In this episode, I interview Tim Ingalsbee, co-founder and executive director of Firefighters United for Safety, Ethics, and Ecology (FUSEE). Tim and I discuss his critiques of the new U.S. Wildland Fire Service, arguing consolidation is framed as efficiency but functions as defunding, job shedding, and a suppression-first “Fire Force” detached from land stewardship, able to override local land managers. Tim says federal fire management is failing due to an obsolete full-suppression paradigm, reinforced by “attack all fires” directives, which wastes resources, increases hazards, and can worsen ecological damage. He advocates strategic suppression and an Alaska-style triage model, prioritizing protection of lives, communities, and infrastructure while living with fire for ecological benefit. Our conversation covers problems with thinning for timber, home ignitability and community-wide mitigation, workforce programs like the Oregon Conservation Corps, Indigenous fire stewardship, cultural change away from militarized firefighting, and FUSEE’s work promoting proactive fire management and policy reform.

03:26 New Wildland Fire Service

05:50 Consolidation Risks And Missions

10:18 Attack All Fires Directive

14:29 Strategic Suppression Triage

18:33 Smokey Bear Myths

22:35 Thinning/Prescribed Fire Debate

28:05 Home Ignition Zone Focus

32:47 Community Workforce Programs

35:46 Preparing Communities For Fire

38:03 Fireproofing Homes First

39:28 Oregon Conservation Corps Model

40:28 Indigenous Fire Stewardship

44:53 Living in the Pyrocene

47:04 Militarized Firefighting Culture

49:31 Toxic Tools and Home Hazmat

52:31 Firefighters as Stewards

55:23 Epiphanies on the Fireline

59:51 FUSEE Mission and Advocacy

01:01:08 Prescribed Burn Smoke Concerns

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