Interview with George Walsh | Spotlight on a Star (07-22-69)

Summary

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Old Time Radio Westerns: Interview with George Walsh | Spotlight on a Star (07-22-69)

Host: Andrew Rhynes
Interviewer: Chris
Guest: George Walsh (veteran radio announcer)
Release Date: December 7, 2025

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Episode Overview

In this episode of Old Time Radio Westerns, Chris takes us back to the golden age of radio with George Walsh, the legendary voice behind shows like “Gunsmoke” and “Suspense.” The discussion is a warm, witty, and insightful look at radio’s heyday, the craft of announcing, and the enduring legacy of classic radio dramas. Listeners are treated to stories from inside CBS studios, reflections on the evolution of radio, and Walsh’s fascinating encounters with fellow stars and fans. The conversation also explores preservation efforts, behind-the-scenes anecdotes, and the lasting magic of radio storytelling.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. George Walsh’s Entry into Radio

• Origin Story: Walsh recounts his accidental start in radio, beginning with a high school speech where he impersonated famous radio voices.
• Memorable Moment: His English teacher recruited him to perform at a prom, kickstarting his radio ambitions.
  • Quote: “I didn’t think so at the time, of course, but that started it.” (04:44)

2. The Craft and Role of the Radio Announcer

• Casting Announcers: Unlike actors, announcers auditioned for each show, and sponsors often influenced casting decisions. (07:04)
• Live Audiences: Walsh shares humorous stories about the complications of performing before live crowds, including warm-up routines and comedic mishaps.
  • Quote: “They got the laugh from everybody except me. I didn't think this was a very good idea at all.” (08:22)
• Warming Up the Audience: Describes his warm-up routines with Red Skelton and for dramatic shows like "Jack Benny." (09:09)

3. Sound Effects and Behind-the-Scenes Evolution

• Transition of Sound Men: Many sound effects artists transitioned to engineering or television roles as radio evolved. (11:07)
• Importance of Sound: Emphasis on the artistic and technical skills required for immersive radio experiences.

4. Legacy of Gunsmoke and Classic Radio Shows

• Joining Gunsmoke: Walsh discusses becoming the announcer in the early 1950s and the meticulous detail creators put into the show.
  • Quote: “They went into a great deal of research... Is there a screen door? And this kind of detail apparently paid off.” (15:39)
• Believable Characters: Elaborates on how Gunsmoke’s creators aimed for emotional realism, especially in Matt Dillon’s character.
• Walsh’s Role: Despite being a celebrated announcer, Walsh jokes about only “mumbling” as a crowd extra, not acting in central roles. (16:56)

5. Memorable Behind-the-Scenes Stories

• Unexpected Ad-Libs: Walsh remembers live slip-ups, like a bar fight scene where a modern phrase was blurted in 1870s Dodge City.
  • Quote: “All of a sudden the fight broke out and one of the actors stood up and ad libbed a great line right into the microphone...” (18:17)
• Meeting Icons: He shares awe in having Herbert Marshall remember him two years later.
  • Quote: “The little kid from Cleveland, Ohio, just wanted to pass out from sheer excitement because this to me was a wonderful feeling.” (19:15)

6. Radio’s Changing Nature and the End of an Era

• Final Gunsmoke Broadcast: Walsh recites the classic closing credits and reflects on signing off the last dramatic show from Hollywood.
  • Quote: “This broadcast concludes the current Gunsmoke series. This is George Walsh speaking.” (22:59)
• Life Moves On: At the time, Walsh was recently married and candid about the transient nature of radio work. (23:34)

7. Preservation and Remembering Radio

• Role of Preservation: Chris describes the Radio Historical Society’s mission to archive and share old shows: “Our group is putting together all the shows that we can through large electrical transcriptions, wire tape and magnetic recording tape. And through trading and preserving them and sharing ideas, we're keeping alive something that was really wonderful.” (30:58)
• Fan Magazines and Nostalgia: They discuss the significance—and rising collectible value—of classic radio magazines. (34:03)
• Generational Differences: Walsh and Chris reflect on how younger audiences might see classic radio as a novelty, questioning, “Well, that’s well and good, but where’s the picture?” (30:01)

8. Speculation: The Future of Radio

• Radio’s Next Act: Walsh predicts radio will become more mobile and information-focused, rather than a family entertainment centerpiece.
  • Quote: “Radio is a mobile thing... I anticipate radio receivers becoming smaller and smaller until they might get to a point where one might wear them as one today wears a wristwatch...” (27:10)
• Audio-only Mediums: They muse on the enduring power of audio, as seen in the success of comedy albums despite the dominance of television.

9. Practicalities and Economics of Reviving Old Radio

• Obstacle of Reproducing Classic Radio: High costs, logistical challenges (live musicians, actors, production), and rights issues make reviving old-time radio impractical. (39:13)
• Archival Practices: CBS kept copies of classic shows, but Walsh admits, “They never throw anything away.” (41:07)

10. Technical Insights & Broadcast Realities

• Live vs. Pre-Recorded Episodes: Early Gunsmoke episodes were performed live with repeats taped for different airings, shifting to fully taped shows later.
  • Quote: “It was done live. And then later on it was on tape as it started. It was done live on Saturday morning and... Repeated on Sunday evening.” (41:28)
• Professionalism of Cast: Walsh praises the “real pros” on the cast who could step up and deliver under any circumstances. (42:15)

11. Reflections on Fellow Announcers and Industry Connections

• Collegial Reminiscence: Walsh updates listeners on the whereabouts of industry peers and gives advice on how to connect with other announcers via the American Federation of Radio and Television Artists. (44:03)

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On Warm-up Duties:
  “All you could be was warm and friendly.” – George Walsh (09:16)

• On Gunsmoke’s Authenticity:
  “They went into the detail … does he go up some steps and does he cross a porch and is there a screen door?” – George Walsh (15:39)

• On Endings:
  “This broadcast concludes the current Gunsmoke series. This is George Walsh speaking.” – George Walsh (22:59)

• On Technology and Progress:
  “Radio is a means of communication and keeping in touch while you are not only driving but, but at the beach anywhere.” – George Walsh (27:10)

• On Preservation:
  “Because of these few people who had the farsight to record them at the time, the sound is preserved forever.” – George Walsh (32:47)

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Timeline of Important Segments

| Timestamp | Segment Description | |-----------|--------------------| | 04:44 | Walsh describes starting as a radio performer in high school | | 07:04 | Discussion of how announcers were selected for shows | | 08:22 | Story about comedic mishap in front of a live audience | | 09:09 | Insights into audience warm-ups for shows like Jack Benny | | 11:07 | Fate of classic radio sound effects artists | | 13:54 | Walsh recites iconic Gunsmoke opening monologue | | 15:39 | Walsh explains the detail-oriented creation of Gunsmoke | | 18:17 | Anecdote about an actor’s out-of-place ad-lib during a live show | | 19:15 | Walsh meets Herbert Marshall, feels starstruck | | 22:59 | Walsh signs off the final episode of Gunsmoke | | 27:10 | Walsh foresees the miniaturization and mobilization of radio | | 30:58 | Chris describes the goals of the Radio Historical Society | | 34:03 | Nostalgia for collectible radio fan magazines | | 39:13 | Discussion of the prohibitive cost of reviving classic radio shows | | 41:28 | Technical history: Gunsmoke live/recorded airing details | | 44:03 | Advice on contacting famous announcers through their union |

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Tone and Atmosphere

The conversation is informal, humorous, and affectionate—a shared celebration of a vanished era. Walsh is self-deprecating, charming, and insightful. Chris’s questions are nostalgic and respectful, inviting Walsh’s storytelling and historical perspective.

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Conclusion

This episode offers a rich tapestry of radio history through the voice of one of its most iconic announcers. George Walsh’s reminiscences paint a vivid picture of radio’s golden age, the artistry behind each broadcast, and the enduring warmth of classic American entertainment. The thoughtful dialogue between Walsh and Chris honors both the nostalgia and the realities of preserving and appreciating these timeless works for future generations.

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Transcript

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[Podcast Host]

Welcome to the Old Time Radio Westerns. I'm your host, Andrew Rines, and I'm excited to bring you another episode. This is one of over 80 episodes released monthly for your enjoyment. You can find more Western shows at our website by going to otrwesterns.com now let's get into this episode.

[Interviewer Chris]

Spotlight on a Star.

The magic that was radio returns to you once again through a series of informative and interesting interviews with the stars and personalities that made it all possible.

It's a special treat today to meet one of our favorite radio announcers, the voice that introduced many thrilling radio dramas of yesterday.

[George Walsh]

And now, tonight's presentation of radio's outstanding theater of thrill suspense.

Tonight we bring you a story of a hired killer who had a deadline to meet. So now, starring Mr. William Conrad and Mr. Stacy Harris, here is tonight's suspense play, a Matter of Timing.

Escape, designed to free you from the four walls of today for a half hour of high advent.

Around Dodge City and in the territory on West. There's just one way to handle the killers and the spoilers, and that's with a U.S. marshal and the smell of gun smoke.

[Podcast Host]

And Doug, here we have the Limu Emu in its natural habitat, helping people customize their car insurance and save hundreds with Liberty Mutual. Fascinating. It's accompanied by his natural ally, Doug Limu.

[George Walsh]

Is that guy with the binoculars watching us?

[Podcast Host]

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[George Walsh]

Liberty.

[Podcast Host]

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[Interviewer Chris]

The spotlight is on George Walsh. It's 10:00pm at Columbia Square, Hollywood. This Monday evening, July 21st, 1969. George Walsh will be stepping into the Cannex studio For his Music Till dawn show in about an hour. But first, he has kindly agreed to step into the spotlight and reminisce about those golden years of radio.

Good evening, Mr. Walsh. It's very kind of you to take time out of your busy schedule to talk with me.

[George Walsh]

Well, thank you very much, Chris. It's a real pleasure to be here. Except I wish you wouldn't call me Mr. I Feel Old enough already. If you call me George, I'll call you Chris. All right.

[Interviewer Chris]

Okay. What brought you to radio as a career?

[George Walsh]

You have a lot of tape, do you? And a lot of time, because this might take a little time and a little tape. I actually started when I was in high school. I had to give a speech as part of an English course, I recall. And because I didn't have any idea of what I was going to be when I grew up, I gave a speech on the possibility of being a radio performer. While the other classmates were giving speeches on being doctors and lawyers and senators and so forth, I. For want of authenticity, I added novelty. I gave a speech on being a radio performer, and as part of the speech, I impersonated some of the famous radio people of those days. I forgot all about it because I got a pretty good grade on the speech Until a little later in the school year, the English professor who happened to be the faculty advisor for the senior prom, came to me and said, we're putting together a floor show of students, and we'd like you to do your impersonation act. I said, I have no impersonation act. He said, well, you know the act you did in our English class last month. We'll give you two tickets to the prom and $15. I've got an actual. And that started it. I didn't think so at the time, of course, but that started it.

[Interviewer Chris]

How many shows have you announced?

[George Walsh]

Oh, I would hesitate to make a guess, Chris, because it's pretty difficult to tell what you mean by a show. I have been announcer on, for example, so many newscasts over a period of years. I have done some programs that have gone one time and some programs that have gone once a week for many, many years. I would rather look at it from a standpoint of a number of years than a number of shows. I don't think I could give you an accurate estimate as to the number of show. Was that enough?

[Interviewer Chris]

Okay. How many years then, have you been in radio?

[George Walsh]

Well, I first went on the air in 1935, which is quite some while ago. I wasn't paid at the time. As I remember, but that was the first time I ever went on the air. Was in 1935 in the old hometown of Cleveland, Ohio. And I entered an amateur contest. They were quite the thing in 1935. And as it turned out, I won the contest. And I fell in love with radio.

[Interviewer Chris]

Were announcers cast for their roles in the same way that actors were cast.

[George Walsh]

Their roles in radio shows, I presume you mean? No, not in the same way.

An announcer was auditioned for the part that he played on a program. And the audition depended on several things. It depended on the type of program. For example, if you were in the position of being a producer. I think that you'd choose a different type announcer. For a dramatic program and a comedy program. One of the things that entered into it probably was whether or not there would be a studio audience. One of the things that certainly entered into it was the commercial product involved. The sponsor or the advertising agency had somewhat of a say so as to who the announcer was. Whereas the actors were generally called from their past performances, their track record. The announcer was called and he was auditioned for the show.

[Interviewer Chris]

Some programs were active before a live studio audience and others were not. What were your experiences in this field?

[George Walsh]

Oh, rather horrible.

It was rather difficult to perform a radio program before a live audience. Because the radio program was created to be heard, not particularly to be seen. And if you started to do a program that was made to be seen. Then you were sacrificing some of your most important element. And that was the element of the audio.

I have had some experience before a live audience in connection with a radio show. I remember one program I did. I don't even remember the program because I probably psychologically want to forget it. But they thought they wanted the program to open with a big laugh. And the way to get a laugh was for me to wear bright red socks with bright red garters. And while I was doing the opening of the program, they're rolling up my pants legs. They got the laugh from everybody except me. I didn't think this was a very good idea at all. And so I look at a studio audience with. With rather mixed emotions. And they were wonderful people, the people that came to see some of the radio programs. But one of the duties that befell an announcer in connection with the studio audience. Was a thing that was called a warm up. They didn't want the star of the show to immediately come out and start to perform before an audience that up until then hadn't been exposed to any entertainment at all. And it usually was the announcer's lot to do the audience warm up in the studio. This was comparatively easy if you were dealing with a light hearted studio or lighthearted program, I should say. But if you were doing it with a dramatic program, it was a rather difficult chore to do a studio warm up because you didn't want to be funny, certainly couldn't be serious. All you could be was warm and friendly. Some programs, like the Jack Benny program, used to put on a warm up prior to going on the air. That was a thing to behold. And it didn't involve Don Wilson, it didn't involve Jack Benning at all. It involved the, the orchestra and they, they put on an act of pantomime and music that just had the audience in stitches prior to the appearance of Jack Benny. So that when they hit the theme song and Jack Benny walked on stage, that audience was ready to go for a while. They did the Red Skelton program on tv. And I recall we. When I say we, I mean Red and I worked out a little routine just prior to his entrance. That was part of the studio warm up. And I would look out over the audience and I would say, I see a lady out there that brought a book in case the program gets dull. And then from right behind me, from behind the curtain, Red's voice would come out and say, and I see another lady that brought flowers in case the show dies. Well, this got kind of a nice laugh from the audience. And you could just see this buzz of anticipation as they nudged each other and said, that's Red Skelton. That's Red Skelton. And a matter of seconds after this, while the program opened and the audience was warmed up, it was fun to do a studio audience program, but not necessary.

[Interviewer Chris]

Radio depended much on the sound effects to set the stage. Whatever happened to those wonderful sound effects man?

[George Walsh]

Well, I don't know what happened to all of them. I know as far as CBS radio is concerned, on the west coast, most of them have converted to straight engineers. They were always rather closely affiliated with the engineers in that many of the sound effects, as you know, were recorded. And those that weren't recorded certainly took a great deal of engineering and artistic talent. And their work with turntables, microphones and so forth sort of lent itself to engineering work. And as far as I know, I think all of them transferred into the engineering department. At least all of them that wanted to on cbs, on the west coast, other stations, other networks. I don't know what happened to them. Some of them, I'm sure, went into the television field. We have some sound men at TV City. And what do you do with a sound man on a television show? Well, when one of the parts of the play depends upon the crunchiness of the snow or sound of a footstep in the hallway or something, you can't depend on the live one to pick up enough so they will have a sound effect man who will put that in. And this of course isn't counting a comedy show where all of a sudden the collar button gives way and the man's collar snaps off. Well, it's got to go. And the sound effects man is providing this.

[Podcast Host]

And Doug, here we have the Limu emu in its natural habitat helping people customize their car insurance and save hundreds with Liberty Mutual. Fascinating. It's accompanied by his natural ally, Doug.

[George Walsh]

Uh, limu is that guy with the binoculars watching us.

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[Interviewer Chris]

Okay, getting back to some of the old shows. One in particular, I think we can agree that the all time favorite radio drama was.

[George Walsh]

Gun Spoke, starring William Conrad. The story of the violence that moved west with young America and the story of a man who moved with it. I'm that man. Matt Dullen, United States Marshal. The first man they look for and the last they want to meet. It's a chancy job and it makes a man watchful and a little lone.

Bill Conrad and I sound considerably younger on that than we do now, you know.

[Interviewer Chris]

When did you join Gunsmoke?

[George Walsh]

I don't exactly remember the precise time, Chris. It was about the same time that I started to work at CBS. Which would make it 1952 or 1953. There was a summer replacement program and I wasn't the first announcer on it. A fellow by the name of Clancy Cassell who is now in San Francisco did some. Fellow by the name of Roy Rowan did some. And then it fell my lot to do some. And about that time, the Program started to become sponsored. It was retained after the summer was over. So it was about, well, the early 50s sometime.

[Interviewer Chris]

Was there a Matt Dillon before Bill Conrad made the role so famous?

[George Walsh]

As far as I know, the only Matt Dillon that existed prior to Bill making the role famous was in the mind of.

Norm MacDonald and John Meston. Norm as the producer, director, and John as the writer of the program. These men founded Gunsmoke. These men created Gunsmoke. They went into a great deal of research. For example, since sound that you mentioned a while ago was so important a part of a radio program.

John and Norm went into the detail as to whether or not an average ranch house around Dodge city in the 1800s had a front porch. So that when Marshall Dillon rode out to the ranch house for any reason, should we take his footsteps from the dirt right into the house, or does he go up some steps and does he cross a porch and is there a screen door? And this kind of detail apparently paid off. In listening to John and Norm talk about the creation of gun smoke, they felt that they were going to create a character that was above all else, believable. A U.S. marshal that knew all the emotions, not only heroism, but one that knew fear. One that probably knew a bit of hate too. And the role was the result. And of course, they gave it to Bill Conrad who just grabbed the ball and ran.

[Interviewer Chris]

Well, believe me, in all the years I've listened to radio, I've heard a lot of actors. I think Bill played the role perfectly. He is my image and my perfect sample of a real US Marshal typed and cast perfectly for the part.

[George Walsh]

Well, he played many famous roles and did them all equally well. He's a very competent, capable actor, very fine fellow.

[Interviewer Chris]

Did you ever play an acting role on that series or any other?

[George Walsh]

Not on that series. I, as the old saying goes, couldn't really act my way out of a paper bag. I'm an announcer, but I played a couple of them and I was very large on some crowd scenes on various programs. And I just mumbled I was the best mumbler in the world. I could sound like four men standing off mic trying to say, gee, what happened here, officer, you know. But I never played a role that got me any cash, credit or anything like that.

[Interviewer Chris]

Was Gunsmoke the longest association you had with a radio show?

[George Walsh]

I have to think about that for a minute, Chris. I suspect so, yes, if not the longest, it was probably the most happy.

[Interviewer Chris]

What is a rare behind the scenes story of radio that you can share with us now?

[George Walsh]

Well, since you probably Will be heard by family groups and some youngsters. I probably have to clean up several of the stories, but one that comes to mind.

Had to do with gunsmoke, as a matter of fact. And Norm MacDonald was directing one day, and we had a scene in the Long branch saloon and all of a sudden a fight broke out. And where there had just been a low, moderate level of conversation.

Throughout the Long Branch prior to this fight. As soon as the fight broke out, he wanted a great reaction from all the people that supposedly were in the Long Branch soon at the time. So here we are in Dodge city in the 1870s, and all of a sudden the fight broke out and one of the actors stood up and ad libbed a great line right into the microphone.

[Interviewer Chris]

Hold the phone.

[George Walsh]

In those days it was a live program and there wasn't much you could do about it. And one of my favorite recollections of the radio business Was when I was lucky enough to be doing the spooky voice thing on suspense. And I met some very, very famous people, some very wonderful people as a result of that program. One day I met Herbert Marshall and about two years went by and he had a repeat performance on suspense. And when I walked into the studio and he looked up and in this wonderful British way of his, said, oh, hello, George, good to see you again.

You know, the little kid from Cleveland, Ohio, Just wanted to pass out from sheer excitement because this to me was wonderful feeling. And to me immediately, Mark Herbert Marshall is one of my all time favorites because he was so warm and gracious.

[Interviewer Chris]

Did you ever show up late for a broadcast and have to huff and puff on the openings?

[George Walsh]

Well, not for a broadcast that required much of an opening. In the old days of radio, you remember, on the west coast particularly, it was necessary for an announcer to say at the beginning of many programs by transcription, well.

Many times I showed up huffing and puffing at literally the last second and my last dying gasp. I sounded like the guy on the desert, you know, looking for the drinking hole. My last dying gas said my transcription, and that was it. But not for a program that involved a legitimate opening. I was always there in plenty of time for that, Usually because it was preceded by a rehearsal and probably a dress rehearsal, and I was there for those too.

[Interviewer Chris]

Did you ever drop a script and have to ad lib?

[George Walsh]

I don't recall that I ever had to ad lib because I dropped a script.

I think there were other circumstances under which I had to ad lib.

One of the most noteworthy comes to mind when I was an announcer on a program that you probably wouldn't recall called Romance.

[Interviewer Chris]

And.

[George Walsh]

The assistant director had many duties. One of them was to keep time for the director. And.

He. The assistant director was going on vacation one time and his replacement was sitting in with him. The assistant director said, now here's how I keep time for the director. I have this little pad here and when we are over five seconds, I just put a five on this side of the pad. When we're under five seconds, I put a five on this side of the pad. Everybody thought this was a wonderful system because it had worked for a long, long time. Well, the assistant director went on vacation the following week and his replacement came in and took over for him. One thing no one happened to notice was the fact that the replacement was left handed. And during the program he is signaling to the director that the director is now five minutes short, or five seconds short, rather. The director keeps compensating, but he's compensating the wrong way. And the next signal he'd get would say 10, which means that he was 10 seconds over. The director figures he's 10 seconds short. The timing was so messed up that I was the last thing on the program. And instead of having to have a minute to go, I had like two minutes to go. They were giving me stretch signs and slow down and everything. Well, you can stretch and slow down only to a certain point. I don't remember what the announcement was. It was not a commercial. It was more like a public service announcement. But I used that as the basis and I did quite a bit of ad living and I think I might have lost a little weight that day.

[Interviewer Chris]

George, you brought many happy listening hours to many of us. Let me tell you the saddest words I ever heard from you.

[George Walsh]

Gunsmoke, produced and directed in Hollywood by Norman McDonald, stars William Conrad as Matt Dillon, U.S. marshal. The story was specially written for Gunsmoke by John Messon. Featured in the cast were Vic Perrin, Gene Bates, John Dana, Barney Phillips and Harry Bartel. Harley Bear is Chester, Howard McNear is Doc, and Georgia Ellis is Kitty.

This broadcast concludes the current Gunsmoke series. This is George Walsh speaking.

Laughs are on Arthur Godfrey weekdays on the CBS Radio Network.

[Interviewer Chris]

With these words, you signed off the last dramatic show to come from Hollywood. Did you realize the impart at the times?

[George Walsh]

Oh, probably not. At the time I was newly wed.

We.

Were on cloud nine, my wife and I. We're still on cloud nine, but now we have three daughters up there with us. It gets crowded once in a while.

And I don't know, Chris, the radio business, as every other business, I guess, is a rather dynamic thing. It doesn't stand still. It moves. And no matter how much you are in love with a program or a show, you know when you start it that it's not going to last for the rest of your life. You've got to look at it realistically and go on to another program or another show.

[Interviewer Chris]

One of the ideas that has been brewing in my mind for a long time is to see a reunion of the radio cast of Gunsmoke. But unfortunately, this will be impossible with the untimely passing of Howard McNear, who played Doc Adams on the air. I have here in front of me a CBS press release which came out about 10 years ago which typifies the performance that Howard McNear portrayed as Doc. And I'd like to read it here for you. And perhaps this could be a fitting tribute to a fine actor.

Is there a doctor on the show? The answer is yes. You're referring to CBS Radio's top notch Gunsmoke series and Doc as Veteran radioactor Howard McNear, who together with star William Conrad, Georgia Ellis and Polly Bear make up the quartet of regulars on the show. McNear plays his part so realistically that he is constantly receiving letters from listeners asking for his medical advice. Would you get a comment, sir?

[George Walsh]

Well, I can't add to that, Chris. That just about covers it beautifully. And Howard was a fine actor. He was a true craftsman. He.

Displayed his ability, I think, not only in the role of Doc, but his great adaptability to other roles. Indeed, I strongly suspect that you have seen Howard in motion pictures on television and you've seen him in a wide variety of roles, all the way from things as serious as Doc Adams to light comedy. And he did them all equally well. He's a wonderful, wonderful man.

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[Interviewer Chris]

Book [e-mail] as a participant in Radio Yesterday and Radio Today, can you speculate on Radio tomorrow?

[George Walsh]

If I could give you an accurate assessment of Radio tomorrow, Chris, I think that we could be carrying on this interview and the salon of one of my yachts because if I had the answer to that question and could give it to you accurately, I think that my financial worries would be over radio today or tomorrow. I don't know. I seriously doubt if it will ever revert to the golden days as you so accurately referred to them a while back. I think that the days of the family gathering around a large console in the living room and shushing each other while they all listen to their favorite program will never return. These are days that I remember, days that your dad remembers. But I don't think that they will ever return. Radio is a. A mobile thing. Radio is, is a means of communication and keeping in touch while you are not only driving but, but at the beach anywhere. These days I anticipate radio receivers becoming smaller and smaller until they might get to a point where one might wear them as one today wears a wristwatch to know what time it is. You might wear a radio of some sort to determine what's going on in the world. And I think this leads me to the further belief that radio is to be more and more a medium of information, not one of entertainment, but primarily one of informing people as to what is going on.

[Interviewer Chris]

Well then, what do you think of an idea of a museum or some type of place set aside so our children and grandchildren can know what real radio was like?

[George Walsh]

What do you think of an idea like this? Well, I think it's a good idea and I think the city fathers of Los Angeles thought it was a good idea too when they started to build what they refer to as the Hollywood Museum that included a section of radio. But the Hollywood Museum became embroiled in a lot of political wrangling and.

And constantly never came to fruition. But I think the idea of a museum is fine. Good. And with due respect to your organization, I think it's good only as long as it is considered to be a museum. If I can draw an analogy, I think that it's almost like comparing a fine old car to a fine new car. A fine old car is fine as long as you realize that it's a museum piece and it's pretty to look at, fine to remember the day you went fishing with your Uncle Charlie in it. But it certainly couldn't compete with today's fine cars. And I think the same thing is somewhat true of radio in that it's fun to listen to as long as we realize what it was. I don't know. As young as you are, you may have had the experience already in looking at a TV show, an old movie, and saying, is it possible that when I saw this X number of years ago in a theater, that I was so thrilled or so entertained or so excited? Because now you look at it with a little different eye. I think the audiences are becoming more sophisticated all the time. There's a whole generation of youngsters, indeed, what, 16, 17 years old, that don't know what it's like to be raised in a world without television.

To them, radio might be anopheley, but if you tried to present to them a radio program from the old days, I think their natural question would be, well, that's well and good, but where's the picture?

[Interviewer Chris]

Well, for the last few minutes, I've been asking you all these questions.

[George Walsh]

Two minutes. I'm the gabbiest guy you ever talked to.

[Interviewer Chris]

Chris, have you got any questions you want to ask me, sir?

[George Walsh]

Yes, I'd like to ask you about the organization that you represent. I'd like to know more about it. How did it come about and what is its aims and purpose?

[Interviewer Chris]

I don't know exactly how it got started. I was in the service at the time and.

The correspondence. I pen pal to one guy back here, and he sent me a few names, and we got to talking about radio, and next thing I do, I was offered membership in the Radio Historical Society. Our aims are simple. We're not out to bring back radio in its full glory because we know it can never happen unless the American people want.

[George Walsh]

And we're waiting.

[Interviewer Chris]

Our idea is to preserve as many of these old shows as possible for posterity. Just like you go to a museum and you see many things which were related to American history at one time. And radio, believe me, falls into it. It was a key meeting at one time. It was the biggest meeting of entertainment, information and education. But as the years have gone by and as the ideas of radio have changed, people have grown up with the idea of radio not as it was and not as it could be. So our group is putting together all the shows that we can through large electrical transcriptions, wire tape and magnetic recording tape. And through trading and preserving them and sharing ideas, we're keeping alive something that was really wonderful. This is strictly the aim of our club. Also, we're meeting new friends around the country and sharing ideas and events that happen in our lives that were related to radio. It's fascinating and I think there's a future in it. We're not known nationwide like the other large clubs such as the Elks or Kiwanis or Lions Club, even the Boy Scouts of America. But our organization has a purpose and a goal which we think can be obtained.

[George Walsh]

Well, your goals and purposes are very lofty. Aren't they also very expensive?

[Interviewer Chris]

Not really. You'd be surprised. A large number of the shows have been acquired by fans who actually recorded them off the air radio in their home. A lot of the people I ran across had wire recorders available right after the war and they took the time in the evening to sit down and actually record the programs right off the air. And isn't it wonderful because many of these programs were live and the sound is gone forever, but because of these few people who had the farsight to record them at the time, the sound is preserved forever.

[George Walsh]

I think it's wonderful. It is wonderful and it's particularly heartening to see a fellow as youthful as you are interested in the olden days. I have an 11 year old daughter and she asked me the other day if when I was a young fellow, if they had covered wagons. And I couldn't convince her that that wasn't the case.

[Interviewer Chris]

Have you ever had the opportunity to play any of the shows that you announced at your home with comments from your children, what they say?

[George Walsh]

Well, I play them occasionally for my own entertainment. But with the comments from the youngsters, they have a rather jaundiced view of Daddy. They have heard Daddy do many, many things in their young life. And I've done some very interesting things. For example, at Disneyland, on the moon ride, they have an audio animatronic figure in the spaceport control center. And I recorded the voice for that. This gave them rather shock to see Daddy's voice coming from this other man is what it looked like. So I don't really attach too much significance to their evaluation of a program on which I appear.

[Interviewer Chris]

Okay, going farther in our organization, you have here in front of you a couple of fan magazines.

[George Walsh]

These Are radio fan magazines.

[Interviewer Chris]

They sure are. And they're available through the mail only at this description or organization. Josh, wouldn't it be nice if these could be available on the newsstands? Because from the front to back cover, the information on there is entertaining and clean.

[George Walsh]

Well, at one time, of course, a radio log was popular magazine as a TV log is today.

[Interviewer Chris]

Remember Radio Mirror, Radio Venture magazines? Those are worth fortunes today in the collective market.

[George Walsh]

And of course they answered one big question that many, many listeners had. I wonder what he looks like, because this was something you didn't know normally with a radio performer.

[Interviewer Chris]

Many of these pictures that you're looking at now come from the radio dial. Radio Mirror magazines which were on newsstands in the 1930s, 40s and early 50s.

The Other Magazine is put out by one man alone and it's called Standby on the Air. This is not part of any club. He is simply putting this out on his own. He's put a lot of heart into it on his own. He has come out bimonthly with a magazine which covers the full facet of radio entertainment in its prime and glory. It's a lot of fun to read and believe me, I think a lot of people would be interested in a magazine like this.

[George Walsh]

It is very interesting, very nostalgic too.

Superman on radio, remember that? No, you don't remember that.

[Interviewer Chris]

Clayton Bud Collier is a man of steel.

[George Walsh]

You better believe it.

[Interviewer Chris]

A lot of these shows were on the air. The adventure thrillers which you just mentioned were on the air until the mid-1950s.

Being born during the war, I was able to catch the last year as an array. In fact, I can claim I am the last generation of Americans to be a faithful fan of Captain Midnight and Sky King. Really, this was in the late 40s, early 50s. In fact, he had juvenile adventure until 1955. When Silver Eagle went off the air, he was portrayed by Jimmy Leachy, believe it or not.

[George Walsh]

55.

[Interviewer Chris]

55. The last juvenile adventure filled.

[George Walsh]

That sounds like it may have been transcribed in advance. I think as far as actually producing new live shows every week was concerned that up until about 55, CBS was the last ones to give up the ghost of old time radio programs.

[Interviewer Chris]

While most of the networks were leaving the active entertainment field of radio, CBS did stick on. Believe me, you put out quite a few great dramatic programs. In fact, as late as 1960 I could sit down, literally sit down in the needle. And after the news of Lil Thomas, I could hear programs like Masters of Melody and Ms. Nene Music Hall. Bob and Ray and good entertainment discussion programs weeknights and then on the weekends came the fun. Johnny Dollar at 5 o', clock, suspense at 5:30, Hab Gun will travel at 6 and Gunsmoke at 6:30, followed by Mitch Miller at 7. What more could you ask for? This is in the 1960s.

[George Walsh]

If we'd had a fire and burn up all the logs in those days, we should have phoned you, huh?

Chris, you want to speculate on something interesting the next time you get some of the members of your organization together? Speculate on this. Although we have kind of decided, at least as far as the two of us is concerned, that radio will never return as far as the golden days are concerned. And I don't think you could find a radio producer who would seriously consider going into the field of comedy with a radio show. For example, throw this one up in the air the next time we want some discussion. What about the commercials that are on radio today? Some of them are the greatest one minute comedy shows you've ever heard.

[Interviewer Chris]

Radio dramas still exists today in commercials. A lot of the old ex radio actresses and actors do appear in commercials. I see every now and then people like Brian Rayburn, Parker Finley, they're doing commercials on radio. I guess that's all that's left for acting.

[George Walsh]

I guess so.

[Interviewer Chris]

That's it.

[George Walsh]

Another question you might throw up to your membership next time we have a discussion is that in the event that.

Radio could not be sold to the public or to an advertising agency, how can they account for the fact that so many hundreds of thousands of comedy record albums are sold every month, which is strictly an audio medium? They don't see these people perform. They merely listen to them on this record and enjoy them and pay good money to buy them.

[Interviewer Chris]

Well, how about dramatic programs on the freeway rush hours?

[George Walsh]

What do you think? Well, I can't speak for cbs, let alone the broadcast industry.

But the executives claim that this is not what the listeners want. They claim that it is not what the advertisers will buy. Freeway rush hours. They say people want to know what is happening one on the freeways, two around the world.

[Interviewer Chris]

People then, as far as you can see by surveys taken, are really satisfied.

[George Walsh]

With radio right now, if we are to believe the surveys, they are satisfied with the direction that radio has taken. They may not be satisfied with it as of this day, but they're more satisfied with it than if they went back to what we can nostalgically refer to as the olden days of radio.

[Interviewer Chris]

It's amazing why these shows can't come back. You're right. Comedy albums are available in record stores. When you read a book, a paperback that's got no pictures. And you must create a picture in your mind in every book you read. And I wonder why these shows couldn't be available unless it's a tag to the public.

[George Walsh]

Well, I think that it would probably be easier to produce a new one than it would be to resurrect an old one. The old one involved so many people. It wasn't uncommon in the old days to have a program that involved 20 or 30 musicians who did nothing more than play the theme songs and the musical bridges or transition between the scenes. They were paid for this performance, but they were not paid from a standpoint of a recording session. Which they would have to be if they were going to use the recording on this program on the air. And when you start talking about modern day musicians and recording sessions and 20 or 30 of them in one group, you're talking about a lot of money. And that's just one of the many.

[Interviewer Chris]

Obvious stumbling blocks in the case this possibly happens in the future. Does CBS still keep a lot of their old shows in their library right here in these studios? Or have they all been removed?

[George Walsh]

As far as you know, they are someplace. I don't know whether they're right here in the studio. They have a copy of them someplace. I can find my way from the parking lot to the studio where I work. And that's about it. They did have a large collection of them at one time. And I know this to be a fact because they were moving them during one of the remodeling periods of the buildings. They remodeled this place about every six weeks. I think. Currently they have just finished. But they'll start six weeks from now to remodel it again. And one of these remodeling periods they moved a large section of storage. And it involved some old radio programs. So I suspect they have them someplace.

[Interviewer Chris]

They do exist, being stored for a reason. I wonder why.

Maybe the still.

[George Walsh]

Well, I don't know. But I suspect strongly that if she weren't dead, I would say that my old maid aunt who used to save string Was now an acting vice president of CBS Radio in New York. Because they never throw anything away.

You paint it again and again and again, modernize it. This is not true of the electronic equipment. They always have the very latest and the way of technical equipment. But as far as anything else is concerned, it seems that no one wants to take the responsibility of throwing anything away.

[Interviewer Chris]

Was gun smoke Done live, pre record on tape or transcription over a period of time.

[George Walsh]

It was done live. And then later on it was on tape as it started. It was done live on Saturday morning and. Excuse me, Repeat recorded at that time. Repeated on Sunday evening.

[Interviewer Chris]

I remember that I would hear the program Saturday morning just after Bob Crane. And it was a Ralph Story, one of the two. And then I would hear the same program the next evening.

[George Walsh]

The next Sunday evening.

[Interviewer Chris]

Next Sunday evening.

[George Walsh]

Repeat. Yes, that was the repeat that you heard. That one was taped. Then later in its final stages. We recorded the show right from the start. It never went on live in the last few years.

[Interviewer Chris]

Rehearsals a problem. The actors were really in the mood that Jesse had been doing this so long that they later gun smokes couldn't record it in the afternoon or at one time.

[George Walsh]

No. We must give credit to the fact that we're talking here about a bunch of real pros. And I'm sure that we could get them in a large barn someplace. And as soon as the director threw the cue, they were ready.

[Interviewer Chris]

A lot of the great radio writers, it's good to see if they still like him on television.

[George Walsh]

You know, Morton Fine and David Friedkin.

[Interviewer Chris]

Work on I Spy. And I see Norm MacDonald's name on.

[George Walsh]

Gunsmoke, the television version.

[Interviewer Chris]

So it's good to see that they're still in the directing field of related shows.

[George Walsh]

Don't think you've seen Norm's name on the Gunsmoke television for quite some while now.

[Interviewer Chris]

Okay.

You worked here. You perhaps knew a lot of the other great announcers that were brought here at cbs. I wonder what they're doing in day seven. People like Bud Sewell, Dick Joy, Michael Roy, Hugh Douglas, John Wald.

Am I bringing back too many people that you might.

[George Walsh]

No, no, no. I remember all of them.

[Interviewer Chris]

Ken Niles and brother Wendell.

[George Walsh]

John is.

John Wall. The last I heard was a TV city as a staff announcer.

Hugh Douglas recently has completed a series of commercials for Standard Oil. Dan Kimberly. Dan Coverley owns and operates a very popular radio station in the northern end of California. I want to say Yreka. I don't know that part of the world, but it's someplace up there. And Dan is the owner and operator. And I suspect strongly, I hope he is one of the fine newscasters in there because he has such a fine voice. Bud Sewell is the last I heard around town. And if you want to know his whereabouts, just call him and tell him you want him to do a commercial. And he'll be on YouTube doorstep in 20 minutes.

[Interviewer Chris]

I like to get a whole lot of these old announcers and actors and.

[George Walsh]

Talk to them about the taste because I think they. It's never been done as far as I know. You're right. I don't think it ever has been done. One of the great contacts you might make. If you want to erase this part of the tape, you can do so. But you should contact the American Federation of Radio and Television Artists, which is a craftsman's union. The Guild for Radio and Live TV does not cover anything on film. But get in touch with them and I'm sure that they'd be more than happy to put you in touch, if not with the artist directly, at least with the artist's agent.

[Interviewer Chris]

Okay. I think it answers my question. And it seems the clock up there doesn't stop and you're about ready to go on the air basically till dawn. So I think I better close out.

[George Walsh]

I think practically been using for all these years the one thing that hasn't changed the radio business. The same merciless clock. No, it never does stop.

[Interviewer Chris]

You've got to be right on time. Well, again, Mr. Walsh, I want to thank you for your time and.

Find recollections you've been discussing about on radio. Really, it's been a pleasure.

[George Walsh]

Thank you. Thank you, Chris. I've enjoyed it thoroughly.

[Podcast Host]

And Doug, here we have the Limu Imu in its natural habitat helping people customize their car insurance and save hundreds with Liberty Mutual. Fascinating. It's accompanied by his natural ally, Doug Limu.

[George Walsh]

Is that guy with the binoculars watching us?

[Podcast Host]

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[George Walsh]

This is George Walsh inviting you to join us again next week when CBS Radio presents another story of the western frontier. When Matt Dillon, Chester Proudfoot, Doc and Giddy together with all the other hard living citizens of Dodge will be with you once more. It's a matter of America growing west in the 1870s. It's gun smoke.

[Podcast Host]

This has been a presentation of otrwesterns.com and we hope you enjoyed. Please take some time to like and rate this episode within your favorite podcast application. Follow us on Facebook by going to otrwesterns.com Facebook and and subscribe to our YouTube channel by going to otrwesterns.Com YouTube become one of our ranch hands and unlock some exclusive content. We want to thank our most recent ranch hands Steve and Ron W. Who joined us recently. You too can join by going to otrwesterns.com donate send us an email podcasttrwesterns.com and you can call and leave us a voicemail 707-986-8739 this episode is copyrighted under the Attribution Non Commercial Share Like Copyright for more information go to otrwesterns.com copyright have a great day and thanks for listening.

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