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- [00:11]
A
Welcome to Other World. I'm your host, Jack Wagner. This episode comes to us from a man named Connor and his wife Lacey. At the time that all this took place, Connor and Lacey had just left Mormonism, which they had been raised in their entire life. This was a very big change for Connor and because of it, he had a complete crisis of faith. He experienced a complete 180 in his beliefs about the spiritual. And when we interviewed him, Connor referred to himself as being a cringe Reddit atheist. He is not the first person to come on the show and describe himself that way. I think a lot of people who grew up in very religious households end up having a complete reversal, like Conor, and they end up being a person who goes out of their way to try to disprove other people's beliefs. So Connor had a hardline, skeptical belief until one day some strange things begin to happen in his house that seem to be connected to a certain family heirloom that was being stored in the closet. This episode is titled Heirloom and you'd're listening to Otherworld.
- [01:40]
B
Hello, is this Bobby? Yes, it is. At its core, the science you can't argue. I'm sorry about is up in the sky.
- [01:47]
A
It's almost frustrating that it's happening.
- [01:49]
C
I'm literally, I'm going to die.
- [01:51]
B
Its limbs were just like, wrong.
- [01:54]
D
Everybody moves back into the light, even if it takes them a minute.
- [02:23]
B
So I'm Connor Cox. I'm from Mesa, Arizona. I was born and raised here. I've spent most of my life here. It's only been like maybe a nine month period where I was living in Oregon and I was actually on a Mormon mission. My parents were very, I guess you'd call them devout Mormons. It sounds weird, but yeah, they were. They were very devout Mormons. I wasn't really given a lot of choice or like freedom growing up. It was kind of. It was a. We had a very strict, very structured household. So, like, for example, my parents would go through our music, like our song, and go through like the song lyrics, decide which content they wanted us listening to. And like, even beyond swear words, like they were worried about like subversive ideas, stuff like that. So that was my life. And then I ended up actually going to serve a mission. And so a Mormon mission with that is once you reach a certain age, what you do is you go out and you basically try and convert people to Mormonism in a very structured sort of way. They send out the missionaries and all that. While it is like voluntary, it's kind of the only choice you have if you want to be, like a good Mormon, that is what you need to do. At least as a Mormon, man, that was an expectation. I ended up serving a mission at least nine months of one. I came home because I got lyme disease. I think just my overall experience with that is actually the first thing that kind of made me start doubting Mormonism. I kind of decided I didn't think what they were saying was the truth, and I didn't believe that the church was actually like, God's hand in our life. Now it just seemed like it was an organization, and it seemed like they were even kind of corrupt and doing a lot of bad stuff. So that causes a full faith crisis is what I would call it. When your entire worldview and just everything, your whole outlook was based on this very structured belief system, you try and leave that belief system or try and kind of like, take that framework out of it, you're gone. It's like, what do I believe about anything? What happens when I die? What is the point of this? What's going on? What do I wake up for? Everything goes into question or even, like, is honesty good? It's just like, everything. Like, you gotta. You gotta figure it all out for yourself. And that's kind of the process I had to go through rebuilding my belief system without that framework that I was started with for that the first 20 years of my life growing up. And like, with Mormonism, a lot of the kind of paranormal stuff, either either they've come up with, like, a good Mormon answer for it, or you don't talk about it, and we don't talk about that. So specifically, I'm thinking, like, ghosts. I remember growing up, like, even trying to, like, talk ghost stories and that stuff. My dad was very quick to, like, shut it down. He'd say things like, oh, these kind of conversations invite these, like, bad things, was basically what his answer was for it. But so we never talked about it, and so we never really got to, like, explore that or really go there after Mormonism. So after I kind of left that belief system, decided that wasn't true. And, like, that wasn't really how you get close to God or. I actually, at that point, didn't think there was a God. I thought that maybe that was another deception that kind of, I think maybe threw the baby out with the bathwater and was like, oh, yeah, no more God. Like, no more Jesus, no more spirituality. Like, none of that stuff exists. It's not real. It's a trick to get you Tithing like, and that's where I was at. And so I kind of was definitely very jaded. And that kind of turned, I would say, like cringe. Reddit atheist. It was very like, if we cannot prove it in a laboratory setting, it doesn't exist anymore because someone hijacked my feeling system. Now I can't trust that. So it's like out the window. That's where I was at for a while, like a long time. And it's wild that I was in that headspace when this experience happened. So I'm actually not positive how the. I mean, it's good that you'll be talking to my wife for this because I'm not sure how the doll came into our lives. We'd recently moved in together. We'd been together a few years, but it's kind of still in that new period where like just stuff appears and like you're like, oh, there's more stuff. So the doll just kind of appeared one day in a closet. And I believe that she. It's like an heirloom or something she can explain.
- [06:53]
D
My name is Lacey. Connor is my husband. We've been together for about 10 years. When I was growing up, for some reason I really liked glass dolls. I thought that they were really pretty and I enjoyed collecting them. So this specific doll was given to me by my grandmother on my dad's side that's passed away. I'd gone through my doll collection when I moved out or as I got older and chose specific ones to keep. And this is one that I kept because of it's fact, the fact that it was given to me by my grandmother. She was really little and had really pretty like red curly hair and a blue dress that had like lace and stuff sewn on the edges of it. I had this doll in a cardboard box and I just stored it in our closet and called it good because obviously I wasn't going to put those up in my house anymore. But it was kind of just like a nostalgic thing and I don't know, a weird attachment thing that I just, I just kept it.
- [07:58]
B
The way that I came into knowing we even had these was that I had a dream and it was a really weird dream. It was like all the features and all the details of my house were the same. Like everything was spot on. It just was like hazy, like super blurry and hazy and dreamy. Like this doesn't feel like the real normal version of my house. At some point in my dream, I ended up opening like one of our Closets in the hallway. And there was a woman just like standing right there. And she had deep red, like, ringlet tight, curly hair. And the doll had. I mean, it was like white complexion. So it was like a white complexion. Same with the woman had a white complexion. Otherwise, though, I don't remember many details about, like, what she was wearing or anything in the dream that was. Feels weird to say this, but it's like, that wasn't what I was supposed to see is how I feel about it now. And that's like a wild way to say it. But it was like the face was important. Like, if you were painting a picture, you would want this thing to be detailed. And then this other thing that's in the painting that you don't want it to be as important, you wouldn't paint as detailed. That's like how it was in the dream. It was more like, I'm showing myself to you and here's my face. The clothing was not important. And that wasn't what I was supposed to see. It was just to look in her face because it was very, like, cloth too. I mean, like a person standing in that closet, there's not a lot of room. Like, she barely fits in there. So it was like, oh, wow, there's someone right here. And it was just like, hi. Kind of energy. Not that she said anything. That's pretty much all. I remember that that startled me awake. But I ended up telling my wife about the dream and her kind of first answer, like, instinct. She actually was just like. She started going through family members of hers. Cause again, like, she's much more, like, in touch with spiritual stuff than I am. And so she was just kind of like, oh, was that my great aunt this person? Or like, grandma this person? Or like, this going through people and like, looked at pictures of them to try and match. It took her a while, and I think, yeah, eventually she just was kind of like, there's a doll. Like, there's a doll in that closet, and the doll has. Has curly red hair like that. Then we kind of ended up going over there and looking at it. What the hell? Like, wait, there's like. It's just like, yeah, that doll resembles the person that appeared in my dream. That. What? That is deeply alarming. It was a lot. It was a lot looking at that doll. And I don't know that I believed anything still even that happened. And I was still kind of like, yeah, like, that's weird. I was more comfortable with the idea of like, maybe I had been through that closet and subconsciously, I'd seen the doll. So that had entered my subconscious and was in my brain. And my brain, you know, it popped out that way. It's convoluted, but, like, sure. I guess I just kind of like, left that experience on a shelf until just in the course of us living together and in that house, the doll got moved from that closet to our personal bedroom closet. And I had a white noise generator that I was using. It was just an app on my phone that kind of made, like, rain sounds. I would turn this thing on, and as I was going to sleep, it was like I could hear chattering, like, talking. This is the hardest part to describe to you because it was like, through the white noise. It was like, you know when someone who's very talented with the guitar, like, uses the guitar to make it sound like the guitar's talking? It's like that. Like, it's like taking. It was like the sounds of talking without the consonants being super hard. Like, it was like they were trying to do it, but it was like, only sort of on the edge of perception. But I would hear this voice talking to me at night. It was this woman, and she would just chatter about things that were going on in my life. Like, just totally random stuff. Sometimes it was just talking at me while I was trying to go to sleep. And it was like somebody that. Like just a real chitter chatter person that just wants to chatter about whatever. Like, it's not really that important. It's more that they're talking and you're listening and we're here together of thing. But like, that. That was happening to me while I was trying to sleep. It was like, really, like, mundane stuff at first. Like, oh, I can't believe she said that. Gossip. Like, dumb gossip. Like, it was like, yeah. And then this person was doing this and I don't know, I kind of. The way the guy was kind of looking into you was kind of like this. It was basically like, I live here too, and I'm observing the people too. And here's my commentary. A little bit really mundane, little gossipy stuff at first. And then even, like, to where I felt like, oh, yeah, this thing clearly doesn't. Like, my friend Chris for some reason, like, the way she talks about him is more negative and more antagonistic. It was like this person has opinions of people and is chattering away at me. When it got really bad, it started to get a little bit more, I would just say, like, targeted. Oh, it doesn't like that person. And it's clearly, like, trying to convince me of stuff. It was, like, actively trying to tell me that my wife was lying to me about certain stuff. Like, very specific things. Even, like, things that she had said in the house. Like, I mean, like, things that it was here for. I guess if it was around. But it'd be like, no, she's lying. Like, she's trying to. She's lying to you and, like, you're the butt end of the joke. Like, that kind of very negative, like, paranoia level. It was. It started leaning into that and trying to, like, make me doubt myself. And I think it wanted to separate me and my wife, too, for whatever reason. That's something I felt like it had intentions on and things it tried to do. I thought that was in my head 100%. Like, I was like, damn. Like, I'm now having auditory hallucinations at night every night. I was like, what is going on? I feel like all these thoughts could have come from my mind, I guess. Like, I could just be making this up. I was positive that's what was going on. One big thing that convinced me it was not was when I started telling my wife, Lacey, about some of these experiences I was having. Like, these dreams and these. These talking and like, it was disturbing me while I was trying to go to sleep. And when she did is just straight up, like, vocalized to it in our. In our room. Like, she just like, hey, stop.
- [14:24]
D
I decided to, like, outright say in the room, like, hey, if you're a spirit and you're here, it's fine that you're here. Just don't bother us when we're sleeping. Just leave us alone. Like, don't put dreams and stuff in Connor's head. Just leave us be. And called it good. I went through a nice age that evening as well and didn't really think
- [14:41]
B
much of it that night. We're laying down. I'm going to sleep. She's going to sleep. I hear the phrase, are you sleeping? Like, whispered out kind of snarkily, like, kind of like she said, like, oh, don't mess with him while he's going to sleep. And she's like, are you sleeping? Like, are you here? Are we good to talk? For, like, it was like, are you sleeping? But my wife also heard this.
- [15:06]
D
We were going to bed, and I heard in a woman's voice, like, a question, sleeping.
- [15:14]
B
We both just kind of froze at the moment. I don't know what you do. If it is a thing in my head, I shouldn't engage with it. If it's a real entity in my room. I probably also shouldn't engage with it. Like, it's. Either way, don't touch. So, like, I kind of just was like, freeze. Pretend you're asleep. Like, just don't. Don't talk to it. Don't engage with it. But then we ended up talking the
- [15:36]
D
next day in the morning, Connor, we basically started getting onto the topic of, like, hey, did you hear that last night? Did you hear that? Like, I heard sleeping as, like, a question, and he was like, oh, my gosh. Yeah, no, I heard that same thing.
- [15:51]
B
That sent a cold chill down my spine again, though. I still kind of thought it was in my head. Like, I was like, damn, I'm messing up my wife now. I don't know. Like, I know. Like, we live in a world of, like, the placebo and the nocebo effect, where we know. Like, if you do not believe that this medication is gonna help you, even if mechanistically it was going to help you, you can undo it. You can stop it with your beliefs. Like, and so I was like, maybe via that power, I am making a thing that's messing with me now. That was more reasonable to me than that. There were forces that I didn't understand existing outside of me, especially for, like, the time period where I'm going to sleep, you know, like, entering sleep or entering the dream world. I'm willing to believe, like, I could. All kinds of weird nonsense could probably happen there. Like, I'm willing to believe that. So that's kind of like, whatever. It wasn't until, like, she heard it too, that I started to believe. I still, again, was still kind of thinking somehow I could be a cause of it or a big factor in it existing, but that there was a thing going on. It was like, no, no, I can't deny it. I was like, that makes no sense for me to deny that. Me and my wife heard the same thing talk last night. I can't. We did hear something, and then the nightmare started. It was like every night. Like, it was like, this is what happens when you go to sleep now. So the dreams themselves, the thing that really sticks out to me that I remember the most is just how they felt. Like, the particular details I don't quite remember, they were all just like. I was in different situations in a weird, blurry version of my house. But it was like, a lot of them. It's like I always got captured. Like, a thing gets me in these dreams. And I don't know how to describe this other than this Is how it feels and, like, how it occurred to me. But the thing that was getting me in the dreams is also the same. And I don't know how to tell you, like, why I know that, but that's like. That was. That was a theme that I was very, like, conscious of. The whole time was like, the same thing is getting me in my dreams, even if it didn't always look the same. But basically all the dreams centered around, like, an entity of some kind being in my house. Like, there was another person here. And that other person kept making themselves known in the dream or charging at me in the dream. I had her grab my shoulders and, like, scream at me. Like in a dream before, too. It got consistent. And I guess bad enough that I actually had to start training myself. I started just. Anytime that entity or anything started to feel awry or uncomfortable in a dream, I would just start screaming. Like, just screaming bloody murder. And what that would do is usually make me start screaming in real life and would usually wake me up to get out. Because it was like, I actually don't feel like I have any avenue in these dreams to do anything about this. Like, I'm gonna just keep being terrorized. So it just got to the point I was like, okay, well, we're gonna develop an eject button and call it Good. So as a person or looked person. It always looked like a person. And I do wanna make that distinction. I guess it felt like it was like its face. Sometimes in my dreams would change. It would change its face in front of me. And there was a time it had changed its face, like, to my wife's face, and then, like, off of. And then, like. And then undid it. And it was like, that was terrifying. Like, that was a threat. I don't. Like. I don't know what that, you know. So it kind of changed shape, but it was always centered around it being a person. And it was always a person that was like a. I would say like a tall person. Like six, five, like six something. They're not muscular. They were kind of thinner. Its features would change, or it could change its features, but generally it had curly. Like, it seemed like the curly radiation. Like, the doll features were more like the. I don't know, like, the normal or the base or, like, what it would go back to. But, like, that was at least a strong, consistent thing. There was. There's dreams of being pulled by my ankles completely out of the bed by force by this thing. There was times where it felt like it was just looming over me, which is kind of a that was a common theme in both the dreams and in in I guess even waking life.
- [20:21]
A
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- [21:56]
C
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- [23:07]
B
It started to be more active during the day. Like there's A time we were talking about it, my wife and I. And while we were talking about it, this is like midday. We're getting ready, like, maybe 11 o' clock or something. We just hear a disembodied voice, like, just come out of the bedroom, probably like 10ft from us. Like, where it sounded like, originated from. Hey, like. And that was it. And it was. It was a girl voice as well, but it was. It was. Hey.
- [23:36]
D
I think I had just gotten out of the shower and Connor was getting dressed or something, and we both heard hey really loudly from across the room. The voice that we heard was obviously a woman's voice, and it was. She was obviously in the room with us. So we both react and look over and then look at each other, and we're like, you heard that, right? Like, yep. Okay.
- [23:56]
B
We're both like, just kind of like, what the hell? Like, did you. Did you hear that? And, like, we just didn't really engage with it, but, like, something was acting out.
- [24:05]
D
There was a couple times where she seemed to be almost messing with me. Like, I remember one night, Connor was working really late. We worked opposite shifts for a little while, so he was an overnight shift and I was a day shift. So I was in bed alone this night. And I was, like, looking. You know how you look at your phone? You scroll through TikTok and stuff at night I was just laying there, mindlessly scrolling in bed where I had this. This experience where she or this some sort of entity, like, rushed me and, like, passed through my phone and came, like, at my face and was making a face at me. And it made me, like, physically jump. It was a really pale face. That was the only thing that I could really glean from it was that its face was really pale. It was almost white. And it didn't really have any distinguishing features other than it was making this, like. Like, it was taunting me. Like, it was smiling. Like, it was excited about, like, screwing with me. It wanted to get a reaction out of me. It wanted me to jump.
- [25:05]
B
It got very bad. Like, the. The dream started to get very aggressive. And what happened was my dog, one of our dogs, a corgi, got to it. Just bored, anxious, looking for something to do. Ended up finding something in the closet that's made of, like, you know, paperboard, like, the box that the. The doll's in. And so, like, chewed into that and started getting into that and ended up, I guess, I don't know if it ended up damaging the doll or just getting to the doll, but that was something we Discovered after I had started having really bad nightmares. So we discovered the dog got to it, and it was, like, chewed up. So of course, we moved the box. Like, we don't want this to keep happening. Move the box somewhere else. By locating in different rooms. We moved it into the guest room just to see what that would do. And, like, there's a dream that really sticks out to me. It was a nightmare where I was in the house again, house as is. And this dark. It's like a silhouette of a person. It was like a dark person shaped nothing. But it was charging full speed, like, I'm gonna tackle you, murder you. Like, just full devastating, like, wild charge at me from the hallway, from the room where we had moved the doll to. So, like, yeah, in the dream, it, like, came out of there and was charging at me and was angry. That was a very terrifying dream. That dream was very intense. And the sight of a dark personage being looking directly at one is like, That's a very deeply discomforting experience. I don't know how to describe it beyond that. It was like, I'm seeing something I'm definitely not supposed to be seeing, and it is mad at me. You just could feel the intention with all of it, too. It was very like, no, I'm coming to kill you. Like, was how it felt. Like it was blasting down the hallway. In my dream, it was hard for me to say that one was in my head. I don't think I could have even imagined that that was more terrifying than, like, the scariest thing I could have imagined. The way it looked and the way it had, like, just the feeling and dread in the dream of it getting me. So while it was getting more aggressive with, like, the nightmares and stuff, it was also being more aggressive, like, when it was talking to me that at night. Talking at me, I guess not to me. But what was happening, too, with that. That was really freaking me out. And making me feel like it was in my head was like. It was like she was reading my mind. When I would put words or thoughts, like, at, like, the forefront of my mind, she would comment on them. Like, if the voice would comment on them. Which, again, made me think, this must be my. This is coming for me. Like, there's no way this is something exterior. So she would comment on my thoughts that I was having and any insecurities I was having, she, would, like, lean into those. It was hard because I wasn't, like, engaging with it on purpose ever. Like, I was literally like, no, I'm trying to sleep. And Just sleep and, like, pretend I'm asleep. But, like, it would call me out for pretending to be asleep. It's like, I know you're not sleeping. And then it would keep talking. In one instance, it seemed possessive over me, I guess, and that's why I kind of felt like it was trying to break my wife and I up and, like, trying to get in the middle of that. Felt like she was after me. And she actually asked me one time while I was, like, trying to go to sleep. I'm up. It's late. I'm sleep deprived because of this situation, and I got work. She's being pretty persistent and kind of aggressive and kind of loud while I'm trying to sleep. But it's very much like she asked me, like, do you love me? Do you love me? You love me? Tell me you love me. You love me. You love me. Don't you? Like, you love me? It was like, okay, this is really weird. But it kept going, and it just kind of kept doing that. And I'm like, I don't know what to make of this. I'd really just prefer if it stopped. I don't know how to make sense of this, but I'm pretty sure I'm just crazy. I must just be insane. So I was like, whatever. Like, yeah, I love you. Like, all right, I love you. Love you too. Like, go to sleep. I don't think I should have done that. That was a bad move. Don't do that. I feel like that was when it had more influence over my dreams. I feel like the dreams got worse. It had more power over me after that time. We talked about getting rid of the doll a lot. And even if there were weeks where it would calm down because she'd smudged the house or done something, it would never stay away. And I think a lot of the pushback on those conversations was like, well, this is, like, this is a family heirloom thing, and I think we could deal with it or make it go away or it's not really the doll. Like, it's just a thing that's messing with us that we should be able to deal with. It shouldn't have to be the doll to you was, I think, basically her approach. And so we talked that over, and we hadn't quite, like, settled on, like, what exactly we're gonna do. But I kind of put my foot down and was like, no matter what, Like, I just. I can't. We can't bring this to our. To our new house. Like, I won't do that and she was, like, 100% in agreement. Like, if we can't figure it out with the doll or whatever, like, yeah, then don't want to bring this whatever, bad energy to the new house at all. We guess we didn't know what to do with it either, because, I mean, if you know that a doll's sketchy or that, like, there's something sketchy going on with the doll, what is. What is your level of responsibility? What am I. Am I supposed to banish the demon? Or, like, do I. Am I supposed to pass this off to someone else? Or, like, are we just supposed to go bury it somewhere? Like, what is the correct answer? And we just, like, I don't know. We didn't know what to do with it, but it was still a valuable doll. And, like, we don't. We can't even guarantee whatever's going on is really the dollar because we don't know. Basically, we were starting to move. Like, we were in the act of moving to the new house. Like, we'd already started moving stuff. It had been several trips, and it was kind of just a thing we needed to deal with. Still, sticking it in the trunk and taking it to Goodwill is a goofy solution, is how it kind of felt. It felt like passing up the problem for sure. But we also, like, we have no idea how to deal with this.
- [31:19]
D
I remember the experiences of we were, like, driving to Goodwill to drop her off. It was like I was getting yelled at in my head. It was like this doll was yelling at me and was mad. And I think I remember mentioning to Connor, I'm like, she's mad that I'm dropping her off at Goodwill. I'm just feeling the energy that you would feel when someone is yelling at you. Like, when someone's really mad at you and they're glaring at you from across the room, and you kind of can sit there and be like, ooh, like, someone. I can feel that someone's mad at me. That's the only thing that I can kind of liken it to, is that I could just feel that she was like, screw you. How dare you drop me off at Goodwill. Like, I have been with you since you were 8, and you're just leaving me here? I'm like, yup, yes, I am. I thought it was kind of funny too. And I'm like, I don't know if there's anything to that. But I kind of, like, snickered at her as I put her down in the bin. Was like, bye, have fun.
- [32:22]
B
See ya.
- [32:23]
D
And it just felt like she gave me a middle finger and was just mad. And then as we drove away and left, it was like all of her anger and stuff just felt more distant and was gone. And the house felt lighter. There's a noticeable difference with her being gone.
- [32:43]
B
For me, it was a very weird feeling. I didn't really think, like, the doll was where this came from. Like, I didn't think, like, oh, this is the doll. Like, I kind of thought something was, like, attached to the doll maybe, or maybe using the doll. But then I was like, I don't. I can't even begin to understand how any of this. The mechanisms of any of this would work. I thought it was a real possibility that us giving the doll away would do nothing. I kind of thought, like, the problem would very. Could very likely exist. But I was really hopeful that it would stop it because I felt absolutely powerless to do anything about any of this. So we gave the doll away. And, I mean, coincidentally, I was, like, moved out of that house, like, within the same week. And the issues stopped. Like, we didn't have any more issues. I wish I could say for sure that it was us giving the doll away, but, like, it was all one thing. And I'm just glad that it stopped more than anything, I guess, because it kind of felt like it was, like, attached to me or after me. And it was like, no, it's not on. It's not after me anymore. It's not on me anymore. So that was a big, like, I guess just chink in the armor of, like, where I was at with, quote unquote, creating gridded atheism. But I liked. Yeah, which. Which was just. There's nothing else interesting going on, and when we die, we just die. And that's like, that was. That was it. That was my belief. And then it was like, I just had to kind of live with this huge shape that doesn't fit. Like, it was just like, oh, there's this giant puzzle piece of an experience I had that does not. That doesn't work. Which for a while I kind of just didn't deal with, but have since, like, I feel like it has since opened my mind a bit more to what other things might be going on around us. Like, there's a lot of feelings and sensations and things that happened that, like, are. Are really not something I should be able to just throw away or that I could just discount because they're happy. Like, yeah, I guess your brain is capable of a lot of interesting stuff. But, like, this was a very Weird collection of things for it to do. I do feel like this. This podcast has actually helped me kind of open my mind to the more. To there being more going on as well. Especially as I've listened to it. It's kind of, I guess, maybe helped me have more of a framework for some of these experiences when they're not this crazy, wild puzzle piece you can't fit into anything. It's a. A little bit. It feels better and easier and like, it makes more sense. It's a more coherent picture. It's like, okay, I feel like I'm closer to understanding what might actually be going on now. I really feel like we live in such a. Almost just strange kind of whimsical sort of world. Like, I didn't feel that way about it before, but I do because, like, there's some weird stuff going on. And like, we're having dreams and people. Some people see the future and like every night you go to sleep and you go somewhere else and like, we're all. That's fine. Like, that's wild to me that, like, we're just like, oh, yeah, you're conscious. We don't know anything about how consciousness works, but we all just go to. We all lay down and we take a break from that and have delusions like, of somewhere else or maybe that is somewhere else. I don't know how to describe what I've believe anymore because it's. Because I'm not sure. I guess I'm open to a lot's going on. I would say it's kind of made it like I used the word earlier, but, like, whimsical. Definitely more hope. I think it kind of gives new meaning to life because I was struggling with what is the point? Like, and with Mormonism, again, I had a very distinct. Like, this is the reason for life. This is the meaning of life. That's. This is what you're doing here. Atheism was like, oh, there is no point. There's nothing like, get what you can out of it. Good luck, dude. That's depressing as hell. Just at its core, like, that's super depressing. Whereas now it's kind of like, I'm not sure what life even is, and I'm not sure what death is, and I'm not sure what the hell's going on. But I'm gonna go for it. As a Mormon, I believed when I died, I was gonna go be like, just tested on how good like, to judge and how good of a Mormon I was. And I was gonna go to heaven or hell. And then as a atheist, it was like, 100%, it's over after you die. Good luck conceptualizing that. Like, now I don't know what happens, but, like, I think it's a lot more reasonable to believe that there's a question mark there than that there's nothing.
- [37:46]
A
Thank you to Connor and also Lacey for sharing this experience with us. You know, I've mentioned on episodes in the past that haunted dolls were one of those things that I really did not expect to be a thing people actually experienced. I put haunted dolls into the same category as floating pumpkins and skeletons walking around. You know, the type of stuff that you see in Goosebumps books and on Halloween decorations. Not something you actually hear about people experiencing in the real world. But we have had so many stories written in to the show about situations like this, and a lot of them have similarities. In fact, we've had enough haunted doll stories sent into us that we only have recorded a few of them. And the ones we do record, I kind of have to space out because I don't want Otherworld to accidentally become a show entirely about haunted dolls. But we get a lot, which is worth noting. Whenever we do have one of these stories, I'm always left wondering where the doll ended up, because the story usually ends with the person getting rid of it. In the case of Connor and Lacey, they donated this doll to Goodwill. You have to wonder who might have bought this doll, what they did with it, and whether or not this presence that seemed to come with it carried on into the household of whoever purchased it. That being said, if you go on ebay right now, you'll find a lot of people trying to sell dolls that they claim to be haunted. And apparently there are also a lot of people out there in the world who want to buy dolls that they think are haunted. The market does exist, so maybe it ended up with a person who actively wanted a haunted doll. I'd say that would be the best case scenario. Either way, I think the fact that all of Connor and Lacey's problems disappeared the moment they got rid of this doll is the most interesting part of this whole thing. That brings us to the end of this episode. Thank you once again to Connor and Lacey. This episode has been called Heirloom, and you've been listening to Otherworld. Otherworld is executive produced and hosted by myself, Jack Wagner. Our producers are Theo Schaeffer, Theo Krantz, Haley Pearson, and Nikki Kate Delgado. Our theme song is by Cobra Man. The soundtrack of this episode is by North Americans. Our artwork is by Cul de Sac Studios. Please show us your support by subscribing, leaving a five star review and telling your friends about the show. If you want to hear bonus episodes of Otherworld, you can become a patron@patreon.com Otherworld Our social media is Otherworldpod. Thank you to the team at Odyssey. Leah Rhys Dennis, Maura Curran, Josefina Francis, Eric Donnelly, Kate Rose, Colin Gaynor and Hilary Schuff. Follow and listen to Otherworld now for free on the Odysee app or wherever you get your podcasts. And finally, if you or somebody you know has experienced something paranormal, supernatural or unexplained, you could send us your stories@storiesotherworldpod.com.
- [41:32]
B
Foreign.
- [41:41]
E
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