← Pablo Torre Finds Out
Pablo Torre Finds Out
A Sex-Charged Share & Tell with Mina Kimes, Dan the Drivers-Ed Teacher, Pablo... and Papi
00:48:33
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- [00:01]
A
Welcome to Pablo Torre finds out I am Pablo Torre. And today we're going to find out what this sound is.
- [00:06]
B
I don't think a lot of people would think of Quinn Snyder as ugly hot. I think he's aggressively cocaine y a plier of chapstick hot.
- [00:16]
A
Right after this ad.
- [00:18]
C
You're listening to Giraffe Kings Network.
- [00:33]
A
Dan looks like a driver's ed teacher. Has anyone pointed that out yet?
- [00:36]
B
Look at how you please Mina by coming on the attack as soon as we're on. Look at you, Mina. I don't look like a driver's ed teacher. I don't know why it is that he. Why would you. Why would you support that as a joke?
- [00:49]
C
Is it the glasses or the button down or just the general harried?
- [00:53]
A
It's also the sleeves rolled up. He's like, these fucking kids again.
- [00:58]
B
This is a tailored Italian shirt. This is made by Massimo. Driver's ed teachers are not getting, I don't think, for their classes. I don't believe they're getting tailored Italian shirts.
- [01:13]
C
Ooh, fancy.
- [01:15]
B
Well, no, I'll tell you the true story, actually, at the end at ESPN when I knew I was going to be gone, I had one last clothing allowance and so I ran out the door and just got a bunch of shirts I would never otherwise get.
- [01:29]
C
You got a clothing budget in your contract?
- [01:32]
B
Oh, wow. Mina. Mina. You didn't get one of those. I remember Mina at the beginning. Mina was. Mina was struggling with the daily labors of. You kidding me? I have to produce television clothes every single day.
- [01:47]
C
How the heck did Dan get a clothing budget? And I have never been offered a clothing budget. And you just wear. You were wearing like T shirts.
- [01:57]
A
That's unhylic. I don't know what's more shocking, that Dan had a contractual clothing budget or that Dan specifically wore clothes that were bought with a clothing budget.
- [02:07]
B
That's right. Spiteful clothes, too. Like I'm telling you that it was. I was not wearing a T shirt on highly questionable means. I was wearing a very nice dress shirt and shorts. That's right. Shorts and sneakers.
- [02:19]
C
Yeah. Dress shirt and shorts. Yeah, yeah, yeah. He had that closet to the side of the studio where I would constantly walk in on Poppy changing shirts.
- [02:28]
A
Shirtless, Right?
- [02:29]
B
A shirtless Poppy.
- [02:30]
C
Yes.
- [02:30]
A
The amount of times I saw.
- [02:33]
C
Yes.
- [02:33]
A
The wife pleaser, as they say.
- [02:34]
B
Yes. And I would ask him to stop that and he would refuse to stop that. And Bomani bought him very nice undershirts. He continued to wear the ones stained with yellow from whenever it is that he was wearing them when he ran a factory in Hialeah 25 years ago.
- [02:50]
A
What do you think? What do you think's in that room now? That room where that dressing room in that studio used to be in the Clevelander Hotel?
- [02:58]
B
Just a big pile of regret. All right, let's finally do this. It's not an intimacy discussion. It is an article. It is an article from the Atlantic, and it's the death of the sex scene. And it is. Jonah Hill is photographed in it. And it is basically about a scene in the movie that Jonah Hill did you people. And there was just no. The relationship went without very much in the way of courtship into flossing and an exclusive relationship. And there was nothing on screen to indicate that there had been any kind of sex scene. They were able to move all around it. Not necessarily that we were all that interested in a Jonah Hill sex scene, but it did make me think of just the general awkwardness that I myself would feel if you asked me to do anything in the way of this kind of acting in front of people. I am too repressed to imagine myself being able to do for a fraction of a second any. A sex scene of any kind, even, even playfully. Even. Even.
- [04:26]
A
Even. This conversation is making me uncomfortable. Just hypothesizing.
- [04:30]
C
I couldn't make eye contact with the camera while Dan was talking about himself.
- [04:33]
A
I was looking out to the side.
- [04:34]
B
Okay, but. Okay, but wait a minute. Forgive me. I know I come off as repressed compared to the sexually flamboyant never nudes in front of me that I imagine and I imagine would just. Both of them would conquer theatrically a sex scene with great confidence because they are so and confident and in touch with their sexuality.
- [04:58]
A
Yeah, I want. I want to be clear about this Jonah Hill movie. First off, like, part of the whole, like, story there is that apparently they, like, deep faked a kiss. So the issue was, like, these people really have chemistry. They don't. To the point where they had to computerize using technology. Intimacy in the most innocent way. But I guess there's a larger thing being going on here where, like, people are wondering in the age of intimacy coordinators, in the age of power dynamics, in the post or I guess during MeToo sort of ongoing discussion of, like, what should we be doing here? There's a larger cultural question of, like, how important is the sex scene in the first place, and what are we losing if we lose them from movies as actors like Penn Badgley, by the way, who stars in that Netflix show, you is asking this is a dude saying, I don't want to do these anymore. It makes me uncomfortable. And that is a hot man. Like an objectively beautiful man. No offense, Dan. Who's saying that?
- [05:50]
B
So, yeah, why would I get offended because you found someone objectively beautiful?
- [05:55]
A
Well, you have the same opinion and you would seem to have different opinions based on certain external, you know, evaluation.
- [06:00]
B
So I'm going to take offense because you meant to offend me. And just because you say no offense doesn't mean it's not offensive.
- [06:07]
C
Are you implying that because Dan isn't as hot as Penn Badgley, he should be enthusiastically doing open to the idea of doing a sex scene with an.
- [06:16]
A
Actress the other way? But I can see the case now that you just made. Yeah, y.
- [06:23]
C
Well, I think in doing so, you, Pablo, maybe inadvertently hint at what is potentially problematic about sex scenes, which is this idea that men would be eager to do them because they, you know, would, I don't know, be titillating to them in some way or give them an opportunity. I don't think that's how actors feel about it generally. I found this article interesting because laid out the date like it had stats for how few sex scenes there are now. I think it was like fewer than 1% of movies. I think that's less about, just as a moviegoer, I think that's less about sexuality being repressed and more about the fact that there just aren't that many romantic movies made anymore. You don't see that many like romantic comedies and romances. And that probably has to do more with Hollywood just not catering to women or like privileging the female audience and then being surprised when a movie like, I don't know, Barbie or whatever does extremely well. But I do think like something is lost because, you know, a lot of my favorite movies and TV shows of all time are ones that depict like realistic believable chemistry between actors and actresses. Like, and I think I don't want to watch a deep fake romance scene, sex or otherwise.
- [07:39]
A
Yeah, I was. A point raised, Dan, in this article that I was struck by and it made sense immediately in a way that's embarrassing for me to now full throatedly admit to, as it were, is that pornography is the other way we model this stuff. Like truly. Like the article points out that like, where, where do normal people, where do people in America at least learn, like what sex is like when it doesn't involve, you know, like firsthand experience, so to speak? You look at movies and you look at porn and if you Cede the space to just pornography. Then you're getting a version of it that is actually disturbing and not.
- [08:23]
B
Look, Mina, why.
- [08:26]
A
Why is.
- [08:27]
C
Because you can't even. Because Dan. The second he said the word pornography, Dan's eyes just went, like, just darted off screen and he couldn't make eye contact.
- [08:34]
B
I will tell you this is. Well, first of all, he's telling us. He's telling everyone. He's going with the absolute of the way that people learn to have all sex. Yes. Is through porn, which I believe is probably a little too absolute and little too general. So I couldn't look at the point that he was making. But also, you have correctly identified that since I was a young man watching movies at the theater with my parents and Urban Cowboy would come on and John Travolta is waking up in bed with two women. I have been uncomfortable with this happening in front of people, like, since I was a child.
- [09:14]
A
What was he like in that setting, by the way? What was he like in that setting for you?
- [09:19]
B
My dad is not. This is. My father and I. The next conversation that my father and I have about any of this will be the first. Okay. One of the places that a boy does not learn about sex is from my father. I will assure you of that. But I'm. I'm actually. The thing that we're talking about here. Right. Is a loss of intimacy. But the ability of actors to transport me with the intimacy of that believably, I believe, has a degree of difficulty I'm not fundamentally capable of. I don't believe that I could do what those actors are doing in faking intimacy.
- [09:57]
A
Yeah.
- [09:57]
C
I'm trying to think of the last. First of all, my experience is identical to Dan's, where. I mean, if. Growing up, watching movies with my parents, if there was ever a sex scene, I just wanted to die and, like, disappear into the cracks of the couch and never come out because I, too, am just. I just don't.
- [10:18]
A
Paralysis. I recall the paralysis of just like. I don't even. I just. I wish I wasn't here is the main feeling I remember.
- [10:26]
C
But even. And maybe this is a level of repression or something. I probably shouldn't reveal this, but my. Even now, as an adult, if there's like, a sex scene, my husband thinks it's really funny to just make very direct eye contact with people because he knows I can't take it.
- [10:49]
B
That is funny.
- [10:52]
C
I mean, by the way, it just cracks him up.
- [10:54]
A
But there was a mo. So, look, as.
- [10:56]
C
As this tremor, he'll crawl A hand onto my shoulder.
- [11:04]
A
Oh, God. Yeah, I. You know.
- [11:07]
C
Sorry, Pablo.
- [11:08]
A
No, no, no. I was. I was just thinking of, like, what's the last sex scene that I came upon? And not. Not that way.
- [11:14]
B
Don't do that.
- [11:15]
A
I'm not trying to. It's just happening. The last sex scene that I saw watching a movie where I was like, this is just. It's too much. All of it. All of it's too much.
- [11:26]
C
Dan, look at. I want you to make direct eye contact with.
- [11:29]
B
I'm gonna run a finger. Run a bunch of fingers. Okay. Okay, now it's too much. Let's go.
- [11:37]
C
No, no unbreaking eye contact. Dan, eyes up, all three of us.
- [11:41]
A
We are staring adultly, talking about the sex scene in Oppenheimer. That's the sex scene that most so bad springs to mind. Wait, how would you describe me to describe it for people who haven't. You saw. Did you see Oppenheimer? Just read the.
- [11:55]
B
I haven't seen. I have not seen Oppenheimer. So tell me about the scene.
- [11:58]
A
Okay, great.
- [11:59]
C
This is not a spoiler. If you're listening. This is not gonna ruin Oppenheimer for you. I saw this part before I fell at about the 45 minute mark. So what happens the first 45 minutes of the movie? And Pablo, no, you cannot. You cannot punt the description on tv. You. You brought this. You have to bear Barrett.
- [12:17]
A
So Oppenheimer, among other things, like inventing the greatest weapon in human history, was also super horny, right? So he is in this scene, he is having a dalliance. A dalliance. He is having sex with Florence Pugh's character, I believe, who is not his wife. And she is like, remarking upon the library or the bookshelves in the room. And it's just one of the most ridiculous sequences where she asks him to, like, quote one of the books that she sees. She's on top of him, right? She's on top of him. And he says, as per quoting this tome, I am become death, destroyer of worlds. And then, I presume, ejaculates at some point shortly thereafter. So it's just one of those scenes where you're like, oh, Christopher Nolan, who notably had never included a sex scene in a movie before, has. This is the first time for him, has this scene. And it is the most. It's just the most ridiculous sex scene I think I've seen in my. I guess, living memory. I don't remember.
- [13:23]
B
Turned on by Oppenheimer's intellect and ego.
- [13:27]
C
Yeah, definitely a real thing that happens. All the time. And not a fantasy of men who write and direct movies.
- [13:36]
A
Oh, God.
- [13:39]
C
The worst I had seen recently. I was thinking about this when you said this article was the Idol, which I don't know if either of you actually watched. It's the week on hbo.
- [13:48]
A
I saw episode one, and loudly, loudly cackled as soon as the credits hit at the end.
- [13:52]
B
The biggest criticism of that show I thought that I read was how over the. The top all of the sex stuff was.
- [14:02]
C
How that is not the worst part of the show. The worst part of the show is the writing, acting, plotting, and pretty much every aspect of the show. But, yes, the sex is super gross and weirdly written. And there's a scene with the Weeknd and the star, who's Lily Rose Depp. It's a sex scene where he's, like, talking to her and just directing her to touch herself and whatnot. That. Honestly, I was watching this, maybe, like, eight months pregnant, and I was, like, thinking to myself, I'm so glad my child isn't alive to see this yet or, like, out in the world, and I hope he's not taking any of it in.
- [14:42]
A
All of this whatnot would be very scarring. Yes, the whatnot would be a lot.
- [14:47]
B
What is this? Earth? I am bringing this child into that. This is what the creativity of the Weeknd births when he arrives at total artistic freedom.
- [14:56]
C
What is a good sex scene? Like, what is one that you look at is.
- [15:01]
A
Yeah, I did some research for this. I'd never seen the movie Atonement.
- [15:05]
C
Okay.
- [15:06]
A
Keira Knightley, James McAvoy, British, classy. There's a literal library. They're standing up. It's beautifully lit. It is. It's almost like there are these, like, objects. Like, the library ladder is, like, in the way of some stuff. It just. That, like, feels like. Yeah, like classic. I'd be close to okay if a parent was in the room. Like, this feels sweet and nice.
- [15:31]
B
So you're going for sweet as opposed to, like, one of the more famous ones. This is ancient. It's fossilized. But it's early Mickey Rourke, nine and a half weeks. It's the floor of a kitchen floor, you know, which I. I think I can say outside of the general thought of most kitchen floors is a place that I will never want to have sex under any circumstances. Not, you know, to each his and her.
- [15:58]
C
What if there's some. Some crumbs?
- [16:01]
B
That's precisely. I mean, I really don't. I really don't want any of that. I don't Want a dirty crumb?
- [16:08]
A
I just wanna. I just wanna. I just like how Mina was like, I know there's a joke here because it's Dan saying this.
- [16:15]
B
I know.
- [16:15]
A
All I got is that, what if.
- [16:17]
B
There'S not just a fat joke? Yes. Well, if you make sure. Now if you make it food, sex, and I can have a little bit of a muffin from the night before that I tried to snarf at the fridge door. Then all of a sudden, yes, obviously, you've titillated me at the heist of.
- [16:33]
C
You know who I thought had fantastic chemistry and something we watched recently. Mr. And Mrs. Smith, Donald Glover and Maya Erskine, who I do not think looks like me at all, but people.
- [16:43]
A
Keep telling me many, many, many disagree. I texted you that.
- [16:47]
C
Yeah, but you watched the series. I did. Didn't you think that they had great sexual chemistry?
- [16:52]
A
Yes, yes, I did. And that felt like, by the way, rom comy action movie, plausible, but also, you know, like a plot point, like a meaningful plot point that advanced the understanding that we have of the characters. The other great sex scene I saw recently, it was an Apple TV show, and I have a clip if you guys want to see it, actually. So they stay together, and in the coming weeks, they mate frequently. Eventually, she'll lay up to 15 eggs. My favorite part was the. Was the classy pomfron that's blocking us from dinosaur penis.
- [17:45]
B
Yes. Yes, that was good. Tastefully done by Attenborough.
- [17:51]
C
It looked like she enjoyed it. I'm really interested in hearing what you guys think about this. I sent you an article. There's been a bunch of articles about Mr. Beast. The one I sent you was in Fox, Washington Post, a big article recently. Times has written about him, I want to say, a few months ago. And the general gist of all of these articles is authors, many of whom are, like, our age. Right. Geriatric millennials or older, who are basically like, what the f? Why is this so popular? I don't understand. So, for those who don't know, Mr. Beast is, I think, the most popular YouTube creator, unless I'm missing. He's certainly up there, and he's built this very huge and successful business out of it. He has 500 employees, 300 of whom work on the YouTube videos. They are really oriented around stunts. I think they're very expensive to make videos where he does, like. I think his first one was Give a. Or first big hit was Give a random homeless man $10,000.
- [19:08]
A
It's a series where I just, you know, be nice and Just give people some help. So if you want to take it, it's about $10,000.
- [19:18]
C
He's done like squid games. And so these things cost millions of dollars, but then he makes millions of dollars off of them. So the. What I find interesting about this is there's two things that I think are interesting. One, the notion that this is just what is successful on this platform that we're all trying to figure out, and then the world all try to figure out side of it. So there's the consumer side of it, which I think is interest. There's the producer side of it, because all three of us make things for YouTube. This lives on YouTube, Dan's shows on YouTube, my show's on YouTube. And I think we're all kind of navigating how to do it, whether to do it, like what to get out of it. And I know that's something I think about a lot. So I find the Mr. Beast story really fascinating.
- [20:07]
A
No, the number on dollars that he's spending, it's between 3 and $5 million a YouTube video, which is, and I just want to quote this here, Dan, roughly the same cost per video as any episode from the first five seasons of Game of Thrones, right? So this is. So what we're watching is a guy who became like, who bootstrapped a YouTube channel doing stunts because he had an understanding of like, how can I compel young people to be interested in something? And he developed this strategy that everybody, us, all of us, we are creators, by the way. We're not just media people, we're creators. It's funny when people say on like comments on my YouTube channel, one of my favorite creators, which is just like a term I'd never thought of before, but like, Mr. Beast embodies. Well, thank you to all of the commenters on my YouTube channel. But what he has created is this whole school of something called retention editing. And this is the term that has been haunting me that I am fascinated by while it's haunted me because there are all these tutorials about how can we retain attention, like Mr. Beast, who has figured it out better than everybody else. And so there are tutorial videos, like these whole, like, attempts at decoding what he does that works and what he did essentially as his style to start. And what he pioneered was his idea of like loud sound effects, fast cuts, flashing lights, like zero pauses. And all of this is sort of embodied even as he tries to move away from it and does his own, like, attempt at being Christopher Nolan, auteur style stuff. Because this is another video that he claims is now slowed down in. Paced much more normally, like a piece of cinema. And it's this one. We just got dropped off in the middle of an abandoned city and we're going to spend the next seven days here. And there goes our only way out. We are now stranded for the next seven days.
- [21:56]
C
Why are we doing this?
- [21:57]
A
For content. So in that you're like, okay. And I watched the rest of it just to see what was there. But the point is that that is budget, that is retention, editing. That is somebody trying to hook you and never let. And he is better than anybody else at hooking you, Dan. Hooking young people, at least.
- [22:11]
B
Well, let me ask.
- [22:12]
A
Just keeping them.
- [22:13]
B
Let me ask you some questions because I remember the first time I ended up being fascinated about something along these lines. I think it was a Malcolm Gladwell book where I was learning for the first time that Blues Clues was not just some arbitrary thing that somehow, by happenstance, lured your child into an addiction to the television. It was all very formulaically orchestrated in order to be able to addict that young person to something like Blue's Clues. This is a natural evolution of something like that. Because the thing that made me both feel outside of the demo and worry for the future of the demo is that this person has some of the gifts needed in order to ensnare young people in a way that allows him to. You. Those numbers you guys gave are crazy idea that he's got 300 to 500 employees, that each video costs as much as one episode of Game of Thrones from the first five seasons. This is an orchestrated, highly calculated way that this person has figured out over the last 15 years to maximize what is now his identity, which is I'm this person that continues pushing the envelope on what evolution is to addict more and more young people. Jake Paul and Logan Paul got into this business. They weren't able to do the upkeep. They've got plenty of fame, but they don't have the same growing popularity and stickiness that Mr. Beast has. He has a set of things that makes me feel like when I'm playing that Royal Match game on my iPad, where I'm clearly addicted from the people who have made that game. They've made me addicted to a stupid Royal match game where I simply cannot stop playing because they figured out how it is to trick a personality like mine.
- [24:06]
A
What is the Royal map?
- [24:08]
B
I don't even want to talk about it. I don't even want to talk about it.
- [24:10]
A
I'm so Embarrassed by it.
- [24:12]
B
I'm so embarrassed.
- [24:13]
C
Like a candy crush.
- [24:14]
B
It's kind of like that. It's embarrassing. I'm ashamed to admit it, but Mr. Beast has figured out, look, I don't know if you guys feel this. I talked about this with Stugats the other day. There's a certain film I have sometimes, after watching YouTube where I. I feel like I've been manipulated down a rabbit hole of my interests.
- [24:37]
A
But that's Mina. I guess the point is that in this era of everyone chasing audience on YouTube, everyone trying to. To please an algorithm that is sorting us into various sorts of videos and creators and all of that, there's this thing that's been happening that's fascinating to me and like, I keep on saying that word, but I. I truly feel this way. The promise of the Internet was that it's an infinite universe of different characters and styles and creators and points of origin. And what we're getting is everyone trying to imitate the most popular person because they figured out something. I talk about this with my friend Wyatt Sinak all the time. The Internet now is just so much more homogenous than anybody thought it would be. We're all trying to be the same thing. In this place of infinite possibility.
- [25:30]
C
When you're in the business now of making things as we all are, I'm really trying not to call myself a creator. By the way, a decision you have to make is, are we going to, in our business, talk about topics that we know are the ones that are doing well on these sorts of platforms that everybody wants to. And I think there's. It can be a little bit excessive to say this is totally different from the past. Like espn, we always talk about the cowboys. That's not new. Right. And for similar reasons, which is if you dug into the numbers you saw, that's what people wanted to hear about. The ratings are great, the audience is huge. So this is not that different from that. Except for, I think it's ruling everything because we are all living in the same space. Or rather, we're working on the same platforms. We are reliant on the same set of pipes. And when that happens, you end up with every creator, every podcaster, every video maker, every whatever writer talking about the same shit.
- [26:36]
A
Yeah. I think the big difference is simply in how strategic and engineered, even the format, even the graphics, all of it is to keep attention. So Mina's right. Insofar as, like, since the dawn of time, this was the criticism of old media, was that, yeah, back then you were just Trying to please an editor or a publisher or a corporate no name faceless guy. He was saying, america needs to know about this. But now what we're doing is we're trying. And they don't give you the rules of the game and so you have to decode it and so you use people who figured out the best. And what you're doing is seeing people who are saying, okay, look, look, this is a psychology question. It's not a content question. It's not about how good you are at telling a story. It's not how good you are at the opinion you have and delivering that. It's okay. The human brain needs to be convinced to keep watching at every second intervals. Like literally on TikTok, there's a line here that I read how TikTok has trained users to scroll away if they aren't hooked within the first half second. And so the flashing lights, the fast editing style, these apps that are now trying to replicate Mr. Beast, it's about seeing the human brain as a lab rat to be manipulated. And of course that's existed by degrees, but this is just so much beyond what we dreamed it would be.
- [27:54]
B
But Mina, it's not just that, right? I've learned since having to pay attention to some of this stuff. Now the people who are doing this well have armies of people working on how to do that. How do they figure out how to ensnare the currency of the day? Which is, how do I get your attention? Because once I have your attention, I can have the tentacles in the algorithm that keep your attention as long as I continue to produce good content. Because the machine works with me to addict you.
- [28:25]
A
Well, this is why it's fascinating to monitor the burnout rates and the regrets of YouTubers who have won the game, so to speak. Right, Mr. Beast?
- [28:33]
B
Life didn't feel happy to me, incidentally. Like it there, there. It felt lonely to me reading all that stuff you sent on Mr. Beast to be this craven in pursu pursuit of this.
- [28:43]
A
Well, I think he's grown introspective over time about the way that he has basically inspired a template for how to make things online. And so all of these, all old and young, are trying to be him. And he's saying now, like that clip I showed from before, like that's him slowing things down. He's been tweeting about how we can still get audience if we change our techniques and we don't do all the flashing lights, fast cuts, screaming at you, literally screaming at you from second number one and so he is trying to, like, pivot to, like. It's funny, right? I. I can imagine all these people have grown tired. None of them seem happy because of the burnout rate of, like, just churning content over and over again. And then you have the guy saying, look, I know everyone wants to be me, but I don't even want to be me the way I used to anymore, because that feels like I'm overdosing on candy. And that, to me, is a giant red flag as to, like, where this is all headed from a sustainability perspective. Perspective.
- [29:38]
C
Yeah. All of these YouTube stars pivot at some point to something else because of that. I think about, like, what's it. Emma Chamberlain. I remember reading an interview with her about it. And she spoke. She, who is this very extremely successful and popular YouTuber who then turned became more of a podcaster fashion person who has coffee. I think Mr. Beast also is a food.
- [30:01]
A
Selling candy. GB literally sells candy now, by the way. Feastable.
- [30:06]
C
The pressure of continuously, like, getting numbers and making these things and making. And they're long. And I mean, I'm just reading this list of the videos. Beast. Mr. Beast. I can't believe I'm calling this human Mr. Beast. Donaldson is his name, anyways, that he's made. Dan, which of these would you be willing to do for YouTube.com lebatardshow 50 hours buried alive.
- [30:32]
B
Oh, God, no.
- [30:33]
C
50 hours in Antarctica. 24 hours trapped in ice. 30 days without food. I don't know how that one worked. Seven days alone in a padded room. Or a week on a small raft. Or paying a bounty hunter to hunt you.
- [30:52]
B
I think that I had the largest recoil in order. Buried Alive was the largest one.
- [31:01]
C
Same.
- [31:03]
B
I might surprise you with second, because my second on. No way I would do that. A week on a raft. A. A week on a raft. I'd rather be in a padded room.
- [31:16]
A
The question would be, in the padded room, does Dan still get to play Royal Match? Which I had the people behind the glass look up, and it's apparently a game that looks like this.
- [31:27]
B
Yeah, I'm embarrassed. I'm embarrassed by. Yes. And it's like, it's a Turkish company. They kept giving me these ads. Look, Valerie, look, I'm glad you put. Because Valerie will walk by me and derisively say, are you pleasing your king?
- [31:45]
A
And also does. Is it intentional that the king kind of looks like Dan? If he grew a beard.
- [31:51]
B
I am. I have a beard. It's. If I grew a big white beard.
- [31:54]
A
I mean, a fuller white beard.
- [31:56]
B
Fuller beard. That does not look anything like me.
- [31:59]
C
The fact that he plays it on his iPad makes it so funny.
- [32:02]
B
I can't believe I admitted that. I cannot believe that I shared that vulnerability with anybody. That was just for me and Valerie.
- [32:10]
A
Oh, God. Thank you, your highness. All right, so speaking of faces, the story I brought today is actually a series of stories that I've noticed over the years, because there's a thing that I have now just called beauty analytics. And I say that because every year you see stories about like, this celebrity, according to science, has the most beautiful face on earth. That dude from Bridgerton, Reggae John something something.
- [32:48]
C
That guy show with many sex scenes, by the way.
- [32:50]
A
Yes.
- [32:51]
C
Should have mentioned that. Yeah, sorry.
- [32:52]
A
Yep, yep, yep. That guy.
- [32:53]
B
She said that awardedly. She said that was very. He. He was perfect. He was viewed as the.
- [32:58]
C
The.
- [32:58]
B
The most physically perfect facial male. Correct.
- [33:02]
A
Reggae Jean Page is officially a smoke show Bridgerton alum deemed practically perfect by science, according to People magazine. And then in 2022, just a million headlines like this, they're just all clickbait about, like, science says that this is what beauty looks like. And like, Amber Heard was the person in 2022. And then you look into this and you're like, oh, like the main source on all of this stuff is a plastic surgeon, and it's this guy. What is the definition of beauty? Now, we all know a beautiful face when we see it, but how do we actually evaluate that? Well, we took the golden ratio and we used it to analyze the human face and create an objective measure of beauty. The golden ratio, also known as phi, is a mathematical number 1.618. It is a proportion. Now, there are 12 key features that we could identify that we can measure in the human face. And we can equate each of these to the golden ratio. And this can give us an objective score. It's Dr. Julian Da Silva, and his whole thing is there's a golden ratio. Are you guys familiar with the golden ratio as a concept only now, because.
- [34:14]
B
You sent us this story on how it is your face is supposed to be proportional, right?
- [34:20]
A
So mathematically, I guess the Fibonacci sequence has blah, blah, blah numbers. What you got to know is this. In the golden ratio, there's this thing, a secret formula that is alleged where there's this number 1.618 having to do with proportion, that your face should be balanced in such a way. And so, yeah, this guy is like the Kirk Goldsberry of beauty. He's like, I've mapped the human face. Here are the zones you got to get better at. Here's all this stuff.
- [34:44]
C
Stuff.
- [34:45]
A
And of course, he's a plastic surgeon. But the idea that there's just analytics behind this has led to all sorts of things, including the ability for all of us to test ourselves and our beauty according to the math of the golden ratio, which I want to do with you guys. But Mina, when I say all of this to you, your reaction to this is fundamentally what.
- [35:03]
C
I think. There's a pretty strong like in cell component to all of this that I. I've just to say that's the only people I've seen on the Internet talking about it are.
- [35:15]
A
Yes.
- [35:17]
C
Men who use it to. On attractive women.
- [35:23]
A
Tamina's credit, Dan, the website in question, the URL is www.incel.tech and. Is it a joke? Is it not a joke? I. It's. I. I'm leaning towards. This is unfortunately disturbingly real. But you take a photo of your face and you submit it. And so what I had Cortez do, because I don't want any of us to just pick our best photos, I had Cortez submit our official headshots to this thing. I had no control over this.
- [35:51]
B
Wow.
- [35:51]
A
This is what Cortez did. And so this actually is the Dan that we got. If we can play.
- [35:58]
C
Let's see it.
- [35:59]
A
So that's the. Again at the Clevelander desk. Highly questionable. You can see the squares, the arrows just mapping Dan's face. And the results are. Yeah, so you get.
- [36:11]
C
Not bad.
- [36:12]
A
A lot.
- [36:12]
B
Three perfect. Three perfects.
- [36:14]
A
Three perfects. So Dan is perfect on Dan. Can you see that?
- [36:18]
C
Horrible. Yeah, there's a. Because they do a horrible.
- [36:21]
B
And you didn't get any horrible noticeably close together eyes. It does horrible. It puts horrible as an adjective.
- [36:27]
A
There are some horribles.
- [36:28]
C
Yeah, that's the worst possible score.
- [36:30]
A
So it's a chart with like 11 different criteria. It's mid face ratio. Dan has a noticeably long mid face, a 0.96, which is short of the ideal, which is 1 to 1.05. It's like looking at, like looking at a second spectrum chart or like whatever you mean, whatever advanced football analytics thing you get like, you get all this broken down and Dan, it turns out his canthal tilt is perfect. Just like green font. Perfect. Canthal tilt.
- [37:00]
C
What's a canthal tilt?
- [37:03]
A
Hold on.
- [37:04]
B
How your eyes are. I think because I also have the perfect eye to mouth angle. Perfect.
- [37:11]
A
Yeah. So canthal tilt refers to the angular slant of the outer corners of the eyes in relation to the horizontal Plane of the face. So Dan Leardard is a. A specimen when it comes.
- [37:21]
B
This is a big upset. This is a big upset. I think I have been. I think science has proven that I while not perfect, while clearly not perfect, clearly not horrible.
- [37:31]
C
Well, your lips like a total score here. Because that just was like on a scale of 1 through 10 or something.
- [37:36]
B
Well, how did you do, Mina? Miss beauty, Miss perfect face.
- [37:41]
A
All right, this is probably not well, Mina's headshot.
- [37:44]
C
Which headshot do you guys use?
- [37:46]
A
Processed. Cortez picked these. These are just like off of. Off of espn, I guess.
- [37:51]
C
Yeah, it's kind of old, but, you know.
- [37:53]
A
Yep, yep, yep, yep. And Mina scores.
- [37:55]
B
Oh, look at all those perfects. Jesus.
- [37:58]
A
So here's the thing, Mina. If you want to assess your own score here, there's a lot of purple.
- [38:02]
C
I got a horrible.
- [38:03]
A
But Mina, perfect on facial. Width to height ratio. Chin to filth filtrum ratio.
- [38:11]
B
I'm delighted. I did not think I'd be this delighted.
- [38:13]
C
Wait, is my horrible lower third height, does that mean I have a weak chin?
- [38:18]
B
Basically, it says you have horribly short lower third.
- [38:23]
A
Yeah. Yeah. So the lower third of your face is. Yeah, you have a short. You have a short chin.
- [38:28]
B
Less than perfect.
- [38:28]
A
1.06.
- [38:30]
B
It's 2/3 of your face is perfect and the lower third third of your face is horrible.
- [38:35]
C
So I got five perfects and one horrible.
- [38:38]
A
You have noticed uneven lips. According to.
- [38:40]
B
You also have a noticeably long mid face.
- [38:45]
A
I like that. I like this informing the replies that Mina might get on Twitter significantly too.
- [38:51]
B
Narrow jaw and too close together eyes. I think this that mean that one's kind of racist.
- [38:58]
C
All right, Dan, Pablo, let's see what Pablo got with the.
- [39:01]
A
All right, I. What's my. Okay, I hate this headshot of me. I hate that Cortez chose it. I dislike it as a principle.
- [39:08]
B
This hair, my hair. The hair is not even studied vertical.
- [39:14]
A
It's too vertical. I'm looking.
- [39:17]
B
On a bus. Unsuccessfully selling real estate on a. On, on, on either a. A bus seat.
- [39:26]
A
Oh, God.
- [39:28]
C
He's the. The junior partner at the law firm who just stays way too long at the Christmas party. That's the vibe I'm getting.
- [39:37]
A
I have. This is.
- [39:38]
C
This was a lot of perfects too tied in perfect.
- [39:43]
A
I like how Mina is. Our Mina was like, I wish there was an overall score. And instead of which she's just tracking how many perfects we all have. And she's like immediately.
- [39:50]
B
And I finished last place in the perfect. So I was feeling good when I Came out of the box.
- [39:55]
A
But my chin to filter them ratio. I have an extremely short philtrum. I'm gonna look up what philtrum is because I don't really. It's the vertical groove between the base of the nose and the border of the upper lip. Anyway. All of which is to say that this thing has the ability to. Yeah. Assess beauty and grade us in ways that.
- [40:15]
C
So.
- [40:15]
A
Yeah. That science allegedly claims.
- [40:19]
C
While you were doing this, I uploaded the most beautiful person I could think of on short notice. Who is Margot Robbie. Who was maybe in my mind because I was talking about Barbie and we all outscored her.
- [40:31]
B
Wow.
- [40:33]
C
Which suggests maybe that the tool is not quite. Not to insinuate that Margot Robbie is hotter than.
- [40:43]
A
Yeah. What's her philtrum like, though? Yeah.
- [40:45]
C
Let's move on. Extremely short. According to this. Yeah. Extremely short. Eyes horribly wide apart.
- [40:52]
A
Horribly wide apart.
- [40:54]
C
Are you familiar with the term ugly hot, Dan?
- [40:56]
B
I am not.
- [40:58]
C
It's a term that people use to describe people who, like, maybe aren't attractive to everyone, but are attractive to them. Or, like, there's just something about their face that you find really appealing, even though they're not. Like, I think I would not put Angelina Jolie in this category. Or certainly not Margot Robbie. But we all have our peccadillo all throughout. One that Pablo is aware of. Quinn Snyder, man.
- [41:30]
A
Oh, God, he does it for me. So I was gonna. So look. Okay. So I was gonna go like, yeah, Adam Driver. Adam Driver's ugly hot.
- [41:37]
C
But me, Adam Driver's a great example of one.
- [41:38]
A
But no, let's not move off of Mina's example, because I'm on a group chat with Mina and she keeps on making the case. It's again, it's the one with me and Mike Sher and Alan Yang, and it's Mina just arguing to us dudes that Quinn Snyder. Actually, can we just. We'll put this photo up. But Quinn Snyder, who looks like.
- [41:55]
C
Put a good photo of him.
- [41:57]
B
Quinn Snyder has some of the same architecture that her husband has, I believe. I. I sort of. He doesn't have the slicked hair, but he. He has.
- [42:07]
A
Nick does not have the slicked hair of a frazzled detective in a Batman movie. Like, I don't think.
- [42:15]
B
I don't think a lot of people would think of Quinn Snyder as ugly hot. I think he's aggressively cocain plier of chapstick hot. Like, but I. I don't think. I. I think. I think a lot of people would look at Quinn Snyder and sort of understand the charm well, wait a minute. The jazz did that to him. This is an older version of Quinn Snyder who's sort of been. He's been eaten up by. By millionaires he doesn't understand who don't want to play the game that he wants to. Any that's coaching go bear for four years when Donovan Mitchell doesn't like him.
- [42:48]
C
Just saying looks good to me.
- [42:52]
A
He had the Sally Jesse Raphael glasses on.
- [42:54]
B
I don't look at that look. That looks like.
- [42:56]
C
Look at those eyes.
- [42:57]
B
That doesn't look like Nick 15, the way he curl Nick 15 years from now. Nick 10 years from now.
- [43:03]
A
He doesn't look like unwilling about to strangle someone with his hands.
- [43:08]
C
That person can be me too hard. Okay, who are your guys? Dan, if you saw the sex scene talk made dad uncomfortable.
- [43:25]
B
Have this episode ending with you aggressively telling Quinn Snider to strangle you. On that note, let's call my father and have you talk to him. And let's break to him. I want to ask him whether he knows whether he was taking his shirt off behind Mina and that he knew that Mina was looking into a mirror when she was getting ready. Bobby.
- [44:01]
C
Hey.
- [44:03]
A
How are you, everybody?
- [44:06]
B
Hello, Poppy.
- [44:08]
A
What do you need?
- [44:09]
B
Mina wants to say hello to you, and we want to ask you a couple of questions to see what you remember about highly questionable and how it is that you would get dressed for the show. Are you ready for Mina's questions?
- [44:21]
A
Yeah, yeah, sure, I'm ready. How are you?
- [44:23]
B
Hi.
- [44:24]
C
I miss you. Poppy, I think Dan is the one who's going to be asking the questions.
- [44:31]
B
Okay, that's it. Mina's sitting this out. All right, Poppy, I will ask the question. She tossed that right back at me. So the question is the following. Poppy, when you were getting ready for the show and you would take your shirt off and Mina was in makeup, were you aware in any way that Mina could tell from the mirror in front of her in front of her that your. You were taking your shirt off in public and that people could see your hairy belly?
- [44:57]
A
No, I wasn't aware of that. You know, I'm very sensitive to my privacy, so if I had not, that probably would have gone someplace else.
- [45:04]
B
Poppy, would you like to file any sort of toxic workplace or sexual harassment claim against Mina because she was clearly. Because she was clearly peering at you through a mirror when you were not expecting to be seen.
- [45:17]
A
She was taking a free ride. You know what I mean? Very cheap.
- [45:22]
C
You know, I gotta jump in here. I gotta jump in here. Poppy, you say you're sensitive to your privacy. But I can count the number of times you took your shirt off. But highly questionable. And I think it's over 10. At least.
- [45:36]
A
At least 10. Gee, I thought that was much, much bigger than that. The number. But that's okay. I never keep track of that stuff.
- [45:43]
B
Mina got a free ride. Most people have to pay.
- [45:48]
A
Free ride. That's right.
- [45:51]
B
All right, Poppy, good catching up with you. One last question on the way out. Would you let Quinn Snyder choke you for pleasure?
- [46:00]
A
Well, I don't want to get into that. He took me for a pleasure. I don't know, but I'm an old guy buddy. Oh, go, God. So Dan got up. I guess, at the very end here, I should say what I found out today. What I found out today, Mina, is that in a world of great change and uncertainty, various technologies, various incentives are trying to make us all the same. This is the story of Mr. Beast. This is the story of facial analytics. This is the story of sexy leads. We are led to be molded by the same thing, free of all of these other disruptions and. And peccadillos, as you called it before. And also, I learned that the three of us cannot maintain eye contact when talking about sex for more than three seconds.
- [46:54]
C
I found out that Dan is gonna get scammed any day now. I. I'm surprised it hasn't happened already. If you are a scammer and to this podcast, I would target him.
- [47:08]
B
Yeah, I. I did not know that I, before coming to this microphone, would share that with anybody publicly. So I. You forced something out of me. I learned something about myself today that I was willing to. I was willing to share a private shame so that Pablo Torre can find out.
- [47:29]
A
What I found out is that my boss is trying to please a virtual king.
- [47:37]
B
But Mina was leering at a real one.
- [48:02]
A
But as for the people who prevent me from being scammed every day of my life. Pablo Torre Finds out happens to be produced by Michael Antonucci, Ryan Cortez, Sam Dawig, Juan Galindo, Patrick Kim, Neely Loman, Rachel Miller, Howard, Ethan Schreier, Carl Scott, Matt Sullivan, Chris Tominiello and Julia Warren. Our studio engineering by RG Systems Our post production by NGW Post Our theme song by John Bravo. We'll be back on Tuesday. Thank you for listening.