Podcast Summary: "Blood Empty: How a Beloved Team Made a Deal with the Devil"

Podcast: Pablo Torre Finds Out
Host: Pablo Torre (with reporting by Bradley Campbell)
Date: May 15, 2025
Episode Theme: A deep-dive into the unraveling of Schalke 04, a storied German soccer club, after a fateful sponsorship deal with Russian energy giant Gazprom—a quintessential "deal with the devil"—and what followed for its identity, fanbase, and future.

Episode Overview

This episode investigates how a beloved, fan-owned soccer team (Schalke 04) faced ruin after entering into a sponsorship with Gazprom, Russia’s massive state-run energy corporation. Through sharp storytelling and reported segments (primarily by correspondent Bradley Campbell), the episode explores the intersection of sports, geopolitics, community, and the perennial tension between ideals and survival in modern sports capitalism. What starts as a family anecdote spirals into an urgent, global narrative about values, money, and the soul of a sports club.

Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Setting Up the Story: Favors Gone Wrong, The Local-Global Connection

• [01:04–04:46] Bradley Campbell opens with a humorous anecdote about asking for a Borussia Dortmund hat while his cousin lives in the rival German city of Schalke. This personal misstep leads to the meat of the story: Schalke 04's struggles.
  • Quote (Bradley Campbell, 02:46): "Well, Borussia Dortmund, they're. They're our enemy. Like, we. We root for this team called Schalke, and we just hate Borussia Dortmund..."

2. Explaining the “Faustian Bargain”

• [04:47–07:25] The story frames Schalke’s ordeal as a German Faustian tale—selling out for salvation at the peril of one's soul.
  • Quote (Pablo Torre, 07:25): "If you’ve seen the Little Mermaid, that's a Faustian tale... but the original goes back centuries. It's about an astrologer who sells his soul to the devil for knowledge and power."

3. Introducing Schalke 04: Local Roots, Working-Class Pride

• [08:45–13:06] Explores the club's history and connection to its mining town origins; "fan-owned" structure likened to the Green Bay Packers.
  • Quote (Axel Haffer, Chairman, 09:54): “Schalke fans are notorious for illusionary optimism... This whole crazy loving fantasy of becoming the champion once again immediately kicks in.”
  • The club boasts 190,000 members, deep local ties, and a proud legacy—last national title: 1958.

4. The Arrival of the ‘Meat Baron’ and the Quest for Money

• [14:29–15:44] Clemens Tönnies, dubbed the "Meat Baron," is introduced: a local mogul and lifelong fan unable to directly inject his own fortune into the club.
  • Quote (Tassilo Hummel, Reuters, 15:23): "He’s originally a butcher... and he was a big, big Schalke fan for his whole life."
• [16:30-16:39] Tönnies secures a sponsorship with Gazprom, Russia’s state-owned gas monopoly—a ‘big fish’ sponsor.

5. Gazprom Enters: Sports, Energy, Geopolitics Intertwine

• [17:18–19:24] Schalke’s new sponsor is sold as a natural fit, playing on mining and energy themes; no controversy at first.
  • Quote (Axel Haffer, 17:42): "When Gazprom was presented... that was very similar to the mining images that we all had in our mind. So it looked like a very good fit."

6. Retrospective: Was Gazprom the Devil?

• [19:24–22:06] The episode underscores that, at the time, neither Putin nor Gazprom were villainized in Germany or the West.
  • Quote (Tassilo Hummel, 19:24): "Putin wasn’t the devil for 10 years... That’s not how it was."
• Context of Germany’s (and the West’s) relationship with post-Soviet Russia is provided, referencing the Berlin Wall, economic optimism, and political naïveté.

7. The "High": Winning and the Illusion of Success

• [22:21–23:39] Post-Gazprom, Schalke surges: second in Bundesliga, Champions League semifinalists. The club and Gazprom both prosper; Nord Stream 2 pipeline project is inked.
  • Quote (Bradley Campbell, 22:40): "It was pure domination. The first year that they did the deal with Gazprom, Schalke went second place in the Bundesliga..."

8. Geopolitics Shift: Crimea, Sanctions, Moral Dilemma

• [23:39–26:08] Russia's 2014 annexation of Crimea sharply alters public sentiment; international sanctions, fan division, and moral quandaries emerge.
  • Quote (Axel Haffer, 25:40): "We have 190,000 members... you have everything from the far left to the far right... some said, okay, it's still a good partner... So for me personally, I never bought a Gazprom jersey... because I just thought, okay, yeah, no, doesn't feel right."
  • Board keeps Gazprom, despite the mounting controversy.

9. The Spiral: Competitive Collapse & Scandal

• [27:04–28:55] Compounding woes—on-field collapse against petrostate-backed Manchester City, managerial chaos, Tönnies’s racist remarks, COVID-19 economic shock, and mass fan disenfranchisement.
  • Quote (Pablo Torre, 27:57): "...as much as you might think that Vladimir Putin’s favorite state owned energy company would have more than enough in its pockets, Manchester City is indeed owned by the Abu Dhabi Royal family..."
  • Quote (Bradley Campbell, 29:20): "They burned through five different managers and finished the season dead last in the league by a lot. ...They just get deeper and deeper in debt..."

10. The Reckoning & Blood Empty—Identity Crisis

• [31:09–33:52] Russia invades Ukraine; immediate pressure to sever Gazprom ties; club faces existential crisis as revenues collapse and risks relegation to amateur status.
  • Quote (Bradley Campbell, 31:15): "Blood. Empty."
  • Quote (Axel Haffer, 32:42): "We’re not the richest club, and we will never be the richest club... but you need to keep the feeling of belonging and really helping each other..."

11. Finding a Path Forward: Angels Within

• [34:19–41:58] The club’s salvation comes from within—the local mining association steps in as interim sponsor; new CEO Matthias Tillman, lifelong fan and former Deutsche Bank banker, orchestrates financial triage.
  • Quote (Matthias Tillman, 39:35): "A lot of people in this region, they spend every penny they have on this club and spend all their time for this club. And yeah, that's why this club is more than just football."
  • The community creates a cooperative to run the stadium and raise funds, aiming to preserve Schalke’s DNA and local ownership.
  • Quote (Tillman, 42:05): "What I think is important is that you don't lose your DNA... the values have not changed. They're still the same hardworking people..."

12. Fan Experience & Personal Transformation

• [44:13–44:52] Campbell attends a Schalke match (vs. Kaiserslautern, the ‘Red Devils’), experiences a vibrant yet suffering community. Coincidentally, his cousin Max also attends the match.
• [46:44–47:01] Campbell, moved by the experience, abandons journalistic distance and becomes an official club member and a real estate stakeholder in the stadium collective.
  • Quote (Bradley Campbell, 46:51): “Right. So this is you becoming one of the 190,000 members.”
  • Quote (Bradley Campbell, 47:01): “...you've been talking to the co-owner of a German professional soccer team, and I would add a budding real estate magnate of Gelsenkirchen.”

13. Season’s End: Survival and Modest Recovery

• [47:15–48:14] As season closes, Schalke staves off relegation; hint of hope.
  • Quote (Pablo Torre, 47:15): "...it does appear that they have fended off relegation this season and things did not look good for a while here."

14. Epilogue: Rebranding, New Sponsors, and Ongoing Identity

• [48:28–49:40] Campbell shows off his ‘rebranded’ (vandalized) Dortmund hat; new sponsor on jersey is revealed to be a Swiss granola bar called Sun Mini Meal—a sharp, comedic contrast to the era of Gazprom.
  • Quote (Pablo Torre, 49:24): "A beautiful, beautiful blue and white Sun Mini Meal. Sun Mini Meal. What is Sun Mini Meal across the chest of your jersey?"
  • Quote (Bradley Campbell, 49:37): "It's a Swiss granola bar."

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• "Fans described it as being blood empty. That's kind of a phrase we use here."
  (Cousin Max, 03:52)

• "That's the nature of a Faustian bargain: you don't really know in real time how bad it will get."
  (Bradley Campbell, 21:40)

• "The devil isn't exactly Russia in our story. The devil seems to be the pursuit of money, the loss of control."
  (Pablo Torre, 37:01)

• "Investors come and go. They want to make money... But people here will stay. ...Players will come and go, even CEOs will come and go. But we will stay. It's us."
  (Matthias Tillman, 42:56)

• "How do you win against the petro states and oligarchs and sovereign wealth funds and the deepest pockets in the history of sports?"
  (Pablo Torre, 43:30)

• "I decided to board the ship, Pablo. I'm abandoning my journalistic integrity."
  (Bradley Campbell, 46:15)

Important Timestamps & Segments

| Timestamp | Segment Description | |---------------|-------------------------------------------------------------------| | 01:04-04:46 | Personal anecdotes about rivalry and misplaced loyalty | | 04:47-07:25 | Introduction to the Faustian bargain theme | | 09:54 | Schalke fan mentality and local community overview | | 13:06-14:29 | Fan-owned structure, financial constraints | | 14:29-16:39 | Clemens Tönnies and clinching the Gazprom deal | | 17:18-19:24 | Gazprom's arrival, local reception | | 23:39-26:08 | Crimea, sanctions, first major moral/geopolitical crisis | | 27:04-29:54 | On-field collapse, pandemic, fallout of Gazprom association | | 31:09 | The emotional toll: “blood empty” and club identity crisis | | 34:19-41:58 | New CEO, reform efforts, stadium co-op plan | | 44:13-44:52 | Game-day experience, existential fandom | | 46:44-47:01 | Campbell’s membership in Schalke | | 48:28-49:40 | Granola bar sponsor, comedic closure |

Concluding Thoughts

This episode of “Pablo Torre Finds Out” deftly weaves together sports, geopolitics, business, and identity, using Schalke 04’s catastrophic sponsorship saga as both a cautionary tale and a testament to the resilience of fan communities. The show asks if, in an era dominated by mega-money and petro-states, there remains a place for values, local control, and communal belonging. The answer, hard-won and humble, is that survival may not look like glory, but can still feel a lot like hope.

End of Summary