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Limu Emu And Doug, here we have the Limu emu in its natural habitat helping people customize their car insurance and save hundreds with Liberty Mutual. Fascinating. It's accompanied by his natural ally, Doug. Limu is that guy with the binoculars watching us. Cut the camera. They see us. Only pay for what you need@libertymutual.com Liberty Liberty Liberty Liberty Savings vary underwritten by Liberty Mutual Insurance Company and affiliates excludes Massachusetts. What do you think makes the perfect snack? Hmm, it's gotta be when I'm really craving it and it's convenient. Could you be more specific? When it's cravinient. Okay. Like a freshly baked cookie made with real butter available right down the street at a.m. p.m. Or a savory breakfast sandwich I can grab in just a second at a.m. p.m. I'm seeing a pattern here. Well yeah, we're talking about what I crave which is anything from AM pm What more could you want? Stop by AM PM where the snacks and drinks are perfectly craveable and convenient. That's Cravenience and AM PM Too much good stuff. Welcome to the old time Radio Westerns. I'm your host Andrew Rines and I'm excited to bring you another episode. This is one of over 80 episodes released monthly for for your enjoyment. You can find more western shows at our website by going to otrwesterns.com now let's get into this episode. Ladies and gentlemen, here is William Conrad. Thank you, George. For nearly 10 years I had the pleasure of portraying a man named Matt Dillon. He's the principal character in radio's first adult western drama, Gunsmoke. Tonight you're going to hear the biography of this exceptional radio series. And helping me tell this fascinating story will be writer John Meston, producer, director Norman McDonald, my colleague Chester Parley Bear, my other colleague Doc, who is one of the sweetest, most wonderful men who ever lived. Howard McNair, our leading lady Georgia Ellis, composer, conductor Rex Corey. And from the many others that brought you this realistic portrayal of the American West. Of course you'll hear some of our best stories too. And now Gunsmoke. And Doug. Here we have the Limu Emu in its natural habitat helping people customize their car insurance and save hundreds with Liberty Mutual fascinating eating. It's accompanied by his natural ally, Doug Limu is that guy with the binoculars watching us. Cut the camera. They see us. Only pay for what you need@liberty mutual.com Liberty Liberty Liberty Liberty Savings Very unwritten by Liberty Mutual Insurance Co. Affiliates excludes Massachusetts. Around dark city and in the territory on west, there's just one way to handle the killers and the spoilers, and that's with a U. S. Marshal. And the smell of gun smoke. Gunsmoke Starring William Conrad transcribed story of the violence that moved west with young America, and the story of a man who moved with it. I'm that man. Matt Dillon, United States Marshal, the first man they look for and the last they want to meet. It's a chancy job, and it makes a man watchful and a little lonely. It was a long ride from Dodge up to Punker Creek in the Dakota Territory, and I killed a good horse getting there. But I caught Lee Trumbo. He was asleep in the clump of willow, and I took him without a fight. We rode his horse double into Sioux Falls, but we came the rest of the way back to Dodge in style, by stagecoach. At least I thought we were traveling in style. Lee didn't seem to care much for it. In fact, he wouldn't even talk until the stage pulled into Dodge and drove up Front street or the Plaza. You're making a bad mistake, Marshall. Is that so? I didn't kill anybody. There are two witnesses say you did, Lee. They're lying. Then why did you run? My brother, Dolph, he said you was after me. That's why I run. You'll get a trial. You can talk about it then. I ain't gonna stand trial, Marshall. Dolph will get me out of jail before that. Is that so? I never figured. Dolph is a man to do much of anything. You've been against us Trumbos ever since we come to Dodge, ain't you, Marshall? Yeah, I have. Neither one of you is any good. See what I mean? There's your brother Dolph now, waiting to welcome you back. How'd he know I was coming? I wired Chester from Sioux Falls a week ago. That Daniel deputy of yours is mail. Chester's not my deputy. Well, he sure acts like it. Yeah, he does, doesn't he? Now, here we are. You got my brother in there, Marshall. Come on out, Lee. You're going to be sorry for this. Yeah, that's what Lee's been telling me. Come on, Lee, get on out of there. I'm coming, Marshall. I'm coming. Shoot him, dog. Don't look at me, Marshall. I didn't even draw. No, no, you didn't dig it off. You didn't have to kick him like that. You hurt him, he'll get his win back. I got him covered, Mr. Dillon. Hello, Chester. Don't you try nothing like that again, Lee. It's all right, Chester. The fights out of him. You want me to take Dolph's gun? That's funny. I keep forgetting. You do wear a gun, don't you, Dolph? Nothing wrong with wearing a gun, Marshall. There is, the way you wear one. What do you mean? Well, you might run into somebody who doesn't know you're afraid to use it. He might shoot you before he found that out. You call me a coward, Marshall? Now, Chester. Yes, sir. I'm going over to the office. When Lee here stops groaning, hurt him over and lock him up, will you? Okay. And if Dolph gives you any trouble, shoot him. Now, Marshall. Get going, Dolph. Go on, move. You'll be sorry for this. I'll make you sorry for it. Oh, say, there's a fellow waiting for you over at the office, Mr. Dillon. He's a stranger to me, but he wanted to see you. All right, Chester. Oh, by the way, welcome back. Thanks. It's been most a month you've been gone. We sure did miss you here. There were times when I missed being here. Chester. Don't let Lee get away from me now, huh? I'd hate to make that ride all over again. No, sir, I won't. Oh, I sure won't. Oh, stop breathing like that. L. Get on your feet. You ain't hurt. Whoa. Hello, Matt. Hack. Hack. Brian. How are you? Good to see you. You're surprised to see me alive, huh? Man, why, Hack, it's been at least 10 years, isn't it? Man, ain't born a good kill me. Leastways, I ain't run into him yet. Or maybe you're just lucky. Luckier than you, anyways. A lot luckier sometimes. The way I recall it. Now you're thinking about Santa Fe. Yeah, he wasn't very lucky that day, Matt. Remember how it was you backed into a corner with nothing but a beer bottle in your hand and three of John Chisholm's drunk cowboys about to empty your guns into you? Yeah, yeah. Then you walked in and killed every one of them. Yeah, it was real surprise, wasn't it, Matt? John Chisholm's been after you ever since, hasn't he? Hacked. Oh, that was just the first of Chisholm's men I've killed, Matt. Been riding with Billy the Kid till about half a year ago. Oh, why'd you quit? Never could make out if Billy was working for or against Chisholm. Besides, didn't pay enough. But you're the one, Matt. When I got to Dodge last night, heard you was U.S. marshal here. I just didn't believe it. Well, being a marshal isn't that hard a job. Oh, you can handle it, all right. I know that. What I mean is it kind of sudden? Find a man you used to know, being a U.S. marshal. Well, I gotta earn my keep somehow. Oh, so sure. What are you doing to Dodge, anyway? I don't know, Matt. I don't know yet. I've been over to Wagon Bed Spring, stretching my legs. You sleeping in a bed? Doing a little gambling and the like. Now, some fella here sent for me. I ain't seen him yet, but if it's a job he's got, I sure need the money. Well, good luck with it, Hack. We'll get together later and have a drink. Straight ahead, Lee. I see that door there. The. What's this? That's the prisoner. What do you do? I didn't do nothing. Shut up and keep walking me. What you locking him up for, man? Murder. That's bad. That's real bad. Murder's always bad. I don't mean that. I mean locking a man up. I couldn't stand that, Matt. I never been in jail. I never ain't going to be. Well, then you better stay sober around here, Hack. And you're taking it back about that drink. No, no, you'll be safe as long as you're with me. Oh, I don't know, Matt. I've been around you when it wasn't so safe. I'll see you later. Yeah, sure, Hack. Hey, come on in, mister. I'm leaving. So long, Matt. Hello, Hank. Marshall. Dylan. Hello, Ollie. How are you? Marshall, I got something I got to tell you. It's my duty, the way I see it. Well, what's the trouble? Hello, Ollie. What you doing here? Well, I come to tell the marshal something, Chester, but I sure don't like informing on people. People. You understand me, Marshall? What's it about? Early Dolph Trumbo, that's what. You got his brother Lee in jail here? We sure have. I just locked him up myself. Well, Dolph's coming to get him out. He's over at the Alphaganza right now talking it up. Talking what up? Well, there's some men at the bar there, Marshall. And Dolph's buying them drinks and telling them his brother's plum innocent and they gotta raid the jail here and get him out. You mean he's forming a mob? That's what he's doing. And I don't like it. There's gonna be trouble. Sure. Oh, Lee, thanks very much for telling me this, but don't worry about the trouble. I'll put a stop to that right now. Come on, Chester. Yes, you. Wouldn't, you know, Doll Crumble do something stupid like this? Mr. Dylan trying to form a mob to take his brother out of jail. How well it works sometimes, Justin. Not in dodge it don't. Oh, not so far, anyway. Here's the Allanza. Now, don't get in the way, huh? No, You're right. Something else. There's nothing to be afraid of. You men, you'll be led by one of the best gunmen in the whole country, I promise you that. And we'll have justice in dark once and for all. Just. What do you want? Marshall, what are you doing here? Oli told you I seen him sneak out. I just been talking, Marshall. No harm in talking, is there? Lee's innocent anyway. He shouldn't be in jail. And I'm going to get him out, too. These men here are all with me. And we're going with. Quiet. Bartender. This place is closed for the rest of the day. No more liquor. You men get out of here. And don't let me find any of you together again. Not for a long time. Now get moving. Oh, here, Chester. I'll pay for the beer. You leaving, Mr. Dylan? Kenny just came downstairs. I haven't seen her yet. I think I'll go over to say hello. Yes, sir. Like for me to go across the street and see if they're keeping the Alberganza closed? No, it's all right. I told them they could open up again tonight. Hello. Well, thanks for the beer, Mr. Dillon. Sure, Chester. Sure. Welcome to Dark Stranger. How are you, Kitty? Fine. I'd be even better if you brought two beers over instead of one, but you can sit down anyway. Well, you can take this one, Kitty. It's kind of warm. I don't want it. Matthew. Suppose the day will ever come when having good manners will be a requirement for the marshal's office. Well, if it ever does, Kitty, I don't guess they'll need marshals anymore. Yeah, maybe you're right at that. Well, how've you been, huh? Everything okay? Well, I was making out pretty good math till I broke my toe. Broke your toe? Yep. How'd you do that? In the line of duty, right here in the saloon. I got tromped on dancing with a Texas cowboy. He should have been spending his trail money on red silk handkerchiefs and soda water instead of me. He Couldn't have been over 16. Darn fool kid. There's not much you can do for a broken toe, is it? No. At least it doesn't hurt when I'm sitting down. I hear you broke up Dolph Trumbo's party at the Alphaganza this afternoon. Oh. Huh. You hear just about everything, don't you, Kitty? Men, they talk more than women. This place is full of men, day and night. You think if I closed my eyes and prayed real hard, they'd all go away? Well, if they did, what would you do for a living that'll keep me awake? Say, there's your friend Dolph now. Just came in, huh? There's a stranger with him, that's all. Well, I won't be. What's the matter? Who is he? He's a gunman, Kitty. That so? Yeah. I guess he's about the handiest man with a gun that ever hit Dodge. Dolph's gone and hired him a gunman. Who is he, anyway? What's his name? He's a friend of mine, Kitty. A friend of yours? Yeah. Good friend. He saved my life once. Now I guess he's going to try to get it back. His name's Klein. Hack Prine. The government never did pay me much for enforcing the law and Dodge. But even if they doubled it, there were times when I'd like to acquit. I sat there with Kitty and watched the two men at the bar. They had a drink and they shook hands. And then Hack walked out. I got up and I followed him, Hollering me, Mac. Yeah, Hack? What for? Where you staying? Dodge House. Huh. Got a room? I. I'd like to talk to you. Street'll do okay. Dolph was trying to form a mob this afternoon. Hack, he wanted to raid his brother out of jail. I heard about it when I went to break it up. I heard him saying they'd be led by one of the best gunmen in the country. That wouldn't be Doubt Himself. No. He's afraid of guns. He. He meant you didn't Height. I hadn't talked to him yet. He was just guessing I'd come in. And you have. Not with no mob. I told him that I don't work with mobs. You should have known better than to say that. How do you work, Hack? Alone? By myself. I'm a pretty good gunman, Matt. Yeah. Yeah, I know. It saved my life once. You're being a good gunman. Yeah. Matt turn his brother loose. I get paid if you do. Look, heck Lee Trumbo murdered a man. He's gonna stand trial for it. I don't get paid if he stands trial. But you get paid for shooting me. That's what Dove said. That was his deal. Well. Oh, they tell me you're better with a gun. You used to be, Matt. Hack, I don't want to fight. You afraid, Mac? How'd you get to be marshal, anyways? It's a job. I took it. Well, I've been offered a job, too, and I took it. Yeah, but you had better jobs, Hack. Well, it's been bothering me some, Matt. I took an awful chance saving your life once. Now I got to take another to kill you. That don't make much sense, does he? Look, Hack, why don't you forget it, huh? Go on back to wagon bed spin. I'll lend you some money to see if you know it ain't that easy, Matt. I back out on this, the word will get around. Nobody will hire me for nothing no more. My reputation won't be worth probate. Did Billy the Kid pay you to kill men? Of course not. Of course not. That was for pleasure. You know how I hate John Chisholm. And you come down a long way, heck, selling your gun. I killed a man for pay over to Lahunta. Didn't bother me none. Who was he? I don't know. Some gambler. Pretty good gunman, though. Tell me something, Hack. Did Dolph say how his brother murdered that man here? Dolph claims he didn't do it at all. Well, there were two witnesses who saw him do it. The man was a buffalo skinner, unarmed. He didn't even have a knife on him. But he refused to buy Lee Trumbo a drink. So Lee shot him unarmed? That's right. Shot an unarmed man. You think it over, Hack. I'll see you tomorrow. Good night. A man like Hack Prine had his own peculiar sense of honor. The idea of shooting me seemed to bother him less than the fact that Lee Trumbull would kill them unarmed man. Later that night, I heard he'd been seen having an argument with Dal, so I figured I'd won. But another killin and Dodge, either me or Hack, had been avoided. Until early next morning, word came that a man had been shot at the Dodge house. I sent Chester on over while I went up and got Doc Adams. How do you know the man isn't already dead, Matt? I don't know, Doc. Well, it doesn't matter. I'll probably make more money off of him dead than alive. How well I get paid for autopsies, don't I? Sure, yeah, but just try to collect for the ones I keep alive. Just you try it. And I'm glad I don't have to, Doc. But I still notice you buy a new buggy ever since. Oh, yes. We out before racing across the prairie, delivering babies, setting bones, digging out bullets. Delivering babies. Well, exercise. Keep the man young. It's a good thing I don't depend on sympathy to keep me young. Here we are. Oh, hold on. Where is he, Justice? In that room right there, number 12. And you know who it is? It's O. O? Yes, sir. And Hack Prine, Charlie. But It's Hack's room, Mr. Dylan. He did it. All right, let's take a look. Where's Hack now, Justin? I don't know, sir. Nobody's seen him for the past hour. I kept everybody out of the room, Mr. Dylan. All right, now, stand aside here, boys. Let the maring dock through. Come on now, let him through. Let me through here. It's Oie, all right. He's dead, Matt. Real dead. Three, four hours, probably nobody heard a shot or nothing. Mr. Dillon, when the clerk come on duty about an hour ago, he saw Hack Brian walk out of here. Why? Anybody want to kill poor little Olia? I do not understand. I'll bet I know, Mr. Dylan. What? Just it you didn't talk Hack out of trying to kill you after all. He went back to Dolph last night and told him he'd take the job. Then he figured the only way to get you into a fight was to shoot somebody. Though you'd have to come after him. Yeah, maybe. Now, come on, let's start looking for him. I guess Alabanza is the only place we haven't looked in, Mr. Dylan. He's got to be there. Unless maybe he's going to try to bushwhack you. Hack may be a paid killer, Chester, but he always faces man head on. Yes, sir. That come right from the Alcamanza. Yeah, Mr. Dylan. There, Jack. He's coming out. Yeah. All right. Get off the street, Chester. Yes. Morning, Matt. Hello. Hack just killed a man that saloon there. Dolph Trumbo. I killed him. I give him a chance, but he wouldn't draw. I killed him anyways. That's too bad, Hack. Ain't no man gonna frame me. I never thought you killed Olie, but I wanted to hear you say so. How'd you know I didn't do it? It wouldn't be your style to kill a defenseless little fellow. Like that, would it? Of course not. So while you were out gambling last night, Dolph killed him and dumped him in your room. I found him there and then I went after Dolph. Ain't no man can do that to me, Hack. According to the law, you murdered Dolph. I'm gonna have to arrest you. What? You're gonna have to stand trial for it. Oh no, Matt. No, sir. I ain't going to jail. Not me, Matt. Never. I'm a law man, Hack. I gotta arrest you, Matt. I told Dolph last night I wasn't gonna take his job. I told him I was going to leave town. You're under arrest, Hack. All right. I guess you gotta do it. Let's go for it, Matt. No, Hack. No. Let's see what happen. Oh, you. You're sure good, Matt. You're awful good. Yeah. Better this way, man, than getting paid to fight. You sure? Sure it is. There weren't no reason to fight you. Not that way. I can't see you no more. It's like being underwater. I can't see nothing. Dylan, that was awful good shooting. I never seen nothing as fast as that in my whole life. My, I'll bet he didn't know what hit him. Way he spun around there when. When you. Mr. Dillon. Mr. Dillon. What's the matter? Mr. Dillon, What do you think makes the perfect snack? Hmm, it's gotta be when I'm really craving it and it's convenient. Could you be more specific? When it's cravinient. Okay. Like a freshly baked cookie made with real butter, available right down the street at am, pm or a savory breakfast sandwich I can grab in just a second at am, pm. I'm seeing a pattern here. Whoa. Well, yeah, we're talking about what I crave, which is anything from ampm. What more could you want? Stop by AMPM where the snacks and drinks are perfectly craveable and convenient. That's cravenience, ampm. Too much good stuff. If you're the purchasing manager at a manufacturing plant, you know having a trusted partner makes all the difference. That's why hands down, you count on Grainger for auto reordering. With on time restocks, your team is will have the cut resistant gloves they need at the start of their shift. And you can end your day knowing they've got safety well in hand. Call 1-800-GRAINGER click granger.com or just stop by Granger for the ones who get it done. Now here is your host, John Hickman. Good evening everyone. The story you're about to hear is long overdue in the telling. It's the story of Gunsmoke, one of the most successful radio properties of recent times. The story, like a typical Gunsmoke script, is filled with drama, love, tragedy, fact and emotion. It's also a story that up until the present, has been largely ignored by serious broadcast historians. Cecil Smith, writing in his Los Angeles times column in September 1975, said Gunsmoke was the dramatization of the American epic legend of the west, our own Iliad and odyssey created of the standard elements of the dime novel and the pulp Western as romanticized by Buntline, Hart and Twain. It was ever the stuff of legend. Those legends, facts and fantasies were brilliantly blended by writer John Meston in his portrayal of Dodge City, Kansas, in the 1870s. Meston's Cowtown was a microcosm of the American west, and in the center of it was Marshal Matt Dillon. We met and came to know him, his friends and his enemies, and we learned of their life in a town referred to by historian Lucius Peebe as a suburb of hell. The picture that Meston painted of Kansas is remarkably accurate. There really was a Front street in Dodge City. You actually could buy a drink at the Long Branch Saloon, the same saloon where Wyatt Earp and Bat Masterson called the bluff of psychopathic killer Clay Allison, branding him a coward and driving him out of town. Chances are there was a doctor similar to Meston's. Most likely, the buffalo steak served in the restaurants of the period did taste like shoe leather, and I can guarantee you that there were many kiddies in that Babylon of the plains. Tracing how the west has been dramatized by other writers would take five hours in itself. Suffice it to say that scores of writers have attempted to portray America moving West, from Ned Buntline of a century ago to Zane Gray of recent vintage. The west has been portrayed in feature pictures by such box office attractions as William S. Hart and Roy Rogers, and television has given us such thrillers as Hopalong Cassidy and Wild Bill Hickok. Radio, prior to a certain Saturday evening in 1952, offered Tom Mix, Red Rider and the Lone Ranger, all in stories about good guys and bad guys, roping, rustling, fights, chases and shootouts. And practically all of it was aimed at an adolescent audience. Looking back, it seems strange that it took from 1926, when network radio began, to 1952 a total of 26 years for someone to offer an adult portrayal of the American West. The reason for radio's disinterest is best explained, I think, by the Peabody Award winning writer, producer and director, William N. Robeson. It's the same old story who Bright young men who contributed the ideas to radio were urban oriented. We were operating out of Chicago, New York and Los Angeles. Those were operated out of Los Angeles and their subsidiary ethnic characters would be Japanese, like Mr. Watanabe, a house servant who featured in some situation comedy of years ago. Those of us who operated out of New York, our ethnic characters would be the stock black or the stock Irishman. And those who did their radio out of Chicago ate the manners of New York, ate the mores of New York. But they wouldn't think for a moment to look towards the West. They were very close to it. Therefore they overlooked it. One of radio's first attempts to treat the west on more adult basis than Tom Mix or Red Ryder was with a CBS program called Hawk Larrabee. The program debuted in the summer of 1947 and was directed by Bill Roy. Come along, folks, and listen to the tale of Huff Laraby on the Western trail. The Columbia Broadcasting System presents Hawk Laraby starring Barton Yarborough and his stories of the timeless West. Stories of men and women, famous and infamous, who loved and hated, lived and died in the colorful drama of the American West. Stories chronicled for you by Hoff Larrabee. Larrabee was an assignment for me. I did not dream it up. I think probably it was Ernie Martin's idea. Ernie Martin was the program director at that time. He went on to become a very successful theatrical producer with such things, Wears Charlie and Mame and things like that. I don't know what his thinking was, but it was decided in the upper reaches of management to try a western and see what would happen, to see if it had any commercial bites. So they put it on Saturday afternoon. I doubt if it went 13 weeks. The original title was Hawk Durango. Then they discovered that Columbia Pictures down the street had released a movie called the Durango Kid. So they figured they better change that. It was a series of stories centered around the main character, whose name was Hawk Larrabee. A cowhand on a ranch in Texas, played by Barton Yarborough, had a wonderful and authentic Texas accent. Well, I might have knowed Rita wasn't fooling. Cause next morning I got a message to meet Colonel Grayson in his office next to the ranch house. And there she was, standing behind his wheelchair, looking like a poker player. Just filled a bobtail flush. Hawk, Rita's got a fool idea. She wants to go on that cattle drive. Hawk knows all about it, dad. Women is bad luck on a cattle drive, Colonel. I've been to trying. Trying to tell her that Hawk. Oh, superstition. Well, how about Cape Mulroney? Went up the Chisholm Trail with a cross tee outfit. The herd was low. Yeah, and the Comanches got Aggie Dawson's herd. And the drive at Searle Parks went on. Well, they ain't never been heard from since. Oh, coincidence, that's all it is. Rita, this idea of yours is sheer tomfoolery. Dad, since you can't go along, you ought to have somebody on that drive to represent you. Larabee represents me. He's a good ramrod and I'm lucky to have him. Me crippled up with rheumatism this way. I want to go with a herd, Colonel. I was hired as boss. Is that right? Sure, Hook. Then either I have all to say about who's going to Abilene or quit right now. Well, really. There's your answer. You ain't going with a herd. Now, Hul thought his troubles were over Colonel Frank and forbid her to go. For authenticity, we employed a man named Kenneth Perkins, who had written a series of western stories for the Saturday Evening Post, was quite good and quite knowledgeable in his Western background or the western background which could be found in Argosy and True Stories and that sort of thing at the time. Now, whether that was authentic or not, I don't know. We would come up with such wonderful words that we'd never heard before, like take a pasilla, which meant to go out and look around or make your play. And it's pretty heavy stuff for us, at least in radio we hadn't heard these kind of phrases. The dialogue was peppered with it. And then of course, any time Barton, when Garber turned on that wonderful accent of his, it had a true ring of authenticity. I think what it ended up being was a kind of a pictureless B grade Western. Same kind of plot and character development that you'd find in a Roy Rogers movie. Maybe a cut above Hawk Never Kissed the Horse. In the fall of 1947, Robson began the prestigious dramatic series Escape. Well, Escape was an anthology show and the truly brilliant thinking of show business at the time. Since suspense was such a great success, why not another show at the same time? So Escape was pretty darn close to suspense and very often we use the same material. The assistant director, who was Norman McDonald for most of the Escape series when I was doing it and who subsequently succeeded me as director on it for a while, the assistant Director's function was to time the rehearsals, to time the show and while on the air advise the director how he was running faster, slow, etc. And generally to take care of the mechanical end of the production. I used the finest actors in Hollywood. Jack Webb, who went on to become Sergeant Friday and Dragnet. Jeff Corey used to do a lot of things. Jeff Corey became and is now a well known actor. Director Ben Wright, an Englishman born in Brooklyn who had a magnificent English accent did many, many wonderful performances such as in the man who Would Be King. I remember particularly Sam Edwards wonderful Texas accent and an authentic one. You'd always get a Texas accent from these actors, but some of them weren't authentic. Jeff Chandler, the late Chandler. Jeff Chandler was one of our regulars. John Lund, a picture actor. John Dana, who was still very active in television. Then there was Parley Baer who did much of the support work. Howard McNair was one of our absolutely invaluable support people. Georgia Ellis, of course, was one of our regulars. And Georgia became Kitty in Gunsmoke. And of course the man who came on in a deep tone said, want to get away from it all Want to escape that man was Bill Conrad. Tired of the everyday grind Ever dream of a life of romantic adventure? Want to get away from it all we offer you Escape. One of the mainstays, one of the strong right arms that I had was Bill Conrad. This is Norman McDonnell, producer, director of Gunsmoke. Bill for a long period played the opening voice on Escape and would also play either bits or important parts. And Bill was, as were all the actors, perfectly content to have it work that way. Bill, for instance, played the great, huge, powerful, powerful Dutchman in Leiningen vs. The Ants, which was one of the better Escape shows I think, that I was ever connected with. Harley Bear would be an example of a man who. I remember a show that Paul played the lead on Second Class Passenger. A funny kind of lost little man who gets into terrible difficulties in Algiers or Morocco or wherever it was. And Parley was just beautiful. On the other hand, Parley would play a little bit of a school teacher or a little bit of a country lawyer or doctor. The same with somebody like Howard McNair or a young ingenue, George Ellis. If I remember correctly, she was the girlfriend of Will Rogers Jr. On a program called Rogers of the Gazette. So this little stock company was, was kept busy. Story editor for Escape was John Dunkle, who in later years became a frequent contributor to Gunsmoke. Dunkle's departure from CBS opened the Door for a promising young writer named John meston. Again, Norman McDonald. It was mid year of 50 that John Dunkle left his position to freelance. He was indeed busy doing that. It was then that John Meston took over his job. John had been head of what we all called censorship, but a more high powered bit of nomenclature would be continuity acceptance. But anyway, he took over Dunkle's spot and busied himself with working on scripts that were submitted and were going to various shows that were on the air at that time, like Suspense, Escape and others. Shortly after he joined the staff, Meston wrote his first script. As far as I was concerned, the first script of his that I worked on was Crossing Paris. That was on Escape and was as I say, mid year or a little after mid year of 1950. John had never thought of himself, I don't think as a budding writer. But it went well and Crossing Paris received critical acclaim and everybody was very taken with was. About two or three months later on the same series Escape, he, he did a western called Wild Jack Rhett. You are standing in a moonlit street of a western cow town, alone and friendless, while moving slowly down on you, their horses crowding every exit, is a band of killers, each one of whom has been paid to shoot you dead. It was something that John and I were becoming increasingly interested in this approach to a western which was not like the others on the air. John, as a matter of fact, said there ought to be a way to do an adult western, meaning that adults could enjoy it without any implication of psychological overtones or anything. When he said adult Western, he meant merely that it wasn't a kid western. It was that simple. While Jack Rhett was the first of several shows that we experimented with done in late 1950, we experimented with what was then called exaggerated sound patterns. They weren't exaggerated, it was merely that we avoided the old radio cliche of never have any dead air. We had lots of dead air and it seemed to work if, if our lead walked across a room, we took time to let him walk across the room and didn't keep dialogue going. If somebody was leaving and crossing the street, we would hear the door close, down the steps, cross the street, sidewalk and across the street. And it seemed to be very effective. Three weeks later, Wild Jack Rhett rode into Red mesa. He was 38 and at the peak of his reputation. He stood well over 6ft feet, better than 200 pounds of plain sinew. Tawny blonde hair grew long in the frontier style and his features were boldly aquiline. He was a picturesque man until one looked at his eyes, which were large and pale blue and had the disconcerting trick of remaining too steadily on people. There was to be seen in them the suggestion of inhumanity. He sent word to the committee that he would meet them at the mayor's office that evening. Eight o'. Clock. Now, where is he? He's in town. That's bad enough. Now be a sport, boy. Ellen, we took a fair vote on that. You'll learn. Here he comes now. Here he comes. Here he. My name is Jack. Rhett, I have your offer. I'm Peter Wayne, Mayor of Red Mesa. Do you accept it? That depends on what you want. Tell me. Well, Rhett, this is a difficult town. The Chisholm Trail lies just across the river and we get most of our money from the riders passing through with Texas cattle. We want them to have a decent time for their money. But we don't like a lot of gunplay in killing. I've always been accustomed to complete authority, Mayor. I presume to know my job and I won't have interference. That's agreed, Rhett. By the way, the last sheriff had a rule that riders leave their hardware at his office. He had trouble enforcing it. Poor rule. Let them pack their guns. Gives the wild ones a fair chance at you. I never give a man a fair chance at me. Me. Is that all, gentlemen? If you're an H vac technician and a call comes in, Grainger knows that you need a partner that helps you find the right product fast and hassle free. And you know that when the first problem of the day is a clanking blower motor, there's no need to to break a sweat. With Grainger's easy to use website and product details, you're confident you'll soon have everything humming right along. Call 1-800-GRAINGER click granger.com or just stop by Grainger for the ones who get it done. If you're the purchasing manager at a manufacturing plant, you know having a trusted partner makes all the difference. That's why, hands down, you count on Grainger Auto reordering with on time restocks. Your team will have the cut resistant gloves they need at the start of their shift. And you can end your day knowing they've got safety well in hand. Call 1-800-GRAINGER click granger.com or just stop by Grainger for the ones who get it done. We tried it again on a show called Pagosa, which was done on a series called Romance. And we used the same understated blunt, somewhat laconic style. And again, we liked it. We felt it was a good way to do a Western. Bill Conrad was in that. He played a man called Jeff Spain. As a matter of fact, I've always referred to Pagosa as Jeff Spain, which it was not. He might say, experiment number two or three on his new style. It's mid morning when Jeff Spain steps out of the lock into Cherokee Street. Across the street and a few doors down, he sees a sign, neatly lettered District Attorney and underneath is the name of Duke Reese. Spain walks over, quickly, throws open the door and enters. Well, Spain, I didn't expect you so soon. I always try to be a little ahead of the other man. Oh, yes, of course. Sit down. I'll stand. You don't like me, do you, Spain? You were going to explain things to me, Rhys. All right, it doesn't matter. We'll make a profitable team anyway. Now, my offer still stands. $500 a month and 30% of the take. Oh, how would I earn it? Well, your reputation will earn most of it for you. It's very simple, Spain. The next six months I shall want campaign contributions from the gambling halls and saloons hereabouts. I'm running for the state legislature, you know. I didn't know. Yes, and I'm sure everyone will contribute generously, knowing that if they don't, our sheriff will close them down for some good legal reason or other. I'll provide that. Well, why don't you send for some other gunfighter, Reese? Why, when I can trust you? What's your point, Reese? Just that in six months you can have title to your land, and I think you want that. And what guarantee do I have of it? You don't need any. In six months, I'm leaving Pagosa for good. I don't care what happens here after that. And if I refuse? In that case, I won't be able to afford to leave, will I? If I do stay on here, Spain, Mitch Travis will file that title in my name. I see. And he'll file it in my name anyway. If you accept the job and you and I, shall we say, don't get along, you have till tomorrow morning to decide. Don't be a fool, Spain. We all make mistakes, Reese. A few minutes later, Spain rides out of town, taking the trail towards the chaparral where Cy Quill is waiting for him there in the shade. They pass the afternoon in talk. Late that night, a pair of riders running off the desert put their horses in Teal Travis stable and walk back to the Kettle house, where in Spain's room they make their final plans and then go quietly to bed. Next morning they come out of the hotel and head for the District Attorney's office. Reese, this is my partner, Cy Quill. Oh, how do you do, Mr. Quill? Howdy. Do you still want to appoint me sheriff of Pagosa? Then you've decided? Yeah. Where's a badge? Right here. Good. Now get one out for Si. I just made him my deputy. What? Give him a badge. I'm not new at this game, Reese, and I always appoint my own men. Well, all right. You insist. Now, go down to the sheriff's office and fire whoever's in there. Get him out by noon. I'll take over then. Now, just a minute, Spain. I'm not used to being ordered around. I can't fire your man. Tell him to turn loose any prisoners he's got in there. I don't like another man's leavings. Messman and I wanted to do a series called Jeff Spain, which was an offshoot of the romance episode called Pagosa Mid 1951. And we approached CBS management with it, but they said no. They were developing a. A western called Gunsmoke. Harry Ackerman had the title and he had the writers and he had the cast in mind. They made two, if I remember correctly, two audition discs with two well known radio actors, but neither were successful. Neither got on the air. Well, despite further urgings, we. We couldn't move the CBS executives to put the show on. A popular Saturday evening program in April 1952 was Operation Underground, a forerunner of foreign intrigue. Its director was William N. Robeson. Well, Operation Underground was a another managerial brainstorm. They wanted to kill two birds with one stone, present an exciting adventure spy story and make it very American and anti communist, I think. Harry Ackerman went on to television glory. Dreamed this one up. What he dreamed up was a character named Ethan Allen Rogers, combining the identity of the conqueror Ticonderoga and the inspirer of Ken Broward's Northwest Passage. Of Rogers Rangers, our hero always went into the hotel room and found that it had been rifled or. The climax was on the Orient Express and as it went into the tunnel, he tosses the heavy through the window. That kind of a story, you know. Lamar Johnson played the starring role of Easton Allen Rogers. Lamar Johnson, who was since then become a very fine motion picture directive. Very interesting, very amusing story about this. Radio entertainment industry was undergoing the widespread attacks for harboring communist sympathizers within the ranks of Its actors, writers, producers, etc. And I was aware of this, as a matter of fact, a target. And I laid on the anti communist aspect pretty heavily in terms of Mr. Roger's attitude towards his antagonists in Eastern Europe. And I was called in one day by an executive of CBS who said, come on, go easy on that anti communist stuff. I said, well, what the hell is your position? He said, well, you know, we're against communists, but remember, communists byproducts too. CBS canceled Operation underground in the third week of April, 1952. Cancel is a harsh word. It was the victim of usual network practice. The show is put on the air and for this instance, picked up for sale. After a reasonable amount of time, it's discontinued and another type of entertainment is put in there in its place. And in this case, Gun Smoke was the other kind of entertainment. And I can't think of a better replacement. We had a week's notice to put a show together and get it on the air. And in that week we had to find a writer, we had to find a star. We had to have a theme, a Gunsmoke theme composed. So it was a busy week. We got Walter Brown Newman to come in, one of the better writers in town. We gave him an acetate disc of Pagosa and I believe, of Wild Jack Rhett and said, this is the style, this is the color, this is the feeling. We laid out no other guidelines except told him how we felt Matt Dillon should be written and the kind of character he was, and sent Walter away. That was on a Monday with the Gunsmoke script in preparation, a CBS program executive called composer conductor Rex Corey in for a meeting. He said, have you ever done a Western? So I said, no. I said, I don't think that I'm not a western writer in that sense of the word. But I said, I'm game to tackle anything. What do you have in mind? Well, he says, we've got a new show we want to put on and a chap by the name of Norman McDonald is going to direct it. And Norm knows exactly what he wants. And if you think you would like to do it, why don't you go downstairs and talk to Norm? I proceeded to go down to his office. We sat down and talked immediately was charmed by Norm. He's a man with a magnetic personality. He knew what he wanted. He said, rex, this is a different type of western than I think that you have probably ever seen. We call this an adult Western. And they said our approach will be purely. It isn't the shoot them up chase type of Western that the public is used to. These, these will be adult stories located in the west, but there will be emotional stories, stories of suspense in action and various other aspects. And he said, we would like to have a seasoned musical director who can tackle a job with that understanding and that perspective. Would you be interested in doing them? I said, well, from what you've told me already, I would certainly not want to turn it down. So he said, well, fine. Now about the theme. He said, we want something that has a big, wide open sound to it, something that suggests the open spaces. He said, the main character, Matt Dillon, is a very complex character, one that you'll want to understand. And we went into delved into the various aspects of it. I think almost immediately formed a cohesion of ideas that was to carry us through in what his turn has become a very, very long and extensive venture. I always wrote what I call the interior music first. The reason I did this was by the time that I had written the so called interior music, I had developed within myself the feeling and the sound that I ultimately would want to establish for the whole series. So I always left the theme till the end. And the theme was written under rather frantic circumstances because I had gone to bed the night before leaving that to be done with the feeling that I knew pretty well what I wanted and figuring that I could do it rather quickly in the morning if I got up early enough. I didn't get up early enough. And the music always had to be in what we call the copyist. Now, the uninitiated probably doesn't know that all music that is composed for orchestra is composed on master score sheets. In other words, we work by the page, putting down all the instrumental parts, whether they be percussion or strings or woodwinds or brass or whatever, they all go on what we call a master score. Now, these parts, the individual parts of the instrumentalist plays, all had to be hand copied off the original master score. So these, the music or the score had to be into the copyist. The people that did this work in plenty of time so that they could get their job done in time to have them on the music stands by recording time or by broadcast time, so that I had to have the music in, in this particular morning into the CBS copies by something like 9:30 or 10 o'. Clock. Here at 8 o' clock in the morning, I'm in the middle of shaving and I suddenly realized that I haven't written the theme. So I grabbed a magazine piece of manuscript and a pencil and sat down in the most convenient spot and that is where the Gunsmoke theme was actually composed. It was composed in the matter of about 10 minutes minutes and rushed to the copies along with the rest of the music. There remained the problem, of course, the enormous problem of finding a star. The CBS executives of course were hoping for a big name. I do remember that we. There was a young actor from Pasadena who had some name at that time, Robert Stack, if I remember correctly, Ray Burr auditioned. I think when they started casting for it somebody said good Christ, let's don't get Bill Conrad. We're up to you know where with Bill Conrad. So they did not get Bill Conrad. They auditioned everybody in town and as a last resort they called me and said okay, we give up, come on in. And I went in and read about two lines and they said okay, thank you. And I walked out and the next day they called me and said, you have the job. I think Meston and I were more enthusiastic about Conrad than the executives because Bill was considered a heavy at that time. He just finished doing the Killers in feature pictures and everybody considered him a heavy and of course he was a marvelous heavy. So I think the CBS executives were a little, a little concerned that William Conrad, heavy extraordinaire would be playing our lead Matt Dillon. The other characters were not set and no contracts were drawn drawn because nobody had yet decided who would be playing with Bill. It just developed that Howard McNair played the doctor who became a running character. Harley Bear played Chester who became a running character. Georgia Ellis was in one of the first shows but Kitty wasn't actually invented until oh, perhaps eight or ten shows into the end of the series. I think Georgia played another saloon girl but was but was not Kitty. If you're the purchasing manager at a manufacturing plant, you know having a trusted partner makes all the difference. That's why hands down, you count on Grainger for auto reordering with on time restocks your team will have the cut resistant gloves they need at the start of their shift and you can end your day knowing they've got safety well and in. Call 1-800-GRAINGER click granger.com or just stop by Granger for the ones who get it done. What do you think makes the perfect snack? Hmm, it's gotta be when I'm really craving it and it's convenient. Could you be more specific when it's cravenient? Okay, like a freshly baked cookie made with real butter available right down the street at a.m. p.m. Or a savory breakfast sandwich I can grab in just a second at am pm. I'm seeing a pattern here. Well yeah, we're talking about what I crave which is anything from am, pm. What more could you want? Stop by AMPM where the snacks and drinks are perfectly craveable and convenient. That's cravenience am PM Too much. Good stuff. This has been a presentation of otrwesterns.com and we hope you enjoyed. Please take some time to like and rate this episode within your favorite podcast application. Follow us on Facebook by going to otrwesterns.com Facebook and subscribe to our YouTube channel by going to otrwesterns.Com YouTube become one of our ranch hands and unlock some exclusive content. We want to thank our most recent ranch hands Steve and Ron W. Who joined us recently. You too can join by going to otrwesterns.com donate send us an email podcasttrwesterns.com and you can call and leave us a voicemail 707-986-8739 this episode is copyrighted under the Attribution Non Commercial Share Alike Copyright. For more information go to otrwesterns.com copyright have a great day and thanks for listening. And Doug Here we have the Limu Emu in its natural habitat helping people customize their car insurance and save hundreds with Liberty Mutual. Fascinating. It's accompanied by his natural ally, Doug. Uh, Limu is that guy with the binoculars watching us. Cut the camera. They see us. Only pay for what you need@liberty mutual.com Liberty Liberty Liberty Liberty Savings Ferry Unwritten by Liberty Mutual Insurance Company and affiliates excludes Massachusetts. If you're an H Vac technician and a call comes in, Grainger knows that you need a partner that helps you find the right product fast and hassle free. And you know that when the first problem of the day is a clanking blower motor, there's no need to break a sweat. With Grainger's easy to use website and product details, you're confident you'll soon have everything humming right along. Call 1-800-GRAINGER clickgrainger.com or just stop by Grainger for the ones who get it done. Here we have the Limu Emu in its natural habitat, helping people customize their car insurance and save hundreds with Liberty Mutual. Fascinating. It's accompanied by his natural ally, Doug. Limu is that guy with the binoculars watching us. Cut the camera, they see us. Only pay for what you need@libertymutual.com Liberty Liberty Liberty Liberty Savings Ferry Unwritten by Liberty Mutual insurance company and affiliates excludes Massachusetts.