Ep 691 - The Invasion (Animorphs #1), by K.A. Applegate

Summary

Overdue Podcast - Episode 691: The Invasion (Animorphs #1) by K.A. Applegate

In Episode 691 of Overdue, hosted by Andrew and Craig from Headgum, the duo embarks on a comprehensive exploration of The Invasion, the inaugural book of the beloved Animorphs series by K.A. Applegate. Released on February 24, 2025, this episode delves deep into the book's narrative, characters, themes, and the broader impact of the series.

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1. Introduction to Animorphs and the Hosts' Approach

Craig opens the discussion by introducing Animorphs as the first book they've tackled in their backlog. "Animorphs by K.A. Applegate that we both read on the podcast number one invasion," Andrew remarks at [01:09]. The hosts establish their intention to provide an engaging and spoiler-rich analysis, blending personal insights with critical examination.

2. Exploring K.A. Applegate: The Author Behind the Series

A significant portion of the episode is dedicated to understanding the mind behind Animorphs. Andrew explains at [05:10], "K.A. Applegate is Katherine Applegate and her husband, Michael Grant, writing jointly under a pseudonym." They delve into the authors' journey from managing weekly rentals to becoming prolific writers, highlighting their initial foray into ghostwriting with the Sweet Valley Twins series ([06:00]).

Craig adds, "[07:05] She won the Newbery Medal in 2013 for The One and Only Ivan," emphasizing Applegate's versatility and acclaim in children's literature. The discussion touches upon various pen names used by the authors, such as Pat Polari and Katherine Kendall, revealing their extensive contributions to both juvenile and adult genres ([07:33]).

3. The Animorphs Series: Scope and Reception

Andrew outlines the breadth of the Animorphs series, noting its extensive run from 1996 to 2001 with 54 main books and 10 companion volumes ([10:50]). They discuss the challenges of maintaining consistency with multiple ghostwriters and how Applegate and Grant occasionally returned to write key installments like books #26, #32, #53, and #54 to preserve the series' continuity ([11:05]).

4. Plot Overview of The Invasion

The hosts provide a detailed synopsis of The Invasion. The story centers on Jake, a typical teenager who, along with his friends Marco, Cassie, Tobias, and Rachel, gains the ability to morph into animals. This power is bestowed upon them by Andalite aliens to combat the invading Yeerk species, parasitic beings intent on enslaving humanity.

Andrew describes the initial setup at the arcade, where the friends stumble upon the Andalites and receive their morphing powers ([31:09]). The narrative quickly escalates as they confront the horrifying reality of Yeerk-controlled individuals within their community ([49:56]).

5. Character Analysis and Development

Jake: The protagonist, Jake, is portrayed as a relatable teen grappling with typical adolescent challenges alongside the extraordinary burden of saving the world. Craig notes Jake's balanced family life juxtaposed with the impending alien threat ([39:12]).

Cassie: Introduced as compassionate and skilled in controlling morphs, Cassie's background in animal rescue is pivotal to her character development ([34:03]). Her ability to manipulate morphing techniques sets her apart in the group ([58:51]).

Marco: Characterized by his reluctance to engage due to personal family struggles, Marco provides a layer of emotional depth. "He's very quick to not want to because he is scared for what would happen to his father if something happened to him," Andrew explains ([34:27]).

Tobias: Perhaps the most complex character, Tobias's transformation into a hawk becomes a profound narrative about identity and self-acceptance. The hosts explore interpretations of Tobias as a trans character, aligning his permanent morph state with themes of gender identity ([67:30]).

Rachel: Jake’s attractive cousin, Rachel's role introduces elements of youthful crushes and interpersonal dynamics. Andrew humorously reflects on the awkwardness of having a "hot cousin" within the story ([33:53]).

6. Themes and Literary Devices

The episode highlights the juxtaposition of youthful adventure with mature, serialized storytelling. Andrew comments on the "tone versus the stakes of the story" being "a little out of sync in this initial entry" ([14:07]). This balance allows Animorphs to cater to a younger audience while embedding deeper, thought-provoking themes about war, identity, and ethics.

Notable literary devices include:

• Morphing Mechanism: The detailed and often graphic descriptions of the morphing process serve as both a plot device and a metaphor for personal transformation ([56:30]).

• Serialized Storytelling: Unlike episodic children's series, Animorphs maintains a continuous narrative, enhancing its complexity and depth ([14:45]).

7. Modern Interpretations and Cultural Impact

Andrew and Craig discuss how Animorphs resonates with contemporary audiences, particularly regarding Tobias's character. They reference Cassius Adair's analysis in Stealth or My Life in Animorphs, which interprets Tobias's transformation as a narrative parallel to transgender experiences ([70:20]).

K.A. Applegate and Michael Grant's personal lives, including their support for trans rights, add layers of authenticity and relational depth to the series' themes, despite their initial intentions not being explicitly focused on these issues ([73:40]).

8. Merchandise and Legacy

The hosts briefly touch upon the series' merchandise, including unique items like the "anamorphing sphere" and themed toys from collaborations with brands like Pizza Hut. These items, while humorous, underscore the cultural footprint Animorphs left in the late '90s and early 2000s ([105:00]).

9. Conclusion and Reflections

In their closing remarks, Andrew and Craig reflect on the intricate layering of Animorphs—a series that combines gripping adolescent adventure with profound philosophical inquiries. Craig summarizes, "War is not a thing that anybody wins... but K.A. Applegate and Michael Grant have a good head on their collective shoulders" ([96:42]).

The hosts express appreciation for how the series continues to inspire and resonate with readers decades later, emphasizing its lasting significance in children's literature.

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Notable Quotes

• Andrew ([01:09]): "I will take away how gross some of the descriptions of the morphing process were because you, I think you just expect it to just go quick. You expect it to be like video game fast."

• Craig ([05:10]): "We're going to talk about the author and then we're going to talk about the book itself."

• Andrew ([14:07]): "The tone versus the stakes of the story seem a little out of sync in this initial entry."

• Craig ([34:27]): "The explicit Des. His family situation is that he never knew his father. His mother left him for some reason he doesn't know."

• Andrew ([67:30]): "One of the main characters for folks who are reading these books with a lens on being trans or otherwise."

• Craig ([96:42]): "War is not a thing that anybody wins... but K.A. Applegate and Michael Grant have a good head on their collective shoulders."

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Final Thoughts

Episode 691 serves as a thorough and insightful examination of The Invasion, setting the stage for future discussions on the Animorphs series. Andrew and Craig successfully balance critical analysis with personal anecdotes, making the episode both informative and engaging for long-time fans and newcomers alike. Their exploration of character depth, thematic complexity, and the series' enduring legacy underscores Animorphs' place as a cornerstone in children's science fiction literature.

For those interested in diving deeper, the hosts recommend reading Cassius Adair's Stealth or My Life in Animorphs and exploring the extensive Animorphs Wiki for fan theories and additional insights.

Transcript

[Andrew]

This is a Headgum podcast.

[Craig]

While Andrew and Craig believe the joy of discovery is crucial to enjoying any well told tale, they will not shy away from spoiling specific story beats when necessary. Plus, these are books you should have read by now. Hey, everybody. Welcome to Overdue. It's a podcast about the books you've been meaning to read. My name is Craig.

[Andrew]

My name is Andrew.

[Craig]

And wait. Oh no. I'm a lizard. I used to be a man.

[Andrew]

I hated the process of watching you turn into a lizard because I had to see every frame of the animation that happens when you turn from a man.

[Craig]

Yeah, I do it in 60fps too, so there's a lot of frames.

[Andrew]

That's my. That's. That's probably the thing I will take away from this book, Animorphs by K.A. applegate that we both read on the podcast number one invasion. Yes, the podcast where both of us, or sometimes one of us reads a book that we've never read before and then tells you about it.

[Craig]

Yeah.

[Andrew]

Every week we're back with another podcast and here we are again. I will take away how gross some of the descriptions of the morphing process were because you, I think you just.

[Craig]

She's in it.

[Andrew]

You expect it to just go quick. You expect it to be like video game fast.

[Craig]

Yeah. Like, it's like, oh. And then you look away. And I wouldn't be surprised if in later books, maybe some of them get a little quick.

[Andrew]

Maybe they get better at morphing.

[Craig]

And even in this book, the morphs at the end.

[Andrew]

It's clearly a skill that can be honed.

[Craig]

Yes. And that when you're not. When you're doing something else while you're morphing, rather than just like sitting in your friend's bedroom, that the author is not always like lingering on the horrors.

[Andrew]

Yeah. But if you, you know, if you, if you've seen a classic cover for an Animorphs book where it's a kid on one end and an animal on the other end and then three or four like deeply upsetting frames in between the kid and the animal. Honestly, that is pretty true to the experience of reading what the book is.

[Craig]

Yeah, it's true.

[Andrew]

Which is. This is wild that neither of us have experienced this, this book series before. But I had never, I had never read it. I just never read it.

[Craig]

I want to say I read this as a kid. I was. I think I had it. I definitely watched some of the Nickelodeon television show. I did just send you a clip in which the main character, Jake does transform into a dog.

[Andrew]

Do I need to watch this?

[Craig]

You just watch it. Right. Just watch it right now. It should have the time. It should have the time stamp for when the. The boy. Because that's like.

[Andrew]

That's pretty nuts. That's pretty nuts.

[Craig]

Just kind of elongates it because of the.

[Andrew]

Though, again, I feel like the, like, the quality of the morph effect that you would have on a 90s kids television show. Pretty true to the way that the morphing is described in this book.

[Craig]

Yeah. Though it's a little less focused on the hairiness.

[Andrew]

And there's a lot of, like. Yeah, there's a lot of thinking about, like, what's my skin doing? What's my hair doing?

[Craig]

Correct. But no, we've never talked about this on the show. We've never really talked about Animorphs to each other other than as a. Isn't it funny how on all the covers the kids go like this and then like, what if you were the third kid in the five kids sequence?

[Andrew]

I feel like, you know, in the last. We've been doing the show for many years. I think at multiple points during our journey with this podcast, I think we've said, like, when are we gonna do Animorphs? And it felt like. And I think. I know we've talked about it in the context of, like, the Long Read series, but the trouble with doing Anamorphs is that it's more intensely serialized than. Than even. Oh, yeah, Sitters Club is.

[Craig]

Yeah.

[Andrew]

And I'm not ready to commit to 54 of these guys if you're. If you're not counting, like, the different, like, compendiums and stuff that.

[Craig]

The Megamorph books.

[Andrew]

Yeah. Megamorphs.

[Craig]

Yep. Huh.

[Andrew]

But here we are reading the Invasion Animorphs number one.

[Craig]

I'm very excited to talk about this book.

[Andrew]

I am. I'm. That's. It was. I had a good time. I have notes, but mostly. Mostly good. I have a lot of notes about a lot of things.

[Craig]

But yeah, we're going to talk about the author and then we're going to. We're going to talk about the book itself. Interesting thing there. The author, K.A. applegate. Andrew. Who is K A. Applegate.

[Andrew]

K A Applegate is Katherine Applegate and her husband, Michael Grant, writing jointly under a pseudonym.

[Craig]

I had. I did not know that until this podcast. I just assumed it was. It was. It's not that it was. It's Catherine Applegate, not Christine Applegate, who's an actress.

[Andrew]

Catherine Applegate.

[Craig]

Applegate that it was just her doing the. Here are my initials. So it's like boys can read a book not written by a lady because it's the 90s. They said that that was a scholastic thing. Now they. They had both been ghost writers prior to this as well.

[Andrew]

I've got. Yeah, I've got a bit on that. This is a. This is Michael Grant talking. This is a transcript I found. 2009 interview he did with the University of South Alabama.

[Craig]

Okay.

[Andrew]

Just about like business, I guess.

[Craig]

Okay.

[Andrew]

He. He says, we got started when Catherine said, you know what? I think maybe we should get careers and have kids. And I said, what? We were living in a beach town, working in restaurants and managing weekly rentals. Basically just living the life of free and easy singles. But we were getting a little old for that life. I took a couple of years from that. It took a couple of years from that point for us to sell our first book. Turns out you have to actually write something first. By that point, we were in a different beach town cleaning homes and offices. Catherine founded the business, you might say. She brought me in to help share the workload. You're not doing anything. Write this book for me. From there, it became a full partnership. Our first break in kid lit was ghostwriting Sweet Valley Twins. From there, we moved into other ghostwriting gigs and then onto our own series.

[Craig]

Yep.

[Andrew]

Yes. Sweet Valley Twins, 1980. Started in 1986, a spin off of the Sweet Valley High series. But yeah, they have both. Both jointly and separately written like a ton of books. Apple Applegate is a Newbery Medal award winner in 2013 for her book the One and Only Ivan.

[Craig]

It's about a gorilla. That book.

[Andrew]

Cool.

[Craig]

It's about a real gorilla.

[Andrew]

She won best New Children's Book series from Publishers Weekly in 1997. She's also. She's. I don't know if you ever encountered like at a Scholastic book fair, the Bar Forama series. Craig.

[Craig]

No.

[Andrew]

This is a truly, genuinely disgusting and out of print series by Applegate under the pen name Pat Polari.

[Craig]

Whoa.

[Andrew]

That's just about like barfing and pooping and stuff.

[Craig]

She loves kid.

[Andrew]

Like children. Like children trying to gross each other out.

[Craig]

Oh, I couldn't. She loves to have an alliterative pen name. Her first. One of her first published works was an adult romance under the name Katherine Kendall in 1988.

[Andrew]

Yeah, I've got Le Blair, Katherine Kendall, Beth Kincaid, Ar Plum, Pat Polari and Nicholas Stevens all listed as pen names for her or for both of them. It's not they don't really distinguish. And then Grant by himself has written. So together they've written a big chunk of the Animorph series, part of the Everworld series, the Making out series. Many of these had ghostwriters involved at some point. I don't have a complete list for any other series other than Animorphs, but by himself he's written the Gone series, the Berserk series, spelled bzrk, the messenger of Fear series, and the Front Lines books.

[Craig]

Okay.

[Andrew]

I think is currently a trilogy. And so, yeah, it's a husband and wife team.

[Craig]

They were both born in the 50s. Books.

[Andrew]

Yes. Yeah. She in 1956, him in 1954.

[Craig]

She. I saw she worked a real May.

[Andrew]

And slightly later in May romance.

[Craig]

The story I saw was that in one interview he said that he saw her through her apartment window and went and knocked on her door. That's how they met. Which is one way to do it.

[Andrew]

That is one way to do it.

[Craig]

Like, hi, there's a pretty lady over there. And this is.

[Andrew]

This is complicated. Yeah, the story is like. It's kind of. It's. It's being tugged between these three points. And one point is like, oh, that's a cute story. And one point is, oh, that's a gross story. And one point is. Isn't that a friend's? Didn't that happen on friends to one of them at some point? Or am I just thinking of that naked guy? They would always look, I think.

[Craig]

No, I don't think that's what he saw. I don't think that's what it is. No, I think it's, um. I saw that, you know, they both moved around a lot when they were younger and she worked as for. For a veterinarian when she was in high school. She went to UT Austin for liberal arts. They settled down in California. And they. Yeah, to. To your. The quote that you read from him earlier. They were just like working odd jobs forever, like for a very long time.

[Andrew]

You know, and then. And then she came to him and she said, no odd job.

[Craig]

Yes.

[Andrew]

Slappers only.

[Craig]

Slappers only. Oh, wow, that one snuck up on you. That's appropriate. Late 90s for this book, you know, Myself laughing. I'm gonna. I'm gonna read Animorphs and go play goldeneye with my friends. You know, paintball mode, whatever. No get no game since has ever been so good at, like, throwing shade at you afterwards with the little superlatives.

[Andrew]

More. More games should have little individualized superlatives that either compliment you or Gently make you feel better. Thank you for, for the game that you just played.

[Craig]

But no. So this series is 96 to 2001, as you said, 54 books, 10 companion books.

[Andrew]

Yeah, I have got, I've got that. Most books between 25 and 52 are ghostwritten.

[Craig]

Yep.

[Andrew]

I was kind of surprised. Like it's a revolving cast of authors. Like I don't, I don't, I didn't, I didn't take down to anyone's name because nobody really writes more than two or three of them.

[Craig]

Yes.

[Andrew]

I was just a little surprised to see so little continuity given. Like a thing like Babysitter's Club where some of the ghost, like the ghost writers are like their individual styles are known well enough that it becomes a.

[Craig]

Subject of like you can have a favorite one.

[Andrew]

Yeah, yeah. Right. The exceptions are 26 and 32 are both Applegate written for whatever reason. And then they return to write 53 and 54 to close the series out at the end. They didn't mean to employ ghostwriters, but they had their first kid and they're working on other series for Scholastic and it just kind of happened.

[Craig]

Yep. And they. There was an Reddit AMA where I think she was like, yeah, we were probably terrible to work for. We had these outlines and we were not trained as editors, so we would get these manuscripts and we're not like gracious about the notes that we were giving and things like that.

[Andrew]

That's a, that is a tough way to be edited. And, and when I've worked as an editor, I've really worked hard to avoid it. But like you, you have to, if you edit, but also you're a writer, you really, really have to be like on guard against that. Like, oh, I wouldn't have written it this way. Let me just completely rewrite it the way I would have written. Yes. Impulse you've got, you've got to let people be able to like make their own, like use their own prose to make the, the like wider points that you want them to make. I guess.

[Craig]

Yes. The. There are like five or six main characters. There are five main characters in this book and then there's a six that I guess we meet in, in later books.

[Andrew]

Mallory.

[Craig]

That's. Yeah. And it was originally conceived as a three part story called the Changelings and then shuffled around into this larger plot inspired by a love of animals. And she heard like initial germ of an idea was like, I'd like to write about animals and that it would be fun to put the reader inside the Animal's mind and body, she said. And then different interviews have her saying it occurred to her or her being like, my husband was like, okay, that's a sci fi story. You need to write a sci fi story in this one. Scholastic article or. No, this was like an old Scholastic website. That's what this was. Oh, boy. This is a fun website. She said. I needed a way for the kids to use their morphing powers. It was either fight aliens or morph to bust whoever stole the sandwich from the locker. That seemed dull. So I started down the alien road and never looked back.

[Andrew]

Yeah, that is cooler. That is objectively cooler. I could see doing the like, mystery solving kids who turn into animals thing.

[Craig]

Yes.

[Andrew]

And like, it would probably work okay, but I don't think people would still be thinking and talking about it.

[Craig]

And you use, you know, one of the things you said to me in prep for the show is that like, kind of the. Some of the tone versus the stakes of the story seem a little out of sync in this, in this initial entry.

[Andrew]

Yeah, like, we'll, we'll talk more about it when we get to the story part. But I do like, you get. You've got like, kid to very young adult book pacing in this, which means it's not very long. You cannot like, take a lot of time to have like a big mystery that unfolds. Like, basically, if somebody decides to look for something, they find the thing that they're looking for. Really, really cool.

[Craig]

Yes.

[Andrew]

That's without, without a lot of, without a lot of looking at it. But then, but, but then also, it is like aliens are taking over Earth and they've built like a subterranean city where they have enslaved the entire town that we live in without anybody realizing it.

[Craig]

Yes.

[Andrew]

So you're, you are doing a very big, like, serialized end of the world story that also has like, it's, it's gotta have, it's gotta move. You've gotta set up a bunch of characters. You've kind of got to end books with. Like, I'll get you next time you gadget. Like sort of temporary small defeat for one side or the other. That does not actually resolve the wider story. Like, it's just, it's a. Because Goosebumps is totally episodic, which makes sense for that series, baby. So just Club is like lightly serialized.

[Craig]

Yeah.

[Andrew]

In a way where you definitely, like, they definitely reference the events of past books in current books, but also, like, there's a little bit of commie kind of every, every book resets, like, starts from a Certain status quo that, that you can expect.

[Craig]

Every time there was at least one interview or Q and A, I read where Applegate was like, yeah, you could probably just pick up a random Animorphs book. I mean, you might need a little help. But I, I think it's probably of the series like this, of this age range and this kind of like the Scholastic omnipresence of it. I think this is the one where you probably want to read them in order the most.

[Andrew]

You probably do, though. I'm sure Scholastic knows, like, you know, you're going to get your kids who are going to read in order, and then you're going to get your kids who, like, buy it at the book fair. They've got. They own books like 116 and 27.

[Craig]

Yep, yep.

[Andrew]

And that's all they've got. And all those books have to, like, work on as standalone things. I'm sure that they do.

[Craig]

She said that the. More this was an interview with Entertainment Weekly around the 20th anniversary. I think the more philosophical or educational elements were in service to the story, not the other way around. Goals number one, two and three were to have readers snapping through the pages and forgetting to breathe. And way down around goal number four was, hey, let's consider the nature of consciousness.

[Andrew]

A few other learn about animals.

[Craig]

A few other notes on the series she apparently used, or they apparently used YM and Seventeen magazines as inspiration for some of the kids. The titles were often handled by the Scholastic editors, of course. This is. This book is called the Invasion.

[Andrew]

The Invasion.

[Craig]

There's lots of references to Lord of the Rings throughout this series. Andrew, did you know where Yerk comes from?

[Andrew]

Oh, is that like an orc thing?

[Craig]

Yes, it is. The. Well, it says here the Sindarin, which I think is Elvish.

[Andrew]

Oh, yes, yes.

[Craig]

For orcs.

[Andrew]

Now I do remember. That is Yerk. Yes. Though it's spelled much differently.

[Craig]

It's spelled differently. And there's a few other things. And I did have a note here that says the classic Animorph cover where a child turns into an animal over five images. They had these. They were designed by David Mattingly using software called, what is it, Elastic Reality, which was this morphing software in the 90s when we had morphing software.

[Andrew]

Software used to be so cool. Software used to be so neat because you needed a different app to do, like every individual active image manipulation that was possible. And now it's like, what if we gave you a calendar app that you always had to be online to use? And also it had AI garbage in.

[Craig]

It for no reason. The original.

[Andrew]

Sell all your data to the Saudis just for fun.

[Craig]

The original one was done by Peter Bollinger and it's a kid turning into a. It's just his head.

[Andrew]

It's just his head.

[Craig]

It's a lot more frames and it's like eight frames. Or you look at the 2011 one and it's just his, like, face with a lizard eye.

[Andrew]

Yeah. The 2011 ones aren't as iconic, I think, but I'm experiencing that primarily as an. As an e book, like on my black and white Kindle. So they're. They're not going to have the impact, I don't think. But yeah, I just. I. And I think you could. I think any person of a certain age who you talk to will agree. I live my nightmares are haunted by the fourth out of five frames in an Animorphous transform. Like, the fourth one is always the most.

[Craig]

There was some. There was.

[Andrew]

Because it's the. That's. The fourth one is always where they switch to using the animal picture as the base.

[Craig]

Yes.

[Andrew]

And then they superimpose the human features over it instead of the other way around.

[Craig]

Yes.

[Andrew]

And it always looks the most busted.

[Craig]

My favorite. There was one in the. In the. In our overdue discord where someone was sharing the one where a girl turns into. I think, what's a. A rat. I thought it might have been a possum, but I think it's a rat. And the fourth one, the rat is wearing pants. And it is. It is truly the meme of what? Of how a horse.

[Andrew]

Wait, which. Yeah. Which direction are the pants on?

[Craig]

They're in the one where it's just the back legs.

[Andrew]

Just the back.

[Craig]

Not all four.

[Andrew]

That makes sense.

[Craig]

Yeah.

[Andrew]

Okay.

[Craig]

They did re. Release these in 2011, or at least the first. The first eight books, I think they rereleased in 2011.

[Andrew]

I've also got. Yeah, like, there haven't been new books in the series since it ended, but. But it is still pretty active. They released audiobooks on Audible for the entire series between 2020 and 2023. There's a graphic novel series coming out at a steady but extremely slow clip. Started in 2020 with a. An adaptation of the Invasion. And a graphic novel for book six is due out on March 4th of this year. They're doing one, sometimes two a year of these.

[Craig]

One of the interviews I found was from last August. The graphic novels are by Chris Grine or Chris Greene, G R I N E. And there was an interview with Both Grant and Applegate about the series. Just because this, you know, this graphic novel series has been cooking for a while.

[Andrew]

Yeah.

[Craig]

So, yeah, that's a. I think that's what I have rel like, up front here.

[Andrew]

I have a little bit of adaptation stuff.

[Craig]

There's.

[Andrew]

You mentioned it. You mentioned it earlier. There was a TV series that ran for two seasons between 98 and 99. One season was of 20 episodes and one season six episodes, which I think most people know to interpret as a cancellation. Some of the episodes mapped, like, pretty specifically to individual books. Others just kind of grabbed individual plotlines from the set books in Toronto as needed. Yeah. As one of. One of many 90s kids TV shows where everybody's Canadian.

[Craig]

Yes. Yeah.

[Andrew]

So, okay, we're going to do this again. Let's talk about the movie.

[Craig]

Oh, can I quickly just tell you that the only actor I recognize from the show is Sean Ashmore. He's the main. He's the main boy. And he.

[Andrew]

What's he.

[Craig]

He would go on to be Iceman in that original X Men trilogy of films.

[Andrew]

Okay.

[Craig]

And Andrew, I think he's in like two or three episodes of the Boys.

[Andrew]

The Boys, you say?

[Craig]

Yeah, one of the Lamplighter. Is that the Boys?

[Andrew]

No, Lamplighter is a guy.

[Craig]

Yeah, he's in like two or three episodes.

[Andrew]

Yeah, he's kind of a tortured superhero sort of guy. That explains everything.

[Craig]

The whole show, I think.

[Andrew]

Right? That explains everything.

[Craig]

And Cassie's mom is played by Melanie Nichols King, who was Shakima's partner on the Wire. That's. That's the only other person I could find that had a role that I recognized on their resume.

[Andrew]

Okay.

[Craig]

So most people are like, hey, here's a Canadian actor who was on Animorphs. But anyway, tell me about the movie.

[Andrew]

The. The movie. We. And we. We just talked about this. This is another. They announced it and we haven't gotten an update.

[Craig]

Oh, no.

[Andrew]

Since they announced it situation. The most recent, like, formal news article I can find about it came from a 2020 Hollywood Reporter article that just said there's a movie that's happening. It would have been or could still be part of a larger deal between Scholastic and a then new production company called Picture Start, which would produce multiple movies based on Scholastic series. All I know about its current status is Picture Start, which is still active. Their horror horrible website still lists it as in development with no director or stars attached. And then Applegate and Grant were involved initially, but as of an early 2021 interview with Grant that I Found they have just like stepped away from it. Not. Not. It doesn't sound like it was acrimonious. It was just like they literally didn't care that to show up.

[Craig]

Would you like a more acrimonious quote?

[Andrew]

Okay. All right. I'm sure. I think they have given. This is. I think they've probably given answers to this question with varying amounts of, like, diplomacy.

[Craig]

Yes. So baked. This is the 2024 comicsbeat.com interview.

[Andrew]

Yes. All right. That's three years later. Of course they're gonna be saltier about this one.

[Craig]

Asked by the interviewer Kaplan about the 2020 movie adaptation, to the best of our knowledge, they say the Animorphs movie project is dead in the water. We're frustrated with the inability of Scholastic to do something with what is, in our opinion, one of the more interesting, potentially more profitable pieces of IP around. None of the people at Scholastic who were involved with Animorphs are still at Scholastic. Few people there now seem really to understand the books or their impact. The best outcome would be for Scholastic to sell their Animorphs rights to someone who could do something with them. Hollywood is well infiltrated by Anifans itching. Do something.

[Andrew]

The invasion.

[Craig]

The invasion has begun.

[Andrew]

Hollywood's been invaded by the Anifans.

[Craig]

They see. Here's what I will say from reading a number of interviews with them. I will return to this comic be interview a little later in the show as we talk about Tobias and some of the, you know, reader narratives around him. They just seem to have a really cool take on the fact that they wrote Animorphs. Like, they just seem to love the people who read Animorphs to have remained pretty chill about it.

[Andrew]

They've got like, kooky aunt and uncle, honestly, also, which is. Which works for them.

[Craig]

The fact that it only ever became one and a half seasons of a TV show may be part of that. Like, if they get that, you know, okay, does KFC and Taco Bell, a Pizza Hut roll out a bunch of Animorphs toys when the TV show is happening? Yes. You can go to the Animars Wiki and learn about these terrible toys. Oh, no. They all look kind of dumb. Andrew, I'm sorry.

[Andrew]

You don't have to apologize to me. Like, I get it.

[Craig]

One is a stopwatch that is meant to be the two hour timer for how long you can. More wait.

[Andrew]

Is this stopwatch that only goes up to two hours?

[Craig]

I don't know. I don't really understand.

[Andrew]

That would be so stupid.

[Craig]

I Mean, it's the claw to hand watch. Let me send it to you.

[Andrew]

Or is it just a regular stopwatch? And they're like, yeah, one of the time intervals you could measure on the stopwatch is two hours.

[Craig]

But I fear that if it had been, it made a, like a big film in the. Oh, wow. We have to find our Harry Potter. Let's make a film out of it that maybe if it had blown up, you know, I would. I would like to think that they would have kept a cool head about it.

[Andrew]

But this is just a little stopwatch that counts down from two hours. Yeah, that's all it is. Claw to hand.

[Craig]

The claw to hand watch.

[Andrew]

Wow.

[Craig]

I just need you to think about that for a second. All right, that's probably it. We've gone. This is one of our longer intro sections. We should probably take a quick break.

[Andrew]

Well, okay, One last thing. This book, this bugs me about Star Trek as well, is that they. They get these morphing powers from an alien who came down from space, but for some reason, the morphing power is exactly synced to our Earth hours.

[Craig]

I had that note.

[Andrew]

Okay.

[Craig]

And I don't. I don't really know. I have other notes about the time limit.

[Andrew]

I don't have anything. I don't have anything to say about it in Star Trek either. Like, at some point they just stopped even doing, like, oh, your Earth days or whatever. It's just like, yeah, everybody. Everybody knows days and hours, and it's fine.

[Craig]

And in the, The. In this book you could say that. Like the. I don't know why it's such a round number, but like the.

[Andrew]

That it's like an hour 57 or like two hours and five.

[Craig]

It's like, you know, galactic swatch time. And the. And the alien is like, well, I'm gonna think about time in my brain and you're gonna hear it as two hours. Like that. That makes sense to me.

[Andrew]

Universal translator explanation.

[Craig]

Yes, but why is it such a round number when we have such a weird, like, pilot around the sun situation? Think about it. If you ever read these books, why is it two hours? Have fun. We'll see you after the break.

[Andrew]

Craig, I got something coming in over the transom.

[Craig]

Okay. I got my earbuds on whatever I'm supposed to do for a telegraph for all overdue.

[Andrew]

Axe, we're. You thought we were done, but we're back. We're still conducting our audience survey. Everybody at Gum FM overdue, and we want to hear from you so we can keep making content. You Love you know this. We know this. There are ads on our podcast. We want to improve that experience. But in order to do this, we need to know a little bit more about you, our audience. The survey is a quick and easy and free way to support this podcast. It'll take you two minutes and you'll be helping us out so much by doing it. And you cannot, you will not stop hearing this ad reminding you to do it until we hit certain numerical thresholds. So please go to Gum FM Overdue to fill out the audience survey. You're helping us and you're helping you. That's G U M F M O V E R D U E. And thank you very much.

[Craig]

The survey continues until morale improves. Okay, I've. I'm done morphing into an ad break now.

[Andrew]

I'm still like, I'm on frame number four between ad and.

[Craig]

Oh, that's why you look that way.

[Andrew]

So I am going to talk mostly about animorphs, but I might also mention, like, mattresses or, or like protein powder or something periodically.

[Craig]

So tell me how this book opens. Andrew, let's get into the plot part of the book. It's not a. It's not a very elaborate one, as you said. It's got, you know, very young reader pacing. There's lots to talk about, but it doesn't like. It doesn't bemoan any of its scenes. It just kind of goes, no.

[Andrew]

So we open the book is told from the perspective of Jake, who is just a kind of a normal teenage boy.

[Craig]

Yep.

[Andrew]

13Ish. My understanding of the. Of the series is that each book comes from the perspective of a different one of our core teens.

[Craig]

Yep.

[Andrew]

But Jake is the one who is our. Is our entry point. He is hanging out with his friend Marco at the arcade playing a game where the sleaze troll shows up right after you cross the Nether Fjord.

[Craig]

Yeah. Yes.

[Andrew]

Which is a little bit. I mean, it's giving me like R.L. stine attempting to talk about kids playing video games without having experienced any video Games himself.

[Craig]

The 90s edition referenced Sega.

[Andrew]

Whoa, really?

[Craig]

Yeah.

[Andrew]

Did they scholastic it?

[Craig]

Oh, man, they did. They did a series of. If you go to animorphs.fandom.com/wiki/the underscore the invasion, you can find the chart comparing the. The relaunch differences between editions.

[Andrew]

Okay.

[Craig]

There are several where in the. In the 90s version a character demanded a question and in the 2011 version they asked the question. Okay. But no, it's. It's. I have Sega at home, so I get lots of practice in. Or I have a system at home, so I get lots of practice in. Don't want to date this book with which video game system is available, even though the most.

[Andrew]

Like, as. As a teen, you would never not say which system it was exactly. Because you would need to. I mean, you were to buy into a console when you. When you're this age, like that is. That is the only one you have. And because it's the only one you have, it becomes the best one of all of the ones that there are to buy and you become an immovable partisan. On.

[Craig]

And later, later in the book, there's a reference to the game Dead Zone 5, which in the 90s edition is a CD game we were going to play on my computer. And in this edition it's a game we were going to play at my place.

[Andrew]

Yeah. Don't be specific about the technology you're playing the game on. I guess.

[Craig]

I guess. But yes, Marco and Jake are at the mall. This spoke to me as a kid who grew up down the road from a big mall with arcades in it. You'd spend time there and then you'd have to find your way home. That's the setup here.

[Andrew]

And then we are. We are introduced to some other characters. We're introduced to Cassie. Who is Cassie. Cassie, who is a black girl who is like Jake is interested in like romantically.

[Craig]

Yes. Her family have some sort of animal rescue farm and her mom works also part time. A zoo garden at a lot of.

[Andrew]

Amazingly conveniently animal adjacent.

[Craig]

Yeah.

[Andrew]

Workplaces. Which I feel. Which is. Probably comes up in future books. For sure. It does definitely come up in this book.

[Craig]

Yeah. Cassie and I know what you're going to talk about.

[Andrew]

Well, okay. I'm gonna. I'm gonna get to her last.

[Craig]

Okay.

[Andrew]

You get Tobias, who seems like maybe he's not like core to the friend group, but Jake did like defend him from some bullies.

[Craig]

Yes. Yes.

[Andrew]

And so Tobias is. Is like hanging around because he is. Because you don't get the sense that a lot of people in Tobias's life are very nice to Tobias.

[Craig]

The explicit Des. His family situation is that he never knew his father. His mother left him for some reason he doesn't know. And he has an aunt and an uncle who are not together, I think, and they like shuttle him between each other without really a care for Tobias at all.

[Andrew]

Tobias is. His arc in this book is both tragic and uplifting.

[Craig]

Yes, it is in a way that.

[Andrew]

I think you did some research about which we'll talk about later. And then we've got Jake's cousin Rachel. I'm just gonna read. I'm gonna read you a passage from the Animorphs. The. The invasion. Animorphs, number one. They're leaving the arcade to go home. Just some normal teens hanging out. We were heading for the exit when I spotted Rachel and Cassie. Rachel is kind of pretty, I guess. I mean, okay, she's very pretty. Although, since she is my cousin, I don't really think about her that way. She has blonde hair and blue eyes and that kind of very clean, very wholesome look. She's one of those people who always know the right clothes to wear and how to look like they just walked out of one of the fashion magazines girls like. She's also very graceful because she takes gymnastics, even though she says she's too tall to ever really be good at it. Fellas, how attracted are you allowed to be to your cousin?

[Craig]

I think Jake is just like. I don't know how to say she's not hot.

[Andrew]

I think. What I think is happening is the book is telling us what kind of. What kind of teen Rachel is.

[Craig]

And it happens to be from Jake's perspective, which is kind of.

[Andrew]

And it happens to be from Jake's perspective, which is like, I don't think about my cousin that way. But let me tell you about my smoking hot cousin.

[Craig]

It's really funny. It is very silly.

[Andrew]

Rachel may look like Little Miss Teen Model or whatever, but she thinks she stormed from the X Men.

[Craig]

Yeah, sure.

[Andrew]

This happens pretty. Like, pretty early in chapter one. I was like, all right, I'm sitting down. I'm gonna read Animorphs. I'm gonna read about some kids morphing into some animals. And the main character of the entire series sits me down for a minute and it's like, okay, I'm gonna tell you about my friends, and then I'm gonna tell you about my sexy cousin. Yeah, well, my sexy cousin Rachel, who I don't. I don't think about her that way. But I don't tell you. Let me tell you.

[Craig]

Don't really think about her that way.

[Andrew]

I don't really think about her that way. But, boy, if we weren't cousins, in a microsecond, I would do it.

[Craig]

I would be crossing the Nether Fjord. Let me just tell you. Yes. No. And we haven't talked about much about Marco. He of the five will go.

[Andrew]

He's not anybody's cousin. So he didn't grab me as much.

[Craig]

In this book, he plays kind of the role of the. I don't wanna.

[Andrew]

He is trying to refuse the call.

[Craig]

Yes. And the reason we are given in his backstory, his mother passed away two years ago. It really messed up his dad. His dad is not in a great place, or at least wasn't for the last, you know, the bulk of the last two years. And when they start being put into a situation where they might be putting themselves into danger, Marco is very quick to not want to because he is scared for what would happen to his father if something happened to him. So that. That it doesn't always play that serious. It does at times, but it does at time.

[Andrew]

But you do have to have characters kind of remind you multiple times, like, oh, Marco's being a jerk because he's worried about his dad.

[Craig]

Yes. And because you. And you sort of need. The book feels like it. It is like I need a character who goes, this is bananas. I don't want to.

[Andrew]

Yeah. Because everybody else is like, pretty cool. I'm just gonna turn into a horse or a dog or whatever. It's gonna be fine.

[Craig]

And it's. It's. It's interesting that Applegate went with. Has a tragic family situation rather than is a coward or is just.

[Andrew]

Yeah. I mean, it's.

[Craig]

You know, we talked about this.

[Andrew]

It's the 90s. It's the. The era of the. Of the broken family. It is. We just got it. We gotta have some kids from. We gotta break up some homes so we can have kids come from them.

[Craig]

Which is interesting that Jake, as our first POV character, is from the most, you know, what we would consider kind of traditional nuclear family. His mom and dad are there.

[Andrew]

Mom and dad are there.

[Craig]

Older brother.

[Andrew]

There's him. And then he's got an older brother who's an alien from outer space.

[Craig]

We'll talk about that. I was mostly surprised by how Latchkey Tom and Jake Thomas, Jake's brother, they just kind of like, you know, it's this kind of Spielbergian, like, ET like, the kids just run around doing whatever.

[Andrew]

Your parents. Your parents just aren't around unless they need to be for reasons.

[Craig]

But even though it's. It's supposed to be one of the more stable family situations in. In this friend group.

[Andrew]

How many times do you think that J. Jake has pitched Marco on. Hey, Marco, could you make out with my cousin Rachel and then come and tell me everything about.

[Craig]

I don't know how it was.

[Andrew]

How many. I think I just feel like. I feel like Jake is curious. He's curious to know he's got a line he won't cross. But he's thinking about his hot cousin.

[Craig]

All the time, probably more than he should. He's got to focus. He did not make the basketball team. He's got to focus on his team, on his free throws. You know, you don't see.

[Andrew]

You don't seem as hung up on this hot cousin thing as I was, because I remember this being a much larger part of the first chapter, honestly. And it's like one very long paragraph. But all I like. I've got two things that I'm thinking about with this book. And, like, one of it is all that, like, alien animorph stuff that we're going to talk about. And then the other part of it is, like, hot cousin.

[Craig]

Hot cousin situation. You know, I mean, well, they partially. It's never revisited.

[Andrew]

Not in this book.

[Craig]

Not in this book. So we'll have to. We'll have to see Rachel.

[Andrew]

Rachel and Tobias are set up to be lightly shipped in this, I think.

[Craig]

Yes. And I do think that that is. That is the case. So they're gonna make it home from. Great. We've talked about the beginning of the book. They're coming home from the mall and they have to go through the recording.

[Andrew]

A blank check.

[Craig]

I know they're going through the abandoned construction site. Always be closing. Abandoned construction site.

[Andrew]

It's a. It's a 90s. It's a 90s. Kids, like NAFTA's probably hollowed out this town. There was a lot of. There's a big construction site. Abandoned. Yeah.

[Craig]

She did say Applegate in one interview that she knows, like, if you've really forced her, she could kind of tell you a particular state and place where the books are set. But she was pretty purposefully not doing that.

[Andrew]

Yeah.

[Craig]

Like, it's just suburban America. Yeah.

[Andrew]

Yeah. You said you set these books intentionally in any town, usa. Because the kids. The reader again. The kids buying them at the Scholastic Book Fair need to be able to see themselves in the book.

[Craig]

So you could see yourself headed home through the abandoned construction site and find a spaceship in the sky.

[Andrew]

Yeah.

[Craig]

It would be landing. It would be kind of the size of a bus, shaped like an egg with wings and tubes. And you might call it cool beyond any coolness ever, as Jake says, which is my new favorite phrase. And a dear Jesus comes out of it. Alien Dear Jesus comes out of it.

[Andrew]

You mean the animal Deer. And not like a. Like, yes, my dear Jesus.

[Craig]

Not like my advice column. Dear Jesus. No. A space deer. Who also dies for their morphing sins in this one.

[Andrew]

Yeah. So this guy's the Andalite. He's like a deer centaur sort of guy.

[Craig]

Prince elf, fangor, serenial, sham, tool. He is a prince of the Andalites. Apparently her original plan, their original plan was that it was just going to be kind of a standard alien. And scholastic said, nah, make it freaky.

[Andrew]

Make it freakier.

[Craig]

Make it freaky.

[Andrew]

Make it freakier. And while. And while you're at it, could you add some more cousin stuff to this?

[Craig]

Make it. Make it a big deer man with no mouth and goofy eyes. And eyes.

[Andrew]

He speaks telepathically. Telepathically.

[Craig]

Eyes. Eyes on his antlers. You know, just kind of go wacky with it. And this guy loves to do info dumps. He's taken info dumps everywhere.

[Andrew]

He info, he info dumps. He takes a big old info dump on everybody. He's like, yeah, I'm an alien. I'm an Andalite. Our job is to, like, fight the evil yeerks wherever they appear. The Yerks.

[Craig]

Yep.

[Andrew]

And your planet has already is already under attack by the Yerks.

[Craig]

Yep.

[Andrew]

And the cavalry is coming. The Andalites are coming to save you. But we need somebody here to push back against them and make sure that there's something here to save. And so you children, including you, young boy who's thinking about his cousin a lot, I'm going to give you my special DNA power where you can touch an animal and then turn into that animal.

[Craig]

Yes.

[Andrew]

And here you think was your under. My understanding, having not read the books, was that each kid, like, could turn into a specific animal. But that's not how it is at all.

[Craig]

I think I knew that.

[Andrew]

It's much more. No, it's much. It's much more like Blue mage.

[Craig]

It is. It is very blue mage coded. Yes. I was one like. Because there's a part later in the book where they all go to the zoo to get new morphs and you.

[Andrew]

Just like, go to get like a booster pack of cool birds to turn into.

[Craig]

And my initial note was like, oh, we got to go level at the zoo. And it's like, that's not quite what it is. It's when you're playing Final Fantasy 63 in the United States and you take Gal to the veldt. This makes sense to everyone. And you are just like fighting a bunch of random monsters from everywhere in the game so he can acquire all their different powers. Like, let's just.

[Andrew]

Or you were. You are like at the start of that last disc of Final Fantasy 9 where it's like the Catboy and the Queena.

[Craig]

Oh, because you've been split up and clowns.

[Andrew]

And you're like, oh, I haven't used this upsetting, useless character this entire time. And now it's half of my party. I better go wander around and eat every animal I can in the hopes that I can acquire a useful.

[Craig]

I do. I did really enjoy the let's get all the morphs we can section.

[Andrew]

That was. That was a lot of fun. It was fun.

[Craig]

No, but you're right. It is not. And you will be bound to this animal that you have become one with. It is. I don't know, man. Like, touch something, it'll kind of take a nap for 10 seconds and then you can turn into an exact DNA replica of that creature.

[Andrew]

Yeah.

[Craig]

When you want.

[Andrew]

And it's like exact. Like you. You are like When Jake touches his DOG Homer again, 90s kids. Yeah, when he touches his dog Homer. Surely named for Homer Simpson and not Homer the Epic.

[Craig]

I think that dog could do as good a job at the nuclear power plant as Homer.

[Andrew]

I think that's a good. Yes, definitely. When Jake touches Homer and turns into his dog Homer, it is. He is an exact copy of Homer. To the. To the extent that you can't let your alien brother see you when. Correct Homer the dog. Because he'll think that you're home. Or the dog.

[Craig]

Yes. What are the yerks, Andrew?

[Andrew]

Slug. Slug monsters that crawl into your head and take you over.

[Craig]

Yep.

[Andrew]

But it's crucially for the book, this is not an irreversible process. Like. No, we'll talk about this more later. But every three days they got slide out of your head into a hot tub so that they can get their HP back.

[Craig]

Okay, so. So in the info dump section we've got the initial like, oh, the yerks are here. I'm dying. You gotta be anamorphs. Which is a term that Marco coins later in the book.

[Andrew]

Very nonchalantly.

[Craig]

Yeah. Because he's not into it. And he's like, I don't know. I guess we're the animorphs.

[Andrew]

Though I did like stand up and pump my fist in the air as I do every time somebody says this. The name of the thing and the thing.

[Craig]

But there is a bit. So Elfangor does a few extra info dumps, one of which is like very title Crawl of a Star wars. Or your DM brought way too much to the first session. Yes. He says of The Yerks. We had hoped to stop them. Swarms of their bug fighters were waiting when our dome ship came out of Z space. We knew of their mothership, and we were ready for the bug fighters. But the Yerk surprised us. They had hidden a powerful blade ship in a crater of your moon. You're like, okay, got what? That's a lot of information.

[Andrew]

Yeah. You can definitely sense the terms that are capitalized in that crawl.

[Craig]

And that's all after, hey, there are people on your planet who are controlled by aliens. You don't know who they are.

[Andrew]

It's all. It's all totally. They're called the controllers.

[Craig]

Yep.

[Andrew]

And they. And they are all totally under the radar.

[Craig]

Yes. The other. And then there's a section when the. Some of the Yerks show up where the kids are running away. And there's this, like, weird little beat where Tobias hangs out with El Fangor for an extra second.

[Andrew]

Right. And Elden El Fangor, of course, as is his want, dumps a bunch of extra info on Tobias he doesn't dump on anybody else. So that after he dies, we can still have, like, a wise character who has other things to convey to us. Like, Tobias explicitly is like, man, I can only remember fragments of it, and it's all coming at me like in pictures, kind of Helter Skelter. Yeah. Like, I'm surely. Over the course of 54 books, I will remember fragments at many convenient points to advance the.

[Craig]

But that is how we learn about the Yerk pools where they have to hop out of their could their hosts. Brains to get the Crandonian rays, or whatever they're called. And it's horrifying. And I think maybe the Yerk should have come up with like, a knockout gas so that the hosts wouldn't, like, be horrifically conscious during this process.

[Andrew]

And it's very. It's very important, though, that the. That the human people be, like, savable.

[Craig]

Yes, Correct.

[Andrew]

Because you do get. You do get some collaborators in here.

[Craig]

Yes. What are they called?

[Andrew]

Who want to. I don't remember what they're called. Who want to lick user 3's boot, like, willingly. Because that's. That's the. That's the most insidious kind of thing that the control.

[Craig]

Voluntary hosts, I think, is one of the things that they call them. Yes.

[Andrew]

But most of the humans who have been taken over, like, they need to be shuttled over to a cage to hang out while they're bringing slug.

[Craig]

Yeah.

[Andrew]

Rejuvenates. And so. So, yeah, it cannot be a. Like a zombie. Style, like, oh, that's not your brother anymore. You have to kill them or whatever.

[Craig]

Correct.

[Andrew]

They're saying to be like, I could. I could save my brother. If we. If we do this right, we do.

[Craig]

Meet Visser 3, who is the only Andalite controller to exist. Andalites being the. The. The deer people.

[Andrew]

Is he an Andalite or does he just have the Andalites morphing ability?

[Craig]

He's a Yerk who is in an Andalite. They say he's the only. And the Light Controller and the Andalites.

[Andrew]

Okay, okay, okay. All right. That's what. That's why I can morph. Okay.

[Craig]

Yes. We. So he's. He's our big bad. He's our Darth Vader. He's our. He's our bad guy. We also have some other henchmen, aliens, the Hork Bajir and the Taxons. I want to mention them specifically because they're.

[Andrew]

These are all, like. These are all season one Star Trek Voyager villains that we. That we leave behind eventually because they suck so bad.

[Craig]

I do need to tell you, Andrew, about a quote from the Entertainment Weekly article about some of these aliens where Applegate says, for the taxons, who were massive worms that lived in a constant state of insatiable hunger that at times drove them to cannibalism, we're pretty sure they were invented on or around April 15th because they're tax. Ons.

[Andrew]

Yes, tax. It's tax time. I intuited that they were.

[Craig]

Get it.

[Andrew]

Yeah. Because we got. We got to make these books quick.

[Craig]

Yeah. You know, apparently a lot of the alien names and other lingo is a mix of, like, Lord of the Rings reference and just scrambling words. There's a term for people who get stuck in the morph, which is because you can only be morphed for two hours. Two Earth hours, no flits or something like that. Apparently she just saw the word Hilton on a hotel and was like, I'm just gonna scramble that in my brain and I'm just gonna. No flits.

[Andrew]

The Tolkien reference thing. I just want to take a. Take a minute to talk about it like it is. I think when we were kids into teens, like, before those movies came out.

[Craig]

Yeah, it was. It was much more obscure. Yeah.

[Andrew]

It was the last, like, I think fans of those books, like, I. I'm thinking about it in the context of, like, a Mystery Science Theater thing where they. They would make Lord of the Rings jokes. And it was not like them commenting on one of the most, like, universally known unpopular film Fries.

[Craig]

Yeah.

[Andrew]

Franchise on the face of the Earth. Like, it was still a pre Internet and like, in the early Internet era, it was being conversant in Tolkien or like, really any fandom was like, still a way for people to find each other. And when you find, when, when you found somebody who would like, drop a Radagast reference or something.

[Craig]

Sure.

[Andrew]

It was like. It was like a special thing. Like you felt. You felt like you had an instant kind of kinship with somebody because of like the depth of a. Of a reference.

[Craig]

Yeah, that's a good point.

[Andrew]

Yeah, it's, it's.

[Craig]

It.

[Andrew]

If you, if you are coming to the series fresh with. Without having known it like it is, it's difficult to convey how different the vibe was before you could buy versions of the books that had the pictures of the actors from the movies on.

[Craig]

Yeah, you know, for sure. And I, I, you know, we did the Lord of the Rings years and years ago. I had read the Hobbit as a child, but had not read the books. I think I read Lord of Lord of the Rings when the movies came out, but I certainly had not read the full series until I did it for the show. But I saw all the films, so I only know Strider as What's his face?

[Andrew]

Viggo Aragorn.

[Craig]

Viggo Mortensen.

[Andrew]

Yeah, the Dune. Like King of the Dune. Okay.

[Craig]

Orlando Bloom, lend me your elf eyes or whatever the line is.

[Andrew]

They're taking.

[Craig]

They're taking the Hobbits to Isengard. So the next day they've all.

[Andrew]

This episode is going to be so long. We have to, we have to. We have to start booking.

[Craig]

You know, we can, we can start booking so that, you know that basically there was a lot of setup early in the book, Morph. It's Morphin Time. Alien battles come in, bad guys. And then we kind of get several chapters of just like, hey, what is it to morph? What is it to have these powers?

[Andrew]

It's. It's the kids in, like, various pairings being like, did that really happen? Like, what does it mean to like. Okay, the things that are set up in this section are like, the kids being like, did that really happen? Slash, are we now on the hook for saving the world?

[Craig]

Correct.

[Andrew]

Yeah. Hey, it seems like a lot of authority figures are really interested in kids who might have been at that construction site last night.

[Craig]

I love the section where they're like, why would cops lie? Unless they're controllers. Wait, are all the cops controllers? And you're like a cab.

[Andrew]

All controllers.

[Craig]

But yeah. Like Toby becomes a cat.

[Andrew]

Yeah. And then, and then, yeah. Like a lot of the kids. And Jake, which is the most important one that happens because you're, you're the one in his head.

[Craig]

The pov.

[Andrew]

A lot of the kids like first, first morphin phase.

[Craig]

Yes.

[Andrew]

And the cool. The cool. The worst thing about the morphing stuff is how it, how the interstitial phases between boy and animal are described. Deeply, deeply upsetting stuff. Bar for Rama, you might say. But the coolest stuff is, yeah, you are a dog, but you also are like sharing a brain with a dog and you have to like fight your dog brain.

[Craig]

Yes.

[Andrew]

Like stay on task.

[Craig]

Yes.

[Andrew]

Which is, which is interesting because it does it when you are an animal. It help. I think it helps you read as an animal to the, to the alien people. Like that that comes up while Jake is being a dog and doing some like dog reconnaissance later.

[Craig]

Yes, correct.

[Andrew]

And it's just like it's, it's an interesting point of tension. Like you can't just turn into the perfect animal. That would solve all your problems right that minute. Like you, you can turn into the animal, you can get the information or you can like accomplish the goal that you want, but you have to deal with the animal instincts that you are suddenly sharing with this thing.

[Craig]

No, that's cool.

[Andrew]

I was not expecting it to be that, to be that way.

[Craig]

And that to me is when you hear Applegate talk about the like the initial germ of what the book was, which is like, hey, what if you could like, what if you just wrote some stories where kids could see the perspective of an animal and like it would teach you about the animal a little bit, but also just be kind of interesting to be like, well what, what happened if my brain functioned differently? Like why, what animals brains, how do they work? And you do see that apparently that is like the whole deal behind that award winning book she wrote about the gorilla Ivan. Because it is like from the gorilla's perspective and it is just something that she.

[Andrew]

That is really interesting because writing the book from the animals perspective sounds like the most like junior year of high school creative writing project.

[Craig]

We've read a couple of those books. Like what? Like it's called the Wild. I think one like Black Beauty, I think is one where you put the whole book through an animal's eyes just to like kind of, kind of switch things up. And Animal Farm, well, that's two legs good, four legs bad sometimes, huh.

[Andrew]

Anyway, depends how they put their pants on.

[Craig]

I say Toby becomes his own Cat. He is into it. He loves morphing. More on that later. Jake becomes his dog. Cassie becomes a horse. Cassie demonstrates a like, specific talent at controlling the morph.

[Andrew]

I love how much time they spend on what happens to your clothes when you morph. Because they could. They could so easily.

[Craig]

We had questions about this in the Discord.

[Andrew]

They could. So they could so easily do the thing where just, like, your clothes are part of it, but they don't. Like the boys. The boys, when they're morphing, they're always naked because their clothes are like, falling off.

[Craig]

Yeah.

[Andrew]

And they. Yeah. And they don't know. They don't know how to do it. But Cassie figures out that if you're like, wearing a, like a singlet, like a tight fitting, like a tight fitting, like, bodysuit or something, you can make that part of the morph. And it's not. That's. That frankly, that's. That's weird. Like, it doesn't make any sense. No. Your clothes should be part of you or they aren't. It's not like, oh, if your clothes are tight, then I guess they're. I guess they can be part of the morph. Like, that's ridiculous.

[Craig]

And also, it's unclear if the Andalites actually wear any clothes. So, like, why would the technology include clothes?

[Andrew]

I think if it was innate to your race, you would just be like, you would just get over shame. Like, you just would. These things are a hassle. Every time I want to morph, they're falling off me and then I gotta go find them. And I'm always like, I'm walking down Main street and there's a big puddle of clothes everywhere because people are morphing. Like, this sucks. I'm not gonna do it anymore.

[Craig]

So the. The other thing that Cassie apparently is, like, really good at manipulating. Like, I think there's a spot where Cassie, like, kind of pauses mid horse to girl to kind of deliberately mimic the Andalite, like, vibes of like, a horse person.

[Andrew]

Yes.

[Craig]

I think that's gonna come up. You know, that probably comes up in later books. Marco, of course, we don't see, you know, transforming at all.

[Andrew]

He's the last one to morph.

[Craig]

Yeah.

[Andrew]

I don't remember what Rachel's first morph is.

[Craig]

I don't know that Rachel has another. Has the first morph that we see until the end either.

[Andrew]

Yeah, she definitely. She does. She has a big morph at the end.

[Craig]

Yeah.

[Andrew]

Where she turns into a big sexy elephant.

[Craig]

That's not how it's described. Andrew, listen, Teens have feelings, but I don't express those feelings about that elephant.

[Andrew]

I don't. I don't think about her that way. But, boy, I could never forget that elephant.

[Craig]

Oh, my.

[Andrew]

You know what I mean?

[Craig]

Come on.

[Andrew]

Let that elephant paint me like one of your French.

[Craig]

I'm gonna banish you to the Nether Fjord. The other thing that's happening is we, you know, as we are taught to be suspicious of everyone now because who. Everyone could be Yerked. The. Oh, I guess the other thing that we learned in the beginning is that the yerks are, like, stoked about Earth because there are so many people here.

[Andrew]

There's so many people, and they could.

[Craig]

You know, take them into space and just. Just send the yerks everywhere, which would be great.

[Andrew]

Love that. Love that. The yerks are, like, falling birth rate, guys. They would. They were if they were here. Now.

[Craig]

The other person that we are a little, kind of weirded out by is Jake's brother, Tom, who has joined a, I guess, cult called the Sharing.

[Andrew]

I cannot. I literally cannot believe. So Jake is like, me and Tom used to be close. I play basketball because he plays basketball.

[Craig]

I did make a team.

[Andrew]

Yeah. Like this. This part of the start of the book that we didn't talk about because we were talking about the hot cousin thing so much, is that Jake didn't make the basketball team. And he's feeling really bummed about it.

[Craig]

Yeah. Because his brother is good at basketball.

[Andrew]

Yeah. Because he was thinking it would. You know, he had been feeling further away from his. His big brother than he wanted to.

[Craig]

Yep.

[Andrew]

And he thought this would bring them back, like, closer together or whatever. And.

[Craig]

No. Do you remember, Andrew, how much Boy Meets World did you watch?

[Andrew]

Not. None of it.

[Craig]

So there is an episode of Boy Meets World. I feel like it's, like, right towards the end of, like, right before they go to college. I can't remember where Sean.

[Andrew]

Boy Meets World's like, Topanga one, right?

[Craig]

Yes. Yes.

[Andrew]

Okay.

[Craig]

Cory Matthews, Sean Hunter, Topanga.

[Andrew]

Like that and, like, Saved by the Bell kind of, like, morph into one.

[Craig]

Oh, no, no, no. They're very distinct.

[Andrew]

I know. I know they're different. I just, like, they're both, like, kind of teen. Like, they're both puberty shows that I didn't watch.

[Craig]

Sure. You know, I would. I would say that Boy Meets World had more heart in it. It was a little bit more of a. Especially in its later seasons, got a little soapier.

[Andrew]

I think Saved by the Bell was a little more like slackery. Right.

[Craig]

Yeah. Save of the bell came first. But Boy Meets World, there's an episode where Sean kind of joins this like, weird youth movement center and like, is clearly getting brainwashed by this, like, I don't even know, influencer, cult leader man. And like an adult has to be like. Like everybody has to like aggressively hug Sean to like break, like deprogram him. It is a really intense episode and it's the only thing I could think about when I watched Jake's brother Tom being like, hey, I really love the sharing. I don't care about basketball anymore. We play night volleyball on the beach and I am a 16 year old and I'm gonna say this is the best organization I've ever joined. That's.

[Andrew]

Yeah. Okay. I did lose my train of thought earlier because I was thinking so much about. About Tom because something about the sharing breaks my brain because from like, even what they. Even what they call it is the weirdest, most cult. Like, this is a. This is a thing where you're gonna end up either trying to like sell plates to your friends.

[Craig]

Yes. It's very, very mlm. Yeah.

[Andrew]

It's either an ML end up all drinking a. A like a Dixie cup full of poison at the end of it. Like, there's no other way for this to end.

[Craig]

For the sharing thing is Scientology. Like it. Which is kind of a combination of.

[Andrew]

Which is kind of in between the. Think about it.

[Craig]

Because he does. There is a thing. So later in the book, they go to a meeting of the sharing on a beach where people are playing night volleyball and everybody.

[Andrew]

Everybody loves the sharing. This is like a cool. It's the third. It's a third space. It is.

[Craig]

We don't have enough third space.

[Andrew]

Doubt him. Yeah.

[Craig]

And. And Tom is like, listen, there are like, you can join the sharing, but then there's like better membership where. Which is basically thetan levels. Like you like, you know, you become a higher level science.

[Andrew]

Except in s. Except in this. When you're a full member of the sharing, that's when they put your. Your plug in. Yep.

[Craig]

But yes, the time. So. So Tom is initially suspicious because he sits backwards on a chair and starts talking to Jake. And I wrote in my notes what a yerk.

[Andrew]

In the book, Marco immediately is like, oh, yeah, Tom's a yerk. And Jake tries to beat him up.

[Craig]

Yep.

[Andrew]

But then when Jake. I don't remember if this comes just before or just after that bit where Marco is like, yeah, your brother's totally a yerk. Where Jake turns into Homer and smells something off weird about Him.

[Craig]

Yep.

[Andrew]

About Tom. Like, it's. It's clear from pretty early on. Not only is.

[Craig]

Yeah, it's not. They don't hide it like, that long. It's pretty clear early.

[Andrew]

It's pretty clear. Like, not. Not only is Tommy Yerk, but, like, this cop is a yerk, the assistant principal at their school is a yerk. Like, the amount of time that passes between you finding out that yerks are a thing at all and finding out that. That yerks have taken over every position of authority in the entire town, from Big Brother up to assistant principal, and they've built a city underground to facilitate the. The enslavement of humanity. Like, it's. It's not that much. It's not that much time.

[Craig]

I'm just picturing, like, it goes quick. A version of myself that had, like, read 20 of these books in middle school, and just any adult I didn't like, I'd just be like, you're a yerk. Shut up. Shut up, Yerk.

[Andrew]

That's basically how, like, Qanon works. Right?

[Craig]

Like, really? You're totally right. No, you're not wrong. But no, Tom is a yerk. Totally. What else is gonna happen? They. They're gonna, like. They need to learn who the yerks are. They need to learn about the yerk pools.

[Andrew]

Yeah. Yes. So, yeah, Tobias is a hawk. He loves being a hawk. He loves talking about how much he's a hawk.

[Craig]

So I have. Okay, let's talk about Tobias real quick.

[Andrew]

Okay. Yes.

[Craig]

Okay. Because we've alluded to. Okay. Spinning ahead in the plot. I'm. I don't know what I said earlier. The yerks need Kandrona particles. I'm just looking at my notes here.

[Andrew]

You did mention the Kandrona particles. That's the thing they need to. To get while they're in the yerk.

[Craig]

In the yerk pool. Okay. Tobias is the character for a lot of readings of the Animorph series that involves trans readings of the work.

[Andrew]

One of the things you were literally transforming into something else.

[Craig]

Yes, I. Let me. Before I get into that, I did pull the hawk trans, like, transformation for body horror purposes. So let me just, like, read it in case anybody hasn't read these and wants to just, like, hear what it's about. Yeah.

[Andrew]

I remember feathers kind of being prominently part of it.

[Craig]

This is all from Jake's perspective watching Tobias turn from a hawk into a boy. Let me tell you something. It is beyond weird watching feathers turn into skin. The brown feathers ran together and merged and turned pink. It was like the feathers were melting, like they had turned into wax and were being heated up. The beak disappeared quickly and lips grew out of it. The talons split into five and became toes. Halfway through the process of changing, Tobias was a lump, half pink, half brown, with feather like patterns still visible on his back and chest. His face was small and mostly human, except that he still had those sharp alert hawk's eyes. Two tiny shriveled arms protruded from the front of his chest with fingers like a baby's. All in all, it was a pretty disgusting sight. But the human DNA asserted itself over the hawk and he became more normal.

[Andrew]

I tell you what, the mental picture of a beak with lips on the end of it, really profoundly upset, really awful. But Tobias in particular, the Andalite never mentions like DNA. It's just like Jake starts talking about DNA at some point.

[Craig]

But Tobias in particular is this like really interesting character for folks who are reading these books with a lens on being trans or otherwise. You know, other issues of identity that you, that you might be going through. The Grant and Applegate, the authors of the series, their eldest daughter, I think is. Came out as Trans and Transition 2016. I think I have that right.

[Andrew]

Yeah.

[Craig]

And in the Comics Beat article they said, you know, our eldest daughter is trans. But we quote, supported trans rights long before that became a part of our lives. Decisions should be left to the people whose lives are directly affected. They went on to say they cannot claim that we intentionally tried to appeal to the trans community back when we were writing the books in the 90s. We wish we had. But they, this goes back to my point about them really having their head on their shoulders about the series. They go on to say it would be sort of a stolen valor kind of thing to claim credit. Like, I just really appreciate that they're like, yeah, we wrote the books that we wrote and we're happy for the folks who have found a very personal connection to them for their trans experience. That is not what we were like, like setting out to write.

[Andrew]

That's just, it just, it just speaks, it speaks well of, of them in their, in their worldview, I think, where, where it's like, yeah, we weren't thinking about trans issues. We weren't thinking about transitioning at all. We especially not in like the, the modern, super charged, like awful context where they're like, where they mention LGBT at all. They're trying to take the tea out of it, which sucks.

[Craig]

Yep.

[Andrew]

It's like, but, but they're saying, you know, if you are, if you are A person who does not feel at home in your body or like, at ease in your circumstances. And you can in whatever way transform into something or like move into different circumstances that fit you better, that make you happy, that like lift you up, then of course you should do that. Like, it is not when Tobias is stuck as a hawk at the end of the book because he's outlasted the magical two hour Animorph Timer.

[Craig]

Yep.

[Andrew]

It is not presented as a tragedy. It's like, you know, I think like Jake, I think all the kids keep telling him, hey, like, hey, you gotta turn back. Hey, you gotta turn back. Hey, you gotta turn back. But it is for Tobias. I feel like it's presented as the choice that is right for him.

[Craig]

So what is? Yes. And what I. Okay, so Sam from our discord patreon.com overdue pod Join the Discord Sam said, I feel like Tobias literally staying embodied in a different form and embracing that existence is similarly as close to a trans experience as they could get away with. Because other folks were also talking about how there are passages in the series that hint at Marco being bisexual that they, you know, didn't otherwise enumerate on in kids lit at the time. But I did read an interesting article reading in Stealth or My Life in Animorphs by Cassius Adair from 2017, which talks about Tobias a lot and talks about the series as a work of, you know, trans storytelling. Where in later books, Andrew and I don't think it's even that too. Even that far into the series and maybe only a few books.

[Andrew]

I think Susanna was telling me about what you're about to talk about.

[Craig]

There is a. There is a sequence where Tobias. So at the end of this book. And you're right, I think just. Just this book, the Invasion, you look at Tobias and there's a lot of moments of him being like. Like man being an animal rules because my current life does not like, feel good. I would like.

[Andrew]

At one point he says almost, almost verbatim, like, changing back into a human feels like putting myself in a prison.

[Craig]

Yeah. Yes, that's exactly the quote. Yes, yes, yes. But apparent. You know, apparently a few books later, he is kind of repulsed by a lot of his instincts, links and the fact that he is no longer human. And this is something that this isn't. This is on avidly, which is part of the LA Review of books from Cassie Zidair talks about like. There's a book where Tobias basically tries to commit suicide as a hawk by like flying into glass or other walls. And the other characters wind up saving him or some other circumstances save him. And he has kind of been become repulsed by, like, his instincts to eat a rat and other things that just no longer feel human. And I think. I think there's like, long term hope that maybe the Andalites will come back and we'll be able to help him out or something like that. But it is interesting to me that in this book it is. His current circumstances are so unappealing and do not feel like a reflection of his identity that. That being a hawk is appealing. And then Applegate and Grant are like, yeah. But also, he may or may not feel satisfied with being stuck as a hawk as well. Like, it is not to say that they. Again, I don't think they set out to, like, write a trans character with Tobias, but it is reflecting a lot of feelings that trans folks have about, like, who am I? Yeah, I relate to my body.

[Andrew]

Like, I was gonna. I was gonna say, like, coming. Coming at it with only, like, a secondhand understanding. Like, I've been. I think we both have been fortunate. We've been very fortunate in that we are like straight CIS guys who have never felt, like, uncomfortable in that identity. Like, it's just kind of like our. The way we present physically matches the way that we feel like mentally. And that's like, not a thing that you can take for granted. But. But yeah, I do. Like, I think we've all known people who have kind of like, drifted between pronouns or whatever, just kind of trying. Trying different things on. Trying to like, negotiate their. Their relationship with, like, their biological sex and with, like, societal, like, understandings of what's expected of you based on how you identify. And yeah, yeah, you aren't. You aren't always. You aren't always doing the same thing. And so, yeah, like, even. Even if they weren't intending it to be that way, I think you. I think you read it that way.

[Craig]

Well, and I will. I will say I really liked this piece by Adair because it also goes on to just talk about, like, all of these kids now have a. They have an identity that they cannot share with the world, which is that they have this, like, morphing power. They are like, like, you know, these freedom fighter, guerrilla characters. But it also involves some.

[Andrew]

I mean, sometimes they're gorillas and sometimes they're like, very clever, good work.

[Craig]

But that they are like, their identities themselves are. It is their choice whether or not to, like, you know, kind of enumerate them upon them for the world sort of thing. And that also speaks to. To a lot of trans folks experiences. So like, like it is not just Tobias who kind of aligns with how people may have felt or. Or feel as they are are trans. And so it's just an interesting. I do recommend that article and they, you know, Grant and Applegate are very upfront that they feel very grateful for the community that has embraced the series with this particular reading.

[Andrew]

Yeah, that. That one we'll make sure we drop on social and play places. Yeah. So people can read it.

[Craig]

But so yeah, so like Tobias, you know, we kind of spoiled the fact that like as they are doing these different missions throughout the middle of the book where they are like going to the sharing, learning about the yerks. He has started turning into a hawk. We learn a little bit about apparently like if you. You don't stop. I don't really know how it works relative to like dnd wild shape rules. But like the hawk that he turned into had a broken wing, but he transforms into a hawk. The dn. The DNA is not that you have a broken wing. So he has. He is. His wings are fine.

[Andrew]

You're copying the. The. The d. Dino DNA. Yes. You just transform into whatever the natural form of that thing is and not whatever that hawk did. Like presumably a raccoon could lay dying in the road and you could go lay your hands on the raccoon. And even if a raccoon died, you would.

[Craig]

You'd be able to be that you'd.

[Andrew]

Be a whole raccoon and not a squish.

[Craig]

Correct. Which is. I have a lot of questions about that. I did find a. I did find a Reddit thread about just. There are later books that expound apparently upon Z space.

[Andrew]

Andrew, I was wondering whether we would hear more about the dome ships and Z space.

[Craig]

Z space may sort of be like an alternate dimension where it's implied if you turn into a bug. Andrew. Right. Like a little. So like. So in this book, Jake turns into a little anal lizard. Is that what it's called? Anole?

[Andrew]

I don't think it's pronounced anal lizard.

[Craig]

It's anol lizard. A N O L E. Is that what it is?

[Andrew]

I don't think you could say analysis.

[Craig]

Sorry. But he becomes a little lizard. Little lizard creature. This is how he finds out that his assistant principal, who is a yerk, who is a controller, is going to the yerk pool under the school. He becomes a little lizard creature. And I. There was a Reddit thread surmising based on some readings of the series that when you become something, whenever you transform, your mass goes into Z space.

[Andrew]

Sure.

[Craig]

And one of the reasons there's a, one of the reasons that there's a time limit is that there's like, there's a certain amount of energy that it takes to maintain the connection between your new shape and your original shape that is being preserved in Z space.

[Andrew]

This is all very Scientology.

[Craig]

And something, something, something. If you stay that way for more than two hours, you can't bring your body back from Z space.

[Andrew]

I do. I do like that. Like the founding principle of this is like if you keep making your face, it's going to be stuck that way.

[Craig]

Yeah, you're right.

[Andrew]

That is exactly what it is.

[Craig]

But so yes, they, they find out that there is this Scientology scheme, that there's Yerk pools under the whole city. Yeah.

[Andrew]

Like, they go under the school thinking that's where the Yerk pool is, and they find like this interconnected network of, of tunnels that's just like. Yeah. These, these, the yeerks, the controllers, Visser 3, they've all been here for way longer than, than anybody could have thought.

[Craig]

Yeah.

[Andrew]

Then we. When we thought they would be. And. And we are in it. We are in it way deeper than we thought.

[Craig]

Yes. It's not just that they are coming, it's that they are here.

[Andrew]

Right. And what I find, that was part of what I found kind of jarring about the, the like juxtaposition of, of kid lit pacing and like adult stakes is this is not a thing where you are like you, you see the beginning of something and at the end of the book you're kind of like standing, looking, being like, well, what, you know. Oh yes, the future could be. The future could be scary. I've just seen the beginning of something that could, that could turn bad. And this one, it's like, yeah, things are already really bad and the duck is stacked against you. And it will be if you. Kids who can change into you like five kids who can change into animals are the only thing standing between Earth and destruction. Man, we are in, we're in it deep.

[Craig]

That's a great way to think about it because they, the, the scene preceding them going and, and finding the Yerk pool is let's go to the zoo to get our morphs. And this is like a caper.

[Andrew]

Yeah, let's, let's all go. Let's all go touch tigers at the zoo.

[Craig]

Let's, you know, Marco's gonna touch a gorilla, Jake's gonna touch a tiger.

[Andrew]

A lot of people I don't know that we're gonna. I don't, I don't. This conversation deep in my bones, the way I feel. The hot cousin one, sure. But a lot of people in the discord being like, yeah, you can't just like, walk into a zoo and start talking all the animals like that. That wasn't a thing that made me personally upset. Even though I did recognize, like, the goofiness of it. The book, it didn't, it didn't stick in my brain. Like, I'm not ready to yell about it. Like, I am about hot cousin.

[Craig]

The book takes minor pains to say that it is not a traditional zoo in that sure.

[Andrew]

It's one of those New Agey zoos where they let people come in and touch all the time.

[Craig]

It is more of a, like a safari zone with some, you know, enclosures.

[Andrew]

And it is like, similar to the Pokemon safari zone. It is a good place to go and catch rare monsters that you can't get anywhere else.

[Craig]

And, and we only like they're there. Some security people are chasing them. And so we only really see Marco and Jake's perspective. And they like, dash in and out of different enclosures to get a gorilla and a tiger because they're like, well, we're gonna fight some aliens. We need some like, you know, we.

[Andrew]

Need some, we need some firepower.

[Craig]

We need some firepower is what they said.

[Andrew]

We need to get the best mother nature has to offer.

[Craig]

Apparently they changed a bunch of the morphs in the TV show based on what animals they had available at the zoo that they were working with.

[Andrew]

Awesome.

[Craig]

That's fun. And yes, they, before they go into the Yerk pool, we learned that a cop, you know, the, your cop got Cassie and that Tobias is already a hawk. We go into the underground Yerk network, as Andrew has talked about. It's the entire town. It's not just go into the janitor's closet at the school. I, I, we didn't really talk about. We really skimmed over it Feels weird to skim over it because it's like the COVID and it is the flip book of all the pages of the book where Jake becomes this little lizard.

[Andrew]

Yeah. When you, when you buy the physical copy of the book.

[Craig]

Thanks to Nora in the Discord for talking about this a little bit.

[Andrew]

Yes. And I do, I did remember that immediately when I saw it. Like, I think, I think I'd probably at least flipped through an Animorphs book in a book fair and seen this. But yeah, when you get the physical book, there's a little flip book animation of, like, if you go through the whole book, it turns from animal to kid, or vice versa, depending on the direction you flip.

[Craig]

Nora said.

[Andrew]

I read ebook version doesn't do that.

[Craig]

No, Nora said. I read a paper copy and I found the font very hard to read. I guess it's supposed to look kind of alien. Was it worth it for the flipbook corner? Yes, for one book. But I couldn't do it for all of them. Yes.

[Andrew]

And so they had to figure out what font that is.

[Craig]

Yeah. I encourage you to look it up. I'm sure we could use it. But they go underground, they find the yerks. They find that this is. There's this thing right. Where the yerk come out of people's heads to go into the yerk pools to, you know, recharge their k Drona particles. And people are horrified when the yerks come out of them. Andrew and I've been playing a lot of Baldur's Gate 3, and there's a lot.

[Andrew]

Several years.

[Craig]

There's a lot of, like, Brain Slug stuff in that game, which is. It feels very yer. And I feel like our group has referenced to the yerks a lot without Andrew knowing what they are until just right now.

[Andrew]

Trying to get a. I'm just looking at the video of the. Of the book flipping. I'm trying to tell if, like, part of the issue. Does it have serifs? I can't even tell. All right, I'll do some research.

[Craig]

Do some research. Okay.

[Andrew]

It's not like we're going to record another Animorphs episode, but it just does. This whole episode feels like it's inexorably drawing us into a long read in a way that I don't how long I can resist it.

[Craig]

We will have to figure it out. But we cannot. We cannot do 50 months of anamorphs, is what I will say.

[Andrew]

Not with that attitude.

[Craig]

Okay, fair enough. They, you know, they, they. There's a big action sequence where they fight the controllers. They try to free people. They do witness the existence of voluntary hosts. Tom is not a voluntary host.

[Andrew]

No, he wants to fight him.

[Craig]

And they turn into animals and they, like, kill some aliens, including Cassie, who turns into. Is Cassie or Rachel the ones who turns into an elephant? Rachel turns in the elephant.

[Andrew]

Rachel turns into it. Rachel. Because remember earlier we were talking about big sexy element.

[Craig]

Yeah, yeah, Elephant.

[Andrew]

Sorry, I'm looking at fonts.

[Craig]

I don't remember what Cassie turns into, but she does end up, like, basically killing the copyright that kidnapped Her.

[Andrew]

Craig. Okay. Oh, the.

[Craig]

Oh, the font.

[Andrew]

Okay. Somebody on Reddit seven years ago says if you're talking about the font they use for the logo, it's called 1979 after the smashing Pumpkin song of the same name.

[Craig]

Oh, my God. Well, that's just the logo. That's not the book.

[Andrew]

No, that's. No, it's just. There are a lot of fonts. There are a lot of fonts.

[Craig]

There are a lot of fonts out there.

[Andrew]

Bookbinder says the official Animorphs font fonts are called 1970, 1979 and Eurostyle. I've uploaded them to Euro Euro Style. Your style with an eye.

[Craig]

Okay.

[Andrew]

Yeah, that look. That looks like it. And it is this. The T kind of has a serif a little. No, it's. This is a sans serif font.

[Craig]

Okay. Okay.

[Andrew]

I think, I think maybe that is what throwing. Because I feel.

[Craig]

I feel like. So there's that.

[Andrew]

Yeah, I just. I. Maybe, maybe this is me. Like every book that I've read for like seven years has been in the same, like Amazon Kindle, like bookerly font. I'm just used to a serif, a gentlemanly serif just sitting there waiting for me to see it.

[Craig]

It's my understanding that sans serif is a more accessible like, you know, people process processing visual information until you're trying.

[Andrew]

To tell whether something's a capital I or a lowercase L. Idiot.

[Craig]

Whoa, whoa, whoa. Shots fired in the Yerk town. The. The children have turned into animals. They are killing aliens. Which is, I don't know, I thought was pretty bold. That, like, it was pretty brutal some.

[Andrew]

The way that some of the aliens get killed in this book.

[Craig]

I was just pretty impressed that like, wow, a tiger could beat this basalian. Like, that seemed a little.

[Andrew]

Yeah, that's pretty cool. Like, the. The thing that I clocked was like, aliens can get smushed into goo and like clearly are. Are killed. Human characters are like hit with fireballs and like stunned in the way. In the way that in an 80s action show you would watch a car roll over 12 times. But then they'd have to show the guys getting out of it to show that nobody was like, seriously.

[Craig]

No, you're totally right.

[Andrew]

You can't kill. You can't kill Tom in the first animarph.

[Craig]

Well, yes, because they do encounter Visser3, who is the only Yerk again who has morphing capabilities, because what.

[Andrew]

And what a weird name to give this guy.

[Craig]

Yeah, I don't really know what the convention is there. I'm sure we would learn it in a later book, but his name is Visser3. He's the only. He's the only Andalite Yerk. He's the only morphing Yerk. He turns into a eight headed creature of some kind.

[Andrew]

Yeah. Because the thing is, he's traveled all over the galaxy. He didn't just go to the. The backyard zoo for disadvantaged animals and like touch whatever the best animal was that you could find. He's been all over the cosmos finding the biggest and most horrible animals animals to touch so he can turn into them.

[Craig]

Okay. So the funny thing about Vizor 3 that I like from the two editions of the book.

[Andrew]

Okay.

[Craig]

Is that in the original edition, there's a lot of like, oh, wow, you're a hero. Like Whenever, whenever Visser3 talks to the dead Andalite that we meet earlier, Prince Elfangor, he's like, oh yeah, you are. You know, you're this like. Like you're a legend. Whatever. Honored to meet you. But the story really wants them to have already known each other.

[Andrew]

Yeah.

[Craig]

So the. In the original, an honor to meet you, you're a legend. And in the 2011 edition, an honor to meet you again. You're a legend now. Which I think is a pretty fun rewrite.

[Andrew]

It reminds me a little bit of Obi Wan.

[Craig]

Yeah, it's Obi Wan. It's General. It's Obi Wan and Grievous. Is that what it is?

[Andrew]

I don't know about Obi Wan, Grievous. I was, I was thinking of the way that that dumb Obi Wan show tried to write around the fact that these characters have clearly not seen each other in 20 years.

[Craig]

Oh no. It is the fact that in the Clone wars cartoon, Grievous and Anakin have to be kept apart for seasons because in episode three there is a like open. Grievous says something like, I didn't know you were so tall. Or something like that. Like, it is something so silly and small that they had to account for. But no, for some reason that Visser 3. But Visser 3 in the little sequence we're talking about, assumes that all of these animals are actually Andalites. Does not know.

[Andrew]

They don't know the identities of the Morphin Kids yet.

[Craig]

Correct. Which I think that's kind of a fun little note to end on.

[Andrew]

It's the. It's the only way to have there be a big climactic fight in the book that involves Jake's brother Tom, where Controller Tom can walk into the house at the end of the book and everybody just has to kind of like pretend to be cool with each other. It's the. It's the only way to keep balancing the.

[Craig]

You're right.

[Andrew]

To have a normal kid life. But also I'm. I've been given magic magical powers by an alien so I can turn into a. To a panther or whatever.

[Craig]

Right. The only human that they managed to save even though they tried to save many of them is an unnamed person who rode on Cassie's back when Cassie was a horse. I double checked after I read it the first time that they do not elaborate on this at all. They saved one person.

[Andrew]

Is this not the. Like I was wondering if this would be because. Because there are five kids in this book but the series description says there are six main characters.

[Craig]

Unless. Unless this reveals itself to be different. It is my understanding that the sixth main character is an Andalite named Axe.

[Andrew]

How do you spell Axe?

[Craig]

Ax.

[Andrew]

Axe. What a X?

[Craig]

Yeah. Who I think is related to Elfangor but I don't know how.

[Andrew]

I'm sorry to ask you all these questions.

[Craig]

Wow. But yes. So the book ends with they escaped from the underground Yerk pools. They saved one human and Tobias had to stay behind lest he be caught. He was just a hawk. Just a lowly hawk. Hawk. And now he is stuck as a hawk because he went past the two hour time limit violating Z space somehow. I don't again once you can.

[Andrew]

It's not. But it's not part of this book.

[Craig]

You can go to Reddit.com r animorph comments/something something/theory of morphing. The 2 hour time limit explained and learn and learn more about the theory of morphing. Yeah, that's what I got.

[Andrew]

What was it about the 90s and the fascination with like morphing from one thing.

[Craig]

What was it? You're right.

[Andrew]

People love. People loved morphin into listen to stuff.

[Craig]

Speaking of it was more.

[Andrew]

It was morphin time. It was a morphin decade.

[Craig]

Speaking of hot cousins. I definitely as a kid had a crush on Alex Mack. Definitely had a crush on Alex Mack as a kid.

[Andrew]

Now why would you say speaking of hot cousins?

[Craig]

No, just saying of like you're a kid and you're people are hot. Like that's all Like I'm not my Larissa Oladig is not my cousin.

[Andrew]

I was. I was gonna ask is Larissa your hot cousin?

[Craig]

No. But just that you know, speaking of having, you know, an awareness of attraction as a young Boy like Jake.

[Andrew]

What a weird way. What a. If you were an Andalite, you came from another planet.

[Craig]

I would say awareness of attraction. Yes, exactly. Maybe I am an Andalite, Andrew. You don't know.

[Andrew]

I guess I don't.

[Craig]

I encourage all of our listeners to assess all people in their lives, whether or not they are Andalites who are morphed or yerks who are controlled. Think about it. Think about it.

[Andrew]

I'm thinking about it right now.

[Craig]

Question.

[Andrew]

You can't stop me from thinking about it.

[Craig]

Don't trust anybody. As Stone Cold Steve Austin used to.

[Andrew]

Say, we have got to be done.

[Craig]

We have to be done.

[Andrew]

You simply have to be.

[Craig]

We had a good read, Andrew.

[Andrew]

I think we had a good read. We had a fun talk. But, you know, like, when you're looking at your hot cousin, eventually you have to stop. So. So people don't get upset.

[Craig]

In closing, I think your points about the tone of the book, like, as a standalone entry, are well made. Like, it is interesting how kind of zany and silly some of the, like, let's turn into animals sequences feel.

[Andrew]

The whole thing where Jake eats a spider and can, like, feel the spider kicking around in his lizard stomach and he's like, like, so grossed out about it is. I'm sorry we didn't get to talk about it.

[Craig]

Well, and that. That to me feels like the Applegate had an idea about what if kids were animals? And, like, let's write a story about that. And then you. You look at the other side of the coin and it's every figure of authority and people in your household are secret alien evildoers. What are you gonna do about it? Yeah, this series is. Is, like, very, you know, not only beloved, but well known for the fact that, like, at the end of the series, there's this, like, kind of letter from Applegate about how, like, war is not a thing that anybody wins. And we can come out of this whole series being like, wow, I'm not. I'm not pleased with everything that took place. But, like, that's the way that this would go if this were like a. If this were real. Which it's not because it's aliens and animorphs, but that, like, what does it say? You don't like the way our little fictional war came out? You don't like. Well, there's a bunch of spoilers here. You don't look like the way that one war led to another. Fine. Pretty soon you'll all be a voting age of draft age. So when someone proposes a war. Remember that even the most necessary war is even the rare wars where the lines of good and evil are clear and clean end with a lot of people dead, a lot of people crippled, and a lot of orphans, widows and grieving parents. If you're mad at me because that's what you have to take away from Animorphs, too bad. I couldn't have written it any other way and remain true to the respect I've always felt for Animorphs readers. So, yeah, Applegate and Grant seem to have a good head on their collective shoulders, is my biggest takeaway from this reading.

[Andrew]

Yeah, Andrews out.

[Craig]

Please take us out before I like I'm gonna start taking this out and I want you to think about.

[Andrew]

You said. You said to close earlier. I was expecting. I was expecting you to close.

[Craig]

I'm gonna. I'm gonna ask.

[Andrew]

I was. I was gonna give you coffee and everything.

[Craig]

I'm gonna ask you to think about before you tell us about the website and the schedule and things like that.

[Andrew]

Yes.

[Craig]

Just what. What animal would you like to morph into? Thanks to everybody who listens to the show. You can send us to an email overdupodmail.com let us know what animal you would like to turn into. Let us know if you've had issues, you know, crossing the Netherfjord or dealing with Yerks.

[Andrew]

Tell us about your hot cousin and how it you don't have family reunions you've ruined with with all this hot cousin talk.

[Craig]

But maybe if you are doing that like set up your own separate email to do that hot cousin gmail.com overdupod gmail.com or overdo pod is the handle we use on Blue sky and other social media platforms where you can follow us. Thanks to Nick Larangis who composed our theme music. I will say that I. I don't know. I do not know how later Animorphs books handle this. I would like to touch these the like skull of a dinosaur and see if I could become and get the DNA a dinosaur. Don't know if it would work. Don't know if it.

[Andrew]

I feel like what I am thinking of. I feel like I would try to be one of the animals that get to have it both ways like like a bear or a hippo.

[Craig]

Oh sure.

[Andrew]

Where you can be perceived as cute in certain contexts but also you can completely destroy a guy. You have to.

[Craig]

Oh I like that. I like that you get to.

[Andrew]

You get to a little bit of both strong, a little sweet, a little spicy.

[Craig]

You are strong and cute. Good work.

[Andrew]

Thank you, Andrew.

[Craig]

If folks want to know more about the show, where do they go?

[Andrew]

Overdue Podcast.com is our Internet website. If you're still with us after all this time, you can go to that website, see the books that we have read, the ones that we are going to read. Our march schedule is almost ready and you will have the full thing soon though. Craig, what are we reading for next week?

[Craig]

Next week you are reading the Princess Bride.

[Andrew]

And actually the Princess Bride not that time that I confused Princess Diaries and the Princess Bride.

[Craig]

And then following that, I'm gonna read Pirnaisi by Susanna Clark. I'm excited to go back to Susanna Clark, the author of Jonathan Strange and Mr. Norrell.

[Andrew]

And not to spoil anything, but I think at some point in the month of March, we might choose to have an adventure of some kind.

[Craig]

Oh sure. And not to spoil anything, but like maybe get hungry for some games.

[Andrew]

Patreon.com overdue pod is our patreon project. Subscribe there. Man, I'm losing. I'm losing words. Like I'm trying to morph into an animal that can't talk. You can get access to our Discord server, to our current Long Reads episodes. We just uploaded a new episode of of Sit Me Baby One More Time where we talk about Babysitters Club book 14. Hello, Mallory. And also dive into the series's perpetual state of 8th grade. You will not believe how many years of 8th grade these girls have subjected.

[Craig]

Too many.

[Andrew]

I will just. I will leave that for you as a tease. Patreon.com overdue pod Read more about the the rewards we offer and also feel good because you buy us equipment, you buy us books, you literally make it possible for the show to happen. So, yes, that's it.

[Craig]

Thanks everybody for listening. This turned into a real glorious episode.

[Andrew]

It was a long one. It was a long one.

[Craig]

We knew this was going to happen.

[Andrew]

We knew it was going to be a long one.

[Craig]

Thank you for joining us, everybody. Andrew, get us out of here.

[Andrew]

All right, everybody, until we talk to you next week, try not to look at your cousin like that. And try to be happy. That was a Headgum podcast.

[Craig]

Other toys, Andrew.

[Andrew]

Oh, boy.

[Craig]

There is the anamorphing sphere. You roll it and the image in it changes.

[Andrew]

Is this Magic 8 Ball?

[Craig]

I'm not quite sure.

[Andrew]

It sounds like it's just a magic.

[Craig]

Oh, this one is good. This one. I like the andalite beam.

[Andrew]

Wait, could you. Could you give me the French on anamorphing sphere? I believe it's the second one.

[Craig]

Oh, hold on one second.

[Andrew]

So it says anamorphing sphere, and then underneath, it has several.

[Craig]

Ah, the bald.

[Andrew]

Do you ever wish you could fly away? You would if you were in charge of protecting Earth from evil alien slugs. Ride the sky.

[Craig]

Just. No. I need you to look at the andalite beam, Andrew, because it is a flashlight that you aim at the wall and it projects a shadow of a boy. And then when you turn knob, it becomes crank.

[Andrew]

It becomes a rhino. Hell, yeah. Only. Only rhino. We couldn't even, like, they couldn't even do a view master thing and include, like, multiple little, like, slides in the flashlight. It's like you're. You're a boy unlocking a door or you're a rhinoceros. Those are the two options.

[Craig]

And then I'm gonna send you these Anna Stampers. This is all gonna go in at the end of the episode. Don't worry about it.

[Andrew]

Anna Stampers does sound like a sort of a lineup of. Of, like, personalized stamps that Jennifer Amsterdam.

[Craig]

Just don't be a yerk, Andrew. Quit being a yerk. I learned all of this in the Animorphs Wiki entry of Animorphs fast food merchandise.

[Andrew]

Tobias Anastamper shows Tobias morphing into a hawk. That's a wild piece of merch to have. So did this happen? I guess if this is all at the end, this is all fair play. Susanna made it like the Tobias turning into a hawk permanently thing, like, stuck with her. But the way she describes it makes it sound like it happened in, like, book 26. I was not prepared for one of the main characters to be, like, permanently an animal.

[Craig]

Oh, yeah.

[Andrew]

By the end of book one. And then they made a toy of a character who only exists in the first book, which is fine. Yeah, this is cool. I'm glad it was somebody's job to do these happy, happy. Make these stupid Happy Meal toys. What the hell are these, guys?

[Craig]

These are.

[Andrew]

This looks like 3D prints.

[Craig]

No, these are.

[Andrew]

They got. I did. They got little filament lines.

[Craig]

What are they? They are animarkers from Pizza Hut.

[Andrew]

Oh, Pizza Hut.

[Craig]

They are felt pen markers.

[Andrew]

Pizza Hut don't do toys no more, do they?

[Craig]

The animal head of the marker encodes a message in invisible ink. And the human head of the marker decodes the message in dark ink. Yes.

[Andrew]

That's so cool.

[Craig]

Oh, do you want a yerk pool ship squirter?

[Andrew]

I'm sorry, what did you say to me?

[Craig]

Do you want the under 3 toy yerkpool? Ship squirter who lives in a pineapple under the sea.

[Andrew]

Now, the sumi Slow ship squirter. No, it's too many syllables. For who lives in a pineapple under the sea?

[Craig]

Just look at this.

[Andrew]

You can't say like, this is a family friendly podcast. You can't say yerk pool Squirter. Whatever.

[Craig]

Yerk pool ship squirter. A rubber ball of the Yerk mothership.

[Andrew]

Gross.