Super Soul Special: Jay Williams: You Can Survive Your Worst Mistake

Summary

Oprah’s Super Soul Special: Jay Williams — You Can Survive Your Worst Mistake

Podcast Date: February 25, 2026

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Episode Overview

In this deeply moving conversation, Oprah sits down with former NBA star Jay Williams to explore how a single moment can change your life, how to find meaning in your worst mistakes, and what it takes to rebuild your identity and spirit after tragedy. From the height of promise as an NBA rookie to a devastating motorcycle accident that ended his career, Jay shares the inner journey of loss, self-forgiveness, and hard-won wisdom. This episode is a testament to human resilience, vulnerability, and the power of shifting perspective.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. The Pivotal Moment: Jay’s Motorcycle Accident

• [02:32 – 07:19]
  • Jay describes his mindset before the crash — young, rebellious, desperate to assert independence after a regimented college life.
    • “I wanted to prove that I was running my own life.” (Jay, 03:01)
  • He recounts ignoring contract prohibitions against motorcycles, the adrenaline of the bike, and the fateful decision to rev the engine:
    • “For some reason, I wanted everybody to know it was me... Ego, ego, ego, ego. All day long.” (Jay, 05:35)
  • As he loses control, he recalls a prophetic dream from age 17, seeing a red fire hydrant during the crash, just as in his dream.
  • Immediate aftermath: instead of gratitude for survival, a sense of profound loss.
    • “The first thing I yell is, not that I don’t want to die. The first thing I yell is, I threw it all away.” (Jay, 06:29)

2. The Spiritual and Psychological Fallout

• [07:45 – 10:39]
  • Jay details his extensive injuries, the uncertainty of ever walking again, and the professional end signaled as the Bulls drafted his replacement while he was still in ICU.
  • Oprah focuses on the role of devastating mistakes as "master teachers."
    • “Even our most devastating mistakes... can serve as a master teacher for us.” (Oprah, 10:08)

3. Power Struggle, Identity, and Ego

• [08:26 – 11:04]
  • Reflects on a lifelong power struggle with his father and the warped reality of sudden NBA celebrity and wealth.
  • Jay realizes how grasping for control often means losing it.
    • “When you try to hold onto something so tightly, you truly realize that you don’t have any control of it at all.” (Jay, 11:05)

4. Climbing Out of Darkness: Depression, Therapy, and Suicide Attempts

• [13:32 – 19:23]
  • Jay opens up about his anger at himself and admits to two suicide attempts post-accident.
    • “I had two attempts at suicide. I tried to slit my wrist one time… I tried to overdose.” (Jay, 14:03)
  • Describes his darkest moments — immobilized in bed, high on painkillers, wrestling with faith and despair.
    • “I just remember sitting there, just trying to take those blades and just pull them over my wrist.” (Jay, 18:13)
  • His mother interrupts, prays with him, and pleads for him to see a larger purpose.
    • “Promise me you’re never gonna hurt yourself again. You’ve been left here for a reason.” (Jay’s mother, recounted at 18:44)

5. The Turning Point: Support, Self-Forgiveness, and Gratitude

• [19:23 – 22:21]
  • Recovery is not linear. It’s the ongoing support of family, therapy, and renewed faith that help.
  • Over time, Jay feels real gratitude for his journey — seeing how unchecked ego and lifestyle could have led him further astray.
    • “I would never be able to sit here and communicate to you my emotions if I never got hurt.... I was headed down a path that wasn’t going to be the man I wanted to be.” (Jay, 20:06)
  • Acknowledges the toxic culture of celebrity athletics: arrogance, hollow relationships, and how only true family told him ‘no.’

6. Reinvention and Accepting a New Normal

• [13:32, 23:04 – 27:38]
  • Jay discusses building a new identity post-NBA, the pain of losing "friends," and finding who was truly there for him.
    • “I found out who was on my bus when I went through my accident.” (Jay, 26:29)
  • Coach K’s role: In Jay’s hospital room with a pendant, promising he would “play again” — a gift that later revealed a deeper meaning.
    • “You give this back to me when you play again... it meant playing in the game of life.” (Jay, 28:32)

7. Life Lessons: Letting Go of Ghosts, Embracing Purpose

• [29:29 – 34:18]
  • Jay learns to stop “chasing the ghost” of who he was supposed to be, instead embracing who he is now.
    • “It’s the most rewarding feeling I’ve ever had... all I did was relive my past mistakes.” (Jay, 31:54)
  • Forgiving his father and himself becomes a cornerstone to his healing.
    • “I was finally able to forgive my father for the mistakes he made because I learned how to forgive myself.” (Jay, 31:54)
  • He advises listeners to form their “own board” — a support group that helps you discern your real passions and strengths.
    • “For every successful business, they have a board... I built another kind of team.” (Jay, 33:49)

8. Happiness and Looking to the Future

• [34:22 – 36:21]
  • Jay is open about his desire for a family, his worries about physical limitations, and a profound dream of domestic tranquility as his new vision for happiness.
    • “I can’t wait to have a family. I cannot wait to be a dad and a loyal husband.” (Jay, 35:44)
  • Expresses gratitude for a second chance and for discovering peace, even after tragedy.

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• “I wanted to prove that I was running my own life.” — Jay Williams (03:01)
• “Ego, ego, ego, ego. All day long.” — Jay Williams (05:35)
• “The first thing I yell is, I threw it all away.” — Jay Williams (06:29)
• “When you try to hold onto something so tightly, you truly realize that you don't have any control of it at all.” — Jay Williams (11:05)
• “Even our most devastating mistakes can serve as a master teacher for us.” — Oprah (10:08)
• “I had two attempts at suicide. I tried to slit my wrist one time… I tried to overdose.” — Jay Williams (14:03)
• “Promise me you’re never gonna hurt yourself again. You’ve been left here for a reason.” — Jay’s mother (18:44, recounted by Jay)
• “I would never be able to sit here and communicate to you my emotions if I never got hurt... I was headed down a path that wasn’t going to be the man I wanted to be." — Jay Williams (20:06)
• “I found out who was on my bus when I went through my accident.” — Jay Williams (26:29)
• “You give this back to me when you play again... it meant playing in the game of life.” — Jay Williams (28:32)
• “I was finally able to forgive my father for the mistakes he made because I learned how to forgive myself.” — Jay Williams (31:54)
• “I think that was more of a gift than an accident, really.” — Jay Williams (22:21)
• “I can’t wait to have a family. I cannot wait to be a dad and a loyal husband.” — Jay Williams (35:44)

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Timestamps for Important Segments

• [02:32] — Jay recounts the night of his accident and the prophetic dream
• [06:29] — “I threw it all away” — immediate thoughts post-accident
• [07:45] — Bulls select a new point guard while Jay’s in ICU; existential crisis
• [10:08] — Oprah on mistakes as teachers
• [14:03] — Jay reveals his suicide attempts and journey through depression
• [18:44] — Jay’s mother intervenes during his darkest suicidal episode
• [20:06] — Jay expresses gratitude for tragedy; admits he wasn’t on the right path
• [26:29] — Jay on discovering who his real supporters were
• [28:32] — Coach K’s pendant; “playing again” in the game of life
• [31:54] — Jay discusses forgiving his father because he learned to forgive himself
• [33:49] — Advice: build your own “board of advisors”
• [35:44] — Jay describes his new dream: family, fatherhood, and peace

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Reflections and Takeaways

With humility and candor, Jay Williams demonstrates that our worst mistakes can be forces for awakening, provided we are willing to confront them, seek support, and let go of ego. The episode encourages listeners to redefine identity beyond achievement, accept life’s painful detours, and create their own “team” to support growth. Jay’s hard-earned self-forgiveness and gratitude are offered as inspiration for anyone seeking meaning through adversity.

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For anyone facing loss, regret, or a shattering setback, this conversation offers hope, perspective, and actionable wisdom on how to not just survive, but transform.

Transcript

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[Oprah Winfrey]

I'm Oprah Winfrey. Welcome to Super Soul Conversations, the podcast. I believe that one of the most

[Interviewer]

valuable gifts you can give yourself is time.

[Oprah Winfrey]

Taking time to be more fully present. Your journey to become more inspired and connected to the deeper world around us starts right now. Former NBA player Jay Williams grew up in Plainville, New Jersey. He was the only son a parent, David, who worked for American Express and Althea. An elementary school principal, Jay led Duke to an NCAA championship in 2001 and was hailed as one of the most electrifying college basketball players in Duke University history. Poised to become one of the biggest superstars in the NBA. Jay says his rookie season with the Chicago Bulls was one of the most difficult years of his life. He struggled both on and off the court to find his confidence and says he began to lose himself to everything he believed it meant to be an NBA star. At the end of that season, Jay ignored the part of his Bulls contract that prohibited him from riding motorcycles and instead bought one. Today, Jay opens up about the motorcycle crash that destroyed his career and tested his will to live his more than 10 year battle to reclaim his destiny. And it's a big lesson Super Solars on how our worst mistakes can be our best teachers.

[Interviewer]

So I was living in Chicago when you crashed your motorcycle. I often wondered what were you thinking before you got on that bike?

[Jay Williams]

I think that's a, that's a great question because I wasn't thinking at all. I think I was just freely living in that moment and I struggled with a lot. I felt I had a lot of pressure on me to be this particular saver for a franchise. And so there was that aspect because you Come in.

[Interviewer]

You have Michael Jordan's locker.

[Jay Williams]

Exactly, exactly. Which I chose to have, by the way. I want to prove that I was running my own life. And you know, it's interesting, we have a lot of people that control what you do. And that's what happened to me in college. You know, everything was regimented. I knew that every day I was gonna wake up at 6am and I was gonna practice for two and a half hours and go to class and then go to school and then training meal. And then all of a sudden you come to the NBA and somebody's like, here's a lot of money, go. And I had no idea what I was gonna do with my time.

[Interviewer]

21 years old. How much money were you making? Your contract was.

[Jay Williams]

I got $3.4 million with the second pick. And then I had a good endorsement with Adidas, where I got another million dollars.

[Interviewer]

Yeah, so that's feeling really good.

[Jay Williams]

Yeah.

[Interviewer]

So you get on the motorcycle now. What's interesting to me is that you had had a vision or dream years before that something would happen.

[Jay Williams]

Yeah. I was 17 years old. I was about to play my first college basketball game at Madison Square Garden. And I'm from Jersey, so that's what you dream of. Playing the mecca of basketball. And I couldn't go to sleep that night. I was up, I was fidgety, I was anxious, couldn't wait to play my first game. And I finally fell asleep and I had this dream that I was spinning. Spinning non stop and almost to the point where it got me dizzy. And when I finally stopped spinning, I looked up and I saw a red fire hydrant. And the crazy thing about that is that you Fast forward about 5 years, 21 years old, and all of a sudden now I'm actually laying on the ground with my. My chest on the pavement as if I'm laying on my stomach, my legs on top of each other, as if I'm laying on my side up on the curb staring at a red fire hydrant after I just spun around.

[Interviewer]

Take me back to that moment where you're on the motorcycle. Why did, did you lose control of the motorcycle?

[Jay Williams]

I was on my bike. Which I shouldn't have been on in the first place.

[Interviewer]

Cause you'd signed a contract that said you wouldn't ride a motorcycle.

[Jay Williams]

Exactly. But once again, rebellious phase of my life. I wanted to prove that I was in control of my own life.

[Interviewer]

And you're not gonna tell me I can't ride a motorcycle.

[Jay Williams]

Exactly. Exactly. The young, immature thing to do.

[Interviewer]

Yep.

[Jay Williams]

And Come to our stop sign. The bike was in neutral. I revved the bike two times. The first two times, it was totally fine. And I'm going about 25 miles an hour now as I'm cruising towards the stop sign. And I revved the third time. And in the middle of the third rev, I just. I hear the bike go, click, click. And it was a huge rev. For some reason, I wanted everybody to know it was me. Coming to a stop sign. I have no idea why.

[Interviewer]

Now you do know why.

[Jay Williams]

Yeah.

[Interviewer]

Ego, ego, ego, ego.

[Jay Williams]

All day long.

[Interviewer]

All day long.

[Oprah Winfrey]

Now you do know why.

[Interviewer]

Yeah.

[Jay Williams]

And before you know it, the bike pops up on me, and I go from going 25 miles an hour to going 65 miles an hour. And now I'm running a stop sign. Now there's a truck coming from my right to my left, and I'm seeing this truck coming. In order for me to not be hit by the truck, I have to speed up even more. So, you know, I pull on the throttle even more. The truck misses me. And as I'm looking at the truck out of the corner of my eye, passing me by as I turn, I run smack into a utility pole going around 75 miles an hour.

[Interviewer]

And you're spinning.

[Jay Williams]

Yep. It clips off the whole left side of my body, and I'm spinning in the air. And you land exactly on my chest on the pavement, legs up on the curb, as if I'm laying on my side. Wow. And.

[Interviewer]

And there is the red fire hydrant.

[Jay Williams]

Red fire hydrant right there staring me in the eye. And the first thing I. First thing I yell is, not that I don't want to die. You know, the first thing I yell is, I threw it all away. I felt at that moment that I had thrown everything I just worked for my entire life away.

[Interviewer]

Well, you had been working a long time. The hours and practice and the dream. Yeah. That's the first thought that came to your mind? Not, I'm glad I'm alive. Not.

[Jay Williams]

Well. I. I couldn't even process what was happening at that particular moment. I just thought about, you know, I've been told so many times not to ride this bike. I've had a dream about this particular moment that I decided not to listen to.

[Oprah Winfrey]

Yeah.

[Jay Williams]

And here I was in a situation that I've had all these signs telling me not to do this, and I still put myself in that position to do so. And, yeah, I felt like I threw everything I worked my entire life for away.

[Oprah Winfrey]

Jay's injuries were devastating. He fractured his pelvis severed a nerve in his foot and required more than 100 staples in his left leg. He also suffered internal bleeding and a full dislocation of his knee. Jay would eventually require 13 surgeries. Doctors weren't sure he would ever walk again.

[Interviewer]

So the moment you said I threw it all away, I threw it all away. And then wasn't it nine days later that the Bulls hired someone else?

[Jay Williams]

Yeah, that's gotta be a moment. I was in icu and I remember watching the draft and watching the Bulls select Kirk Heinrich, the point guard that I competed against the year prior because he played for Kansas. And just thinking to myself, I don't really want to be here anymore. I don't even know why I'm here. Look what I've done to myself. And it all seems so surreal. It was like a dream that I just wanted to wake up from. But it was reality and I couldn't change that.

[Interviewer]

I know you've worked really hard to pinpoint the true spiritual cause of the crash. I heard that you had described it at one point as a power struggle that really was going on, had developed in your life, you now believe contributed to your demise. Is that true?

[Jay Williams]

Yeah. Because, you know, it's funny how you put things in perspective as a kid. As a 21 year old, your sense of reality is a little bit warped, Especially for everything I was going through at that time. You know, it was a fast paced life. It wasn't real. It was, it was almost. It was a false world that I didn't really get acclimated to, but it's

[Interviewer]

the world everybody dreams of. Oh my gosh. You're 21 and you're making four point something million dollars a year. You can't even. This is. Yeah, you can't even figure out what that is when it's happening to you.

[Jay Williams]

I. No, I had no sense of it at all because it was happening like that. And there was this power struggle that I had with my dad. And my dad is a very strong individual. And now, you know, reflecting back on it, he was just doing it because he loved me and he wanted to guide me in the right direction. But I took it as my dad's always telling me what to do. And my dad and my mother had some issues. You know, it caused me to be a little bit closer to my mother. And there was a little bit of dissension I had towards my father. And then my dad being the CEO of my company while I was playing, telling me what to do with my money, when to do it with My money, how to invest my money, what I could spend my money on. And all of a sudden, to see that moment flip to where, you know, I'm laying on my back and I being told, I don't know if I'm going to be able to walk again, to looking at my father being like, you were exactly right. But I didn't want to listen to you because I want to do what I want to do when I wanted to do it, to prove that I was running the show.

[Interviewer]

Yeah. I think that your story is such a great reminder to all of us that even our most devastating mistakes, and that was. That was a mistake that, when you look back, could have been avoided in that moment. But even our most devastating mistakes can serve as a master teacher for us. And so in this time, in this circle of life, you've been able to take that moment lying on the pavement to really figure out who you really were. Because were you at that time, obviously, I would think, defined by basketball?

[Jay Williams]

Yeah, basketball was exactly who I was. And, you know, we talk about control, and I find it so fascinating that at that particular moment where the bike pops up on me going 65 miles an hour, you know, I wanted to control everything. So in order to control it, I had to grab onto the bike because I don't want to wreck my bike. And that's everything about life. When you try to hold onto something so tightly, you truly realize that you don't have any control of it at all.

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[Oprah Winfrey]

Jay says he spent the last decade on a journey to both forgive himself and reclaim his purpose. He attempted a Pro comeback in 2006, but it was not to be. Jay finally realized he was chasing a ghost, he says, and began to consider a new vision for himself. He is now a respected commentator with espn.

[Interviewer]

So you now have gone through really a reinvention of your own identity, would you say?

[Jay Williams]

Yeah, because I basketball was something that I thought defined me and the power struggle was something that defined me.

[Interviewer]

And everybody does it in their own way. I know a lot of people who were married who thought the marriage defined them. I know a lot of people who had jobs, they thought that job defined them. So yours is just a struggle that we get to see in the spotlight.

[Jay Williams]

And everybody has a form of adversity that they go through.

[Interviewer]

Everybody does.

[Jay Williams]

And one of the things and I had to go through therapy. I mean, I was angry at myself. I had two attempts at suicide. I tried to slit my wrist one time.

[Interviewer]

I tried to overdose where were you in that moment?

[Jay Williams]

I was in a moment that I couldn't move. I had to lay on my back for months, and I had nothing but time to reflect on the mistake that I had done to myself.

[Interviewer]

Cause you really no longer wanted to

[Oprah Winfrey]

be here if you couldn't play basketball?

[Jay Williams]

Well, I think it was the fact that I did to myself.

[Interviewer]

Oh, yeah.

[Jay Williams]

That, you know, I. It wasn't something that happened because of outside circumstances. It was something that.

[Interviewer]

Well, you'd still be asking, why me? Why me? Right.

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Yeah.

[Jay Williams]

And I.

[Interviewer]

But you actually knew why you.

[Jay Williams]

Well, I found that out later. Yeah, I think I found that out later. And I think I finally got to a point a year after my accident where I said, why not me? I'm built to handle this. I was supposed to be in this moment. And it was difficult for me to try to explain that to other people, because other people look at my NBA career or my life in the lens of failure. You know, you didn't make it. You had this great opportunity. I'm like, whoa, whoa. I made it. I made it better than I could ever imagine making it, because that experience has made me exactly who I'm supposed to be in this moment. At the age of 33, when did

[Interviewer]

you come to accept the new normal? Because I think anybody who gets a difficult challenge or setback in their life has to adjust to what is the new normal. When did that happen for you, Jay?

[Jay Williams]

I think I finally accepted it after I didn't make it back to an NBA. I was trying to become an agent, and I was very depressed. I was living in New York City, and every single day, somebody reminded me of the accident that I had done to myself.

[Interviewer]

How would they remind you? Just come up to you and say, hey, yeah.

[Jay Williams]

I mean, did it today in the airport on my way here.

[Interviewer]

Really?

[Jay Williams]

Yeah. I mean, if you don't think about it, and it's okay, because now I'm okay with it. But before, I used to get angry about, oh, hey, why are you limping? What's wrong with your foot? Is that what you threw away your career on? Or why'd you do something so dumb? Like, you had everything. Why'd you throw it all away?

[Interviewer]

Wow.

[Jay Williams]

You know, and they're trying to start a conversation with you. They're not saying it in a malicious way. It's their way of connecting to you. And for a long time, I didn't know how to handle that. And I think it all kind of came to a culmination for me is I was trying to Be an agent. And I remember I went to a bar, and I was. Was drinking a lot because I was depressed, and I was sad. And I honestly had a guy that came up to me and slapped me on my left leg. And he was probably a little bit drunk. And he's like, jay Williams, is that why you messed up your whole career? And I got angry, and I said, who are you to tell me what I messed up? And I. I proceeded to drink a little bit more, and I walked towards my apartment. I fell down the stairs and proceeded to go into my room, and I sat there in my room, and I drank by myself. And I took about three to four pills of OxyContin, and I didn't want to be here anymore.

[Interviewer]

Well, take me back to what had to be, if not the darkest, certainly one of the darkest moments with the scissors in your room.

[Jay Williams]

I was in my. I was in my own house, and I was laying there. I was very high on morphine, and I was praying a lot at that time. I bounced back from prayer to anger so quickly. I had no idea who I was, who I wanted to be, if I was going to be able to walk again or run again.

[Interviewer]

Where are you in the time frame here?

[Jay Williams]

I'm about maybe two and a half months after I got out of the hospital by accident. I just had one of these moments where I was alone. My parents did a really good job of not letting me be alone, and I actually thought it was a sign. And this is how delusional you can become when you're on a morphine tab. I saw a pair of scissors there on the side of the bed. And I just remember thinking to myself, if I could reach those scissors, then I deserve not to be here, because they were put there for a reason. And I sure enough tried to reach over, and I grabbed the edge of the scissors with my pinky and I pulled it in. And I just remember sitting there, just trying to take those blades and just pull them over my wrist.

[Interviewer]

This is your blades?

[Jay Williams]

Yeah. Over the tattoo that says, believe in my wrist, looking at it, saying, I don't believe in anything anymore. What do I have to believe in? And I was angry. I always tried to do things right. I'd been on time. I had gone to charities and just kind of thought, like, you know, I can't believe you would do this to me. I don't have anything to believe in. That moment and me drinking a lot in my apartment were the two darkest moments I had in my life.

[Interviewer]

So your mom comes back into the room, and she sees you with the

[Jay Williams]

scissors, starts screaming at me, what are you doing? What are you doing? What are you doing? Takes the scissors out of my hands and just grabs my hand and starts to pray and said, promise me you're never gonna hurt yourself again. You know, you've been left here for a reason. And I remember her saying that, but I remember me quickly thinking to myself, what reason is that? What reason do I have to be here? You know, to be made fun of, to be told by everybody that I'm a failure, you know? And she just prayed.

[Interviewer]

How were you able then? What would you say was the seminal moment for beginning to turn it around?

[Jay Williams]

I don't think there was one moment. I think it was the constant support of the people who loved me that really pulled me through those dark times, because I was. I was lost. I had. Basketball had defined me. My accident had defined me, and I had no idea what I wanted to do. I don't think it was until later, a couple years later, until I started going to counseling, started to try to go to church. I put my faith into something bigger, and that was through my mother and my father helping me believe that you were left here for a purpose.

[Interviewer]

Wow. So you look back on that time now, do you have a sense of gratitude for it?

[Jay Williams]

I'm more thankful than I thought I would ever be. I would. I would never be able to sit here and communicate to you my emotions if I never got hurt. And I know people might think that might be crazy. I could have a lot of money and could have a lot of success and notoriety, but I can quickly see how I was headed down a path that wasn't going to be the man I wanted to be. I was going to become somebody who cheated on his wife. I'm telling you right now, I would have. I was going to become somebody.

[Interviewer]

How do you know that?

[Jay Williams]

Just because it was all around me. It was around me and it was socially accepted. It was accepted. It was accepted that you could kiss your wife and your kids and get on a plane and go to a different city and meet somebody there and have fun with that person and turn around and come back and be with your family again, and nobody would say anything. It's just how it's supposed to be.

[Interviewer]

That is the culture.

[Jay Williams]

It is. I mean, it's not only the culture in basketball. It's the culture in a lot of walks of life, too, where it's accepted and, you know, being aloof and closed off and not having a sense of what reality was. Because you don't know who to trust. I don't know who to trust.

[Interviewer]

But isn't it interesting how everything that you're saying really is just sort of breeding a level of arrogance and feeding the ego in a way that, you know that your ego becomes completely out of control and you're completely run by

[Jay Williams]

your ego because nobody told you no. Yeah, Nobody ever told you no. It's like, okay. And you didn't have people tell you no because people were afraid to lose you as a client. So I'm gonna do this. Okay. I'm gonna go on a private plane after practice and go somewhere and party and then come back and play in the game. Okay. You know the only people who really told me no? My mother, my dad, my mom. You're not gonna ride that bike. Or she's gonna put gum in the exhaust of the bike to try to. Or hide my bike in the back of the house.

[Interviewer]

Wow.

[Jay Williams]

You know, those are the people that had a firm foundation into helping you understand what was right and what was wrong.

[Interviewer]

So in spite of that big accident, what I hear you saying is there really are no accidents.

[Jay Williams]

Exactly. Yeah. I think that was more of a gift than an accident, really. I just think I was living a life that I don't know if it was the right life I should be living. I was doing things I shouldn't be doing. I was drinking a lot. I was partying a lot.

[Interviewer]

How are you doing that? I thought you guys had a really strict, regimented life for playing ball. And then I read where you actually had gotten some people upset where you said, you know, guys are hitting on girls from the court.

[Jay Williams]

Oh, yeah.

[Interviewer]

And that they're doing drugs the night before.

[Jay Williams]

Yeah, I was shocked to hear that.

[Interviewer]

I thought there was that whole, everybody wants the same thing, and that is to win the game. And, you know, you can't win the game if you're hitting on girls and if you're having drugs and everything depends

[Jay Williams]

on what game you're talking about. Are you talking about the basketball game or are you talking about the individual game? And for some of these guys, you know, they're in their own game.

[Pharmaceutical Advertiser]

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with monthly dosing EBGLIS Lebricizumab LBKZ a 250mg per 2ml injection is a prescription medicine used to treat adults and children 12 years of age and older who weigh at least 88 pounds or 40 kilograms with moderate to severe eczema, also called atopic dermatitis, that is not well controlled with prescription therapies used on the skin or topicals or who cannot use topical therapies. EBGLIS can be used with or without topical corticosteroids. Don't use if you're allergic to Eglis. Allergic reactions can occur that can be severe. Eye problems can occur. Tell your doctor if you have new or worsening eye problems. You should not receive a live vaccine when treated with ebglis. Before starting Ebglis, tell your doctor if you have a parasitic infection.

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[Interviewer]

What has been your biggest discovery about yourself in this whole process?

[Jay Williams]

That I am so strong. I'm strong. I'm stronger than I ever thought I was. And I'm strong not because of something internally. I'm strong because of the people that support me on a daily basis. And I found a new zest for life through them because of their support.

[Interviewer]

And so when you say you have a new zest for life, did you actively start to process what the steps would be to get you to where you are now?

[Jay Williams]

No, I was still trying to be an agent. I was a little bit jaded by the way my agent had treated me throughout the process. You know, you go from being a guy who gets all the attention to being a guy when I was trying to come back to play. Didn't get that much attention at all.

[Interviewer]

Well, you did go back and you played for what, three weeks or I Came back.

[Jay Williams]

I played for a short stint.

[Interviewer]

Short stint.

[Jay Williams]

A short stint, yeah. Enough to. Just to prove to myself I could.

[Interviewer]

What did that feel like?

[Jay Williams]

Sad.

[Interviewer]

Sad.

[Jay Williams]

Very sad. Why? Because I couldn't do the things I used to do.

[Interviewer]

Yeah.

[Jay Williams]

There was nothing more saddening to me that the one thing that I would be able to do that was my safe haven, that could take me away from, you know, all the troubles that you think you have in life was playing basketball. And I didn't have that anymore.

[Interviewer]

So even playing, you were playing at a deficit and you knew it.

[Jay Williams]

Yeah, because I wasn't. I wasn't. Basketball wasn't fun anymore. Yeah, it was something that I felt like I wanted to do because I don't. I don't know what else Jason can do besides the sport that he was told by so many people he was

[Interviewer]

great at doing, which at some point, I think every athlete has to come to terms with. When your body no longer can physically perform the way it did in your youth. But you didn't expect that to happen at 21, maybe 35, 40, you would have expected that to happen.

[Jay Williams]

You know, I look at a lot of my friends, too. I mean, friends who, you know, lose a parent, and they thought that, you know, I think, hey, my parents are going to be around forever. Well, that's not reality. They're eventually going to pass. And how am I going to deal with that? Or if you lose your job or if you go through a divorce? Everybody has some form of adversity that they go through in their life. And are you cognizant enough to try to surround yourself with people who are invested in you? And I found out who was on my bus when I went through my accident. And I found out people who were invested in me. Me, the person, my foundation, who I was, not what I brought to the table. Because I had a lot of people that were enjoying the ride.

[Interviewer]

So what happened? The friends.

[Jay Williams]

Oh, disappeared.

[Interviewer]

They disappeared.

[Jay Williams]

Disappeared. Maybe one phone call, hey, how are you? Checking in on you and never heard of again. It was mind blowing to me. And that made me sad, too, because I thought. I thought, wow, I have connection with some of these people. These people are. These people were my friends. These people are people I relied upon. You know, I looked to for support and guidance, and people were gone. Yeah, in a heartbeat.

[Interviewer]

But I do remember reading that you looked up and there was Coach K in the room.

[Jay Williams]

He was.

[Interviewer]

He's just.

[Jay Williams]

He's an unbelievable person.

[Oprah Winfrey]

Duke University head basketball coach Mike Krzyzewski, also known to Fans worldwide as Coach K is the winningest men's coach in NCAA history. Widely respected as a mentor, friend, and often a father figure to his players, Coach K has supported Jay Williams through every step of his recovery.

[Jay Williams]

The night of my accident, I'm on my back and I have a tube down my throat. All these pins inserted in my body, and people were running around frantically. There's, you know, my mom, my dad, and Coach K. Coach K was there holding my hand, and before I could even say, I'm never going to be able to walk again, yet alone, maybe play again, he handed me a pendant that I still have to this day. And he said, you give this back to me when you play again. You give this back to me when you play again, because you are going to play again. Now, the funny thing about that is that at that time, I thought playing again meant basketball, but I was going to be playing in a bigger game than basketball could ever be and playing in the game of life. And I got a second chance. And we still talk about that's what that statement meant.

[Interviewer]

Do you think it took a motorcycle crash for you to see who you really are?

[Jay Williams]

Yes.

[Interviewer]

Do you think it took a motorcycle crash for other people to see you for who you really are?

[Jay Williams]

I think people finally now are starting to see who I am because I've recently found out who Jason is. And I think that was the most challenging step for me, is that I had to not control it and kind of let God take his path.

[Interviewer]

I understand it took you years to even let people see the scar, right?

[Jay Williams]

Yeah. I mean, I got a scar that goes literally from here all the way up to here on my thigh. And I got a fasciotomy. So I have, you know, five slits. I have one here, one here, one here, one here, and one right here where they had to release the pressure. And I have a slit on the side of my foot and on the top of my foot that are pretty long.

[Interviewer]

So you get reminded every day.

[Jay Williams]

Yeah. And I still. I mean, I can't walk properly. I have drop foot. So there's always going to be some kind of a limp I'm going to have. And the difficult thing was this. The stare that I was used to having was. I think you can relate to this, is if you were to walk through the airport, somebody that's Oprah, you know, or somebody who was in Chicago, think, oh, that's Jay Williams. He plays for the Bulls. And how that look quickly went from that look to, oh, my God, poor kid. That's the Kid, he got in an accident and I didn't know how to

[Interviewer]

handle that look from people's adoration to people's perceived.

[Oprah Winfrey]

Yeah, yeah.

[Jay Williams]

And at 21, I made an idiotic mistake that instead of being defined now at 33, like, oh, he's a 10 year all star. People still say to me, he's an analyst now, but he's a guy that threw away his career or what could have Jay been if he didn't get hurt, you know? And now it's funny because now I have a better sense of understanding about who I am and what I stand for. So when people come up to me and say, I'm so sorry, I'm like, you have nothing to be sorry about. I have everything to be thankful for. You could have been sorry if I was not here, if I had passed away. But I am here and I am making the best out of this life. I have a second chance.

[Interviewer]

I understand that despite the crash, that you don't feel that your destiny has changed.

[Jay Williams]

No, I still feel like my destiny is going to be great. It's just a different vehicle. I thought that vehicle was basketball, and now I think that vehicle is doing television.

[Interviewer]

Yeah. I read where Coach K said jason Williams, the basketball player, died. And I love what you said. For many years, you were still chasing the ghost of that.

[Oprah Winfrey]

Mm.

[Jay Williams]

I was chasing something that everybody else wanted me to be because it never took time to realize who Jason really was.

[Interviewer]

Yeah. So I think the question for everybody listening or watching is what ghosts are you still chasing? Because as long as you're chasing the ghosts of the past, you can never fully, literally live in and absorb the present moment or do whatever it is you're supposed to do.

[Jay Williams]

I don't think I'm chasing any ghosts right now. I don't think I'm chasing anybody. I think I'm on my own. I'm in my own race. And I think that's. It's the most rewarding feeling I've ever had in my life because for a long time, all I did was relive my past mistakes. And you know what's interesting is that I held on to a lot of dissension to my dad for a long time because of the mistakes he made in his past. And I was finally able to forgive my father for the mistakes he made because I learned how to forgive myself. And I didn't know if I was ever going to be able to forgive myself. And I finally have. And it's gratifying to wake up and to smile and to watch a sport that I still love and be able to talk about it and not be bothersome to me.

[Interviewer]

Yeah.

[Jay Williams]

And to put that energy into my

[Interviewer]

life, I think that would be really hard, that you can forgive yourself. But then it's like, I don't want to watch basketball. I don't want to see any basketball. But not only that. Now you're in the business of analyzing it.

[Jay Williams]

Exactly. And I thrive off it. I love it. And I.

[Interviewer]

And can you do that and not have a longing for it? I mean, like, in the beginning, could you do it, talk about it, be present with it, and not think, God, I wish that was me.

[Jay Williams]

No way. Not in the beginning. Not in the beginning, no. I mean, I actually. I worked for ESPN for two years, and then I quit because I couldn't do it.

[Interviewer]

Yeah.

[Jay Williams]

And I would constantly reevaluate. This is. If I was 24, this is where I would be in my career then.

[Interviewer]

I would be making this much by now. Exactly.

[Jay Williams]

Yeah. It was always trying to adjust.

[Interviewer]

That's what you were doing. That's chasing the ghost.

[Jay Williams]

Exactly. And now when I watch the game and kids say, hey, you were. I was like, yeah, I was back then, but this is who I am now.

[Interviewer]

Wow.

[Jay Williams]

And this is great. Yeah, I love that.

[Interviewer]

And so anybody who's going through their own setback, their own challenge, their own difficulty, their own crash, what. What is your best advice to them?

[Jay Williams]

I was lucky enough to form a committee for every successful business. They have a board. Yeah, right. A board of advisors. And my mother was on my board. My dad was on my board. My girlfriend at the time was on my board. Coach K was on my board, had some other really good people, and what I did with them is I sat down and I went through the pros and cons about what is Jason good at, what is Jason like? Never took time to actually think about what are my passions.

[Interviewer]

You built another kind of team.

[Jay Williams]

Exactly, Exactly. That's a great way of putting it.

[Interviewer]

Would you say you're now living in a space of happiness?

[Jay Williams]

I think I'm happier. I think I could be a lot happier when I find somebody I can share my life with and I can have a family, you know, one of the most.

[Interviewer]

You are having trouble doing that?

[Jay Williams]

I am.

[Interviewer]

Really?

[Jay Williams]

I am.

[Interviewer]

With every. I got a list of women for you.

[Jay Williams]

Okay, well, you could be my intel, then. How about that?

[Interviewer]

God. Can I help you? Oh, honest to goodness, I never heard a guy in your position who's, like, having trouble finding somebody. Really?

[Jay Williams]

You know, I think when I. When I went through my accident and I shattered my pelvis, I couldn't. I didn't know if I was going to be able to have kids because I didn't know if I was going to be able to get erect ever again. And I think that all of a sudden that put a lot of things into perspective. I think I started to think about, will I be able to dance with my daughter one day when she gets married? Will I be able to show my son how to round first base? And this is really weird for me for a guy to say, because I don't think it was until a couple of years ago until I really had this internal shift where, okay, I know who I am now, I know what I stand for, and I feel comfortable with where I'm at. I can't wait to have a family. I cannot wait to be a dad and a loyal husband.

[Interviewer]

Isn't it interesting? Didn't you also have a dream about that?

[Jay Williams]

I did.

[Interviewer]

You did?

[Jay Williams]

I did.

[Interviewer]

And what was the dream?

[Jay Williams]

It was a dream that I just. I was living on the water and I took a tennis ball and I threw it out into the ocean and I had a dog that went and went to go get it. And my wife was. I don't even know what my wife looked like, but she was by my side and I had these kids that were playing around on the beach. And I just remember being in a state of peace of mind where I was just very tranquil and I was very relaxed. And I just remember this is what life should be.

[Interviewer]

So can you have children now?

[Jay Williams]

Yes, I can. I can. Yes, I can. Trust me.

[Interviewer]

Oh, that's great.

[Jay Williams]

Very, very thankful for that. And this is my path. This is my path.

[Interviewer]

Happy for you.

[Jay Williams]

Thank you.

[Interviewer]

Thank you for sharing.

[Jay Williams]

Thank you so much for having me.

[Interviewer]

That's beautiful. Thank you.

[Jay Williams]

You are wonderful.

[Oprah Winfrey]

Appreciate it. I'm Oprah Winfrey and you've been listening to Super Soul Conversations, the podcast. You can follow Super Soul on Instagram, Twitter and Facebook. If you haven't yet, go to Apple Podcasts and subscribe.

[Interviewer]

Rate and review this podcast.

[Oprah Winfrey]

Join me next week for another Super Soul Conversation.

[Interviewer]

Thank you for listening.

[Pharmaceutical Advertiser]

Eczema is unpredictable, but you can flare less with ebglis, a once monthly treatment for moderate to severe eczema. After an initial four month or longer dosing phase, about 4 in 10 people taking EPGLIS achieved itch relief and clear or almost clear skin at 16 weeks. And most of those people maintain skin that's still more clear at one year with monthly dosing.

Hempclus Lebricizumab LBKZ a 250mg 2ml injection, is a prescription medicine used to treat adults and children 12 years of age and older who weigh at least 88 pounds or 40 kilograms with moderate to severe eczema, also called atopic dermatitis, that is not well controlled with prescription therapies used on the skin or topicals, or who cannot use topical therapies. Eglis can be used with or without topical corticosteroids. Don't use if you're allergic to Ecglis. Allergic reactions can occur that can be severe. Eye problems can occur. Tell your doctor if you have new or worsening eye problems. You should not receive a live vaccine when treated with ebglis. Before starting Eglis, tell your doctor if you have a parasitic infection.

Ask your doctor about eglis and visit ebgliss.lilly.com or call 1-800-lilyrx or 1-800-545-5979.

[Redfin Advertiser]

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