster]

Tastes like a creamy melon, and no one knows it.

[Ed Gamble]

I might look gross.

[James Acaster]

No one's going to scoop me out of it.

[Santiago Lastra]

No. It's a very traditional thing to eat in the Caribbean.

[James Acaster]

Right.

[Santiago Lastra]

There's people that, you know, like, in these different islands that what they do is to just, like, just find these nails and just scoop them out and eat them in the, like, they actually, you spend some time there. Like, they, they take you on the boat and they found the snails, they open them up and then they make you the, like a ceviche in the boat.

[Ed Gamble]

Wow.

[Santiago Lastra]

It's amazing. But in Mexico, it's not so traditional, but it's, it's been now this, this places where you can eat that you can, you can fish them for, for like a little bit of time, you know, like, like three, four months a year. And then you have to stop. So they reproduce and then you can use them again. I mean, like, you can use clams as well for that or shrimps. You know, like, you can just put whatever you want in there.

[James Acaster]

You know, you have 100% conch.

[Santiago Lastra]

I, yeah, I have this nail. I have this nail. Yeah.

[Ed Gamble]

Nothing but the snail.

[James Acaster]

I mean, we're off to a flying start. That's absolutely delicious. I want to try all of that. And I'm glad that you've immediately hacked it and had a side dish for your starter as well.

[Ed Gamble]

I think you might be the first person to use the phrase for my main starter.

[James Acaster]

Yes.

[Santiago Lastra]

Race the rudders.

[James Acaster]

Race the sails.

[Santiago Lastra]

Race the sails.

[James Acaster]

Captain, an unidentified ship is approaching. Over.

[Santiago Lastra]

Roger, wait. Is that an enterprise sales solution?

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[James Acaster]

Are your dream main course. Is there a main main here and a side main it is also.

[Santiago Lastra]

I think this is also an experience. One of my favorite things to do is to cook like whole animals, like a roast whole animal. And one of my favorites is the. My favorite is the lamb. So you have these lambs that you cook in the cross, like a Patagonian style. And. And you make a bonfire. You open the lamb so it's like nice and tight in the cross. And then you just salt it. Like, you put loads of salt in it. You rub it for like, like about two, three hours and just leave it. And then after that, you made a bonfire. And then you. You basically stick the cross close to the bonfire so the lamb starts cooking really slowly, first from the inside, and then you flip it to make the skin crispy. And while you're cooking it, you make a mix of like, chopped garlic, water, lime juice, and maybe some herbs like thyme or rosemary. And then you can put it, like in a. Literally in like a plastic bottle or like a. Just like a squeeze bottle or whatever. And then just kind of squeeze the. Spray it with that while you're cooking it. So it takes around three hours to cook. Three and a half hours, something like that. So while you're having your starters and, you know, like having some sparkling still water and having a laugh or something, you're cooking that. And then when it's ready, what you do is to pull the meat out of the lav.

[James Acaster]

And then I was laughing because Ed just slumped forward. Like, just like I literally thought Ed's entire microphone was gonna go down his throat and into his tummy. Like, he just, like it was too much for him. As soon as you mind Pulling the lamb. He said you pull the lamb. He's like.

[Santiago Lastra]

You know, when the lamb is ready.

[James Acaster]

Yeah.

[Santiago Lastra]

You press the skin. So when, when it's already crispy, you press it and you feel. You hear the crackling. But also all the juices are like dripping down, like.

[James Acaster]

Yeah.

[Santiago Lastra]

And so then when you, when you pull it out, then you can literally just the squeeze the piece of meat. There will be like, lots of. Lots of juice, you know, so it's amazing. Anyways, that's, that's like the main thing. And then you can have like some fresh tortillas to make your own tacos of lamb.

[James Acaster]

Yeah.

[Santiago Lastra]

In Mexico, normally you will have like a piece of wood, like chopping board, you know, and then with like a big cleaver and then you. I will put the lamb and then just pull the meat out and then just chop it with a cleaver, like.

[James Acaster]

Yeah.

[Santiago Lastra]

And then have like different sites that you. You can decide, you know, because I don't know who am I with? Are we together having whoever you want to.

[James Acaster]

You.

[Ed Gamble]

It's your dream. It's your dream slash, last meal.

[James Acaster]

Yeah.

[Ed Gamble]

You're about to die, remember?

[James Acaster]

We're not going to be offended if we're not there, you know.

[Santiago Lastra]

No, it just depends, you know, because some people.

[James Acaster]

It'S the best meal Ed's ever had and he's just hearing about it.

[Santiago Lastra]

So depends, you know, but you can, you can have mashed potatoes or you can just do like tacos with it, or you can have it like as a bankers with like some roasted braised purple cabbage and mashed potatoes and like a, like a lamb sauce. Or you could have like a more Mexican thing, just like tacos of lamb. So. Yeah. So that's the main course.

[James Acaster]

Incredible. Have you ever buried a lamb?

[Santiago Lastra]

What?

[James Acaster]

Have you ever, like, dug a pit? All right, fire in there and then let it go out a bit and put some damp hay on there and then put the lamb in them and bury it and then cooked it that way.

[Santiago Lastra]

Yeah, yeah, it's barbacoa. So that's a different thing. Yeah. So then for that one, you have to break down the lamb first. So you just separate by, by, by different parts. And then there's two different styles in, in Mexico, birria and barbacoa. So with birria, you have to do like a chili paste, like with different chilies and like maybe tomato, garlic, onion. You blend that into, like paste to marinate, and then you marinate the lamb with it and then you. Normally in Mexico, we wrap it with agave leaves. So, like burned agave leaves. It looks like. Like aloe vera, but, like really big. And then you wrap. Wrap the lamb with that. And then underneath you put a pot and like a steaming tray. So then all the juices from the lamb and the. And the. And the agave drip into the water underneath, so it becomes a broth. So you will normally have that. And then you cook that with stones. You put wood, then stones. Then with the wood the fire consumes. Then the stones are really hot, so it can keep the heat. And then you. You. You close that down with, like, leaves and soil. And then. So then it becomes like some sort of pressure cooker. And it cooks for a long time. And then you have that in the morning. So you have breakfast. You just like normally in the fields. So you just open that up, take the lamb out, and then you have people doing tortillas in there in the side. And then you just have that as a. As a breakfast with. With the broth in the side, you know. Yeah. Of the juices, you know. So that's barbacoa.

[Ed Gamble]

So that's how you do it.

[Santiago Lastra]

Yeah, that's be. Yeah, exactly.

[James Acaster]

There's a lot of steps in that that I think a friend of ours didn't do.

[Ed Gamble]

Yeah.

[Santiago Lastra]

Really?

[James Acaster]

Yeah. And that might be why his lamb came out raw. Like as raw as when he. Him and his best friend garden. Yeah, I was.

[Santiago Lastra]

Let me know. I can. I can go next time and just do it.

[James Acaster]

Yeah, well, I think. Yeah, I'll. We'll let him know.

[Santiago Lastra]

It's good. Like, if. If anyone does, like, one of those things, I like to go, you know, like, it's good to do it, you know, like, it's not. You normally don't have, like, a big whole.

[James Acaster]

Yeah, yeah.

[Santiago Lastra]

And like a lot of people. Well, it's good to do it.

[Ed Gamble]

You know, there's not a lot of gardens, but. Gardens.

[Santiago Lastra]

Yeah, exactly. This is not something that you do every day. Like, in Mexico, the restaurants will have like a backyard on their ground over in some restaurants, and they will do the lamb there, but we don't have that here. We can dig holes in Maryland, unfortunately.

[James Acaster]

I also like the sound of this. Jesus lamb.

[Santiago Lastra]

Yeah, I like that one. I just. I just think this easier.

[James Acaster]

Yeah.

[Santiago Lastra]

And also I like the roasted flavor of the skin. Like the. The caramelization that you don't get when the lamb is cooked under the ground. You don't get that because it's steamed. I mean, it's still really delicious, but you don't get this roasted flavor. I rather the roasted flavor.

[James Acaster]

So also when you're describing it and, you know, obviously I just got my friend here next to me, like, flopping his body all over the place and drooling all over the shop and it's a whole thing. But like, when you were saying about you had it there for a long time and you can go up and then you pull the meat and you test it and stuff. The bit in the Jesus crucifixion story that has never really made sense to me is that the. The Roman centurion goes over to him at the end just to check that he's. He's dead. He sticks a spear in his side and it does that. And it sounds like quite a similar thing. I'm like. They're like, right, I think he's done now. And he goes over and just puts a spare in him. Yeah. And he's like, yeah, yeah, yeah, that's. He's done. That's all the juices coming down.

[Santiago Lastra]

Yeah. I'm not sure about that.

[James Acaster]

As a kid, I was always like, I don't get why they're doing that. Surely they know.

[Santiago Lastra]

Yeah, but the lamb was.

[James Acaster]

They've done the job or not. Why is the centurion going, santiago makes a good point.

[Ed Gamble]

The lamb is dead already. Before you put it on, you're not checking to see if it's dead or not.

[Santiago Lastra]

Yeah, exactly. You're checking if he's cooked or not. You know, like if he's cooking to perfection.

[James Acaster]

No, I thought you were just getting a lamb.

[Ed Gamble]

Please never do this because you are going to get a live lamb. Put it on a crucifix.

[Santiago Lastra]

Yeah, exactly. You can't do that.

[James Acaster]

Yes. It's going to be.

[Santiago Lastra]

Check if it's there or not before serving it raw.

[Ed Gamble]

It takes about 10 minutes for the world.

[Santiago Lastra]

You need to get it dead first. That's important.

[James Acaster]

Hard to get a. Yeah, but I think.

[Santiago Lastra]

I wasn't specific about that.

[Ed Gamble]

Yeah, yeah.

[Santiago Lastra]

The lamb was dead and had a good debt before he was marinated with the salt.

[James Acaster]

Yeah.

[Santiago Lastra]

When you do it, do you put.

[Ed Gamble]

Two other criminal lambs either side?

[James Acaster]

Two criminals. That's very important.

[Santiago Lastra]

Depends how many guests comes, you know. Yeah, yeah. But I mean, like, I think one lamb is enough for, like, 12 people.

[James Acaster]

12 people disciples. The Last Supper.

[Ed Gamble]

It is the last Supper.

[Santiago Lastra]

It is our last.

[James Acaster]

Yeah, there we go.

[Santiago Lastra]

We need more people.

[Ed Gamble]

This is great.

[James Acaster]

Your dream side dish.

[Ed Gamble]

We've obviously had some side dishes.

[James Acaster]

We're going to allow those as part of the main course. You have the mashed potato part, the main course. We'll let you have a different side dish. Dish.

[Santiago Lastra]

Because we. It was like a really good, really well made guacamole. So in the south of Mexico and in different places, actually, in Mexico, you have this avocado that is. You know what avocado means, by the way? Oh, no.

[James Acaster]

Can we guess? Have a guess.

[Ed Gamble]

Is it something rude? Are we walking around going, oh, avocado, something rude?

[James Acaster]

What do you think you're saying it.

[Ed Gamble]

Means, like, goblin jizz or something interesting.

[James Acaster]

So goblin jizz is Ed's guess.

[Santiago Lastra]

I think we should make a poll.

[James Acaster]

I don't think there's any need for me to guess after that. No.

[Santiago Lastra]

What about, like, what do you think avocado looks like?

[James Acaster]

Well, I guess. I mean, now he's made me think it's rude. So testicle.

[Santiago Lastra]

Yes, yes, yes.

[Ed Gamble]

There you go. So it was rude.

[Santiago Lastra]

He's not rude.

[James Acaster]

It's not as rude as goblins. You absolute maniac.

[Santiago Lastra]

But testicles are not rude.

[James Acaster]

Yes, testicles are medical.

[Ed Gamble]

Depends where they are.

[Santiago Lastra]

Depends where they are.

[James Acaster]

Yeah, True. We're popping these in our mouth on.

[Ed Gamble]

The body and geographically.

[Santiago Lastra]

Anyways.

[James Acaster]

We're popping these testicles in our mouths. Santiago.

[Ed Gamble]

That's rude.

[James Acaster]

Yeah, that's rude. We're covering them in lime juice and gobbling them up.

[Santiago Lastra]

No, it does means that. So avocado in Spanish is aguacate. That comes from the word aguacatu and means testicles. Because, you know, I don't know why, but anyways.

[James Acaster]

Well, they do.

[Ed Gamble]

I guess if you put two of them next to each other, it could.

[Santiago Lastra]

Look like a couple of big old saunas.

[James Acaster]

Absolutely.

[Ed Gamble]

Yeah.

[Santiago Lastra]

Anyways, apart from the definition of the.

[Ed Gamble]

One, if yours do look like that, go to a doctor.

[Santiago Lastra]

Yeah, that was the same in the package.

[James Acaster]

Yeah, every time. It's important. Also, like, if you ever. If you ever check it yourself.

[Ed Gamble]

Yeah.

[James Acaster]

You know if they're ripe or not.

[Ed Gamble]

Yeah. So when we go around the supermarket and people squeeze the avocados, it's like they're checking themselves.

[Santiago Lastra]

Yeah, no, they're checking. They're checking.

[James Acaster]

Yeah, they're just checking.

[Santiago Lastra]

Checking someone else. Someone else checking someone.

[James Acaster]

Yeah. Yeah.

[Santiago Lastra]

Anyways, I think we went to a different direction with this, but. And it's guacamole.

[Ed Gamble]

So the guacamole.

[Santiago Lastra]

Guacamole means. No, not yet. No, it's mole means blend.

[Ed Gamble]

Yeah.

[Santiago Lastra]

Right. So avocado, aguacatu. So then is. Is mole. It's Is blend. Avocado, basically. So that's what guacamole means. So there is an amazing avocado from different parts of Mexico that is the criollo avocado that you can eat the skin.

[Ed Gamble]

Oh, wow.

[Santiago Lastra]

And the skin tastes like licorice. So it's, like, incredible. So then I will do a guacamole with that kind of avocado. And guacamole normally has the avocado. If you have this avocado, you can eat the skin. You can chop the skin and then mix it with some chopped onions and lime juice and then leave that for a little bit and then add it to the. To the avocado, and then some chopped coriander and chopped serrano chilies. And that's it. With maybe some chopped tomato as well. Yeah. So then that's it. Like, our guacamole doesn't have any olive oil or any mayonnaise or anything. Like, I don't know. Like, some people.

[Ed Gamble]

What are the. What's the worst mistake you've ever seen? What's the worst thing? Mayonnaise. People adding mayonnaise.

[Santiago Lastra]

Yeah. You had mayonnaise?

[James Acaster]

No, no, I don't do it. But, like, I'm aware that we constantly get it wrong in this country. And I can only imagine how you feel when you see the kind of potted guacamole that's in, like.

[Santiago Lastra]

Yeah, like creme fridge.

[James Acaster]

Stuff like that.

[Santiago Lastra]

No, there, you know. Yeah, exactly. Just, like, it's really simple. Yeah, really good. So then that's. That would be the. The side dish. It's like a really beautiful guacamole.

[Ed Gamble]

Add that to a bit of the lamb as well.

[Santiago Lastra]

Yeah, exactly, exactly. It needs to come together, you know?

[Ed Gamble]

Yeah. We don't need to invite 12 people to this. I reckon I could do three quarters of that.

[James Acaster]

Yeah, yeah. I've got this covered. Easily do it. And there's no, like, tortillas or anything with the.

[Santiago Lastra]

Yeah, yeah, Some tortillas with the lamb.

[James Acaster]

Of course.

[Santiago Lastra]

Yeah. But you also have some of the hachipura left, so you can also put lamb in there and. Yeah, just for the brave. Just some lamb.

[Ed Gamble]

And I'm brave. I've got a massive set of avocados.

[James Acaster]

Well, congratulations, man. Do you remember the first time, like, you had, like, so a dish like guacamole like, you must have had your whole life, but, like, can you remember, like, having it for the first time and it being like, wow, this is, like.

[Santiago Lastra]

I think it's just something that you just grow up with, you know?

[James Acaster]

Yeah.

[Santiago Lastra]

You don't think about it so much. But when you start thinking about it is when you don't have it. I've been living out of Mexico for now 14 years. And I remember the first two or three years it was like, man, I need avocado. You know, like it's something that you just really miss. I think 14 years ago, like it wasn't as easy to get avocados from like in somewhere else. Now you can get avocados from like Portugal and Spain that they, they grow there like naturally. But yeah, it was a. Like when you miss it is when you're like, oh. And then you go back to Mexico, you're like, yes.

[James Acaster]

Yeah.

[Santiago Lastra]

So it's one of those things, but it just, in a way it kind of keeps it special. It's hard to get really good avocados here in, in the UK at the moment. Actually in cold we do a courgette guacamole. So we just slice courgettes and we cook them and mix them with hemp seeds to give creaminess and some fermented gooseberry juice and chilies and. And we do this like guacamole, like avocado free guacamole. That is amazing.

[Ed Gamble]

And is that because you can't get the rice?

[Santiago Lastra]

Yeah, exactly. Yeah. So the thing is that when you reference up something is so good, you don't want to do something that is not good enough because then it's just like, oh, why am I doing this? So then that's one of the reasons why we don't use ingredients from Mexico in coal because it's just not going to be as good. So then we rather to find something else that could be its own thing. Maybe it's not the same, but similar and it's good in its own unique way.

[James Acaster]

Your dream drink, Mezco, of course we knew this.

[Santiago Lastra]

Yeah. No, I mean, like I was thinking something a little bit different, but I think it's the flavor but also it's just the fact that it just makes you be really open minded. I think something about mezcal that like not a lot of people know is the way that it makes you feel. Like how drinks make you feel. I mean like obviously like drunk maybe if you drink too much, but in.

[Ed Gamble]

Which James's stomach is going crazy right now and it has been for the last ten minutes. James's stomach. And I'm the one who's freaking out about the menu over here. And James's stomach is going insane.

[James Acaster]

My stomach sounds like a haunted. Well, it's absolutely.

[Santiago Lastra]

It's a haunted well, just like Sorry.

[Ed Gamble]

For the interruption, Santiago.

[James Acaster]

I'm trying to get it to shut up.

[Santiago Lastra]

Maybe your stomach wants to get involved.

[Ed Gamble]

Yeah.

[James Acaster]

Oh, it absolutely does.

[Santiago Lastra]

That's why he is absolutely. We need getting excited.

[Ed Gamble]

An extra little microphone.

[James Acaster]

Yeah.

[Santiago Lastra]

Oh, that's very interesting. So this is the way that makes you feel, you know, like which. Or think about how drinks make you feel. I think that is something that we normally don't think about too much. And mezcal makes you feel like joy, and also it gives you a boost of energy, and it also allows you to be more open in your conversation and stuff like that. So that's how normally have mezcal. Like, we have mezcal with food as well. It's not a digestive. It's a drink that you have with your food, that you have with your lamb, and it will allow you to just keep having a great time and feel great. And also, if you survive this meal, you don't get a hangover the next day, you know, so I can. I can have like a lot of mezcal. And then the next day, as soon as you drink water, it's important before you go to sleep, just little water, and then the next day you're fine. It's a miraculous drink because it's made from natural ingredients.

[Ed Gamble]

Yeah. But I. I hear this about a lot of drinks. I hear this about natural wine. I hear this about the. Oh, you don't get hangover. That's not true.

[Santiago Lastra]

But do you drink water before you go to bed?

[Ed Gamble]

I always drink water before I go to bed. The problem is I don't think I've ever had a night where I've drunk one type of alcohol.

[Santiago Lastra]

Yeah, it's the problem.

[James Acaster]

Yeah, it's all about one type of mescal. Then you think what we. Nice now.

[Santiago Lastra]

Yeah, it's all about lovely old fashioned. Yeah, it's all about one type, but then the right type made with natural things that don't have chemicals. So mezcal, it's. Yeah, it's the one. But anyways. Also tastes delicious.

[Ed Gamble]

And it's great because let me tell you, when we came for that meal at your house, we definitely had a hangover the next day.

[James Acaster]

Yes.

[Ed Gamble]

James left early. He tried to leave me.

[James Acaster]

Yeah, the mascot. The mascot made me feel scared and confused. I. I had to get out of there. I was like, what the am I doing in this stranger's kitchen? This is nuts. He fed us ants when we arrived. I'm getting out of here right now. Ed went to the toilet. And while Ed was in the toilet. I was like, I'm going now. I'm immediately leaving, so. Because that's the one guy I know.

[Ed Gamble]

Yeah.

[James Acaster]

He's left me. He's in the toilet. I'm him.

[Ed Gamble]

I came out and I caught you getting into an Uber.

[James Acaster]

He took. Caught me getting into the Uber. Yeah. I was like, bye, Ed. You're like, what are you doing? And leave me here with Professor Green.

[Santiago Lastra]

Yeah, that's true. That's true.

[Ed Gamble]

But that night we had some crazy, like, coffee. Mezcal.

[James Acaster]

Yeah.

[Santiago Lastra]

Yeah, that was good. That was that the thing. Like, Mezcal can be also infused with different things, and it will give you whatever you want, you know, like a great experience. You know, there's so many different types. There's one that is called the Pechuga Mezcal. That means breast. And.

[Ed Gamble]

This whole menu.

[James Acaster]

This whole menu is all over the place right now. You're a pervert, mate. Everything you're ordering. This means testicle, this means breast. I want it all.

[Santiago Lastra]

No, I'm just saying what it means. Yeah, no, but I have a point. I have a point. Yes.

[James Acaster]

We Google these afterwards. If it doesn't mean these things, you're in big trouble. You're in big trouble, man. What does coal mean? What's Fonda made?

[Santiago Lastra]

Wait, so it means. Because we are using a turkey breast.

[James Acaster]

Yeah.

[Santiago Lastra]

You know, so what you do is to make the mezcal and put this turkey breast into the mezcal. The mezcal has normally two distillations. So you take the plant, cook it for, like, the plant has in the middle some sort of pineapple, so it looks like a pineapple, the core. So then sometimes you have to wait for that plant to be 12, 14, or sometimes like 30 years old for you to be able to take it and use it. So it has enough sugars developed. And what we do is to take out the leaves of the plant and then these pineapples, they get cooked for seven days, and then you crush them and fill them with water. And then it has this natural fermentation. Like, it becomes like a meadow. And then after that, it gets distillate. Distillate twice. So then petroga means that you will add something else to get extra flavor, and then you distillate the third time. So traditionally, you use turkey breast with fruits. So you put maybe some mandarins, maybe some sugar cane, other, like, local fruits and a turkey breast. And you test, you make a distillation and then you get the liquid. It doesn't taste like chicken, but it has the oils of the turkey breast, and it's. And it's really, really rich. And then what they do with this coffee, mescal, what they do is instead of the turkey breast, they use coffee. So they put the coffee, you know, for the distillation, and you can also infuse it with coffee as well. So. Yeah, it's funny because you go to these places and they have always a turkey running around and. And they. And it's like friends, like, of the family, everything, you know, but they wait for Christmas or for a wedding to basically use that turkey for making that special mezcal for the celebration.

[Ed Gamble]

And is that the mescal you want on your dream menu?

[Santiago Lastra]

Yeah, let's do it. Let's do a pechuga.

[Ed Gamble]

You don't want the coal mescal because you do your own.

[Santiago Lastra]

Yeah, I mean, like. Yes, of course. I mean, we'll have a lot of different ones.

[Ed Gamble]

Okay.

[James Acaster]

I have a feeling that throughout your meal, there'll be.

[Santiago Lastra]

Yeah, I think we'll have, like. Yeah, maybe later for the after party. Yeah, we need to have an after party. Yeah. Yeah. Nice.

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[Santiago Lastra]

Your dream dessert, it will be cheesecake. So it's a little bit of, like a nostalgia kind of thing, because I used to sell cheesecake when I was like, 15 years old, no less. I think I was like, like 14 or 13 years old. 14. And I came up with this, like, recipe of cheesecake, like, really traditional. I think someone told me, like, oh, you know what? Like, you can make cheesecake like this. I was like, oh, right. And I just did it at home, and then I used to sell it, and then it became, like, this family recipe. And then my mom used to sell it as well. Like, it's cool. Like, she's a teacher. And then I will sell it to the teachers and stuff like that. And if I'll sell 10 slices, I could go out on the Friday, you know? So then I was, like, counting the slices that I could sell, and. And then my brother got the recipe and start selling to restaurants. Like, after I left my hometown, he kind of, like, put his own. Like, he. When he. I was 14, my brother, he was 11, and he learned the recipe.

[Ed Gamble]

Wow.

[Santiago Lastra]

And. And then when he was 15, he. He's more of a. Of a businessman. So he will go to, like. I mean, he was 14 years old, but he will go to restaurants to sell the cheesecake. So it was, like, famous there in my hometown. And. And then when we left, my mom made the cheesecake herself. And then now we are doing this cheesecake actually in Fonda. We're gonna have the.

[Ed Gamble]

Oh, great.

[Santiago Lastra]

The. The Santiago's cheesecake in the menu. And. And it's just, like, one of those things, like, with desserts, I'm not really a dessert person as much. And I could ask for, like, something really strange, but. Or just, like, a piece of watermelon. I really like watermelon, but. But I think, you know, like, it's nice to, like, remember good. The good old days, you know, that cheesecake, you know?

[James Acaster]

So, yeah, I'd love to know what your sales pitch was when you were selling the slices of cheesecake to the teachers when you were 13.

[Santiago Lastra]

I don't remember. I think was like, more like word of mouth. I gave some cheesecake to try to the teachers and to the students.

[Ed Gamble]

Like a drug dealer.

[James Acaster]

Yeah, that's cool.

[Ed Gamble]

Free. So, yeah, you don't have to pay for that. I'm crawling back, shivering.

[James Acaster]

Your brother watching. I need some more cheesecake.

[Santiago Lastra]

But, yeah, exactly. I mean, like, it wasn't supposed to be a business, you know, it's like one of those things that I wasn't like, oh, my God, I got to, like, make money. It was more like, I just want to share it. Like, I made it. I bring it to my school, and I share it. But then suddenly, people were like, oh, you don't have a little bit more of that cheesecake? And I'm like, yeah, sure, I can make some more. So I will come, like, like, the next day with cheesecake. And then Suddenly people will be like, oh, I want to buy. I want to buy some for my wife, you know, like the teacher.

[Ed Gamble]

I was like, oh, the teacher.

[Santiago Lastra]

Yeah, yeah.

[Ed Gamble]

I was just thinking of a little kid. I gotta buy something for my wife.

[James Acaster]

Yeah. My kind of like vision of Mexico. Like your little businessman, little grooms. Yeah. Everyone's just got. The teachers are kids.

[Santiago Lastra]

Yeah.

[James Acaster]

So.

[Santiago Lastra]

So then like that. Then. Then suddenly I was like, okay, well, maybe I'm going to sell by the slice.

[James Acaster]

Yeah.

[Santiago Lastra]

You know, so you make more money with it, like if you sell it by the slice. I think the slice was. Was like maybe like 80p the slice or something like that, which it was.

[Ed Gamble]

That's cool. That's.

[Santiago Lastra]

That was good. And then suddenly, then people got a bit obsessed with the cheesecake. So then I will bring like, I will make quite a lot of cheesecake, which it was good. Yeah. So it's one of those things that I think there's like, when I was a kid as well, I will bring even like homemade, like agua fresca, like horchata, or like sharing things that you make with your friends or with people that, you know. It's something that I remember enjoying a lot since I was like 8 years old or something, you know. But then suddenly you can actually cook something.

[Ed Gamble]

Yeah.

[Santiago Lastra]

And then if you actually can make money with it, it's like the dream.

[Ed Gamble]

Yeah.

[Santiago Lastra]

I was like, making my cheesecakes. I'm like, yes. You know, like, I'm just living the dream, you know, like.

[James Acaster]

Was it a baked cheesecake?

[Santiago Lastra]

Yeah, it's a bake. It's a baked cheesecake and it has this like, cookie, like really traditional cookie, a base that is a bit similar as the DJ Steve's cookies that you have here. And they're just blended as a powder with butter with like melted butter. And then you make the crust and then you have condensed milk, evaporated milk and. And fresh cheese, like Philadelphia cheese, and a little bit of vanilla and eggs. You blend that and put it in the middle, bake it, and then we use BlackBerry jam on top and that's it. It doesn't really have anything else, but it's just. Yeah. Just iconic.

[James Acaster]

Imagine like your mum just being like, my kids have started a cheesecake business.

[Ed Gamble]

Where's my kids started wearing a Rolex. Where's all this money coming from?

[James Acaster]

Make it into their phones horizontally. Walking around yelling at people. That's incredible. That sounds delicious. And Joe. What? I'll throw in a slice of watermelon for you.

[Santiago Lastra]

Yeah, nice as well.

[James Acaster]

I Think nice. You know, I'll send that over at the end of the day for the after party.

[Santiago Lastra]

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Like watermelon after party. Yeah, Watermelon theme after party.

[James Acaster]

You got a fact about watermelons? Do they mean something rude? You're perf.

[Santiago Lastra]

I just love it. Just love watermelon. I think it's just the fact that, like, my. My dad. My family's dad from there. From Spain.

[James Acaster]

Yeah.

[Santiago Lastra]

And I remember going to Spain and I used to live there. I live there four years, and they do these parties in the streets where big truck will come with watermelons. I was like, what? And it's just. It's free watermelon for everyone.

[Ed Gamble]

Wow.

[Santiago Lastra]

In the little town. And they just, like, big truck, like huge watermelons. It's hot. Like. Like today. It's a hot day. And then they put, like, a big table. They cut the watermelons in big slices, and then you just eat it. Like, you just, like, literally just like, bite into it and, like, it's just incredible. So I love watermelons.

[Ed Gamble]

What are you doing with the pips?

[Santiago Lastra]

There's some people that have problems with the watermelon. Yeah. Seeds. Yeah, Like. Like phobia kind of thing as well.

[Ed Gamble]

So I think I just.

[Santiago Lastra]

Sorry about those people.

[Ed Gamble]

I'm just necking.

[Santiago Lastra]

You like.

[James Acaster]

Yeah.

[Santiago Lastra]

The seeds. Yeah.

[Ed Gamble]

They're going down.

[Santiago Lastra]

Yeah. I think my grandmother used to say that a watermelon will grow in your stomach if you eat one of those.

[James Acaster]

Great. Love watermelon. Yeah. Don't even have to eat it. Grows in my stomach. It's already there. That's where it was going anyway.

[Santiago Lastra]

And I used to think that the pregnant ladies ate watermelons. So I was like, oh, my God. So I thought that that was like, people that had that, you know, like victims of the watermelon seeds.

[James Acaster]

Yes. Benito has a question about the cheesecake. Now, he doesn't involve himself in the edit.

[Santiago Lastra]

All right.

[James Acaster]

So he's going to ask it, and I'm going to have to repeat it to you.

[Santiago Lastra]

All right, great.

[James Acaster]

Even though you can hear him when he says it, but he thinks people want to know. Okay, ask away and hold onto your pen, little man. What is the ratio of biscuit base to cheesecake? He. Benito says people will want to know how much biscuit to cheesecake we talk in here.

[Santiago Lastra]

Not a lot of biscuit. I mean, like, I think the ratio will be around probably 80% cheesecake and.

[Ed Gamble]

20%, but it's coming up the sides as well.

[Santiago Lastra]

Yeah, like. Yeah, exactly. On the sides on the bottom, you know?

[Ed Gamble]

Yeah.

[Santiago Lastra]

So in total will be around 20% biscuit and then 80% cheesecake.

[Ed Gamble]

Happy bonito.

[James Acaster]

Yeah, yeah, we know that. By people you mean how. You guys, you're the one who asked it. And there's absolutely no one was ever going to tweet the podcast saying, what are the ratios?

[Santiago Lastra]

But which radio ratios you guys like?

[Ed Gamble]

I'm happy with anything, to be honest.

[Santiago Lastra]

Yeah.

[James Acaster]

Yeah.

[Ed Gamble]

Take it as it comes.

[James Acaster]

I'd say. I don't. If the base is too thick.

[Ed Gamble]

Yeah.

[James Acaster]

And upon looking at it, I'll be like, oh, that's a bit. But then if it's delicious, if the base is like, they've really put a lot of effort into making it taste really nice.

[Santiago Lastra]

Right.

[James Acaster]

Great.

[Ed Gamble]

I'll tell you what I don't want. I don't want it to be so thick that when you're putting a fork through it, you get to the biscuit and you're pushing and then you hear the clink of the fork on the plate because it goes through. I don't want that.

[Santiago Lastra]

Interesting. Interesting. No, that doesn't happen.

[Ed Gamble]

I want a bit of crumb. I like the crumb. Yeah, a little bit, but it's a.

[Santiago Lastra]

Little bit crispy in the edge, but not crazy. Yeah, the one in front that doesn't have the one in the side.

[Ed Gamble]

Okay.

[Santiago Lastra]

So it's just the bottom, I think.

[Ed Gamble]

I can't wait to try it.

[Santiago Lastra]

Can't wait for you to try it.

[James Acaster]

Yeah. Absolutely delicious. Well, I'm going to read your menu back to you now, see how you feel about it.

[Ed Gamble]

This is going to be what I would describe as a festival of mispronunciation.

[James Acaster]

Well, if I have to mispronounce this, because if I get them all right. Ed's gonna be flipped into space by his own boner. If I. If I'm able to pronounce all of this, he's gonna. It's so delicious that he's not gonna be able to hack it. So I. I owe it to the listener to not be able to pronounce this. Otherwise, I think we get this podcast getting censored. It won't be. We're gonna release it. Water, you would like 50, 50. Sit still in sparkling with a dash of sea buckthorn juice, pockets of bread. You would like kachapuri with sea urchins, starter lobster tacos, and aguachile with pink snail, the conch main course.

[Ed Gamble]

I mean, I can't believe we've had all avocados. Means testicles. This is Breast mezcal. And you didn't say anything about the pink snail.

[James Acaster]

What are we talking about? Main course. You would like the bonfired lamb with mash and purple cabbage side and tortillas. So people make tacos.

[Santiago Lastra]

And salsa.

[James Acaster]

And salsa.

[Ed Gamble]

Don't forget this.

[James Acaster]

Yes.

[Ed Gamble]

Because I think I'd go tortilla. Yeah.

[Santiago Lastra]

You will have the lamb tacos in one side. And then you also have. For the people that don't want tacos, you will have the mash.

[Ed Gamble]

I don't want a cabbage. Don't invite those people.

[James Acaster]

I want mash as well.

[Santiago Lastra]

Yeah, he wants them.

[Ed Gamble]

You go and eat your mash in the corner, man. We're having tacos.

[James Acaster]

I'll have tacos, too. Cut you up. Both.

[Santiago Lastra]

You can have both. Yeah.

[James Acaster]

Why are you saying no? What the.

[Ed Gamble]

You're going to turn around. He's going to put mash in a tortilla. I know what he's going to do.

[Santiago Lastra]

Yeah. You can't put the mash in.

[Ed Gamble]

That's the excitement.

[Santiago Lastra]

I won't do it.

[James Acaster]

I won't do that.

[Santiago Lastra]

Okay.

[James Acaster]

Can't stop me once I'm in. Side dish, you would like beautiful guacamole with tortillas. Drink mezcal. And. And that's throughout the whole meal. And dessert, you would like your very own cheesecake. And then afterwards, a slice of watermelon at the after party.

[Santiago Lastra]

And more me.

[Ed Gamble]

And more me.

[James Acaster]

And more me. Obviously, that's never stopping. That's flowing constantly. Every single type that you could. You could wish for of mezcal.

[Santiago Lastra]

That's great. I think the. The only thing is the guacamole will have totopos or tostadas. Like crispy tortillas, basically. Not soft.

[James Acaster]

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Santiago Lastra]

Exactly.

[James Acaster]

Yeah. I mean, imagine.

[Santiago Lastra]

But yeah, that sounds. Sounds lovely.

[James Acaster]

Sounds very good. Yeah. Sounds absolutely delicious. Thank you for your food descriptions as well. There's going to be a few people re listening to those, mainly Ed.

[Santiago Lastra]

Yes.

[Ed Gamble]

Do them again now.

[Santiago Lastra]

I'm glad you like it.

[Ed Gamble]

Fantastic. So pop along to Fonda. Go to Cole.

[James Acaster]

Absolutely.

[Ed Gamble]

You're gonna have an amazing time. Santiago, thank you so much for coming to the dream restaurant.

[Santiago Lastra]

Thank you. Thank you so much.

[James Acaster]

Thanks, man.

[Ed Gamble]

Thank you so much to Santiago for coming in. What a menu. What a man.

[James Acaster]

Wow. Delicious. Yeah. You. I'm glad that we video these episodes now because it will have your reactions. Yes. And Billy could do a super cut of you just like.

[Ed Gamble]

I think I just. Your chair completely, like, glazed over. I was there. I was in the dishes.

[James Acaster]

You were. You felt like you Were by that fire on the beach.

[Ed Gamble]

I was the lobster. I was the lamb. I was eating myself.

[James Acaster]

Wow, that's a good song lyric, man.

[Ed Gamble]

I was the lobster. I was the lamb.

[James Acaster]

I was eating myself. Yeah, yeah, yeah, That's. That's beautiful.

[Ed Gamble]

Thanks, man.

[James Acaster]

Thank you to Santiago. Thank you for not saying dairy the cheese slices as well. So as soon as we heard. To be fair, as soon as he said the water course, I was like, yeah, they're not coming up. We'll have a dairy Lee cheese slices on this.

[Ed Gamble]

No one's doing sea buckthorn juice in a half and half water. And then the starter being a pack of dairy ly cheese slices.

[James Acaster]

Yeah. There was never any danger of it. Yeah. But that means we can tell you all to go to Fonda. It has just opened. And also, if you haven't been to Cole, the tasting menu restaurant, you should go there as well. Both delicious.

[Ed Gamble]

Both delicious, Cole. Good for, I guess, a special occasion.

[James Acaster]

Yeah. If you've got room for 17 courses, which you will, by the way.

[Ed Gamble]

Yeah.

[James Acaster]

Because they're all delicious. So you want to keep eating them.

[Ed Gamble]

Yeah.

[James Acaster]

Go to Cole and then Fonda for a more casual affair.

[Ed Gamble]

Absolutely.

[James Acaster]

Still, I mean, that cheesecake, man, that sounds. Everyone knows that's as good as in my belly.

[Ed Gamble]

Yes. The thing is, when we do good menus like that, I do think I've got to go home and have something like that.

[James Acaster]

Yeah, that's the. That's the problem.

[Ed Gamble]

I ain't going to be able to do any of that.

[James Acaster]

You sure? You could do, like, a version of it?

[Ed Gamble]

A version of what?

[James Acaster]

I don't know. Is there another. Is there a smaller animal you can put in a crucifix and, like, just put in your oven?

[Ed Gamble]

Yeah, maybe, like, I don't know, like, I could do a snail probably. I could do a snail aguachile, but it would be from sort of snails that are outside in the garden.

[James Acaster]

Yeah, yeah. Well, that might be nice. No, no, no. It would not be nice.

[Ed Gamble]

I might do a slow roast lamb and put it in tacos.

[James Acaster]

There you go. You can do that. That sounds delicious, Ed.

[Ed Gamble]

Thank you and thank you. We will see you next week on the off menu podcast.

[James Acaster]

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