Summary5 min read

Podcast Episode Summary

Optimal Finance Daily #3480: “Should You Die With Zero?”

Original Post by Nick Maggiulli (Of Dollars and Data)
Host: Diania Merriam
Date: March 6, 2026

Episode Overview

This episode explores the provocative question posed by Bill Perkins’ book Die With Zero: Should you strive to spend your wealth over your lifetime, rather than leaving a large inheritance? Diania Merriam narrates and comments on Nick Maggiulli’s analysis, which challenges the traditional anxiety around retirement savings. The episode examines data on retirees’ spending behaviors, inheritance timing, and the psychological trade-off between saving and fully experiencing life. Diania reflects on her personal stance on inheritance and encourages mindful, intentional enjoyment of wealth.

Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. The Paradox of Retirement Saving Anxiety

Widespread Anxiety: “One of the most common personal finance questions I get asked is Am I saving enough?... 48% of US adults experienced high or moderate levels of anxiety around their level of savings.” (01:09)
Reality Check: Data actually shows that most retirees are not running out of money; in fact, retirees tend to withdraw less than their investments earn.

2. Retiree Wealth Tends to Increase with Age

Wealth Preservation: Only about 14% of retirees draw down their principal yearly; the rest live off investment earnings. (02:08)
Surprising Stats: “The average retired adult who dies in their 60s leaves behind $296,000 in net worth, $313,000 in their 70s, $315,000 in their 80s, and $238,000 in their 90s.” (02:34)
Insight: Retiree wealth actually tends to go up with age, implying many may be saving more than necessary.

3. Bill Perkins’ “Die With Zero” Principle

Central Idea: “You should try to die with zero dollars to your name. Every dollar that you didn’t spend while alive is wasted life energy.” (03:17)
Reasoning: Money not spent while living is either unnecessarily earned or a missed chance to positively impact heirs earlier.

4. Inheritance: Timing Over Amount

When Do Heirs Benefit Most?: “The age of inheritance receipt peaks at around 60... roughly the same number of people receive inheritances at age 40 as at age 80.” (04:03)
The Twitter Poll Thought Experiment:
- Given three inheritance options:
  - $250k at age 30
  - $500k at age 40
  - $1M at age 50
    70% preferred $250k at age 30, showing a strong preference for having money earlier in life—even if the sum is smaller. (05:02)
Key Quote: “Even when we offer people a return stream that is basically unmatched in the investment world, the vast majority of them would still prefer to have less money earlier in time.” (06:04)

5. The Trade-off Between Time and Money

Life Impact: “What good is an inheritance if you’re too old to use it?” (06:25)
Optimal Giving: Perkins’ view: “…by giving my money to my kids and other people at a time when it can have the greatest impact on their lives, I’m making it their money, not mine.” (06:43)

6. The Complexities of ‘Dying With Zero’

Challenges: It’s difficult to plan perfectly—questions of fairness, timing, and the right amount are hard to solve.
Quote on Planning: “This is what makes financial planning an art as much as a science.” (07:10)
Conclusion: Striving for “closer to zero” is a worthy goal; Die With Zero challenges readers to re-evaluate their money mindset.

Diania Merriam’s Commentary & Reflections

7. Savings Habits in the FIRE Community

Over-saving Caution: “Over saving can provide an illusion of safety… at a certain point the money we leave behind becomes a representation of how much life we didn’t live.” (10:29)
Personal Example: A friend, Mark, created a “fun fund” to ensure he spends more on enjoyment after early retirement.

8. Rethinking Inheritance as a Responsibility

Challenging Traditions: “Some people feel it’s their responsibility to leave their children an inheritance, but I would challenge this line of thinking.” (10:57)
Financial Literacy Priority: “It’s your responsibility to help your children become financially literate so that they don’t need your inheritance.” (11:06)
Her Personal Wish: “If it were up to me, my mom would spend every last penny living her best life and leave me nothing.” (11:14)

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

On the goal of retirement savings:
“This suggests that more people should be asking the question, am I saving too much? Rather than Am I saving enough?” — Nick Maggiulli (02:14)
On inheritance timing:
“What good is an inheritance if you’re too old to use it?” — Nick Maggiulli (06:25)
On financial parenting:
“It’s your responsibility to help your children become financially literate so that they don’t need your inheritance.” — Diania Merriam (11:06)
On enjoying wealth:
“At a certain point the money we leave behind becomes a representation of how much life we didn’t live.” — Diania Merriam (10:33)

Key Timestamps

01:09 — Nick introduces the common anxiety about savings and the evidence retirees aren’t spending down assets.
02:34 — Data on how retiree net worth often increases with age.
03:17 — Introduction to “Die With Zero” and its main argument.
05:02 — Results from Twitter inheritance poll favoring money earlier.
10:29 — Diania discusses the pitfalls of over-saving, referencing FIRE movement tendencies.
11:06 — Diania's perspective on inheritance and financial literacy.

Summary Takeaways

Many retirees underspend, leaving larger than necessary inheritances, often received by heirs late in life.
Die With Zero encourages a shift: plan to use your wealth earlier for meaningful experiences and timely gifts to loved ones.
The challenge is balancing prudent financial planning with living fully, embracing the idea that maximizing both money and life’s enjoyment takes thoughtfulness, not just discipline.
Diania reinforces that the ultimate financial legacy isn’t a sum of money, but the ability to live well and empower others to do the same.

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Transcript4 lines

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this is Optimal Finance Daily should you'd die with zero? By Nick Magiulli of of dollarsanddata.com One of the most common personal finance questions I get asked is Am I saving enough? Whether we're discussing saving for retirement and a child's education, or something else entirely, many people are worried about the size of their nest egg. In fact, 48% of US adults experienced high or moderate levels of anxiety around their level of savings, According to Northwestern Mutual's 2018 Planning and Progress Study. Despite this anxiety, the evidence suggests that the opposite seems to be true. Many individuals seem to be saving too much. As I stated in Chapter two of Just Keep Buying, the Investments and Wealth Institute reported, across all wealth levels, 58% of retirees withdraw less than their investments earn, 26% withdraw up to the amount the portfolio earns, and 14% are drawing down principal. This means that only about one in seven retirees are withdrawing principal within a given year. The remaining retirees are living off their investment or less than what their investments earn annually. The end result of this behavior is lots of money left to heirs. Once again, from Chapter two of Just Keep Buying, According to a study by United Income, the average retired adult who dies in their 60s leaves behind $296,000 in net worth, $313,000 in their 70s, 315,000 in their 80s, and 238,000 in their 90s. Surprisingly, retiree wealth tends to go up, not down, with age. This suggests that more people should be asking the question, am I saving too much? Rather than Am I saving enough? This is the primary idea behind Die with zero by Bill Perkins in it, Perkins presents a radical new way to think about saving and spending money. Namely, that you should try to die with zero dollars to your name. His reasoning is simple. Every dollar that you didn't spend while alive is wasted life energy. It's money that you never needed to work for in the first place, or money that could have been given to heirs earlier in time. Either way, Perkins comes to the same conclusion. You should aim to die with zero. Of course, this is easier said than done. With all the uncertainties surrounding retirement, I.e. living longer, health issues, etc. The risks associated with striving to die with zero are considerable. Running out of money when you're unable or unwilling to work is not something that should be taken lightly. Despite this very real risk, Perkins argument seems to be a move in the right direction. Given the inheritance data presented, dying with zero or closer to zero would be an improvement over the status quo. Why? Because, as the saying goes, wealth is wasted on the old. This is especially true when it comes to inheritances. As Perkins notes, for any income group you look at, the age of inheritance receipt peaks at around 60. In other words, if you were betting on how old someone will be when they inherit money, assuming that you know nothing else except that they stand to inherit, 60 is your best bet. More importantly, as Perkins explains, the distribution of the age when people receive an inheritance is a bell curve. This means that roughly the same number of people receive inheritances at age 40 as at age 80. But is this what heirs actually want? Do people want to wait for an inheritance, or would they prefer less money earlier in time? To find out, I asked Twitter the following Imagine you'll receive an inheritance from a distant relative who you've never met. However, you have to choose when and how much you'll receive. Assuming all amounts are adjusted for inflation, which would you prefer? 250,000 at age 30, 500,000 at age 40, or a million dollars at age 50? After more than 17,000 votes, the answer was overwhelmingly 250,000 at age 30. Among those who answered, 70% chose the 250 at age 30, 16% chose a million at 50, and 14% chose 500,000 at 40. This is true despite the fact that the implied return on your money by delaying your inheritance from age 30 to 40 or 50 would be over 7% per year in real terms. To give you some context on how amazing 7% real returns are, consider the fact that the US stock market provided real returns of 6.9% since 1926. So not only would delaying your inheritance in the example discussed provide you with a higher return than US stocks, but that return would have been guaranteed for decades as well. Think about that. Even when we offer people a return stream that is basically unmatched in the investment world, the vast majority of them would still prefer to have less money earlier in time. Why does this matter? Because your heirs probably feel the same way. Just like my Twitter audience, the people you will eventually gift money to would most likely prefer to receive that money earlier in time, even if it's a smaller amount. Ultimately, this thought experiment exemplifies the trade off between time and money, and why the optionality associated with money earlier in life is so valuable to people. After all, what good is an inheritance if you're too old to use it? Of all the points made in Daiwa Zero, this seems to be the most compelling. As Perkins states, by giving my money to my kids and other people at a time when it can have the greatest impact on their lives, I'm making it their money, not mine. Of course, it's easy to say Die with zero in theory, but it's much more difficult in practice. There are tons of unaddressed issues at play. How do you give your money away fairly? When is the right time to give it? How much should you give? I wish I had all the answers to these questions, but this is what makes financial planning an art as much as a science. Ultimately, dying with zero is no easy task, but dying with closer to zero seems like a worthy goal that we should all strive for. Either way, it's rare for a book to change the way I look at money, but Die with Zero succeeded after I read it earlier this year. I can only hope that it will have a similar impact on you. You just listened to the post titled should you'd die with zero? By Nick Magiulli of Of Dollars and dot com the new year always gets
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a fantastic book that is often discussed within the fire community. This is a group of people who have made diligently saving and investing in a grained habit and it's typical for them to save too much over saving can provide an illusion of safety. It's really easy to convince ourselves that we're being financially responsible when we focus our efforts here, but at a certain point the money we leave behind becomes a representation of how much life we didn't live. This article made me think of my friend Mark, who retired in his early 50s with more money than he needs. After encouragement from some other five friends, he puts some money into what he calls his fun fund. He's challenging himself to spend a certain amount of money every year on himself or others, purely for fun. Some people feel it's their responsibility to leave their children an inheritance, but I would challenge this line of thinking. From my perspective, it's your responsibility to help your children become financially literate so that they don't need your inheritance. And as mentioned in this article, many people receive inheritances at a time in their life when they're already financially stable. If it were up to me, my mom would spend every last penny living her best life and leave me nothing. And that concludes another installment of Optimal Finance Daily. Thanks, as always, for joining. Have a great rest of your day and I'll see you again tomorrow, where your optimal life awaits.