Maggie Bowles (1:52)

Okay, let's recap.

Ryan Tillotson (2:03)

Episode one. We're back.

Maggie Bowles (2:06)

It opens with a flashback to 1962. Loretta's past as a young girl who loved the theater. To her present auditioning for Oliver.

Ryan Tillotson (2:13)

We revisit what we saw at the end of season two where Ben Glenroy drops dead on stage. Then we travel back four months.

Maggie Bowles (2:21)

We meet a whole new cast of characters at the table read for Oliver's play, Deathrattle. Ben Glenroy, played by Paul Rudd, is a famous actor and he seems like he might be a little bit of a tool.

John Hoffman (2:31)

Okay, okay.

Actor (Ben Glenroy) (2:35)

Who farted

Elizabeth Keener (2:39)

Ben Glenroy.

Maggie Bowles (2:40)

Ladies. Loretta doesn't impress the producers or Ben, but Oliver pledges to keep her in the show.

Ryan Tillotson (2:46)

Then we're back in present day. Oliver has everyone back to his apartment for the opening night party to figure out what to do now that Ben is dead.

Maggie Bowles (2:54)

We learn that Ben gave everyone a handkerchief as an opening night gift. And Mabel already wants to do another podcast. And Charles is secretly relieved that the play is canceled. And Loretta and Oliver have an intimate moment at the piano.

Ryan Tillotson (3:07)

Then all of a sudden, Ben storms in. He's alive. He apologizes to everyone individually except Loretta, who he calls a snake.

Maggie Bowles (3:15)

Then Ben gets a call and he leaves the party.

Ryan Tillotson (3:18)

Mabel finished the remodel of her apartment. The trio decided to have a late night pickle diner moment. And on the way down, Ben Glenroy's body falls through the ceiling of the elevator. And this time, he's definitely de.

John Hoffman (3:42)

You gotta be kidding me.

Maggie Bowles (4:05)

Welcome back. Here it is, our interview with John Hoffman, showrunner, co creator, producer, and the director of season three, episode one.

Ryan Tillotson (4:13)

How are you?

John Hoffman (4:14)

Oh, my God. I'm good. How are you doing?

Ryan Tillotson (4:17)

Really good. We've got some questions for you, John. I know this is going to be, like, really difficult because I don't know what we can actually talk about or how. I don't know if our questions are.

Daniel Ferreira (4:28)

Yeah, let us know what's off limits.

Ryan Tillotson (4:30)

Yeah.

John Hoffman (4:31)

Oh, my God. Listen, we will fight through, roll through, whatever we need to do. I know. It's so interesting. As a producer and a director, I can answer questions, which is so bizarre because I, you know, and I'm so far. I'm just trying to hang in this moment of, you know, tremendous support and try to ride the line of, of, you know, the show is coming on. So I don't, you know, it has to be produced so well.

Ryan Tillotson (5:02)

Listen, we're in the studio and there's the I saw a whole wall of murders stuff on Melrose here. What was it like coming back to set after the break? How was the feeling the first day?

John Hoffman (5:13)

First day. Okay. So speaking as a director now with the director hat on, that was a moment for sure. Having grown very familiar with the set of only murders in the building and the cast involved and the daily dizzying sort of who's coming on set today and who's coming on now to work with Paul Rudd and Meryl Streep in a real way on top of this incredible cast. And it was pretty early on, I think. First day. First day was basically everyone in our cast for a big, huge group scene. From episode 301 and that Paul had to run the room. And I woke up that morning kind of having, I think, this moment, like. Like, it's like it sort of pierces through a little bit. I had been in denial probably about these famous people working on the show, because I had to just do it. And I had to think, okay, I just have to make it as good as we can possibly make it. And then I kind of forgot in a way that I'd be directing Meryl Streep and Paul Rudd. Like that. That hit me that morning I woke up and I thought, oh, for God's sake, how do I go about doing that? And how do people like to be directed? And I started going very basic. Like, I don't even know what to say. When do I say action? I don't know. But it gets very, like, down to basics in my head. But the moment that I'll never forget is. Was very sweet. On the first day, we had Meryl on set, and everyone was abuzz. And she had a first scene with Marty, Oliver and Loretta at the P in Oliver's apartment. And that was her first scene she shot. I feel better now.

Ryan Tillotson (7:22)

How about you, Anne? It was new.

John Hoffman (7:24)

We were all nervous, and I was nervous. But setting up the shot. First setup was great. We did a few takes with the first setup. We were going to move the camera for the next setup. And Marty told me this later. But Meryl, as she was stepping out to wait for us to set up the next setup, said to Marty, oh, okay. It's always good to get the first one out. The nerves, you know? And I thought, oh, my God, you don't realize someone else is going to be nervous, especially Meryl Streep. When you're thinking only of, like, what do I do that's going to be so wrong? And she'll walk off the set and never come back. But otherwise, that was amazing. And from that point on, it was kind of a dream.

Ryan Tillotson (8:08)

Well, it's good to know that Meryl was. Was just as nervous, right? Yeah, it's relieving. It's like we're all in it together.

Daniel Ferreira (8:14)

She's a human.

Ryan Tillotson (8:15)

Yeah, she's human.

John Hoffman (8:18)

She's a human. That was the other thing you realize in that moment, too, is that, oh, my God. Okay. Of course she's nervous. That's what makes her so great, you know? And it's all of the questions. It's all of the way of watching her work. And it's all of the way in which you see everyone on her set. Steve does the same, Marty does this, Selena does the same. You recognize what makes them great is the sort of manner in which they are on a set and the manner in which they go about their work from the moment they are in a costume fitting and the feelings they have about the character. The minute they walk on a set and see what the set looks like and how they feel about it. And if something feels wrong, they ask that something else be put in its place. And it's all beautiful to watch.

Daniel Ferreira (9:05)

So what are some of the changes that you wanted to explore or I guess, new places you wanted to take the show in season three versus season two and season one?

John Hoffman (9:19)

Season one was very focused on Mabel and her history and story with Tim Kono and sort of this burgeoning possibility that could happen with these two older gentlemen in the arconia. Then season two was highly centered on Charles and his relationship to his father, vis a vis that painting and unlocking the mysteries around the personal side for him and what that meant. And then season. So it made sense to me that by the end of season two that when we're looking to springboard into a new season, that it might lend itself toward a story for Oliver that could open up his personal story in a way. So the world of the theater and my own familiarity with it, you know, I look for anything that I can, when I need more than anything sort of that hook in to say, I can do it, I can. I can write, that I can produce, that I can do those things that you're supposed to know how to do. If there's some familiar base around it that that gives me that confidence to lead a group of brilliant people to make it happen. So in that way, the theater was a comfort for me. I knew it. And I was longing to sort of have fun with a whole new world. Has a premise that is both delightful and intriguing and cozy. Murder mystery esque. But for the life of an ongoing series, you want to shake it up, too, a little bit and freshen it up when you can. And so in this way, leaning into Oliver and that world of the theater and opening up a new cast of characters and opening up of our show and setting it, but keeping very true still to the spirit of the show was critical. So keeping the building very alive and how to do that right from episode one and sort of address the concerns of some audience members who thought we belied our title at the end of season two was fun to play with as well. You know, Mabel, we couldn't have done the podcast Anyway, because Ben didn't die in the building.

Daniel Ferreira (11:45)

Yeah, I, I loved that Charles in the, in the elevator saying, like, well, we couldn't have, we couldn't have done the podcast anyways because it wasn't in the building. And then the blood, I think it's like right after that the blood starts dripping and it's like, oh, they got us. They got us.

John Hoffman (12:03)

I hope that works. I really do. I hope that works. It was one of the, like, oh my God. One of the early stages, big swing moments we make. But it feels so fun to do and, and it's funny you say that because in editing there was a moment where do we even need Charles to say that line? And I thought, oh, I need it. I need it.

Daniel Ferreira (12:27)

Yeah, I needed it.

Ryan Tillotson (12:28)

I liked it.

Daniel Ferreira (12:29)

Yeah.

Ryan Tillotson (12:32)

We're going to take a quick break and when we come back, how a late night Pickle Diner moment led to Paul Rudd joining the cast and the uncanny coincidences with Loretta and Meryl Streep.

Maggie Bowles (12:50)

Welcome back. We are talking with John Hoffman, showrunner, co creator, producer and the Director of Season 3, Episode 1. Only Murderers has always been able to get great people to join the show and this season they've outdone themselves. Here's John talking about how both Meryl Streep and Paul Rudd got involved.

John Hoffman (13:08)

Oh yeah, that was the greatest. Well, both are personal and Paul has been a good friend of Marty's for many years. Paul also has been a good friend of Selena's for many years, worked with her and made a film with her and adores her. And so we were set up nicely as a friendly environment for someone like Paul Rudd to come join us. However, schedules were very challenging. The third level in that is that Paul will tell you he has since childhood, like, utterly revered Steve Martin and that he genuinely sort of like holds Marty and Steve on a Mount Rushmore of comedy for himself and has all his life. So there was a, there was an invitation that was appealing for him for sure, but the actual logistics were challenging. So at the end of season two, we knew we needed an actor and hopefully someone famous who could fit into the world of our show to play Ben Glenroy. And Paul was number one for us and we reached out. We were in that vague place of waiting for agents to talk. Then lo and behold, we were at the Pickle Diner one night at around 9:30 at night shooting. And I said, marty, just do me a favor, just do me a favor right now and just text Paul. Just say anything you want to say, but maybe just check in and say, is it possible that you're joining? And he didn't. We were all hovering around his phone as he texted, then waiting. And then it was literally like just a few minutes later. And blink up came Paul, like, I'm so excited. And we were. We all kind of like let out a scream in the pickle diner at 9:30 at night, thinking, oh, my God, he really knows about it. And, you know, he wants to do it. Because the challenge there was you needed an actor to come and do a small bit for the end of our season two, then hang in wait. Yeah. For six months. Six to eight months before we're shooting again and commit to what we do with all of our victims, which is delve deeply into them throughout the season. And so to ask a major movie star like Paul Rudd to say, come do this little thing for one day with us now and then hang out and wait and say, you'll. You'll clear your deck for us enough that we can shoot you all for season two was a huge ask. And. And he jumped at it, so it was thrilling. And then shortly after that, like a month after we wrapped shooting, Steve Martin and Marty Short got a message from Meryl saying she'd love to have a zoom with them. She missed Steve. She knows both of them, but she said, I would love to work with you on something. We have to find something to do. So we heard that Steve and Marty called up and said this happened. I'm like, what? When is the zoom in?

Ryan Tillotson (16:15)

Two days.

John Hoffman (16:15)

Oh, okay. And what are you going to say to her? Do you want to do a movie? Do you think she has a movie? Do you think? Well, I. I mean, I think we're doing a television show, so maybe she wants to do. I'm like, okay, weirdly, weirdly. About a week before that, a week I was with Dan Fogelman and Jess Rosenthal, having first Glimmer talks about season three as producers, but positing some notions about what I was just telling you about leaning into Oliver Putnam's story and the theater and everything else. And we all felt like there was great potential to have a lovely romantic story for Oliver, which we'd never done before. So we started crafting this character, this leading actress in his play, who would be of an age, but who had never gotten a shot. And the one person who gives her the shot is Oliver Putnam.

Ryan Tillotson (17:21)

Where have you been?

John Hoffman (17:28)

I said, where have you been? And he puts himself on the line and then start falls in love with this one woman. And as we were talking about it, I Said to Dan, I said, well, you know who. Like, the perfect person to play the person who's never gotten a lucky break. Like the Sliding Doors version of Meryl Streep, basically. I says, meryl? And he's like, yes, John, that's. That would be lovely. That would not be. So a week later. A week later, when she called and. And Steve and Marty, I said, hey, this happened. I don't know what's gonna happen. And Dan was gonna be like, john, it's never gonna happen. That's very exciting. Lovely here. It's never gonna happen. And then I'll never forget the text I got after the Zoom that Steve and Marty had with Meryl, where they said, you know, we're doing this show. And before they said anything more, she said, I'm in. Because she was a fan of the show. And she. And so she said, but feel no obligation. You don't have to make this work. If it doesn't work, it's fine. But if. If it could work, I'd be in. And so we got this tech. I got this text from Stephen, Marty, that morning. She's in. And I was like, what? And I texted Dan, I said, so this is the text I just got from Marty and Steve. And he said, it's still never going to happen, but that's crazy. So then it was about negotiating and figuring out how the hell that we could make that happen. And there were many challenges. He's not wrong. There were many challenges to seeing our way clear, to making that happen. But, boy, it's the beauty also, of when the actors want to do it. It makes a big difference to the help of negotiation and everything else. So it's a miracle for me. And then there were incredible, incredible moments of utter synergy and fate. It felt like fate in many ways. The first Zoom I had with Meryl Streep, I was to walk her through her season and the character she was going to play. And so the whole opening of episode one, I pitched her because I said, your character opens our season. And we follow your character's history from a little girl at the age of 10, where you're seeing your first Broadway show, You're a little girl from St. Louis, and you're watching a production of no Strings starring Diane Carroll. And before I got any further, Meryl, on the Zoom went, I saw that production.

Ryan Tillotson (20:11)

What?

John Hoffman (20:13)

And it was not a huge success. It was a successful show, but not. There's so few that could say they saw it.

Maggie Bowles (20:20)

Wow.

John Hoffman (20:20)

And I was like, no, no, you didn't she said, I must have been around 10. Oh, my God. I did my own math on that one. But yes. So. But I said yes. And she said. And I insisted my mother take me. And I'll never forget it because Diane Carroll was in it. She sang this beautiful song and she started to sing the sweetest sounds. And I had to, like, I was dizzy. I was gonna pass out. And he said, okay, you've gotta stop singing because this is so preposterous. Meryl, because I am going to send you our script for episode one. And on page one of that script are the lyrics you just sang for the sweetest sounds because the song is the thing that ushers us right into your. And she was. We were all kind of rare. So that fate seemed to be running through.

Daniel Ferreira (21:16)

I got chills.

Ryan Tillotson (21:17)

Yeah, I got chills hearing that story.

John Hoffman (21:19)

Wow. I know.

Daniel Ferreira (21:20)

That's amazing.

John Hoffman (21:22)

Yeah, it all gets very emotional for me because it seems preposterous, but it was really like. And the connection she found to the character was constantly moving to me because we talked about actors and we talked about friends. We. We all have that. We watch brilliant people who have spent their life being brilliant and being better and. And getting better and doing amazing work who the larger public may not even know by name and never really got the break that could have made them big. And so it felt like an opportunity for our. Arguably, not for me, but the greatest actress living today to honor anyone who hasn't had a break by sort of being that artist she was right from the very beginning, and the version of herself that might have taken a different turn had nothing happened for her. So that was incredible. And off we went. Yeah.

Maggie Bowles (22:38)

We're gonna take a quick break. When we come back, Paul Rudd embarrasses himself in front of 21 time Academy Award nominee Meryl Streep and maybe a clue in Mabel's apartment.

Ryan Tillotson (22:59)

Welcome back. We're talking to John Hoffman, showrunner, co creator, producer, and the director of season three, episode one. When Ben comes back from the dead, he's seen the light and he tries to make amends. Here's a clip.

Actor (Ben Glenroy) (23:12)

Kimber, I'm so sorry I made everything messy between us. I fucked up, but I'm gonna make it right. Ty, forgive me, please, for getting so mad at you for wanting to use my trainer. Hutch is my secret weapon. And, you know, there's no shot you can afford him, but I suppose I could give you his digits.

Ryan Tillotson (23:39)

Jonathan, Everyone hates Ben. It seems like at first, you know, he kind of goes through and apologizes after he comes back from the dead.

Daniel Ferreira (23:47)

But yeah, he apologizes in the most douchey way possible

Ryan Tillotson (23:53)

and you're like, oh, well, everyone hates him.

John Hoffman (23:54)

I know. That was a blast to shoot. And I will say Paul Rudd, that was that first day I was mentioning when he returns to the party. That day of shooting was Paul's first day on the set, I think, oh, wow. And he had to literally run the room and he had a cast of characters. He had to remember everyone's character name as he looked at them. And we were doing almost a oner, so the camera was just following him in a circle. We had a whole built up choreography to the way we were shooting that included him having a moment, his first moment with Meryl that he'd ever had.

Actor (Ben Glenroy) (24:35)

And Loretta, the consummate professional.

Ryan Tillotson (24:43)

But

Actor (Ben Glenroy) (24:45)

Cobro knows a fellow snake when he sees one.

Daniel Ferreira (24:55)

Oh, my God, I love that. Being their first. His first moment with Mel Stream.

John Hoffman (25:01)

Right. I, I think he'll be okay with me telling you this. It might have been told before, I don't know. But Paul, that night, we were so blown away by him and everyone in that room just watching him do that scene, just delightful. And to direct it and to talk with him about it and to sort of watch him create that. I wrote him that night a text after shooting and I said, I just want you to know you have been just the talk of everybody for what you did in that room today. I said, we were all kind of bowled over. And that went from everybody. And he wrote back, oh, my God, I'm so happy to receive this text because I, I, it's all kind of a blur to me. Oh, well, I kind of don't remember doing any of it. And what I focused on is because I knew how he felt about Meryl and, and he kind of couldn't believe he was going to be working with her. So I knew that. But he said, all I've been focused on is when I left set just about an hour ago, I said goodbye to Meryl and I kissed her on each cheek like I was French or something. And he was driving home and he was like, oh, my God, I'm such an. Why did I kiss her on each cheek? Like, like I'm like European, like bon vivant. I'm like, no. What? It's so that was.

Ryan Tillotson (26:49)

I love that. I love that. And I love that he was beating himself up about it afterwards.

Daniel Ferreira (26:54)

Yeah, I identify

John Hoffman (26:58)

totally. And I get. Of course, when you're with Meryl Streep, you'll fumble a Little bit. And then you'll kiss her on each cheek as though, like. And maybe her hand, you know, I don't know.

Daniel Ferreira (27:07)

Yeah, A bow and a curtsy and

John Hoffman (27:09)

then walk away going, what am I doing? That's great. Okay.

Ryan Tillotson (27:14)

That's great.

Maggie Bowles (27:15)

As is tradition for this podcast, we do have a clue for you that we stumbled upon in our conversation with John. But first, he had this to share

John Hoffman (27:23)

regarding the strike, because I'm so happy to be here, and I think it's really important, more than anything in this moment to reiterate that I stand in full solidarity with both SAG and the WGA and the importance of fairness and respect and the wish for a quicker resolve than we've had as of yet. Because this entire season, it could not be more clear the value of all of the people in. In both of those unions and beyond, IATSE included, and the DGA as well. But it is. It is such an ensemble collaboration. So many talented and gifted, both talented and gifted. I guess it's the same thing. But the people I love who are. Have helped create this show. This pause is necessary, but it's also hoped that we can move beyond it. I speak on behalf of those people who created this show with me, and. And I speak in pure solidarity for the cause of. Of what's being fought for right now.

Daniel Ferreira (28:46)

Awesome.

Maggie Bowles (28:46)

We're with you.

Ryan Tillotson (28:47)

Yeah. Thank you. Thank you for that.

John Hoffman (28:50)

Thank you

Maggie Bowles (28:52)

now for the clue.

Ryan Tillotson (28:54)

Now, John didn't call this a clue, per se, but we feel like there must be something here.

Daniel Ferreira (29:01)

We see that Mabel has finally finished renovating the apartment, which has been pretty long time coming, and it's, like, very clean and it's very chic and. And modern, which kind of surprised me. I guess I was expecting a little more funk, maybe with more industrial. Yeah, yeah. But then it also kind of checked out a lot, too, because I think that's what she would know would sell in that. In the Arconia, you know? So it. I thought that was really, really well done, but that means she has to move out of the Arconia. Are we gonna learn where she's going to go, or can you talk about that at all?

John Hoffman (29:45)

I can't talk about that yet.

Daniel Ferreira (29:47)

Okay.

Ryan Tillotson (29:48)

All right.

John Hoffman (29:49)

But that is. That is. It's one of the driving forces for her throughout the season. And you're 100% right. We had big talks with our production team about what that apartment should look like and what's inspiring her to make it that way. And sort of. We very much wanted also to sort of feel a Familiarity and a nostalgia for the broken down, you know, holes in the wall place that we've gotten used to her living in, which was also kind of elegant in its own way. And then to sort of have her be. What's pushing her is her surroundings in some ways, like to make her look a little bit not quite comfortable in this space. It's not a place where she feels like she's at home. It's a home for a young family that might move in, which sort of where we're going. So in order to do her brief, to fulfill her aunt's brief on this apartment, that's what we will learn, is that she. She has done the best she can to make something very appealing for sort of a more neutral palette of simple, modern, contemporary elegance. So she's done really well that way, I think, with the apartment, but it's not Mabel Mora. So to have her in that apartment throughout this season felt right for where she was going emotionally as a character, but really fun to design those spaces. You know, it was like, boy, that was really, like, fun. But also, I didn't want it to go too bland and be obvious that way. I wanted to be elegant and have imagine people like, boy, that would be fabulous to live in that. It was. It's beautiful and elegant in a way that I think shows her talent. Wait, there was another question in there, though. Am I blanking on it?

Daniel Ferreira (31:58)

I was just wondering where she's gonna go. Yeah, but I'm assuming we can't know that yet.

John Hoffman (32:03)

Yeah, I can't tell you.

Daniel Ferreira (32:05)

Oh, yeah, yeah.

Ryan Tillotson (32:06)

Especially not for episode one.

Daniel Ferreira (32:07)

Yeah, yeah, yeah, I guess so. Yes, it's episode one plus, I guess.

Ryan Tillotson (32:13)

Yeah, yeah, yeah. Okay.

John Hoffman (32:15)

Exact.

Elizabeth Keener (32:21)

Foreign.

Ryan Tillotson (32:31)

Here's a quick message from Keener.

Elizabeth Keener (32:33)

Hi, everyone. This is Elizabeth Keener here and your host of Only Murders in the Building podcast. But unfortunately, I'm letting you guys know, all the fans of the show, all the fans of KK and myself, all the fans of Straw Hut media, want to tell you, sadly, I cannot host the show right now because of the SAG AFTRA strike, and I am just not allowed. I'll get slapped on the wrist, slapped on the hand, slapped on the buttocks. I don't know where I'll get slapped, but I'll get slapped, and I don't want to because it's solidarity. And, you know, we got to keep going with the strike until it's done. But I thank you. I thank you all. Please keep listening. Ryan and Maggie are doing an excellent job. Please listen. The show is amazing this year, I know it. And and we'll be back out soon and unfortunately I just want to let you know KK can't make it because he was murdered in the study with a candlestick. So that's that.

John Hoffman (33:39)

Foreign

Maggie Bowles (33:43)

thanks for listening to Season three Episode one of Only Murders in the Pod. Our inbox is open again, so please send over your thoughts and your theories to only murders strawhutmedia.com and we'll be sharing them throughout the season. We'd love to get some voice memos too, so please send those in. Also, if you want to send a message to KK or Keener, tell them how much you miss them, how much you love them, how much better of

Ryan Tillotson (34:07)

host they are, you can send it

Maggie Bowles (34:09)

there too and they'll see it. If you're enjoying the show, please please, please leave us a rating and review. Share it with your friends. It really helps. If you want to know more about the strike with WGA and sag, we recommend listening to the Deadline Strike Talk podcast. We'll link it in the show.

Ryan Tillotson (34:23)

Notes Only Murders in the Pod is a production of Straw Hut Media. This episode was written, edited and hosted by Maggie Bowles and Ryan Tillotson, with additional editing and sound mixing by Daniel Ferreira. Motion graphics for promotional materials are by Ali Ahmed with graphic design by Mohamed Samir. Our associate producer is Steven Markley. Original music by Kyle Merritt and Only Murders Theme music by Siddhartha Khosla. Big, big thanks to John Hoffman, Javier Salas, Emily Leets, Yasmin Azarakish, Lydia McMahon, Cindy Neighbor, and the rest of the Hulu team. And thanks to Keener and kk. We wish you were with us this season.

Maggie Bowles (35:00)

We miss you.

Ryan Tillotson (35:05)

Welcome back. Nope, that was weird. Okay, well, welcome back. Welcome back.