S4 E3: Two for the Road (Part 2)

Summary

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Only Murders in the Building Official Podcast

Season 4, Episode 3: "Two for the Road (Part 2)"

Release Date: September 13, 2024
Host: Michael Cyril Creighton (Howard), with Ryan Tillotson & Maggie Bowles
Guests: Richard Kind ("Stink Eye Joe"/Vince Fish), John Hoffman (co-creator & showrunner), Kristen Newman (writer), Eva Longoria (cast)

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Episode Overview

This episode dives deep into the making of "Two for the Road," the third episode of Season 4, by blending behind-the-scenes insights with playful banter. Hosts Ryan and Maggie guide conversations with actor Richard Kind and showrunner John Hoffman, exploring casting choices, on-set stories, comedic influences, and the creative process behind character moments and clues. Fan theories and subreddit highlights round out an episode that's both revelatory and celebratory of the series' signature blend of mystery and comedy.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Forgetfulness & the Actor’s Experience

[01:47–04:12]

• Richard Kind explains why actors often sincerely forget details about projects they've shot months prior:
  • “You memorize it for the test. If you're watching the show, it impacts you much differently than if you memorize three pages of a script and act it out. ...And the minute it's over, we forget it. We simply forget it.” [01:49–02:20]
• He shares a hilarious anecdote about discovering himself in an old clip he'd completely forgotten filming, pondering whether it’s memory loss or just the relentless nature of an actor’s resume.

2. Getting Cast as Stink Eye Joe / Vince Fish

[03:19–05:01]

• Kind retells how he was approached for the role by executive producer Dan Fogelman—admitting skepticism based on being given empty promises in the past:
  • “When a producer comes up and says, we're writing something for you...it's the biggest crock of bull in the world. I wish I had a dollar for every promise of, oh, we're thinking of you.” [03:23–03:38]
• Only after he finished a day on set did he believe the role was truly his.

3. One-Man Show Opinions & Connection to John Hoffman

[05:12–06:50]

• Kind voices distaste for one-man shows, describing them as "masturbatory," while lauding Hoffman's exceptional "Northern Lights."
• Tells a story of writing Hoffman a heartfelt note after seeing the show, which Hoffman remembered years later.

4. Comedy Legends on Set

[07:16–12:19]

• Richard reflects on his history with Martin Short (worked together in "Clifford" and Second City improv) and shares awe at performing with Steve Martin and Eugene Levy.
• He highlights a profound moment realizing he was “making cinema history” by being the ‘straight man’ in a scene with these legends.
  • “I'm standing there watching Eugene, watching Steve Martin... I look like this, and Google, look at Steve Martin. You're acting with... Who would have ever thought that this would be your blessing in life?” [12:13–12:19]
• Favorite memory: Steve Martin did a callback to his ‘80s persona (a “Dr. Farar” delivery from "The Man with Two Brains"), and Kind nearly broke character with laughter.
  • "He did that, which he hasn't done in years and years and years." [13:21–13:43]

5. Off-Screen Camaraderie

[09:39–10:44]

• Kind shares a quiet but memorable validation: Steve Martin inviting him, out of 150 guests, into an intimate green room for a documentary screening.
  • “That’s when it resonated, not when he said, oh, nice job... out of 150 people, I'm one of six people.” [10:26–10:44]

6. Scene-Specific Insights — The Eye Patch Scene

[10:52–14:35]

• Kind describes keeping a straight face as Steve Martin and Eugene Levy worked their comic magic in the scene where they try to remove his eye patch.
• He consciously leaned into a Steve Martin-like delivery as an homage, testing if Martin noticed—"I consciously did it as an homage to him. Whether or not it comes off that way, I don't care...” [16:09–16:16]

7. Hollywood Trio Casting & Meta Comedy

[17:10–18:57]
John Hoffman discusses the complex task of casting the Hollywood "doubles" (Eva Longoria, Zach Galifianakis, Eugene Levy) for the main trio:

• “We made up lists basically for each one...personality types, all of it. We just made crazy lists. And then when we got down to it...having characters that could reflect and ask questions and be annoyed...”
• Eva Longoria was cast to play on the show’s running intergenerational jokes.
• The chemistry between Zach Galifianakis and Martin Short is highlighted by their shared absurdist comedic legacy ("Jiminy Glick" and "Between Two Ferns").

8. Fan-Favorite Side Characters: "Christmas all the Time Guy"

[20:36–24:03]

• Kristen Newman reveals the idea behind casting Kumail Nanjiani as the "Christmas all the Time Guy": subverting expectations with a young, fit guy who seems potentially creepier than the usual eccentric neighbor.
  • “You went on a date with some guy from Tinder, and he brought you home, and then you saw Christmas all the Time. That’d be so scary.”
• Newman doubles down: “That’s a serial killer. There’s just no other reaction.”
• John Hoffman reflects on how we project assumptions on our neighbors, rooted in his own voyeuristic curiosity: “Just the idea of, like, how we all do this, right? …Like, have you seen eyebrow lady?”

9. Easter Eggs, Clues & Meta Layering

[24:30–26:16]

• The hosts and Hoffman tease out the significance of the episode's "Perfect Strangers" montage, the recurring "ham radio" and "Dudenoff" clues, and confirm that even seemingly random details might have meaning.
  • “Some bear out to be essential clues. Some bear out to be emotional clues. …They all have grades of importance.” [25:39–26:04]
• They speculate about the identity of the mysterious voice on the ham radio; hosts’ theory: it could be Tina Fey's character, Cinda Canning. [26:32–26:53]

10. Fan Theories from Listeners & Reddit

[27:10–31:29]

• Listener submissions include:
  • The possibility of a "Jon Hamm" cameo (ham radio, ham theme).
  • A theory that Saz is the one living in the empty apartment, possibly tied to a cold case.
  • Subreddit user musing that Dudenoff could be a fake name the Westies use for squatting, or possibly a radio station clue: "F.M. Dudenoff."
  • Discussion of the blood message Saz wrote, potentially alluding to a bug/tap in Charles’ apartment.

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• “I have enjoyed you over the years. You’ve made me laugh.” — Steve Martin to Richard Kind [09:39]
• “I'm standing there watching Eugene, watching Steve Martin...Look where the hell you are. Who would have ever thought that this would be your blessing in life?” — Richard Kind [12:13]
• “I consciously did it as an homage to him. Whether or not it comes off that way, I don't care.” — Richard Kind on channeling Steve Martin’s delivery [16:09]
• “That’s a serial killer. There’s just no other reaction as a woman...” — Kristen Newman, on Kumail’s "Christmas all the Time Guy" [21:13]
• “The whole world has gone out of control as suddenly... that feels like it’s turned beautiful until it turns again, you know?” — John Hoffman, on tonal shifts and surprises [24:13]
• “Some bear out to be essential clues. Some bear out to be emotional clues...” — John Hoffman, on clues’ importance [25:39]
• “I wish we could have created a behind the scenes of this season because just the green room talk and chatter was both hysterically funny more than ever, but also really sweet.” — John Hoffman [18:57]
• “You are pretending that you don’t know. Today I know...I don't remember them.” — Richard Kind, on identifying with actors’ forgetfulness after long careers [32:43]

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Important Timestamps

• 01:49 – Richard Kind on why actors forget details
• 03:23 – How Kind was cast as Vince Fish
• 05:12 – His critique of one-man shows & praise for John Hoffman’s "Northern Lights"
• 07:16 – Working with Marty (Martin Short), "Clifford," and Second City
• 09:39 – Steve Martin’s compliment & green room story
• 10:52–14:35 – Filming the eye patch scene with Martin and Levy; laughs, homages, and straight-man discipline
• 17:10 – John Hoffman on casting the Hollywood trio (Eva, Zach, Eugene)
• 20:36–24:03 – The Christmas all the Time Guy & writer’s POV on neighborly suspicion
• 24:30 – The importance of clues, "Perfect Strangers," and the ham radio cliffhanger
• 27:10–31:29 – Reddit fan theory session & community shoutouts

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Tone & Style

The episode is playful, self-aware, and tinged with both reverence and cheerful irreverence for the icons and tropes of comedy and mystery TV. Richard Kind’s anecdotes are both sincere and self-deprecating; John Hoffman brings transparency to the creative process; the hosts interject with genuine fan enthusiasm and conspiracy-theory energy, making this a joyfully nerdy deconstruction of fan culture as much as a behind-the-scenes exposé.

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For Listeners Who Haven’t Tuned In

This episode is a treat for fans who savor the details behind ensemble comedy, casting surprises, and the mysterious texture of the Arconia. It’s loaded with funny and honest perspectives from a cast member thrust among his heroes, creative insight from the showrunner, and plenty of speculation from the fan community—offering both clarity and new layers to Season 4’s ongoing whodunit.

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Transcript

[Narrator/Host Intro]

Straw Hut Media.

[Richard Kind]

I'm looking at him going, steve Martin from the 80s. You got him right in your face. So I remember that distinctly.

[Ryan Tillotson]

Hello, and welcome back to the Only Murders in the Building podcast. I'm Ryan Tillotson.

[Maggie Bowles]

And I'm Maggie Bowles. And we are looking behind the scenes, mining for clues as we meet the cast and creators of the Hulu original series, Only Murders in the Building.

[Ryan Tillotson]

Today on the show, we are continuing our conversations all about season four episode, Episode three, Two for the Road, formerly

[Maggie Bowles]

known as Star Wars, Episode two, Attack of the Clones.

[Ryan Tillotson]

If you haven't seen Episode three or you haven't listened to part one of this week's podcast, go do both those

[Maggie Bowles]

things first, because today we are talking to Richard Kind, who plays Stink Eyed Joe or Vince Fish, all about acting alongside comedy legends and what he does and doesn't remember about being on set a lot, apparently.

[Ryan Tillotson]

We'll also talk more with John Hoffman, co creator, showrunner, about casting Eva Longoria, Zach Galifianakis and Eugene Levy and the different types of clues in the show.

[Maggie Bowles]

Let's start, though, with Richard Kind. Sometimes when we talk to actors, we ask them about certain scenes or lines or bits and they say, I don't remember or I have no idea. And I suppose usually we're talking to them like six months or so after they've actually filmed the thing. So are they playing dumb or what do you think?

[Ryan Tillotson]

Sometimes I feel like it's too broad of a question and you need to have like a specific thing because as soon as it's become specific and then they're like, it triggers something in their brain and they can think of a million examples on set, you know, that's a good point.

[Maggie Bowles]

Richard Kind give us his own explanation.

[Richard Kind]

Yeah, it's sort of like, have you ever taken art history? Sure, yeah, in college, you know, you know art history, you know the dates of the paintings, you know who painted it, you know the effect it had. And the minute you take the exam, you completely forget who painted it and what year it came out. You just forget. But you memorize it for the test. If you're watching the show, it impacts you much differently than if you memorize three pages of a script and act it out. I have no idea what happened. And the minute it's over, we forget it. We simply forget it. I was, what do you call it, youtubing something and got sent this clip of Corbin Bernson fighting. Oh, an actress that I knew. He was in a boxing match with her. I click on and I'm in the clip and I'm the ring announcer. I don't remember. I was in the ring and I don't remember. Wow. Now, am I going through memory loss or I just do not remember?

[Ryan Tillotson]

No, there's. You've been in so many things, and

[Richard Kind]

I've been in so many things. People mention about the name of a movie, and I'm going, I don't know what that is. It doesn't even sound familiar. Let's see if I remember or can tell you anything.

[Maggie Bowles]

Yeah.

[Ryan Tillotson]

Okay. Well, let's start with how did you get involved in the show?

[Richard Kind]

Yes, I am friends with. It's. Dan Fogelman is the executive producer of this. When a producer comes up and says, we're writing something for you or we have you in mind for something, it's the biggest crock of bull in the world. I wish I had a dollar for every promise of, oh, we're thinking of you. Oh, I would be wealthier than the amount of money that I get paid from all the people who come up and say, we're thinking of you. That now I play golf with Dan. And Dan said, we're thinking of you for this character. I have been in this business long enough that when I have finished a day on set, that's the only way I know that I got the part. It's the only way.

[Ryan Tillotson]

Wow. Jaded.

[Richard Kind]

Very, very jaded when it comes to this. And he was kept telling me, we have a part. We have a part where we're thinking of you for this part. Then he goes, your agent's going to get a call. Your manager is going to get a call. And then I did. They wrote a part for me. I didn't even have to audition, and they wrote it with that in mind. And it's scary sometimes when something is written for you and you show up and it's completely different than what they envisioned. The flip side of that is it's better than they ever could have hoped for. I don't know what this was, but I didn't audition. And I showed up and I saw the first script and I go, yeah, I think. I think I have a handle on this. So I think I could intersect with it pretty well.

[Maggie Bowles]

When we've spoken to some of the writers so far this season, they say that Stink Eye Joe's name in the script was originally Richard Kind.

[Richard Kind]

That's funny. I'm going to tell you something else. I don't like One man shows. I think that they are masturbatory. I think it takes a lot more Craft to write two, three, four people in a scene talking about live theater than it is to do a one man show. John Hoffman years ago did a one man show called Northern Lights. When I tell you how superior this piece was, and I will tell you in ways that are not normally in a one man show, the story and the characters were so good that HBO did a movie, directed and I think starring, but directed by Diane Keaton. Think it's called Northern Lights. It's not good. It's not a good movie. The story is John's, but there was such an art to what he did and took you from different character to different character. I wrote him a note one time saying just what it admired. I think I might have seen him afterwards, but I'm nobody, you know, and I'm sure everybody did it. And then I wrote him a note, but he remembered the note. He remembered that I. And I might have been. I don't want to say a name, but I might have had more fame than I had when I first saw it. And therefore he paid attention to it more and was very sweet about it.

[Ryan Tillotson]

I'm curious because you say you don't like one man shows. Why did you go?

[Richard Kind]

It doesn't mean I don't see them. I don't like them. I'll go see them. I'll go see them. But I wish they had written a play. I think it's very easy to stand up there and. And just spout these words. I just. I just do.

[Ryan Tillotson]

So wait, you are. You definitely are a name. And you have been in so many things like we've talked about. Like, have you worked with any of this cast before?

[Richard Kind]

Well, I certainly worked with Marty before because Marty did a movie called Clifford and I played his father in Clifford.

[Maggie Bowles]

Fantastic.

[Richard Kind]

Well, I'll argue with you, fantastic. But it is revered. But it's ain't so fantastic.

[Maggie Bowles]

Cult classic, let's put it that way.

[Richard Kind]

And as a cult classic, it's spectacular.

[Ryan Tillotson]

I think Rob wrote a whole essay on Clifford, right? One of the writers in Murders wrote a whole essay on Clifford.

[Maggie Bowles]

Rob Terbowski.

[Richard Kind]

Oh, yeah. So very much so. For Vulture. Yeah. He's out of his mind. Yes, I know him. Okay, where else? Well, Marty, I had improvised with him quite a few times because of our relationship with Second City. Who else? Steve Martin didn't know. I did go through one thing. Okay, here's a little bit of insight. We were sitting there and we were sitting alone and I said, I have to tell you, when you first started stand up comedy before the big auditoriums. He played a place called Amazing Grace in Evanston, Illinois, while I was in college. So this was sometime between 74 and 78. And he played two on Friday and two on Saturday. And I went to all four shows, but I didn't. I've never met. I met Steve once before at a poker table for charity. In a poker event for charity. Very kind to me. But he's notoriously shy. And we had very passing complimentary things at the table. Wow, what a pleasure. But I can't say I met him. But I will tell you how I knew he liked me. Okay. We used to. In between, while they're setting up different lighting stuff and everything. And it takes about 20 minutes to 40 minutes. So you go to the green room or the sitting room where we would sit, and we would sit and talk. So one time we're in there, and it was. I think the scene was just me and Eugene Levy and Steve. Eugene had already left and gone to the. To the set. And I'm fiddling around and I'm putting my phone down, and Steve is doing something, and he says to me, I have enjoyed you over the years. You've made me laugh. Okay, that's great. He could say that to anyone.

[Maggie Bowles]

Okay.

[Richard Kind]

I don't think he was lying, but you go, oh, that's so nice of you. But a kind man. Three nights later, his documentary. The documentary about him was having a screening at a. At a screening room for about 150 people. I have been invited to it, and I go there. I walk in, I'm standing at the bar. There's about 150 people around. And the person who has been taking names goes, excuse me, Mr. Kind. And I'm standing there getting a drink. Mr. Martin is in the green room. He wanted to know if you'd like to join him in there. There were only six people there, and I was one of them. He likes me. That's how I knew he liked me.

[Ryan Tillotson]

He does like you.

[Richard Kind]

That's when it resonated, not when he said, oh, nice job. Anybody can say nice job, but out of 150 people, I'm one of six people. It's the filmmaker, I think, John, Marty. I think Marty was there. Somebody else.

[Ryan Tillotson]

And me, I love that little secret club you guys have.

[Richard Kind]

I know. Well, for that night, for 20 minutes, yes, it was a secret club, and I was better than everybody else.

[Ryan Tillotson]

Sure were. Okay, well, speaking of Steve and Eugene, in episode three, I'm going to get specific now. There is a great, great scene where they Are trying to get your eye patch off.

[Richard Kind]

I know.

[Ryan Tillotson]

Can you tell us about that scene? Can you tell us about shooting that scene? What do you remember?

[Steve Martin (voice or referenced)]

Wait, wait, wait. I get it, I get it. You've tried everything on the market. But you will change your tune when you. When you hear my friend's tale, my tail. The tale you told me last week at. At the Impression. Oh, oh, yes. And well, my tale is simple. My. My cousin is an ophthalmologist. Dr. Savage.

[John Hoffman]

Salazar Savage.

[Steve Martin (voice or referenced)]

Yes.

[Richard Kind]

And Eugene is also a hero of mine, especially through Second City, certainly through all of the Chris Guest movies. I'm standing there watching Eugene, watching Steve Martin, looking at him. What are you saying? Looking at him. What are you saying? Of course I'm like, what. What the hell are you people speak. Talking about? But this is what's going on in my head. I look like this. And Google, look at Steve Martin. You're acting with.

[Maggie Bowles]

Look at.

[Richard Kind]

Look where the hell you are. Who would have ever thought that this would be your blessing in life?

[John Hoffman]

Can you imagine?

[Richard Kind]

Imagine history. I made cinema history. I'm acting with Eugene Levy and Steve Martin. And here's something else. I'm the straight man in the scene. Do your job. Don't try and get a laugh. It's not your place to get a laugh. It's your place to be there so that they can get laughs. Something else about that scene. Steve Martin did a movie. I think it's the man with two brains. His name is Dr. Farar. Do you remember that? You remember that name? Dr. Farah. Okay. He has to. In trying to pull points from the air, he has to make up a medicine or where he got it. And he said the Dr. Farah, something like that. And he had to do it. He. He went back into his. I don't want to say bag of tricks, but something that he did once that was so of its time in the 80s that I was so impacted by, and he did that, which he hasn't done in years and years and years. He hasn't done it since then and he did it. And I'm right there and I am a giggler. And I can laugh. Somebody makes me laugh. I am not good at suppressing it. And he did it. And damned if I didn't laugh. I did not laugh. I kept it. I'm looking. And of course I'm looking at him going, Steve Martin from the 80s. You got him right in your face. So I remember that distinctly. Distinctly. That was wonderful.

[Maggie Bowles]

Salazar Savage, right?

[Richard Kind]

Yeah, yeah. Dr. Sabha Salabar. That's what it is. Doctor. Dr. Salabar. Whatever it is. And it sees. It made me laugh and. And I didn't laugh, but it just almost made me cry because I. It was there, there.

[Ryan Tillotson]

After the break, Richard Kyne tells us about an homage to Steve Martin in episode three.

[Maggie Bowles]

And John Hoffman tells us about Stink Eye Joe's neighbor, Christmas all the Time Guy, and the process of casting the trio's Hollywood doubles. Welcome back. We are talking to Richard Kine about the scene in episode three where Eugene Levy and Charles are trying to see what's behind Stink Eye Joe's eyepatch. Chaos ensues. But by the end of the episode, Charles and Mince are pals. And Eugene then.

[Ryan Tillotson]

It's a very funny scene.

[Richard Kind]

He did something. I don't know whether or not he's sort of conscious of this or he's not conscious in it. I did a very Steve Martinez delivery. Something about where he says, I'm lonely. And I go, I'm lonely, too.

[Maggie Bowles]

I'm awkward.

[Richard Kind]

I'm awkward, too. That was very Steve Martin. And during one take, he became Steve Martin and did it like that. And I'm wondering if he thought to himself, this is Richard's wait to get a laugh. I'm not going to. And he didn't do it after that. That's how I interpret it. Or maybe he didn't think it was funny or that it didn't fit. But I remember going, I'm awkward, too, like that. Which is a. This figure is very Steve Martinesque.

[Maggie Bowles]

Yeah, it definitely is.

[Richard Kind]

Yeah.

[Maggie Bowles]

So I love that.

[Richard Kind]

That's something that he was very kind about. And I. I consciously did it as an homage to him. Whether or not it comes off that way, I don't care. I don't care whether people recognize it or not. But I know that I was influenced by how he used to do his delivery.

[Maggie Bowles]

So, yeah, I love that it was

[Ryan Tillotson]

a beautiful moment when you guys finally hugged.

[Richard Kind]

And we hug and we hug.

[Maggie Bowles]

Yeah. The bond.

[Richard Kind]

Whenever I see you through the window, you always look away.

[Steve Martin (voice or referenced)]

No, I'm just awkward.

[Richard Kind]

I'm awkward, too.

[Steve Martin (voice or referenced)]

You're awkward?

[Richard Kind]

I'm very awkward, yes. Oh, man.

[John Hoffman]

Ah, Charles.

[Richard Kind]

Yeah, Eugene.

[Ryan Tillotson]

We will be hearing from Richard Kind again. Don't worry, listeners. But for now, let's move over to John Hoffman and talk about the casting of the Hollywood Trio.

[John Hoffman]

Such a great process, because it, you know, you could go a lot of different ways. And we made up lists basically for each one and thought, okay, you could go younger with Mabel. You could go older. With Charlie, we age wise personality types, all of it, we just made crazy lists. And then when we got down to it and we started writing and blocking out what was happening and thinking in terms truthfully of like having characters that could reflect and ask questions and be annoyed with their characters and, like, bored by them and all those things that are like. Or just grossed out by the narcissism or like anything of that sort of nature. It started to feel, oh, we need to be more. A little bit down the pike of casting. Who makes sense for casting? And then the last decision was with Eva, who's so great, but it was more like, even though there's a big age gap between Zach and Marty, it was, you know, in one direction. So pointing out this age gap in the decision as to why and then having Eva constantly, you know, sort of relating in the younger way that she was just. She was just flawless about young. I guess it's the intergenerational jokes we've always done in the show. And so it was very much a part of that as well.

[Maggie Bowles]

We also both noticed Zach Galifianakis has like the one line about Between Two Ferns and we were noticing the Jiminy Glick Between Two Ferns kind of connection between Martin Short and Zach Galvanagus Feels.

[Ryan Tillotson]

Feels right.

[Maggie Bowles]

Felt. Felt very natural.

[Ryan Tillotson]

Feels right.

[John Hoffman]

I mean, that's where the meta goes crazy when you're sort of watching sometimes because. Yeah. And I think it's so. I wish we could have created a behind the scenes of this season because just the green room talk and chatter was both hysterically funny more than ever, but also really sweet. Like watching Zach. Zach just there was there. I don't think there's anyone that tickles him as much as Martin Short because he just was read constantly and doubled over. And Marty is hysterical. But it was very sweet to watch the two of them worked together and. And we all had like the greatest time. Eugene is gold. And I knew that Steve was wildly excited to work with Eugene again and loves him. So. And, and everything about those days, especially in episode three with Richard Kind and Eugene and Steve Martin, those were days like, you just feel like you're sitting on Mount Rushmore of comedy all the time.

[Ryan Tillotson]

Yeah. You know, we've heard in the past, like on set, Marty's always the one goofing around. Like, so was that still. Was that still the same or were there people?

[John Hoffman]

I mean, Marty is an ever present comedic force on screen, off screen. And you know, I think in truth, like, when people first come on to any show, they're all lovely professionals and respectful and stuff like that. And then it all loosened up. It was like, literally, if we only had a campfire in the center of the room around all the director chairs they were sitting in for the guest for the green room.

[Richard Kind]

I love that.

[Maggie Bowles]

While Eugene Levy and Charles work on Vince Fish, Eva Longoria and Mabel are with Christmas all the Time Guy. Kristen Newman, one of the writers, the one we spoke to for episode two, she sees a really scary side of that.

[Ryan Tillotson]

I don't know.

[Kristen Newman]

Christmas all the Time guy came up pretty early because we were like, wouldn't it be weird for that person to be, like, a single young guy? It's always. You know, it's always like, an old woman, but it was just a really muscular, hot young person just dating. And you, like, went on a date with some guy from Tinder, and he brought you home, and then you saw Christmas all the Time.

[Ryan Tillotson]

That'd be so scary.

[Kristen Newman]

That's a serial killer. There's just no other reaction as a woman being brought home to an apartment than to think, I'm definitely with the serial killer now. So that seemed like a good, spooky character trait.

[Maggie Bowles]

Yeah. I feel like there's a joke here that I can't find with, like, a red and green flag. You know what I mean?

[Kristen Newman]

Yeah.

[Maggie Bowles]

Like, it's a red flag.

[Ryan Tillotson]

It's a red.

[Maggie Bowles]

Yeah, I'll workshop it.

[Richard Kind]

I'll workshop it.

[John Hoffman]

I like that.

[Maggie Bowles]

Ugh.

[Eva Longoria]

What are you doing here? What are you doing here? Solving a murder. Ma Belle works alone, remember?

[Ryan Tillotson]

Who's there?

[John Hoffman]

Ooh.

[Richard Kind]

Do we have company?

[Eva Longoria]

Eva, I guess.

[John Hoffman]

Well, Rudy. So I was. I was intrigued by this idea because. Just the idea of, like, how we all do this, right? You look across your neighbors into the yard, and you see, like, someone's doing something weird, and you're like, what the hell is. What is that thing over there? I don't know what they. They do it every night. I don't know. Like, there was a woman. I used to live in an apartment building where I looked over and I watched her every night, and it was soothing after a while, but I thought, this is still crazy. She would sit in her window, and there was a light facing her face, and she had cold cream all over her face, and she would carefully pluck at her eyebrows every night.

[Ryan Tillotson]

Wow. She's really serious.

[John Hoffman]

This is fascinating. And. But it was, like, a ritual thing that was happening, But I was like, what is going on? So I was like, have you seen eyebrow lady? Like, I'm like that. So you you do that. We all do that.

[Ryan Tillotson]

Totally.

[Maggie Bowles]

Did.

[Ryan Tillotson]

Did that process take her like, 10 minutes or an hour? Like, I'm so curious about.

[John Hoffman]

I want to say it was about a half an hour every night. Yeah. It was kind of magnificent.

[Richard Kind]

Yeah.

[John Hoffman]

But I was like, how many? Why? Is there anything left to groom?

[Maggie Bowles]

Yeah, quickly. Are these women's eyebrow hairs growing? I know. That's the real question.

[John Hoffman]

Yeah, but. But that whole idea of contextualizing someone in that way and making assumptions felt great. Very. Only murders in the building, sort of. Who are they really? What's going on with them? And that keeps developing. So that all felt really good. Kumail just. I mean, the idea that. That just seemed weird that, you know, a great looking guy was over there amidst all the Christmas decorations. What the hell is going on? He's like. That really seemed suspicious. It seemed freakish.

[Eva Longoria]

Admit it. Christmas is all you have.

[John Hoffman]

Yeah.

[Eva Longoria]

Christmas and fitness. Fitness is clearly important to you. That is not lost on me. But mostly, you love Christmas. So when your scrooge of a neighbor tries to take away your real Christmas trees, you snapped.

[Maggie Bowles]

Eva, put the gun down.

[Eva Longoria]

And once you had Charles in your sight.

[Richard Kind]

Eva Ligoria's unhinged.

[Maggie Bowles]

That is correct.

[Eva Longoria]

You shot.

[Maggie Bowles]

I love the chemistry between all three of them in that scene when they're. She starts breaking the things and then she gets the gun and it's like, so fun. Yeah.

[John Hoffman]

Yeah. Doing everything Mabel wouldn't do. And like, this whole thing, the whole world has gone out of control as suddenly the. The mess that Oliver found himself in with Zach, that started out that way, and then all of a sudden that feels like it's turned beautiful until it turns again, you know?

[Richard Kind]

I know.

[Maggie Bowles]

Yeah. I loved the Oliver Zach Galifianakis friendly friend montage.

[Ryan Tillotson]

It felt so good.

[Maggie Bowles]

It did so, so good.

[Ryan Tillotson]

That's why it hurts so much. At the end, he's on the call with his manager,

[John Hoffman]

Perfect Strangers. That montage. And, and watching Zach Galifianakis do a bell kick with a.

[Ryan Tillotson]

Twice, I think. Did you do it twice?

[Steve Martin (voice or referenced)]

Luggage carts.

[John Hoffman]

Yeah, that was. And then Jackie Hoffman in the elevator. I don't know. The whole thing just was insane, but felt very right.

[Ryan Tillotson]

What's. What is the connection to Perfect Strangers?

[Maggie Bowles]

What?

[Ryan Tillotson]

Are you a huge fan? What's.

[John Hoffman]

No,

[Ryan Tillotson]

because the ham radio. No, but it's, you know, it was.

[John Hoffman]

Look, we were, you know, I, I there. I hesitate to say too much because it still comes around a little bit.

[Ryan Tillotson]

That's fair.

[John Hoffman]

It's fair.

[Maggie Bowles]

I understand what we can say. It's. It's not random.

[Ryan Tillotson]

We can say that perfectly.

[John Hoffman]

No, it's connected. It's connected. There's. There's always random things. I think we sort of build in random things and specific things, and sometimes they bear out to be essential clues. Some bear out to be emotional clues. Some bear out to be. Oh, that's what was going on. And then there are others that are. Feel much more like, you know, so we'll see. But they all. Yeah, yeah. They all have grades of importance.

[Maggie Bowles]

Yeah. The cliffhanger, I guess, at the end of episode three, is that voice on the ham radio with the accent?

[Narrator/Host Intro]

Yeah.

[John Hoffman]

Yeah.

[Maggie Bowles]

I don't know what my question is.

[John Hoffman]

No, I know there's a voice with an accent on the floor on the. On the ham radio and. Yes, well, that we have theories. Gosh, I hope we answer that one.

[Maggie Bowles]

Yeah, me too.

[Ryan Tillotson]

Yeah, me too.

[Maggie Bowles]

Ryan, should we tell the listeners our theory?

[Ryan Tillotson]

I. Yeah, I guess this would be the place to do it.

[Maggie Bowles]

This would be the place to do it because I feel like we've teased our theory, but we feel like we recognize the voice.

[Ryan Tillotson]

We could be wrong. We have no clue.

[Maggie Bowles]

We are almost always wrong, which is why we don't share our theories with you listeners, because we're usually wrong. We think it sounds kind of like Tina Fey.

[Ryan Tillotson]

Is Sanda Canning involved again?

[Maggie Bowles]

That's what we need to know. What do you think, listeners? Does it sound like Tina Fey? Do you think Cindy Canning's involved? Is she going to come back? Let us know. Thank you all so much for your emails, too. We got some good theories. Here are some of the things that you guys are thinking.

[Ryan Tillotson]

Anna from Florida believes there is more to the ham theme.

[Maggie Bowles]

A lot of ham.

[Ryan Tillotson]

And Patty thinks that maybe all this ham talk is pointing to a guest. Guest appearance from Jon Hamm.

[Maggie Bowles]

I love that.

[Ryan Tillotson]

Which is. So when I read that, I was like, yes, I love it.

[Maggie Bowles]

I love it. I really.

[Ryan Tillotson]

I hope it's true.

[Maggie Bowles]

We also had an interesting theory from Shauna who thinks that maybe Saz is the one renting the empty apartment and that Jan was using it as a safe house. That was her banging on the door.

[Ryan Tillotson]

Interesting.

[Maggie Bowles]

And that all that the code is oh, hell to make it easy for everybody to remember, and they all kind of use it to store stuff in it.

[Narrator/Host Intro]

Okay.

[John Hoffman]

All right.

[Maggie Bowles]

Interesting idea.

[Ryan Tillotson]

Interesting. Okay. And now here's Hannah from the only Murders subreddit.

[Narrator/Host Intro]

Hey, Maggie. Hey, Ryan. And hello to all of the pod listeners. This week gave us another great episode with new leads and new clues. And so I am back with new theories from the only Murders Subreddit R onlymurders Hulu firstly, we keep going back and forth on the topic of the intended target and this week people are back to thinking Saz could have been the real target, but with the addition of Charles potentially being in danger as well. Genespecialist4988 says from what the woman said on the radio, Saz was the target that night. As she said, the last person who was investigating got killed. That was Saz who had suspicions that somebody near Charles was out to get him. Could it be that the person in the apartment was somebody who felt wronged by Charles in the past? And maybe Saz grew suspicious because she recognized the person during one of her visits? So as you can see, people have many interrogations about what Saz knew, what was she doing, who was she investigating, and what was the sensitive issue she wanted to discuss with Charles at the end of last season. My theory so far for this season is that Saz was bringing a cold case from the past that happened in the building but was either looked over or unsolved. So she moves into the building and is staying in the empty apartment overlooking the trio while she investigates the cold case, drawing the ire of the of the killer who still lives there. We obviously all have many questions surrounding the ominous Dudenoff Ramblin. Rect says, I don't think Dudenoff is a real person, but rather a made up person all the Westies use as a way to claim that someone is squatting in that apartment so the apartment stays empty and they get it for free and can use it for leisure activities, storage, etc. And then Ottez and TM says I was just wondering about Dudenov and all this talk of radio. The apartment belongs supposedly to M. Dudanoff and the apartment letter is F F M Dudenoff or Dudenoff FM could be a radio station. Our members also love an anagram and are wondering if Dudenoff could be an anagram or an ambigram for something. So if any of you have any ideas on that, let us know on a subreddit this week we met another Westie and while Mabel and Eva Longoria seem to have written him off as a murderer, the Westies are still suspicious to our members. Practical Check 5206 says each season there are always two secrets. In the first season we had the death of Tim and the Demas grave robbing business. The second season had the savage painting and Bunny's death and the third season had Loretta's secret and Ben's murder. So I believe that the Westies have a secret of their own. People are also discussing the word Saz appears to have written in her own blood. All for believing there is a tap in Charles apartment, a bug. That's a sensitive subject Saz wanted to talk about. Perhaps she wasn't able to finish writing. Or it has a double meaning for us. This is supported by the fact that many bugs use radio frequencies and ham radios have been a recurring topic. Finally we have Cervis who my over the top theory is a Strangers on a Train kind of plot where someone in LA and someone in New York did murders for each other so they had alibis and then possibly the New York person didn't hold up their end of the bargain so is at risk from the LA killer. So while there's still no clear suspect on our end, we're analyzing all the clues and perhaps episode four will come in with new banging revelations. So I'll be back next week with more theories from the Only Murders in the Building subreddit.

[Richard Kind]

Foreign.

[Maggie Bowles]

Thanks for listening to this episode of Only Murders in the Building podcast. Please send your thoughts and theories to us at only murders strawmedia.com you can also send us a voice memo and we might play it on the show.

[Ryan Tillotson]

We love the voice memos. If you enjoyed the show, take a minute to subscribe rate, Follow us and leave us a nice review.

[Maggie Bowles]

Only Martyrs in the Building podcast is a production of Straw Hut Media hosted and produced by Maggie Bowles and Ryan Tillotson. Our associate producer, Steven Markley, with original music by Kyle Merritt and Only Murders in the Building theme music by Siddhartha Khosla. Assistant editor is Daniel Ferreira and production assistant is Caroline Mendoza.

[Ryan Tillotson]

Thank you so much to Richard Kind for talking with us this week. Thanks to Hannah over at Reddit and

[Maggie Bowles]

a big, big, big thanks as always to John Hoffman and the entire Hulu team.

[Ryan Tillotson]

See you soon.

[Maggie Bowles]

See y.

[Richard Kind]

Are we recording visually as well?

[Ryan Tillotson]

Well, Richard, we would love to be able to use little pieces for social media.

[Richard Kind]

Go ahead, if you're okay with it. Sure, I look like an idiot, but yes, let's do it. Okay. All right.

[Maggie Bowles]

I think you look great.

[Richard Kind]

Okay, good. I'll tell you an example is I was a waiter years ago. Two of my favorite shows in the world that I can tell you every little thing about it was the Mary Tyler Moore show and the Dick Van Dyke Show. I loved those two shows and what did they have in common was Mary Tyler Moore. I'm a waiter in the Hamptons, and I'm waiting tables on her, and I asked her about specific questions about the Dick Van Dyke show, about the Mary Tyler Moore show, and she said, I'm sorry, I don't remember. And I'm looking at her going, you're a horrible woman. I'm asking you these questions, and you are pretending that you don't know. Today I know you'll go through episodes of Mad about you as Spin City. I don't remember them.