Becoming a Top Sales Producer - Outside Sales Talk with Andrew Barbuto

Summary

Podcast Summary

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Outside Sales Talk – "Becoming a Top Sales Producer" with Andrew Barbuto

Host: Steve Benson
Guest: Andrew Barbuto
Date: May 28, 2025

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Overview

In this episode, Steve Benson interviews Andrew Barbuto, a high-performing ad tech sales professional and author of "Top Sales Producer: How to Crush Your B2B Sales Quota" (releasing November 2024). Andrew shares his journey to sales excellence and dives into practical, hard-earned strategies for becoming a top producer in outside sales. The discussion is packed with actionable insights on prospecting, time management, managing complex sales cycles, and the importance of both internal and external relationship-building.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Andrew’s Sales Journey and Early Lessons

• Foundations in Sales:
  • Started at Enterprise Rent a Car; learned customer-oriented selling through hands-on experience.
  • Initial experience in digital media sales at Zaxis.
  • Recognized importance of being a domain expert after "learning the ropes" as an associate.
• Biggest Early Lesson:
  • “You can’t sell something if you don’t truly understand what you’re selling.” (A, 08:59)

2. Selling Services vs. Selling Software

• Difference Between Sales Types:
  • Selling services: focused on trust and reliability ("white glove" support), often more tactical and short-term.
  • Selling software: involves more change management, longer sales cycles, and higher-level business conversations.
• Key Insight:
  • “It's less about making life easy, and more about making the business profitable.” (A, 06:38)

3. The Importance of Expertise

• Continuous Learning:
  • Andrew emphasizes the need to “get the dirt on your fingernails,” doing every role in the process to understand client needs deeply.
• First Step for Sales Success:
  • "Your first step is to become an expert before anything else." (A, 08:59)

4. Prospecting Strategies

• Targeting:
  • "More than 50% of the battle is finding the right people." (A, 09:58)
  • Focus on qualifications: Do they have the means and an immediate need?
  • Prospect research is “the foundation of the house.” If not strong, everything else fails.
• Multichannel Approach:
  • Use LinkedIn, email, and phone. Sequence outreach to increase visibility (“Start with LinkedIn, follow up with an email, then a call”).
  • Leverage LinkedIn Sales Navigator for researching connection overlaps and potential warm intros.
• Persistence:
  • “Takes about 7 touch points to actually get a response from a cold prospect.” (A, 09:58)
  • Don’t get discouraged after one or two emails; vary timing and channels.

5. Running Effective Sales Meetings

• Preparation & Research:
  • “If I go into a meeting and just jump in with questions, they're going to be like, ‘didn't you reach out with some ideas to help?’” (A, 18:56)
  • Start with tailored insights to establish credibility.
• Conversation Balance:
  • Let the prospect do 70% of the talking in initial meetings.
• Securing Next Steps:
  • “If everything we talk about today seems like it would be helpful, typically we'll set up a follow up demo... does that sound good?” (A, 20:46)
  • Get confirmation before ending the meeting to ensure momentum.

6. Sales Cycle Management & Time Management

• Avoiding Stalled Deals:
  • Often caused by not “talking to the right people with an immediate need.” (A, 21:26)
  • Provide value between meetings, even if no sale is imminent.
• Time Allocation:
  • “How you spend your time will have a massive impact on your ability to achieve quota.” (A, 23:56)
  • Prioritize time on research, prospecting, and client/prospect conversations.
  • Minimize internal distractions and meetings.

7. Selling to Executives

• Getting C-Suite Buy-in:
  • Salespeople should not be intimidated by CEOs—“If you can present yourself as a potential way to improve their business, they'll listen.” (A, 27:40)
  • Use research to personalize the pitch, tie into strategic priorities (AI, operational efficiency, etc.), and reference competitors for urgency.
  • Perfect timing: Schedule 8am emails or LinkedIn messages to catch busy execs.

8. Selling to Large Companies vs. Small Companies

• Large Companies:
  • More “buying committees,” multiple decision-makers, longer sales cycles, additional steps (procurement, finance, etc.).
• Small Companies:
  • Decisions often made by one person, more direct access to C-level, shorter cycles.

9. Common Sales Mistakes

• Top Mistake:
  • Not doing sufficient research, using generic slides, not focusing on the prospect’s actual needs.
  • “By the end of the meeting, we didn’t even talk about what we asked to talk about.” (A, 31:56)

10. Mentorship and Continuous Growth

• Advice to New Sellers:
  • “Find a mentor… Look at the leaderboards… set up time with them.” (A, 33:03)
• Value of Internal Selling:
  • “You're going to be selling internally just as much as you're going to be selling externally.” (A, 00:00 / 33:57)
  • Know your internal contacts and processes for legal, finance, and marketing support.

11. Daily Habits & Success Mindset

• Daily Discipline:
  • “Success is the accumulation of daily positive habits.” (A, 35:53)
  • Start each day by reading industry news and thinking how to add specific value to prospects and customers.
• Be Proactive, Not Reactive:
  • “No one's going to tell you what to do when you first get into the day... figure it out.” (A, 47:17)

12. The Art and Science of Sales

• Continuous Improvement:
  • Sales is both art (human psychology, listening, customization) and science (metrics, process, persistence).
• Listening is Central:
  • “The big thing… that sits at the center is being a good listener, actively listening.” (A, 40:27)

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• Andrew Barbuto:

  • “You can’t sell something if you don’t truly understand what you’re selling.” (08:59)
  • “I have not sent an email unless I've sent seven of them.” (16:52)
  • “Target the right people. You have productive meetings that lead to opportunities that lead to sales. Target the wrong people... you're not going to see any revenue.” (26:50)
  • “If you can present yourself as a potential way to improve their business, they'll have a duty to explore.” (27:53)
  • “You're going to be selling internally just as much as you're going to be selling externally.” (00:00 / 33:57)
  • “Success is the accumulation of daily positive habits.” (35:53)

• Steve Benson:

  • “First step to being a great salesperson is to become an expert in your field, their field, and the stuff that you're selling.” (37:37)
  • “No one likes to get lapped by their competitors, right?” (39:35)
  • “One of the reasons that sales is so hard is it's 20 different skills, and if you screw up any of them, you can blow the deal.” (46:34)

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Timestamps for Core Segments

• Sales journey & path to B2B sales: 01:52–04:21
• Services vs. software, domain expertise: 05:20–08:56
• Prospecting strategies & tools: 09:42–16:52
• Email/channel sequencing tactics: 13:31–16:52
• Effective first meetings & securing next steps: 18:00–21:00
• Maintaining deal momentum & time management: 21:08–27:18
• Reaching executives & C-level: 27:18–30:33
• Differences between selling to big/small companies: 30:33–31:50
• Common mistakes in sales meetings: 31:50–32:50
• Advice & lessons for new sellers: 33:03–33:43
• Most valuable sales lesson: 33:57–35:23
• Daily habits & success: 35:53–37:35
• Summary, book promotion, and closing thoughts: 37:35–45:00
• Continuous growth & proactive mindset: 45:38–47:56

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Final Thoughts

This episode is essential listening for anyone in B2B or field sales. Andrew Barbuto delivers candid, nuanced advice distilled from years of top performance. His emphasis on preparation, research, relationship-building (both external and internal), persistence, and continual learning provides a comprehensive blueprint for any seller aspiring to reach the top of the leaderboard.

Connect with Andrew Barbuto:

• Book: andrewbarbuto.com
• YouTube: youtube.com/andrewbarbuto
• LinkedIn: linkedin.com/in/andrewbarbuto

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Transcript

[A]

As a salesperson, you're going to be selling internally just as much as you're going to be selling externally. So you need to put as much emphasis on your internal relationships and your internal communication as you do your external communication. If you work in B2B sales, chances are you're part of a team. So you work with other people. You're going to have to rely on those people and it's really important that you have strong relationships with them because what's going to happen is you're going to have to, at some point go out of process to run a piece of business and you want those people that are going to have to approve you going out of process to want to do that for you.

[B]

This is Outside Sales Talk, the best podcast for outside salespeople. I'm your host, Steve Benson, and we're here to chat with the world's top sales experts so that you can get their best sales tactics to level up your game. Welcome back to Outside Sales Talk. Today I've got Andrew Barbuto with us and he's going to teach us about becoming a top sales producer. Andrew, welcome to the show.

[A]

Thanks for having me.

[B]

So, by way of introduction, Andrew is a top performing ad tech sales professional with a passion for helping customers. Over the past eight years he's sold 250 million in services and software, becoming the top grossing rep at two digital media companies. Andrew's first sales book, top Sales producer how to crush your B2B sales quota is releasing in November 2024. He'll be sharing his proven 10 step sales method designed to help new salespeople ramp up quickly and experienced reps close more profitable deals faster. And today we're going to be covering some of those topics that he covers in the book. So, Andrew, let's jump into it, man. How did you get started in sales?

[A]

Yeah, yeah. So, you know, my path probably somewhat similar to the average person that gets into sales. I mean, you know, I was in college, just like most people, I really didn't know what I wanted to do. You know, I just knew I didn't want to graduate college. That was the big thing. But unfortunately you can only hang on for so long. So, you know, while I was in college, I got an internship. I was basically trying to go as broad as possible so that way I could keep my options open. And one of the companies that did a lot of recruiting on campus was Enterprise Rent a Car. And it was like a good management trainee program where you pick people up, you're selling the insurance, they're very much customer service oriented. And I did that. And I did it for a summer leading into my senior year. And it was great experience. I was the top salesperson in Long island for the interns. The only issue was those pesky nightmares that I was having where I was doing my sales script in my sleep because I was so stressed out having to sell every day. So I was looking for something to be a little bit longer term and not like, on a daily basis. So I basically was going to decide to go back to school, just frankly, to extend my college experience as long as possible. I enrolled in a program in Albany, which is where I went to school, and I needed an internship prior to my entering into the program. And I got a sales internship at a company called Zaxis, which is a digital media company. And I essentially just shadowed the team and I got to see what B2B sales was all about. And that's when it was kind of like an aha moment. Like, kind of took the best of both worlds of what I enjoyed about sales. The customers, you know, facing interaction with customers, the fact that you work hard, the harder you work, the better you're going to do. And at the same time, I didn't have to worry about selling every single day. And so once that internship was over, I decided, okay, this makes sense, I'm ready to go. But unfortunately, my manager was like, oh, that's not quite how it works. You can't just go from being an intern to a sales rep. You have to start at the bottom. So that's exactly what I did. I started as an associate, learning the ropes, and then worked my way to an account manager, and then ultimately made my way back onto the sales team a couple years later. And the rest was history.

[B]

Started from the bottom, now we're here. So. And you've sold digital media services and software in your career. What would you say were. What did you learn from selling those different things? What were the biggest differences that you saw in selling the different project products? I learned so much earlier in career about what direction I wanted to go in from selling. I was at IBM and I was selling software and consulting and hardware because IBM in those days kind of had their. Their fingers and everything. I guess they still do Big Brother. And. Yeah, so they. But. And I really learned, you know, how much I like selling software as opposed to, say, consulting services, um, because it's so much easier and consulting's a harder business, basically. Um, but what. Tell. Tell me about what you learned from. From selling different things.

[A]

Yeah. So when I started out my career, I exclusively sold digital media services. And so, you know, it is, you know, probably somewhat similar to the consulting business that you are in because there's a level of us doing service on behalf of customers. They are relying on us to do everything for them. And it's very short term focus. Right. So we did a campaign by campaign basis and I got really good at that. I think that the biggest difference between selling services and selling software is selling services is really just about basically convincing somebody that you are able to take care of them. You give them full white glove service, you're going to be there, you're going to deliver on what you say you are, you're going to be quick to respond, provide great customer service, they can rely on you. But it's really less of a business conversation than software. Software is significantly different. So my first job, like I said, I just sold services. But in my industry, the technology that we were using to execute campaigns on behalf of our clients was increasingly being brought in house by, by the people we were selling to, so advertising agencies and marketers. And so that's really where the wind was blowing. And so that trend has continued. And so I wanted to position myself somewhere where I could sell the software to the clients that I was working with previously. But the difference between selling service and software, like I said, very different. So it's kind of like night and day in a certain respect in my industry because when you're selling software there's significantly more change management involved. Typically there's more decision makers. It's a long term conversation. And what's most different about it is that it switched from more of like a tactical conversation to a business conversation. So rather than hey, let me make your life as easy as possible, it switched to hey, let me make your business as profitable as possible. And then there's a whole other suite of training, onboarding that's separate from services. Right. Because with services we're doing everything on their behalf. So there was a lot, it was a pretty big learning curve. And I think that that's probably something that a lot of people can relate to. When you do make that switch over or really selling anything differently, selling really isn't selling. You have to really understand these days, you have to be a domain expert. So you have to really thoroughly understand. And going back to what I mentioned earlier about being an associate, that was one of the biggest thing, the best things for my career because I got to, although it was the true grunt work, you know, doing the behind the scenes Stuff that nobody else wanted to do. It gave me, you know, the experience to look under the hood and really learn the ropes. So that way when I did get into a position to talk to clients about what I was using, I could speak from my experience and not just speak from, you know, a high level.

[B]

So important to have that expertise in, in what you're selling and actually understand the use case and actually understand what the customers need. It's, it's funny how many people in sales aren't actually able to be do consultative sales because they're actually not experts in, in their area. And that's, you know, really step one, I'd say to, you know, becoming a top sales producer is you've got to be able to add that value and be a true expert. And like you say, I mean, you know, you were when you were an associate learning the blocking and tackling, so value so, so valuable to like get the dirt on your fingernails and learn how.

[A]

And that's why it is the first step in my goal.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

That is how my book, so my book starts out with that, which is your first step is to become an expert before anything else. Right. That's so important. Right, Stephen? Because you know exactly what you just mentioned. You can't sell something if you don't truly understand what you're selling. Back in the day, I recall a salesperson that switched over previously was selling like insurance and I'm sure he was great at selling that. But then when he moved into the digital media world, it's a completely different ball game. The sales cycle is nothing like it. And so, you know, you really need to understand what you're selling when you're doing consultative sales. And that's even more important in the software business.

[B]

Absolutely. And tell me about prospecting strategy. How do you coach people or what? You know, when you, when you teach people to be. To become a top sales producer like you, what's, what do you. How do you discuss prospecting?

[A]

Yeah. So I think that, and this has been a really awesome experience for me with the whole writing of the book thing. Basically where it started out was me just wanting to consolidate all of my learnings from the last eight years of sales, just in case I ever got zapped on the Men in Black thing and I lost all my memory. I just wanted to put everything down in paper and just kind of consolidate it. And so what this has allowed me to do is really flush out the processes that I've been using. And the biggest thing when it comes to prospecting that I'VE come to understand is it's really more about who you're targeting. That's probably more than 50% of the battle is finding the right people. Because depending on what industry you're in, you may be selling a niche product. My industry, we're pretty commoditized and so it's really important that we're targeting the right people. So spending more time upfront to find those right people is more than half the battle. And exactly how you approach it is probably the other 50%. But if you're not targeting the right people, that could be very detrimental because that's where everything starts. I look at it like it's a house and the prospect research is the foundation of the house. If it's not on a strong foundation, then the rest of it's just not going to work. And so how I define qualified is twofold is someone needs to have the means to buy from you. So they need to have the funds and they need to have the funds available in the short term as opposed to, hey, we've got $5 billion, but it's locked up into long term contracts. That does nothing for you. And then they need to have a need. Right. So that's what's so critical is do they have a need? It's not about what you want to, who you want to work with. Right. It's about who you can help. So spending more time in that research phase, treating it like, you know, in a very. As important as the outreach is something that I think has had a big impact in my prospecting efforts. And then from there it's about just targeting people on multiple channels, being persistent, following up. Takes about 7 touch points to actually get a response from a cold prospect. But the research is also important for turning cold prospects into potentially warm leads. So what I mean by that is in your research, aside from just finding out who you're going to be targeting from a company standpoint, is also finding out where you can get to actually become more of a like warm up that prospect. So I use LinkedIn Sales Navigator all the time. It's fantastic tool because what it allows you to do is say, okay, all the people that went to my ALMA material, all the people that maybe went to that worked at my company in the past or worked at one of my customers companies and moved on, all of that is right there for you. And then also if you have mutual connections with them, that's another great use case because you can message the person who is on your team that maybe knows them and see if you can get an introduction. So that's another big piece of research which I think is sometimes a little bit undervalued.

[B]

Absolutely. Leveraging those relationships or finding relationships that you could make because you have that overlap. Are there any other tools that you find to be super useful other than LinkedIn as you're doing research and figuring out the multiple channels that you're using to interact with your prospects?

[A]

Yeah, so I use three main channels. Right. From an actual communication standpoint, the email, of course, LinkedIn and the phone. And I think that what's important is the strategy that you're using with how you sequence your messages. So I feel like a lot of times salespeople will send one or two emails and they'll give up. But the reality is that not everybody answers on every single channel. So maybe this is somebody who Never is using LinkedIn or is never really on it, or someone that has a million emails in their inbox and so they have to dig through their email. Or maybe somebody who never answers the phone. The way to ensure that you're going to have the best chance of actually getting noticed is by using multiple channels and sequencing them. So starting with LinkedIn, following up with an email, if you don't get a response after a few days, maybe give them a call.

[B]

Yeah, it's, it's so important to catch people where they are. Right. Like, someone that I actually did want to interact with was just, they just friended me on LinkedIn. They hadn't even reached out yet. But I, I knew who they were and wanted to interact with them. I pinged them right back and I was like, oh, hey, you know, we got to, we gotta chat about this. Then. Then once I talked to him, I figured out they'd been chasing me on Instagram for months. But I never open Instagram.

[A]

There you go.

[B]

I, I just open it and find out that I got tagged in a bunch of things I can't see anymore. But, but you know, like, but to them, you know, they're, you know, 15 years younger or something. They're like, you never go on Instagram. I'm like, no, they're on LinkedIn every day.

[A]

Right, Right.

[B]

So, you know, it's, it's a, it's, it's cultural, it's what country you're in, it's your age. All these different things of like, you know, where to catch people. Right. Like the phone versus email versus et cetera, et cetera. Right. So it's really, I think, the multiple channel strategy, but also adjusting it, you can often make a guess about where you're going to actually catch somebody. But certainly don't get discouraged with two emails.

[A]

I mean, right.

[B]

That's because that's some people. I mean I've seen people that have 30,000 emails in their inbox and I'm like, how do you live? I mean I would, I don't ever.

[A]

Expect at least something I learned very early on. I don't ever respect expecting a response from my first email or even my second email. Not just, not just with prospects, with clients too, honestly. And that was a little surprising for me. But the reality is that people are busy and it's not personal. Right. If they're not responding to you, it's just because they're busy. Just like everyone. Like we're all busy. Right. And I think that what it comes down to is how far are you on their priority list?

[B]

Well, and, and I, I've, I've emailed friends and that I know want to talk to about a certain thing or we, you know, and they just won't get back to me. Then I'll forget about them. Be like a week later, I'm like, ah, I was supposed to talk to them about this. You text them, they get right back to you, like, oh, well my. You know, and then you, then you realize, oh, this guy never deals with me. It just kind of depends. Right. So I think that's, that's great advice and important to kind of come from a place of empathy of everyone's got 17 places they're getting messages and some of them they may never open. Right?

[A]

Right. Yeah. And if you look at it like, okay, like don't. One way to look at it is I have not sent an email unless I've sent seven of them. Right. So like I just. Cause I hit them, you know, reach out to somebody one time. You also have to vary the timing that you send the emails. So, so some people are early risers and they maybe start work at 8am Some people work late and they may be more, you know, more susceptible to be. To read your email and respond later versus earlier. You gotta mix it up. Also the channels they use can also vary by time. So for example, I just look at my own habits, but I also. This also translates to my prospecting efforts, which is email from my experience is usually better in the mornings. Like first thing in the morning, you want to be the first in their inbox. Whereas LinkedIn Sales Navigator is more of an evening thing. People maybe midday lunch, maybe like the day is winding down. They're checking out their LinkedIn and they mean more likely to respond at that point versus something that is a first thing in the morning where they're trying to get all their most important priorities done.

[B]

Yeah, makes sense. Talk about what are some things that you do in a new business meeting, new customer prospect, to make sure that it's a productive interaction and that you're moving the ball downfield and that there are solid next steps coming out of the interaction.

[A]

Yeah, that's a great question. And I think that this is something that does come with some experience. So with newer sales and for myself, you know, when I first started, this was something that it's a learning curve in terms of actually getting next steps in a meeting and not just like, oh, the meeting went really great, I'm going to send over follow ups and then you don't hear back. So I would just say that, you know, one quick point is especially with software, that was a big adjustment for me where, you know, with services it's like if the conversation goes well, I'm looking to submit a proposal afterwards, right. Whereas with software I'm not looking to immediately submit a proposal. I just need to get to a demo stage. Right. So shooting for that demo stage as opposed to trying to jump ahead was something that was a learning curve for me. Generally speaking though, when it comes to how I ensure I have productive meetings that lead to next steps, especially in a first meeting, do a lot of research. But then when you get into the meeting, ask questions and let your prospect talk, right? Let them do the majority of the talking. Like I want my prospect to do 70% of the talking in the beginning, in an initial sales meeting, I want to be there listening diligently. So that way I can understand how I can help. Right? But one thing that I do even before I really get into those questions is first I want to qualify myself as somebody who's credible. And that's where the meeting research, pre meeting planning comes in. So importantly, because if I go into a meeting with somebody and I just jump in with questions, then they're going to be like, well, didn't you reach out with some ideas to help? Like, you know, what were you talking about? Clearly it was just like a sales prospecting thing. But if I go in and say, hey, listen, I checked out your site, I did some research, I noticed that we actually worked together three years ago. I saw that you're a full service provider. And so I have some ideas I want to share. But before I do, there's a couple different ways that you can work with us. I just want to make sure that our conversation is as productive as possible. And so, you know. But because there's a couple of different ways to work with us, I want to just ask a couple of clarifying questions that I wasn't able to find out from my research before talking about the specifics about how I feel we can help you. And then, and this is important. So I started my agenda. I go, if everything we talk about today seems like it would be helpful, typically we'll set up a follow up demo so that way you can see what we've been discussing. Does that sound good? Does that work?

[B]

Definitely.

[A]

And then get their confirmation, get that confirmation so that way later you can reference it once you've demonstrated personalized value.

[B]

Excellent. And how do you go about maintaining momentum in a sales cycle? How do you minimize. Maintain momentum, minimize the length of a sales cycle and keep a sales cycle from getting stalled, which is everyone's least favorite.

[A]

And this goes back to what we were talking about earlier, which is when deals get stale, when they get stalled, most of the time it's because you're not talking to the right people. So you're not talking to somebody with an immediate need or with somebody who's got the means perhaps. And granted that's not to say that people that are qualified, they're going to have an immediate need. But the reality is if you're talking to enough qualified prospects, somebody in the short term will be ready to buy. What you do until that happens is you provide value. So just because there's no monetary exchange doesn't mean that I can't still help you and be a resource deal. So what I'll do is it's all situational, of course, but let's say I have a really good conversation with somebody, they've expressed that this would be a helpful solution for them. I will try to get that next step on my initial meeting before it ends. I'll try to get it on the calendar. If I'm not able to, for whatever reason, I'll ask. Okay, well when, when makes sense then, like what's your timeline look like? It's important that you understand what they're buying process is like is it a short term thing or is it a long term thing? You know, so that you can temper your expectations. And regardless of whether it's a short term or a long term, I always focus in between meetings by trying to provide personalized value. So that way I'm continuing to help them regardless of whether they're a customer now or will be in the future, I think that's something that is really important because when there is an opportunity, they will remember that you were the person that was continuing to provide them with that value. So that way, you know, you're top of mind and they choose to work with you.

[B]

And to zoom back. What do you see as the key factors that really separate top salespeople from average salespeople? What's, what do you, if you were to point your finger to a handful of things, what, what do you think has made you a top sales producer? And in these, in a relatively commoditized space, right. Ad tech, where you know, it's difficult to differentiate yourself and beat out competitors and you know, certainly a high dollar value, highly competitive space, how can a salesperson win and how can they be the best on the team?

[A]

So I would boil it down to one thing. Obviously there's a lot of factors. We've already spoken about several of them. Doing your research before you go into meeting, make sure that you're going in prepared, being flexible, doing more listening, less talking. Of course hard work is always going to be a major factor. That's still probably the most important thing when it comes to sales because it is so difficult, especially in a commoditized space. But generally speaking, it's very difficult to get people to do what you want them to do. So you have to work hard to make sure you can do that. But the one thing I would boil it down to is time management. And the reason why I say that is because, I mean, we only get so much time in the year in a day. And how you spend your time will have a massive impact on your ability to achieve quota and to bring in a significant amount of revenue. And so I think that there is a big difference in how top salespeople spend their time than the average ones. And so just to give you a few examples, like I want to spend the majority of my day speaking with clients and prospects. I want to minimize internal meetings as much as possible. I want to minimize any sort of internal work that is, can be, if I can delight, I will. I want to be spending all my time doing prospecting. I want to make sure that I carve out time every week, you know, every other day to do prospecting. That needs to be a priority. It's not something that you could just be like, oh, you know, I have to, I'll deal with more time sensitive client work. So making sure that you're spending an adequate amount of time on that New business work is. Is vitally important to continue to have a filled pipeline. But the other thing is, is that, like I said, the. A big percentage of my time, and I think it's probably more than the average person is dedicated to research, is dedicated to making sure that I'm finding those people that are qualified that are potentially likely to buy from me. And I know I have a very good understanding as to. Because I've worked with so many clients at this point, I have a very strong understanding as to what are the best customers that will benefit from our solution. And then I spend all my time trying to find those customers. And sometimes it's a needle in the haystack, but it's worth it because let's say you do. I could set up a meeting, no problem with some of these larger companies or what have you. But if there's no real opportunity there, then that's just a waste of time. And I've personally had my fair share of experiences where I end up winning a piece of business. They're a large company, they don't have budget available for us. And then what that ends up happening is that you spend a lot of time and you don't have a lot to show for it. So that is also a mess. Has a massive impact on your time. Management is if you are targeting the right people, target the right people. You have productive meetings that lead to opportunities that lead to sales. Target the wrong people, you'll have opportunities that go nowhere. Or even worse, maybe you do close it, but then it's going to end up wasting a ton of your time and you're not going to see any revenue from it. So how you are allocating your time is very important as a top salesperson to make sure that you're spending your time on what's going to ultimately move the needle towards your quota. And that all goes into strategy and planning.

[B]

I read some stuff that you said about scheduling time with executives, CEOs, top people that are tough to get in front of. Tell us a little bit about what your approach is and what strategies that you've used really successfully to get time with people that are tough to get time with.

[A]

Yeah. And I think that this is something that's a misconception that a lot of salespeople have. I certainly had it myself where they tend to shy away from reaching out to CEOs because they feel like, oh, they're so busy and they are busy, but you also have to look at what is their main priority as a CEO. And it is the success of their business, you know, so if you can present yourself as a potential way to improve their business, then they'll have, they'll feel as if they have a duty to exploit. And even if it doesn't mean them talking to you, if they pass you on to somebody whose job is to buy solutions that you offer, that's still, that happens all the time, you know. And so how you prove that to them is doing your research before you reach out. So pop their company's name into Google, take a look at their LinkedIn page, see what they've been posting about their public company, take a look at some earnings reports, have a good understanding as to the industry trends that are impacting everybody. Right? Like artificial intelligence. Everybody's trying to figure that out right now. So if you can somehow, if your solution uses it and you see that there is something that they're investing in, then by tying a strategic priority that they have to something that you offer, and then equally important, showing that it delivers results by sharing examples of similar companies that are benefiting from it, then they will feel an obligation. Okay, this is something that I should be exploring, right? Because if my competitors are doing it, then they must have something going for them. And if they don't explore it, then they risk being left behind. And so that's the approach that I take, which is I do my research, I find out what is their strategic priorities. I then identify what our company offers that could help with those strategic priorities. And then I will search for a case study or use case that I can reference and just reach out first thing in the morning. I'll schedule emails to be sent into their inbox at 8am or reach out on LinkedIn, what have you, and it'll just say something like, hey, you know, I saw that you've been making large investments in artificial intelligence. We utilize artificial intelligence to help streamline processes. It's helped a certain competitor improve their operational efficiencies by 25%. I feel like we could do the same for you. Do you have any time to jump on a call? And you know that's a compelling offering, right? If you can somehow increase their operational efficiencies by 20%, that would be massive for their business. Those are the type of things they care about. Not every employee is going to care about things like financial metrics. So you have to make sure that when you're reaching out to people, you're personalizing the value based on what they care about and what they're responsible for.

[B]

Absolutely. Well, a few quick Questions. Quick answers first. What have you seen as the biggest difference between selling to big companies versus small companies? What do you change? How do you shift?

[A]

Yeah, buying committee is, I would say, the biggest difference. Large companies tend to have more decision makers. They tend to require more steps in the sales cycle. It tends to take longer. They have people like finance and procurement that maybe you might not deal with as much. With smaller companies you may have one person, if it's a company of 20 people that has the ability to make that decision, whereas with a larger company it's a much more. You have to navigate a lot more people. Also, you may be more likely to deal with someone who is a C level executive at a smaller company because they are making those decisions on behalf of their company as opposed to a large company when they focus more on like high level at the C level level. Whereas they have people that have more titles like VP that are dealing with. Depending on what your solution is, that may be more likely to be the champion that will end up buying from you.

[B]

What are some of the biggest mistakes that you've seen new sellers make in sales meetings?

[A]

Yeah, and this is something that I mentioned earlier. I was kind of thinking about this example when I was speaking, which is I did the same thing going into a meeting, not doing a ton of research and just start presenting slides about your company. A few months ago, we reached out to a rep looking to find out about a specific service and it was laid out. This is what we want to talk about. The new rep gets on the phone and starts giving our company history and starts telling us about all the awards that they've won and all the different services which had nothing to do with what we reached out about. By the end of the meeting, we didn't even talk about what we asked to talk about. So presenting a presentation without first understanding what the customer actually wants to talk about, what they care about.

[B]

And what advice would you give someone who's just starting out in B2B sales and would love to follow in your footsteps and become a top producer on the team?

[A]

My advice would be to find a mentor. Find multiple mentors, reach out to people that you see doing really well at your company, look at the leaderboards, see who's got the most customers, who's got the most revenue, and then set up time with them and see if they'd be willing to set up a recurring conversation with you. You know, somebody that's outside of maybe your typical manager role, somebody that will tell you, tell you how it is somewhere. Who most Importantly is where you want to be and then meet with them and ask them how they did it. Those have been some of the most productive conversations I've had, and I still have them to this day.

[B]

And is there a lesson, something that's kind of in your mind that jumps out that you've learned over the years that you'd say is the most valuable sales lesson you ever learned?

[A]

That's a good question. Most valuable. Oh, this is, this is one that was a. I did not realize this when I first started, which is, as a salesperson, you're going to be selling internally just as much as you're going to be selling externally. So you need to put as much emphasis on your internal relationships and your internal communication as you do your external communication. If you work in B2B sales, chances are you're part of a team, so you work with other people. You're going to have to rely on those people. And it's really important that you have strong relationships with them because what's going to happen is you're going to have to, at some point, go out of process to run a piece of business, and you want those people that are going to have to approve you going out of process to want to do that for you. The other thing is make sure you understand the. Go to contacts internally. That's one of the things that could take a while and can have a really detrimental impact on your time management. If you don't know where to go, then you send yourself up to run all over the place to. Every time you need to ask a legal question or you need to find something from marketing or finance, make that a priority. To do when you first start is to know who all the internal contacts are to go with and where. You know, where do you go and when. So understanding your sales cycle, understanding all the steps in the sales cycle and who to go to for what when you come up to them. If you make that a priority up front, you'll save yourself a lot of time later on the road when you actually need them.

[B]

So true. Especially if you're selling something that's not straightforward, like consulting and that sort of thing. It's, it's, it's so something that's an amorphous product. I think it's, you know, you can spend more time, especially at a larger company, dealing internally than the next.

[A]

Yep.

[B]

What, what would you say is, what should all salespeople do every day? What, what habits should they develop to become more successful?

[A]

I love that question because I, you know, you can really break down the success that we all achieve as the accumulation of daily positive habits. So what that was another thing that was a learning for me is, you know, you want to have success right away, but that's just not how it works. Your success will come if you put in the work and you do the right things every single day. It will happen. It may take six months, it may take three months, depending on your industry. But as long as you're consistently doing the right things and you're improving, that success will happen. So one of the things that I think is important to do every day is to think about how you can help individual prospects and customers, how you can provide value. I start my day by reading the trades. I'll see what's been going on in my industry so that I can advise my customers if there's anything that they should know. I'll see if there's any research out that could make sense for one of my customers and, or a prospect. And I will then use that to either add value to a customer just to be, you know, a strategic advisor for them or to move the proposals down the field. Right. So when you just reach out and you just checking in, that's pointless. That's just like an annoying email that, you know, you'd be like, if I, if I had something to tell you, I would tell you. Right. But if you say, hey, I know we were discussing the CPG vertical, here are some insights that I found that I think you might find a lot, very helpful. And hey, and by the way, do you have any updates on what we spoke about? Now that shows that you're just not, you're not just in it for yourself. You're providing value. So that way if they do, they'll have that appreciation towards you whenever the time may be.

[B]

Such great advice. Well, I'm going to attempt to summarize the wisdom you've dropped on us today here. For everybody that's driving while they're listening, first step to be to being a great salesperson is to become an expert in your field, their field, and the stuff that you're selling. Prospecting is all about who you're targeting. So make sure you take the time to really tightly define the right people that you should be targeting and keep iterating on that. You want to target those people that you decide are the right ones on multiple channels and try to catch people where they're the most active. And, you know, there's, it's tricky to figure out which one, which channel is the right one. For someone Sometimes try varying your timing on when you reach out to people since some people are more active or less active on certain channels at different times of the day and you know people are busy. So don't expect a response in your first two emails. On average it takes seven touch points for the person to, to really kind of bring, bring it to an interaction that is more meaningful. In meetings with new prospects, ask questions and let the prospect do most of the talking. As for a follow up meeting at the end of the first meeting to get a confirmation that they're interested in seeing more, it's a good time to bring that up. Time management is super important to being a top seller. You want to make sure you're allocating enough time towards new business and growing your pipeline. And also make sure you're setting aside enough time to research your new opportunities and research your customers and make sure you know everything you need to know to be prepared. Going into meetings and interactions with those customers, getting in front of CEOs and executives. The trick is to show them that you can move their business forward, help them with their problems. So do this back to research. Do this by doing good research, figuring out what their priorities are, figuring out what's important to them and their industry right now and, and, and figure out what they're willing to invest in, what are their top priorities and, and share, share how you've benefited similar companies because that can really kind of pique their interest in, in, in, in what you're doing and, and how you help people. Nobody likes to get laughed by their competitors, right. So great to bring that up in conversations. And you want to make sure your conversations are super personalized. You want to personalize your communication with your customers. Well, this has all been so helpful Andrew. Where can listeners read more about your work? What's the best way to get a hold of you?

[A]

Yeah, so I think that you just did a really good job summarizing everything. And honestly that's like the big thing also that we didn't really talk about. But it sits at the center of all of this which is being a good listener, actively listening. So if you're not listening when your prospect's talking, you're going to turn them off. It's super important that you're leaned in because ask questions only half the battle. Being able to recite back just like you did is what is required to have an effective sales meeting. So good job.

[B]

Thanks Chris.

[A]

Yeah, you know, I always try to give kudos like I've been buying a lot of stuff lately for my book, you know, and I, like, admired some of the salespeople that I've been talking to, and I like to call it out because, you know, as one salesperson, you know, it's nice to acknowledge when somebody's doing a good job. And the one common thread is that in all of those meetings, I was the one yapping away, and they were just listening. And then once they, you know, once they. Once I was done yapping, they said, okay, this is what we can do for you. That's how you sell in 2024. Yeah.

[B]

So how can you do that?

[A]

Right.

[B]

Because. Because everyone's needs are slightly different and so many solutions are customizable. And so, I mean, a lot of the. The basic widget sales, you know, if it's that basic, it's already just being sold on Amazon. Right. So almost all of us in professional sales jobs, the thing that, by nature, the thing that we're doing is complex, so it needs to be customized, even if it's just customizing the concept. And it's always the same thing you're giving people. No two people are using the same thing the same way.

[A]

Yeah. And so this is what I spend a lot of time writing about in my book, which is the answer to your question, which is how you could read more of my processes, stuff like that. You can sign up for the [e-mail] book a big part of the book is talking about how the art and science is the art and science of sales, the science being the numbers game, which we are all familiar with. And then the art, of course, being the human psychology element of it. So no two sales are the same, but there are common elements within each one of them. And that's what I try to attempt to do with my book, which is create processes of turning the art into a science. What you can do to get a prospect to like you, how you can build confidence, how you can create urgency. These are all things that I weave throughout while also talking about my stories, because sales careers are not linear. So I have had a lot of setbacks and I've had a lot of challenges. And I want to make that very clear to anybody who's in sales is. It's super hard. Anybody who tells you it's not probably doesn't actively sell. I actually do sell. So I get where you guys are coming from. And so that I also have been. We were talking about this earlier about putting out YouTube videos, and I'm just getting the hang of it. I'm not very technically savvy when it comes to that, but I have been speaking about a lot of the topics we've been talking about today, including things like competitive analysis, how to build rapport, instantly prospecting. And that could all be found on my YouTube [e-mail] Andrew Barbudo. And you can connect with me on LinkedIn. Happy to discuss anybody trying to build up my LinkedIn following. So I try to post regularly, content articles, et cetera. And that is LinkedIn.com in Andrew Barpedo.

[B]

I'll tell you on the, on the videos.

[A]

My.

[B]

One of my big lessons there is if you, if you actually put something out into the world that creates value, it's just, it's kind of a gift that keeps on giving. Like there, there are videos that I did, you know, seven, eight years ago that have just been sitting on YouTube and people just keep watching them and, you know, they, they'll, they'll discover, you know, what badger maps does or, or, or whatever. They'll find the podcast because of it. Who knows? But they're, you know, they'll, YouTube is a, there's billions of videos on it, I'm sure. But people are looking for specific things and great way to, you know, as a salesperson. Great way to get the special things that, you know, out into the world and create some magnets to catch some business.

[A]

Right, Right. And even if my half my face is off the camera, hopefully you can still hear my voice and still get value from it. Cause that's, that's one of the things I'm like. I'm trying to get things set up here. I don't have a professional setup here, believe it or not. You know, this is all pretty new to me. I had to move my desk so you don't see all my kitchen in the background. But I'm getting the hang of it. I'm trying to improve every day. That's what it's all about.

[B]

Yeah. I'll tell you, some of my first ones were pretty rough, honestly. But you see a big difference. If you want a good laugh, you can watch. There are a lot of the training videos I have are all in one list on Amazon, and I think they're in reverse order because the best ones are at the top. But if you want a good laugh, go back to the earliest ones and watch them the other way.

[A]

Or you can look at it the other way, which is. This is what I think about it. Like, you know, yes, it's a good laugh, but look how far you've Come. And when I think back when I first started, you know, I cringe when I think about the meetings that I had. I still can remember the look of my manager's face glaring at me when I was in a meeting, just presenting a pitch deck and not asking any questions. Somebody would bring up something, you know, prosper, bring something up, and I would just be like, kind of ignore it. Right. There's a learning curve, and no one's good at anything when they first start. But you can continue to improve and get better than everybody else if you continue to invest in get better. And then, you know, that's not a stagnant thing. That's another thing which a lot of salespeople do. They get to a certain point and they stop learning, they stop improving. I try to continue to learn from others because I don't know everything, and there's always more to know. So I try to set up as many meetings today with top salespeople as I did when I first started.

[B]

Yeah, I'll tell you that one of the reasons that sales and in particular field sales is so hard is it's, it's 20 different skills, and if you screw up any of them, you can blow the deal. Right? So it's, it's so many little things, and it's. It's a funny thing about this podcast is we, we've taken deep dives into so many little things. You're just like, I never even would have even thought about how, how many, how much complexity there is in this one little slice of sales. Marketing is a similar thing where there's just. There's a million little things going on. It's so, it's so different than a lot of jobs where it's just like, yeah, I'm an expert in this one thing, and I do that one thing, and it's because I'm an expert in it and they pay me for it. And it's like, wow, that sounds so.

[A]

Easy compared to proactive versus Reactive. Yeah, that was another big thing from proactive versus Reaction. No one's going to tell you what to do when you first get into the day. You know, you have to figure it out, which is why time management so important. You're your own boss. You're better off. Your clients are your own, are your boss. And the revenue that you bring in from them, they'll tell you with their wallet if you're doing a good job or not. So that was another thing that was a learning curve is like, oh, going from a reactive job, like an account manager type of role or a services and support role where you are told what to do to, hey, you're in sales, figure it out. You have a quota, do your best to achieve it. And if you don't, you know, yeah.

[B]

Well, the rubber's got to meet the road somewhere in the world and there's benefits that it meets the road in sales. You know, obviously it's, you know, it's a well compensated career path and I think it's an exciting and mentally engaging career path. No one's bored, so those the good things. But it is, you know, it does mean you have to hit a curveball and there's, there's a lot to know about a lot of things. Well, hey, guys, this has been a great episode of the outside sales talk. If you work in field sales, you'll love badger maps. It's the number one route planner. Helps you sell 20% more, drive 20% less. You can get a free [e-mail] today. And if anyone can think of any other sales reps that would, that would benefit from the stuff that, that we've learned today, definitely take, take the time to share this with them. And you know, I really appreciate your time today, Andrew, and thanks for coming on the show.

[A]

Thanks for having me.

[B]

Take care.

[A]

By.