Second Drink: Local Ad

Summary

Office Ladies — "Second Drink: Local Ad"

Podcast: Office Ladies
Hosts: Jenna Fischer & Angela Kinsey
Episode: Second Drink: Local Ad
Date: December 29, 2025
Theme: Revisiting “Local Ad” (Season 4, Episode 9), sharing behind-the-scenes stories, fan mail, hidden gems, and audio clips from director Jason Reitman.

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Episode Overview

This Second Drink episode is a deep-dive revisit into The Office’s iconic “Local Ad” episode. Jenna and Angela respond to fan mail, spotlight fun facts and hidden gems, recount behind-the-scenes moments—especially from director Jason Reitman—and celebrate the creative and personal connections (“crossover connections”) among the cast, crew, and guest stars. The episode is rich with warmth, nostalgia, and the trademark quirky humor of both hosts.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Fan Mail & Hidden Gems

• Kit Kat Jingle Differences (02:11 - 03:14)

  • Jade from New Zealand shares they've never heard the U.S. Kit Kat jingle, noting their local version is “Have a break, have a Kit Kat.” This leads to a discussion about misheard jingles and a Billie Eilish story about thinking Bono was from Scranton.

    "I always thought that Break me off a piece of that Fancy Feast was the correct ending to the jingle that was stuck in Andy's head." (02:54, email from Jade A., read by Jenna)

• Mike’s Cereal Shack Real Life Parallels (03:46 - 05:19)

  • Multiple fans write in to say cereal cafés exist in the U.S. (Stirs in Utah, Cereality in Chicago) and Spain, proving Michael Scott’s idea isn’t as far-fetched as it seemed.

2. Fan Catches

• Michael’s “Final, Final, Final Video” Subject Line (06:10)

  • Ilona N. points out the subtle joke in Michael’s email subject, delighting both hosts with its meta humor. Jenna & Angela relate to the urge to constantly revise and resend creative work.

    "I actually think it's because he kept sending different versions." (Angela, 06:10)

• Holly Absent in Nashua Commercial (07:00 - 07:48)

  • Joan S. wonders why Holly isn’t seen in Nashua's ad, prompting the hosts to explain the character hadn’t been introduced yet, and riff hilariously about her being “out sick the day they filmed the Wave.”

3. Episode Breakdown & Behind-the-Scenes

Opening Reflections (08:36 - 09:42)

• Angela & Jenna’s Ongoing "I declare BANKRUPTCY!" Bit
  • Classic Office references spark laughter and recognition of the show’s catchphrases.

Fast Facts

• Fast Fact #1: Director Jason Reitman (10:16 - 15:26)

  • Jason Reitman shares (via audio) his perspective on directing, describing it as “like someone asking you, do you want to drive my Lamborghini?”

  • He details the unique camera work and how even the director becomes part of the cast, particularly during Talking Head scenes.

    "Really, you are simply the first audience... as a director on The Office, it's a learning experience and a joyful one." (Jason Reitman, 12:44)

    "The set was freezing cold, which was Steve Carell’s request... this whole 'cold is comedy' thing." (Jason Reitman, 15:18)

• Fast Fact #2: Second Life Deep Dive (17:19 - 21:36)

  • Jenna explains Second Life’s mechanics and history, its social, not gaming, roots, and its weird, creative online culture.

  • Hosts explain how Second Life was customized for the show with developer cooperation, using avatars modeled after the cast.

    "I stopped playing Sims when I had built myself a little house, and... in the game, I was petting my fake cat, and I looked over at my real cat... and I thought, yeah, I need to get out of this game and pet my real cat." (Jenna, 17:59)

• Fast Fact #3: Kit Kat Jingle & “Earworms” (21:55 - 24:44)

  • Detailed timeline and musical trivia, including the jingle’s 1986 U.S. debut, and its place in “top 10 earworms” (Chili’s Baby Back Ribs, “We Will Rock You,” etc.).

Crossover Connections

• Director and Guest Stars Interconnection (33:20 - 35:40)
  • Almost all guest stars in “Local Ad” also appeared on the show “Monk” in various small roles. Angela’s delight in these “crossover connections” is infectious, including personal stories (Tim Kang’s daughter and Angela’s daughter played soccer together; Jenna and Kyle Bornheimer were both in Blades of Glory).

Specific Episode Moments and Behind-the-Scenes Details

• Dwight’s Second Life Profile (37:01)

  • Jenna shares Dwight’s absurd avatar interests (“cornhusk doll maker, beat sculptor, not tying champion; goal: to calculate the exchange between Schrute Bucks and Linden Dollars”).

• Deleted Scene: Michael’s Outrageous Pitch

  • A deleted Rome-to-prison-resort-commercial-pitch scene is referenced, prompting the real pitch replay from Jason Reitman (39:04).

    "Little girl in a field holding a flower... zoom back further, the desert's a sandbox in the world's largest resort hotel. Zoom back... hotel is the playground of the world's largest prison." (Michael's pitch as recounted by Jason, 39:04)

• Creating the Nashua Branch Commercial Parody (41:02 - 42:57)

  • Jason Reitman reveals he relished making a deliberately "bad" but authentic-feeling corporate commercial, even using his long-time actor friend Jeff Witzke as its star.

    "There's certain things that you may not know how to do authentically, but you know how to satirize." (Jason Reitman, 41:35)

On-Set Stories

• Angela’s Pregnancy Glow & The Rooftop Scene (74:18 - 77:30)
  • Angela explains why she’s not on the rooftop in the ad conclusion—she was at an OBGYN appointment. She and Mindy were added in post-production: “We just did a wave... then they did a little fancy editing and put us in the shot.” (74:26)
  • Jenna recalls Angela telling her about her pregnancy in Jenna’s trailer, a touching moment for both: “I was just so happy for you. I knew how much you wanted to be a mother... you are such a good mother.” (Jenna, 77:02)

Fan Questions and Fun Facts

• Pam Sleeping at Work: Subtle Hints and Continuity (68:20 - 71:47)

  • Jenna and Angela debate if Jim and Pam are living together; discuss Pam staying overnight to finish her animation; and riff on the logistical downsides (contacts, toothbrushes).

• Commercials in Real Life & The Office (55:16 - 58:32)

  • Jenna shares she didn’t book a speaking commercial for 20 years—until her Smirnoff ad with Ted Danson.
  • Angela’s moneymaker was commercials: “I did a lay’s Olestra [chips]. It said on the bag it caused anal leakage. But I ate those chips all day, guys, and I was totes fine.” (Angela, 57:43)

• Jingles: Written by Family (60:48 - 61:06)

  • The Dunder Mifflin ad jingle was written by BJ Novak’s brother, Jesse Novak (“BoJack Horseman,” “The Mindy Project”). Later, the jingle is rewritten by Craig Robinson (Darryl).

• Easter Eggs: Philly Jim’s Guitar (62:10 - 63:47)

  • Jim’s “Second Life” avatar’s guitar and job as a Philly sportswriter is later mirrored in Season 9—possibly due to the show's bible picking up these little character threads.

• Improvisation: Kevin’s Tape-Tissue (65:41 - 67:23)

  • Brian Baumgartner improvised giving Phyllis tape instead of a tissue, a bit that earned a camera angle adjustment in subsequent takes.

• Paper Airplane POV Shot (81:19 - 82:51)

  • Jason Reitman explains that the effect is a tribute to 90s bullet/arrow POVs (e.g., Sam Raimi, John Woo), achieved by taping the paper airplane to the camera.

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments (w/ Timestamps)

• "Directing The Office was like someone asking you, do you want to drive my Lamborghini?"
  — Jason Reitman (12:44)

• “You could probably walk down the street and stick a microphone in someone's face and say, give me a break, and they'd immediately go into it.”
  — Jenna Fischer (24:44)

• “I just want to remind you that's the theme of this episode—hidden gems and crossover connections.”
  — Jenna Fischer (25:02)

• “I hate it. I don't hate it. I just don't like it at all. It's terrible.”
  — Michael Scott (Craig Robinson’s jingle scene, ~64:43)

• Angela’s strong feelings on the mystery genre:
  “I find the mystery genre disgusting, and I hate being titillated.” (Angela Martin, 55:12)

• On Michael’s endless enthusiasm:
  “He is on fire today... Has Michael ever had a more exciting day at work? No.”
  — Jenna Fischer (09:42)

• On improvisation and cast chemistry:
  “That's such a great example of how our improvisations would work into a scene... if they liked them, they'd draw you in to create a fun button.”
  — Jenna Fischer (67:08)

• On the ending’s emotional payoff:
  “Anyone who’s ever done a high school play or made a high school video knows what it feels like when outsiders come together to make something... it bonds you and erases fights because you can’t help it.”
  — Jason Reitman (79:03)

• Ed Helms’ many failed jingle attempts:
  “Break me off a piece of that applesauce, Chrysler car, football cream, lumber tar, Snickers bar...”
  — Angela Kinsey (83:07)

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Important Segment Timestamps

• 03:14 — Kit Kat Jingle global variations
• 04:45 — Real-life cereal cafés inspired by Mike’s Cereal Shack
• 06:10, 07:00 — Hilarious fan catches about Michael’s “final, final, final video" and missing Holly, Nashua
• 10:16–15:26 — Jason Reitman on directing The Office (audio)
• 17:19–21:36 — Deep dive: Second Life; how graphics were made for the episode
• 24:44 — Kit Kat earworms and pop culture trivia
• 33:20–35:40 — Crossover connections with Monk, personal stories from Jenna & Angela
• 41:02–42:57 — Jason Reitman on making the fake Nashua commercial (audio)
• 57:43 — Angela’s “anal leakage” potato chip commercial story
• 60:45 — Discussion of BJ Novak’s brother writing the jingle
• 62:10–63:47 — Philly Jim’s guitar and sports job foreshadowed
• 65:41–67:23 — Kevin offers Phyllis tape instead of a tissue (Brian Baumgartner’s improv)
• 74:18–77:30 — Angela reveals pregnancy, how she and Mindy were edited into the rooftop scene, Jenna’s joyful reaction

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Final Message & Reflections

• Jason Reitman’s closing audio (84:04):
  • His daughter only knows his directing work from The Office and is proud of it.
  • “It really is a privilege to be part of the history of that show... there’s only so many people who have walked on the moon, and there’s only so many people who have directed The Office.”
  • Recalls the warmth and fun of the cast, counter to the “comedy only comes from anger” myth.

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Takeaway

This episode is a nostalgic and heartfelt reminder of The Office’s creative magic, both in front of and behind the camera. Jenna and Angela’s rapport and genuine affection for their colleagues, combined with Jason Reitman’s anecdotes and the impressive attention to detail (from prop emails to the pitch-perfect “bad” commercial), make this a treasure trove for fans.

Next Week:
Branch Wars — “I think we're going to have a few hidden gems in a row. I'm predicting.” (Jenna, 85:31)

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Compiled with warmth, laughs, and plenty of crossover connections.

Transcript

[Angela Kinsey]

So I was driving from Manhattan to the airport, you know, to jfk.

[Jenna Fischer]

Yeah.

[Angela Kinsey]

And we were going through all the different boroughs of New York, you know that drive to get to the airport.

[Jenna Fischer]

Sure.

[Angela Kinsey]

And I saw a Bob's Discount Furniture.

[Jenna Fischer]

Did you get all excited?

[Angela Kinsey]

I did.

[Jenna Fischer]

Did you go in there and buy a recliner? They have great recliners.

[Angela Kinsey]

I couldn't fit that in my carry on.

[Jenna Fischer]

It wasn't convenient. Well, they truly have everything. They have beds, dressers, sofas, sofa sleepers, mattresses. They have extendable dining room sets.

[Angela Kinsey]

Also, if you have like a style slump and you want to give your home a whole zhuzh, Bob's has affordable styles that really can perk up your house but not break the bank.

[Jenna Fischer]

Get your picks in 26 at Bob's Discount Furniture.

[Angela Kinsey]

Oh, we are in that post holiday to New Year window. You know, it's that time where everyone's kind of resetting. You're either hibernating or you're getting really reflective. Cause the New Year's about to roll around.

[Jenna Fischer]

You might have some big resolution energy going on right now. And if you do and you need something, maybe something you weren't gifted, head on over to Macy's.

[Angela Kinsey]

Yeah, maybe it's time to treat yourself.

[Jenna Fischer]

They've got an after Christmas sale event going on now from December 26th to January 1st. You can save big on a lot of Items. They've got 50% off women's wool blend coats, 33% off women's party and cocktail dresses, and 20 to 40% off activewear at brands like Nike and Adidas.

[Angela Kinsey]

I mean, you gotta love a sale like that. Shop now@macy's.com or in store.

[Jenna Fischer]

Hello, everyone, and welcome to your second drink of local ad. This is a great episode. We have audio clips from director Jason Reitman.

[Angela Kinsey]

Yeah.

[Jenna Fischer]

And Angela, I don't know if you remember, but when we did our original breakdown of this episode, you titled this podcast episode Hidden Gems and Crossover Connections.

[Angela Kinsey]

I am such a dork. I do remember. Guess what? So when we dove into our mailbag for the second drink, I believe we found even more hidden gems.

[Jenna Fischer]

We did not find any more crossover connections.

[Angela Kinsey]

No, we did not.

[Jenna Fischer]

But that's okay. I think this episode still holds that title. Okay, let's start with an email that I found charming from Jade A. In New Zealand. You might remember, Angela, that I gave some Kit Kat facts in my fast facts. Sure. Well, Jade wrote in and said, quote, I would like to just say that I found your Kit Kat facts to be an amusing revelation. I Have never heard the Kit Kat jingle that Andy was singing in the episode. No idea why, but maybe we have different advertising in New Zealand. Our KitKat jingle is have a break, have a Kit Kat. I mean, I don't know if I'm singing it right, but instead of gimme a break, break me off a piece of that Kit Kat.

[Angela Kinsey]

Kit Kat bar. Yeah, you were singing it to the same tune. But they might have their own tune.

[Jenna Fischer]

They might have their own tune, but their jingle is have a break, have a Kit Kat. So Jade said, I always thought that Break me off a piece of that Fancy Feast was the correct ending to the jingle that was stuck in Andy's head.

[Angela Kinsey]

They clearly also don't have Fancy Feast cat food there.

[Jenna Fischer]

I guess not. Jade said, I found this very amusing and after watching the Office so many times, I'm glad to have found a new joke to laugh at.

[Angela Kinsey]

I love that.

[Jenna Fischer]

I love it that our podcast revealed that to her.

[Angela Kinsey]

That reminds me of when Billie Eilish was on.

[Jenna Fischer]

Yes.

[Angela Kinsey]

And she had. What was it?

[Jenna Fischer]

She thought Bono was from Scranton.

[Angela Kinsey]

From Scranton. Oh my gosh. This is also the episode where Michael has his big idea to start a restaurant where you only eat cereal.

[Jenna Fischer]

Yes. Mike's Cereal Shack.

[Angela Kinsey]

That's right. You wondered, Jenna, if anyone had ever opened a cereal shack. Well, we got a fan mail flurry. We got so many letters from people sharing about Cereal Shacks.

[Jenna Fischer]

Wow.

[Angela Kinsey]

I mean, it's too many to read, but I want to share a few. Mackenzie T. Wrote in and said, I have some info for your deep dive about Mike's Cereal Shack. There is a place near my home in Utah called Stirs that has put Michael Scott's business model into action. They have over 75 name brand cereals and their slogan is changing the way you eat cereal.

[Jenna Fischer]

Wow. Right?

[Angela Kinsey]

And then Mackenzie goes on to say, P.S. i love your podcast so much and look forward to it every week. You brighten my Wednesdays.

[Jenna Fischer]

Aw, thank you.

[Angela Kinsey]

Here's another one. Brittany Y. Says, ladies, all caps, multiple exclamation points. Hi, huge fan. There is in fact a cereal shop in Madrid, Spain. I took a trip there in 2019 and I had to visit it because it reminded me of Michael.

[Jason Reitman]

Wow.

[Angela Kinsey]

How about that? In Spain. In Spain. Last one. Lacey W. Says. Hi, ladies, not a question, but I wanted to let you know that there definitely was a cereal restaurant very similar to Mike's Cereal Shack. I remember because it was in Chicago and while I was visiting on a business trip years ago, I made sure to visit it. It was called Are you ready for this?

[Jenna Fischer]

What?

[Angela Kinsey]

It was called Cereality. Wow. Get it?

[Jenna Fischer]

Mm.

[Angela Kinsey]

You could get regular old cereal, but it also had all kinds of toppings. You could pick a different type of milk. The whole thing. She said it was a real hoot. Ah.

[Jenna Fischer]

Wow. So there. Yes. The answer to my question is yes.

[Angela Kinsey]

There's lots of cereal shacks.

[Jenna Fischer]

Wow. Who knew? Well, finally, I wanna share two fan catches. The first one is from Ilona N. Who says, not a question, but a late catch. At around 16 minutes and 45 seconds, when Michael emails the ad to corporate, his email reads, quote, here is the final, final, final video. I love this, as it could imply that he either submitted multiple videos and then retracted them because they weren't perfect enough or that corporate kept requesting the submission and he delayed for the same reason. I know the podcast already aired, but it made me laugh harder than it should have. Love you too. And the podcast, oh, my God, that is so funny.

[Angela Kinsey]

I actually think it's because he kept sending different versions.

[Jenna Fischer]

Yes, I agree. And this reminds me of, like, whenever we would turn in our book or if I've ever turned in a script or something I've written, I'll send it. And then the next day I'll be like, wait, no, read this one. I'm sending a new version. I zhuzhed it again this morning.

[Angela Kinsey]

You and I did that constantly when we wrote our book.

[Jenna Fischer]

We did.

[Angela Kinsey]

I would send it to you, and I would write, okay, I'm titling this AK Final, right?

[Jenna Fischer]

Yes, that's right. And then it would be like, final, final.

[Angela Kinsey]

Yeah.

[Jenna Fischer]

Well, that email handle, that also would have been a little treat from our crew members who set up that shop. You know, something like that wasn't in the script, but our crew, they might have gone to a writer and said, listen, we're gonna shoot this score. What do you want the subject line to be? I love that. I love that attention to detail.

[Angela Kinsey]

Same.

[Jenna Fischer]

It's a funny little joke. You have to look for it. All right, well, finally, here's my second fan catch. You know how we see the commercials from the other branches, and at the end of their commercials, it's just all the employees like, waving. Michael thinks it's so boring. Well, we got this from Joan S. Joan said, I was watching the show, and I paused it twice on the Nashua commercial. I wanted to see if Holly was, in the end, waving. I didn't see her, and I didn't hear you ladies mention if she was in it. But since we see her at the end of the Season. I would think she's already working for Dunder Mifflin around the time this commercial was made. Was this an oopsie or was that storyline not on the table yet?

[Angela Kinsey]

Oh, they didn't have her yet.

[Jenna Fischer]

No, no.

[Angela Kinsey]

That's why. But what a good catch.

[Jenna Fischer]

I mean, cause yeah, she would have been there. Yes. She would have been an employee at Nashua at this. But no. Maybe we'll just say she was out sick the day they filmed the Wave. Well, that's all we've got for today. Please enjoy our second drink of local ad. Have a great rest of your year and we will see you in 2026.

[Angela Kinsey]

See you then.

[Jenna Fischer]

I'm Jenna Fisher.

[Angela Kinsey]

And I'm Angela Kinsey.

[Jenna Fischer]

We were on the Office together and we're best friends. And now we're doing the ultimate Office Rewatch podcast just for you.

[Angela Kinsey]

Each week we will break down an episode of the Office and give exclusive behind the scenes stories that only two people who were there can tell you.

[Jenna Fischer]

We're the Office Ladies. Welcome to Office Ladies, everyone. Hello.

[Angela Kinsey]

Hi. Good morning. Or good afternoon or maybe good evening.

[Jenna Fischer]

We don't know when you listen.

[Angela Kinsey]

No.

[Jenna Fischer]

So we're going to cover all of it.

[Angela Kinsey]

What if I was like, actually, we do. They're going. What?

[Jenna Fischer]

We are here today to talk about local A.D. season four, episode nine, which I'm going to declare a hidden gem.

[Angela Kinsey]

Whenever you say I'm going to declare, you know where my brain goes. I can't help it.

[Jenna Fischer]

Bankruptcy. Yes.

[Angela Kinsey]

For the rest of my life, I'm just going to walk this earth and someone's going to be like, I declare and I'm going to think bankruptcy.

[Jenna Fischer]

Yeah. Can't help it.

[Angela Kinsey]

It's like, that's what she said. We can't help it.

[Jenna Fischer]

That's what she said.

[Angela Kinsey]

I don't know.

[Jenna Fischer]

It doesn't work.

[Angela Kinsey]

It is a gem. Let's hear about it, Jenna.

[Jenna Fischer]

It was written by BJ Novak and directed by Jason Reitman. Here is a summary. When the Scranton branch is asked to participate in a Dunder Mifflin television ad, Michael seizes his chance to exhibit his creativity and enlists the help and talents of his employees. I mean, has Michael ever had a more exciting day at work? No.

[Angela Kinsey]

I can't imagine the giddiness that he had. How he woke up to his bacon on his George Foreman grill by his bed. He ate it real fast, nudged Jan because she was passed out and went to work.

[Jenna Fischer]

He is on fire today. Also in this episode, Dwight explores the online world of second life as a means of escaping his real life pain about his breakup with Angela. Oh, and Andy will not stop asking Dwight's advice in his pursuit of Angela. It's just torturing poor Dwight.

[Angela Kinsey]

It is. Have you ever had a crush where your friend was maybe liking the same guy but was doing better or something, and they'd be like, hey, he said this. What should I say back? And you're just like, oh, it's the worst. It is. Poor, poor Dwight.

[Jenna Fischer]

Well, let's get into some fast facts. Fast fact number one. Like I said, this episode is directed by Jason Reit. Jason Reitman, Golden Globe nominated for his movie thank youk for Smoking. He also won the Independent Spirit Award for best screenplay for that and Academy Award nominated director of Juno, among many other things. I mean, amazing.

[Angela Kinsey]

Yeah.

[Jenna Fischer]

Now, when he came to direct the Office, he had finished Juno, but it had not come out yet. So all of those accolades were in his future. But one of the stars of Juno was Rainn Wilson.

[Angela Kinsey]

Yes.

[Jenna Fischer]

A little connection.

[Angela Kinsey]

And Jenna, I'm gonna let you do your fast facts, but this whole episode for me is about crossover connections with people.

[Jenna Fischer]

Oh, local ad colon. Crossover connections.

[Angela Kinsey]

Local ad colon. Hidden gym slash crossover connections.

[Jenna Fischer]

There it is.

[Angela Kinsey]

Hashtag.

[Jenna Fischer]

That's what she said.

[Angela Kinsey]

That's what she said. Jenna. I have been emailing with Jason over these last few months because I, Oscar and Brian and I were part of Jason's remake of the Princess Bride for Quibi.

[Jenna Fischer]

It was so good.

[Angela Kinsey]

It was so fun. And we all shot it, you know, separately, like at our homes. And then Jason edited together all the dialogue. I played Vizzini, Oscar played Inigo, and Brian played Fesic. It was so much fun. So we were trading emails and I was like, hey, by the way, local ad is coming up. Would you send in some audio clips? And he was so generous. These are so great. I'm excited for you guys to hear.

[Jenna Fischer]

Of course, the first thing we asked him was how he came to direct on the Office. And here is what he had to say.

[Jason Reitman]

Like any human being who was alive at the time, I was an enormous fan of the Office. I thought it was the greatest thing on television. It was this collection of the greatest talent actors and writers who were making a generation defining comedy, which was somehow sweet but always subversive. And the storytelling was great. You know, feature directors that I really admired had already come and directed the show, like Harold Ramis, I think I had already directed Rain in Juno and I had these little connections to other people on the show. I feel like I knew a fair amount of the cast and some writers on the show already. I don't even know why, but either. My agent reached out and said, hey, do you want to direct any television? And I think my response was, I would be up for directing the Office. And Rain made it even sound like a better opportunity by saying, look, the worst you can do when you direct the Office is get a B plus. And the best you can do is an A. Well, all right. I mean, I always used to tell people that directing the Office was like someone asking you, do you want to drive my Lamborghini? And it's like, okay, it's just a. It was a show. And clearly, particularly when I came in, because I came in in season four, that so clearly knew exactly who it was and how it was made, that as a director, really, you are simply the first audience and you have the opportunity to maybe point a couple people in the right direction. But otherwise, as a director on the Office, it's a learning experience and a joyful one.

[Jenna Fischer]

How about a hidden gem of an audio clip? Jason and crossover connections.

[Angela Kinsey]

Yes.

[Jenna Fischer]

It's all there. I love what he said about directing the Office was like, if your friend said, hey, do you want to drive my Lamborghini? Like, so nice.

[Angela Kinsey]

We also asked Jason if he had any first impressions of, you know, being on the set and being with all of us.

[Jason Reitman]

I remember getting there, and I was just blown away by the directing process, that the camera operators were meant to be performers themselves, and unlike anything I'd ever directed in the past. I was given a floor plan and asked to draw out the performance of the camera operators, which direction they would go and which direction they would look. Because the idea was that within a single take, you should be able to cover every camera angle that can be used in the editing of a scene. So this was a unique challenge as a director and kind of a thrilling one, where you knew that there was eight shots, you wanted to get off a wide, a couple mediums, close ups, and you wanted to be able to pan into reactions, and that somehow you had two cameras, you had two operators, and they were gonna need to catch all these things without catching each other, and they would duck under desks as one would pan by the other. It was like doing Sudoku, you know, it was like this fun problem to solve, and at the same time, a thrill to watch the actual operators who knew how to do it. Remember, the set was freezing cold, which was Steve Carell's request, if I remember right. You know, this whole cold is comedy thing. I love that. I Love cold. So that was fine by me.

[Jenna Fischer]

Okay, here's what I have to say about that audio clip. What the two things that he mentions are. One, just incredible, masterful choreography of the camera work and that it was freezing cold. That should tell you how cold our set was.

[Angela Kinsey]

I mean, I have pictures of people that weren't in scenes like hair and makeup in full on parkas with hoods up and gloves. But I am really glad that Jason described the sort of dance that our cameramen did. I mean, we've talked about it a little bit, but I thought he was very eloquent in how he described it because it was a really just fascinating, beautiful thing to watch. If you weren't in the scene, you could watch those guys. And I was like always so impressed.

[Jenna Fischer]

And I imagine especially weird to see the first time walking onto our set and seeing all that they did to get the shots.

[Angela Kinsey]

Yeah. One of the things I remember about Jason is him breaking and laughing when we did Talking Heads. I just remember him cracking up because I had one in this. And there were also some in the deleted scenes that didn't make it in. So he must have had a whole day of Talking Heads. And he talked about it in the DVD commentary that one of the things he wasn't really prepared for as a director on this show is how the director is part of the cast, because the director sits in the conference room when you do Talking Heads.

[Jenna Fischer]

And.

[Angela Kinsey]

And we talked directly to the director as part of the mockumentary and he said he kept laughing. And that is my memory too.

[Jenna Fischer]

Yes, you're so right. We'll talk about it when we get to it. But Pam has a talking head that we could not get through. Well, we're really grateful that Jason sent in these clips and we have even more. We'll sprinkle them throughout the episode. Yes. Next up is Fast fact number two, which is all about Second Life.

[Angela Kinsey]

Oh, Jenna, let me tell you, when I rewatched this and saw the Second Life storyline, I was like, oh, I know my lady Jenna Fisher is going to do a deep dive on this because you love these kind of games. You play these kind of games.

[Jenna Fischer]

Well, I played the Sims.

[Angela Kinsey]

Yes.

[Jenna Fischer]

Which is very different from Second Life. Oh, by the way, Second Life is real and it still exists today. And like Dwight says in the episode, it's not a game. Sims is a game where you have a character and you have to eat food and go to the bathroom and have a job and try to build a mansion and things like that.

[Angela Kinsey]

This is what I Remember, Jenna?

[Jenna Fischer]

I remember.

[Angela Kinsey]

You built a whole world. You were working on your world. Isn't that like a second life?

[Jenna Fischer]

A little bit. You know, I stopped playing Sims when I had built myself a little house, and I had a little cat that was just like my real cat, Andy. And in the game, I was petting my fake cat, and I looked over at my real cat, who was like. And I thought, yeah, I need to get out of this game and pet my real cat.

[Angela Kinsey]

Oh, man.

[Jenna Fischer]

So Second Life, it predated Twitter and Instagram and social media, and it was almost like a virtual online chat room. You created an avatar of yourself, and then you could go in and interact with other people's avatars, like Reddit.

[Angela Kinsey]

Like, if I animated myself and then I could go in a Reddit chat room.

[Jenna Fischer]

Yes, very similar, but you can build things. You could build a little hotel and run it, and then other avatars could come to your hotel.

[Angela Kinsey]

Oh, that's kind of fun.

[Jenna Fischer]

You can go to a concert. There were college classes, press conferences that you could attend as your avatar, and you could even buy land, shop for clothes and gadgets, visit with friends. It was this online world. It was created by Linden Lab, and it was just like a social experience. It wasn't a game. You didn't win anything, but you could earn money in the game that you would then spend on these different experiences.

[Angela Kinsey]

I get it. I could see where that would be really fun. It kind of reminds me a little bit of this movie we just watched with the kids called Ready Player One. You sort of design your avatar and you get to go explore and interact with other people.

[Jenna Fischer]

I've not seen that movie, but that sounds on point.

[Angela Kinsey]

You should see it.

[Jenna Fischer]

Okay.

[Angela Kinsey]

I think you would like it.

[Jenna Fischer]

Okay, I'll watch the first 20 minutes of it.

[Angela Kinsey]

Yeah. Tell me about the towel next to the coffee pot.

[Jenna Fischer]

You got it. Is there a charming random detail I can hone in on in the first 20 minutes of the film?

[Angela Kinsey]

I'm sure you'll find it. So much shade. Okay, go on.

[Jenna Fischer]

It's good. You're still not bitter about it, though. We had a fan question about Second Life from Winston F. Olivia Lovell, Gianna Williams, and John Luscombe. They just said, can you please tell us everything about using Second and Second Second Life on the Office? It seems like such a big undertaking to program a whole massive multiplayer online game for a single episode. Who came up with it? How did you do it? Well, you know who I had to reach out to?

[Angela Kinsey]

Kenta. Kenta. Kentopedia.

[Jenna Fischer]

Kentapedia. Kent reached out to the developers of Second Life, Clear Ink and Linden Labs, and we entered into a license agreement with them. They ended up creating all of the avatars and animation for us. Kent had to send pictures of John and Rain over to those guys, and they drew out little avatars of them based on Jason and Greg's direction. And that's how they made it so cool.

[Angela Kinsey]

And Kent is so awesome. We go to Kent every week.

[Jenna Fischer]

I know. Thanks, Kent. We got a letter, Angela, from CYN Skyberg. And listen to this. I worked at Second Life when this episode came out, and we were so excited. I was the head of customer service at the time, and I got all our team together virtually to watch the episode. Second Life was and is a crazy place, and so much really nutso stuff happened in there. This was a big highlight for all of us.

[Angela Kinsey]

I bet Sin has some good stories.

[Jenna Fischer]

No, I didn't want to open up that Pandora's box because I thought, oh, no, I don't want to get anyone in trouble. But how cool I am now.

[Angela Kinsey]

Curious. That is so cool.

[Jenna Fischer]

Are you ready for fast fact number three? Yeah. I'm calling this one KitKat fun facts.

[Angela Kinsey]

Oh, did you do a deep dive on Kit Kats, lady?

[Jenna Fischer]

Of course I did. As you know, in this episode, the character of Andy cannot remember the end of the famous jingle. Gimme a break. Gimme a break. Break me off a piece of that Kit Kat bar. Yeah. So I thought y' all might like to know that the Kit Kat bar was brought to market in 1930 by Roundtree of York in the United Kingdom. It was advertised as the best companion to a cup of tea.

[Angela Kinsey]

Round tree of maker of chocolate, seventh of its name. Best companion cup of tea.

[Jenna Fischer]

I don't know.

[Angela Kinsey]

I'm sorry. I just make everything a Game of Thrones title.

[Jenna Fischer]

Even though I never finished Game of Thrones like John Wick. I love your Game of Thrones names that you make, Angela.

[Angela Kinsey]

Thank you. I feel seen somewhat.

[Jenna Fischer]

The jingle that Andy Can't Remember debuted in the United States in 1986, and it is still the jingle today. The words are by Ken Shuldman and the music was written by Michael A. Levine. Versions of the original have been covered by Carrie Underwood, Sean Colvin, and countless actors who have been seen in the commercials. But here's where it gets interesting, okay? This song, the Kit Kat jingle, was cited in a study by a researcher at the University of Cincinnati who declared it one of the top 10 earworms. An earworm is a bit of a melody or Bit of a song that becomes stuck in your head.

[Angela Kinsey]

Oh, yes.

[Jenna Fischer]

The researcher's name is James Caleris and he studied this phenomenon. Why do bits of songs get stuck. Stuck in our heads? He said that it happens to almost everyone at some point in their life, but he found that it did happen more to women and musicians.

[Angela Kinsey]

Huh. I have had Biminin stuck in my head for years.

[Jenna Fischer]

Oh, okay. That was not on his list. But do you know what was on his list of wormiest songs?

[Angela Kinsey]

Let's hear it.

[Jenna Fischer]

The Chili's Jingle Baby Back Ribs.

[Angela Kinsey]

Oh, yes.

[Jenna Fischer]

Which has also been featured on the Office. The other songs that made the top 10 were we will Rock youk, who Let the Dogs out, the Mission Impossible theme song, Whoomp, There It Is, the Lion Sleeps Tonight, It's a Small World after all, and ymca. Those are the wormiest songs.

[Angela Kinsey]

The wormiest songs. Well, I guess Bi Menon isn't really a song.

[Jenna Fischer]

No, but it's a bit of melody. Yes. So you don't get the whole song trapped in your head. You just get some little bit of the melody stuck in your head. Yeah, there you go.

[Angela Kinsey]

Well, I feel like everybody. You could probably walk down the street and stick a microphone in someone's face and say, give me a break, and they'd immediately go into it. Yeah, everyone knows that.

[Jenna Fischer]

That's all I got, lady.

[Angela Kinsey]

I thought those were wonderful fast facts. I'm excited to get into this episode. I've got some stuff coming up.

[Jenna Fischer]

Well, I hope it's a ton of hidden gems and crossover connections. I just want to remind you that's the theme of this episode.

[Angela Kinsey]

Thank you for the reminder. Let's take a break and come back with some more hidden gems and local ad. This podcast is sponsored by Squarespace.

[Jenna Fischer]

We probably don't need to tell you that our officeladies.com website is active and wonderful. Thanks to Squarespace.

[Angela Kinsey]

Yeah, we've talked about Squarespace a lot because we love it and we use it every single week.

[Jenna Fischer]

Yes, Ileana manages our website and she does it through Squarespace. And the reason that she does it through Squarespace is because it is so user friendly.

[Angela Kinsey]

It's so user friendly that only a handful of times when Ileana has taken a vacation or been out of town, she passes this torch along to Josh.

[Jenna Fischer]

Who then manages our website for the.

[Angela Kinsey]

Day and a half that he needs to. But it's that user friendly.

[Jenna Fischer]

It's amazing. It has cutting edge design, it will help you find a domain, it can help you fundraise, you can post videos, head to squarespace.com officeladies for a free trial and when you're ready to launch, use offer code officeladies to save 10% off your first purchase of a website or domain.

[Angela Kinsey]

You guys have heard us talk about Acorns before. It is a simple tool that's going to help you save and you know at different times in your life you have different goals. I remember when I got my first job and my dad helped me set up a banking account so I could save money for the things I wanted. And I remember being so proud that I was saving money. Acorns makes it easy to give your money a chance to grow. Here's how it works. You don't need to be a finance whiz. Acorns puts your money into an expert built portfolio to make sure you're investing wisely and not wildly. Sign up now and Acorns will boost your new account with a $5 bonus. Investment join the over 14 million all time customers who have already saved and invested over $25 billion with Acorns. Head to acorns.com officeladies or download the Acorns app to get started. Paid non client endorsement compensation provides incentive to positively promote Acorns Tier 2 compensation provided investing involves risk. Acorn Advisors LLC and SEC registered investment advisor.

[Jenna Fischer]

View important [e-mail] OfficeLadies Josh and I.

[Angela Kinsey]

Recently drove up the coast for our anniversary and we walked past the most adorable house and found out you can book it on Airbnb. Oh yeah. So we snapped a picture because we want to go back there with our kids, you know.

[Jenna Fischer]

Sure.

[Angela Kinsey]

And we're going to need a bigger place to stay because, you know, we've got the kids with us and it's so cute. I can't wait to book it.

[Jenna Fischer]

Well, when you book it, you realize you could host your home on Airbnb while you're traveling because you. Anybody can do this. If you're going to be traveling or if you travel a lot, you can host your home on Airbnb and then your house can be earning money while you're away.

[Angela Kinsey]

This is really great for someone who travels frequently. Yeah, because then you're making money on your house while you're away. That can be put towards your future travel. It's a practical way to earn extra money while you're out in the world doing your thing.

[Jenna Fischer]

Didn't Gwyneth Paltrow host her little guest house on Airbnb as like a special thing? Like if you had a guest house, you could do it.

[Angela Kinsey]

Yeah. I want to stay in Gwyneth's guest house.

[Jenna Fischer]

Exactly. Your home might be worth more than you think. Find out how [e-mail] host.

[Angela Kinsey]

You know, Jenna, how some people, they have a whole, like, 12 step beauty routine. I can't. I can't do. I can't do it. I need, like, five steps. Give me, like, five steps.

[Jenna Fischer]

Five steps at most.

[Angela Kinsey]

I can manage that.

[Jenna Fischer]

I like a minimalist beauty routine. And you know what I also like is when my makeup is also just good for my skin. I'm getting my skincare and my makeup in one. Guess what I'm headed to here?

[Angela Kinsey]

Merit.

[Jenna Fischer]

Yes. Correct. The holidays are right around the corner.

[Angela Kinsey]

You don't have time for lots of steps. You need to look good in a few steps.

[Jenna Fischer]

Yes. You want to focus on enjoying the season, not stressing over a makeup routine. Head over to Merit Beauty. Grab the minimalist. It works double duty as both a foundation and a concealer, and it gives you great quick coverage. Right now, Merit Beauty is offering our listeners their signature makeup bag with your.

[Angela Kinsey]

First [e-mail] that's meritbeauty.com to get your free signature makeup bag with your first order, meritbeauty.com all right, so this episode starts with a conference room scene. Michael's getting the gang to brainstorm ideas for their upcoming commercial. He's super excited. Right at the top, Phyllis shouts out dancing baby. Jenna, you know what she's talking about, right?

[Jenna Fischer]

There were those commercials with dancing babies in them, right?

[Angela Kinsey]

It was this phenomenon. Okay, here's my little mini deep dive, guys. It's referred to as the uka chaka baby. It was a 3D rendered animation of a baby dancing. It became a media phenomenon. It was one of the very first viral videos in the 90s. It was this dancing baby animation. It went all over these popular web forums, websites. It got emailed to people, demo videos, commercials. Eventually it ended up in mainstream television. It was featured on cbs, cnn. And then what I remember it from is it ended up being part of these, like, fantasy kind of things that Ally McBeal would have on her show.

[Jenna Fischer]

Show. Oh, yes, right. Yes. The dancing baby on Ally McBeal. I remember that.

[Angela Kinsey]

So this was one of the very first viral videos. And I went back and watched it. It's so creepy. It's so creepy. I have to put it in our stories. It is just the creepiest thing.

[Jenna Fischer]

America, what did we love about it? Sometimes you look back and you're like, why'd we go so crazy over that thing?

[Angela Kinsey]

I think because we'd never seen anything like it. This was like sort of the beginning of What? Memes and GIFs or GIFs, what do you call those? This was the beginning of that. This was this 3D animated baby dancing awkwardly to this song. And people were like, oh, my God, lady.

[Jenna Fischer]

Also, at the very beginning of this episode, we had a fan catch from Linda K, Sadie K. And Jackie Hewitt in the background of Michael's talking head. Angela, you are way out of character. What is going on there? It's at 16 seconds, everybody. 16 seconds.

[Angela Kinsey]

I know I have it. I took a screen grab of it. I am literally laughing. And then I just start chatting away. You see my mouth going. I am so out of character. I clearly didn't realize I was in the shot. Sometimes they would have Steve do talking heads right outside the conference room. And we were in the background, but it was like a little blurry, you know?

[Jenna Fischer]

Yeah.

[Angela Kinsey]

And I didn't realize, but I looked and it's rain, Brian, me, you and Ed. And I guess I'm telling a story.

[Jenna Fischer]

You are holding court. You are seated with your legs crossed, and we're all kind of standing around you. And you are clearly telling a very fun story. I know.

[Angela Kinsey]

I caught it, too.

[Jenna Fischer]

It was amazing.

[Angela Kinsey]

Also, it sets up in this scene the great runner of Andy not being able to remember the end of the KitKat jingle. And Jim immediately says, don't help him. So no one helps him.

[Jenna Fischer]

I know. That is the worst. I know. It also sets up that Pam has volunteered to make a logo for Michael's commercial. She's going to design a logo. She's very excited.

[Angela Kinsey]

Well, she says she's taking an animation class.

[Jenna Fischer]

I love that.

[Angela Kinsey]

I know. I was like, go, Pam.

[Jenna Fischer]

Next, the ad guys arrive. Michael runs out of the conference room and he is immediately going to start pitching them his ideas. He says he wants this commercial to be like MTV on crack. He goes around, he introduces them to everyone in the office.

[Angela Kinsey]

There's even more in the deleted scenes. He literally goes up to, like, every single person and does, like, a horrible.

[Jenna Fischer]

Introduction of all of them, the way only Michael can.

[Angela Kinsey]

If you want to see some more awkward, cringy Michael introductions, go to the deleted scenes.

[Jenna Fischer]

These two ad guys were played by Kyle Bornheimer and Tim Kang. You probably recognize these guys. Kyle has been on a ton of stuff. He was on Brooklyn Nine Nine. He's done a bunch of commercials. Tim is the same way. He went on to be a regular on the Mentalist and the reboot of Magnum P.I.

[Angela Kinsey]

Yes. Are you ready for some crossover connection?

[Jenna Fischer]

Lay them on me.

[Angela Kinsey]

Tim, who plays? Tim, ready for this? His daughter and my daughter were on the same soccer team in 2019. The Falcons. I was the team parent. My ex husband Warren was the coach. We make it work, y'. All. We make it work. And the Falcons made it to the finals in our AYSO division. We went on to play in the regional playoffs, you guys. And then we advanced to the area playoffs. The girls came in third and they were the runner up team to go to state.

[Jenna Fischer]

Lady, I will never forget your messages to me during this time of Isabel's soccer team going so far.

[Angela Kinsey]

It was the never ending year of soccer.

[Jenna Fischer]

It was. I would text you and I would say, what are you up to? And you're like, lady, we are still in this soccer tournament.

[Angela Kinsey]

Yes.

[Jenna Fischer]

But it was so exciting. I remember how excited those girls were. And Tim is one of the other parents of another girl. I love that.

[Angela Kinsey]

Yes. So Tim and I have sat on the sidelines together and cheered our girls on.

[Jenna Fischer]

Well, I have a connection to Kyle. It's not as exciting as that, but we were both in the movie Blades of Glory. He played the rink PA announcer. And so I guess in a way we also both sat in stands and cheered on a sporting event of ice skating, though fictional.

[Angela Kinsey]

Yes.

[Jenna Fischer]

Well, I have another crossover connection for you, Angela.

[Angela Kinsey]

I think I know this one.

[Jenna Fischer]

This one's really weird. And it's gonna be a runner through this whole episode. Like every guest star in this episode. Local AD has also had a guest appearance on Monk.

[Angela Kinsey]

It's so wild, isn't it?

[Jenna Fischer]

What is going on? Kyle played uniform cop in Mr. Monk and the Kid. And Tim played Mr. Brennaman in Mr. Monk is up all Night.

[Angela Kinsey]

I know. It's so wild to me. We have more crossover connections coming up. But there's your first two.

[Jenna Fischer]

Now we get into this episode and it opens with Dwight playing Second Life.

[Angela Kinsey]

And Jenna at 3 minutes, 39 seconds. Is it just me or does Dwight fly like Mother and Raised by Wolves?

[Jenna Fischer]

I don't know. Raised by Wolves. I know. I knew you would. It sounds very similar to Game of Thrones.

[Angela Kinsey]

Okay. Raised by Wolves is nothing like Game of Thrones. It is just the weirdest show on HBO Max. Here's the overview of Raised by Wolves. Two androids are tasked with raising human children on a mysterious planet. As the human colony threatens to be torn apart by religious differences, the androids learn that controlling the beliefs of humans is treacherous and a difficult task. Also, the androids mother is able to have babies. It's very bizarre, Jenna. It's so bizarre.

[Jenna Fischer]

It is not a surprise to me that I'm watching Last Tango in Halifax instead of raised by wolves.

[Angela Kinsey]

Now listen, Last Tango in Halifax is right up my alley. You know, I love any kind of, like, BBC programming, but I also love me some weird sci fi. Okay, I'm gonna show you. This is how Dwight flies in simple life. And this is how mother flies.

[Jenna Fischer]

Mm, I see it.

[Angela Kinsey]

They both go upright with their arms out.

[Jenna Fischer]

It's very creepy.

[Angela Kinsey]

I know. Anyone else that watch Raised by wolves go to 3 minutes, 39 seconds. Watch how Dwight does his lift off and it will remind you of mother.

[Jenna Fischer]

Angela will also put that on the pod.

[Angela Kinsey]

I'm gonna put it in our stories.

[Jenna Fischer]

I looked up Dwight's profile on second Life.

[Angela Kinsey]

You did?

[Jenna Fischer]

I did. It's still there. Here's what he has down as his interests. Muscle cars, pop culture, and sci fi buff. In parentheses, Harry Potter, the Lord of the rings, Star Wars 24, alias Smallville, the Apprentice, Lost, and Battlestar Galactica. His talents are listed as avid cornhusk, doll maker, beat sculptor, and not tying champion. He had to list a goal for his second life, and he wrote to calculate the exchange between shrewt bucks and and linden dollars. Linden dollars are the currency in second life. Okay, so there you have it. When he's not flying like mother, he is trying to calculate the exchange between shruitbox and linden dollars.

[Angela Kinsey]

I love that. Up next, Michael is going to pitch his big idea to the ad guys. I want you guys to know a deleted scene would have come before this between Jim and Michael. That is so delicious and fun. Basically, Michael wants to practice pitch to Jim. He brings Jim in the office, right? He has Jim sit behind his desk so he can practice pitch. And he says, this is his pitch to Jim. We start on a blank piece of paper. We widen to reveal ancient Rome. Jim's like, can't do that. Michael's like, okay. We widen to reveal a spaceship blasting out of a woman's womb.

[Jenna Fischer]

What?

[Angela Kinsey]

Then they do this very funny roleplay where Jim's like, get out of my office. It becomes a whole thing, but for real, the pitch Michael settles on is this one. And I thought we had to hear it. Sam, can you play it?

[Jason Reitman]

Little girl in a field holding a flower. We zoom back to find that she's in the desert and the field is an oasis. Zoom back further the desert. The desert is a sandbox in the world's largest resort hotel. Zoom back further. The hotel is actually the Playground of the world's largest prison. But we zoom back further. I can tell that your time is valuable.

[Jenna Fischer]

Oh, well, I love what he says when the guy is like, listen, I can tell your time is valuable. And Michael's like, well, actually, I don't get paid by the hour anymore. I get paid by the year. So, yeah, basically, I can waste as much time as I want. Not a problem.

[Angela Kinsey]

Yes. But I love that this is the pitch that he led with and. And knowing that he had other ideas, but this is what he went with.

[Jenna Fischer]

The ad guys are great. They're so real in how they react to Michael. They say, listen, we made something for the Nashua branch. Why don't we show that to you? And it'll give you an idea of what we can do. So he plays this commercial, and then they explain the only part of the commercial they're allowed to alter is the last five seconds. Yeah.

[Angela Kinsey]

And Michael's like, what? We just wave at the end? He goes, you know, you could clap. You know, make it your own.

[Jenna Fischer]

Yeah. This is where you can really get creative. You can be inside, you can be outside. We had a fan question. Aaron Jassa, Harry Driscoll, Molly Coates, and many others. They wanted to know who directed this commercial that plays in the middle of the episode. Was it Jason Reitman? Yes, it was Jason Reitman. I texted with BJ about this commercial, and he told me that Jason Reitman had directed real commercials before this. And he remembers that it was so cool because Jason laid out this big circular track on the floor and had the camera going around in circles, and BJ was like, I had never seen anything like that before. It was so cool.

[Angela Kinsey]

Well, we asked Jason about filming this fake commercial, and here's what he had to say.

[Jason Reitman]

The episode, local ad, contained two commercials inside it, and I'd been a commercial director. I was a bad commercial director, I should say. You know, the majority of the commercials that I directed were ones that, if you saw, you would revoke my Director's Guild card. You would just say, you're not allowed to direct again, and I would, you know, name clients, but that would be rude, but, you know, typical fast food and beer and just, like, not good work. I was not Spike Jonze, but I learned that format. There's certain things that you may not know how to do authentically, but you know how to satirize. Like, I know that I could never direct a David Fincher film, but I love him so much as a filmmaker that I could probably direct a satire of a David Fincher film. And so I don't know how to direct a great commercial, but I think I know how to direct the satire of a good commercial. And that was the kind of the. The great thing about doing the Dunder Mifflin ad was I felt my commercial brain trying to do the best worst version of what Dunder Mifflin would hand Michael Scott, which was this kind of cutesy commercial. It starred Jeff Witzke, who is an actor I've worked with since I was a kid. He literally was in my first short film and has been in everything I've ever made since. And he was the star of it, and that was great.

[Angela Kinsey]

I love that Jason just uses his friend Jeff in everything. I just think that's wonderful. Jenna. I want you to be in everything I do from here on out.

[Jenna Fischer]

Great. I love it.

[Angela Kinsey]

Okay, well, we have some crossover connections with Jeff. Are you ready? He was also in Mindy and Brenda, the TV short written by Mindy Kaling and Brenda Withers. Oh, yeah, he played the sales clerk.

[Jenna Fischer]

Well, lady, guess what? He also did a guest spot on Monk. He played human cannonball in Mr. Monk, Ghost of the Circus. That one really got me. I might need to look that one up. Human cannonball. Very curious.

[Angela Kinsey]

You might need to see what the human cannonball looks like.

[Jenna Fischer]

Yes.

[Angela Kinsey]

So not only did Jason hire Jeff again, he also hired a friend that he had worked with before to compose that music that sort of like. I don't know, it's like salsa Muzak that's playing in the background. It was composed by the same composer that did all the music for Juno Matteo Messina.

[Jenna Fischer]

I love that. Now things are going to get awkward. Andy pulls Dwight aside to get advice on how to get to first base with Angela. He says they've been necking a lot, but that means that they are literally rubbing their necks together. There's no kissing involved.

[Angela Kinsey]

Why don't we have any footage of that?

[Jenna Fischer]

I don't know. I don't know. Angela, we had a fan question from Amy Noki. She's dying to know, what is your backstory for Angela and Andy, and what is with the necking? Do you think this was for Angela, or is it because she can't stomach Andy and she's just trying to get back at Dwight?

[Angela Kinsey]

I love this question. I thought that Angela went out with Andy as sort of a revenge date. She was very mad at Dwight. She really thought she was done with Dwight. She was super, super angry with him. And as she started dating Andy, I think it became very clear to her. That really, Dwight had her heart, but she was too prideful to admit that. So she tried to date Andy, but it was a chore. And I think the necking thing is just something she was doing to put him off. Like, how can I let him touch me but not really touch me? So, yeah, I think her heart wasn't in it from the beginning.

[Jenna Fischer]

Yeah, I was thinking about it, and, you know, Angela can be very fussy and very structured, but we saw her going at it in Jim's little toy Playhouse thing and email surveillance. So when she's into someone, it's not like she puts people through these weird paces of, like, okay, first we just rub our necks together. I think this was exclusive to Andy. Oh, yeah, yeah.

[Angela Kinsey]

And maybe the senator, too, perhaps. I really think Dwight was the love of her life. And, you know, it just took them a while to get there.

[Jenna Fischer]

Poor Dwight. He's having to listen to all this, and he tries to put Andy off. He says, I don't think we should talk about this. People might overhear us. But then Andy just takes that to mean that they should come up with code names. Dwight's like, okay, well, Angela can stay the same, but let's change Andy to Dwight.

[Angela Kinsey]

Hmm?

[Jenna Fischer]

Okay.

[Angela Kinsey]

Yeah. And Andy's like, that's not really. That's not how this works, lady.

[Jenna Fischer]

This really reminded me of how you and I tried to come up with code names when we would have conversations and we were afraid other people could overhear us. And our code names were about this good. They were so obvious, it would be like a person's initials. So obvious.

[Angela Kinsey]

I know. We're not gonna be spies, Jenna.

[Jenna Fischer]

We're not gonna be spies, but we're gonna be mom detectives solving small crimes.

[Angela Kinsey]

I would love to be a mom detective with you mom detectives solving the small crimes no one cares about in your neighborhood.

[Jenna Fischer]

It's a hit.

[Angela Kinsey]

Who graffitied the construction cone at the intersection?

[Jenna Fischer]

Exactly. We'll find out. We'll tell you.

[Angela Kinsey]

We're on it. So coming up, we have a scene between Ryan and Michael that is so funny to me when Michael calls him, you know, to gripe. First of all, he calls him Rye. And then Ryan is like, don't call me about small problems. What have I told you about that?

[Jenna Fischer]

Yeah. And he says, well, you don't like it when I call you about big problems either, so what do you want from me?

[Angela Kinsey]

What do you want? So Jason said on the DVD commentary that they shot this in real time. Now, Jenna, do you remember they had built a little office that was Ryan's office at Corporate, right?

[Jenna Fischer]

Yes.

[Angela Kinsey]

So they had bj, you know, on the other side of the soundstage in this little room with a camera with him.

[Jenna Fischer]

And.

[Angela Kinsey]

And then they had a camera with Steve in his office as Michael. And that's the room Jason sat in. And they shot it simultaneously. And I think it really works because the chemistry is happening in real time.

[Jenna Fischer]

I always loved when we did that because it meant that you could improvise a little and the other person could react to you and you would get it on both cameras.

[Angela Kinsey]

Yes. And BJ said something I thought was so delightful because it's one of my favorite lines in this whole episode. BJ said he wrote the line, I can't cook, and I'm starting a restaurant.

[Jenna Fischer]

And the restaurant he says he's going to start is Mike's Cereal Shack. It's going to have every cereal you can get in the store.

[Angela Kinsey]

Yeah.

[Jenna Fischer]

I want you to know I did a little bit of a deep dive on Mike's Cereal Shack. I had to know, has anyone opened a Cereal Shack? The answer is no. But a woman named Catherine has designed the most adorable vintage poster for Mike's Cereal Shack. She has a company on Etsy called Cat Bone Design. It's so, so cute. I'm gonna put a picture of it in the pod. And then her profile really got me, Ange. Her profile says, I'm a stay at home mom with a passion for creating colorful and happy homes. Good design keeps me balanced and brings me joy. And being a designer means I can share that joy with others.

[Angela Kinsey]

Jenna shared it with me. It is adorable. We're going to put it in our stories, you guys, so you can look at the rest of her art.

[Jenna Fischer]

There's one more thing I want to say about this scene before we move on. Ryan's assistant.

[Angela Kinsey]

Yes.

[Jenna Fischer]

She pokes her head in the door at the beginning, and she says, eddie Murphy is on the line for you.

[Angela Kinsey]

Yes.

[Jenna Fischer]

Well, Ryan's assistant was played by Virginia Newcome. And I'll have you know she has not been on an episode of Monk. I know.

[Angela Kinsey]

I looked to see if she was.

[Jenna Fischer]

On Monk too, but she has been on the Walking Dead.

[Angela Kinsey]

Oh.

[Jenna Fischer]

So no crossover connection, but perhaps you recognize her from the Walking Dead.

[Angela Kinsey]

So Michael says, you know what? AD guys go away. I'm gonna do this on my own. He's gonna stake his whole reputation on it.

[Jenna Fischer]

Oh, yeah, yeah. He calls David Wallace. Yeah. And he says, listen, I'm going to make it. If you don't like it, fine. I'll Bring those guys back and I'll pay for it on my own dime. I need to do this.

[Angela Kinsey]

Well, he leads off the whole call with, I don't know who talks to their boss like this. I would never talk to a boss like this. He's like, hey, yeah, Ryan's being a little again. And Ryan goes, I'm on the call, Michael. And he's like, hey, bro. Like, so awkward.

[Jenna Fischer]

I just love Ryan's matter of factness. He is never rattled by Michael being Michael. And he's so direct and honest with Michael. He is to Michael what Daryl is to Kelly. Yes. Just the straight truth. And I feel like neither one of them knows how to handle that.

[Angela Kinsey]

Mm, mm. Not at all. This scene with BJ as Ryan just being very direct reminded me the most of who BJ is in real life. It's true, and he's very fair. But he'll break it down for you. He'll be like, I don't think you should do that. And here's why. You know?

[Jenna Fischer]

And it's what I love about him. Everybody needs that friend who doesn't blow smoke up your ass, frankly. You need that person that you can call and you know which friends are which friends. You know the friend you call when you want them to agree with you. And then you need that friend that you can call to get the straight truth. Right? And BJ is that friend. You can call him, but you have to be prepared to hear the real answer. Not what you want to hear, but what you need to hear.

[Angela Kinsey]

Yes. It's like having the friend that tells you the piece of broccoli's in your teeth.

[Jenna Fischer]

Yes.

[Angela Kinsey]

You need that friend.

[Jenna Fischer]

Yes. I have a little bit of a fan catch from this phone call scene coming in from OM Patel and Mina Hoyt. When David Wallace and Michael are on the call, the camera keeps swishing down to the phone. At first, the time on the phone shows that it is 9:38, but at the end of the call, the clock shows 9:22.

[Angela Kinsey]

Oh, that's a good catch.

[Jenna Fischer]

I want you to know that the date on the clock says October 3, 2007. That is when we shot this episode. I think that clock is the real time they were shooting this episode. They shot it in the morning around 9am on October 3, 2007.

[Angela Kinsey]

I'm positive of that.

[Jenna Fischer]

So Michael's about to gather everyone in the conference room, but maybe we should take a break and then we'll come back and get into his big ideas for his big commercial.

[Angela Kinsey]

They have a huge shoot ahead of them all hands on deck.

[Jenna Fischer]

I know. Sue Grafton.

[Angela Kinsey]

Sue Grafton.

[Jenna Fischer]

We'll be back.

[Angela Kinsey]

Reggie. I just sold my car online. Let's go, Grandpa. Wait, you did?

[Jenna Fischer]

Yep.

[Angela Kinsey]

On Carvana. Just put in the license plate, answered a few questions, got an offer in minutes. Easier than setting up that new digital picture frame. You don't say. Yeah, they're even picking it up tomorrow. Talk about fast.

[Jenna Fischer]

Wow.

[Angela Kinsey]

Way to go. So about that picture frame. Ah, forget about it. Until Carvana makes one, I'm not interested. Car selling made easy on car pickup fees may apply. Looking for a new way to grow.

[Jenna Fischer]

Your business with TikTok? For business, anything is possible. If you've ever thought about advertising on.

[Angela Kinsey]

TikTok, now's the time to do it.

[Jenna Fischer]

You can drive more customers to your.

[Angela Kinsey]

Website, sell products right in the app.

[Jason Reitman]

And you can even use TikTok's creative.

[Jenna Fischer]

Tools to easily make content and find.

[Angela Kinsey]

Creators to help sell your products for you. Find new customers today, just open your browser.

[Jenna Fischer]

Browser.

[Angela Kinsey]

Type in getstarted.TikTok.com tiktokads and grow your business fast.

[Jenna Fischer]

Maybe you like cooking, maybe you don't. Either way, the new Blue Apron is for you. Because along with our classic meal kits, we're offering new pre made and one pan meals to help you get dinner on the table fast. And now there is no subscription needed so you can just order and enjoy.

[Angela Kinsey]

Do delicious food your way.

[Jenna Fischer]

Shop 100/[e-mail] Get 50% off your first two orders with code APRON50. Terms and conditions apply. Visit blueapron.com terms for more. Okay, we are back and everyone is in the conference room. Michael is giving a big pep talk about how everyone is creative. Don't let anyone tell you that you're not creative. And this leads into a series of talking heads.

[Angela Kinsey]

And I want you guys to know there are even more in the deleted scenes. Pretty much every single person had a talking head in this episode, but not all of them made it in.

[Jenna Fischer]

So now Michael starts delegating jobs to people in preparation for this big commercial shoot.

[Angela Kinsey]

Yes, he says, kelly, makeup, Oscar, costume design guys go to 10 minutes, 4 seconds. Oscar shoots a look directly to camera, right down the barrel. That is so great. When Michael says costume design, look at that moment. And then he says, phyllis, get a celebrity.

[Jenna Fischer]

Yes. As we move out into the bullpen, this is when Phyllis learns that Sue Grafton, the mystery novelist, is at the Steamtown mall doing a book signing. And Michael says, go, Phyllis, go. You go get her. You convince her to be in our commercial and don't take no for an answer.

[Angela Kinsey]

He says, yeah, this will be a big coop, big cooperation.

[Jenna Fischer]

This is when Andy is going to try to butter up Angela a little bit by asking if Sue Grafton is attractive. To which Creed says, oh, yeah, she's super hot. And Andy says, maybe Angela should just pretend to be Sue Grafton in the commercial since Angela is also super hot.

[Angela Kinsey]

Yeah, Angela's like, that's not gonna happen.

[Jenna Fischer]

It's not gonna happen because as you reveal in your talking head, you find the mystery genre disgusting and you hate being titillated. Angela, we had a fan question from Chloe M. She would like to know how many takes did it take for you to get out the line. I hate being titillated without laughing.

[Angela Kinsey]

Chloe. I think they used the only one. I think I only did one where I didn't laugh. We were cracking up. Angela Martin is just wired so tight. I laughed at just saying the mystery genre was disgusting, disgusting, disgusting.

[Jenna Fischer]

I love every time Angela has very, very strong feelings on random subjects such as this.

[Angela Kinsey]

I do, too. Well, you know, I had an alternate talking head that didn't make it in. I guess they were deciding between which one. I definitely think they picked the best one. But I want to share with you what the alternate talking head is. It's in the deleted scenes. In this deleted talking head, Angela Martin says, this is not my first commercial. When I was in high school, I played a six year old in a electronic store ad. And it was humiliating. I mean, how small was I in high school that I could be passed for a 6 year old?

[Jenna Fischer]

I love it.

[Angela Kinsey]

And who made her do this? Did she have a stage mom? Did Angela Martin have a stage mom?

[Jenna Fischer]

I don't know. You did the pageant, right?

[Angela Kinsey]

I did pageants and now I did commercials. What was her childhood?

[Jenna Fischer]

We had a fan question from Jay Tickle. Can y' all talk about any commercials you've been in?

[Angela Kinsey]

Oh, Jay, I was in so many. That's how I, like, supported myself. I was an operator at 1-800-DENTIST and I did commercials.

[Jenna Fischer]

When I moved to Los Angeles, my one connection that I had was that my roommate had a commercial agent. And I was convinced that all I had to do was give this commercial agent my headshot and this person would also become my commercial agent. That did not happen. It took me about two years to find a commercial agent. And then I never booked a single commercial in a speaking role ever. In my whole career as an actress, I have never been in a commercial. I've been in the background of many commercials. I did A lot of background work. And then finally, about a year ago, I was approached by Smirnoff Vodka to be in a commercial with Ted Danson. I flipped out. My mom was so excited. She said, jenna, you're finally going to be in a commercial. Twenty years later, finally booked a commercial.

[Angela Kinsey]

Jenna, I loved that commercial you did with Ted Danson. I thought it was so stinking cute. I did a ton of commercials. I did a Buick spot. Oh, I did a lay's olestra. Remember the potato chips?

[Jenna Fischer]

Yeah. Did you get anal leakage?

[Angela Kinsey]

No, but that was on the bag. It said it caused anal leakage. But I ate those chips all day, guys, and I was totes fine.

[Jenna Fischer]

Well, there you go. That's the best commercial ever.

[Angela Kinsey]

I did a Nordstrom's commercial. I actually found my old sizzle reel. You guys, when you're out here as a commercial actor, you would put all your commercials on one, like video to send out to people, like a visual resume. And I found it.

[Jenna Fischer]

Jenna, that's amazing.

[Angela Kinsey]

I might have to put it in office. Ladies. We should put our early commercials in there.

[Jenna Fischer]

All I have is me blurry in the background of a telephone commercial. The Jurassic park ride.

[Angela Kinsey]

I'll put my leisure olestra spot and you put your Jurassic park ride. We'll put it in the stories.

[Jenna Fischer]

I don't even know if I can find it anymore. I'll look for it.

[Angela Kinsey]

Okay.

[Jenna Fischer]

I think they took it down off YouTube.

[Angela Kinsey]

Aw, that's too bad. Those would be two cute ones that.

[Jenna Fischer]

We could put in. I know. I have another fan question, Angela from Ashley Snell, who would like to know, has Sue Grafton ever held a book signing at the Steamtown Mall? Ashley, I looked it up and from what I could find, no. She is a real author. She is a New York Times best selling author. Actually, she is best known for writing a series of mystery novels starring a character named Kinsey Miley.

[Angela Kinsey]

Kinsey. And it's spelled exactly like my last name. It's K, I, N, S, E, Y.

[Jenna Fischer]

Isn't that crazy? Yeah.

[Angela Kinsey]

I couldn't believe it. It's the Alphabet mystery series. Kinsey Mulhoney was a former police officer turned private investigator.

[Jenna Fischer]

Hmm.

[Angela Kinsey]

Jenna, should I play Kinsey Milhoney?

[Jenna Fischer]

You should definitely look into this. I have a little bit of extra trivia. This is not the first time that there is a Sue Grafton reference on the Office Back on the Fire, which was also written by BJ Novak. Michael confuses Stanley Kaplan, who is the founder of a company that makes test prep materials with Sue Grafton. Now I Texted BJ about this, because I was thinking, does BJ have a connection to sue grafton? I mean, BJ's father was a famous writer. I thought maybe his family knew Sue Grafton. But BJ said no. He just thought it was a really funny reference.

[Angela Kinsey]

There you go. All right, we have got to talk about this fantastic jingle that Darryl has written for the commercial.

[Jenna Fischer]

Yes. Back by the break room, we have Darrel on keyboard surrounded by Andy, Kevin, Creed, and Kelly all singing this song that's meant to be in Michael's commercial. Michael comes up. He doesn't care for it. He was really hoping they were going to write a rap. Yeah.

[Angela Kinsey]

Darryl's like, what's a wrap? And Michael's like, oh, Darryl, I'm going to make you a mix. And Daryl's like, yeah, I am looking forward. Yeah.

[Jenna Fischer]

We had a fan question from Kaylee Adkins, Winston fans, Rob Holland, Alyssa Patterson and Matthew Kruel, and many others who wanted to know who wrote this jingle.

[Angela Kinsey]

Ooh, we have some good trivia about that, don't we?

[Jenna Fischer]

Yes. The jingle in this scene was written by BJ Novak's brother, Jesse Novak, who is a professional composer. He's also done Compositions for BoJack Horseman and the Mindy Project. He wrote this jingle. How fun is that? They kept it in the family.

[Angela Kinsey]

It's so great. Well, Jenna, now Jim overhears Andy telling Dwight he has an update for him for Operation Fallen Angel. And Jim is worried about Dwight and goes over to Pam, you know, gonna share with her about his second life.

[Jenna Fischer]

Like, dude, yes. Jim has created his own second life avatar because he's worried about Dwight. Yes. And he shows Pam, look at how bad it is. I'm going to take you into second life. Dwight has created second second life so that he can disconnect even more from reality. And this is when we find out a lot of things about Jim.

[Angela Kinsey]

About Jim, about Philly Jim.

[Jenna Fischer]

Yes. Jim's avatar has a guitar slung on his back. Remember, the only indication we've ever seen of Jim and guitar is that lone guitar in his room during email surveillance. But we never see him play a guitar. Clearly, Jim wishes he had learned to play that guitar. It's part of his second life avatar.

[Angela Kinsey]

Yeah, I guess it just sits in the corner of his room and is collecting dust. And even Pam is like, what? I didn't know you played guitar.

[Jenna Fischer]

Yeah, we had a lot of fan questions about this. Angela Maria Sosa, Kiana Raber, Autumn Baker, Natalie H. And Delissa Alanis, who said, we find out that Jim's second life. Avatar is a song sports writer in Philly. Was his avatar's job the inspiration for Jim's season nine job? Was this planned?

[Angela Kinsey]

I mean, no. Right, Jenna? Is it just by chance?

[Jenna Fischer]

Here's what I think. I think this moment happened in this episode, and it went into the show bible, this little bit of business, Right?

[Angela Kinsey]

Yeah.

[Jenna Fischer]

And then later, when it came time to write season nine, you know, that's when I got my copy of the show bible. And so did John.

[Angela Kinsey]

That's right, because you guys were producers, and now I remember you were. Were part of, like, pitching, like, story ideas and stuff.

[Jenna Fischer]

Yes. And John pitched the idea that Jim would go off to Philly and have this sports job. So I didn't check with him, but I have to imagine that maybe. I'm speculating. There was that little moment in the show bible, and he ran with it, but that was his pitch. It was not connected in this moment when we shot it, but that's how I think it might have happened.

[Angela Kinsey]

Yeah. I think the seed had been planted for Philly Jim.

[Jenna Fischer]

Philly Jim. And here's something crazy. We'll get to it, but I'll bring it up here. When he does move to Philly, there's an electric guitar in his apartment. I don't know if he ever learns to play the guitar. But Philly Jim and his guitar, they do show up again.

[Angela Kinsey]

I mean, it was all connected, you guys. I'm convinced now at 12 minutes, 52 seconds, you guys, Darryl and his team are continuing to rehearse. They've got a new theme song because, you know, Michael gave them notes. Right. So now they've written a new song. And guess who wrote this version.

[Jenna Fischer]

Tell us, Ange.

[Angela Kinsey]

Craig Robinson.

[Jenna Fischer]

Yes. And of course, we knew that Craig was an amazing musician.

[Angela Kinsey]

Oh, yeah. Craig is fantastic. He, like, tours and everything. He's great. In the DVD commentary, they shared that there was a heated debate in the writers room about which jingle they should use. And they ultimately were like, the room was divided. They loved them both, so they found a way to have them both in the episode, which I thought was great.

[Jenna Fischer]

So fun. Yeah. BJ told me it was cool because it set up this idea that Michael was really obsessive, and he kept making them write new versions of the song. There's a line from this scene that I love from Michael.

[Angela Kinsey]

He says, I hate it. I don't hate it. I just don't like it at all. It's terrible.

[Jenna Fischer]

I love that line so much.

[Angela Kinsey]

One other thing I want to share with you that Craig talks about on the commentary is that he only had an hour to rehearse with those guys. And he said they got it right away.

[Jenna Fischer]

Right away.

[Angela Kinsey]

It just fell into place.

[Jenna Fischer]

Except for maybe one moment. We had a fan catch. Rachel and Jeremy wrote in to say at 13 minutes, 15 seconds, Ed starts to sing at the wrong time. And then he almost breaks. It's the best lady. Let's move to the parking lot. Michael is really losing his patience with people.

[Angela Kinsey]

Yeah, well, he says, you know, this is a pivotal scene. If they don't get it, the whole thing will fall apart.

[Jenna Fischer]

Yeah. Andy is dressed in some sort of running gear. They don't get very far because Phyllis comes back from the mall. She is sobbing. She is so gutted.

[Angela Kinsey]

She is gutted she got kicked out of the mall in front of her friends. All of her friends, I guess, love Sue Grafton. They were all there for autographs, and Phyllis just wouldn't take no for an answer because Michael told her, don't take no for an answer. Get Sue Grafton here. And she kept bugging her and they kicked her out.

[Jenna Fischer]

At the very end of the scene, there is a great little tag where Kevin offers Phyllis a piece of tape in lieu of a tissue. We got some mail about it. Angela from Winston F. And Delina Delano. They wanted to know if this bit was improvised or scripted. I texted Brian about it because I don't have the scripts for season four.

[Angela Kinsey]

I'm going to guess it was improvised. That seems very much like something Brian would improvise.

[Jenna Fischer]

You are correct. He told me that originally the scene had ended with the camera just lingering on Phyllis crying. And he was actually placed a further in the background with Kate. They were still kind of working on the little running scene, but he had the idea at the end to walk up and offer her a piece of tape as a tissue. Well, they loved it. So the next time they did the scene, they actually pulled him a little bit more into the foreground. And they gave Steve the line, someone give her a tissue. And then he tore off the piece of tape, and that became the button of the scene.

[Angela Kinsey]

It's so great. It's perfect.

[Jenna Fischer]

That's such a great example of how our improvisations would work into a scene. We would do them, and then if they liked them, they would say, okay, well, let's draw you into this in a way that that creates a fun button or creates a fun moment.

[Angela Kinsey]

I also want to point out, I think I can see Phyllis about to break. She looks like she is literally about to laugh.

[Jenna Fischer]

I Don't know how to say this without it sounding weird, but I love every time the character of Phyllis is crying, I. Why? Why is it so funny?

[Angela Kinsey]

She's just so good at playing those, like, emotional beats. And I just love her.

[Jenna Fischer]

I love it too. I really love it.

[Angela Kinsey]

Jenna. Pam is working so hard at her desk. 14 minutes, 49 seconds. This is Dunder Mifflin Logo. She is just really putting her heart and soul into it.

[Jenna Fischer]

I admire her. I think this is the key to success. It doesn't matter how big or small the project, if you're getting paid or not getting paid. When you're a struggling artist, you have to give every project your all. She has to treat this as if it's going in a Martin Scorsese film. And she is. And I think she's right on. Yes.

[Angela Kinsey]

And so much so that she doesn't go home. Jim's like, are you coming? And she's like, no, I'm gonna stay. I have a question. Is this a little hint that they're living together?

[Jenna Fischer]

Interesting. I never thought they were living together, but I think they're in that phase of their relationship where they're staying over at each other's places a lot. Like, they might as well be living together. But I don't think they are yet.

[Angela Kinsey]

Okay, well, poor Jim has to ride home now with Meredith.

[Jenna Fischer]

He does. And then Pam, we reveal, has slept in the office overnight. And then the next morning opens with Pam waking up to a phone call from Jim. He got her breakfast.

[Angela Kinsey]

He got her breakfast. And in the commentary, they said there was a big debate in the writer's room about does he bring her orange juice or coffee.

[Jenna Fischer]

I don't remember seeing either. On the desk, there's a cup of.

[Angela Kinsey]

Orange juice and what looks like some kind of breakfast, maybe sandwich.

[Jenna Fischer]

Yeah, I'm guessing it's from McDonald's, because Jim says that Creed ate the hash browns.

[Angela Kinsey]

Yes, but they felt like orange juice was just a sweeter token than coffee. That's what they decided, but no detail went unturned. You guys, this is the point that there was a whole conversation about should there be orange juice or coffee? That's how much thought was put into all of these moments.

[Jenna Fischer]

Well, you know, Pam does not regularly drink coffee. You know, she drinks tea. So I think orange juice was the right choice. Yeah, well, Pam explains in a talking head that she worked until 2:45am and then she had to decide between spending the night with Michael and Dwight in the office or risk driving home and falling asleep at the wheel and dying in a fiery car wreck. She passed out on her keyboard trying to decide. So this was the talking head with Jason that I could not get through. I could not get through that last line. I passed out on my keyboard trying to decide because there's this little pause. And in that pause, the anticipation of that last line would make us laugh.

[Angela Kinsey]

This is something you guys should all know I have found over the years. And I think, Jenna, you'll agree with me. It's the pauses in comedy that get you almost more than the line when Steve would pause before saying something ridiculous as Michael. It was that three second pause that would have us all on the floor. It was like this collective moment where we all knew what was coming and.

[Jenna Fischer]

We couldn't bear it 100%. I have a catch.

[Angela Kinsey]

Okay.

[Jenna Fischer]

In an upcoming episode, it is going to be revealed that Pam wears glasses, remember? Because she's going to have to wear her spare pair to work.

[Angela Kinsey]

Right.

[Jenna Fischer]

Does that mean that Pam just slept in her contacts? Can you do that? I don't wear contacts, but I think you're not supposed to do that.

[Angela Kinsey]

I think that's a big no. No, I think it dries your eyeballs out or something. I mean, also, like, does Pam keep a toothbrush and toothpaste in her desk?

[Jenna Fischer]

I thought the same thing. And finally, before we move on from this little moment, what has Dwight done to the couch? He turned it on its side and then he has taken all the cushions off and he is sleeping under the cushions. It's so odd.

[Angela Kinsey]

I think he got cold and he was trying to make a cushion blanket, I guess.

[Jenna Fischer]

It's very strange.

[Angela Kinsey]

I feel like he's done it before. He has a system for that couch.

[Jenna Fischer]

What we know now, Angela, is probably that Dwight, Pam, and Michael all have really bad breath because I can't imagine any of them had toothbrushes.

[Angela Kinsey]

No.

[Jenna Fischer]

Maybe Michael, though. I feel like maybe Michael keeps one in his cabinet so he's got fresh breath. But I. I mean, my guess is.

[Angela Kinsey]

Michael has a whole change of clothes in that cabinet. And he's got some boxer shorts, pair of socks. Yeah, he's prepared.

[Jenna Fischer]

Should we move into the break room? Because Andy has some news for Dwight. Oh.

[Angela Kinsey]

Operation Fallen angel turned a corner, I guess while they were doing their form of necking. He's kissing her earlobe and she says.

[Jenna Fischer]

O. Dwight's face lights up.

[Angela Kinsey]

Lights up.

[Jenna Fischer]

Andy thinks that this is because of his name and D, but we all know the truth.

[Angela Kinsey]

Andy, what a stretch. Why would she single out one letter of your name?

[Jenna Fischer]

O.

[Angela Kinsey]

A O N O D O Y. Yeah.

[Jenna Fischer]

But Dwight then has this very fun moment where he is rejoicing with Andy over Angela calling out, O D. There's hope.

[Angela Kinsey]

Dwight. I love the next scene. Michael sends the commercial to corporate. He's like, they'll probably watch it right away. I know I would.

[Jenna Fischer]

Yeah.

[Angela Kinsey]

And he's like, I'm not gonna call him. I'm not gonna bug em. And then he calls him 10 seconds later.

[Jenna Fischer]

I know. It's perfect. We've all been there. Yeah. We've all, like, sent somebody something. We've written something you've worked on. And then you just wait and wait. And then you do that thing in your head where you're like, oh, my gosh, what if my email was down? Yeah. What if they never got it? Oh, I should call them. I should text them and just nudge them.

[Angela Kinsey]

Yeah. Ten days later, and this was a big deal. This kind of time jump we hadn't done in the show before.

[Jenna Fischer]

It's very strange. They had that little bit of an unwritten rule that the ideal episode happened over one day.

[Angela Kinsey]

Yeah.

[Jenna Fischer]

We didn't always keep to it, but for the most part, our episodes happened in one day.

[Angela Kinsey]

So this says 10 days later. It didn't bump me, Jenna. No, I was fine with it. And Michael is saying, well, welcome to the world premiere of the corporate crap fest.

[Jenna Fischer]

Yeah. They did not pick his commercial.

[Angela Kinsey]

They did not. The whole gang has gathered at Poor Richard's pub to watch the corporate crap fest.

[Jenna Fischer]

Yeah.

[Angela Kinsey]

Yeah.

[Jenna Fischer]

They watch it. They're delighted. They are. In the last five seconds, it's the same commercial as the Nashua branch, but this time it ends with everyone at Dunder Mifflin Scranton waving on the roof. On the roof. I guess that was Michael's big creative contribution, is we'll wave from the roof.

[Angela Kinsey]

Yeah. We won't be in the parking lot. We're gonna go on the rooftop. Jenna, do you remember I wasn't there that day.

[Jenna Fischer]

No, I know.

[Angela Kinsey]

Mindy and I both were not there that day. We had to be superimposed in. We never went up on the roof. We just did a wave. They sort of cheated it in the parking lot, and then they did a little fancy editing and put us in the shot.

[Jenna Fischer]

That is crazy, because I did look specifically to see if everyone was in there, and you're there.

[Angela Kinsey]

But if you look closely and I screen grabbed it, Mindy and I are kind of awkwardly off to the side. Do you see the gap?

[Jenna Fischer]

That is crazy. That's like that crazy thing they do when someone has to play their own twin?

[Angela Kinsey]

Exactly. Well, you can see it at 18 minutes, 10 seconds. And I know why I couldn't be there that day. I can't remember why Mindy couldn't be there, but I had one of my first ob GYN appointments because I was pregnant lady.

[Jenna Fischer]

I was wondering if you were going to share that in this episode, because I just want you to know I can see I'm getting goosebumps. I can see your glow. Really? In this whole episode? Yes, I clocked it the minute I put this episode on. I was like, oh, my gosh. This is the episode where Angela was pregnant?

[Angela Kinsey]

Yes. And I had this appointment and I guess I couldn't move it. And, you know, Kent was really sweet. He was like, oh, it's fine, Angela. Well, don't worry about it. Go to your appointment. Yeah, that's why I wasn't in it.

[Jenna Fischer]

Well, I'll never forget Angela, because you told me you were pregnant in my trailer at work.

[Angela Kinsey]

Yes. This is one of my favorite moments of our whole friendship. We were in Jenna's trailer having lunch, as we often did, and you were telling me a whole story. I think it was about your cat. Was it about your cat Lady?

[Jenna Fischer]

I remember I was done with lunch. You were still eating, and I was doing these little five pound weights. Little bicep curls.

[Angela Kinsey]

Yes. You were telling me a whole story while lifting weights. You're very passionate.

[Jenna Fischer]

I'll never forget it because I go on and on and on and on. I'm pumping my arms and then I get finished, and you say, well, I have some news. I'm pregnant. And I just dropped the weights and I screamed. And our ad came over to the trailer because I think they thought someone had had an accident. There was this huge thud followed by a scream.

[Angela Kinsey]

And then you said to me, ange, why didn't you interrupt me? I'm just rambling on about nothing, and you're sitting on this big piece of information. Why did you let me go on and on? And I said, well, I wanted to hear your story.

[Jenna Fischer]

My God, So sunny. I was just so happy for you. I knew how much you wanted to be a mother, and I could just. I'm tearing up right now thinking about it, because you are such a good mother. You are a born nurturer. And I was just so happy for you.

[Angela Kinsey]

Aw.

[Jenna Fischer]

I knew how much you wanted that. But yes, when I watched this episode, I knew right away. Oop, this is the one. And I didn't know if you were gonna share it. Or not. So I waited. Yes.

[Angela Kinsey]

I was never up on the roof. Never, Never in the whole series.

[Jenna Fischer]

Wow.

[Angela Kinsey]

I know. You're old hat at being up on the roof.

[Jenna Fischer]

Oh, man.

[Angela Kinsey]

So Jim does a very sweet thing. He asked the bartender if he will play their commercial, the one that they all made together. He hands them the disc, and Michael is so moved by this.

[Jenna Fischer]

Yeah, well, you know, the bartender slash waiter guy was played by Drew Powell. You guys might recognize him from Gotham. He's a regular on Gotham. He also played Eddie Murdock from The Monk episode, Mr. Monk can't see a Thing.

[Angela Kinsey]

And here's my crossover connection with Drew. Drew and I played husband and wife in a Lifetime movie called Terror in the Woods.

[Jenna Fischer]

Oh, I remember this.

[Angela Kinsey]

Yes. We filmed it in Atlanta. And so we hung out and spent some time together. And when I got back to la, we realized our kids were at the same elementary school.

[Jenna Fischer]

You're kidding me.

[Angela Kinsey]

No. Our sons went to elementary school together. And then I started seeing him at morning assembly meetings and all kinds of stuff.

[Jenna Fischer]

That's so crazy.

[Angela Kinsey]

I know.

[Jenna Fischer]

What a small world. So everybody watches Michael's version of the commercial, and it's so charming. Everyone reacts really well to it. And there was a decision to be made as to whether or not when we watch Michael's commercial, we were going to be kind of embarrassed and like, oh, Michael. Or if we were all going to love it. And Jason talked about this. It was really important to him that they pick the sweeter ending. Here's what he had to say.

[Jason Reitman]

There was an opportunity for a tender ending. And I got the sense that the writing staff of the Office was hesitant to do too many of those. That there's this kind of traditional television episode where it's funny throughout, it has opportunity for satire, and then towards the end, you have some sort of tender denouement. And that they didn't want to be doing this every time, but I really wanted that for this spot. I really wanted the episode to end in a place bar where the cast is watching the commercial together and they bond over it. And there's something really lovely about people who come together to make something that was really important to me, because that's an idea I know really well. I think anyone who's ever done a high school play or made a high school video or done anything creative knows what it feels like when outsiders come together to make something. And no matter how it turns out, the collective process of creating something is just wonderful and bonds you and erases fights because you can't help It. But come together and make something. And that's what the end of that episode felt like. I remember everyone just standing in the bar watching the episode, and we aired the actual. You know, we played back the actual thing. It was just so lovely. And I remember seeing a cut of the episode for the first time. And again, watching an edit of the episode was much like directing it. These guys knew what they were doing. You know, I don't think I had any notes. I just kind of watched an Office episode that I happened to have a directing credit on, and it has a slightly emotional ending. And I'm really proud, and I'm really grateful that the writing staff was up for that at the end of the day, because it makes me cherish the episode even more.

[Jenna Fischer]

I love it, too.

[Angela Kinsey]

Oh, my gosh. Yeah. I couldn't imagine it any other way. I mean, this was such a big collective project that everyone came together for. I feel like everyone in the office would have had some kind of personal interest in it. And I'm so glad we were happy and reacted that way.

[Jenna Fischer]

I have a confession.

[Angela Kinsey]

What?

[Jenna Fischer]

The very beginning of the commercial, it starts with a woman's hand taking a piece of paper off of the copier. Yeah, that is supposed to be me. That's supposed to be Pam. But I wasn't there that day. I don't know why I was not pregnant. Everybody, for whatever reason, they put Pam's watch and Pam's sweater on someone else. I don't know. I kind of feel like it was one of our ads or one of our PAs. So that is not my hand at the top.

[Angela Kinsey]

I did not know that. I am not in this either. One of the things Jason said in the commentary about it that I loved is that he said filming this really reminded him of home movies he would make with his dad. His dad is Ivan Reitman, an amazing director. Jason said when he was a kid, he had a little handheld camera, you know, and he would make these videos, like the paper airplane, like that, all of that with his dad. And it really reminded him of that. And that's, in fact, how they shot. They shot with just a little handheld.

[Jenna Fischer]

It's funny you mentioned the paper airplane, because we had a fan question from Grant Pickle, who said, how did you get the shot of the paper airplane? Well, guys, they just taped it to the front of this little handheld camera. And Jason talked about the inspiration behind that shot. Sam, will you play that clip?

[Jason Reitman]

There was a shot that really became popular in the 90s, and you saw it in, like, Sam Raimi films and John Woo Wu films. I associate it with Evil Dead 2 and army of Darkness, but also would have been popular in, like, literally any John Woo film where you, like, follow a bullet, you know, where it looks like the camera is riding on the back of a bullet or an arrow or something like that. And I could have just imagined, you know, Michael Scott seeing any one of these films, you know, Mission Impossible 2 or, like, Broken Arrow or, you know, I don't know. I don't know if Michael Scott watches the old Hong Kong films, but maybe he just saw, like, Van Dyke in Hard Target and was like, we need to do a camera attached to the paper airplane shot. And again, this is my favorite kind of thing. It would be kind of great to make an entire movie that way.

[Jenna Fischer]

I love how much thought went into this commercial. It's so perfect.

[Angela Kinsey]

Yeah. We end this episode with a little tag. It's Andy's talking head. He's still trying to figure out the end of the Kit Kat jingle.

[Jenna Fischer]

He cannot figure it out, and he.

[Angela Kinsey]

Struggles with it throughout the whole episode. Jenna. I wrote down every single guess that Andy made. Ed also mentions in the commentary that he must have improvised, like, 20 of these, and he didn't know until he watched the episode which ones made it in. Oh, here's all of the wrong guesses Andy makes throughout this episode. Break me off a piece of that applesauce Chrysler car Football Cream, Lumber Tar, Snickers bar, Gray Poupon, Claude Van Dam, Hair for men, poison gas, NutraSweet, and finally, fancy Feast.

[Jenna Fischer]

And he's convinced. That's it. I did it.

[Angela Kinsey]

Nailed it.

[Jenna Fischer]

It's a cat food. Break me off a piece of that Fancy Feast So good. Before we go, we have a final message from Jason.

[Jason Reitman]

You know, my daughter Josie is 14, and she was a baby when I directed the Office. And to this day, she has only seen one movie I've directed. In fact, up until recently, she hadn't seen any film I'd ever directed. And the only thing she had ever seen that I had directed was the Office, of which she is a super fan. And that made her overwhelmingly proud of me. And it made me very grateful that I had directed the Office because it put me in such high esteem of my child. But just to say thank you, it really is a privilege to be part of the history of that show. Every once in a while, it'll pop up in a way. Certainly when I'm doing interviews, it's one of the questions that always comes up. What was it like to direct the Office because it's kind of like, you know, there's only so many people who have walked on the moon, and there's only so many people who've directed the Office, and I get to be one of those people. I've directed two episodes, in fact, and it's something that I carry really proudly because I didn't create that thing. I just got to be a guest. There's this presumption that you need to be angry to do comedy, and being at the Office proves that concept wrong, because it was a group of some of the loveliest and funniest human beings I've ever met.

[Jenna Fischer]

So sweet.

[Angela Kinsey]

So sweet. And, Josie, we're so glad we helped make your dad cool.

[Jenna Fischer]

Yeah. There you go. Guys, thank you so much again for sending in your questions. And, Jason, thanks for sending in all those clips.

[Angela Kinsey]

And we will be here next week talking about branch Wars.

[Jenna Fischer]

It's another hidden gem. I think we're gonna have a few hidden gems in a row. I'm predicting.

[Angela Kinsey]

See you next week, everybody.

[Jenna Fischer]

Thank you for listening to Office Lady's second drink.

[Angela Kinsey]

This episode was initially created in collaboration with Earwolf.

[Jenna Fischer]

Office Ladies is a presentation of Odyssey and is produced by Jenna Fisher and Angela Kinsey.

[Angela Kinsey]

Our executive producer is Cassie Jerkins, and our audio engineer and associate producer is Molly Nugent. Odyssey's executive producer is Leah Rees Dennis.

[Jenna Fischer]

Office Ladies was mixed and mastered by Bill Schultz. Our theme song is Rubber Tree by Creed Bratton.