S5 E4: Dirty Birds

Summary

Only Murders in the Building Official Podcast

S5 E4: Dirty Birds

Host: Michael Cyril Creighton
Guests: John Hoffman (showrunner/co-creator), Christoph Waltz (Bash Steed), Dana Covarrubias (costume designer)
Date: September 16, 2025

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Episode Overview

This episode dives behind the scenes of “Dirty Birds” (S5E4), unpacking the season’s billionaire “anti-trio” and new characters, with insights from the showrunner and standout cast. Host Michael Cyril Creighton explores casting stories, character development, and on-set dynamics with John Hoffman, wry perspectives on comedy from Christoph Waltz, and all things costuming with Dana Covarrubias. The tone is witty, fast-paced, and filled with the meta charm fans expect from Only Murders in the Building (OMITB).

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

Episode Recap and Main Plot Developments

• [01:14] New robotic doorman, Lester, is being trained by Howard after the original Lester’s demise.
• Oliver builds a murder board and enlists Vince Fish to decode bird names in Lester’s ledger.
• The trio releases a podcast teaser hoping to provoke a response from Jay—who does show up, along with Camilla and Bash.
  • The billionaire suspects all claim Nikki was high on cocaine and cut off Jay’s finger.
  • Major twist: The severed finger points the wrong way in Mabel’s photos—Jay lied.
  • The group gets a deal from Wundafy, only to learn the billionaire trio now owns Wanda5, thwarting their investigation.

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Casting, Character Origins, and Show Evolution

Michael Cyril Creighton & John Hoffman

• Howard Morris (Michael) was named as an homage to an executive producer but “became very fun to write.”

• [03:41] Origin stories of casting mix-ups:

  • “I had auditioned for a smaller part, and then Jamie [Babbitt] recommended me for Howard.” (Michael Cyril Creighton)
  • [05:12] On Michael’s audition: “You did a perfect read, and then I gave you a 180 turn suggestion—make him menacing, put a little menace in there... It was dazzling.” (John Hoffman)

• Audition fun facts: Actors often came in for one role, but were cast in another (ex: Adina auditioned for Cinda Canning; Teddy Kaluca for Teddy Demas).

Billionaire Trio Casting

• [06:09] They assembled a dream list—"Renee Zellweger, Logan Lerman, Christoph Waltz"—hoping stars would want to come play for a season.
• The show’s on-set reputation (“Steve Martin, Martin Short, Selena Gomez, Meryl Streep…”) draws in big names looking to work with legends and have “a great hang.”

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Introducing Thea and Character Archetypes

• [07:10] Beanie Feldstein’s Thea: a meta casting as Selena Gomez’s pop star childhood friend.
• [09:19] “Sunny and Cloudy” energy between Thea and Mabel; Thea is played as “joyfully condescending” (Michael), “pure joy with cutting words” (John).
  • “I really care about you because you live in such a dumpster.” (John Hoffman on writing Thea)
• The show’s formula: Characters often appear as archetypes, but gain complexity and reveal hidden vulnerabilities as the season progresses.

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Robots, Technology, and Thematic Choices

• [11:04] Lester the Robotic Doorman symbolizes the infiltration of tech into classic NY jobs.
  • “The opportunity was to sort of say, what does that [doorman] look like technologically? And, of course, it looks like a robot.” (John Hoffman)
  • [13:24] There’s a “mystery” about who voices Lester (“Do your work, Internet.”)
• [13:41] Season 5’s opera theme ties into New York culture and was foreshadowed last season by an operatic song when Lester was found dead.

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Mysteries, Money, and Power

• [15:04] “What are these billionaires really doing? Is a question that should hang over everything... And how does it tie into the murder investigation?” (John Hoffman)
• Conflicting interests: The wealthy trio now holds the keys to the podcasters' future and much more.

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Christoph Waltz (Bash Steed) on Comedy, Bash, and Joining the Show

On Joining the Cast

• [17:31] “Frankly, I have no clue. Somehow it came up, and I was, as per usual, extremely skeptical and suspicious... Why do they want me?” (Christoph Waltz)
• Watched three episodes before joining. Appreciates the show’s unusual, drop-in-friendly format.
• “You can come in, play with us for a season, and then be gone.” (Michael)
• [18:39] On adjusting to comedy: “This kind of comedy is something for comedians, I thought... I'm more at home with clearly structured drama.”

On Set Atmosphere

• [20:02] “It is an unusually relaxed, open, friendly, mutually supportive atmosphere. It is unusually so.” (Christoph Waltz)
• Departing from strict drama, he called it a “horizontal widening experience”—the format let him “cling to what I usually operate with,” but in a new, enriching way.

On the “Anti-Trio”

• [21:24] The billionaire trio aren’t united: “We're actually each doing our thing... They don’t have a common cause. They’re more of a trio because they’re working against each other… a classic clown setup.” (Christoph Waltz)
  • [22:12] Memorable moment: Bash chopping parsley with Steve Martin—it’s “one of the funniest visual moments of the season.” (Michael)
  • Waltz: “Not at all [a cook]... I dislike cooking. But Steve as a person—for me, that was the highlight.”

On Steve Martin and Set Magic

• [22:54] “To get to know [Steve]… befriend him and share... my fascination with music... He brought the banjo to set and played—I was completely overwhelmed, truly touching music.”
• [24:40] Steve Martin’s Hollywood Bowl banjo act: “A classic musical clown number... Music as comedy. Whenever someone says, ‘you just worked with Steve Martin,’ I start raving about this act.” (Christoph Waltz)
• [26:07] “They’re not little moments to me. Big moments.” (Christoph Waltz, on set camaraderie and creative sparks)

On Bash as a Character

• [27:14] “If you played it well... you don’t control finer threads of a character—they evolved. So, I stay away from talking about the characters I played. All I can say is I hope more than I am aware of right now.” (Christoph Waltz)

On Bash’s Age

• [28:13] “He’s probably 127.” (Christoph Waltz, deadpan)
• “He lost his virginity to Dorothy Parker!” (Michael)

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Costume Design: “Personality Through Style” with Dana Covarrubias

Season 5 Inspirations & Casino/Mob Motifs

• Themes include a secret casino under the Arconia and a “mob element.” Costumes blend “mobster vibes” with “casino and gambling” looks.

Dressing the Billionaires

• Bash (Christoph Waltz):

  • Inspired by Bryan Johnson, a dash of Mao, and “a little bit of Dr. Evil.”
  • Futuristic, uniform-like—no pockets, at Waltz’s suggestion: “He was like, ‘I just don’t think my character would need pockets...’” (Dana)
  • “The most efficient way of dressing that would take no time... so that would be to have a uniform.” (Dana)

• Camilla (Renee Zellweger):

  • Inspired by Martha Stewart, Peggy Lee, Ann Margret, with a vintage-retro twist.
  • Gloves: Flesh-toned and “creepy”—“They kind of look like hands, but they’re not.” (Dana)
  • Creams, pastels, and signature neck scarves. Writers later worked the glove detail into the plot.

• Jay (Logan Lerman):

  • Modeled on early Zuckerberg: cargo shorts, hoodies, “super casual... he’s so rich and so confident he doesn’t have to try.”
  • Refined for attractiveness as his romantic subplot with Mabel emerged—needed to be “not too slubby bro.”

Thea’s Pop Star Aesthetic

• [36:37] Outfits inspired by Sabrina Carpenter, Ariana Grande, bits of Britney and Madonna.
• “We wanted her to have a signature color... so she’s just like pink, pink, pink, pink. She’s very girly, bows and sparkly and strawberries... a very insane costume, very insane character.” (Dana)
• Thea is overstyled because she’s “desperately grabbing at all these different inspirations to create her own look,” reflecting her search for identity.

Mabel’s Style Evolution

• [38:04] “Now she has a bit of money and... has really embraced this role of being a podcast producer—she wants to dress the part.”
  • Blazers, pinstripes, and strong silhouettes give Mabel an updated, empowered vibe.

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Memorable Quotes and Moments

• “Make him menacing, put a little menace in there, make him suspicious... That was dazzling.”
  —John Hoffman on casting Howard (05:12)
• “The fact that they are a trio just results from the fact that there are three of them. But not because they're together... They're more trio because they're working against each other.”
  —Christoph Waltz, on the billionaire trio dynamic (21:24)
• “Steve as a person, for me was the highlight... He brought the banjo to set... and played something truly lyrical... I was completely overwhelmed.”
  —Christoph Waltz on Steve Martin (22:54–24:32)
• “If you played it well... you don’t really control finer threads of a character… I stay away from talking about the characters I played.”
  —Christoph Waltz on acting process (27:14)
• “He’s probably 127.”
  —Christoph Waltz (deadpan, on Bash’s age) (28:13)
• “For Bash, we were inspired a little bit by Bryan Johnson, but also some Mao... a little bit of Dr. Evil, maybe also in there.”
  —Dana on dressing Bash (30:22)
• “I had no idea.”
  —Michael, on Bash’s no-pocket policy (32:15)

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Important Timestamps

• 00:00–01:14: Cold open, episode summary, introduction.
• 02:53–16:04: Deep-dive with John Hoffman—casting, themes, new characters, Howard’s arc, season foreshadowing.
• 16:51–28:38: Christoph Waltz—on Bash, comedic acting, set stories, trio dynamics, Steve Martin.
• 28:57–39:01: Dana Covarrubias—costume inspirations, process with actors, differentiating billionaire styles, behind-the-scenes fitting stories, Thea and Mabel’s signature looks.
• 39:02–41:36: Playful “costume game” riffing on fashion choices for show characters.
• 41:43–end: Wrap-up, preview for next episode.

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For New and Returning Fans

This episode is a delight for fans of both the show’s mystery and its ensemble magic. The podcast abounds in behind-the-scenes stories, playful banter, and in-depth craft discussions—delivered with the irreverent, fast-talking charm that defines OMITB. Insights into how casting and character work unfolds, direct input from actors and creators, and deeply geeky costume details make this a must-listen for anyone wanting to savor episodes long after the credits roll.

Transcript

[Michael Cyril Creighton]

One of the funniest visual moments is Bash chopping parsley.

[Christoph Waltz]

Yeah, I'm glad.

[Michael Cyril Creighton]

Are you much of a cook?

[Christoph Waltz]

No, not at all.

[Michael Cyril Creighton]

Oh, hello and welcome to Hulu's Only Murders in the Building official podcast. I am your host, Michael Cyril Creighton. I play your favorite trio's fourth wheel, keeper of the building secrets, Howard Morris. We're dissecting episodes, sharing behind the scenes stories and playing games with some of the amazing, amazing actors, writers and crew from season five of Only Murders in the Building, now streaming on Hulu and Hulu on Disney.

[Christoph Waltz]

We're all here for one reason.

[Michael Cyril Creighton]

Yes.

[Christoph Waltz]

Yes. To give you the opportunity to keep us out of your podcast before we.

[Michael Cyril Creighton]

Sue you for libel. Today's show is all about episode four, Dirty Birds. We're talking to showrunner and co creator Jon Hoffman about our brand new billionaire trio. We're talking with the incomparable Christoph Walls about how ancient Bastide really is. And costume designer Dana Covarrubius joins us to talk about characters personalities through style. But first, a quick recap of episode four. So if you haven't watched, just stop and watch it, okay? I will be here when you get back.

[Dana Covarrubias]

Hello.

[Michael Cyril Creighton]

What the hell? I'm Lester. We meet the Arconia's new robotic doorman, Lester. Howard has been hired to train him upstairs. Oliver has built his own murder board and recruited Vince Fish, Lester's old birding buddy, to decode the birds names in Lester's ledger. Our trio releases their season five podcast teaser, hoping to bait Jay into responding. Then a video from Jay arrives. He's coming over at 7 to clear things up. Hey, podcasters, sounds like you have some thoughts. J shows up, then Camilla, then Bash.

[John Hoffman]

Hello.

[Michael Cyril Creighton]

All three say they're here to clear Jay's name, or at least protect their own. All three billionaires claim Nikki was high on cocaine and cut off Jay's finger in a rage. Later, the trio gets big news. Wundafy wants to sign us. WI has accepted Mabel's pitch.

[Dana Covarrubias]

This is your studio.

[Christoph Waltz]

Whoa, really?

[Michael Cyril Creighton]

Okay, yeah. They tour their fancy new studio, but when Mabel flips through her photos, she notices the severed finger points the wrong way. Which way do your pointers curve? Jay lied. Then comes the blow. The podcast executive says they can't investigate the wealthy trio because they're the new owners of Wanda 5 Tricky. We are almost halfway through the season now, so this is a perfect time to check in with our co creator and show and guardian angel, John Hoffman.

[John Hoffman]

Guardian angel. Hi, Michael.

[Michael Cyril Creighton]

Hi. Let's start with my favorite story related to the show. How did you discover me? Oh, wow.

[John Hoffman]

And I really did.

[Michael Cyril Creighton]

You did.

[John Hoffman]

I discovered you.

[Michael Cyril Creighton]

You've made my life.

[John Hoffman]

That's very kind, because you were very successful before I discovered you. So Howard Morris is aptly named after one of the executive producers of Grace and Frankie, who I. I worked with. And I thought, well, that's a nice homage. But then the character himself became very fun to write. And so every great character actor in New York came in to audition for this, and it was Jamie Babbitt who had worked with you and said, you should see Michael for this.

[Michael Cyril Creighton]

And I had actually gone in for a smaller role in the show.

[John Hoffman]

Oh, I didn't know that.

[Michael Cyril Creighton]

Oh, you didn't know this audition for Dr. Grover Stanley. But I also know this happened with a lot of actors. Right. Like, Jackie auditioned for Ursula.

[John Hoffman]

Oh, yeah, she did.

[Michael Cyril Creighton]

Teddy.

[John Hoffman]

Yeah.

[Michael Cyril Creighton]

Oh, no. Yeah. Teddy Kaluca auditioned for Teddy Demas.

[John Hoffman]

Yes, he did. And, yeah, he's great.

[Michael Cyril Creighton]

Poppy Adina auditioned for Cinda Canning. Right. Yeah. So that's funny how that happened. So I had auditioned for a smaller part, and then Jamie recommended me for Howard.

[John Hoffman]

Right, Jamie recommended you for Howard. And that's funny you say that, because it was one of those things. This opportunity with the show was just like a dream, but it was also an opportunity to work with my dream type of actor, a New York character actor. Okay, maybe not here, but we've gotta find something.

[Michael Cyril Creighton]

Right?

[John Hoffman]

And so this was Jamie suggesting that we were like, okay, great. But it was all you, kid. It was all you. It was. It was an audition process.

[Michael Cyril Creighton]

Unlike my glasses fog up because I'm getting slow.

[John Hoffman]

It really was, though. It really was. And it was. I would be remiss not to say there were incredible actors coming in to play Howard, and I loved each one of them. And it was unquestionable. When you auditioned, we had a zoom audition where I think you did a perfect read, and then I gave you almost a complete different 180 turn suggestion.

[Michael Cyril Creighton]

Yeah. You said make him menacing, put a little menace in there, make him suspicious, I think. Yeah.

[John Hoffman]

And then you did a subsequent perfect and hilarious read. But it was again, just one of those things. Like, that was dazzling. And then it was settled. And no question. And then we gotta bring him into the fold as much as possible.

[Michael Cyril Creighton]

This is my favorite story. As I said, we're almost halfway through the season and we're talking a little bit about casting just now.

[John Hoffman]

Yeah.

[Michael Cyril Creighton]

We meet some new characters in this episode.

[John Hoffman]

We do.

[Michael Cyril Creighton]

They're billionaires played by three ridiculously amazing actors. So I'm noticing three of the richest people in the world are here in our little building.

[Christoph Waltz]

I'm top three. They're top 20.

[Dana Covarrubias]

Sebastian on many lists. I'm four.

[Michael Cyril Creighton]

How did you land on these three actors for. For these three characters?

[John Hoffman]

A process, as always. You make a list, and then I tend to winnow it down to, like, the dream list. And I think, well, I don't know, maybe there's a chance someone like Renee Zellweger or someone like Logan Lerman, Christoph Waltz would say, may be available and maybe just be okay with coming for a few months. This is a challenging thing to kind of cast because these are characters that move across the entire season. So it's attractive because there's enough meat on the bone for a brilliant actor, hopefully, if we can craft it right for them. But it's very much a big ask. And so that's the beauty of having Steve Martin. Martin short and Selena Gomez and Meryl Streep dropping by. And it starts to feel like a place that people want to come and have some fun and have a great hang and work with the greats.

[Michael Cyril Creighton]

We also got the great Beanie Feldstein this season.

[Dana Covarrubias]

Oh, my God. Mabel Mora.

[Michael Cyril Creighton]

What was that like creating this character of Thea, this sort of pop sensation?

[John Hoffman]

I remember the day in the writer's room that we came up with Althea. I don't know if fi was actually the name, but it was the notion that Selena Gomez. I'm gonna call it Selena Gomez, as Mabel Mora, would have a childhood friend that there was. They were very close. And then it broke off, and there was a wound there that was formed and also reverberated, I think, through Mabel's life and her resistance to finding friends her own age. But then the delight in Selena Gomez having a friend come back who's now the reigning pop star on the charts and is confronted as Mabel Mora with a pop star, Selena Gomez. It all just felt. Every now and then, we like to get a little meta. Just a little meta on the show. Just a touch. It felt like a pop star that I was wanting to see more than maybe what might be expected.

[Michael Cyril Creighton]

Yeah. And I feel like we get what you and the writers did so beautifully with thee, which we'll see maybe a little bit later in the season, is like, we often meet characters. We think we know what they're like. We thought we knew who Bunny was.

[Dana Covarrubias]

All in favor of evicting all three.

[Michael Cyril Creighton]

Members of Murder She Wrote until we realize she has a big beating heart. Don't think I've said it yet. So thank you.

[Christoph Waltz]

Aw, Bunny, you're too kind.

[Michael Cyril Creighton]

And a lot of vulnerability. Same with Uma. You know, a real friend would have cared, but Oliver only cares about his show.

[Dana Covarrubias]

I'm sorry to hear that.

[Michael Cyril Creighton]

It's tough to lose friends at our age. Same with Howard. All right, don't laugh, but I've always wanted to be a children's librarian. I'm a librarian. Shut up. That's our slogan. And now we have this new character, Thea, and there's. She's doing it like no one else. It's really, really, really great.

[John Hoffman]

Talk about, you know, there's this thing of Sunny and cloudy that Mabel and Thea have. When they were kids. They did this little thing. They were one was. And the joke, of course, is that, you know, the guys are saying, well, clearly you are Cloudy to Mabel. And Mabel says, no, no, I was Sunny. But obviously we're playing the opposites of but. But that's Beanie in my mind. She has this lit from within kind of energy. That's not false and it's not overdone. She is pure joy in the way she expresses herself. So the words she's using can be a bit like, I don't like her. But she's saying them in such a cute, funny way that and friendly and well intentioned. And I thought that was a really funny spin on a character like that.

[Michael Cyril Creighton]

That she's, like, joyfully condescending.

[John Hoffman]

Joyfully condescending and everything. I really care about you because you live in such a dumpster.

[Dana Covarrubias]

No, don't feel bad. It's so hard to get noticed when you're indie. Right.

[John Hoffman]

I've always been drawn to characters with big sort of strong thumbprints that you can recognize, and then underneath it, find particulars and details about their behavior that feel memorable.

[Michael Cyril Creighton]

Yeah. Like five episodes down the line, often a character on this show, you'll be like, oh, that's why they're like that.

[John Hoffman]

Yeah.

[Michael Cyril Creighton]

And that's nice. That's satisfying. I think that's what one of the cool things about being an actor on the show is that you never know where your character's gonna go or I never do. I think a lot of us never do. And then the writers and you guys always come through. It's never seems from nox. You know what I mean?

[John Hoffman]

Yeah.

[Michael Cyril Creighton]

Speaking of which, I get a new character to act with this episode, this season. Lester. Sorry, sorry. Lester the robot. I'm Lester. Ah, look how moved everyone is. Meet our new doorman we named him after the dead one in tribute. How did you land on adding a robot to the cast?

[John Hoffman]

Well, again, thematically is where I always go sort of across the season and what are we saying? And this infiltration of technology that, you know, is brought about, you know, in all of our lives now.

[Michael Cyril Creighton]

Yeah.

[John Hoffman]

But also, you know, through the character of Bash Steed and his AI technology work and his longevity dives and all of those things. So this felt like the Arconia is also being encroached upon by that in certain ways, as many of the buildings in New York are. We're talking about cars that are going to drive themselves. And what does that mean for the workforce of, you know, the old.

[Michael Cyril Creighton]

You can't go into, like, a drugstore without checking yourself out.

[John Hoffman]

Right.

[Michael Cyril Creighton]

Everything is too easy.

[John Hoffman]

Everything's becoming automated and all of that. And the notion of knowing that our season was gonna be built around a beloved doorman, a classic job, a classic figure in New York history and across major metropolises. I think that was what the opportunity was to sort of say, what does that look like technologically? And, of course, it looks like a robot. And then the idea of pairing our favorite person to pair with any sort of companion of any kind.

[Michael Cyril Creighton]

Dog, pig, that's not human. Yes, I'm up for it. I'm game.

[John Hoffman]

Yeah, I know. You're very game. And I thought the relationship and the admissions that could happen in the. The sort of humanization of this technology would be best sort of seen as a conduit through Howard.

[Michael Cyril Creighton]

Yeah. Well, it makes sense. Like, lonely men turn to technology. They always have, and they get wrapped up. Yeah. Get wrapped up in it.

[John Hoffman]

Yeah.

[Michael Cyril Creighton]

Well, he's a lovely addition to the cast, and I can't wait for him to win a supporting actor Emmy.

[John Hoffman]

And there's a voice in there, too, that.

[Michael Cyril Creighton]

Wait, are we allowed to say this?

[John Hoffman]

We can't say who the voice is, I don't think. But we can say that there is a nice new mystery for discerning viewers around the voice of Lester Robot. But, yeah, there might be a little mystery around who that voice is. Do your work, Internet, or who that voice belongs to.

[Michael Cyril Creighton]

Yeah. Maybe there's a big opera theme in this season, right?

[John Hoffman]

There is, yes.

[Michael Cyril Creighton]

How long has that been in your mind, the sort of idea of opera and the Arconia?

[John Hoffman]

It was teed up a little bit at the end of the previous season. Our brilliant composer, Sid Kozla, I love him. And I talked about where we were going in the next season, and it, you know, if you Listen closely. There's this gorgeous singing at the end of the previous season when Lester is discovered in the fountain. And it's this operatic voice and tone that he wrote and worked with the singer. And it's just gorgeous. That was all teeing up. The notion that Lester's wife was an opera singer and wanted to be an opera singer and loved it. It felt also deeply New York and having the Met so intrinsic to sort of the cultural sort of center of New York and an opportunity again. Each season we try to do a sort of nod, sort of culturally, artistically within the things that make New York New York.

[Michael Cyril Creighton]

Yeah. I love that. You really are thinking ahead, Pepper, in that line. It's proper. Yeah.

[Dana Covarrubias]

It's a true.

[John Hoffman]

Sometimes they line up. Sometimes they're like, oh, we don't do that thing.

[Michael Cyril Creighton]

So we're now in the middle of the season. Without giving too much away, can you let audience members know what they have to look forward to coming up in the back end of the season.

[John Hoffman]

Lots of twists, lots of. Lots of turns. And I think also determining what is at the sense of what is at the core of the mystery here. What are. What are these billionaires really doing? What are they up to? Is. Is a question that should hang over everything. And how does it tie into the murder investigation if it is going to tie into it at all?

[Michael Cyril Creighton]

Yeah.

[John Hoffman]

What is the. What is the driving force behind what they're wanting?

[Michael Cyril Creighton]

Yeah. Is money really making this world go round?

[John Hoffman]

Yeah. And how much of a game is it for them who really hold the levers to a lot of the way we're all going to be living?

[Michael Cyril Creighton]

I'm excited to watch the rest. I haven't seen them yet. It's going to be real fun. And thank you for being here. I think we're going to check in with you later in the season.

[John Hoffman]

Really?

[Michael Cyril Creighton]

Yes, I think so. And you'll probably be wearing this same exact thing. And now Michael Cyril Creighton on Howard Francis Morris. Because Jonathan, his boyfriend, is out of town and his animals have bonded, making him feel like a third wheel and he's not getting the attention he feels he deserves from the trio, Howard does what most lonely men do and turns to technology for comfort. He starts finding purpose in the form of Lester, our logic engineered secure tenant robot. My greatest challenge is my unsettling effect on humans. Well, I've seen the Terminator, so I'm on Team Machine. We also learned that Howard is a giant fee fan. There were many, many dance moves.

[John Hoffman]

Just stopping by for a drink bash.

[Christoph Waltz]

No I'm here because they're investigating you. Naturally, I've been having you followed. I knew you'd try to pin it on me.

[Michael Cyril Creighton]

Bash Steed is a special kind of billionaire. We don't know how old he really is, but it's somewhere between 65 and 172 now, because he was calling in all the way from Germany. I spoke to the man who brought Bashted to life, Christoph Waltz from my living room. I remember when John told us who was cast as the billionaires, and my jaw dropped. It's an embarrassment of riches having you and Renee and Logan on the show. I just sort of wondered, how did you get involved? How did you playing Bash come about?

[Christoph Waltz]

Frankly, I have no clue. Somehow it came up, and I was, as per usual, extremely skeptical and suspicious. That's a. Why do they. Why do they want me? And that's that. So it's. It's not a rare thing for me to be hyper skeptical before I start something.

[Michael Cyril Creighton]

Did you watch the show before?

[Christoph Waltz]

Well, I saw three episodes.

[Michael Cyril Creighton]

Okay. Yeah.

[Christoph Waltz]

And it's funny. When everyone knows the show, they hold it in the highest regards and they think it is unusual. All of which is true.

[Michael Cyril Creighton]

Yeah.

[Christoph Waltz]

But. Well, I guess it allows you to drop in and out.

[Michael Cyril Creighton]

Yeah. We're lucky that way. We get some of the best of the best because the time commitment is not crazy. You're not like, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. You don't have to do seven seasons. You can come in, play with us for a season, and then be gone.

[Christoph Waltz]

Lovely. Fantastic.

[Michael Cyril Creighton]

I always think of you as one of our greatest dramatic actors, obviously. Thank you.

[Christoph Waltz]

That's very kind.

[Michael Cyril Creighton]

Did your skepticism have anything to do with the fact that this is such a comedy forward project, or how did it feel jumping into a comedy project like this?

[Christoph Waltz]

This kind of comedy is something for comedians, I thought, you know, it doesn't have a very tight dramatic structure, you know, deconstructed comedic creature that. That takes on different shapes and forms and colors and. And I'm more at home with, you know, clearly structured drama.

[Michael Cyril Creighton]

Yeah, we're a bit of a clown show. There's some clowning going on.

[Christoph Waltz]

Yeah, sometimes and sometimes not. And then, you know, there. There are strands woven into it, and it's interesting. So to orient myself was really the most alluring element of it.

[Michael Cyril Creighton]

Yeah. I mean, we always talk about how it's such a nice set to be on, sort of uncharacteristically pleasant job, and I've been there since season one, so I'm used to it. I know everybody And I always wonder what it's like for someone who's coming in just for a season and sort of joining this well oiled machine. Did you find it easy to jump in with all of us?

[Christoph Waltz]

You're absolutely right. It is an unusually relaxed, open, friendly, mutually supportive atmosphere. It is unusually so. That's absolutely true. But speaking of the unusual format, so to say, I still cling to what I usually operate with. And that was. That was. That was a change for me. And I have to say that an extremely enriching and horizontal widening experience. You know, it's like they have a different mode. They have a completely different mode. Part of which is being so open and friendly and mutually supportive.

[Michael Cyril Creighton]

And you get to do. You get to be part of a unit sort of in this, you're your own trio. We have our main trio and then we have you and Renee and Logan. How was it working with the two of them? The dinner scene in episode four is so fun when you're all in Oliver's apartment together. And how was creating a relationship with the two of them?

[Christoph Waltz]

Well, the way it's written is we're actually each doing our thing.

[Michael Cyril Creighton]

Right.

[Christoph Waltz]

And in competition with each other. So the fact that they are a trio just results from the fact that there are three of them. But not because they're together.

[Michael Cyril Creighton]

Yeah, they're not united.

[Christoph Waltz]

Exactly. They're not united. They don't have a common cause. They're more trio because they're working against each other. So speaking of clown show, which is kind of a classical clown setup, you have a group, but they are all working against each other and playing pranks and against each other.

[Michael Cyril Creighton]

Yeah. And you're with Steve most of this episode, which is so funny. I mean, I think one of the funniest visual moments of the season is Bash chopping parsley. Yeah, I'm glad. Are you much of a cook?

[Christoph Waltz]

Not at all.

[Michael Cyril Creighton]

Not at all.

[Christoph Waltz]

No, not at all. I dislike cooking. I'm proud to say that I learned from him and I thought it was. Look, I'm stammering because I don't want to offend anyone else, but that for me, that was, you know, Steve as a person, for me was the highlight of this whole thing.

[Michael Cyril Creighton]

Yeah.

[Christoph Waltz]

You know, to get to know him and to, you know, sort of almost befriend him and share. Share common. Yeah, well, that's what you share. But common interests and my fascination with music and my complete ignorance of the musical possibilities of a banjo. And, you know, he brought the banjo to the set once and he Played these things. And by then I was told that he's one of the foremost banjo players of the world.

[Michael Cyril Creighton]

Yeah.

[Christoph Waltz]

So he. He played it, and of course, he. You know, he plays it as the virtuoso he is.

[Michael Cyril Creighton]

Yeah.

[Christoph Waltz]

And I said, you know, everything. And fast to me. Fast to me is not a quality in itself. Well, I said, can you play something lyrical? And he said, of course I can. I could. He said, yes. I said, sorry, I didn't quite, you know, perceive the. The. The lyrical element. Could you be more lyrical than that? And he played on that odd piece of. I don't know what it is. Yeah. He played something truly lyrical, and I was completely, completely overwhelmed because it was truly touching music.

[Michael Cyril Creighton]

Yeah.

[Christoph Waltz]

Then I went to see him or hear him at the Hollywood Ball. He played the Hollywood Bowl.

[Michael Cyril Creighton]

Yeah.

[Christoph Waltz]

He did something that I. That I still. That. That is still with me. Not all the time, but occasionally a classical, a classic musical clown number, you know, the banjo as the means and manner and way for comedy. Music as comedy. And I. I'm still. I'm still. I'm. I. Whenever someone says, oh, you just worked with Steve Martin, I start raving about this. This act at the Hollywood bowl. That was. That was enchanting.

[Michael Cyril Creighton]

No, that's like what we were talking about, of how the show is uniquely pleasant. And, yes, I've been on many unique sets as well that are very pleasant and very lovely to work on. But it's things like that that seem per capita, so much higher on our show that you get these beautiful moments of humanity from these icons. I would say seeing Steve play the banjo, hearing Marty tell a story, you know, there's just. That's part of. Why, for me, I feel like it's such a unique thing. Cause it's not just the work and the story and the people and the crew. It's those little moments of seeing behind the curtain which are so, so special. Yeah.

[Christoph Waltz]

Not little. Not to me. Yeah, they're big moments.

[Michael Cyril Creighton]

Yeah. Can we talk a little bit about Bash? How would you describe him?

[Christoph Waltz]

I always stay away from describing. Describing characters I play. Because if you played it well. And I'm not saying if the result is noteworthy. I'm saying if you played it well, you don't really control finer threads of a character. Yeah, they evolved. They. They happen. You can't really consciously control a character as it's happening. So what I would. What. I. I take these things seriously, you see.

[Michael Cyril Creighton]

I know I like it.

[Christoph Waltz]

So if an actor describes his character, he describes more. First of all, what's within his scope to understand. And second, what's his hope that a possible outcome would be? Neither of which is terribly interesting.

[Michael Cyril Creighton]

Right.

[Christoph Waltz]

So I stay away from talking about the characters I played because all I can say is I hope more than I am aware of right now.

[Michael Cyril Creighton]

See, this is a banjo moment for me. This is. I'm learning so much. I'll never describe a character again. No, don't, don't. No, I won't. I won't. No. It makes sense to me, though, and I think it's really interesting. I think a lot of people don't think of it that way. Can we touch, though, on how old we think he is? Do you know how old he is? But if I. If I give you a number.

[Christoph Waltz]

Well, he's probably 127, but that's what I thought.

[Michael Cyril Creighton]

That's what I thought. He lost his virginity to Dorothy Parker.

[Christoph Waltz]

I guess to a very young Dorothy Parker. In any case, those hints to certain personalities, they are subtle reminder that people like that actually do exist.

[Michael Cyril Creighton]

Yeah. Thanks for being with me. I'm glad that we had some time to talk to each other.

[Christoph Waltz]

Thanks a lot.

[Michael Cyril Creighton]

I think that we can all agree that the costumes on Only Murders in the building are absolutely unforgettable. And costume designer Dana Covarrubias has been nominated for three emmys for her amazing work. So let's talk about costumes. Let's talk about style. Hello, Dana. Welcome.

[Christoph Waltz]

How are you doing?

[Dana Covarrubias]

Good, good. Thank you for having me.

[Michael Cyril Creighton]

You look very nice.

[Dana Covarrubias]

Thank you. Thank you.

[Michael Cyril Creighton]

Did you put that together yourself?

[Dana Covarrubias]

I did put this together myself. It is inspired by this season.

[Michael Cyril Creighton]

Very nice.

[Dana Covarrubias]

I'm sure we'll get into.

[Michael Cyril Creighton]

Yes. Now, you know, I know that every season, generally, story wise, there's a theme, there's overarching sort of ideas. But I also know the same goes for the costume design, that you have inspirations season by season. Cause I've seen your boards in the room, which are beautiful. What was the inspiration for this season?

[Dana Covarrubias]

So I knew that in this season there was gonna be a big casino theme as our trio discovers this casino that's been hiding under the Arconia for all these years. And that there was also gonna be a mob element. And so it was kind of a mix of mob style, old school mobster vibes and casino and gambling. And all of that was the overall theme this season.

[Michael Cyril Creighton]

We get a bunch of new characters, but I want to focus on three specific ones. The billionaires. Let's talk about their style and how you landed on it. Let's Start with Bash.

[Dana Covarrubias]

Okay. Well, it's a little intimidating to have to design for billionaires when you don't have a billion dollars, because that is what they would have.

[Michael Cyril Creighton]

Right.

[Dana Covarrubias]

So you have to be smart about it. But we definitely had real life inspirations for each of them. I think that the fans will be able to watch and kind of figure out who those people are. But for Bash, we were inspired a little bit by Brian Johnson, but there's also some Mao in there. We did a mix up of a few different sort of billionaire. A little bit of Dr. Evil, maybe also in there.

[Michael Cyril Creighton]

I see that completely.

[Dana Covarrubias]

Yeah, he does seem sort of futuristic. Yeah, it's a little futuristic. Yeah, it's a little timeless. He's obsessed with youth and with prolonging his life. And the thought behind that with the costume design was what is the most efficient way of dressing that would take no time away from your day, and so that would be to have a uniform, you know, and so he just has a closet full of the same type of shirt, the same type of pant, the same type of turtleneck, and he just puts a different one together every day. But it's. They're all very similar and they're very simple. And we had a really fun time in the fittings with Christoph Waltz, who's unbelievable. And, you know, one of the first things we tried on it actually had a ton of pockets. It's a, you know, a button front jacket with a bunch of pockets on the front. And he was like, I just don't think my character would need pockets or have. It's too much business. And so we removed every single pocket from his costume and on his pants. I think he also had pockets on his pants, and that became, you know, and that's how you create in a fitting with an actor. It's like, it's so cool that that was his idea. And I'm like, oh, that totally makes sense for that character. And then moving forward for the whole season, you'll notice when you're watching that there are no pockets on his costumes.

[Michael Cyril Creighton]

Incredible. I had no idea.

[Dana Covarrubias]

Yeah, I mean, there's sometimes there were some pockets that we couldn't really remove, but they were so streamlined that it seemed like it made sense for the.

[Michael Cyril Creighton]

Character to still have them. Yeah.

[Dana Covarrubias]

Yeah, that was fun.

[Michael Cyril Creighton]

Now, one of my favorites, Camilla, Camilla.

[Dana Covarrubias]

Played by Renee Zellweger, was such a blast to design for it. Really. Where we started with it and where we ended up with it again is a testament to what it is to build a character with an actor in a fitting. It's my favorite part of the job. And Renee is such a creative genius, and it was just so fun to build that character with her. But originally she was inspired by, you know, Martha Stewart a little bit. There's a little bit of Peggy Lee in there. There's a little bit of Ann Margret in there. We wanted. Yeah, we wanted to have some sort of vintage, retro vibe to her to make her unique, because we didn't want it. We didn't want to copy, you know, Martha exactly, or Gwyneth or, you know, these, you know, women billionaires who have this very chic, beautiful style. We wanted it to be very unique. So I think that vintage and Margaret sort of Peggy Lee vibe set it apart, but that's where we started. And then in the fitting, we came up with all sorts of wacky, weird things. The character's last name is White, and originally, I think the writers were intending for her to only ever wear creams and whites and cashmeres. But in the fitting, we decided no. I mean, we, like, again, like, we don't want the character to feel one dimensional. You know, she's still a person. And so, you know, we introduced some other pastels, and that felt more in the 50s 60s world. And there's another element to her character that we came up with in the fitting. And I can't remember even where the idea came from. I'm trying to remember, but we had all these options of gloves, and we ended up choosing the creepiest ones we could find, which are these cotton gloves that completely match her skin tone. And so they kind of look like hands, but they're not.

[Michael Cyril Creighton]

Oh, wow.

[Dana Covarrubias]

And so it's very creepy. And then we also added a little neck scarf that kind of is retro feeling. And then, you know, that all we came up with in the fitting. And then many episodes later, I think they end up writing about that in the script, and it becomes a.

[Michael Cyril Creighton]

Involved in the plot line.

[Dana Covarrubias]

And so it's interesting. It's like we came up with it in the fitting, but then the writers incorporated into the story, into the story.

[Michael Cyril Creighton]

And finally, Jay Logan. Lermies. Logan. Lerman. Logan. Lerman.

[Dana Covarrubias]

Logan. Lermies. Logan was pretty directly inspired by Zuckerberg, and, well, like, early Zuckerberg, like when he, you know, was wearing, like, his cargo shorts and his flip flops and hoodies and, you know, just kind of showing that tech guy who's, like, super casual and, like, he's so rich and he's so confident that he doesn't have to try. Like, he can. Everyone else in the room is wearing a suit, and he's in his flip flops, and he's still the boss, you know?

[Michael Cyril Creighton]

Yeah.

[Dana Covarrubias]

And he. But, you know. But then we tried some stuff that was very, very casual on him. Very, like, college dude. But then we realized as the episodes were being written that he was. I think you discover in 504 that he is a bit of a love interest for Mabel. And there might be something there. You might see some sparks flying. And so we also wanted to make him attractive.

[Michael Cyril Creighton]

Yeah.

[Dana Covarrubias]

We wanted Mabel to find him attractive. And so the costume couldn't be too slub.

[Michael Cyril Creighton]

It could not be slubby, bro. Yeah. You know?

[Dana Covarrubias]

Cause it had to make sense that Mabel would be into it.

[Michael Cyril Creighton]

Yeah.

[Dana Covarrubias]

Mabel has good taste.

[Michael Cyril Creighton]

Yeah. Yeah. Oh, that's fun. There's another character that returns this episode, Thea Althea. Now, these costumes are bananas. They are so fun. They get better and better as the season goes on. What was the inspiration for Thea?

[Dana Covarrubias]

You know, she's a pop star, and the main inspirations were Sabrina Carpenter and Ariana Grande kind of mix, but then just general sort of. You know, there's some Britney in there. There's some Madonna. There's just. We just took from all sorts of little bits and pieces from pop stars, but we wanted her to have a signature color, as a lot of pop stars do. So she's just like, pink, pink, pink, pink. She's very girly. Bows and sparkly and strawberries and, you know, it's like a little bit like. I don't know. We just. It's just very insane. It's a very insane costume. Very insane character.

[Michael Cyril Creighton]

So good.

[Dana Covarrubias]

But I think that, you know, I think the idea behind her is that she's really. She doesn't know who she is. And so she's just kind of like. We did. Is desperately grabbing at all these different ideas and all these different inspirations to create her own look as a of part. And it's not really who she is deep down. And I think that's sort of why Mabel and her have a bit of tension, because Mabel knows who she really is because they grew up together.

[Michael Cyril Creighton]

Yeah, that makes sense. Mabel, I feel like, is really coming into her own as far as style goes. She's really evolved and sort of become this sort of incredibly. She's becoming a really strong woman. How would you say her style has evolved?

[Dana Covarrubias]

Exactly that. I think that was our main goal this season, was to show that now she has a bit of money and she has, you know, really embraced this role of being a podcast producer. And she wants to dress the part.

[Michael Cyril Creighton]

Yeah.

[Dana Covarrubias]

So I think it was that in combination with the inspiration of sort of mobster style. We did a lot of pinstripes. We did. That's why I wore stripes today and pinstripes today, because, you know, we were inspired by that element. And. Yeah, we just want to. You know, we did a lot of blazers with strong shoulders, and we did a lot of chic, sort of simple, strong silhouettes on her that I think she just looks. I mean, she always looks stunning. I think she looks really stunning this season.

[Michael Cyril Creighton]

Really, really incredible job. Do you have an animal?

[Dana Covarrubias]

Yes, I have a dog and a cat.

[Michael Cyril Creighton]

What is the dog's name?

[Dana Covarrubias]

Noodlebean.

[Michael Cyril Creighton]

What would its job be?

[Dana Covarrubias]

Oh, Noodlebean. What would Noodlebean's job be? Oh, my gosh.

[John Hoffman]

Oh, oh.

[Dana Covarrubias]

Trash. Trash collector.

[Michael Cyril Creighton]

Trash man.

[Dana Covarrubias]

Yes, because trash, trash, trash. Because he loves to eat trash.

[Michael Cyril Creighton]

Great. And what is the other animal's name?

[Dana Covarrubias]

My cat, who is a male, is named Diane Sawyer.

[Michael Cyril Creighton]

And what would Diane Sawyer's job be?

[Dana Covarrubias]

A news anchor.

[Michael Cyril Creighton]

Perfect. Okay, great. Do you want to play a game with me? Yeah. Okay, cool. So now it is time for a game called costume. And here's how it works. I'm gonna describe an item of clothing or a style, and you are going to tell me who from the only murders world would wear that thing. It could be the trio. It could be anybody else in season five. Up to you. Are you ready, Remy? I think fuzzy heels. Z A fedora.

[Dana Covarrubias]

Oh, Charles. In, like, 1992.

[Michael Cyril Creighton]

Two perfect, teeny, tiny little sunglasses.

[Dana Covarrubias]

Teeny, tiny little sunglasses. I have no idea. Maybe, like, maybe one of Howard's cats. I would think that, like, Howard would have clothing, a whole clothing collection for his animals.

[Michael Cyril Creighton]

I also think maybe trash can Miller. A trash man. Trash man Miller. I can see in, like, those little tiny glasses.

[Dana Covarrubias]

His whole thing was that he was stealing clothes that were coming down the trash chute. And so you'll notice, you know, he's wearing bits and pieces of other people's costumes.

[Michael Cyril Creighton]

Howard's Oliver's scarves, cargo pants.

[Dana Covarrubias]

Logan's character Jay.

[Michael Cyril Creighton]

Head to toe denim.

[Christoph Waltz]

Oh.

[Dana Covarrubias]

No.

[Michael Cyril Creighton]

1 Ursula off hours.

[Dana Covarrubias]

Oh, Ursula.

[Michael Cyril Creighton]

Ursula off hours.

[Dana Covarrubias]

Yes, I can do that.

[Michael Cyril Creighton]

Head to leather.

[Dana Covarrubias]

Oh, Howard off.

[Michael Cyril Creighton]

Howard off hours. Yeah, Howard is a little, like, worked up this season. He needs a little attention. A wallet chain.

[Dana Covarrubias]

Oh, wait, I do think we gave someone a wallet chain at one point. Oh, Paul Rudd's character had a wallet chain.

[Michael Cyril Creighton]

Oh, Ben Glenroy Yes.

[Dana Covarrubias]

Ben Glenroy.

[Michael Cyril Creighton]

You know who else would wear wallet chain? Kt, the stage manager from season three.

[Dana Covarrubias]

Oh yes.

[Michael Cyril Creighton]

Kt, Ring of keys. A yellow plaid suit.

[Dana Covarrubias]

Mabel.

[Michael Cyril Creighton]

Mabel for sure. That screams Mabel. A floor length black velvet cape.

[Dana Covarrubias]

Oliver.

[Michael Cyril Creighton]

Yeah. Oliver.

[Dana Covarrubias]

Yeah. Yeah.

[Michael Cyril Creighton]

Well, that was a fun game that we completely made up. Well, thank you so much for being here. You make the show look so amazing.

[Dana Covarrubias]

Thank you.

[Michael Cyril Creighton]

May you always get nominated for Emmys and always work on everything I do and always make me look so good. Thank you for everything. Thank you and see you soon. Bye. Bye. Well, that's it for today. Thank you so much for tuning in. And if you haven't already, subscribe and follow us wherever you're listening or watching from. Leave us a little rating or a review. Go into the comments, talk about who you think did the murder and who you think is going to be murdered next. And join us next week when we talk to the Arconia's new doorman Randall, played by the hilarious Jermaine Fowler, actor David Patrick Kelly, who plays a mysterious and never before seen character, and writers Ben Smith and JJ Philbin. See you next week. And until then, don't get killed. Watch and listen to Only Murders in the Building official podcast available on Hulu and wherever you get your podcasts. And don't miss Only Murders in the Building now streaming on Hulu and Hulu on Disney plus. As far as the plasma donors that he has to stay young, is that something that you worry about?

[Christoph Waltz]

I worry about aging, but like a regular person does, like my bones, you get up and your back creaks.